This is what REALLY SUCKS about RunRev! - was Menubar Help

[Geoff Canyon]

On Nov 25, 2005, at 2:59 AM, David Burgun wrote:

>> It's entirely possible to have a group that is not on any card. To  
>> do this, simply create a new stack, add a button, group the  
>> button, and type this in the message box:
>>
>> remove group 1 from this card
>>
>> It's a limitation in the app browser, certainly, that the group in  
>> question won't show up in the stack. It shouldn't show up under  
>> the card, because it's not on the card.
>
> In this case, if it's not in the card, then surely it's not in the  
> stack and should not be available for "Placing" or whatver.

This simply isn't true. It is possible for a group to exist in a  
stack _without_ being on any card in that stack. The above method  
will create such a stack/group. As Jacque pointed out, if there are  
more than one card in a stack and you delete the last card containing  
a group, that will also leave you with a stack containing backgrounds  
that are not on any card.

>>
>> I'm not sure I'm following what you're describing after that part,  
>> but it sounds like you placed the group, which would make it show  
>> up in the app browser, allowing you to delete it.
>
> Yes.
>
>> Again, I'm not sure I'm following, but it sounds like getting rid  
>> of this extraneous group fixed your menu bar problems. If so, great.
>
> Yes.
>
>> So, there is definitely a limitation in the app browser, but not a  
>> bug. It sounds like a useful feature request to backgrounds that  
>> aren't in any card under the stack.
>
> No. it's a bug in RunRev. The only way a group could be created  
> like that, is in a stack that exists in memory but not as a file.  
> This is possible - once! But during the course of tracking this  
> problem down I quit RunRev, restarted the machine and re-loaded  
> RunRev. The Group was part of the stack where the error occured.  
> When I created another stack the problem wasn't present, yet the  
> Group in question was still in the Place Groups Sub-Menu. Besides  
> all this I really don't think a Group can exist (or at least be  
> accessible by RunRev), unless it is in a stack, and all stacks have  
> at least one card, and they should appear in the App Browser anyway.

You are correct that a group can't exist outside a stack. You are  
correct that a stack must have at least one card. You are incorrect  
that therefore the group must be in the card. You are incorrect that  
this is a bug. It is a limitation. The app browser doesn't display  
any contents for the stack itself -- this is a limitation. If the  
group _is_ on the card and _doesn't_ show up on that card in the app  
browser, _that_ would be a bug. But that's not what you described.

>
>> How the group got there in the first place remains a question for  
>> investigation. You can certainly submit it as a bug. If it's not  
>> reproducible it'll be difficult to confirm, and harder to fix  
>> (assuming it is in fact a bug).
>
> Yes, It's a Bug - Shock Horror! There are loads of em in RunRev -  
> Get used to it and stop being in denial!

No denial here. I can view the report in bugzilla and see that there  
are currently 586 active bugs, which is far fewer than there were a  
few years ago. I submitted some of them, too. Most of mine have been  
closed (I haven't submitted any lately). As others have pointed out,  
sarcasm and hostility isn't likely to help things much.

gc (done here)