Endless discussion on licensing and pricing
richmondmathewson at gmail.com
Mon May 2 15:50:46 CEST 2016
On 2.05.2016 15:56, Paul Dupuis wrote:
> This really is a pointless discussion and I know people will find that
> comment offensive and it is not intended to be.
No, I cannot see how that is offensive.
BUT, water does wear away stones, and while water does not
wear away stones overnight, it does have a significant environmental
impact over time.
> For ANY product - even Free ones - there are people who will feel that
> the "value" for the "cost" (whether that cost is money, time, whatever)
> is not what it "should be". The higher the cost, the more people will
> fall into this group.
> For every organization delivering a product, that organization has to
> make the product's cost vs value work for THEM. If they charge too
> little, they go out of business. If they charge too much, no one buys
> it. If they favor one market segment with huge discounts while others
> pay a fortune, they piss off the segment paying the fortune or do not
> make enough revenue due to the huge discounts
Well, this is, very much, Livecode's dilemma; and, just possibly, one of
the ways to
sort things out is to listen to what their customers / potential
customers / past customers
have to say; and as Livecode have not sent out any significant "feelers"
to find out what
these people think, and because a lot of these people have a significant
stake in Livecode,
and Livecode depends on them, might it not be a good idea if those
"shouting" until Livecode do take heed?
> Organizations making products, unless they are complete idiots (and
> hence would be out of business quickly), look at all their feedback. If
> the are not pricing something a certain way, it because that way doesn't
> work for them. Potential customer can (1) not buy anything; (2) find the
> money to buy it, possibly waiting for a "sale"; or (3) waste time and
> effort uselessly rehashing discussions that have long since taken place
> (new people to lists are excused since they may never have seen prior
I run a school which, by nature of it not being state funded, is also a
there is a constant "dance" between the need to provide education and to
make sufficient funds
to finance the thing; and, almost inevitably, those things often
conflict - I listen to my
client base (parents, pupils, and so on) and get someone to keep ringing
up my rivals
and tell them lies about their having a son who needs "extra tew" in
English and how does
their pricing work. If I didn't do these things I would be, to use one
of my son's favourite
phrases "well f*cked".
There is also a "price point" which is notoriously difficult to
establish, and is normally worked out
by balancing what "extra" I might have over my rives, how much parents
are prepared to pay,
and what my rivals charge.
> We make a niche product for researchers, primary academic researchers.
> We have separate pricing tiers for commercial users (retail price),
> government users (a discount), educational institutions (a bigger
> discount) and a special price for students (80% discount). I know we
> loose sales because some students think our student price is still too
> high and we loose some sales because our commercial users think they pay
> too much compared to others. We price our products after careful review
> of our markets, our competition's pricing, and what we need to do to not
> loose money, but make a dollar or two. We have never lost a sale to
> anyone who needed a better price who contacted us in private email to
> ask for a better price, but we've never responded to public comments for
> revisions to our pricing because pricing is complex and should never be
> driven by arguments on a email list or forum.
> Again, I don't mean to be offensive, but it just seems like people's
> time would be better spend either contacting LiveCode private to try to
> negotiate a price point for some need of theirs or spend the time coding
> or learning a new xTalk feature or anything but arguing about pricing
> and licensing yet again.
There is a general pattern with contacting companies privately: no
witnesses, no comeback.
Now I wouldn't like to characterise Livecode in that way, but they may
not, frankly, have the time to
cope with a slew of individual attempts at negotiation.
If this "conversation" is kept going, and Livecode takes tent of it, it
help them to help us to find a modus operandum that both satisfies more
and brings them greater revenue.
And, as Paul Brett's very well stated post makes clear, that is the
lever on which everything hinges.
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