Andy's comments and positioning...

[Pierre Sahores]

Dear Chipp and Kevin, Hello List,

Le 6 févr. 04, à 13:27, Kevin Miller a écrit :

> On 4/2/04 9:35 pm, Chipp Walters <chipp at chipp.com> wrote:
>
>> I like to think of RR as a *real development tool*, not as a 
>> HyperCard clone
>> or newbie play toy. Unfortunately, I believe Andy thinks of it more 
>> as a
>> HyperCard clone...primarily because of positioning.
>
> I'm assuming you're referring to the MacWorld review.  Its true that 
> he got
> that point wrong, but this *isn't* a general problem that we have.  If 
> it
> was, other reviewers would make the same mistake, and in dozens of 
> reviews,
> they haven't.  No review I've seen hasn't had some kind of factual 
> error in
> it, it happens in the best of them.
>
>> What if RR is positioned as the ubiquitous RAD programming 
>> environment for
>> cross platform development -- surpassing in both speed and 
>> performance other
>> tools such as JAVA, QT, VB, etc.? I think this is a valid positioning
>> statement. Now to turn around and say "and it's only $99" and your 
>> Mom can
>> use it, certainly doesn't seem to back this up.
>>
>> Which brings us to the real problem...positioning. RR can be 
>> positioned as a
>> 'HyperCard clone' for the inventive user OR as a full-featured 
>> development
>> tool for professionals can use to build commercial and enterprise
>> applications.
>>
>> There have been a few comments lately about Rev pricing...
>>
>> I think Rev's pricing is right on the money. Users can download a free
>> version which they can try out for 30 days. Of course the HyperCard 
>> clone
>> crowd wants a version for $99 bucks. That is where their expectation 
>> is set
>> (just like Andy). After all, Apple used to 'give it away.'
>>
>> But, developers whose business depends on RR, are used to paying much 
>> more
>> for professional tools. Just look at other cross-platform development
>> suites. By comparison, RR is a steal.
>>
>> One of the biggest challenges for Xtalk companies is their ability to 
>> stay
>> funded and alive. I believe in RR as a professional development tool. 
>> And,
>> as a professional developer, I can make money with it, even if it 
>> does cost
>> hundreds of dollars.
>
> Essentially what we are going to be doing more and more over the next 
> few
> versions is to differentiate Express from Revolution.  So we have two
> product lines: "Revolution" which contains Studio and Enterprise aimed 
> at
> professional developers; and Express which is aimed at the 
> entry-level.  We
> have a number of ideas about how to best manage this differentiation in
> terms of feature sets, pricing, promotion and support.  We'll be 
> introducing
> this over time - still preserving options for the existing user base, 
> but
> more clearly differentiating where new users join the Revolution.

Probably a good thing to do the professional issues of Rev more 
powerfull than the hobbyst ones in the future. Features alike the shell 
access, databases connectors, xml or regular expressions support, 
etc... don't feet the hobbyst needs. On the other hand, including an 
Apache Rev's native module, an "Entreprise Revolution Beans" design 
patterns suit of tools "à la Java", Sybase ASE and Borland Interbase 
native connectors, some more rocking Oracle and PostgreSQL unix 
connectors issues, etc... in a "N-Tier Professional Development 
Revolution package would probably help us to let know any kind of 
customers that Revolution can really feet any kind of professional 
grade needs.

I was, last week, speaking with "X", a databases administrator, witch 
manage, with two other collegues, a 24/24 7/7 farm of 120 SunSpark 
Solaris + BEA Weblogic + Sybase ASE 12.5 servers in a great french 
telecom compagny. Here is what he said : the license prices is never a 
problem for the IT Staff : the more expensive they are, the more secure 
the IT Staff feel, even if the servers are going to krach... Why ? 
Simply because if you are owning "one of the best market wieved product 
lines", you are not responsable of "aventurious choices" : if the stuff 
kraches, it's not your fault and it will be to the product line vendor 
to provide to you the needed solution... Probably, those kind of IT 
Staff will never think that, in using Revolution, i can feet their 
needs, as long as it will not be a suffisant expensive "peer installed 
processor" license issue of Rev.

Probably would it be a great help for us, the Rev's professional 
developpers, to be able to get two or three kind of Rev's licenses : 
the first one, unexpensive (aka the "Commercial Entreprise" current 
price)  dedicated to our development works, a second one, a little more 
"seriously expensive" as a deployment license feeting our small to 
middle class entreprise customers and a "very seriously more expensive" 
deployment license dedicated to feet "the needs" of big companies, 
whose have to do with SAP, PeopleSoft, Oracle, Sybase and so on... 
product lines.

P.S.: Technically speaking, Sybase ASE 12.5 and PostgreSQL 7.xx are, 
today, lots more suitables than the last issues of Oracle are...

> Kind regards,
>
> Kevin
>
> Kevin Miller ~ kevin at runrev.com ~ http://www.runrev.com/
> Runtime Revolution - User-Centric Development Tools
>
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>
>
Best Regards, Pierre Sahores

100, rue de Paris
F - 77140 Nemours

psahores at easynet.fr

GSM:   +33 6 03 95 77 70
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Inspection académique de Seine-Saint-Denis
Applications et SGBD ACID SQL (WEB et PGI)
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Bien cordialement, Pierre Sahores

100, rue de Paris
F - 77140 Nemours

psahores at easynet.fr

GSM:   +33 6 03 95 77 70
Pro:   +33 1 41 60 52 68
Dom:   +33 1 64 45 05 33
Fax:   +33 1 64 45 05 33

Inspection académique de Seine-Saint-Denis
Applications et SGBD ACID SQL (WEB et PGI)
Penser et produire "delta de productivité"