Can Rev be used as server database?

[Alex Rice]

On Saturday, July 12, 2003, at 06:13  AM, 
revolution at knowledgeworks.plus.com wrote:

>
> (Sorry folks, this is a long and rambling post...)

Bernard, you are raising lots of interesting issues but I disagree with 
you about some of technical possibilities.

- Very high performance servers can be constructed in a single thread 
on the Medusa design

- Python is a scripting language with an object persistence scheme.

- Transcript is a scripting language with data stacks and custom 
properties (like object persistence)

Technically, the starting points are the same. I conclude that Python 
has nothing up on us, and it's totally possible to do it in Revolution.

If you are arguing on business and organizational grounds that it's not 
a good idea, that we don't want to be kind of second-rate ZOPE 
competitor with less programmers and less funding and less organization 
then I can agree with that.

> I don't see any benefit from Rev users or Runrev re-inventing the 
> wheel.

Agreed. But custom properties are *fast* and integrate completely into 
revolution. So let's use them! I get tired of SQL and this is one of 
the things that appealed to me about Zope.

> Now, on to Zope :-) ...

All well put.

> I agree totally with the idea of greater integration of Rev with web 
> standards and technologies, but I don't think that the aim should be 
> on server-side processing.  I mentioned this also on the list 
> recently, but was met by a fairly dead silence.

I do not think people should be prevented from using Rev on the server 
side, for lack of documentation or supporting. I think already Rev is 
firmly oriented on the client-side and one should not to worry it's 
going to suddenly turn into a server-side only solution.

> I asked what Runrev's plans for XML were, and pointed out that it 
> seemed to be a bit unclear as to the purpose of including XML 
> functionality in the latest version.

Huh? Maybe I don't understand the question. Obviously the purpose was 
to have an XML parser. I'm using it in my project. OK it's only 1 file 
of XML I'm parsing and could have easily done it with regular 
expressions instead- but since the XML parser is there I'm using it.

>  Geoff Canyon responded to say he has a stack that can transform a Rev 
> app to XML and can transform XML to Rev.  But it doesn't work with Rev 
> 2, so as far as I can see, they still don't have any clear plan for 
> XML integration.

Probably lack of time.

> IIRC, the altBrowser is IE only?  I would not like to rely on 
> Microsoft for anything.  They have a history of destroying competition 
> (by fair means or foul).  And it is my belief that we have seen 
> nothing yet: they are going to tighten their monopoly position in ways 
> that many people have not yet imagined.

Naturally... But embedding browsers into apps is something the 
Microsoft has offered and Apple (will) offer. I don't think either of 
them are going to stop offering an embed-able browser.

> If Runrev is going to become more closely integrated with a browser, 
> then I would strongly suggest that people consider the Gecko rendering 
> engine from the Mozilla project.  Yes, I know that the Mozilla browser 
> can be a bit of a sloth compared to IE (although I don't think they 
> are that different - I've seen IE take up to 100mb of RAM on my 
> laptop...yep, 100mb!)  I'm unclear as to how big a task it might be to 
> employ Gecko.  I suspect that MS make it relatively easy to integrate 
> IE (people behind the Mozilla project just didn't get it, until Apple 
> snubbed them with Safari).
>
> I don't think one should get hung up on web browsers as a platform.  
> They are a joke.  Try developing quite simple CSS that work in IE6 on 
> XP, then view them in IE on OS X and see them not work.  Same applies 
> to Netscape and Mozilla.  Same applies to Javascript.

Yes, as a former web developer/programmer, I agree. Also look at 
bugzilla. Their project goals state it will be "browser agnostic". Ha! 
So far it only works with mozilla.

> Why is replacing Java applets or Flash over-optimistic?

Because they have huge installed bases I guess. I think a lot of Flash 
users wouldn't touch Revolution one they saw the jaggy graphics in Rev. 
They are used to antialiased graphics I'm sure. Personally I dislike 
Java applets, so I wish Rev would kill them off.

> So what is required?
> a) integration with web technology (especially XML)
> b) trust (certification) and/or a local security sandbox.
>
> These are both achievable (and probably in many different ways), and I 
> think the market potential is phenomenal.

Agreed!

> I want to be able to use Rev as I have described above within the next 
> 6 to 12 months.
>
Well I hope it happens :-)


Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
http://ARCplanning.com