From ncouch at mail.airmail.net Sat Mar 1 08:27:00 2003 From: ncouch at mail.airmail.net (ncouch) Date: Sat Mar 1 08:27:00 2003 Subject: Directory information Message-ID: Anyone know of a way to gather directory or drive information? I have tried the "volumes" and "diskSpace" functions but they don't seem to get what I am looking for. What I am looking to do is use Revolution to gather information on such things as: file size free disk space file version information Under Windows NT or Macintosh. From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Sat Mar 1 12:09:33 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Sat Mar 1 12:09:33 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available Message-ID: <3E60E84C.8050405@hyperactivesw.com> I have just posted a solution for Macintosh users who want an easy way to play scripted musical notation in Revolution or MetaCard. Shakobox is a combination stack and supporting application which interprets HyperCard-style musical notation and plays it back using the QuickTime MIDI musical instrument library. All 128 MIDI instruments and sound effects are available for playback, with full control over pitch and velocity. The stack ships with both the 68K and OS X versions of the supporting application "PlayCommand", which is embedded as a set of custom properties directly within the stack. An install button copies PlayCommand to your hard drive where it is immediately ready for use. If you want to distribute stacks built with scripted notation, you can use the same technique and installer scripts to ensure that your users also have the PlayCommand application available. There are some minor limitations to this initial release; see the stack for details. Even so, it is often possible to play multiple scripted note strings simultaneously to achieve simple chording or harmony. There is an example in the stack. Because it relies on AppleScript, Shakobox is a Mac-only solution. But since most of the requests for scripted notation have been from HyperCard converts, maybe that's enough for now. If anyone is interested in building a DLL for the Windows side, please let me know. The PlayCommand application was written by Jon Bettencourt, who holds the copyright, but it is being distributed free of charge. You can get Shakobox at: -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From rogerguay at centurytel.net Sat Mar 1 12:12:01 2003 From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay) Date: Sat Mar 1 12:12:01 2003 Subject: Vertical Tabs, anyone?? Message-ID: <66117C0B-4C08-11D7-B992-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Has anyone a solution for vertical tabs? I would greatly appreciate your help. Thanks, Roger From bvg at mac.com Sat Mar 1 12:28:01 2003 From: bvg at mac.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?=) Date: Sat Mar 1 12:28:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: <3E60E84C.8050405@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: Or you could use the much older crossplatform version from udi: http://homepage.mac.com/udi/stack/stack.html And you can also wait for vers. 2.0 which will also feature such a midi-player stack... On Samstag, M?r 1, 2003, at 18:05 Europe/Zurich, J. Landman Gay wrote: > I have just posted a solution for Macintosh users who want an easy way > to play scripted musical notation in Revolution or MetaCard. Shakobox > is a combination stack and supporting application which interprets > HyperCard-style musical notation and plays it back using the QuickTime > MIDI musical instrument library. All 128 MIDI instruments and sound > effects are available for playback, with full control over pitch and > velocity. > > The stack ships with both the 68K and OS X versions of the supporting > application "PlayCommand", which is embedded as a set of custom > properties directly within the stack. An install button copies > PlayCommand to your hard drive where it is immediately ready for use. > If you want to distribute stacks built with scripted notation, you can > use the same technique and installer scripts to ensure that your users > also have the PlayCommand application available. > > There are some minor limitations to this initial release; see the > stack for details. Even so, it is often possible to play multiple > scripted note strings simultaneously to achieve simple chording or > harmony. There is an example in the stack. > > Because it relies on AppleScript, Shakobox is a Mac-only solution. But > since most of the requests for scripted notation have been from > HyperCard converts, maybe that's enough for now. If anyone is > interested in building a DLL for the Windows side, please let me know. > > The PlayCommand application was written by Jon Bettencourt, who holds > the copyright, but it is being distributed free of charge. You can get > Shakobox at: > > -- > Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com > HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From valetia at mac.com Sat Mar 1 12:39:04 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Sat Mar 1 12:39:04 2003 Subject: Vertical Tabs, anyone?? In-Reply-To: <66117C0B-4C08-11D7-B992-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Message-ID: Hi Roger, How about using buttons with images that look like vertical tabs? Valetia > From: Roger Guay > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2003 09:08:18 -0800 > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Vertical Tabs, anyone?? > > Has anyone a solution for vertical tabs? I would greatly appreciate > your help. > > Thanks, Roger > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From dsc at swcp.com Sat Mar 1 15:42:01 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Sat Mar 1 15:42:01 2003 Subject: Vertical Tabs, anyone?? In-Reply-To: <66117C0B-4C08-11D7-B992-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Message-ID: On Saturday, March 1, 2003, at 10:08 AM, Roger Guay wrote: > Has anyone a solution for vertical tabs? Do mean buttons as along the edge of a notebook? Or do you mean vertical spacers in a field? Dar Scott From NAGY.Emmanuel at wanadoo.fr Sat Mar 1 16:53:01 2003 From: NAGY.Emmanuel at wanadoo.fr (Emmanuel NAGY) Date: Sat Mar 1 16:53:01 2003 Subject: Vertical Tabs, anyone?? References: Message-ID: <002e01c2e03c$55f822e0$9001a8c0@pski6pux38ozg9m> oui, bon je te redonne mon numero de tel, si tu veux toujours de moi, je me couche tard, donc tu peux m'appeler : 06 65 40 68 91 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dar Scott" To: Sent: Saturday, March 01, 2003 9:38 PM Subject: Re: Vertical Tabs, anyone?? > > On Saturday, March 1, 2003, at 10:08 AM, Roger Guay wrote: > > > Has anyone a solution for vertical tabs? > > Do mean buttons as along the edge of a notebook? Or do you mean > vertical spacers in a field? > > Dar Scott > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu Sat Mar 1 17:07:01 2003 From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry) Date: Sat Mar 1 17:07:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: <3E60E84C.8050405@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: Yippee!! Thanks, Jacque :-D Judy On Sat, 1 Mar 2003, J. Landman Gay wrote: > I have just posted a solution for Macintosh users who want an easy way > to play scripted musical notation in Revolution or MetaCard. Shakobox is > a combination stack and supporting application which interprets > HyperCard-style musical notation and plays it back using the QuickTime > MIDI musical instrument library. All 128 MIDI instruments and sound > effects are available for playback, with full control over pitch and > velocity. From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu Sat Mar 1 17:09:00 2003 From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry) Date: Sat Mar 1 17:09:00 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Not the same thing... At least, last time I checked... Judy On Sat, 1 Mar 2003, [ISO-8859-1] Bj?rnke von Gierke wrote: > Or you could use the much older crossplatform version from udi: > http://homepage.mac.com/udi/stack/stack.html > > And you can also wait for vers. 2.0 which will also feature such a > midi-player stack... From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Sat Mar 1 18:37:04 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Sat Mar 1 18:37:04 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E614340.10407@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/1/03 11:24 AM, Bj?rnke von Gierke wrote: > Or you could use the much older crossplatform version from udi: > http://homepage.mac.com/udi/stack/stack.html > > And you can also wait for vers. 2.0 which will also feature such a > midi-player stack... I didn't see anything similar on Udi's site, but unless I misunderstand, I think both the solutions you mention will only play back files that have been created in MIDI format. Shakobox is different -- it allows scripted, on-the-fly, HyperCard-style notation, which isn't the same as MIDI. This type of notation seems to be one of the rare things that HyperCard people want but which isn't supported in either MetaCard or Revolution. Shakobox tries to fill that gap. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Sat Mar 1 20:07:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Sat Mar 1 20:07:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: <3E614340.10407@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: <20030302010324.58797.qmail@web20002.mail.yahoo.com> this is fantastic. along with other programs being developed by Rev people, this seems to be part of a musical movement. until now musical scripting has been treated as a cute little toy. with the right tools people could create their own music the way they create their own card graphics. those with sequencers already do. listen to the three-blind-mice level riffs on many rap recordings. sequencer GUI's generally alarm people, but focused scripted environments could change this. thanks again! erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bvg at mac.com Sat Mar 1 20:47:01 2003 From: bvg at mac.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?=) Date: Sat Mar 1 20:47:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: <3E614340.10407@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: <60840503-4C50-11D7-B6E3-003065AD94A4@mac.com> ah i got to the wrong page on udi's page it should be the first item here: http://homepage.mac.com/udi/stack/tool.html Its all there in the "makeSMF" stack, even in library form and many example files in a format called "SMD", which is exactly what you described, namely a sequence of characters which it is able to play. also the stack from runrev is included into the 2.0 beta and does indeed only create midi files. On Sonntag, M?r 2, 2003, at 00:33 Europe/Zurich, J. Landman Gay wrote: > On 3/1/03 11:24 AM, Bj?rnke von Gierke wrote: >> Or you could use the much older crossplatform version from udi: >> http://homepage.mac.com/udi/stack/stack.html >> And you can also wait for vers. 2.0 which will also feature such a >> midi-player stack... > > I didn't see anything similar on Udi's site, but unless I > misunderstand, I think both the solutions you mention will only play > back files that have been created in MIDI format. Shakobox is > different -- it allows scripted, on-the-fly, HyperCard-style notation, > which isn't the same as MIDI. This type of notation seems to be one of > the rare things that HyperCard people want but which isn't supported > in either MetaCard or Revolution. Shakobox tries to fill that gap. > > -- > Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com > HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From pixelbird at interisland.net Sat Mar 1 21:11:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sat Mar 1 21:11:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1162 - 11 msgs In-Reply-To: <200303011701.MAA27380@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 15:11:11 -0600 > From: "J. Landman Gay" > Subject: Re: playing sounds > On 2/28/03 12:46 PM, Marty Billingsley wrote: >> Specifically, how do I go about making the following HC command work: >> play "harpsichord" C4q >> which plays middle C for a quarter note with a harpsichord sound. > > This isn't supported natively. But hang on -- by tonight or tomorrow I > will have a solution for everyone who has been asking for this feature. > Stay tuned. :) ---------- I had a feeling you would get to that sooner or later. So many HC'ers have stacks that use that feature. I suspect if it's a good solution it will attract a fair chunk of holdouts, so TIA. Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Sat Mar 1 21:14:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sat Mar 1 21:14:01 2003 Subject: Oops sorry In-Reply-To: <200303011701.MAA27380@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: I think I forgot to reset the subject line on my last post. Say, does anyone have a cure for that which automatically does it, or at least raises an alarm to remind us.? Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Sat Mar 1 21:21:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sat Mar 1 21:21:01 2003 Subject: G4 online In-Reply-To: <200303011701.MAA27380@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Alrighty then, I brought my G4 onto my boat to work with Rev. What a relief! I didn't really want to, but the bonus is that little 2 degree list to port is now ballasted to center. Plus, I can now watch DVD movies in extreme resolution. ;+) Ken N. From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Sat Mar 1 22:11:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Sat Mar 1 22:11:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: <60840503-4C50-11D7-B6E3-003065AD94A4@mac.com> References: <60840503-4C50-11D7-B6E3-003065AD94A4@mac.com> Message-ID: <3E617556.2010605@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/1/03 7:43 PM, Bj?rnke von Gierke wrote: > ah i got to the wrong page on udi's page it should be the first item here: > http://homepage.mac.com/udi/stack/tool.html > Its all there in the "makeSMF" stack, even in library form and many > example files in a format called "SMD", which is exactly what you > described, namely a sequence of characters which it is able to play. Yes, I see now. I think I actually downloaded this a while ago, and it would probably be a good solution for someone who needs cross-platform capability. It does more than Shakobox, but isn't as straight-forward as HyperCard's implementation. Shakobox is simpler to use, though not as versatile. It's a trade-off, but having two options is a good thing. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu Sat Mar 1 22:37:01 2003 From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry) Date: Sat Mar 1 22:37:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: <60840503-4C50-11D7-B6E3-003065AD94A4@mac.com> Message-ID: But it's still not what Jacque's done, which is to implement HC's very easy musical scriptation system into MC/Rev, ala: play "instrument" | tempo | c4q in which c = note 4 = octave pitch q = quarter note. With this system, one needn't know MIDI, just be able to read sheet music and transcribe from it into the system above. Judy -- who's really wanted something like this for a while now! On Sun, 2 Mar 2003, [ISO-8859-1] Bj?rnke von Gierke wrote: > ah i got to the wrong page on udi's page it should be the first item > here: > http://homepage.mac.com/udi/stack/tool.html > Its all there in the "makeSMF" stack, even in library form and many > example files in a format called "SMD", which is exactly what you > described, namely a sequence of characters which it is able to play. > > also the stack from runrev is included into the 2.0 beta and does > indeed only create midi files. From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 2 00:09:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 2 00:09:01 2003 Subject: Writing with standalones In-Reply-To: <200303011701.MAA27380@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hi list, OK, I'm ready to figure this out for real. I think an HC standalone will save new cards to itself automatically, but what do I do if I want to save new cards to a Rev standalone? On the Mac, I would just make a stack in the same folder operable by the standalone, add new cards to it and save it from the standalone. This assumes the Rev engine is in the standalone and, though it can't read and write to itself, I guess it can read and write to the other one. Should the other stack be a substack? Can I read and write to a substack, (which will be in the same folder, right?)? Anyway, now I remember reading that you can't do that with Windows (put the save data stack into the same folder). I have no clue why that would be so. It's normal on a Mac to put data, images, plugins, etc. into the same folder as the app, so the app doesn't have to go on a search mission for it's normally-used files. So what, exactly, would be the "normal" procedure for Windows. Where should I put the folder that contains data stacks and image files? Ken N. From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Sun Mar 2 01:29:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Sun Mar 2 01:29:01 2003 Subject: Writing with standalones In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E61A3C4.30001@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/1/03 8:14 PM, Ken Norris wrote: > Hi list, > > OK, I'm ready to figure this out for real. I think an HC standalone will > save new cards to itself automatically, but what do I do if I want to save > new cards to a Rev standalone? > > On the Mac, I would just make a stack in the same folder operable by the > standalone, add new cards to it and save it from the standalone. This > assumes the Rev engine is in the standalone and, though it can't read and > write to itself, I guess it can read and write to the other one. Right. This would work the same way in Rev. You can make a standalone to run the whole business, and a separate data stack that the standalone can save data to. > Should the other stack be a substack? Can I read and write to a substack, > (which will be in the same folder, right?)? No. The rule is that an application can't save to its own file. A substack would be in the same file on disk as the standalone app, so you wouldn't be able to save to it. You need a separate stack on disk if you want to save data. > Anyway, now I remember reading that you can't do that with Windows (put the > save data stack into the same folder). I have no clue why that would be so. > It's normal on a Mac to put data, images, plugins, etc. into the same folder > as the app, so the app doesn't have to go on a search mission for it's > normally-used files. This is a little off. The rule is that applications can't save to themselves -- the actual standalone file on disk cannot be altered after it is compiled, and therefore any new data must be saved in another, separate file. Other files in the same folder are fine. You can set up the same folder structure you normally do. > So what, exactly, would be the "normal" procedure for Windows. Where should > I put the folder that contains data stacks and image files? Everything can go in one folder, or in any folder grouping you want. It is also normal on Windows for all related files to be grouped together in the same directory. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From valetia at mac.com Sun Mar 2 02:21:01 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Sun Mar 2 02:21:01 2003 Subject: Writing with standalones In-Reply-To: <3E61A3C4.30001@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: Hi Ken, >> Should the other stack be a substack? Can I read and write to a substack, >> (which will be in the same folder, right?)? > > No. The rule is that an application can't save to its own file. A > substack would be in the same file on disk as the standalone app, so you > wouldn't be able to save to it. You need a separate stack on disk if you > want to save data. Yup, Jacqueline's right. By default, substacks are saved within the same file as the standalone once built, so you can't save to them. However, if you do prefer to work with substacks rather than actual separate stacks, you can get the distribution builder to automatically save your substacks as separate stacks during the build process. You'll find more information about how this is accomplished here: http://www.runrev.com/revolution/developers/articles/tipoftheweek/1.html Valetia From simran at teleline.es Sun Mar 2 10:31:00 2003 From: simran at teleline.es (Peter Lundh) Date: Sun Mar 2 10:31:00 2003 Subject: Here's an easy one: Loop to change bkgcolor In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi, all. After a longish time away from Revolution I know have to make a very simple utility to help me characterize and calibrate a LCD display. I have to measure the light emitted by the display with a spectrophotometer. Against a grey background (128,128,128) I have to measure the light from a 300x300 px rectangle. I want to make several measurements at increments of 15 (0,0,0 15,0,0 30,0,0 etc) of each colour. Since the spectrophotometer is at some distance away from the from the display I want to make the process of changing the colour as automatic as possible. That is, each time I hit the return key, or pageDown key the value 15 is added to the backgroundColor until it's value reaches 255, after which it starts adding 15 to the second (green) value - 0,15,0 0,30,0 0,45,0 etc. I would like it to loop through the R, G and B channels after which it does the grey levels (15,15,15 30,30,30 45,45,45 etc). Could anyone please show me how to increase the R, G and B values each time I hit the returnkey. Many thank in advance. -Peter -- Peter Lundh E: simran at teleline.es UK From rogerguay at centurytel.net Sun Mar 2 11:04:01 2003 From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay) Date: Sun Mar 2 11:04:01 2003 Subject: Vertical Tabs Message-ID: <21B44462-4CC8-11D7-AE22-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Thanks for the response to my question about vertical tabs. My hope is to produce something that closely resembles the standard "Tabbed Buttons" along the outer right edge of the card in a vertical format rather than the existing horizontal. I will revert to buttons with my own icons if needed, but the subtle beauty of the existing "Tabbed Buttons" is my preference. Thanks, Roger From rcozens at pon.net Sun Mar 2 12:30:01 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Sun Mar 2 12:30:01 2003 Subject: Here's an easy one: Loop to change bkgcolor In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >I have to measure the light emitted by the display with a spectrophotometer. >Against a grey background (128,128,128) I have to measure the light from a >300x300 px rectangle. I want to make several measurements at increments of >15 (0,0,0 15,0,0 30,0,0 etc) of each colour. Since the spectrophotometer >is at some distance away from the from the display I want to make the >process of changing the colour as automatic as possible. That is, each time >I hit the return key, or pageDown key the value 15 is added to the >backgroundColor until it's value reaches 255, after which it starts adding >15 to the second (green) value - 0,15,0 0,30,0 0,45,0 etc. I would like it >to loop through the R, G and B channels after which it does the grey levels >(15,15,15 30,30,30 45,45,45 etc). Hi Peter, Here's a starter: In field script: on focusIn set the backgroundColor of me to "0,0,0" setBackgroundColor true end focusIn on returnInField setBackgroundColor false end returnInField In some script: local secondPass on setBackgroundColor initLocal if initLoacal then get "15,0,0" put false into secondPass else get the backgroundColor of the target if it is "255,255,255" then get "0,0,0" put not secondPass into secondPass else put item 1 of it into rValue put item 2 of it into gValue put item 3 of it into bValue if rValue < 255 or secondPass then put rValue+15 into item 1 of it if gValue < 255 or secondPass then put gValue+15 into item 2 of it if bValue < 255 or secondPass then put bValue+15 into item 3 of it end if end if set the backgroundColor of the target to it end setBackgroundColor If this does basically what you want, I leave it to you to determine how to trap for the pageDown key. -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From rcozens at pon.net Sun Mar 2 12:36:01 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Sun Mar 2 12:36:01 2003 Subject: Here's an easy one: Loop to change bkgcolor Message-ID: >> if initLoacal then get "15,0,0" << To get the initial effect you want, perhaps this should be 'get "0,0,0"' -- Rob Cozens Vive R Revolution! From rcozens at pon.net Sun Mar 2 15:42:01 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Sun Mar 2 15:42:01 2003 Subject: Here's an easy one: Loop to change bkgcolor Message-ID: >> if rValue < 255 or secondPass then put rValue+15 into item 1 of it if gValue < 255 or secondPass then put gValue+15 into item 2 of it if bValue < 255 or secondPass then put bValue+15 into item 3 of it >> Sorry Peter, I'm intellectually low today & it shows: if secondPass then put rValue+15 into item 1 of it put gValue+15 into item 2 of it put bValue+15 into item 3 of it else if rValue < 255 then put rValue+15 into item 1 of it else if gValue < 255 then put gValue+15 into item 2 of it else put bValue+15 into item 3 of it end if end if -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 2 16:00:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 2 16:00:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: <200303020338.WAA05397@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2003 11:05:16 -0600 > From: "J. Landman Gay" > Organization: HyperActive Software > Subject: Scripted musical notation available > I have just posted a solution for Macintosh users who want an easy way > to play scripted musical notation in Revolution or MetaCard. Shakobox is > a combination stack and supporting application which interprets > HyperCard-style musical notation and plays it back using the QuickTime > MIDI musical instrument library. All 128 MIDI instruments and sound > effects are available for playback, with full control over pitch and > velocity. ---------- IMHO, this is the coolest addition to Rev's capabilities since Tuviah's TTS X. Now, maybe there is hope I can get myMac to sing in Rev. ---------- > If anyone is interested > in building a DLL for the Windows side, please let me know. ---------- Well, one of the reasons to use Rev is it's x-platform ability. I'm still looking at easy to use TTS solutions with a decent selection of voices for Windows. So far everything comparable to the Mac's 'normal everyday' TTS and voices seems pricey. Plus, you have to be sure of compatiblity. ---------- > The PlayCommand application was written by Jon Bettencourt, who holds > the copyright, but it is being distributed free of charge. You can get > Shakobox at: ---------- Many thanks to Jon then. Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 2 16:10:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 2 16:10:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: <200303020338.WAA05397@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2003 11:05:16 -0600 > From: "J. Landman Gay" > Organization: HyperActive Software > Subject: Scripted musical notation available > I have just posted a solution for Macintosh users who want an easy way > to play scripted musical notation in Revolution or MetaCard. ---------- Gosh, it'll be hard to finish going through my emails...I want to try it out RIGHT NOW! BTW, thanks again :+) Ken N. From monte at sweattechnologies.com Sun Mar 2 16:17:03 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Sun Mar 2 16:17:03 2003 Subject: Writing with standalones In-Reply-To: <3E61A3C4.30001@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: > > So what, exactly, would be the "normal" procedure for Windows. > Where should > > I put the folder that contains data stacks and image files? > > Everything can go in one folder, or in any folder grouping you want. It > is also normal on Windows for all related files to be grouped together > in the same directory. > This is not quite correct. There can be problems saving files within the Program Files directory on Windows if the user is running NT, 2000 or XP and are not logged in as an administrator. Windows actually has a special folder specifically for saving user data into. Regards Monte From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 2 16:31:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 2 16:31:01 2003 Subject: Writing with standalones In-Reply-To: <200303021701.MAA20200@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 00:25:08 -0600 > From: "J. Landman Gay" > Organization: HyperActive Software > Subject: Re: Writing with standalones > Right. This would work the same way in Rev. You can make a standalone to > run the whole business, and a separate data stack that the standalone > can save data to. ---------- OK, got it. Thank you. ---------- >> Should the other stack be a substack? Can I read and write to a substack, >> (which will be in the same folder, right?)? > > No. The rule is that an application can't save to its own file. A > substack would be in the same file on disk as the standalone app, so you > wouldn't be able to save to it. You need a separate stack on disk if you > want to save data. ---------- Yes I see, I suspected that. ---------- >> So what, exactly, would be the "normal" procedure for Windows. Where should >> I put the folder that contains data stacks and image files? > > Everything can go in one folder, or in any folder grouping you want. It > is also normal on Windows for all related files to be grouped together > in the same directory. ---------- OkeyDokey. That clears it up a bunch. I'm beginning to see the light... Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 2 16:35:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 2 16:35:01 2003 Subject: Writing with standalones In-Reply-To: <200303021701.MAA20200@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 17:17:17 +1000 > Subject: Re: Writing with standalones > From: "valetia at mac.com" > Yup, Jacqueline's right. By default, substacks are saved within the same > file as the standalone once built, so you can't save to them. > > However, if you do prefer to work with substacks rather than actual separate > stacks, you can get the distribution builder to automatically save your > substacks as separate stacks during the build process. ---------- Thanks much. I'm not sure why I would want to do that. If they must be separate, why not just create them that way from the get-go? ---------- > You'll find more information about how this is accomplished here: > > http://www.runrev.com/revolution/developers/articles/tipoftheweek/1.html ---------- Thanks again, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 2 17:02:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 2 17:02:00 2003 Subject: More groups In-Reply-To: <200303021701.MAA20200@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: OK, here's another one: These are virtual keyboards. How do I reference the same stored image to three separate background groups? The reason is because I need 3 parts of image 2 visible simultaneously as cutouts in the top image 1, such that the transparent buttons in those positions can control the visibility of the image parts. Orrrr... should I replace the transparent buttons with non-transparent buttons and toggle icons (not sure how to do that). This is the _least_ desireable method. The objective is to use large screen images for the keyboards so I can allow the user to switch keyboard styles in a preferences palette stack and see how they look and feel, i.e., the palette will have representational buttons in it and clicking on one switches the whole keyboard to that style in realtime. Ken N. From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Sun Mar 2 17:23:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Sun Mar 2 17:23:01 2003 Subject: Directory information In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <08F38679-4CFD-11D7-B147-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> I hadn't noticed that before, but diskSpace does seem to have problems with large disks. I have 22 GB free but it only says I have 2 GB free. As regards file or folder size, check out "the long files" and "the long folders". These gives lots of different bits of info, you'll have to check the docs to see what is what. Sorry, I don't know of any way to get file version numbers. Cheers, Sarah On Saturday, March 1, 2003, at 11:30 pm, ncouch wrote: > Anyone know of a way to gather directory or drive information? I have > tried > the "volumes" and "diskSpace" functions but they don't seem to get > what I am > looking for. > > What I am looking to do is use Revolution to gather information on such > things as: > > file size > free disk space > file version information > > Under Windows NT or Macintosh. > >> From what I have seen Revolution is limited in this area. The >> DiskSpace > seems to have a 1 GB limit on how much "free space" it can see (when I > have > over 24GB free on one drive alone. Maybe it is only measuring the free > space in the environment it is capable of using. > > Any thoughts? > > Nate Couch > Plano, TX > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Sun Mar 2 17:30:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Sun Mar 2 17:30:01 2003 Subject: Revolution vs. MetaCard In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Chris, There are many people on this list more qualified than me to answer this one, but I'll make the first attempt and they can all jump in when I get it wrong :-) Basically, Revolution IS Metacard but with a different front-end plus some added features. Revolution runs on the Metacard engine, so anything MC can do, Rev can do too (unless it is something that only appears in the latest version of MC - Rev is sometimes a version behind). My recommendation would be to download both starter kits, have a go at the tutorials and see which one feels more comfortable. For me, Metacard had the power but didn't operate in a way I could relate to. Rev came along and I found that it suited me very well, so I chose Rev, but I realise this is just a personal preference. There have been some reports of Metacard being more stable, but most of Rev's instability is in the development environment. Compiled apps are extremely stable. I can't help you with the database query. I know Rev has a lot of features for accessing various forms of external database, but I don't know how much of that is in MetaCard too. Cheers, Sarah On Saturday, March 1, 2003, at 02:22 am, Chris Sheffield wrote: > My company is currently looking at several development > tools to use for developing a reading comprehension > program for elementary age students. The program > consists of several levels of stories that the student > must interact with in different ways. There is also a > teacher management portion that the teachers use to > administer tests and track student progress throughout > the course. A full reporting system is a must. > > Anyway, I have been seriously looking at Revolution, > as I'm sure it would do the job for us, but then I > heard mention of MetaCard, which sounds like almost > exactly the same thing. So my question is, what's the > differency between the two? Is one better than the > other? Does someone have something that compares the > two? Maybe a white paper or something like that? Is > one easier to use than the other? How about database > access? > > I would appreciate any feedback from anyone. > > Thank you, > > Chris Sheffield > Read Naturally > > P.S. For a peak at what we're wanting to do, go to > www.readnaturally.com. The software is currently done > in Macromedia Authorware. > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more > http://taxes.yahoo.com/ > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From macstacks at earthlink.net Sun Mar 2 17:58:01 2003 From: macstacks at earthlink.net (Bruce A. Pokras) Date: Sun Mar 2 17:58:01 2003 Subject: Applescript to print PDFs from Rev? Message-ID: I know that this is a little off-topic, but I am trying to print several PDFs in a folder using AppleScript from Revolution. The idea is to select and print the files from the Finder, since Acrobat Reader is not scriptable. I can easily print the files when I use a literal list of files: select {file pathToFile1, file pathToFile2, file pathToFile3} print selection The problem comes when I try to use a variable to hold the list: select variableName (where variableName holds an AppleScript list) print selection That always gets me an "Invalid key form" error. Does anyone have a suggestion? Regards, Bruce Pokras mac-stacks at kagi.com From jbradshaw at blueyonder.co.uk Sun Mar 2 18:04:01 2003 From: jbradshaw at blueyonder.co.uk (Jez) Date: Sun Mar 2 18:04:01 2003 Subject: Prevent CloseStack Message-ID: <000501c2e10f$8c5a6a90$f2abc050@Jez2> How do I prevent the CloseStack message actually closing the stack ? I want to do various checks before I allow exit. Passing the message does not seem to work. From psahores at easynet.fr Sun Mar 2 18:31:01 2003 From: psahores at easynet.fr (Pierre Sahores) Date: Sun Mar 2 18:31:01 2003 Subject: Revolution vs. MetaCard References: Message-ID: <3E628738.B0E27762@easynet.fr> Sarah a ?crit : > > Hi Chris, > > There are many people on this list more qualified than me to answer > this one, but I'll make the first attempt and they can all jump in when > I get it wrong :-) > > Basically, Revolution IS Metacard but with a different front-end plus > some added features. Revolution runs on the Metacard engine, so > anything MC can do, Rev can do too (unless it is something that only > appears in the latest version of MC - Rev is sometimes a version > behind). > > My recommendation would be to download both starter kits, have a go at > the tutorials and see which one feels more comfortable. For me, > Metacard had the power but didn't operate in a way I could relate to. > Rev came along and I found that it suited me very well, so I chose Rev, > but I realise this is just a personal preference. There have been some > reports of Metacard being more stable, but most of Rev's instability is > in the development environment. Compiled apps are extremely stable. > > I can't help you with the database query. I know Rev has a lot of > features for accessing various forms of external database, but I don't > know how much of that is in MetaCard too. > > Cheers, > Sarah > > On Saturday, March 1, 2003, at 02:22 am, Chris Sheffield wrote: > > > My company is currently looking at several development > > tools to use for developing a reading comprehension > > program for elementary age students. The program > > consists of several levels of stories that the student > > must interact with in different ways. There is also a > > teacher management portion that the teachers use to > > administer tests and track student progress throughout > > the course. A full reporting system is a must. > > > > Anyway, I have been seriously looking at Revolution, > > as I'm sure it would do the job for us, but then I > > heard mention of MetaCard, which sounds like almost > > exactly the same thing. So my question is, what's the > > differency between the two? Is one better than the > > other? Does someone have something that compares the > > two? Maybe a white paper or something like that? Is > > one easier to use than the other? How about database > > access? > > > > I would appreciate any feedback from anyone. > > > > Thank you, > > > > Chris Sheffield > > Read Naturally > > > > P.S. For a peak at what we're wanting to do, go to > > www.readnaturally.com. The software is currently done > > in Macromedia Authorware. > > > > Just an add-one about using MC/REV to access RDBMS, To see a working example on how to link Metacard/Revolution to PostgreSQL, just read the great and detailled Sadhu's tutorial at . -- Cordialement, Pierre Sahores Inspection acad?mique de Seine-Saint-Denis. Applications et bases de donn?es WEB et VPN Qualifier et produire l'avantage comp?titif From psahores at easynet.fr Sun Mar 2 18:38:00 2003 From: psahores at easynet.fr (Pierre Sahores) Date: Sun Mar 2 18:38:00 2003 Subject: Applescript to print PDFs from Rev? References: Message-ID: <3E6288EC.43007968@easynet.fr> "Bruce A. Pokras" a ?crit : > > I know that this is a little off-topic, but I am trying to print > several PDFs in a folder using AppleScript from Revolution. The idea > is to select and print the files from the Finder, since Acrobat > Reader is not scriptable. > > I can easily print the files when I use a literal list of files: > > select {file pathToFile1, file pathToFile2, file pathToFile3} > print selection > > The problem comes when I try to use a variable to hold the list: > > select variableName (where variableName holds an AppleScript list) > print selection > > That always gets me an "Invalid key form" error. > > Does anyone have a suggestion? > > Regards, > > Bruce Pokras > mac-stacks at kagi.com > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution If you are using MacOS X, have an eye on the "HTMLDOC" free utility. I use it under Linux to send and display, on the fly, html sources as pdf screens inside webbrowsers and it works fine. -- Cordialement, Pierre Sahores Inspection acad?mique de Seine-Saint-Denis. Applications et bases de donn?es WEB et VPN Qualifier et produire l'avantage comp?titif From psahores at easynet.fr Sun Mar 2 18:40:01 2003 From: psahores at easynet.fr (Pierre Sahores) Date: Sun Mar 2 18:40:01 2003 Subject: Applescript to print PDFs from Rev? References: Message-ID: <3E628971.B3009C8C@easynet.fr> "Bruce A. Pokras" a ?crit : > > I know that this is a little off-topic, but I am trying to print > several PDFs in a folder using AppleScript from Revolution. The idea > is to select and print the files from the Finder, since Acrobat > Reader is not scriptable. > > I can easily print the files when I use a literal list of files: > > select {file pathToFile1, file pathToFile2, file pathToFile3} > print selection > > The problem comes when I try to use a variable to hold the list: > > select variableName (where variableName holds an AppleScript list) > print selection > > That always gets me an "Invalid key form" error. > > Does anyone have a suggestion? > > Regards, > > Bruce Pokras > mac-stacks at kagi.com > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution If you are using MacOS X, have an eye on the "HTMLDOC" free utility. I use it under Linux to send and display, on the fly, html sources as pdf screens inside webbrowsers and it works fine. To drive it from within Rev, you just need to use the shell() command. -- Cordialement, Pierre Sahores Inspection acad?mique de Seine-Saint-Denis. Applications et bases de donn?es WEB et VPN Qualifier et produire l'avantage comp?titif From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Sun Mar 2 18:55:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Sun Mar 2 18:55:01 2003 Subject: Applescript to print PDFs from Rev? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Firstly, make the script work in the Script Editor before trying to put it into Revolution. A couple of ideas: 1. try using: repeat for each item f in filelist select f print selection end repeat 2. In the literal list, you have the word file. Does the variable contain the word "file" for each item? If so, how about using the word "alias". I don't know if it will make any difference, but it would be worth a try. Cheers, Sarah On Monday, March 3, 2003, at 08:57 am, Bruce A. Pokras wrote: > I can easily print the files when I use a literal list of files: > > select {file pathToFile1, file pathToFile2, file pathToFile3} > print selection > > The problem comes when I try to use a variable to hold the list: > > select variableName (where variableName holds an AppleScript list) > print selection > > That always gets me an "Invalid key form" error. From monte at sweattechnologies.com Sun Mar 2 18:58:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Sun Mar 2 18:58:01 2003 Subject: Prevent CloseStack In-Reply-To: <000501c2e10f$8c5a6a90$f2abc050@Jez2> Message-ID: Look at closeStackRequest for a stack or shutDownRequest for an application quit. Not passing either of these will abort the close/quit. Monte > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Jez > Sent: Monday, 3 March 2003 9:31 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Prevent CloseStack > > > How do I prevent the CloseStack message actually closing the > stack ? I want > to do various checks before I allow exit. Passing the message > does not seem > to work. > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From ambassador at fourthworld.com Sun Mar 2 19:47:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Sun Mar 2 19:47:01 2003 Subject: Prevent CloseStack In-Reply-To: <000501c2e10f$8c5a6a90$f2abc050@Jez2> Message-ID: Jez wrote: > How do I prevent the CloseStack message actually closing the stack ? I want > to do various checks before I allow exit. Passing the message does not seem > to work. See the closeStackRequest message. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From timothy.hart5 at verizon.net Sun Mar 2 21:54:02 2003 From: timothy.hart5 at verizon.net (Tim Hart) Date: Sun Mar 2 21:54:02 2003 Subject: standardize window locations Message-ID: Is there a way to keep windows in a certain place when switching from stack to a substack. I am closing the stack when going to a substack. I want to windows to show up in the same place. Any ideas? From ncouch at mail.airmail.net Sun Mar 2 22:02:00 2003 From: ncouch at mail.airmail.net (ncouch) Date: Sun Mar 2 22:02:00 2003 Subject: directory Information Message-ID: Sarah, Thanks for the info. I think I can work with the "long files" and "long folders" enhancements. Cheers. Nate From ambassador at fourthworld.com Sun Mar 2 22:13:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Sun Mar 2 22:13:01 2003 Subject: standardize window locations In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Tim Hart wrote: > Is there a way to keep windows in a certain place when switching from > stack to a substack. I am closing the stack when going to a substack. > I want to windows to show up in the same place. Any ideas? Set the location of the substack in a preOpenStack handler. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From alrice at ARCplanning.com Sun Mar 2 22:16:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Sun Mar 2 22:16:01 2003 Subject: Windows standalone question Message-ID: <002BADBA-4D26-11D7-8AD3-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Having conquered the XP background color issue - thanks whoever wrote that script, I am troubleshooting some other windows oddities in my standalone. Looking at my standalone on Windows 2000, I notice: Some text which has it's foreground color set to blue loses it's colors (when running as a standalone) Some buttons which are disabled at certain times never appear disabled (when running as a standalone) Both of these issues do not exist in the IDE, on Windows 2000. Maybe I am doing something wrong in the build process? Thanks in advance. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Sun Mar 2 22:36:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Sun Mar 2 22:36:01 2003 Subject: Writing with standalones In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E62CCC0.1080900@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/2/03 3:12 PM, Monte Goulding wrote: > > Windows actually has a special folder > specifically for saving user data into. Thanks, I didn't know that. What folder would that be? -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 2 23:28:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 2 23:28:01 2003 Subject: Writing with standalones In-Reply-To: <200303022332.SAA29330@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: "Monte Goulding" > Subject: RE: Writing with standalones > Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2003 07:42:41 +1030 >> Everything can go in one folder, or in any folder grouping you want. It >> is also normal on Windows for all related files to be grouped together >> in the same directory. >> > > This is not quite correct. There can be problems saving files within the > Program Files directory on Windows if the user is running NT, 2000 or XP and > are not logged in as an administrator. Windows actually has a special folder > specifically for saving user data into ---------- Just one? That's wierd. I expect I will need many. Where is it? TIA, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 2 23:43:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 2 23:43:01 2003 Subject: Can't see shakobox.mc In-Reply-To: <200303022332.SAA29330@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hello, I can't see shakobox.mc in any list, and can't open it at all. I D/L'd it OK. and it's on the desktop, but nothing will open it. I tried opening it from Rev, but the list dialog doesn't show it. The Desktop Folder doesn't show it. When I tried to open from the DT, I got a dialog saying it couldn't open it because it couldn't find the program that created it, and couldn't find a translator. The only clue that it exists at all is its presence on the DT. I trashed it, went back to HyperActive and D/L'd it again with exactly the same results. I made a new folder and put it in it. Then I opened the folder and it was there. BUT, when I tried to open the folder from Rev, it was empty! I have no clue what's happening. Ideas? Ken N. From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Sun Mar 2 23:46:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Sun Mar 2 23:46:01 2003 Subject: color button contents? In-Reply-To: <002BADBA-4D26-11D7-8AD3-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: <20030303044225.21122.qmail@web20004.mail.yahoo.com> can you color button contents so that some choices are disabled? i have been using a "|" in front of disabled options. a list field might be easier to script, but the button has that familiar menu action. TIA erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Mon Mar 3 00:04:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Mon Mar 3 00:04:01 2003 Subject: Can't see shakobox.mc In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E62E18A.4030801@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/2/03 7:47 PM, Ken Norris wrote: > Hello, > > I can't see shakobox.mc in any list, and can't open it at all. > > I D/L'd it OK. and it's on the desktop, but nothing will open it. I tried > opening it from Rev, but the list dialog doesn't show it. The Desktop Folder > doesn't show it. When I tried to open from the DT, I got a dialog saying it > couldn't open it because it couldn't find the program that created it, and > couldn't find a translator. The only clue that it exists at all is its > presence on the DT. It's a StuffIt archive. Did you decompress it? If so, do you mean you can't open the stack itself? -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Mon Mar 3 00:31:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Mon Mar 3 00:31:01 2003 Subject: Can't see shakobox.mc In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E62E7BA.8090209@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/2/03 7:47 PM, Ken Norris wrote: > > I can't see shakobox.mc in any list, and can't open it at all. I just downloaded it myself and it uncompressed okay and opened in Revolution 1.1.1. But I noticed that the last tab on the main button -- the Install tab -- was missing when the stack is opened in Rev 1.1.1, which is crucial to stack operation. The missing tab is caused by the difference between anti-aliased text and Rev's older plain text in OS X. I've fixed the button so that all the tabs now display in both MetaCard and any version of Revolution. Those who can't see an "Install" tab on the button should probably download the newer version I just put on the server, which does display properly. Sorry about the mixup; I had forgotten about the difference in font displays. http://www.hyperactivesw.com/downloads/shakobox.sit This doesn't directly address why you can't see the stack in Revolution's file dialog, though. It worked here for me, so I'm not sure what's going on. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From monte at sweattechnologies.com Mon Mar 3 01:08:00 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Mon Mar 3 01:08:00 2003 Subject: Writing with standalones In-Reply-To: <3E62CCC0.1080900@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: > - > On 3/2/03 3:12 PM, Monte Goulding wrote: > > > > Windows actually has a special folder > > specifically for saving user data into. > > Thanks, I didn't know that. What folder would that be? > Well there is more than one and for a full rundown of special folders on Windows check out the tip on the Sons of Thunder site. I use specialFolderPath(26) which is for the current user but there are other folders that can be used for all users. Regards Monte From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk Mon Mar 3 04:34:01 2003 From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg) Date: Mon Mar 3 04:34:01 2003 Subject: Writing with standalones In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 7:42 am +1030 3/3/03, Monte Goulding wrote: >> > So what, exactly, would be the "normal" procedure for Windows. >> Where should >> > I put the folder that contains data stacks and image files? >> >> Everything can go in one folder, or in any folder grouping you want. It >> is also normal on Windows for all related files to be grouped together >> in the same directory. >> > >This is not quite correct. There can be problems saving files within the >Program Files directory on Windows if the user is running NT, 2000 or XP and >are not logged in as an administrator. Windows actually has a special folder >specifically for saving user data into. The same issue applies to Mac OS X if you have your standalone in the Applications folder and the logged on user has no Admin rights. On Windows, there are two "Application Data" folders for each user that can be used for saving datas. One is *typically* at "C:/Documents and Settings//Application Data"; the second is at "C:/Documents and Settings//Local Settings/Application Data". The first location is the standard location; the second is for data that you want to remain on the local machine only and not copied back to the user's roaming profile where such things are used. For example, cached internet files would go in the "Local Settings" location. On Mac OS X, the equivalent would be the Application Support folder at: "/Users//Library/Application Support/" See Ken Ray's increasingly brilliant documentation of how to get these locations on any machine using "specialFolderPath" at: Cheers Dave From simran at teleline.es Mon Mar 3 04:35:00 2003 From: simran at teleline.es (Peter Lundh) Date: Mon Mar 3 04:35:00 2003 Subject: Here's an easy one: Loop to change bkgcolor - follow-up (2) In-Reply-To: <200303022332.SAA29413@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: I put Rob's two scripts into a field and banged away on the returnKey and it works well: ============= --I put this script in a field on focusIn set the backgroundColor of me to "0,0,0" setBackgroundColor true end focusIn on returnInField setBackgroundColor false end returnInField local secondPass on setBackgroundColor initLocal if initLocal then get "0,0,0" put false into secondPass else get the backgroundColor of the target if it is "255,255,255" then get "0,0,0" put not secondPass into secondPass else put item 1 of it into rValue put item 2 of it into gValue put item 3 of it into bValue if secondPass then put rValue+15 into item 1 of it put gValue+15 into item 2 of it put bValue+15 into item 3 of it else if rValue < 255 then put rValue+15 into item 1 of it else if gValue < 255 then put gValue+15 into item 2 of it else put bValue+15 into item 3 of it end if end if end if end if set the backgroundColor of the target to it end setBackgroundColor ============= I would like to make two modifications to the script above and would appreciate some help: At the moment it cycles through the red color and then moves on to the green and the blue color and finally scales through the neutral colors (R=G=B). (1) I would like to modify it a bit, but can't figure out how - perhaps you can help: When it comes to the end of the red colors (255,0,0) it should RESET the red color (0,0,0) before moving on to the green color (0,15,0 0,30,0 etc). At the moment it keeps the red values at 255 producing a backwards yellow scale (red+green) instead of a green one. Like ways, at the end of the second cycle (255,255,0 at the moment, but should be 0,255,0) it should reset the red and green colors to 0 before starting on the blue scale (0,0,15 0,0,30 etc). At the moment the red and the green values are stuck at 255 making the scale go from pure yellow (255,255,0) to white (255,255,255) instead of from black (0,0,0) to pure blue (0,0,255). I have tried to fiddle around with the else...if arguments, but get lost... === (2) I would like the finished build not to be displayed in a window, or there to be a menu at the top of the screen. Just neutral grey background on which the colored square is placed. How can I achieve that? Many thanks in advance. -Peter -- Peter Lundh von Leithner E: simran at teleline.es UK From heather at runrev.com Mon Mar 3 06:18:01 2003 From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams) Date: Mon Mar 3 06:18:01 2003 Subject: T-shirt competition Message-ID: Greetings! The t-shirt competition is now open for voting. If you point your browsers here: http://www.runrev.com/revolution/tshirt.html you can admire all the entries. Choose the one you like best, and email me the number of your selection. Please send votes to me, heather at runrev.com, NOT TO THE LIST. You may vote once, and once only for a t-shirt and likewise, once and once only for a mug design. The winner will be the design with the most votes (no, really?). In the event of a tie, the winner will be decided by our esteemed managing director, Kevin. Voting will close at 9am my time, next Monday, the 10th March. May the best design win! Regards, Heather -- Heather Williams Runtime Revolution Ltd. Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought From jan.decroos at groepvanroey.be Mon Mar 3 08:28:02 2003 From: jan.decroos at groepvanroey.be (Jan Decroos) Date: Mon Mar 3 08:28:02 2003 Subject: Directory information (file version information on MacOS) Message-ID: This covers only the request for file version information : You can set or get a file's version (MacOS) by next DoVersion function - To *get* the version, let pVersion empty (give an empty string (mouseUp handler) when asking for the version string). - there is a bug in the engine when *creating* a new vers resource (file has no res.fork) : this will be solved in the 2.0 version. (the file looses it's type and creator) - Doversion is a function, also for setting the version of a file (returns empty) on mouseUp answer file "Give file:" if it is empty then exit to top put it into lFile -- 'version' : -- set : sets both long and short versions -- get : gets the long version answer "'Long version', 'short version' or 'version' ?" with "Long version" or "short version" or "version" put it into lOption ask "Give version (leave blank to get version):" put it into lVersion answer Doversion(lOption, lFile, lVersion) end mouseUp function DoVersion pOption, pFile, pVersion if the platform <> "MacOS" then answer "Error DoVersion : can only get/set versions on MacOS !!" exit to top end if if pOption is not among the items of "version,short version,long version" then answer "Error DoVersion : 1st argument must be 'version','short version' or 'long version' !!" exit to top end if if the number of lines of pFile <> 1 or pFile is empty then answer "Error DoVersion : 2nd argument must be one line and <> empty !!" exit to top end if if there is not a file pFile then answer "Error DoVersion : File not found !!" exit to top end if put pVersion is not empty into lSetting -- lSetting (setting the version) is true when pVersion is not empty put empty into lResult if pOption = "short version" then put false into lisLVers put true into lisSVers else if pOption = "long version" then put true into lisLVers put false into lisSVers else put true into lisLVers put lSetting into lisSVers end if if there is a file pFile then put getResource(pFile, "vers", 1) into lVersResource if lSetting then put "" into lSVers put "" into lLVers if lVersResource = "" then -- 1 : relase, 0 (2nd and 3rd part of release), 32 : development, 0 : non-release, 0 & 0 : Country Code (US : 0 & 0, France : 0 & 1, ...) repeat for each item litem in "1,0,32,0,0,0" put numtochar(litem) after lVersResource end repeat else put chartonum(char 7 of lVersResource) into lSVersLength put (char 8 to (8+lSVersLength-1) of lVersResource) into lSVers put (char (8+lSVersLength+1) to -1 of lVersResource) into lLVers end if if lisSVers then put line 1 of pVersion into lSVers if lisLVers then put line 1 of pVersion into lLVers put (char 1 to 6 of lVersResource)&(numtochar(length(lSVers)))&lSVers&(numtochar(length(lLVers)))&lLVers into lVersResource -- setResource(, , , , , ) get setResource(pFile,"vers",1,"version","",lVersResource) else if lVersResource <> "" then put chartonum(char 7 of lVersResource) into lSVersLength if lisSVers then put (char 8 to (8+lSVersLength-1) of lVersResource) into lResult else put (char (8+lSVersLength+1) to -1 of lVersResource) into lResult end if end if end if end if return (lResult) end DoVersion From Doug_Ivers at lord.com Mon Mar 3 08:41:01 2003 From: Doug_Ivers at lord.com (Ivers, Doug E) Date: Mon Mar 3 08:41:01 2003 Subject: another audio problem Message-ID: I've recorded audio files and saved them in the .au format. On Mac X, audio files can be played right from the finder window. The sound is crisp and clean. When I import into Rev. 1.1.1 and play in the Application Overview window, there is a raspy sound, esp. heard near the end when the volume is decreasing. Is this fixed in 2.0? -- D From runrev at technetx.com Mon Mar 3 12:24:01 2003 From: runrev at technetx.com (runrev at technetx.com) Date: Mon Mar 3 12:24:01 2003 Subject: Windows standalone question References: <002BADBA-4D26-11D7-8AD3-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: <001401c2e1a9$1a0d5840$0201a8c0@nh2> Alex, I have those inconsistent issues after building apps on WinXP and WinMe. Thankfully, it doesn't seem to have any issues with the core program though, just minor little annoyances. Ron runrev at technetx.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alex Rice" To: Sent: Sunday, March 02, 2003 7:12 PM Subject: Windows standalone question > Having conquered the XP background color issue - thanks whoever wrote > that script, I am troubleshooting some other windows oddities in my > standalone. Looking at my standalone on Windows 2000, I notice: > > Some text which has it's foreground color set to blue loses it's colors > (when running as a standalone) > > Some buttons which are disabled at certain times never appear disabled > (when running as a standalone) > > Both of these issues do not exist in the IDE, on Windows 2000. Maybe I > am doing something wrong in the build process? > > Thanks in advance. > > Alex Rice, Software Developer > Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. > alrice at ARCplanning.com > alrice at swcp.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From runrev at technetx.com Mon Mar 3 12:43:01 2003 From: runrev at technetx.com (runrev at technetx.com) Date: Mon Mar 3 12:43:01 2003 Subject: FYI -- disappearing stacks when launching Message-ID: <004801c2e1ab$be85eb60$0201a8c0@nh2> Hi all, this is just FYI. On Win systems, once in a while my main stack will seem to disappear for no reason. Other stacks will open, but the main stack simply doesn't show up. I've since learned that if this happens, simply open up the dimensions dialog and check where the location of the window is on the desktop. I had one that was x,y -33900,-46000 (respectively). I don't know how it got to that unvisible location on the desktop, but changing it back to 0,0 or something reasonable brought it back to the visible area. Thanks, Ron From janschenkel at yahoo.com Mon Mar 3 13:28:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Mon Mar 3 13:28:01 2003 Subject: "Heather Williams" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030303182410.29469.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com> --- Heather Williams wrote: > Greetings! > > The t-shirt competition is now open for voting. > > [snip] > > Regards, > > Heather Hi Heather, As a Lord of the Rings fan, I simply _must_ vote for the one that says "One tool to rule them all" :-) Can we get that on a mug as well? One side with the slogan, and the other side with the logo of RunRev? Just let me know when I can place my order... Best regards, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From alrice at ARCplanning.com Mon Mar 3 14:05:00 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Mon Mar 3 14:05:00 2003 Subject: Windows standalone question In-Reply-To: <001401c2e1a9$1a0d5840$0201a8c0@nh2> Message-ID: <7ED76CE6-4DAA-11D7-BA4F-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Monday, March 3, 2003, at 10:19 AM, runrev at technetx.com wrote: > Alex, I have those inconsistent issues after building apps on WinXP and > WinMe. Thankfully, it doesn't seem to have any issues with the core > program > though, just minor little annoyances. OK- I'm glad it's not just me. Does anyone have ideas for workarounds on the two items I mentioned? (font color, button disabling) I would also be thankful for any printing "gotchas" that exist on XP. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 3 14:14:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 3 14:14:01 2003 Subject: Can't see shakobox.mc In-Reply-To: <200303030935.EAA06612@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 23:00:58 -0600 > From: "J. Landman Gay" > Organization: HyperActive Software > Subject: Re: Can't see shakobox.mc > On 3/2/03 7:47 PM, Ken Norris wrote: >> Hello, >> >> I can't see shakobox.mc in any list, and can't open it at all. >. > > It's a StuffIt archive. Did you decompress it? If so, do you mean you > can't open the stack itself? ---------- PreNOTE: If you made shakobox.mc to work ONLY on OSX then that might account for it. I thought you said there were two versions, but there is only one available at the d/l site. When I d/l'd Tuviah's externals collection there were two files: 1) Mac OS, and 2) Mac OSX. However, BOTH show up in Rev's stack list dialog, whereas "shakobox.mc" does not Yes to both questions. Notice the name (of course I could've renamed it, but I didn't). When I d/l'd the file it comes up "shakobox.sit", then when you doubleclick it, Stuffit automatically unstuffs, i.e., decompresses it. AFAIK, it would do that no matter where it is. Then you end up with 2 files: shakobox.mc shakobox.sit I trashed "shakobox.sit" ...but you know all that is normal. If I try to open it from the DT, I get this Mac message: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ The document "shakobox.mc" could not be opened because the application that created it could not be found. Could not find a translation extension with appropriate translators. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ...in addition, "shakobox.mc" cannot be seen by the stack list dialog in Rev. It simply isn't there, and so it cannot be opened. I put it into a folder and moved the folder into the Rev folder (the Externals Collection folder is also in the Rev folder). When I open the folder from within the Rev folder window, the file is there, but when I open the folder from Rev's stack list dialog (Menu item "Open Stack"), it is EMPTY. The only explanation I can think of is that Rev 1.1.1 doesn't recognize it as a stack. NOTE: I don't have MC other than the Rev engine. Still, Tuviah Snyder's externals d/l'd fine and the OS will open from within Rev and install OK as well, but if I try to open them 'cold' from the folder they will also throw the same message above, and won't open (but. as I said, they DO show up in the Rev stack list dialog, and WILL open, unlike "shakobox.mc" I tried renaming it with a .rev extension and with no extension name, no good, no effect. Tuviah's stacks don't have extensions. The folder which I put shakobox.mc into shows 4 tiny parallelograms in the upper left corner of the mem line of the folder window. I've never seen them before and don't know what they mean, but it MUST have something to do with it because they are not there in the folder which has the externals collection. Where can I find info on the 4 little parallelograms (do they perhaps represent 4 other folders?). I have no cure so far :-(, but maybe it has something to do with OS 9.1. Perhaps the text problem caused it. Maybe it will work if I d/l it to the PB under OS 8.6. If I can open it there, maybe I can try transferring the file while file sharing is on. If not maybe I can open it from there and install it in my Rev apps from there (that would lead me to believe the problem is somewhere in OS 9.1, i.e., the dithered font doesn't exist and so it refuses recognition). I'll try it. Ken N. From janschenkel at yahoo.com Mon Mar 3 14:26:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Mon Mar 3 14:26:01 2003 Subject: Can't see shakobox.mc In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030303192219.66293.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Ken, The OS appearently doesn't know what 'filetype' and 'creator' the .mc file has. Have you tried drag&dropping the 'shakobox.mc' file onto the RunRev icon? If that doesn't do it, let us know, Jan Schenkel. --- Ken Norris wrote: > ********** > > Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 23:00:58 -0600 > > From: "J. Landman Gay" > > Organization: HyperActive Software > > Subject: Re: Can't see shakobox.mc > > > On 3/2/03 7:47 PM, Ken Norris wrote: > >> Hello, > >> > >> I can't see shakobox.mc in any list, and can't > open it at all. > >. > > > > It's a StuffIt archive. Did you decompress it? If > so, do you mean you > > can't open the stack itself? > ---------- > PreNOTE: If you made shakobox.mc to work ONLY on OSX > then that might account > for it. I thought you said there were two versions, > but there is only one > available at the d/l site. When I d/l'd Tuviah's > externals collection there > were two files: 1) Mac OS, and 2) Mac OSX. However, > BOTH show up in Rev's > stack list dialog, whereas "shakobox.mc" does not > > Yes to both questions. Notice the name (of course I > could've renamed it, but > I didn't). When I d/l'd the file it comes up > "shakobox.sit", then when you > doubleclick it, Stuffit automatically unstuffs, > i.e., decompresses it. > AFAIK, it would do that no matter where it is. Then > you end up with 2 files: > > shakobox.mc > shakobox.sit > > I trashed "shakobox.sit" > > ...but you know all that is normal. > > If I try to open it from the DT, I get this Mac > message: > > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > The document "shakobox.mc" could not be opened > because the application that > created it could not be found. > > Could not find a translation extension with > appropriate translators. > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > ...in addition, "shakobox.mc" cannot be seen by the > stack list dialog in > Rev. It simply isn't there, and so it cannot be > opened. I put it into a > folder and moved the folder into the Rev folder (the > Externals Collection > folder is also in the Rev folder). When I open the > folder from within the > Rev folder window, the file is there, but when I > open the folder from Rev's > stack list dialog (Menu item "Open Stack"), it is > EMPTY. The only > explanation I can think of is that Rev 1.1.1 doesn't > recognize it as a > stack. > > NOTE: I don't have MC other than the Rev engine. > > Still, Tuviah Snyder's externals d/l'd fine and the > OS will open from > within Rev and install OK as well, but if I try to > open them 'cold' from the > folder they will also throw the same message above, > and won't open (but. as > I said, they DO show up in the Rev stack list > dialog, and WILL open, unlike > "shakobox.mc" > > I tried renaming it with a .rev extension and with > no extension name, no > good, no effect. Tuviah's stacks don't have > extensions. > > The folder which I put shakobox.mc into shows 4 > tiny parallelograms in the > upper left corner of the mem line of the folder > window. I've never seen them > before and don't know what they mean, but it MUST > have something to do with > it because they are not there in the folder which > has the externals > collection. Where can I find info on the 4 little > parallelograms (do they > perhaps represent 4 other folders?). > > I have no cure so far :-(, but maybe it has > something to do with OS 9.1. > Perhaps the text problem caused it. Maybe it will > work if I d/l it to the PB > under OS 8.6. If I can open it there, maybe I can > try transferring the file > while file sharing is on. If not maybe I can open it > from there and install > it in my Rev apps from there (that would lead me to > believe the problem is > somewhere in OS 9.1, i.e., the dithered font doesn't > exist and so it refuses > recognition). > > I'll try it. > > Ken N. > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 3 14:41:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 3 14:41:01 2003 Subject: Fixed (was Can't see shakobox.mc) In-Reply-To: <200303031701.MAA13730@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: on 3/3/03 11:18 AM, Ken Norris at pixelbird at interisland.net wrote: > If not maybe I can open it from there and install it > in my Rev apps from there (that would lead me to believe the problem is > somewhere in OS 9.1, i.e., the dithered font doesn't exist and so it refuses > recognition). ---------- This was apparently the problem. After Jacque's font fix I trashed the old folder and downloaded again. This time I could see and open the stack from Rev. So, the non-existence of a font style used in a file may cause list dialogs to ignore the existence of the file under OS 9.1? Ken N. From mmaitzen at iupui.edu Mon Mar 3 14:52:01 2003 From: mmaitzen at iupui.edu (Maitzen, Michael R) Date: Mon Mar 3 14:52:01 2003 Subject: T-shirt competition Message-ID: <8F38A22EC36A0948B854417D7EC91E0363C6C7@iu-mssg-mbx01.exchange.iu.edu> I really like the first mug entry. None of the shirt entries quite make it for me. I may have to put aside my current projects and make something up. I will send something yet today. MRM -------------------------- > Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2003 11:14:05 +0000 > Subject: T-shirt competition > From: Heather Williams > To: > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > Greetings! > > The t-shirt competition is now open for voting. If you point your browsers > here: > > http://www.runrev.com/revolution/tshirt.html > > you can admire all the entries. Choose the one you like best, and email me > the number of your selection. Please send votes to me, heather at runrev.com, > NOT TO THE LIST. You may vote once, and once only for a t-shirt and > likewise, once and once only for a mug design. The winner will be the design > with the most votes (no, really?). In the event of a tie, the winner will be > decided by our esteemed managing director, Kevin. > > Voting will close at 9am my time, next Monday, the 10th March. May the best > design win! > > Regards, > > Heather > > -- > Heather Williams > Runtime Revolution Ltd. > Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 > Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought > From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Mon Mar 3 15:26:00 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Mon Mar 3 15:26:00 2003 Subject: Fixed (was Can't see shakobox.mc) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E63B977.8030809@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/3/03 10:45 AM, Ken Norris wrote: > After Jacque's font fix I trashed the old > folder and downloaded again. This time I could see and open the stack from > Rev. > > So, the non-existence of a font style used in a file may cause list dialogs > to ignore the existence of the file under OS 9.1? Doubtful. I'd suspect Jan's explanation is the better one -- that the creator and type codes didn't get translated from the Stuffit archive. I'm not sure why that would happen, since most people are downloading and opening the file okay, and since I used the same process to stuff the second version. I tried to contact you offlist, but my email bounced back. If you have any other trouble with Shakobox, contact me offlist and we'll figure it out. Then if necessary I can post any update information here to the list. We may as well spare everyone the gory details. ;) -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From chipp at chipp.com Mon Mar 3 15:35:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Mon Mar 3 15:35:01 2003 Subject: strange list behavior... Message-ID: I've got a list It expands and contracts (like an outline) sometimes, when the focus leaves the list... the hilitedline 'goes away.' sometimes it doesn't. There are no 'set the hilitedlines' commands for the list...any ideas? -Chipp From k_major at os.surf2000.de Mon Mar 3 15:55:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Mon Mar 3 15:55:01 2003 Subject: T-shirt competition In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0E82E286-4DBA-11D7-8ACF-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Hi all, > Greetings! > > The t-shirt competition is now open for voting. If you point your > browsers > here: > > http://www.runrev.com/revolution/tshirt.html > > you can admire all the entries. Choose the one you like best, and > email me > the number of your selection. Please send votes to me, > heather at runrev.com, > NOT TO THE LIST. You may vote once, and once only for a t-shirt and > likewise, once and once only for a mug design. The winner will be the > design > with the most votes (no, really?). In the event of a tie, the winner > will be > decided by our esteemed managing director, Kevin. > > Voting will close at 9am my time, next Monday, the 10th March. May the > best > design win! > > Regards, > > Heather i got an error when trying to compile the first entry. on drink do fill me repeat... ... But it works now, after i added quotes!!! on drink do "fill me" ## !!! repeat... ... So be careful when using that script! Hope that helps. Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de P.S. I doubt that entry number 2 will have a future in the USA without being censored a tiny bit;-) And missing quotes again... From RGould8 at aol.com Mon Mar 3 16:41:01 2003 From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com) Date: Mon Mar 3 16:41:01 2003 Subject: OT: Mac OSX Server administrator account Message-ID: This is off-topic, but somewhat relevant for me, as we're storing all our Revolution apps on a host server. My question is this - - - - someone I managed to mess up our Mac OS X Server in that my administrator account is gone - - - - - I can still log in as administrator in the Mac OS itself, but no longer in the Workgroup Manager. Is there a root administrator account I could use, or a hack to get into the Workgroup Manager for my server? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chipp at chipp.com Mon Mar 3 17:00:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Mon Mar 3 17:00:01 2003 Subject: T-shirt competition In-Reply-To: <0E82E286-4DBA-11D7-8ACF-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Message-ID: Klaus, I'm not sure what you mean...can you explain? > > P.S. > I doubt that entry number 2 will have a future in the USA without > being censored a tiny bit;-) > > And missing quotes again... Chipp From chipp at chipp.com Mon Mar 3 17:20:02 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Mon Mar 3 17:20:02 2003 Subject: strange list behavior...BUG Identified (Scott,Kevin) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Bug identified... Create a list field and populate it with lines more than the scroll of the list field (so that you can scroll the hilitedline off the field). If you put the following: on mouseDown put the htmlText of line (the hilitedlines of me) of me into temp end mouseDown in the script of the list field. It will 'reset'(set the hilitedlines to empty) when the hilited line item is scrolled off. (WinXP. Don't know about Mac --perhaps someone could test) The fix: Store the htmlText of the fld in a variable and access it that way. on mouseDown put the htmlText of me into tempHTMLtext put line the hilitedlines of me of tempHTMLtext into temp end mouseDown -Chipp From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 3 18:12:04 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Mon Mar 3 18:12:04 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: <3E60E84C.8050405@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: <20030303230841.23181.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com> --- "J. Landman Gay" wrote: > An install button copies > PlayCommand to your hard drive where it is > immediately ready for use. in Revolution mac OS 9.2.1, the "install" button presents a number of RR folders. is there a prefered folder? ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 3 18:21:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Mon Mar 3 18:21:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: <3E60E84C.8050405@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: <20030303231729.35573.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com> most of your examples join a time value to EACH note even when the time values have not changed. this is essential if you want to cut and paste. this practice needs to be the default if any editing is to be done. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Mon Mar 3 19:08:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Mon Mar 3 19:08:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: <20030303230841.23181.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030303230841.23181.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3E63ED99.90809@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/3/03 5:08 PM, erik hansen wrote: > in Revolution mac OS 9.2.1, the "install" button > presents a number of RR folders. is there a > prefered folder? I've answered this privately. Please direct all tech support questions on Shakobox to either me or Jon Bettencourt, whose email address is on the first card of the stack. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From alrice at ARCplanning.com Mon Mar 3 19:42:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Mon Mar 3 19:42:01 2003 Subject: printing on XP Message-ID: It tool all day, but I've made a breakthrough and now have a handler that prints a set of cards. More importantly, it works correctly with all images and button icons. It uses printer fonts. Looks great on XP. Scales to user's paper/orientation selection. Whew! If anyone wants to compare notes about printing from Rev, I'd love to shore up some of the things I learned today. Is there a printing cookbook section planned for 2.0? Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 3 20:40:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 3 20:40:00 2003 Subject: Fixed (was Can't see shakobox.mc) In-Reply-To: <200303032221.RAA22507@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2003 14:22:15 -0600 > From: "J. Landman Gay" > Subject: Re: Fixed (was Can't see shakobox.mc) >> So, the non-existence of a font style used in a file may cause list dialogs >> to ignore the existence of the file under OS 9.1? > Doubtful. I'd suspect Jan's explanation is the better one -- that the > creator and type codes didn't get translated from the Stuffit archive. ---------- Well, I did TWO separate d/l's with the first stack. Both times the exact same problem occured. After the font fix, I d/l'd again and it worked. If I were a cop, I'd think the OSX font was the guilty party, but I don't know if it will hold up in court. Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 3 20:50:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 3 20:50:00 2003 Subject: Referencing images in groups In-Reply-To: <200303032221.RAA22507@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: What happens if I reference the same image to two or more background groups? Does it have to store more than one image to work? TIA, Ken N. From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Mon Mar 3 21:07:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Mon Mar 3 21:07:01 2003 Subject: Here's an easy one: Loop to change bkgcolor - follow-up (2) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <897831E0-4DE5-11D7-B0D2-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Hi Peter, I don't know about your second query - you can do without menus but I think you can't display a field without a window. For resetting the red & green values back to 0 after their loops, try these script alterations: Set up 2 more local variables to tell you whether red & green have been done yet. local secondPass, redDone, greenDone In your setBackGroundColor handler, if initLocal is true then set both these new variables to false. Now edit the script as shown below: if rValue >= 255 then put true into redDone if gValue >= 255 then put true into greenDone if redDone = false then put rValue+15 into item 1 of it else if greenDone = false then put 0 into item 1 of it -- reset red to 0 put gValue+15 into item 2 of it else put 0 into item 2 of it -- reset green to 0 put bValue+15 into item 3 of it end if Note: I have reformatted the if ... then .. else loop. I often find that this makes it easier to trace and see what is happening when. Cheers, Sarah On Monday, March 3, 2003, at 07:35 pm, Peter Lundh wrote: snip > if rValue < 255 then put rValue+15 into item 1 of it > else > if gValue < 255 then put gValue+15 into item 2 of it > else put bValue+15 into item 3 of it > end if > end if snip > (1) I would like to modify it a bit, but can't figure out how - > perhaps you > can help: When it comes to the end of the red colors (255,0,0) it > should > RESET the red color (0,0,0) before moving on to the green color (0,15,0 > 0,30,0 etc). At the moment it keeps the red values at 255 producing a > backwards yellow scale (red+green) instead of a green one. > > Like ways, at the end of the second cycle (255,255,0 at the moment, but > should be 0,255,0) it should reset the red and green colors to 0 before > starting on the blue scale (0,0,15 0,0,30 etc). At the moment the red > and > the green values are stuck at 255 making the scale go from pure yellow > (255,255,0) to white (255,255,255) instead of from black (0,0,0) to > pure > blue (0,0,255). snip From chipp at chipp.com Tue Mar 4 00:34:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Tue Mar 4 00:34:01 2003 Subject: printing on XP In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Alex, That's great! Perhaps you can jot down some notes on a website. Or, if you like, you can email your notes to this list and I'll copy them and post them on my RunRev site -- perhaps Ken will do the same. Looking forward to hearing more;-) best, Chipp > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Alex Rice > Sent: Monday, March 03, 2003 6:39 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: printing on XP > > > It tool all day, but I've made a breakthrough and now have a handler > that prints a set of cards. More importantly, it works correctly with > all images and button icons. It uses printer fonts. Looks great on XP. > Scales to user's paper/orientation selection. Whew! > > If anyone wants to compare notes about printing from Rev, I'd love to > shore up some of the things I learned today. > > Is there a printing cookbook section planned for 2.0? > > Alex Rice, Software Developer > Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. > alrice at ARCplanning.com > alrice at swcp.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From janschenkel at yahoo.com Tue Mar 4 01:42:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Tue Mar 4 01:42:01 2003 Subject: Here's an easy one: Loop to change bkgcolor - follow-up (2) In-Reply-To: <897831E0-4DE5-11D7-B0D2-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Message-ID: <20030304063815.40386.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com> --- Sarah wrote: > Hi Peter, > > I don't know about your second query - you can do > without menus but I > think you can't display a field without a window. > > [snip] > Hi Peter, The easiest way to achieve that last bit, is to make the field the size of the stack, and then set the decorations of the stack to empty -- this will effectively prevent it being dragged around. However, if you don't display any menus, and don't have a close box for your window, you better have a button somewhere the user can click to quit your app. Hope this helped, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From k_major at os.surf2000.de Tue Mar 4 05:50:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Tue Mar 4 05:50:01 2003 Subject: T-shirt competition In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Chipp, > Klaus, > > I'm not sure what you mean...can you explain? >> >> P.S. >> I doubt that entry number 2 will have a future in the USA without >> being censored a tiny bit;-) >> >> And missing quotes again... > > > Chipp well, entry number 2 is about someone putting love into someone else and NOT about blood, killing, murder and the right of owning a gun... So i doubt that it will be a big hit in america, since i am sure it will be consored or at least someone will always hit the buzzer when it comes to that sentence... Now my intended joke about the land of the free (speech) and buzzers is as dead as the company i was working for ;-) Sorry for the confusion... Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From pierre.bernaert at www.runrev.com Tue Mar 4 05:50:36 2003 From: pierre.bernaert at www.runrev.com (Pierre) Date: Tue Mar 4 05:50:36 2003 Subject: Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical problems. Message-ID: De: Pierre Date: Sam 1 mars 2003 09:20:33 Europe/Paris ?: Liste R?volution Objet: Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical problems. Hi everyone, I'm a french and i'm in the process of translating major (For me) applications written with Hypercard to RR 1.1. The main tools of some of them mainly relies on "HyperText" approach. I found, using RR, that SORT and FIND commands didn't work with words having diacritical (Lettres accentu?es). Here is a small transcript which demonstrates what I mean for sorting: On MouseUp Put "?uf,Elephant,El?phant,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,Tigre," into OriginalValue Put OriginalValue into SortedValue Sort Items of line 1 of SortedValue Answer "Original Value :" && OriginalValue & return & "Sorted Value :" && SortedValue & return & Return & "The correct spelling in french is '?l?phant or El?phant and ?uf', other spellings are mistakes" End MouseUp The result is : ,Elephant,El?phant,Tigre,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,?uf Observing what the result is for "Tigre" and "?uf" shows what the problem is ... Too bad for the command Find , for example "Find El?phant" will not find ?l?phant I did send a mail to Kevin Miller below is its reply. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ---------------------------------------------------- My mail and the Answer from Kevin De: Kevin Miller Date: Jeu 20 f?v 2003 20:39:03 Europe/Paris ?: Objet: R?p : Find, Sort and more generally speaking "Diacritical" ... On 19/2/03 8:25 am, Pierre wrote: As you surely know, in RR 1.1 diacritical doesn't work as far as: ? At least FIND and SORT commands are concerned. ? I believe "RawKeyDown" is concerned too In both cases you get wrong answers (This was working fine with HC using "International" for sorting). I'm not used to "Unicode", as far as I know it will be implemented in Version 2. Will "Unicode" solve this major problem for "Hyper Text" applications ? Thank to tell me what are the plans on this topic. You can script around these issues, relatively easily. Unicode supports entering and display international text. We don't plan to make any further changes to these functions for 2.0, but could consider revisiting this (at the scripting level at least) for 2.1. In the mean time, try asking on the use-revolution mailing list, someone there is bound to be able to help write a script to overcome these issues. Kind regards, Kevin ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- As far as I am concerned I don't see how to deal with this, so my question to the members of this list is Has some members an idea on how to solved this and better has someone made it work ?? Many Thanks -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text/enriched Size: 3394 bytes Desc: not available URL: From janschenkel at yahoo.com Tue Mar 4 06:59:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Tue Mar 4 06:59:01 2003 Subject: Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical problems. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030304115542.40412.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com> --- Pierre wrote: > De: Pierre > Date: Sam 1 mars 2003 09:20:33 Europe/Paris > ?: Liste R?volution > > Objet: Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical > problems. > > Hi everyone, > > I'm a french and i'm in the process of translating > major (For me) > applications written with Hypercard to RR 1.1. > > The main tools of some of them mainly relies on > "HyperText" approach. > > I found, using RR, that SORT and FIND commands > didn't work with words > having diacritical (Lettres accentu?es). > > Here is a small transcript which demonstrates what I > mean for sorting: > > On MouseUp > Put > "?uf,Elephant,El?phant,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,Tigre," > into > OriginalValue > Put OriginalValue into SortedValue > Sort Items of line 1 of SortedValue > Answer "Original Value :" && OriginalValue & > return & "Sorted Value > :" && SortedValue & return & Return & "The > correct spelling in > french is '?l?phant or El?phant and ?uf', other > spellings are mistakes" > End MouseUp > > The result is : > ,Elephant,El?phant,Tigre,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,?uf > > Observing what the result is for "Tigre" and "?uf" > shows what the > problem is ... > > > Too bad for the command Find , for example "Find > El?phant" will not > find ?l?phant > > [snip] > > As far as I am concerned I don't see how to deal > with this, so my > question to the members of this list is > > Has some members an idea on how to solved this and > better has someone > made it work ?? > > Many Thanks > Bonjour Pierre, This issue has come up in the past. The easiest solution is to use the 'international' clause: sort lines of tVariable international However, some people have reported strange results, so your mileage may vary. If it doesn't work, you can adopt a different technique, which I described in an earlier post. Here's the link: http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2002-September/008173.html Hope this helped, Jan Schenkel. PS: here's a handy link for using google to search the use-revolution archives : http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From alrice at ARCplanning.com Tue Mar 4 08:56:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Tue Mar 4 08:56:01 2003 Subject: OT: Mac OSX Server administrator account In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <59271F4C-4E48-11D7-8E81-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Monday, March 3, 2003, at 02:37 PM, RGould8 at aol.com wrote: > This is off-topic, but somewhat relevant for me, as we're storing all > our Revolution apps on a host server.? My question is this - - - - > someone I managed to mess up our Mac OS X Server in that my > administrator account is gone - - - - - I can still log in as > administrator in the Mac OS itself, but no longer in the Workgroup > Manager.? Is there a root administrator account I could use, or a hack > to get into the Workgroup Manager for my server? I don't know about the Workgroup Manager, having only used OS X server a little bit. OS X, like NEXT, uses NetInfo for it's passwords and administrative info. In theory you can change any setting anywhere on the network, and it will be updated in the server, as long as you specify the correct netinfo domain, not the local machine domain. It's kind of a mystery, though I was sysadmin on some NEXT machines recently, I don't understand it. - As far as the root account, yes that's always a fallback administrator account on every OS X machine. First try logging in as root with your same password. It could work. - If necessary, enable the root account first. Gotta be administrator to do this! See Knowledge Base #106290 - Worst case scenario: Reboot the computer holding down Command-S. This will put you in single-user mode. It's a Unix shell with root access, and a stripped down environment. Disks may or may not be mounted, services not started up, etc. You could change passwords or (Maybe) issue netinfo commnds (start with ni-) from there. Or do limitless damage to your setup ;-) If you can become root on the Server machine, Workgroup Manager should allow you to add your administrative account back in. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From heather at runrev.com Tue Mar 4 09:02:03 2003 From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams) Date: Tue Mar 4 09:02:03 2003 Subject: T-shirt competition Message-ID: Greetings, again. The t-shirt voting is hotting up, and a winner is emerging. However, I have just received two late entries which I felt had such merit I had to put them up. So... If you want to go and look again, I'll accept an altered vote for either of the last two entries if you tell me you already voted and want to change it. The url once again: http://www.runrev.com/revolution/tshirt.html Regards, Heather -- Heather Williams Runtime Revolution Ltd. Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought From richmond at mail.maclaunch.com Tue Mar 4 09:14:01 2003 From: richmond at mail.maclaunch.com (Mathewson) Date: Tue Mar 4 09:14:01 2003 Subject: Drop Targets ??? Message-ID: Drop Targets Suppose I have 2 trashcans: 1 labelled ?Minerals? and the other labelled ?vegetables? (let them be jpegs) and a number of other jpegs: carrot, apple, diamond, sandstone, cabbage. I want users to drag the jpegs to the relevant trashcans and the jpegs to either: stick to the cans or disappear if the trashcan is the correct one, else pop back to its original position I?ve done this with Director (lovely but expensive) and Toolbook (Yuck) - and would love to do it with RunRev ................. Richmond Mathewson --------------------------------------------------------------- Great Macintosh Products The MacLaunch Store! http://www.maclaunch.com/cgi-launch/store/agora.cgi --------------------------------------------------------------- From alrice at ARCplanning.com Tue Mar 4 10:19:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Tue Mar 4 10:19:01 2003 Subject: print screens example handler (Rev 1.1.1) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <243EB7DA-4E54-11D7-8E81-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Monday, March 3, 2003, at 10:30 PM, Chipp Walters wrote: > Alex, > > That's great! Perhaps you can jot down some notes on a website. Or, if > you > like, you can email your notes to this list and I'll copy them and > post them > on my RunRev site -- perhaps Ken will do the same. > > Looking forward to hearing more;-) OK... here's my shpeel. I found that simply doing "print this stack" in Revolution would print stuff, but usually not what one wants to see. In my app the user fills in answers on a bunch of screens, and on the last screen there is a Print Screens button. So I'm printing the screens current stack. My requirements were- it should look nice, images and button icons should render properly, the print job should use printer fonts (formatForPrinting that is). The print job should respect user's selection for paper size, orientation and scaling. I found that these requirements cannot be achieved by actually printing the on-screen stack the user is looking at. There are several reasons for this: 1- the formatForPrinting property only takes effect after re-opening the stack. 2- "lock screen" causes some printing artifacts with icons. 3- Without "lock screen", the stack will be flashing from card to card, opening/closing and generally confusing the user. So, just bite the bullet and create a new stack for doing the print screens from. Like everything else in transcript, it's less code than you would think. Here is the handler I am using at this point: -- -- nicePrintScreens handler -- -- prints selected cards from a stack -- works with graphics and button icons -- uses printer fonts if available -- scales to user's zoom and orientation selections -- appears to work nicely on WinXP, 2000 and Mac OS X. -- todo: error handling on stack save/open commands -- on nicePrintScreens set the cursor to watch -- -- create a new stack for performing print screens layout -- lock messages new invisible stack "PrintScreens" -- don't keep stack in memory after we are done with it set the destroyStack of stack "PrintScreens" to true -- don't use printer fonts- yet. set the formatForPrinting of stack "PrintScreens" to false -- dont bother buffering since we are not actually displaying this stack on screen set the alwaysBuffer of stack "PrintScreens" to false -- make it our size set the width of stack "PrintScreens" to the width of this stack set the height of stack "PrintScreens" to the height of this stack -- copy selected cards repeat with tCardNumber = 1 to the number of cards in this stack -- here you could test the card to see if it's supposed to be printed put "true" into tActive if tActive then copy card tCardNumber of this stack to stack "PrintScreens" end if end repeat -- get rid of the first card in the stack -- it is blank and was put there when the stack was created. delete card 1 of stack "PrintScreens" -- yes, use printer fonts set the formatForPrinting of stack "PrintScreens" to true -- save out to file save stack "PrintScreens" as "printScreens.rev" close stack "printScreens.rev" -- re-open it to get the printer fonts to take effect go stack "printScreens.rev" -- -- perform the print job -- -- standard print dialog on Windows, page setup dialog on OS X. answer printer if the result = "Cancel" then beep exit nicePrintScreens end if -- the user's response for zoom and orientation is set into -- the printPaperSize put item 1 of the printPaperSize into tImgWidth put item 2 of the printPaperSize into tImgHeight put item 1 of the printMargins into tLeftMargin put item 3 of the printMargins into tRightMargin -- determine the scaling to fit the long sides -- of the print image and the card -- this was coded for a stack of 760x540 and it assumes that -- the stack is wider than it is tall. put the width of this stack into tMyWidth -- subtract the margins off the printable width put tImgWidth - tLeftMargin - tRightMargin into tImgWidth -- scale, if necessary -- note, this is scaling from Revolutions point of view. -- the user's zoom setting has already been translated into printPaperSize if tMyWidth > tImgWidth then put tImgWidth / tMyWidth into tScale set the printScale to tScale end if -- nice borders set the printCardBorders to true -- show the macos print dialog, if necessary if the platform = "MacOS" then open printing with dialog if the result = "Cancel" then beep exit nicePrintScreens end if else open printing end if print stack "PrintScreens" close printing close stack "PrintScreens" end nicePrintScreens Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From bvlahos at mac.com Tue Mar 4 11:20:00 2003 From: bvlahos at mac.com (Bill Vlahos) Date: Tue Mar 4 11:20:00 2003 Subject: T-shirt competition In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Heather, I vote for #11 for both mug and shirt. Any chance you could make sweatshirts or baseball caps too? Bill Vlahos On Tuesday, March 4, 2003, at 05:55 AM, Heather Williams wrote: > Greetings, again. > > The t-shirt voting is hotting up, and a winner is emerging. However, I > have > just received two late entries which I felt had such merit I had to > put them > up. So... If you want to go and look again, I'll accept an altered > vote for > either of the last two entries if you tell me you already voted and > want to > change it. > > The url once again: > > http://www.runrev.com/revolution/tshirt.html > > Regards, > > Heather > > -- > Heather Williams > Runtime Revolution Ltd. > Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 > Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > Bill Vlahos IT Manager, AeroVironment, Inc. From bvlahos at mac.com Tue Mar 4 12:08:01 2003 From: bvlahos at mac.com (Bill Vlahos) Date: Tue Mar 4 12:08:01 2003 Subject: T-shirt competition In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5F7B0F20-4E63-11D7-A8ED-000393C44AE0@mac.com> Oops. Sorry. I did not mean for that to go to the list. Bill Vlahos On Tuesday, March 4, 2003, at 08:16 AM, Bill Vlahos wrote: > Heather, > > Bill Vlahos > > On Tuesday, March 4, 2003, at 05:55 AM, Heather Williams wrote: > >> Greetings, again. >> >> The t-shirt voting is hotting up, and a winner is emerging. However, >> I have >> just received two late entries which I felt had such merit I had to >> put them >> up. So... If you want to go and look again, I'll accept an altered >> vote for >> either of the last two entries if you tell me you already voted and >> want to >> change it. >> >> The url once again: >> >> http://www.runrev.com/revolution/tshirt.html >> >> Regards, >> >> Heather >> >> -- >> Heather Williams >> Runtime Revolution Ltd. >> Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 >> Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought >> >> _______________________________________________ >> use-revolution mailing list >> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution >> > Bill Vlahos > IT Manager, AeroVironment, Inc. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > Bill Vlahos IT Manager, AeroVironment, Inc. From k_major at os.surf2000.de Tue Mar 4 12:59:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Tue Mar 4 12:59:01 2003 Subject: Drop Targets ??? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <98E78CF2-4E6A-11D7-93D4-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Hi Richmond, > Drop Targets > > Suppose I have 2 trashcans: 1 labelled ?Minerals? and the > other labelled ?vegetables? > (let them be jpegs) and a number of other jpegs: carrot, > apple, diamond, sandstone, cabbage. I want users to drag > the jpegs to the relevant trashcans and the jpegs to either: > stick to the cans > or > disappear if the trashcan is the correct one, else pop back > to its original position > > I?ve done this with Director (lovely but expensive) and > Toolbook (Yuck) - and would love to do it with RunRev > ................. > Richmond Mathewson no problem, i have done this before and i am still alive and well :-) Give this script to the things that are supposed to be dropped on the trash: on mousedown grab me ## yes, the easy way, why not :-) end mousedown on mouseUp if within(img "the correct trashcan", the mouseloc) then hide me ## or do whatever you want in this case else set the loc of me to x,y ## replace x,y with the original loc of this object end if end mouseUp Hope that helps... Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de P.S. Is the CD-ROM still coming? Or will i have to wait for christmas? ;-) From alrice at ARCplanning.com Tue Mar 4 14:55:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Tue Mar 4 14:55:01 2003 Subject: copying groups en mass q. Message-ID: --The workaround: Lock screen Go cd y Select group "x" Copy Go cd 1 paste -- in this message http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2002-December/ 010571.html -- Seems to work for me, however, it's a little baffling why it works. When one copies a group, when will all the properties of it's subgroups, controls, etc. get copied along with it, and when won't they? Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From mphasak at hotmail.com Tue Mar 4 15:20:00 2003 From: mphasak at hotmail.com (Michael Hasak) Date: Tue Mar 4 15:20:00 2003 Subject: can't import from file in OSX? Message-ID: >>get the fifth line of URL "file:/Users/guest/Desktop/radmindgui/ps_output" >>put it into field theOutput > >hmm... this should work as far as I see it... maybe there are no five lines >in that file? >maybe wanna quote the field name (for excluding all possible errors): >put it into field "theOutput" > Thanks, Bjorne, for the helpful suggestions -- I got sidetracked and wanted to have more to say when I wrote. Unfortunately, I'm still having the same trouble and so are some other people I've been working with (quoting the field name didn't help). I'm about to pursue the "open file", "read from file" syntax which I found at the awesome site http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs, which someone posted on the list. This isn't documented in any of the Revolution docs, though. Has anyone else had trouble with the URL file methods? I'll post with my results. Mike _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From alrice at ARCplanning.com Tue Mar 4 15:46:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Tue Mar 4 15:46:01 2003 Subject: backColor q. Message-ID: set the backColor of stack "X" to "white" Why does this only work part of the time? Looking for a pattern here. Thanks, Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From benr_mc at cogapp.com Tue Mar 4 16:10:01 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Tue Mar 4 16:10:01 2003 Subject: can't import from file in OSX? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 4/3/03 8:16 pm, Michael Hasak wrote > I'm about to pursue the "open file", "read from file" syntax which I found > at the awesome site http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs, which someone posted > on the list. This isn't documented in any of the Revolution docs, though. Well, "open file", "read from file" etc are documented in the Transcript Dictionary; and noted in the Development Guide in the same entry which describes use of the URL scheme. They aren't linked from the URL entry in the Transcript Dictionary (though there is a 'see also' link to "file", which itself has 'see also' links to "open file", "read from file" etc); and those entries themselves do each end with a tip noting the alternative of using the URL scheme. So perhaps it would be good if the URL entry ended with a tip noting the alternative of using the open file et al commands; but I think it's a little unfair to say that this syntax isn't documented in any of the Revolution docs! Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From mphasak at hotmail.com Tue Mar 4 17:24:00 2003 From: mphasak at hotmail.com (Michael Hasak) Date: Tue Mar 4 17:24:00 2003 Subject: can't import from file in OSX? (dictionary behavior) Message-ID: >From: Ben Rubinstein >Well, "open file", "read from file" etc are documented in the Transcript >Dictionary; and noted in the Development Guide in the same entry which >describes use of the URL scheme. They aren't linked from the URL entry in >the Transcript Dictionary (though there is a 'see also' link to "file", >which itself has 'see also' links to "open file", "read from file" etc); >and >those entries themselves do each end with a tip noting the alternative of >using the URL scheme. > Doesn't show up in my development guide entry for "import data from file", and it's not mentioned in the "file" entry of the dictionary. I never ran across it in the "see also" box either, probably because of the strange behavior of this box. For instance, I just followed my "file" search of the dictionary with an "open" search, and rather than getting an "open" entry it brought up the "go" entry with no see-also to anything related to this open-from-file syntax. I see this wrinkle to searching the documentation now, thanks to your pointer. But I had given up, and other would-be developers are likely to get hung up on this non-intuitive lookup behavior. Mike _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Tue Mar 4 17:36:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Tue Mar 4 17:36:01 2003 Subject: print screens example handler (Rev 1.1.1) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: This is interesting stuff Alex, but do you need to delete the "PrintScreens" stack after each print. If not, what happens when you try to save the next newly created "PrintScreens" stack. If it just over-writes without a dialog, that would be OK in this instance, but you don't want your users getting ambushed by a warning they know nothing about. One other wrinkle: as far as I know, formatForPrinting has no effect on Macs, so you could leave out quite a chunk of your script if you checked for this first. Cheers, Sarah On Wednesday, March 5, 2003, at 02:18 am, Alex Rice wrote: > I found that simply doing "print this stack" in Revolution would print > stuff, but usually not what one wants to see. In my app the user fills > in answers on a bunch of screens, and on the last screen there is a > Print Screens button. So I'm printing the screens current stack. > > My requirements were- it should look nice, images and button icons > should render properly, the print job should use printer fonts > (formatForPrinting that is). The print job should respect user's > selection for paper size, orientation and scaling. > > I found that these requirements cannot be achieved by actually > printing the on-screen stack the user is looking at. There are several > reasons for this: > > 1- the formatForPrinting property only takes effect after re-opening > the stack. > 2- "lock screen" causes some printing artifacts with icons. > 3- Without "lock screen", the stack will be flashing from card to > card, opening/closing and generally confusing the user. > > So, just bite the bullet and create a new stack for doing the print > screens from. Like everything else in transcript, it's less code than > you would think. Here is the handler I am using at this point: From alrice at ARCplanning.com Tue Mar 4 17:59:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Tue Mar 4 17:59:01 2003 Subject: print screens example handler (Rev 1.1.1) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5F477CD8-4E94-11D7-8E81-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Tuesday, March 4, 2003, at 03:31 PM, Sarah wrote: > This is interesting stuff Alex, but do you need to delete the > "PrintScreens" stack after each print. Maybe not, but it just seems safest- since this is a one-shot deal and all. > If not, what happens when you try to save the next newly created > "PrintScreens" stack. If it just over-writes without a dialog, that > would be OK in this instance, but you don't want your users getting > ambushed by a warning they know nothing about. Good point. So far, no warning messages when saving the "PrintScreens" stack over and over. > One other wrinkle: as far as I know, formatForPrinting has no effect > on Macs, so you could leave out quite a chunk of your script if you > checked for this first. Another good point. I'm not going to bother with it though since my deliverable is windows-only. Cheers, Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From benr_mc at cogapp.com Tue Mar 4 18:26:01 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Tue Mar 4 18:26:01 2003 Subject: can't import from file in OSX? (dictionary behavior) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 3/4/03 10:20 PM, Michael Hasak wrote > Doesn't show up in my development guide entry for "import data from file" wierd - it's the last item (at least on 1.1.1r2) > and it's not mentioned in the "file" entry of the dictionary. I agree it would be helpful and appropriate if it was referenced there. Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From gsaylor at net-virtual.com Wed Mar 5 04:51:01 2003 From: gsaylor at net-virtual.com (Greg Saylor) Date: Wed Mar 5 04:51:01 2003 Subject: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field In-Reply-To: <200302251702.MAA12024@www.runrev.com> References: <200302251702.MAA12024@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <20030305094711.30622@mail.earthlink.net> Hello, I was very interested in this, because it's exactly what I want to do... But, I am wondering how can you do this so that it is even more like iTunes?... What I mean is, I need to be able to sort the various columns with the little vertical arrows depending on which field was sorted and how it was sorted... The fields I have are going to be either numeric, alphanumeric, and a date in the format of "03-02-2003"... Thanks so much! - Greg >Hi Valetia, > >There are two ways to go, depending on what you want. >1) if you're okay with 'line-per-line' scrolling of >your field, you can simply: >- create a pattern in your favourite painting app >- import it as an image >- use the 'Colors' palette to set the >backgroundPattern of the field to your imported >pattern >- set the script of the field to : > on scrollbarDrag > put the scroll of me into tScroll > put the effective textHeight of me into >tLineHeight > if (tScroll MOD tLineHeight) is not 0 then > set the scroll of me to \ > ((tScroll DIV tLineHeight) * tLineHeight) > end if > end scrollbarDrag > >2) if you want pixel-per-pixel' scrolling, things get >a bit more complicated, but it is possible ; here's >the way I did it : >- create a pattern in your favourite painting app >- import it as an image >- create a rectangle the size of the field > 'Foo' >- set its lineSize to 0 >- use the 'Colors' palette to set the >backgroundPattern of the rectangle to your imported >pattern >- group the rectangle > 'Bar' >- set the margins of group "Bar" to 0 >- set the lockLocation of group "Bar" to true >- move the group behind the field >- set the field's opaque to false >Now a few more steps are needed to make it scroll >well: >- set the script of the field to : > on scrollbarDrag > set the scroll of group "Bar" to the scroll of me > end scrollbarDrag > on InitBkgnd > put the rect of graphic "Foo" into tBgRect > put the formattedHeight of me into tHeight > add (tHeight - item 4 of tRect - item 2 of tRect) >\ > to item 4 of tRect > end InitBkgnd >- and use the message box to : > set the scroll of grp "Bar" to 1 > set the scroll of fld "List" to 1 > send "InitBkgnd" to fld "List" > >You may have to fiddle some positions a bit with >respect to the field margins, and you'll have to make >sure the list field has a fixed line height. > >Hope this helped, > >Jan Schenkel. From mcompanys at mac.com Wed Mar 5 05:01:00 2003 From: mcompanys at mac.com (Emmanuel Companys) Date: Wed Mar 5 05:01:00 2003 Subject: Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical problems. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Le lundi, 3 mars 2003, ? 18:45 Europe/Paris, Pierre a ?crit : > De: Pierre > Date: Sam 1 mars 2003 09:20:33 Europe/Paris > ?: Liste R?volution > Objet: Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical problems. > > Hi everyone, > > I'm a french and i'm in the process of translating major (For me) > applications written with Hypercard to RR 1.1. > > The main tools of some of them mainly relies on "HyperText" approach. > > I found, using RR, that SORT and FIND commands didn't work with words > having diacritical (Lettres accentu?es). > > I did send a mail to Kevin Miller below is its reply. