OT: Computer Science in today's market

[Dan Shafer]

Yeah, I'd say four-year-old data is "the early days."

My data says you're out of date but I'm sure my data has a bias to it  
as well.

Dan

On Aug 24, 2005, at 6:35 PM, Jim Bufalini wrote:

> Dan,
>
> The "several years" was late 1999 through 2001. If those were the  
> early
> days, then so be it.
>
> Of course, using a word like outsourcing is like saying  
> programming. There
> are many different kinds. Do these companies have their own facilities
> offshore like IBM and Microsoft with 3,000+ programmers each in  
> India alone?
> Or, do they have a dedicated full-time programming staff offshore?  
> Do they
> have a half dozen or so resident offshore programmers onsite on H-1  
> and B-1
> visas?
>
> The company we worked with had 350 programmers who admittedly were  
> not in
> love with our business model, which used them as a backend programming
> resource for smaller US developers who could then convert their  
> personnel
> from programmers to consultants who would work with the actual  
> clients,
> write the specs and do the installs.
>
> The motivation of many programmers in India is to put in 4 or 5  
> hard and
> lean years with a company there to earn the right to travel to other
> countries, where the pay is much higher and where they have a good  
> chance of
> immigration. I'd be surprised if this has changed much in 5-years.
>
> Glowing articles aside, the realities of outsourcing are more involved
> technically and culturally than appear on the surface. This is not  
> to say it
> doesn't work, but I highly doubt any client who outsources will get  
> the kind
> of quality and satisfaction that they would otherwise get from the  
> types of
> people who frequent this list.
>
> Jim
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: use-revolution-bounces at lists.runrev.com
>> [mailto:use-revolution-bounces at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Dan  
>> Shafer
>> Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 1:10 PM
>> To: How to use Revolution
>> Subject: Re: OT: Computer Science in today's market
>>
>>
>> My guess is that this is old data. Funny, but old. I know several
>> companies that outsource fairly complicated software projects that do
>> involve relatively rich UIs and they report consistently good results
>> from their outsourcing partners.
>>
>> In the early days of outsourcing, there was a lot of this kind of
>> miscommunication but I suspect that in the "several years" that have
>> elapsed since Jim's experience, the Indian programming world has made
>> great strides. Read "The World is Flat" by Thomas L. Friedman for an
>> up-to-date look at this whole area.
>>
>>
>> On Aug 24, 2005, at 11:16 AM, Richard Gaskin wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Jim Bufalini wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Several years ago I had a company that outsourced to India. You
>>>> can't leave
>>>> anything to the imagination in the spec. If you do it's guaranteed
>>>> to come
>>>> back wrong. And there are cultural differences to deal with that
>>>> effect the
>>>> software.
>>>> For example, making requests to reorder the prompts on a working
>>>> entry
>>>> screen, so it matches the customer's workflow, elicit disbelief
>>>> and outright
>>>> laughter. The programmers can't understand why you would take
>>>> something that
>>>> works and change it solely for the convenience of the end user.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> I hope all my clients' competitors outsource. :)
>>>
>>> That last line is one of the funniest things I've read in this
>>> industry in years.  Should be a t-shirt....
>>>
>>> --
>>>  Richard Gaskin
>>>  Managing Editor, revJournal
>>>  _______________________________________________________
>>>  Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com
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>>
>>
>>
>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> Dan Shafer, Revolution Consultant and Author
>> http://www.shafermedia.com
>> Get my book, "Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought"
>>  From http://www.revolutionpros.com, Click "My Stuff"
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
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