OT: Catalina - the end of ad hoc & in-house development?

JJS jjs at krutt.org
Sat Sep 7 07:53:49 EDT 2019

I forgot, it was Mattias Rebbe who wrote the notarizing app which you 
can you fro free, aint that great!

He also made an excellent lesson which is on lessons.livecode.com

Op 7-9-2019 om 13:36 schreef JJS via use-livecode:
> Well said.
> There is help on this.
> On of the list members will jump in i guess and he made an excellent 
> tool which will help you out notarizing and all other stuff Apple 
> tries to kill you with.
> If you already have a Apple dev account (only 100$ per year) which 
> gives you the ability to help 100 people(am i correct?) (thought there 
> was an option for 1000??) then this tool will help you do these things 
> and you can go on with coding as before.
> I also put stuff on Google Play which is not intended for everybody, 
> but i use a password combination, just like banks do with their apps. 
> Their apps are also not for everyone, but only they who have an account.
> You could do that too, so only people with access credentials can 
> access the app.
> Indeed you gave a few reasons why i choose not to develop for Apple, 
> unless i can make enough money with it which compensates for it.
> Jerry(Sphere)
> Op 7-9-2019 om 13:18 schreef Peter Reid via use-livecode:
>> I've been using LiveCode as my development platform since 1999. 
>> Practically all the apps I've developed have been for in-house use by 
>> my family, friends and customers - all very low numbers of copies 
>> distributed in an informal manner. I've no interest in App Store 
>> distribution and the users of my apps trust me such that they do not 
>> need my apps to be "approved" by Apple. What's more important to them 
>> is how quickly I can release new apps and new versions of existing apps.
>> Up to and including macOS Mojave my users can run my apps with the 
>> minor inconvenience of having to right-click an app and approve its 
>> use, just once. With macOS Catalina, if I understand things, it's not 
>> so simple, instead these are the options:
>> 1. Code-sign and notarise my apps – I'm not interested in this for my 
>> kind of apps which are essentially in-house/at home developments.
>> 2. Using an active Internet connection, go through the right-click 
>> technique as now not just once, but EVERY time the app is opened.
>> In the past the 'Security & Privacy' General tab had a 3rd option for 
>> the setting 'Allow apps downloaded from:' which allowed you to 
>> install and use apps from any source. It seems that this is not 
>> possible with Catalina.
>> So with Catalina my users will need an Internet connection and will 
>> have to go through the right-click authorisation process every time 
>> they open one of my apps.
>> More seriously, it is becoming increasingly difficult to recommend 
>> the combination of the Mac plus LiveCode for app development. Up to 
>> now I've done all my app development on Mac+LC, even where the target 
>> platform is Windows or Android or Linux – I find it's simply faster, 
>> less error-prone and more pleasant with the Mac. However, from 
>> Catalina onwards even simple little utility apps, created for 
>> short-term use, will be tedious when opening or you have to learn 
>> about the complexity of code-signing and notarising and accept slower 
>> development cycles due to the need for Apple's approval!
>> This is quite depressing, especially since I abandoned iOS 
>> development due to Apple's distribution restrictions.
>> Back when the iPad 2 had just been released I developed for one of my 
>> customers an app to support health & safety audits for a national UK 
>> retail chain. The app took me 15 days to develop in total. As a 
>> result of being able to field a team of 10-20 staff with iPads 
>> running my app, my customer was able to carry out 350 half-day H&S 
>> audits for 3 years. However I was unable to roll-out this app to 
>> other customers as the ad hoc distribution method I was using was 
>> limited to 100 iPads per year and the App Store was not appropriate 
>> for this type of app.
>> As a result of the limitations Apple impose on tablet app 
>> distribution, recently I developed a speech-aid app just for small 
>> Android tablets and larger phones. I have not made an iOS app. This 
>> app is low volume (in terms of number of users) and requires 
>> significant personalising in order to be effective for its users 
>> (typically they are stroke victims). I chose to deliver the app on 
>> Android because of the facility to use developer mode and because of 
>> price – Android 7in tablet plus minimal add-ons: £80, Apple iPad plus 
>> add-ons: £320. Some of my users of this app already have an iPad but 
>> they are having to buy a cheap Android tablet. Like the Mac and 
>> Catalina, the iPad and iOS is driving away potential app developers 
>> due to Apple's rigid control of the delivery mechanisms.
>> Maybe I'm wrong, Catalina will be OK – if I am wrong, please correct me!
>> Regards
>> Peter
>> -- 
>> Peter Reid
>> Loughborough, UK
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