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > ----------------------------------------------------- > My mail and the Answer from Kevin > > De: Kevin Miller > Date: Jeu 20 f?v 2003 20:39:03 Europe/Paris > ?: > Objet: R?p : Find, Sort and more generally speaking "Diacritical" ... > > On 19/2/03 8:25 am, Pierre wrote: > > As you surely know, in RR 1.1 diacritical doesn't work as far as: > > ? At least FIND and SORT commands are concerned. > ? I believe "RawKeyDown" is concerned too > > In both cases you get wrong answers (This was working fine with HC > using "International" for sorting). > > I'm not used to "Unicode", as far as I know it will be implemented in > Version 2. > > Will "Unicode" solve this major problem for "Hyper Text" applications ? > > Thank to tell me what are the plans on this topic. > > You can script around these issues, relatively easily. Unicode > supports > entering and display international text. We don't plan to make any > further > changes to these functions for 2.0, but could consider revisiting this > (at > the scripting level at least) for 2.1. In the mean time, try asking > on the > use-revolution mailing list, someone there is bound to be able to help > write > a script to overcome these issues. > > Kind regards, > > Kevin > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > > As far as I am concerned I don't see how to deal with this, so my > question to the members of this list is > > Has some members an idea on how to solved this and better has someone > made it work ?? I encountered the same problem one year ago when I was working on my program Polylexis, that you may download from my iDisk. HyperCard has had "sort ascii" sorting according to the ascii value of each character, AND "sort international" with ignored both the upper case/low case difference AND any diacritics. This was a "pis-aller" more or less acceptable solution for French. Jos? Ileras, a RR user from Barcelona, told me that he had corresponded about the sorting problem with the R-R staff and that it should be taken care of in version 1.1; but I didn't find it was really implmented. Besides, the problem is not solved by just ignoring diacritics : FIRST: Where will be sorted special chars such as the german "SZ" (?)?; or "bar-o" (?), the "edh", "thorn", "bar-D", the "medium dot" (?), etc for that matter? SECOND: the diacritized letters have a special sorting behavior depending on the language: a) ? is sorted as a different letter in spanish, betwen N and O, in dictionnaries; and so is ? and many diacrized letters in several languages. Ignoring the diacritic then totally changes the alphabetical presentation. b) even when the diacritized letter is not considered as a separate letter, the typographic rules of the language my asign them a special place: for instance, in French "Macon" may come before "Ma?on", "Lez" before "L?s", "Pr?s" before "Pr?s" and so on. By simply ignoring the diacritics we get a random sorting. THIRD: Digraphs may have a special behavior too: a) Ligatures such as ? or ? will be equated to their upper case correspondents by "international sorting"; but where will they be listed? After the Z? As a separate letter (between and B, or O and P), as if they were normal digraphs (ae, oe)? equated to "?" or "?" (and "?")? Kevin Miller says: "We don't plan to make any further changes to these functions for 2.0, but could consider revisiting this (at the scripting level at least) for 2.1." I wish many R-R user will encourage him to do so (although I don't understand what "at the scripting level at least" means). The use of Unicode by istelf will not solve all the sorting problems, and, besides, it still has many inconveniences, mostly practical, and some technical; they certainly will be overcome but to use this two-byte system now, for chars that had been correctly sorted in any computer for 20 years is simply illogical. The work around I used in Polylexis is less elegant that Jan Schenkels's scripts (http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2002-September/ 008173.html), and I don't knw which one is faster. But mine takes care of all the points, while Jan's simple makes the diacritics and the case to be ignored. My script put the field to be sorted in a local, then reads the first word of each line of the local, and puts into a second item the "fake form" of it. This "fake form" is obtained by changing the diacritized letter by a digraph (or trigraph) that will ensure the correct location in the list: for instance, for spanish it will replace "?" by " "nzz" and "ch" by "cz" and "ll" by "lzz". Then I' just have to sort by item 2". Afterwards item 2 is deleted, and the contents of the local replaces that of the original field. I wrote a different "make fake" function for each of the 9 languages used in my program. Of course, this is slow in old computers. R-R should have at least: a) an option "sort international", and b) externals or plug-ins for at least the most used one-byte compliant languages. It would be nice if we had an option "sort system selected language" using the sorting system selected by the operating system; but I don't know how much this would be difficult, in a cross platform program... Manuel -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text/enriched Size: 6654 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gsaylor at net-virtual.com Wed Mar 5 06:07:01 2003 From: gsaylor at net-virtual.com (Greg Saylor) Date: Wed Mar 5 06:07:01 2003 Subject: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field (Jan Schenkel) In-Reply-To: <200302251702.MAA12024@www.runrev.com> References: <200302251702.MAA12024@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <20030305110336.24486@mail.earthlink.net> Hi Jan, Sorry for a second email on the same subject -- hopefully this won't cause confusion for you.. I did what you said below and it works except that the pattern does not seem to scroll when the field scrolls... Am I doing something wrong or did I miss something important?.. - Greg >Hi Valetia, > >There are two ways to go, depending on what you want. >1) if you're okay with 'line-per-line' scrolling of >your field, you can simply: >- create a pattern in your favourite painting app >- import it as an image >- use the 'Colors' palette to set the >backgroundPattern of the field to your imported >pattern >- set the script of the field to : > on scrollbarDrag > put the scroll of me into tScroll > put the effective textHeight of me into >tLineHeight > if (tScroll MOD tLineHeight) is not 0 then > set the scroll of me to \ > ((tScroll DIV tLineHeight) * tLineHeight) > end if > end scrollbarDrag From Cubist at aol.com Wed Mar 5 06:22:01 2003 From: Cubist at aol.com (Cubist at aol.com) Date: Wed Mar 5 06:22:01 2003 Subject: Finding and sorting by diacriticals Message-ID: <1d6.45ad7a4.2b9736e9@aol.com> I wrote a HyperTalk handler to perform an offset function that's sensitive to both diacriticals and capitalization: function IntlOffset Str1,Str2 put offset (Str1,Str2) into Fred if Fred <> 0 then put the length of Str1 into LenS1 put numToChar (8) into NullChar repeat until Fred = 0 put char Fred to (Fred + LenS1 - 1) of Str2 into Str3 if not ((Str1 < Str3) or (Str1 > Str3)) then exit repeat put NullChar into char Fred of Str2 put offset (Str1,Str2) into Fred end repeat end if return Fred end IntlOffset I gave this puppy some rudimentary testing in MetaCard 2.4.1 running under MacOS 8.6, and it seems to work fine. The trick is that second line inside the repeat loop: "if not ((Str1 < Str3) or (Str1 > Str3)) then exit repeat". In HyperTalk (and, apparently, in Transcript as well?), it is quite possible for two strings to return 'true' to *both* "StringA < StringB" *and* "StringA = StringB". This is because the poor engine is confused about capitalization and diacriticals. However, if StringA is neither greater than nor less than StringB, you can be confident that the two strings really and truly are equal! As for sorting, I've got another handler (a garden-variety Shell sort) which should theoretically do the job. While it works just fine in HyperCard, note that I have *not* tested it in MetaCard! This shouldn't be a serious problem -- even if MC barfs on this specific handler, the underlying logic ought to be clear enough that you can easily implement this algorithm in Transcript. function LSort TheList put (1 + the number of lines in TheList) div 2 into Pivott put "" into S1 put line Pivott of TheList into S2 put "" into S3 delete line Pivott of TheList repeat with K1 = 1 to the number of lines in TheList put line 1 of TheList into ThisUnit delete line 1 of TheList if ThisUnit < S2 then -- this is the sort/test! put ThisUnit into line (1 + the number of lines in S1) of S1 else put ThisUnit into line (1 + the number of lines in S3) of S3 end if end repeat if S1 "" then put LSort (S1) & return before S2 end if if S3 "" then put return & LSort (S3) after S2 end if return S2 end LSort Hope this helps... From Doug_Ivers at lord.com Wed Mar 5 06:29:00 2003 From: Doug_Ivers at lord.com (Ivers, Doug E) Date: Wed Mar 5 06:29:00 2003 Subject: another audio problem Message-ID: Still looking for help on this one... Is there an audio format that is generally best for Rev? -- D > -----Original Message----- > From: Ivers, Doug E > Sent: Monday, March 03, 2003 8:37 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: another audio problem > > > I've recorded audio files and saved them in the .au format. > On Mac X, audio files can be played right from the finder > window. The sound is crisp and clean. When I import into > Rev. 1.1.1 and play in the Application Overview window, there > is a raspy sound, esp. heard near the end when the volume is > decreasing. > > Is this fixed in 2.0? > > -- D > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From janschenkel at yahoo.com Wed Mar 5 06:43:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Wed Mar 5 06:43:01 2003 Subject: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field In-Reply-To: <20030305094711.30622@mail.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20030305113918.15457.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com> --- Greg Saylor wrote: > Hello, > > I was very interested in this, because it's exactly > what I want to do... > But, I am wondering how can you do this so that it > is even more like > iTunes?... What I mean is, I need to be able to > sort the various columns > with the little vertical arrows depending on which > field was sorted and > how it was sorted... The fields I have are going to > be either numeric, > alphanumeric, and a date in the format of > "03-02-2003"... > > Thanks so much! > > - Greg > Hi Greg, While I can't give you a complete stack to play around with at the moment, I'll give you a few hints: - set the script of the field to something like this: setProp uSortColumn pColumnAndDirection -- pColumnAndDirection form :: , put item 1 of pColumnAndDirection into tColumn put item 2 of pColumnAndDirection into tDirection set the itemDelimiter to tab sort lines of me tDirection by item tColumn of each -- pass so you can retrieve this info later pass uSortColumn end uSortColumn - create rectangular buttons above the field - set their labels, change the alignment to left so you can have icons on the right side of the buttons - set their scripts to something like this: constant kAscendingIconID = "123456" constant kDescendingIconID = "654321" -- better find suitable icon IDs for this on mouseUp -- this assumes it's the second column switch the icon of me case kDescendingIconID -- a triangle pointing down -- sorted descending, so we must sort ascending set the uSortColumn of fld "TheList" to \ "2,ascending" set the icon of me to kAscendingIconID break case kAscendingIconID -- a triangle pointing up -- sorted ascending, so we must sort descending set the uSortColumn of fld "TheList" to \ "2,descending" set the icon of me to kDescendingIconID break default -- no icon set for this button -- hasn't been sorted on this column yet -- so we'll set it to our preferred initial sort set the uSortColumn of fld "TheList" to \ "2,ascending" set the icon of me to kAscendingIconID break end switch end mouseUp - you can add things for numeric sorts, and the like - have a look at the stack Chipp Walters made for resizing columns ; it's available at : http://www.altuit.com/webs/altuit2/RunRev/Downloads.htm - however, things can get complicated if you want different alignments per column ; in such cases, you might want to overlay those columns with opaque fields with the correct alignment, and adapt the script of the field : setProp uSortColumn pColumnAndDirection -- pColumnAndDirection form :: , put item 1 of pColumnAndDirection into tColumn put item 2 of pColumnAndDirection into tDirection set the itemDelimiter to tab sort lines of me tDirection by item tColumn of each -- update the fields with different alignment -- this assumes column 3 is right-aligned instead repeat for each line tLine in me put item 3 of tLine & return after tColumn3 end repeat -- update, char 1 to -2 to avoid the trailing return put char 1 to -2 of tColumn3 into fld "Column 3" -- pass so you can retrieve this info later pass uSortColumn end uSortColumn on selectionChanged -- update the fields with different alignment set the hilitedLines of fld "Column 3" to \ the hilitedLines of me -- don't forget to add a similar 'selectionChanged' -- handler to those fields ! end selectionChanged Making a nice sample stack for these purposes is on my ever-growing "to do"-list, but I hope these hints got you started. Best regards, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From janschenkel at yahoo.com Wed Mar 5 06:51:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Wed Mar 5 06:51:01 2003 Subject: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field (Jan Schenkel) In-Reply-To: <20030305110336.24486@mail.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20030305114733.56372.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Greg, Now I remember what I thought afterwards I should have added to this scenario: - make TWO patterns, one where the white is on top and the blue below, and vice versa. - change the script slightly to : constant kPatternOneID = "456789" constant kPatternTwoID = "987654" -- better change these to the correct image IDs on scrollbarDrag put the scroll of me into tScroll put the effective textHeight of me into tLineHeight if (tScroll MOD tLineHeight) is not 0 then set the scroll of me to \ ((tScroll DIV tLineHeight) * tLineHeight) end if -- update the background pattern put (tScroll MOD tLineHeight) MOD 2 into tOddEven if tOddEven = 0 then set the backgroundPattern of me to kPatternOneID else set the backgroundPattern of me to tPatternTwoID end if end scrollbarDrag Hope this cleared a few things up, Jan Schenkel. --- Greg Saylor wrote: > Hi Jan, > > Sorry for a second email on the same subject -- > hopefully this won't > cause confusion for you.. I did what you said below > and it works except > that the pattern does not seem to scroll when the > field scrolls... Am I > doing something wrong or did I miss something > important?.. > > - Greg > > >Hi Valetia, > > > >There are two ways to go, depending on what you > want. > >1) if you're okay with 'line-per-line' scrolling of > >your field, you can simply: > >- create a pattern in your favourite painting app > >- import it as an image > >- use the 'Colors' palette to set the > >backgroundPattern of the field to your imported > >pattern > >- set the script of the field to : > > on scrollbarDrag > > put the scroll of me into tScroll > > put the effective textHeight of me into > >tLineHeight > > if (tScroll MOD tLineHeight) is not 0 then > > set the scroll of me to \ > > ((tScroll DIV tLineHeight) * tLineHeight) > > end if > > end scrollbarDrag > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From valetia at mac.com Wed Mar 5 07:08:01 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Wed Mar 5 07:08:01 2003 Subject: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field (Jan Schenkel) In-Reply-To: <20030305114733.56372.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Jan, I can't seem to get the patterns to line up properly with the textHeight of the field. Do you have examples of combinations of pattern dimensions and textHeights that are known work together? (Or perhaps a method of calculating these?) I've been trying to go with 16x16 since that's what the docs are recommending for cross-platform compatibility, but none of the textHeight integers seem to fit the patterns... Valetia > From: Jan Schenkel > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 03:47:33 -0800 (PST) > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field (Jan > Schenkel) > > Hi Greg, > > Now I remember what I thought afterwards I should have > added to this scenario: > - make TWO patterns, one where the white is on top and > the blue below, and vice versa. > - change the script slightly to : > constant kPatternOneID = "456789" > constant kPatternTwoID = "987654" > -- better change these to the correct image IDs > on scrollbarDrag > put the scroll of me into tScroll > put the effective textHeight of me into > tLineHeight > if (tScroll MOD tLineHeight) is not 0 then > set the scroll of me to \ > ((tScroll DIV tLineHeight) * tLineHeight) > end if > -- update the background pattern > put (tScroll MOD tLineHeight) MOD 2 into tOddEven > if tOddEven = 0 then > set the backgroundPattern of me to kPatternOneID > else > set the backgroundPattern of me to tPatternTwoID > end if > end scrollbarDrag > > Hope this cleared a few things up, > > Jan Schenkel. > > > --- Greg Saylor wrote: >> Hi Jan, >> >> Sorry for a second email on the same subject -- >> hopefully this won't >> cause confusion for you.. I did what you said below >> and it works except >> that the pattern does not seem to scroll when the >> field scrolls... Am I >> doing something wrong or did I miss something >> important?.. >> >> - Greg >> >>> Hi Valetia, >>> >>> There are two ways to go, depending on what you >> want. >>> 1) if you're okay with 'line-per-line' scrolling of >>> your field, you can simply: >>> - create a pattern in your favourite painting app >>> - import it as an image >>> - use the 'Colors' palette to set the >>> backgroundPattern of the field to your imported >>> pattern >>> - set the script of the field to : >>> on scrollbarDrag >>> put the scroll of me into tScroll >>> put the effective textHeight of me into >>> tLineHeight >>> if (tScroll MOD tLineHeight) is not 0 then >>> set the scroll of me to \ >>> ((tScroll DIV tLineHeight) * tLineHeight) >>> end if >>> end scrollbarDrag >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> use-revolution mailing list >> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more > http://taxes.yahoo.com/ > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From janschenkel at yahoo.com Wed Mar 5 07:39:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Wed Mar 5 07:39:01 2003 Subject: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field (Jan Schenkel) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030305123531.75202.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> --- "valetia at mac.com" wrote: > Hi Jan, > > I can't seem to get the patterns to line up properly > with the textHeight of > the field. > > Do you have examples of combinations of pattern > dimensions and textHeights > that are known work together? (Or perhaps a method > of calculating these?) > > I've been trying to go with 16x16 since that's what > the docs are > recommending for cross-platform compatibility, but > none of the textHeight > integers seem to fit the patterns... > > Valetia > Hi Valetia, Try changing the top margin of the field: put the margins of field "TheList" into tMargins if the number of items of tMargins = 1 then put tMargins & comma & "0" & comma & tMargins & \ comma & tMargins into tMargins else put 0 into item 2 of tMargins set the margins of field "TheList" to tMargins If that doesn't cut it, your best bet is to make the field transparent, make a rectangle behind it, with its backgroundPattern set correctly, shift it down a bit and add a tiny extra rectangle at the top to compensate for the offset of the textHeight ; then set this 'top' rectangle's colour or background pattern accordingly. Hope this helped, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From steve at messimercomputing.com Wed Mar 5 08:52:03 2003 From: steve at messimercomputing.com (Stephen Messimer) Date: Wed Mar 5 08:52:03 2003 Subject: copying grps In-Reply-To: <200303051003.FAA18237@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <201D421E-4F11-11D7-8DFD-000A27D75508@messimercomputing.com> On Wednesday, March 5, 2003, at 05:03 AM, use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote: > -- Seems to work for me, however, it's a little baffling why it works. > > When one copies a group, when will all the properties of it's > subgroups, controls, etc. get copied along with it, and when won't > they? Hi Alex, I work a lot with groups. I don't seem to have any problems with copied grps retaining the properties I stipulate. In my experience with this I have found that Rev will always copy grps faithfully and this includes any buttons, fields and nested grps. The problem arises when you try to get their scripts to work properly. When you copy a grp all the objects in the grp get new IDs. If you have referenced the ids in your scripts they aren't going to work (because they will have changed). I have found that if I name all the objects in a group ( at least those that are going to be referred to in scripts) that everything works out fine. Hope this helps. Regards Steve Stephen R. Messimer, PA 208 1st Ave. South Escanaba, MI 49829 www.messimercomputing.com From Doug_Ivers at lord.com Wed Mar 5 09:49:01 2003 From: Doug_Ivers at lord.com (Ivers, Doug E) Date: Wed Mar 5 09:49:01 2003 Subject: menu paradigm of Rev/MC and other goofiness Message-ID: Does anyone have an example they could send me in which a menubar menu is a stack? What would be the best way to show a checkmark in this case? How are submenus done? Maybe this would avoid some of the menu (and the associated scripting) goofiness since every menuItem is an object. -- D From benr_mc at cogapp.com Wed Mar 5 09:50:01 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Wed Mar 5 09:50:01 2003 Subject: Finding and sorting by diacriticals In-Reply-To: <1d6.45ad7a4.2b9736e9@aol.com> Message-ID: on 3/5/03 11:18 AM, Cubist at aol.com wrote > I wrote a HyperTalk handler to perform an offset function that's sensitive > to both diacriticals and capitalization: Out of interest, can you explain in what ways the 'caseSensitive' property falls short in this regard? I've had some problems with that property myself, but (without having tried it) I would have expected that it would do what was required here. If we can establish what it's not doing, perhaps we can press for some changes or an additional function. I think this is a very common need. Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From Doug_Ivers at lord.com Wed Mar 5 10:02:00 2003 From: Doug_Ivers at lord.com (Ivers, Doug E) Date: Wed Mar 5 10:02:00 2003 Subject: Finding and sorting by diacriticals Message-ID: In the near future I will need to sort and parse various European language texts, so I agree. -- D > -----Original Message----- > From: Ben Rubinstein [mailto:benr_mc at cogapp.com] > Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2003 9:46 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: Finding and sorting by diacriticals > > > on 3/5/03 11:18 AM, Cubist at aol.com wrote > > > I wrote a HyperTalk handler to perform an offset function > that's sensitive > > to both diacriticals and capitalization: > > Out of interest, can you explain in what ways the > 'caseSensitive' property > falls short in this regard? > > I've had some problems with that property myself, but > (without having tried > it) I would have expected that it would do what was required > here. If we > can establish what it's not doing, perhaps we can press for > some changes or > an additional function. I think this is a very common need. > > Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com > Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 > http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From alrice at ARCplanning.com Wed Mar 5 10:35:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Wed Mar 5 10:35:01 2003 Subject: copying grps In-Reply-To: <201D421E-4F11-11D7-8DFD-000A27D75508@messimercomputing.com> Message-ID: <966A6128-4F1F-11D7-A84D-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Wednesday, March 5, 2003, at 06:48 AM, Stephen Messimer wrote: > > I work a lot with groups. I don't seem to have any problems with > copied grps retaining the properties I stipulate. In my experience > with this I have found that Rev will always copy grps faithfully and > this includes any buttons, fields and nested grps. The problem arises > when you try to get their scripts to work properly. When you copy a > grp all the objects in the grp get new IDs. If you have referenced > the ids in your scripts they aren't going to work (because they will > have changed). I have found that if I name all the objects in a group > ( at least those that are going to be referred to in scripts) that > everything works out fine. Hi, I'm not referencing the IDs. Actually what I was seeing is that all the text was disappearing from the fields which were in the copied groups. Something was definitely wrong. If this is not a known bug, should I try to make a recipe for it? Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From scott at tactilemedia.com Wed Mar 5 11:13:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Wed Mar 5 11:13:01 2003 Subject: another audio problem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Recently, Ivers, Doug E wrote: >> I've recorded audio files and saved them in the .au format. >> On Mac X, audio files can be played right from the finder >> window. The sound is crisp and clean. When I import into >> Rev. 1.1.1 and play in the Application Overview window, there >> is a raspy sound, esp. heard near the end when the volume is >> decreasing. Try .WAV files, using "standard" sampling rates (11K, 22K, or 44K, at 8 or 16 bits). Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design Email: scott at tactilemedia.com Web: www.tactilemedia.com From michael-kristensen at dsa-net.dk Wed Mar 5 14:50:03 2003 From: michael-kristensen at dsa-net.dk (Michael Kristensen) Date: Wed Mar 5 14:50:03 2003 Subject: Latest pre-beta 2? In-Reply-To: <200303051701.MAA27528@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hi there Is Revolution 2.0 pre-beta 2 the latest release? Will we hear about new pre-beta releases here? Kind regards Michael Kristensen From pierre.bernaert at www.runrev.com Wed Mar 5 15:12:01 2003 From: pierre.bernaert at www.runrev.com (Pierre) Date: Wed Mar 5 15:12:01 2003 Subject: Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical problems. In-Reply-To: <20030304115542.40412.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1651CC2C-4E90-11D7-B9E1-000A27AF1BBC@local.> Bonsoir Jan There is a problem on the the Transcript Dictionary which doesn't mention "International" as a valid Sort Type. In fact International does something different which is Surprising Here is the result with "International": ,Tigre,?uf,?uf,?l?phant,?l?phant,?lephant,El?phant,z?bre,Z?bre,Elephant and the result without "International" ,Elephant,El?phant,Tigre,z?bre,Z?bre,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,?uf,?uf I shall use the links you gave me, they will give me a chance to find something to begin with and may be a solution. It seems the Find problem has been mentioned in these old mails. Thanks Pierre Le mardi, 4 mars 2003, ? 12:55 Europe/Paris, Jan Schenkel a ?crit : > > Bonjour Pierre, > > This issue has come up in the past. The easiest > solution is to use the 'international' clause: > sort lines of tVariable international > However, some people have reported strange results, so > your mileage may vary. > > If it doesn't work, you can adopt a different > technique, which I described in an earlier post. > Here's the link: > http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2002-September/ > 008173.html > > Hope this helped, > > Jan Schenkel. > > PS: here's a handy link for using google to search the > use-revolution archives : > http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more > http://taxes.yahoo.com/ > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text/enriched Size: 1813 bytes Desc: not available URL: From janschenkel at yahoo.com Wed Mar 5 15:21:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Wed Mar 5 15:21:01 2003 Subject: Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical problems. In-Reply-To: <1651CC2C-4E90-11D7-B9E1-000A27AF1BBC@local.> Message-ID: <20030305201740.40657.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> Bonsoir Pierre, Yves Coppe reported similar results. I mailed him earlier with an idea, but he hasn't replied yet, so maybe you could run the test for me? If you're not using a Mac, then disregard the following question. Would you try, with the same input: function MyInternationalSort pTextToSort put MacToISO(pTextToSort) into tTextToSort sort lines of tTextToSort international return ISOToMac(tTextToSort) end MyInternationalSort And tell me the result? Sort international works just fine on my WinME AND Win2K machines, so I was wondering if it was Mac-only and might be fixed with the above conversion. Thanks in advance, Jan Schenkel. --- Pierre wrote: > Bonsoir Jan > > There is a problem on the the Transcript Dictionary > which doesn't > mention "International" as a valid Sort Type. > > In fact International does something different which > is Surprising > Here is the result with "International": > ,Tigre,?uf,?uf,?l?phant,?l?phant,?lephant,El?phant,z?bre,Z?bre,Elephant > and the result without "International" > ,Elephant,El?phant,Tigre,z?bre,Z?bre,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,?uf,?uf > > I shall use the links you gave me, they will give me > a chance to find > something to begin with and may be a solution. > It seems the Find problem has been mentioned in > these old mails. > > Thanks > Pierre > > Le mardi, 4 mars 2003, ? 12:55 Europe/Paris, Jan > Schenkel a ?crit : > > > > Bonjour Pierre, > > > > This issue has come up in the past. The easiest > > solution is to use the 'international' clause: > > sort lines of tVariable international > > However, some people have reported strange > results, so > > your mileage may vary. > > > > If it doesn't work, you can adopt a different > > technique, which I described in an earlier post. > > Here's the link: > > > http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2002-September/ > > > 008173.html > > > > Hope this helped, > > > > Jan Schenkel. > > > > PS: here's a handy link for using google to search > the > > use-revolution archives : > > > http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more > > http://taxes.yahoo.com/ > > _______________________________________________ > > use-revolution mailing list > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From yvescoppe at skynet.be Wed Mar 5 17:10:01 2003 From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (Yves COPPE) Date: Wed Mar 5 17:10:01 2003 Subject: Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical problems. In-Reply-To: <20030305201740.40657.