Business Application Framework

[Mike Bonner]

As you read this, keep in mind I have no direct knowledge of the financial
standing of RunRev, so its all supposition. (Plus, i'm not a big brain like
most on the list, so ignore me if you wish)

Lets get this out of the way first:
Contributions here, and in the forums, as well as monetary contributions
during kickstarter while NOT being an engine contributor <> leaching.

Even just quietly using lc (community or otherwise) without posting here is
a contribution.   Everyone I know, who has even a passing interest in
programming knows about livecode now.  Some are rather sick of hearing
about it.

While I too fear a growing feature disparity between community and
commercial, there is truth when its stated.. "it's open source. if you want
it, add it."

Next:
Alas, appearance matters.  I can understand why people are freaking out.
Runrev has a pool of available man hours that can be used. A finite
resource.  And it appears that man hours that could have been used to
further the goals of the kickstarter have been used in an effort to
differentiate the 2 versions instead.  In this case, one should take a
deeper look.

Nobody doubts that expenses and time have gone WAY beyond what was
expected.  I would guess that the phrase "bleeding money" is a fairly
accurate description of the situation.  While its not exactly the same
business model, in manufacturing I've seen companies that are making a
product that costs more to make than they're getting in return, and these
same companies INCREASE production on these very items that are bleeding
them dry.  A loss leader can be great for marketing, but you MUST be able
to make enough profit from other areas to cover the costs.  This is what is
happening here.  Kevin and Runrev are looking for ways to offset the
tremendous cost of much needed retooling, and introducing new product
features to hopefully increase their income flow to offset the huge outgo.
Could they have shoved every possible resource towards the kickstarter
goals, ignoring all other needs?  Yep.  Would it have been a mistake?
Almost surely.

On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 6:24 AM, Graham Samuel <livfoss at mac.com> wrote:

> Well said!
>
> Graham
> (Indy licence holder and Kickstarter contributor).
>
> > On 14 Aug 2015, at 14:12, Roger Eller <roger.e.eller at sealedair.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Not contributing time and code does not necessarily make one a leech!
> Many
> > of us contributed monetarily to the kickstarter, and I believe that earns
> > us just as many beech points as anybody.  Climb down off that high horse.
> > We can hardly see you way up there.
> >
> > Everyone should be able to have input, IMHO.
> > On Aug 14, 2015 6:04 AM, "Kay C Lan" <lan.kc.macmail at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >>> illustrates to me that the community is very concerned about the
> >>> possibility of a two-tiered livecode environment where we need to pay
> >> extra
> >>> to get added premium features that we all will want.
> >>>
> >>
> >> I wasn't going to post but this is such and oxymoron, and so prevalent
> here
> >> I just can't constrain myself.
> >>
> >> I'm not a big Dual Licence user but of those companies I deal with that
> do
> >> such a thing, it seems this is EXACTLY what happens, open source users
> >> DON'T get what the premium users are paying for. Lets take just one
> small
> >> example: MySQL, where an Enterprise license only costs US5000 as year.
> Lets
> >> see what features they get that the Community Users don't get:
> >>
> >> MySQL Fabric
> >> MySQL Partitioning
> >> MySQL Utilities
> >> Storage Engine: NDB
> >> MySQL Enterprise Dashboard
> >> MySQL Enterprise Advisor
> >> MySQL Query Analyzer
> >> MySQL Replication Monitor
> >> Hot Backup for InnoDB
> >> Full, Incremental, Partial, Optimistic Backup
> >> Full, Partial, Selective, Hot Selective Restore
> >> Encryption and Compression
> >> Point-in-Time-Recovery
> >> MySQL Enterprise Authentication
> >> MySQL Enterprise Encryption
> >> MySQL Enterprise Firewall
> >> MySQL Enterprise Audit
> >> Thread pool
> >> HA using Oracle VM Template
> >> HA using Oracle Linux and DRBD
> >> HA using Oracle Clusterware
> >> HA using Solaris Clustering
> >> HA using Windows Clustering
> >> Configuration and Provisioning
> >> Automatic Scaling
> >> Management and Monitoring
> >> ...
> >> and the list goes on and on.
> >>
> >> For the "World's most popular open source database" there seems to be a
> >> MASSIVE difference between the features the Community gets compared to
> >> those who purchase and Enterprise license. From my perspective LiveCode
> Ltd
> >> seem to be dragging their feet a bit and if I'd purchased an Enterprise
> >> License I might wish to complain that I'm not getting enough 'extras'.
> >>
> >> I, personally think I've got excellent value for money from LiveCode
> Ltd. I
> >> got what I wanted from the KickStarter campaign plus more. But maybe I
> just
> >> have a far more realistic view on life, the universe, and software
> >> development.
> >>
> >> Where I live and work there is no social security, if you don't work,
> you
> >> don't eat. It's survival of the fittest. The thought of people just
> >> leeching off society is just abhorrent. It's interesting how such
> attitudes
> >> make a community work, thrive and survive.
> >>
> >> So please, when you post negative comments about all that is wrong with
> the
> >> LiveCode Community, please include an estimate of the number of hours a
> >> week you spend posting to this list, and the number of hours you spend
> >> adding to Community Edition - either directly to the Engine/IDE or some
> >> Community Software like lcVCS or GLX2. Because from my perspective the
> only
> >> worrying concern with regard to LiveCode Community is the number of
> leeches
> >> compared to the numbers actually contributing.
> >>
> >> 1 hr posting / 0 hrs improving LC Community - I'm a leech.
> >>
> >> I find it interesting that the few open source communities I deal with,
> all
> >> of them suffer the same situation, those that expend the most ($, time
> and
> >> effort) in the Community seem to complain the least (as seen by the few
> >> previous posts focusing on what can be done to get lcVCS really working)
> >> and those that expend the least complain the most.
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> >>
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