Recent anger - and new guy here

[David Burgun]

>Ok, with the recent anger expressed, and with me being a new guy on the block,
>   let me ask some questions:
>
>   - What's the size of the company behind this product?  You don't 
>have to give precise numbers, but somebody must know if this company 
>is - a thousand people - doubt it, a hundred people - still probably 
>doubt it, at least dozens of people - probably, and I hope, or one 
>or two people - I don't hope this is the case.

I'd guess at dozens.
>   
>   - What are the support options?  Do we get 100% of support via the 
>dialog in this forum, or is there a way to contact a tech support 
>team at the company and occasionally get a good answer?
>

Check the web site, there are different packages, the basic studio 
version there is no support included, you can pay for tecch support 
indcidents at around £75 PH I think, but again check the web site. 
The enterprize edition comes with some support I think.

>   - What's the frequency of the release of minor levels and major 
>levels of the software?

Minor levels don't seem to be announced, you have to download the 
package and check the build number. More major updates are announced 
and I reckon since I've been using it there are around 3 per year.


>   
>   - Are people out there making a livelihood using this product 
>nearly exclusively, or is this rare to nonexistent?

Yes, I am using it to develop applications that will be sold. It 
makes solid good applications - once you get over the silly bugs that 
just don't seem to go away. Having said that, I have not found a 
situation that I have not been able to work around, and this list is 
just GREAT. Actually, without it, I think RunRev would just die.
>   
>   Thanks.
>   [I'm a long time developer, and I have used Many tools and 
>languages, and while this thing doesn't look like the tool for All 
>jobs, it does look like The Tool for some jobs.
>   So, I start out my journey here enthusiastically until someone 
>tells me otherwise.]
>

I decided to rant today to let off some steam. The problem is that 
you get SOOOOOOO much done so quickly that when you hit one these 
"silly" problems it is amplified. What I mean is that I coded a 
whole, fairly complex window with loads of controls and images in 
about 2.5 days. I then spent most of a day trying to fathom a bug in 
the RunRev system, the bug is probably else where from the menu 
system and caused a corruption.

I have not found a task that you cannot do with RunRev, you may need 
to develop some external commands written in C/C++, but I would say 
designing and implenting a GUI is FAR faster than any other 
environment I have used (and I've been in software development for 
over 25 years, the last 12 on Mac with some Windows).

The thing I am moaning about really is that the documentation is 
really poor and there are some really silly bugs that just don't seem 
to get fixed, but at the same time there are more new features added.

Part of the problem is that the IDE is also written in RunRev so 
intreraction between (perhaps buggy) scripts and the development 
system occur.

I really would like them to just do a bug fix/IDE enhancement 
release, in fact I think it is NEEDED if RunRev is going to grow to 
any size, and I sincerly hope it does, it is a REAL pleasure to build 
an Application in RunRev and it really is a fantastic product. it's 
how I've always imagined it should be, since the first time I really 
understood OOP and GUI's!

Hope this helps
All the Best
Dave

>   Frank
>   ____________________________________________________________________
>
>Stephen Barncard <stephenREVOLUTION at barncard.com> wrote:
>   Dave, it's cool. Take a deep breath. You've got a lot of love in the
>room on this list.
>
>Complaining, making threats and playing the role of the disgruntled
>customer won't go as far here as calm discussion. Please be careful
>about dissing Runrev in particular - your careless comments could
>scare away lurkers - potential runrev users (and therefore a
>healthier business, with continued development, etc). I have no doubt
>that you will find help in this place within hours. The best
>scripters in the world hang out here.
>
>This stage (OUTRAGE+Confusion) is typical of one's self-education in
>using rev. Either it will be fixed in the next revision or we write a
>thing to go around it for now. As far as I'm concerned the gains in
>using this erector set far outweighs any glitches I encounter.
>
>Are you angry enough to write your own Menu Maker? It can be done.
>
>>What Gives? Why is this SUCH a difficult thing to do in RunRev? I
>>don't know any other environment where this is SUCH a big deal, I
>>could have done this 100 times over in C or even PowerPC assembler!
>>
>>Getting to the end of a long day and I have to get this working
>>tonight! I really don't want to have to tell my boss that I can't do
>>this in RunRev and that the support it so bad that you can't even
>>get someone to look at it!
>>
>>All the Best
>>Dave
>
>--
>stephen barncard
>s a n f r a n c i s c o
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