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030305201740.40657.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: >Yves Coppe reported similar results. I mailed him >earlier with an idea, but he hasn't replied yet, so >maybe you could run the test for me? >If you're not using a Mac, then disregard the >following question. Would you try, with the same >input: > >function MyInternationalSort pTextToSort > put MacToISO(pTextToSort) into tTextToSort > sort lines of tTextToSort international > return ISOToMac(tTextToSort) >end MyInternationalSort > >And tell me the result? Sort international works just your sort doesn't work for me with the list of Pierre :o( I run on Jaguar X.2.4 and Rev 1.1.1 French sytem (system preferences : international : french) sorry.... -- Greetings. Yves COPPE Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Wed Mar 5 17:19:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Wed Mar 5 17:19:01 2003 Subject: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greg, Download Chipp's altFldHeader stack from http://www.altuit.com/webs/altuit2/RunRev/Downloads.htm This gives you a group of header buttons that allow you to resize the columns of a field. You can also specify whether you want the button to be active and if so, you can put a sort routine in each one, or set a property that specifies the type of sort to do, and have a general sort routine that uses this. If you store the settings for the last sort, you can do reverse sorts if the same sort button is clicked a second time. Cheers, Sarah On Wednesday, March 5, 2003, at 07:52 pm, Greg Saylor wrote: > Hello, > > I was very interested in this, because it's exactly what I want to > do... > But, I am wondering how can you do this so that it is even more like > iTunes?... What I mean is, I need to be able to sort the various > columns > with the little vertical arrows depending on which field was sorted and > how it was sorted... The fields I have are going to be either numeric, > alphanumeric, and a date in the format of "03-02-2003"... > > Thanks so much! > > - Greg > >> Hi Valetia, >> >> There are two ways to go, depending on what you want. >> 1) if you're okay with 'line-per-line' scrolling of >> your field, you can simply: >> - create a pattern in your favourite painting app >> - import it as an image >> - use the 'Colors' palette to set the >> backgroundPattern of the field to your imported >> pattern >> - set the script of the field to : >> on scrollbarDrag >> put the scroll of me into tScroll >> put the effective textHeight of me into >> tLineHeight >> if (tScroll MOD tLineHeight) is not 0 then >> set the scroll of me to \ >> ((tScroll DIV tLineHeight) * tLineHeight) >> end if >> end scrollbarDrag >> >> 2) if you want pixel-per-pixel' scrolling, things get >> a bit more complicated, but it is possible ; here's >> the way I did it : >> - create a pattern in your favourite painting app >> - import it as an image >> - create a rectangle the size of the field > 'Foo' >> - set its lineSize to 0 >> - use the 'Colors' palette to set the >> backgroundPattern of the rectangle to your imported >> pattern >> - group the rectangle > 'Bar' >> - set the margins of group "Bar" to 0 >> - set the lockLocation of group "Bar" to true >> - move the group behind the field >> - set the field's opaque to false >> Now a few more steps are needed to make it scroll >> well: >> - set the script of the field to : >> on scrollbarDrag >> set the scroll of group "Bar" to the scroll of me >> end scrollbarDrag >> on InitBkgnd >> put the rect of graphic "Foo" into tBgRect >> put the formattedHeight of me into tHeight >> add (tHeight - item 4 of tRect - item 2 of tRect) >> \ >> to item 4 of tRect >> end InitBkgnd >> - and use the message box to : >> set the scroll of grp "Bar" to 1 >> set the scroll of fld "List" to 1 >> send "InitBkgnd" to fld "List" >> >> You may have to fiddle some positions a bit with >> respect to the field margins, and you'll have to make >> sure the list field has a fixed line height. >> >> Hope this helped, >> >> Jan Schenkel. > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From Cubist at aol.com Wed Mar 5 18:53:01 2003 From: Cubist at aol.com (Cubist at aol.com) Date: Wed Mar 5 18:53:01 2003 Subject: Finding and sorting by diacriticals Message-ID: <120.1eb6c3f4.2b97e6e2@aol.com> sez me: >> I wrote a HyperTalk handler to perform an offset function that's sensitive >> to both diacriticals and capitalization: sez benr_mc at cogapp.com: >Out of interest, can you explain in what ways the 'caseSensitive' property >falls short in this regard? Nope -- haven't played with 'caseSensitive', sorry. I posted those handlers because AFAICT, they're useful solutions which can be applied *right now*, without having to wait for Scott Raney to tweak the MetaCard engine (or the RunRev folks to tweak Rev). Naturally, it would be preferable for the engine itself to be intrinsically capable of dealing with case and diacriticals. But until that day... From smilingeyes at mac.com Wed Mar 5 19:55:01 2003 From: smilingeyes at mac.com (Ray Bennett) Date: Wed Mar 5 19:55:01 2003 Subject: windows, memory and how the heck do i debug crashes Message-ID: Okay, this isn't an easy question, but let me try and cut to the chase. I have a fairly complex application that is well-behaved on OS X (10.2.4) and well-behaved on OS 9.2.2. On Windows, 98 and XP, the application crashes with irregularity. I think have isolated it to times of intensive paging, pardon the pun. Specifically, if I do a lot of "go to card x, get some data, change some other data depending on that, then come back, make some changes on this card, then go back, etc.... The stacks I'm building on the fly approach 10 MB pretty frequently. The standalone will just quit (graceful Windows abort, not a hard crash). I register the app with the registry using the snippet that was on the use-rev list earlier this year. Now, I don't check to see if the app is already registered, I just do the HKEY sets every time I fire up if the platform is Win32. Other than that, I do no platform checking. Two questions: a) is there a known issue with standalones on windows and memory? b) how do I debug these windows problems? Really stuck here. Thanks! Ray From monte at sweattechnologies.com Wed Mar 5 20:57:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Wed Mar 5 20:57:01 2003 Subject: windows, memory and how the heck do i debug crashes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Ray When you build for Windows are you ding it in a Windows box. Even thogh you can build for Win32 on MacOS that doesn't mean you should. Opening all your files and saving them on a Win32 box then doing your build may help if that's the case. I think it's something to do with character encoding. This may not be your problem but it could be a possible issue. Cheers Monte > > Okay, this isn't an easy question, but let me try and cut to the chase. > > I have a fairly complex application that is well-behaved on OS X > (10.2.4) and well-behaved on OS 9.2.2. > > On Windows, 98 and XP, the application crashes with irregularity. I > think have isolated it to times of intensive paging, pardon the pun. > Specifically, if I do a lot of "go to card x, get some data, change > some other data depending on that, then come back, make some changes on > this card, then go back, etc.... > > The stacks I'm building on the fly approach 10 MB pretty frequently. > > The standalone will just quit (graceful Windows abort, not a hard > crash). > > I register the app with the registry using the snippet that was on the > use-rev list earlier this year. Now, I don't check to see if the app > is already registered, I just do the HKEY sets every time I fire up if > the platform is Win32. Other than that, I do no platform checking. > > Two questions: > a) is there a known issue with standalones on windows and memory? > b) how do I debug these windows problems? > > Really stuck here. Thanks! > Ray > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Wed Mar 5 21:07:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Wed Mar 5 21:07:01 2003 Subject: Transparent images Message-ID: AAARGGHHHH! I've done this before and now I can't get it to work. I am importing an image and I can't get the background to be transparent. I am using GraphicConvertor as my image editor and I have tried both PNG & GIF files, both with the background color set to transparent. In GC the background is shaded out and in the Finder it is greyed out. As soon as I import, the background goes back to opaque white and I can't do anything about it. This is driving me crazy, so I anyone has any ideas, please help! Sarah From kray at sonsothunder.com Wed Mar 5 23:08:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Wed Mar 5 23:08:01 2003 Subject: Viewing PDF Files in Revolution (Mac only) Message-ID: <006d01c2e395$723b8210$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> One of the posts to the SuperCard list mentioned a neat feature using QT under OS X: you can load PDF files inside of a Player object and then (assuming you have the controller showing) page through the PDF using the controller (or you can do so using a 'set the currentTime' script). Resizing the Player object resizes the PDF, and it renders beautifully. Note that this to require the release of 2.4.3 or higher of the MC engine, so it only appears to work in Rev 2.0 at the moment. Unfortunately it's not supported on Windows... dash it all... but for OS X implementations, it's a really cool feature. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From thinkertoys at cyburb.com Wed Mar 5 23:19:01 2003 From: thinkertoys at cyburb.com (thinkertoys) Date: Wed Mar 5 23:19:01 2003 Subject: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field Message-ID: Here's a solution to create a field w/ alternating colored lines that scroll. To get a demo stack just type the following into the message box: go stack URL "http://www.cyburb.com/rev/alternating.rev" The trick is to use a transparent scrolling fld on top of another field where it's htmlText is used to display two graphics that create the alternating lines. Then just change the scroll of both at the same time via scrollBarDrag. Make sure the graphics are sized to exactly match the textHeight of the top fld & set the margins for the bottom fld to 0. Eric Thinker Toys From janschenkel at yahoo.com Thu Mar 6 00:12:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Thu Mar 6 00:12:01 2003 Subject: Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical problems. In-Reply-To: <2F0D0E01-4F5E-11D7-8275-000A27AF1BBC@local.> Message-ID: <20030306050824.99060.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> --- Pierre wrote: > Bonsoir Jan, > > I'm using MAC system X.2.4 R.R. 1.1.1 > > I made a slight modification to your function to fit > my handler testing. > I used Items instead of lines. > I don't think it should bother it. > > [snip] > > It gives the same incoherent result as MAC original > sort using > International. > > [snip] > > Can you tell me what result you get running my test > on your machine > please ? > > Thanks, > > Pierre > --- "Yves COPPE" wrote: > your sort doesn't work for me with the list of > Pierre :o( > I run on Jaguar X.2.4 and Rev 1.1.1 French sytem > (system preferences : international : french) > sorry.... > -- > Greetings. > > Yves COPPE > Rats, there goes my theory. Oh well, it was worth a shot. FYI, the results of a regular sort international on my WinME Dutch : ?uf,Elephant,El?phant,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,oeuf,Oeuf,?uf,Tigre,z?bre,Z?bre And that was after I shuffled the data around a bit, to make sure it wasn't merely returning what you had stuffed into it. So it seems it's off on the capital ? but otherwise at least mostly okay. I'd say this is an area in the MetaCard engine that could use some loving and caring attention from Scott. In the meantime, we'll need some trickery to convert to a non-diacritical copy, do our sort/find/... on that copy, and interpret the results and apply them on the diacritical originals. Best regards, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Thu Mar 6 00:39:02 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Thu Mar 6 00:39:02 2003 Subject: Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical problems. In-Reply-To: <20030306050824.99060.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20030306053519.13236.qmail@web20010.mail.yahoo.com> how about Scandinavian? ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From valetia at mac.com Thu Mar 6 01:10:01 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Thu Mar 6 01:10:01 2003 Subject: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Eric, The stack looks great! However, the textHeight and patterns still don't seem to line up perfectly. You'll see it if you scroll to the bottom of the list (line 200)...the text isn't exactly in the middle of the colored lines anymore...is this issue solvable? Thanks! Valetia > From: thinkertoys > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Date: Wed, 5 Mar 03 23:15:50 -0500 > To: > Subject: Re: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field > > Here's a solution to create a field w/ alternating colored lines that > scroll. > > To get a demo stack just type the following into the message box: > go stack URL "http://www.cyburb.com/rev/alternating.rev" > > The trick is to use a transparent scrolling fld on top of another field > where it's htmlText is used to display two graphics that create the > alternating lines. Then just change the scroll of both at the same time > via scrollBarDrag. Make sure the graphics are sized to exactly match the > textHeight of the top fld & set the margins for the bottom fld to 0. > > Eric > Thinker Toys > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From valetia at mac.com Thu Mar 6 01:33:00 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Thu Mar 6 01:33:00 2003 Subject: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hey Eric and everyone, I may have found something...it seems when I added 1 more line to the field containing the pattern (in Eric's stack), the issue that I mentioned earlier disappeared... ...so a possible solution could be to simply always have 1 more line in the field containing the pattern. Valetia > From: "valetia at mac.com" > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2003 16:06:36 +1000 > To: > Subject: Re: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field > > Hi Eric, > > The stack looks great! However, the textHeight and patterns still don't seem > to line up perfectly. > > You'll see it if you scroll to the bottom of the list (line 200)...the text > isn't exactly in the middle of the colored lines anymore...is this issue > solvable? > > Thanks! > > Valetia From mcompanys at mac.com Thu Mar 6 03:29:00 2003 From: mcompanys at mac.com (Emmanuel Companys) Date: Thu Mar 6 03:29:00 2003 Subject: Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical problems. In-Reply-To: <20030306053519.13236.qmail@web20010.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2738964A-4FAD-11D7-B561-003065A81762@mac.com> Le jeudi, 6 mars 2003, ? 06:35 Europe/Paris, erik hansen a ?crit : > > how about Scandinavian? See my post (yesterday 10:58 western european). I tried to make a complete account of the problem. For scandinavian, as far as I know, I suppose you should do theese conversions: ? = ? > azz, ? = ? = ? > ozz, ? > azzz, "thorn" > tzz, "edh" > dzz the other diacriticals ignored (? > u, for instance) and or course lower case = upper case. If you are dealing with many languages you can write a function handler with a language parameter. I found it more convenient to directing the program to language specialized sub-handlers, rather than using complicated inbedding IFs. If you would like a copy of my post just ask. I didn't want to bother everybody in the llist by reproducing my long mail. You also can download my "Polylexis" from my iDisk public folder, and see how the system works with 9 different languages. Regards Manuel From chipp at chipp.com Thu Mar 6 03:59:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Thu Mar 6 03:59:01 2003 Subject: tab key doesn't work... Message-ID: Any idea why the tabkey would stop moving from field to field? I can't get it to work inside a field either (going to next tabstop). I've got a couple nested groups I'm working with. Any help is much appreciated. --------------------- Chipp Walters Altuit, inc. http://www.altuit.com http://www.chipp.com --------------------- From chipp at chipp.com Thu Mar 6 05:16:00 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Thu Mar 6 05:16:00 2003 Subject: tab key doesn't work... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Well, after some careful dissecting, I ended up doing the following to get this all to work. created a temp btn on mouseUp repeat with x = 1 to the number of controls on this cd set the traversalOn of control x to false --170 controls! end repeat end mouseUp Then I carefully ungrouped (not a good idea to store scripts in groups!) each group, reordered the tabbed elements and set their traversalOn to true. Got it working the way I wanted (thankyou RR for the Alignment palette reorder function) then carefully grouped it back together using a very light touch on the mouse and crossed fingers. It appears that the MC engine can get confused by nested groups and going in and out of them a lot. I launched the same stack in MC and had the same problems. -Chipp From ttasovac at princeton.edu Thu Mar 6 10:27:01 2003 From: ttasovac at princeton.edu (Toma Tasovac) Date: Thu Mar 6 10:27:01 2003 Subject: sentences as items Message-ID: How can I make Revolution count each sentence in a field as an item -- so that I can then easily manipulate whole sentences as item 1, item 2 etc. In other words is there a magical way to make several characters ("." "?" "!") count as the same itemDelimiter? All best, Toma From ambassador at fourthworld.com Thu Mar 6 10:31:00 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Thu Mar 6 10:31:00 2003 Subject: windows, memory and how the heck do i debug crashes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > I have a fairly complex application that is well-behaved on OS X > (10.2.4) and well-behaved on OS 9.2.2. > > On Windows, 98 and XP, the application crashes with irregularity. I > think have isolated it to times of intensive paging, pardon the pun. > Specifically, if I do a lot of "go to card x, get some data, change > some other data depending on that, then come back, make some changes on > this card, then go back, etc.... > > The stacks I'm building on the fly approach 10 MB pretty frequently. > > The standalone will just quit (graceful Windows abort, not a hard > crash). Two things to checkL 1. Try turning your display's hardware accelleration option off. 2. Make sure you have the latest drivers installed for your display. I've been making Win standalones on my Mac for years, and in the few cases where I've had mysterious behavior, one or both of the above have taken case of it in nearly every case. They may not be at the root of your issues, but they're worth trying. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From heather at runrev.com Thu Mar 6 12:12:01 2003 From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams) Date: Thu Mar 6 12:12:01 2003 Subject: latest pre-beta 2? In-Reply-To: <200303060542.AAA05953@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 20:44:39 +0100 > Subject: Latest pre-beta 2? > From: Michael Kristensen > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > Hi there > > Is Revolution 2.0 pre-beta 2 the latest release? Yes. > > Will we hear about new pre-beta releases here? Yes, if they are public ones. If we do a private alpha or beta, these will only be available to professional license holders, Regards, Heather > > > Kind regards > Michael Kristensen -- Heather Williams Runtime Revolution Ltd. Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Thu Mar 6 12:14:00 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Thu Mar 6 12:14:00 2003 Subject: sentences as items In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030306170933.21208.qmail@web20416.mail.yahoo.com> I don't know if this will work with itemDelimiter, but I used this trick in version 2.0 with the new lineDelimiter property. It worked well. What I did was put a special character at the end of each sentence (NumToChar(160) on Windows and NumToChar(202) on Mac). This character looks just like a space when displayed on screen, but it isn't really a space. Then I set the lineDelimiter property to that character. It worked perfectly. You might be able to do the same thing with itemDelimiter. Hope that helps. Chris Sheffield --- Toma Tasovac wrote: > How can I make Revolution count each sentence in a > field as an item -- > so that I can then easily manipulate whole sentences > as item 1, item 2 > etc. In other words is there a magical way to make > several characters > ("." "?" "!") count as the same itemDelimiter? > > All best, > Toma > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk Thu Mar 6 12:18:01 2003 From: livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk (livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk) Date: Thu Mar 6 12:18:01 2003 Subject: Transparent images Message-ID: <1c61f01c2e403$cfe74430$748017ac@blueyonder.net> On Thu, 6 Mar 2003 12:02:51 +1000, Sarah wrote: >AAARGGHHHH! I've done this before and now I can't get it to work. I am >importing an image and I can't get the background to be transparent. I >am using GraphicConvertor as my image editor and I have tried both PNG >& GIF files, both with the background color set to transparent. In GC >the background is shaded out and in the Finder it is greyed out. As >soon as I import, the background goes back to opaque white and I can't >do anything about it. >This is driving me crazy, so I anyone has any ideas, please help! Sarah, I tried to reproduce the problem and couldn't, but I didn't use the image editor from inside RR. If I use GraphicConverter on MacOS 9.2.2 and use the 'T' tool to set transparency in a GIF, and save the GIF outside Revolution, then the 'Import as Control' item in the RR Dev environment does produce an image with transparency set (for me, anyway). Did you have trouble with this technique, or just the one where the image editor is invoked from within Revolution? -------------------- Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK & France From ttasovac at princeton.edu Thu Mar 6 12:48:01 2003 From: ttasovac at princeton.edu (Toma Tasovac) Date: Thu Mar 6 12:48:01 2003 Subject: sentences as items In-Reply-To: <20030306170933.21208.qmail@web20416.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Thanks a lot, Chris. I think that's exactly what I need. But, pardon my ignorance: how do you insert these special characters? Also, if you're using Unicode and you set the useUnicode to true, is there a corresponding Unicode character that does the same trick and that I could then use in both Mac and Windows versions? Many thanks, again. Toma On Thursday, March 6, 2003, at 06:09 PM, Chris Sheffield wrote: > I don't know if this will work with itemDelimiter, but > I used this trick in version 2.0 with the new > lineDelimiter property. It worked well. > > What I did was put a special character at the end of > each sentence (NumToChar(160) on Windows and > NumToChar(202) on Mac). This character looks just > like a space when displayed on screen, but it isn't > really a space. Then I set the lineDelimiter property > to that character. It worked perfectly. You might be > able to do the same thing with itemDelimiter. > > Hope that helps. > > Chris Sheffield > > --- Toma Tasovac wrote: >> How can I make Revolution count each sentence in a >> field as an item -- >> so that I can then easily manipulate whole sentences >> as item 1, item 2 >> etc. In other words is there a magical way to make >> several characters >> ("." "?" "!") count as the same itemDelimiter? >> >> All best, >> Toma >> >> _______________________________________________ >> use-revolution mailing list >> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >> > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more > http://taxes.yahoo.com/ > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Thu Mar 6 14:19:01 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Thu Mar 6 14:19:01 2003 Subject: sentences as items In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030306191510.40637.qmail@web20414.mail.yahoo.com> Well, first let me say that I am very new to Revolution. It just so happens that I was working on a similar problem yesterday, and this is how I solved it. So I thought I'd share it. :-) It is entirely possible that there is a better solution. As far as inserting these characters, you can do it the long way like I did and copy the character to the clipboard and then paste it into your text. Are you using external text files or static text in a field? You could probably make the process a lot easier by writing a small script that would search through a block of text, locate any sentence-ending punctuation (".", "!", "?", etc.) and then insert the special character after the punctuation. I haven't done this yet because I was just trying to throw something together to show my boss, but I'm sure it would work. Keep in mind that it will look like a space when on the screen, so you may also have to remove existing spaces at the end of sentences. As for the unicode thing, that's a little beyond my skills at this point. Sorry. Maybe someone else on the list can address that one. Chris Sheffield Read Naturally --- Toma Tasovac wrote: > Thanks a lot, Chris. I think that's exactly what I > need. > > But, pardon my ignorance: how do you insert these > special characters? > Also, if you're using Unicode and you set the > useUnicode to true, is > there a corresponding Unicode character that does > the same trick and > that I could then use in both Mac and Windows > versions? > > Many thanks, again. > > Toma > > > > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu Thu Mar 6 15:56:01 2003 From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry) Date: Thu Mar 6 15:56:01 2003 Subject: Trap/script for arrow keys? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Here's my stupid question of the day: How to trap for the arrow keys and rescript their behavior to move a graphic (in this case, I used a button) about the screen? Here's what didn't work: on keydown whichkey global theXcoord, theYcoord if whichkey = numToChar(30) then -- up arrow key? subtract 10 from theYcoord set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord end if if whichkey = numToChar(31) then --down arrow key? add 10 to theYcoord set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord end if if whichkey = numToChar(28) then --left arrow key? subtract 10 from theXcoord set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord end if if whichkey = numToChar(29) then --right arrow key? add 10 to theXcoord set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord end if end keydown Perhaps this maps differently on a windows or unix machine, but I think that these are the correct mac keyboard numbers (from the Danny Goodman book) but when I try "answer numToChar(28)" in the message box it gives me other characters. Any suggestions? Thanks! Judy From scott at tactilemedia.com Thu Mar 6 16:14:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Thu Mar 6 16:14:01 2003 Subject: Trap/script for arrow keys? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Recently, "Judy Perry" wrote: > on keydown whichkey > global theXcoord, theYcoord > if whichkey = numToChar(30) then -- up arrow key? > subtract 10 from theYcoord > set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord > end if > if whichkey = numToChar(31) then --down arrow key? > add 10 to theYcoord > set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord > end if > if whichkey = numToChar(28) then --left arrow key? > subtract 10 from theXcoord > set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord > end if > if whichkey = numToChar(29) then --right arrow key? > add 10 to theXcoord > set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord > end if > end keydown > > Perhaps this maps differently on a windows or unix machine, but I think > that these are the correct mac keyboard numbers (from the Danny Goodman > book) but when I try "answer numToChar(28)" in the message box it gives me > other characters. > > Any suggestions? You could use the arrowKey message: on arrowKey tKey switch tKey case "left" # your move script break case "right" # your move script break # etc. end switch end arrowKey Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design ----- E: scott at tactilemedia.com W: http://www.tactilemedia.com From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Thu Mar 6 17:48:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Thu Mar 6 17:48:01 2003 Subject: How do I measure character width? Message-ID: I want to put some characters in a field, equally spaced horizontally and vertically. Meaning, my lines are "A B C D" etc, and want the vertical distance between lines the same as the horizontal distance between A and B. I'm using a monospaced font. I've found the textHeight parameter. Now how do I measure the width of a string such as "A " so that I can set the text height to that? -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From ambassador at fourthworld.com Thu Mar 6 18:00:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Thu Mar 6 18:00:01 2003 Subject: How do I measure character width? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Victor Eijkhout wrote: > I want to put some characters in a field, equally spaced horizontally > and vertically. Meaning, my lines are "A B C D" etc, and want the > vertical distance between lines the same as the horizontal distance > between A and B. I'm using a monospaced font. > > I've found the textHeight parameter. Now how do I measure the width > of a string such as "A " so that I can set the text height to that? See the formattedWidth property. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From NFeasey at utpress.utoronto.ca Thu Mar 6 18:04:01 2003 From: NFeasey at utpress.utoronto.ca (Feasey, Nicholas) Date: Thu Mar 6 18:04:01 2003 Subject: Silly Array Question Message-ID: Ok, I admit it, I'm not getting it. I have no problem deleting an item (line) from a list but now I'm trying to delete an item from an array. I have looked through the online documentation and, for some reason, I'm not grasping which the command used to delete an array element? Any assistance, as per usual, is greatly appreciated. N From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu Thu Mar 6 18:07:00 2003 From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry) Date: Thu Mar 6 18:07:00 2003 Subject: Trap/script for arrow keys? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Pfffft! @;-) Thanks! Judy On Thu, 6 Mar 2003, Scott Rossi wrote: > You could use the arrowKey message: > > on arrowKey tKey > switch tKey > case "left" > # your move script > break > case "right" > # your move script > break > # etc. > end switch > end arrowKey From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu Thu Mar 6 18:26:00 2003 From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry) Date: Thu Mar 6 18:26:00 2003 Subject: Trap/script for arrow keys? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Still doesn't work: on arrowKey tKey switch tKey case "left" subtract "10" from theYcoord set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord break case "right" add 10 to theYcoord set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord break case "up" subtract 10 from theXcoord set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord break case "down" add 10 to theXcoord set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord break end switch end arrowKey ??? Judy From monte at sweattechnologies.com Thu Mar 6 18:37:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Thu Mar 6 18:37:01 2003 Subject: Silly Array Question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: delete variable myArray["whatever"] Cheers Monte > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Feasey, > Nicholas > Sent: Friday, 7 March 2003 9:31 AM > To: 'use-revolution at lists.runrev.com' > Subject: Silly Array Question > > > Ok, I admit it, I'm not getting it. > > I have no problem deleting an item (line) from a list but now I'm > trying to > delete an item from an array. > > I have looked through the online documentation and, for some > reason, I'm not > grasping which the command used to delete an array element? > > Any assistance, as per usual, is greatly appreciated. > > N > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Thu Mar 6 18:47:00 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Thu Mar 6 18:47:00 2003 Subject: Trap/script for arrow keys? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4EDAB807-502D-11D7-8F32-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Judy, I can't see where you set theXcoord and theYCoord initially. Try inserting these lines before the "switch" statement: put item 1 of the loc of btn "Fish" into theXCoord put item 2 of the loc of btn "Fish" into theYCoord It seems a bit illogical that you are using left & right arrows to move up & down and vice versa :-) I think you need to change it so that left & right change theXCoord and up/down change theYCoord. Cheers, Sarah On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 09:31 am, Judy Perry wrote: > Still doesn't work: > > on arrowKey tKey > switch tKey > case "left" > subtract "10" from theYcoord > set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord > break > case "right" > add 10 to theYcoord > set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord > > break > case "up" > subtract 10 from theXcoord > set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord > break > case "down" > add 10 to theXcoord > set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord > break > end switch > end arrowKey > > > ??? > > Judy > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From monte at sweattechnologies.com Thu Mar 6 18:52:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Thu Mar 6 18:52:01 2003 Subject: Trap/script for arrow keys? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Try on arrowKey tKey put the loc of btn "Fish" into tLoc switch tKey case "left" subtract 10 from item 1 of tLoc break case "right" add 10 to item 1 of tLoc break case "up" subtract 10 from item 2 of tLoc case "down" add 10 to item 2 of tLoc break end switch set the loc of btn "Fish" to tLoc end arrowKey Put it in the card script Cheers Monte > > > Still doesn't work: > > on arrowKey tKey > switch tKey > case "left" > subtract "10" from theYcoord > set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord > break > case "right" > add 10 to theYcoord > set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord > > break > case "up" > subtract 10 from theXcoord > set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord > break > case "down" > add 10 to theXcoord > set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord > break > end switch > end arrowKey > > > ??? > > Judy > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu Thu Mar 6 19:17:01 2003 From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry) Date: Thu Mar 6 19:17:01 2003 Subject: Trap/script for arrow keys? In-Reply-To: <4EDAB807-502D-11D7-8F32-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Message-ID: Sarah, I have these set in the openCard handler, so they DO possess a value prior to the keydown being sent. Ummm, yeah, it would be nice if things matched wouldn't it?! Actually, I'd just be happy to get the *&#! thing to move! Judy On Fri, 7 Mar 2003, Sarah wrote: > Judy, > > I can't see where you set theXcoord and theYCoord initially. Try > inserting these lines before the "switch" statement: > put item 1 of the loc of btn "Fish" into theXCoord > put item 2 of the loc of btn "Fish" into theYCoord > > It seems a bit illogical that you are using left & right arrows to move > up & down and vice versa :-) I think you need to change it so that left > & right change theXCoord and up/down change theYCoord. From xslaugh at hotmail.com Thu Mar 6 19:30:01 2003 From: xslaugh at hotmail.com (Scott Slaugh) Date: Thu Mar 6 19:30:01 2003 Subject: Creating and grabbing buttons Message-ID: I have a bunch of buttons in a group. In the mouseDown handler of the button, it calls a handler which copies the button to the card, gives it a new script, and renames the button. In the script of the new button, I have a grab command in the mouseDown handler. The behavior I am trying to get is that I double-click on the button in the group and drag away, with the new button following the mouse. However, I currently have to click on the group button, then wait a second before I click on the new button, otherwise I can't drag the button. Does anyone have any suggestions of how to remedy this? Scott Slaugh _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Thu Mar 6 19:41:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Thu Mar 6 19:41:01 2003 Subject: Transparent images In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I think it might partly be a GraphicConverter in OS X problem. Chipp sent me a test image which works perfectly in Rev but looks weird when opened in GC. I upgraded to GC 4.5.1 and his image now works fine, but doesn't look as if any color is set to transparent. My images still aren't working correctly, but I have found that if I create a new image (rather than copying some clipart) and save it as a GIF, then it will come in transparent. otherwise, I can use a Mac only solution and set the ink to transparent. I still can't work out why I can't get PNGs to work transparently. Cheers, Sarah On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 03:21 am, livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk wrote: > On Thu, 6 Mar 2003 12:02:51 +1000, Sarah > wrote: > >> AAARGGHHHH! I've done this before and now I can't get it to work. I am >> importing an image and I can't get the background to be transparent. I >> am using GraphicConvertor as my image editor and I have tried both PNG >> & GIF files, both with the background color set to transparent. In GC >> the background is shaded out and in the Finder it is greyed out. As >> soon as I import, the background goes back to opaque white and I can't >> do anything about it. > > >> This is driving me crazy, so I anyone has any ideas, please help! > > > Sarah, I tried to reproduce the problem and couldn't, but I didn't use > the image editor from inside RR. If I use GraphicConverter on MacOS > 9.2.2 and use the 'T' tool to set transparency in a GIF, and save the > GIF outside Revolution, then the 'Import as Control' item in the RR > Dev environment does produce an image with transparency set (for me, > anyway). Did you have trouble with this technique, or just the one > where the image editor is invoked from within Revolution? > > -------------------- > Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK & France > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Thu Mar 6 19:43:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Thu Mar 6 19:43:01 2003 Subject: Creating and grabbing buttons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3110F03B-5035-11D7-8F32-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Use a mouseDoubleDown handler. If the interval between clicks is too short, it gets trapped as a mouseDoubleDown (& Up) message but if you put your grab script in a mouseDoubleDown handler, it should work as you expect. Cheers, Sarah On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 10:30 am, Scott Slaugh wrote: > I have a bunch of buttons in a group. In the mouseDown handler of the > button, it calls a handler which copies the button to the card, gives > it a new script, and renames the button. In the script of the new > button, I have a grab command in the mouseDown handler. The behavior > I am trying to get is that I double-click on the button in the group > and drag away, with the new button following the mouse. However, I > currently have to click on the group button, then wait a second before > I click on the new button, otherwise I can't drag the button. Does > anyone have any suggestions of how to remedy this? > > Scott Slaugh > > _________________________________________________________________ > Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu Thu Mar 6 19:49:01 2003 From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry) Date: Thu Mar 6 19:49:01 2003 Subject: Transparent images In-Reply-To: Message-ID: This probably doesn't help you, Sarah, but I am using GC in OSX to produce images with areas of transparency and it works fine for me (easier than the 'set ink to noop' or whatever it is). Judy On Fri, 7 Mar 2003, Sarah wrote: > I think it might partly be a GraphicConverter in OS X problem. Chipp > sent me a test image which works perfectly in Rev but looks weird when > opened in GC. I upgraded to GC 4.5.1 and his image now works fine, but > doesn't look as if any color is set to transparent. My images still > aren't working correctly, but I have found that if I create a new image > (rather than copying some clipart) and save it as a GIF, then it will > come in transparent. otherwise, I can use a Mac only solution and set > the ink to transparent. I still can't work out why I can't get PNGs to From xslaugh at hotmail.com Thu Mar 6 20:22:01 2003 From: xslaugh at hotmail.com (Scott Slaugh) Date: Thu Mar 6 20:22:01 2003 Subject: Creating and grabbing buttons Message-ID: I would use that, except that by the time that I am clicking the second time, there is a new button in that position. I have the template button, and I then have the new moveable button right on top of the template button. Scott Slaugh >Use a mouseDoubleDown handler. If the interval between clicks is too short, >it gets trapped as a mouseDoubleDown (& Up) message but if you put your >grab script in a mouseDoubleDown handler, it should work as you expect. > >Cheers, >Sarah > >On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 10:30 am, Scott Slaugh wrote: > >>I have a bunch of buttons in a group. In the mouseDown handler of the >>button, it calls a handler which copies the button to the card, gives it a >>new script, and renames the button. In the script of the new button, I >>have a grab command in the mouseDown handler. The behavior I am trying to >>get is that I double-click on the button in the group and drag away, with >>the new button following the mouse. However, I currently have to click on >>the group button, then wait a second before I click on the new button, >>otherwise I can't drag the button. Does anyone have any suggestions of >>how to remedy this? >> >>Scott Slaugh _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 From jhurley at infostations.com Thu Mar 6 20:31:00 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Thu Mar 6 20:31:00 2003 Subject: sentences as items In-Reply-To: <200303061702.MAA14647@www.runrev.com> References: <200303061702.MAA14647@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > >Message: 6 >Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 16:19:01 +0100 >Subject: sentences as items >From: Toma Tasovac >To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > >How can I make Revolution count each sentence in a field as an item -- >so that I can then easily manipulate whole sentences as item 1, item 2 >etc. In other words is there a magical way to make several characters >("." "?" "!") count as the same itemDelimiter? > >All best, >Toma > > Toma, I'm not sure what kind of manipulation you had in mind but as an example of what you might try, the mouseUp handler below will interchange sentences 3 and 5 in text in which all sentences end in .,? or ! It's not pretty. It puts a new delimiter at the end of each sentence, does the manipulation and then deletes the delimiter. On mouseUP put "*" into tChar --Or some less likely character put field 1 into tText put addDelimiter(tText,tChar) into tText put interchangeSentences(3,5,tText,tChar)into tText replace tChar with "" in tText put tText into field 2 end mouseUP function addDelimiter temp,tChar replace "." with "." & tChar in temp replace "?" with "?" & tChar in temp replace "!" with "!" & tChar in temp return temp end addDelimiter function interchangeSentences n,m,theText,tChar set the itemdelimiter to tChar put item n of theText into temp put item m of theText into item n of theText put temp into item m of theText return theText end interchangeSentences Hope this gives you some ideas. Jim From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Thu Mar 6 20:35:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Thu Mar 6 20:35:01 2003 Subject: Trap/script for arrow keys? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <8A023F78-503C-11D7-8F32-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Judy, insert a "put" or "answer" statement in your arrowKey script so you can see if it is actually being called. Also, check the settings for textArrows and navigationArrows. They may have no effect but it is worth checking. Cheers, Sarah On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 11:25 am, Judy Perry wrote: > Sarah, > > I have these set in the openCard handler, so they DO possess a value > prior > to the keydown being sent. > > Ummm, yeah, it would be nice if things matched wouldn't it?! Actually, > I'd just be happy to get the *&#! thing to move! > > Judy > On Fri, 7 Mar 2003, Sarah wrote: > >> Judy, >> >> I can't see where you set theXcoord and theYCoord initially. Try >> inserting these lines before the "switch" statement: >> put item 1 of the loc of btn "Fish" into theXCoord >> put item 2 of the loc of btn "Fish" into theYCoord >> >> It seems a bit illogical that you are using left & right arrows to >> move >> up & down and vice versa :-) I think you need to change it so that >> left >> & right change theXCoord and up/down change theYCoord. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu Thu Mar 6 21:06:01 2003 From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry) Date: Thu Mar 6 21:06:01 2003 Subject: Trap/script for arrow keys? In-Reply-To: <8A023F78-503C-11D7-8F32-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Message-ID: I get this message for error description: Error description: do: error in source expression b " There was an Execution Error at 5:55:56 PM Error description: set: can't set property Object: card id 1002 of stack "/TiX/Users/judyperry/Documents/RunRev Stuff/MovingSprite.rev" -------------------- switch tKey -------------------- Value: arrowKey " There was an Execution Error at 5:54:54 PM Error description: subtract: destination has a bad format (numeric?) Object: card id 1002 of stack "/TiX/Users/judyperry/Documents/RunRev Stuff/MovingSprite.rev" -------------------- subtract 10 from theXcoord -------------------- and Error description: Object: coordinate is not a point Line: 0 Character: 0 Value: theXcoord Error description: Chunk: can't set property set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord Line: 12 Character: 15 Value: But the math aspect of it works just fine from within a button (the business of adding or subtracting 10 from theX|Ycoord). ??? Judy From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Thu Mar 6 21:24:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Thu Mar 6 21:24:01 2003 Subject: Trap/script for arrow keys? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5053229B-5043-11D7-8F32-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Ah, you got stuck in the old trap where Rev doesn't compile a script with an error, but then doesn't tell you about it :-) When you add a new line, it thinks again. Anyway, it seems that theXCoord is not being set to a number. Maybe you are not separating the 2 items of the loc (this could happen if the item delimiter was set to something other than comma when you filled in the initial values). Can you get your stack to show you it's value before you do any subtraction or addition? If you want to email me the stack directly, I'd be happy to take a look and see if I could get it working for you. Cheers, Sarah On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 12:07 pm, Judy Perry wrote: > I get this message for error description: > > Error description: do: error in source expression > > b > " There was an Execution Error at 5:55:56 PM > Error description: set: can't set property > Object: card id 1002 of stack "/TiX/Users/judyperry/Documents/RunRev > Stuff/MovingSprite.rev" > -------------------- > switch tKey > -------------------- > Value: arrowKey > > > " There was an Execution Error at 5:54:54 PM > Error description: subtract: destination has a bad format (numeric?) > Object: card id 1002 of stack "/TiX/Users/judyperry/Documents/RunRev > Stuff/MovingSprite.rev" > -------------------- > subtract 10 from theXcoord > -------------------- > > and > > Error description: Object: coordinate is not a point > > Line: 0 Character: 0 > Value: theXcoord > > Error description: Chunk: can't set property > set the loc of btn "Fish" to theXcoord,theYcoord > Line: 12 Character: 15 > Value: > > But the math aspect of it works just fine from within a button (the > business of adding or subtracting 10 from theX|Ycoord). > > ??? > > Judy > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Thu Mar 6 21:27:00 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Thu Mar 6 21:27:00 2003 Subject: Creating and grabbing buttons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <9BEEDF5C-5043-11D7-8F32-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Hadn't thought of that wrinkle. What about just making the first mouseDown do all the work? Have it duplicate the bottom button and then grab the new button all in one go. Cheers, Sarah On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 11:22 am, Scott Slaugh wrote: > I would use that, except that by the time that I am clicking the > second time, there is a new button in that position. I have the > template button, and I then have the new moveable button right on top > of the template button. > > Scott Slaugh > >> Use a mouseDoubleDown handler. If the interval between clicks is too >> short, it gets trapped as a mouseDoubleDown (& Up) message but if you >> put your grab script in a mouseDoubleDown handler, it should work as >> you expect. >> >> Cheers, >> Sarah >> >> On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 10:30 am, Scott Slaugh wrote: >> >>> I have a bunch of buttons in a group. In the mouseDown handler of >>> the button, it calls a handler which copies the button to the card, >>> gives it a new script, and renames the button. In the script of the >>> new button, I have a grab command in the mouseDown handler. The >>> behavior I am trying to get is that I double-click on the button in >>> the group and drag away, with the new button following the mouse. >>> However, I currently have to click on the group button, then wait a >>> second before I click on the new button, otherwise I can't drag the >>> button. Does anyone have any suggestions of how to remedy this? >>> >>> Scott Slaugh > > _________________________________________________________________ > Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online > http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Thu Mar 6 22:21:41 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Thu Mar 6 22:21:41 2003 Subject: [Announce] Rev Navigator 2.5: Drag and Drop In-Reply-To: <62D180EF-4FC0-11D7-9B03-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> Message-ID: <5B3148F8-504B-11D7-9B03-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> An update to Rev Navigator is now available at The biggest two changes for this update are: 1. Drag and Drop support. This is a major advance. You can drag and drop to set the layers of controls or cards, move controls into or out of groups, copy controls, groups, or cards from one stack to another, and to place a group (background) on one or more cards. NOTE: removing controls from a group and putting them back in might cause you to lose non-shared properties like the hilite and field contents. Use at your own risk. 2. Support for MetaCard. Change the file extension and open Navigator in MetaCard. It should take care of inserting the scripts it needs to function properly. This feature is still experimental, but seems to work pretty well. Also added is a stack list view, a custom property menu, select stacks by pointing at them, rename bookmarks, and more. For anyone who's not familiar with it, here's the note on Navigator when it first came out: ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ----- Navigator is a plugin I developed to make it easier to work with controls, properties, and scripts in Revolution. There's too much to list in an email, but briefly: -- Navigator displays lists of Revolution objects: stacks, cards, groups, and controls. -- The list can show the controls on the current card of the topStack, or of any card or group of any stack. -- You can bookmark references to any controls, and color-code the references. You can mix and match bookmarks any way you like. -- Navigator allows you to edit scripts, set properties or run code against any list of objects. For example, you could select controls from several different stacks and set the visible of all the controls to false with one command. -- Navigator makes it easy to work with controls that aren't normally accessible: controls in groups, hidden controls, controls on hidden stacks, controls that are in different places, controls that are in palettes or non-modal stacks. -- Navigator allows you to do things you wouldn't ordinarily be able to do: align controls that are on different cards, for example. -- Navigator makes you a faster developer: edit the scripts of controls on different cards quickly and easily; change any property with a single menu selection rather than using a palette; go to the handler you want to edit in a long script with a single command. Finally, I should mention that Navigator is, as far as I know, the only Revolution plugin that supports plugins of its own ;-) Text files with executable Transcript can be used within the Navigator plugin. This is a beta release. Navigator should work on all platforms, with Revolution 1.1.1 and 2.0. If you have any problems, let me know. regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From alrice at ARCplanning.com Thu Mar 6 22:47:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Thu Mar 6 22:47:01 2003 Subject: Trap/script for arrow keys? In-Reply-To: <5053229B-5043-11D7-8F32-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Message-ID: On Thursday, March 6, 2003, at 07:20 PM, Sarah wrote: > Ah, you got stuck in the old trap where Rev doesn't compile a script > with an error, but then doesn't tell you about it :-) > When you add a new line, it thinks again. When building a distribution, does Rev compile all scripts at that time? It would not be good if this delayed-script-error problem made it's way into a standalone! Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From katir at hindu.org Fri Mar 7 00:41:01 2003 From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami) Date: Fri Mar 7 00:41:01 2003 Subject: Change "built in" Cursor images Message-ID: <21B7709E-505F-11D7-BFBC-003065FB9830@hindu.org> i distribute stacks that are entirely self-contained with the exception the cursor. i.e. I can tell someone to get the Rev engine off a local server and then run this or that stack. They don't get the developer IDE. just the engine to serve as a player. Rather than issue new distribution versions and going through the build distribution process, it would be easier just to reference an image in my own stack for the needed cursors... usually only three: hand (browsing buttons) , iBeam (for text) and Busy or Watch (spinning ball) Then I just serve the stack as is without any build process required. Docs say: "If you change the set of built-in Revolution cursors, you must either quit and restart the application or use the reset cursors command to begin using the new cursor shapes." And, there is a reference to "custom cursor images" but no "how to" OK, but how does one set the cursors to a new id in the first place? Of course one can set it temporarily by script, but I am looking for a "global' change... that doesn't require scripting to set the cursor to the new images as needed. Say for example one makes a nice hand or pointer image, how do you apply that to the hand cursor so that it "takes" over the cursor when the pointer moves out of a text field... and the same for iBeam where a bigger more visible cursor is wanted when you do move into a text field. One would presume that it would require that an image be in the stack that had the same ID as the normal built-in hand cursor shape and so the engine would find the local image first and use that when needed. if that assumption is correct... where is the ID list for the builtin cursors? This would be nice addition to the cookbook... probably a no brainer, but I can't find it. Is there a search function that goes through ALL the documentation? tia Sannyasin Sivakatirswami Himalayan Academy Publications at Kauai's Hindu Monastery katir at hindu.org www.HimalayanAcademy.com, www.HinduismToday.com www.Gurudeva.org www.Hindu.org From pixelbird at interisland.net Fri Mar 7 02:32:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Fri Mar 7 02:32:01 2003 Subject: Import snapshot snafu In-Reply-To: <200303070542.AAA30958@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Howdy, I have two stacks open. This button is in the second stack and the image I want to collect is in the first: on mouseUp import snapshot from rect "28,90,118,128" of window id 475519808 end mouseUp Why doesn't it work? TIA, Ken N. From ambassador at fourthworld.com Fri Mar 7 02:53:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Fri Mar 7 02:53:01 2003 Subject: Import snapshot snafu In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ken Norris wrote: > Howdy, > > I have two stacks open. This button is in the second stack and the image I > want to collect is in the first: > > on mouseUp > import snapshot from rect "28,90,118,128" of window id 475519808 > end mouseUp > > Why doesn't it work? What happens when you run it? If there's no visible error, what is the value of "the result" after you execute the "import" statement? -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From malte.brill at t-online.de Fri Mar 7 05:04:01 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Fri Mar 7 05:04:01 2003 Subject: Not using QT for Video playback on OsX In-Reply-To: <200303070542.AAA31012@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hi, this one is for the Mac OsX users on the list (which I am not yet). Is it possible to choose another playback system on OsX for digital Video, like it should be on *nix Systems with set the videoClipPlayer to playerpath? Has anyone tested it? Any help will be greatly appreciated. Regards, Malte From ttasovac at princeton.edu Fri Mar 7 05:58:01 2003 From: ttasovac at princeton.edu (Toma Tasovac) Date: Fri Mar 7 05:58:01 2003 Subject: sentences as items In-Reply-To: <20030306191510.40637.qmail@web20414.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <89295FA4-508A-11D7-9E45-000393D60E0C@princeton.edu> Chris, let me abuse your kindness one last time. Your solution is exactly what I need, but what's still not clear to me is the very first step. Once I know how to insert the special character, it will be pretty trivial to to a search and replace in BBEdit and make sure that all sentences end with a punctuation sign + special character. But how do I insert that special character in a text editor in the first place? I know that this is something terribly obvious and banal, but please indulge my ignorance! Many thanks for your help. Toma On Thursday, March 6, 2003, at 08:15 PM, Chris Sheffield wrote: > Well, first let me say that I am very new to > Revolution. It just so happens that I was working on > a similar problem yesterday, and this is how I solved > it. So I thought I'd share it. :-) It is entirely > possible that there is a better solution. > > As far as inserting these characters, you can do it > the long way like I did and copy the character to the > clipboard and then paste it into your text. Are you > using external text files or static text in a field? > You could probably make the process a lot easier by > writing a small script that would search through a > block of text, locate any sentence-ending punctuation > (".", "!", "?", etc.) and then insert the special > character after the punctuation. I haven't done this > yet because I was just trying to throw something > together to show my boss, but I'm sure it would work. > Keep in mind that it will look like a space when on > the screen, so you may also have to remove existing > spaces at the end of sentences. > > As for the unicode thing, that's a little beyond my > skills at this point. Sorry. Maybe someone else on > the list can address that one. > > Chris Sheffield > Read Naturally From k_major at os.surf2000.de Fri Mar 7 07:44:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Fri Mar 7 07:44:01 2003 Subject: Not using QT for Video playback on OsX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1B34BB69-509A-11D7-8430-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Hi Malte, > Hi, > > this one is for the Mac OsX users on the list (which I am not yet). > Is it possible to choose another playback system on OsX for digital > Video, > like it should be on *nix Systems with > > set the videoClipPlayer to playerpath? > > Has anyone tested it? > > Any help will be greatly appreciated. > > Regards, > > Malte i think you have bad luck... As far as i know, QuickTime is the only multimedia-layer on OS X. It is a part of the "deeper" core of OS X. Means: QuickTime or die ;-) This is from the doxs: VideoClipPlayer: This property can be used on UNIX systems to specify an alternate name for the xanim player used to play movies with the "play" command. Since there is no Xanim player of OS X i think you cannot cahnge that... Anyway, have a nice weekend :-) Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From derek.huby at ntlworld.com Fri Mar 7 13:01:55 2003 From: derek.huby at ntlworld.com (Derek Huby) Date: Fri Mar 7 13:01:55 2003 Subject: Trap/script for arrow keys? Message-ID: Monte's script: on arrowKey tKey put the loc of btn "Fish" into tLoc switch tKey case "left" subtract 10 from item 1 of tLoc break case "right" add 10 to item 1 of tLoc break case "up" subtract 10 from item 2 of tLoc case "down" add 10 to item 2 of tLoc break end switch set the loc of btn "Fish" to tLoc end arrowKey .. works beautifully here, except that there's a "break" missing in the "up" case statement. Peace, Derek. From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Fri Mar 7 13:04:51 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Fri Mar 7 13:04:51 2003 Subject: sentences as items In-Reply-To: <89295FA4-508A-11D7-9E45-000393D60E0C@princeton.edu> Message-ID: <20030307173939.69384.qmail@web20419.mail.yahoo.com> You can do it one of two ways. I am using .rtf files and reading them in at run-time so that I have styled text. What I first did was use the command "set the clipboardData["text"] to NumToChar(160)" in the Rev Message Box. Then I opened my text editor and pasted where necessary. It worked well. But then I moved my file to the Mac. Because it's a higher ASCII character, it didn't display right on the Mac. So what I ended up doing was putting some other lower ASCII character like "~" (or anything that's not very likely) in my files instead of the actual delimiter character. Then in my code I replaced that character with NumToChar(160) on Windows and NumToChar(202) on Mac after reading in the file. I hope that all makes sense. Chris Sheffield --- Toma Tasovac wrote: > Chris, let me abuse your kindness one last time. > Your solution is > exactly what I need, but what's still not clear to > me is the very first > step. Once I know how to insert the special > character, it will be > pretty trivial to to a search and replace in BBEdit > and make sure that > all sentences end with a punctuation sign + special > character. But how > do I insert that special character in a text editor > in the first place? > I know that this is something terribly obvious and > banal, but please > indulge my ignorance! > > Many thanks for your help. > > Toma > > > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From NFeasey at utpress.utoronto.ca Fri Mar 7 13:07:00 2003 From: NFeasey at utpress.utoronto.ca (Feasey, Nicholas) Date: Fri Mar 7 13:07:00 2003 Subject: Silly Array Question Message-ID: My..my. It just as simple as that? All the other elements in the array will adjust their position in the array? N -----Original Message----- From: Monte Goulding [mailto:monte at sweattechnologies.com] Sent: 6-Mar-03 6:33 PM To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com Subject: RE: Silly Array Question delete variable myArray["whatever"] Cheers Monte > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Feasey, > Nicholas > Sent: Friday, 7 March 2003 9:31 AM > To: 'use-revolution at lists.runrev.com' > Subject: Silly Array Question > > > Ok, I admit it, I'm not getting it. > > I have no problem deleting an item (line) from a list but now I'm > trying to > delete an item from an array. > > I have looked through the online documentation and, for some > reason, I'm not > grasping which the command used to delete an array element? > > Any assistance, as per usual, is greatly appreciated. > > N > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > _______________________________________________ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution at lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From malte.brill at t-online.de Fri Mar 7 13:30:01 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Fri Mar 7 13:30:01 2003 Subject: Not using QT for Video playback on OsX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Klaus wrote: >i think you have bad luck... >As far as i know, QuickTime is the only multimedia-layer on OS X. >It is a part of the "deeper" core of OS X. Well there is something called VLC (Video Lan Client) http://developers.videolan.org/vlc/ >Means: QuickTime or die ;-) Don?t say so, I?m just getting happy again living... :-) >This is from the doxs: >VideoClipPlayer: >This property can be used on UNIX systems to specify an alternate >name for the xanim player used to play movies with the "play" command. Well, I read this before, but thought maybe this is outdated... :-( There seems to be happening so much on the OsX front. >Since there is no Xanim player of OS X i think you cannot cahnge that... Are you sure? I guess someone has ported it allready. >Anyway, have a nice weekend :-) Just keeping on coding. :-) >Regards >Klaus Major Regards, Malte From alrice at ARCplanning.com Fri Mar 7 13:37:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Fri Mar 7 13:37:01 2003 Subject: Silly Array Question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <464BCBD2-50CB-11D7-8616-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 10:56 AM, Feasey, Nicholas wrote: > My..my. It just as simple as that? > All the other elements in the array will adjust their position in the > array? I probably shouldn't answer this since I'm somewhat of a newbie, but I think arrays in Rev are really hashes or shelves. So when you do delete variable something[x] you are telling the array to drop the key named x and it's value. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From ttasovac at princeton.edu Fri Mar 7 14:17:01 2003 From: ttasovac at princeton.edu (Toma Tasovac) Date: Fri Mar 7 14:17:01 2003 Subject: sentences as items In-Reply-To: <20030307173939.69384.qmail@web20419.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <508EECC1-50D0-11D7-9E45-000393D60E0C@princeton.edu> gochya. thanks a lot! T. On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 06:39 PM, Chris Sheffield wrote: > You can do it one of two ways. I am using .rtf files > and reading them in at run-time so that I have styled > text. What I first did was use the command "set the > clipboardData["text"] to NumToChar(160)" in the Rev > Message Box. Then I opened my text editor and pasted > where necessary. It worked well. But then I moved my > file to the Mac. Because it's a higher ASCII > character, it didn't display right on the Mac. So > what I ended up doing was putting some other lower > ASCII character like "~" (or anything that's not very > likely) in my files instead of the actual delimiter > character. Then in my code I replaced that character > with NumToChar(160) on Windows and NumToChar(202) on > Mac after reading in the file. I hope that all makes > sense. > > Chris Sheffield > > --- Toma Tasovac wrote: >> Chris, let me abuse your kindness one last time. >> Your solution is >> exactly what I need, but what's still not clear to >> me is the very first >> step. Once I know how to insert the special >> character, it will be >> pretty trivial to to a search and replace in BBEdit >> and make sure that >> all sentences end with a punctuation sign + special >> character. But how >> do I insert that special character in a text editor >> in the first place? >> I know that this is something terribly obvious and >> banal, but please >> indulge my ignorance! >> >> Many thanks for your help. >> >> Toma >> >> >> > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more > http://taxes.yahoo.com/ > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From alrice at ARCplanning.com Fri Mar 7 14:33:00 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Fri Mar 7 14:33:00 2003 Subject: mystery exception Message-ID: <31668555-50D3-11D7-8616-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> I am getting an exception that only happens in my standalone, not in the IDE. Does anyone recognize this exception & have a clue for me? The exception message is 91,425,31 77,425,31 443,425,5,false 529,425,1,false Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Fri Mar 7 14:49:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Fri Mar 7 14:49:01 2003 Subject: Import snapshot snafu In-Reply-To: <200303071757.MAA07647@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: *************** > Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2003 23:50:07 -0800 > Subject: Re: Import snapshot snafu > From: Richard Gaskin >> on mouseUp >> import snapshot from rect "28,90,118,128" of window id 475519808 >> end mouseUp >> >> Why doesn't it work? > > What happens when you run it? If there's no visible error, what is the > value of "the result" after you execute the "import" statement? ---------- Well, when I make the script it errors like this: ? There was a Script Compile Error at 11:26:47 AM Error description: Handler: bad command Object: button id 1006 of card id 1002 of stack "/Macintosh HD/Desktop Folder/MyRev Stacks/TTS Speech Test.rev" -------------------- import snapshot from rect "28,90,118,128" of window id 475509520 -------------------- Value: 475509520 ...but the value IS the value of the current window ID for the stack I specified, because I checked it. No other value for the result at all. I closed out the stacks, even closed Rev, then went back and reopened everything. Of course, that means the window id changes so I rewrote the script as shown in the error report (still doesn't work) below. Note the new window id, which is correct as I checked it separately in the Message Box (put the windowID of stack "Practice 1"). ? There was an Execution Error at 11:35:47 AM Error description: Object: does not have this property Object: button id 1006 of card id 1002 of stack "/Macintosh HD/Desktop Folder/MyRev Stacks/TTS Speech Test.rev" -------------------- import snapshot from rect "28,90,118,128" of window id (windowID of stack "Practice 1") -------------------- Value: 447832976 ...but of course, the object (stack window) actually DOES have the property and reports it accurately according to the error dialog. The command WILL reproduce a SCREEN image given the proper screen rect, but errors if I try to reproduce an image using coordinates inside the specified window. It must be the command that is failing, even though it is apparently written correctly according to the Transcript Dictionary. Is it a bug? Ken N. From ambassador at fourthworld.com Fri Mar 7 14:57:00 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Fri Mar 7 14:57:00 2003 Subject: mystery exception In-Reply-To: <31668555-50D3-11D7-8616-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: Alex Rice wrote: > I am getting an exception that only happens in my standalone, not in > the IDE. Does anyone recognize this exception & have a clue for me? The > exception message is > > 91,425,31 > 77,425,31 > 443,425,5,false > 529,425,1,false Hve you included the Execution Error dialog in your standalone? -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From alrice at ARCplanning.com Fri Mar 7 15:19:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Fri Mar 7 15:19:01 2003 Subject: mystery exception In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <7CBD1C62-50D9-11D7-8616-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 12:53 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote: > Alex Rice wrote: > >> I am getting an exception that only happens in my standalone, not in >> the IDE. Does anyone recognize this exception & have a clue for me? >> The >> exception message is >> >> 91,425,31 >> 77,425,31 >> 443,425,5,false >> 529,425,1,false > > Hve you included the Execution Error dialog in your standalone? The "Error Reporting" checkbox on the resources tab of the Distro builder? Yes, I included it. And this handler was failing silently until I wrapped it in a try/catch statement. How can I tell what other handlers area failing silently? I'm a unclear on the concept of how the Error Reporting dialogs are supposed to work (or why they wouldn't work) Thanks, Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From dsc at swcp.com Fri Mar 7 15:55:01 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Fri Mar 7 15:55:01 2003 Subject: mystery exception In-Reply-To: <7CBD1C62-50D9-11D7-8616-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: <899EC7C8-50DE-11D7-9401-000A9567A3E6@swcp.com> On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 01:15 PM, Alex Rice wrote: > The "Error Reporting" checkbox on the resources tab of the Distro > builder? Yes, I included it. And this handler was failing silently > until I wrapped it in a try/catch statement. How can I tell what other > handlers area failing silently? I'm a unclear on the concept of how > the Error Reporting dialogs are supposed to work (or why they wouldn't > work) I have had the same problem. And I suspect the same reason--I don't know how to use the error reporting dialogs. The error string that a catch gets is not very helpful. Dar Scott From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk Fri Mar 7 15:57:01 2003 From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg) Date: Fri Mar 7 15:57:01 2003 Subject: Import snapshot snafu In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 11:53 am -0500 7/3/03, Ken Norris wrote: >>> on mouseUp >>> import snapshot from rect "28,90,118,128" of window id 475519808 >>> end mouseUp >>> >>> Why doesn't it work? Try without "id" import snapshot from rect "28,90,118,128" of window 475519808 Cheers Dave From NFeasey at utpress.utoronto.ca Fri Mar 7 16:25:00 2003 From: NFeasey at utpress.utoronto.ca (Feasey, Nicholas) Date: Fri Mar 7 16:25:00 2003 Subject: Silly Array Question Message-ID: Yeah, that's what I thought as well. I'm only trying to delete an element in an array. In text fields it is a snap to delete a line. N -----Original Message----- From: Alex Rice [mailto:alrice at ARCplanning.com] Sent: 7-Mar-03 1:33 PM To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com Subject: Re: Silly Array Question On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 10:56 AM, Feasey, Nicholas wrote: > My..my. It just as simple as that? > All the other elements in the array will adjust their position in the > array? I probably shouldn't answer this since I'm somewhat of a newbie, but I think arrays in Rev are really hashes or shelves. So when you do delete variable something[x] you are telling the array to drop the key named x and it's value. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com _______________________________________________ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution at lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From valetia at mac.com Sat Mar 8 03:21:00 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Sat Mar 8 03:21:00 2003 Subject: Inverse-colored custom cursor shows up... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi all, When I try to use a custom cursor by setting it to a specific image ID, the cursor shows up as an inversed version of the image (which itself looks fine). With the cursor, black shows up instead of white and vice versa. The image had been imported into the stack via a PNG file that contains black, white and transparent pixels. How do I get the cursor to show up as an exact replica of the image? Valetia From mailjjt at bellsouth.net Sat Mar 8 10:13:01 2003 From: mailjjt at bellsouth.net (John J. Theobald) Date: Sat Mar 8 10:13:01 2003 Subject: Inverse-colored custom cursor shows up... References: Message-ID: <3E6A0810.2070708@bellsouth.net> valetia at mac.com wrote: > Hi all, > > When I try to use a custom cursor by setting it to a specific image ID, the > cursor shows up as an inversed version of the image (which itself looks > fine). With the cursor, black shows up instead of white and vice versa. > > The image had been imported into the stack via a PNG file that contains > black, white and transparent pixels. > > How do I get the cursor to show up as an exact replica of the image? > > Valetia > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > Did you try reversing the black and white image data in the png? John J. Theobald From kray at sonsothunder.com Sat Mar 8 11:19:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Sat Mar 8 11:19:01 2003 Subject: Inverse-colored custom cursor shows up... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <003f01c2e58d$e6ddf310$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Valetia, The best way (albeit a bit awkward) is to use Rev's own image editing tools on a 16x16 image. The reason is that cursors need to be 3 colors (black, white and the transparent color) and this is a real problem for most editing programs (they like to do B/W or 4 color, but 3 color with transparency is difficult). I've been able to create cursors outside of Rev, but they show up properly in OS 9, Windows and OS 10.1.5, but show up inverted in 10.2 or later. I'm in discussions with Scott Raney to see if there's some way to get a recipe for doing this outside of the MC/Rev environment, but so far the best suggestion is to do it in Rev. Don't forget that if you Command-click (control-click in Windows) with the pencil tool, you get a magnify window that you can do pixel editing in. When I have a definitive answer, I'll post it to my site as a Tip and let the list know. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > valetia at mac.com > Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 2:17 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Inverse-colored custom cursor shows up... > > > Hi all, > > When I try to use a custom cursor by setting it to a specific > image ID, the cursor shows up as an inversed version of the > image (which itself looks fine). With the cursor, black shows > up instead of white and vice versa. > > The image had been imported into the stack via a PNG file > that contains black, white and transparent pixels. > > How do I get the cursor to show up as an exact replica of the image? > > Valetia > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From scott at tactilemedia.com Sat Mar 8 11:34:03 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Sat Mar 8 11:34:03 2003 Subject: Inverse-colored custom cursor shows up... In-Reply-To: <003f01c2e58d$e6ddf310$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: >> When I try to use a custom cursor by setting it to a specific >> image ID, the cursor shows up as an inversed version of the >> image (which itself looks fine). With the cursor, black shows >> up instead of white and vice versa. >> >> The image had been imported into the stack via a PNG file >> that contains black, white and transparent pixels. >> >> How do I get the cursor to show up as an exact replica of the image? > The best way (albeit a bit awkward) is to use Rev's own image editing > tools on a 16x16 image. The reason is that cursors need to be 3 colors > (black, white and the transparent color) and this is a real problem for > most editing programs (they like to do B/W or 4 color, but 3 color with > transparency is difficult). I thought there was a suggestion posted a while back that mentioned the option of creating the image in an image editor, importing it into Rev/MC, and then clicking the image with the paint tool? Supposedly this action forces the image to be Rev/MC "compliant" and then will work properly. Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design Email: scott at tactilemedia.com Web: www.tactilemedia.com From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Sat Mar 8 13:28:00 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Sat Mar 8 13:28:00 2003 Subject: Can I call a function that is in a different script? Message-ID: Suppose I have a function defined in some field's script. Can I call it from a handler in another field's script? (I tried finding this in the docs, but no luck. "Function" doesn't seem to appear in the development guide, at least for as far as I could discern. I couldn't figure out how to search through the development guide.) -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From kray at sonsothunder.com Sat Mar 8 14:02:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Sat Mar 8 14:02:01 2003 Subject: Can I call a function that is in a different script? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <004e01c2e5a4$ad4cbd40$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Check out the tip "Calling Functions In Other Objects" at: http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_scrp001 Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > Victor Eijkhout > Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 12:16 PM > To: Use Revolution List > Subject: Can I call a function that is in a different script? > > > Suppose I have a function defined in some field's script. Can I call > it from a handler in another field's script? > > (I tried finding this in the docs, but no luck. "Function" doesn't > seem to appear in the development guide, at least for as far as I > could discern. I couldn't figure out how to search through the > development guide.) > -- > Victor Eijkhout > tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ _______________________________________________ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution at lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From pixelbird at interisland.net Sat Mar 8 14:11:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sat Mar 8 14:11:00 2003 Subject: Import snapshot snafu In-Reply-To: <200303081620.LAA22702@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 20:52:52 +0000 > From: Dave Cragg > Subject: Re: Import snapshot snafu > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > At 11:53 am -0500 7/3/03, Ken Norris wrote: > >>>> on mouseUp >>>> import snapshot from rect "28,90,118,128" of window id 475519808 >>>> end mouseUp >>>> >>>> Why doesn't it work? > > Try without "id" > > import snapshot from rect "28,90,118,128" of window 475519808 ---------- That's right! How did I misconstrue that? Duhh :-/ Works fine now. Maybe I can use it to automate the process of separating out all the button images I'd like to convert to icons (about 80 of them). Thanks so much, Ken N. Ken N. From BradAllen at mac.com Sat Mar 8 16:49:01 2003 From: BradAllen at mac.com (Brad Allen) Date: Sat Mar 8 16:49:01 2003 Subject: List View GUI In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Is there a preexisting way in Rev to build a list view GUI, with repeating control widgets within a scrollable body? I'm planning on converting some FileMaker databases to mySQL with Rev 1.1.1 as the client front end, and I haven't throught of a graceful way to implement the list views that FileMaker users take for granted. Here are the only ideas I've come up with so far: * a simple text list in a scrolling field with hyperlinked text instead of buttons -- this works but looks primitive. * a group of controls that repeat vertically down the window, with text values populating the fields as the user "scrolls". This also looks rather primitive, but to create an effect in which the controls within the list sections actually scrolled visually up and down the screen would be a fairly time-consuming programming project. Rev 2.0 will reputedly have a spreadsheet-like text fields and/or tables, but this doesn't sound like it will include the ability to embed GUI controls (such as buttons) within a scrolling table. Am I wrong about this? Any ideas on this will be appreciated...thanks. From pixelbird at interisland.net Sat Mar 8 17:08:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sat Mar 8 17:08:01 2003 Subject: Goofy button behavior In-Reply-To: <200303081620.LAA22702@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Howdy, I have a button which is not part of a group, and never was. It shows its own selection handles, not group selection handles, with "Select Grouped Controls" off, the same as other buttons which are not grouped. If I select buttons which are grouped in that case, it shows the group's selection handles. All OK so far? OK, now watch this (here's the problem): It is executing the script of a group. In fact it is mixing the script of a group to which it does not belong (in fact, it is not grouped at all) with its own script. What's going on and how do I fix it. Ken N. From ambassador at fourthworld.com Sat Mar 8 18:31:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Sat Mar 8 18:31:01 2003 Subject: Can I call a function that is in a different script? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Victor Eijkhout wrote: > Suppose I have a function defined in some field's script. Can I call > it from a handler in another field's script? See the call commond. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Sat Mar 8 18:35:00 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Sat Mar 8 18:35:00 2003 Subject: Inverse-colored custom cursor shows up... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030308233130.24894.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com> --- Scott Rossi wrote: > ...creating the image in an image > editor, importing it into Rev/MC, > and then clicking the image with the paint > tool? Supposedly this action > forces the image to be Rev/MC "compliant" and > then will work properly. does this paint OVER the image or allow you to change the pixel values INSIDE the image? TIA ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Sat Mar 8 18:45:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Sat Mar 8 18:45:01 2003 Subject: re HTML posting In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030308234159.38433.qmail@web20002.mail.yahoo.com> --- David Vaughan wrote: > On another list, I found this reference to a > site which discusses why > not to post in HTML and how to turn it off in a > wide range of mail > packages. This may help. > > www.expita.com/nomime.html > > regards > David thanks again. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Sat Mar 8 18:48:00 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Sat Mar 8 18:48:00 2003 Subject: StartUp handler on Windows In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030308234446.60790.qmail@web20006.mail.yahoo.com> --- "Jeanne A. E. DeVoto" wrote: > The best thing is to create a plugin. is there a tutorial on plugins? TIA ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From valetia at mac.com Sat Mar 8 21:32:01 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Sat Mar 8 21:32:01 2003 Subject: Inverse-colored custom cursor shows up... In-Reply-To: <20030308233130.24894.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Scott: Just gave this a try (clicking using a paint tool) and it did indeed begin working properly afterwards. Erik: It appears to actually change the pixel values inside the image. What I did was use the "bucket" tool and clicked on an existing black pixel in the imported image. Nothing about the image changed visually when I did that (and that would indeed be the expected outcome of such an action), but it fixed the cursor. Valetia > From: erik hansen > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 15:31:30 -0800 (PST) > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: Inverse-colored custom cursor shows up... > > --- Scott Rossi wrote: > >> ...creating the image in an image >> editor, importing it into Rev/MC, >> and then clicking the image with the paint >> tool? Supposedly this action >> forces the image to be Rev/MC "compliant" and >> then will work properly. > > does this paint OVER the image or allow you to > change the pixel values INSIDE the image? > > TIA > > ===== > erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more > http://taxes.yahoo.com/ > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From brasmussen at earthlink.net Sun Mar 9 03:30:01 2003 From: brasmussen at earthlink.net (Bob Rasmussen) Date: Sun Mar 9 03:30:01 2003 Subject: Variable uninitialized variable values (or unexpected declarations) Message-ID: <3E6AFAB6.B7390D21@earthlink.net> I found the following to be rather surprising. Set the script of a button to the following: on mouseUp switch 1 case 1 put "var =" && quote & var & quote break case 2 put "whatever" into var break end switch end mouseUp Press the button and the message box will say var = "var" However, reverse the cases in the switch so case 2 statements comes first, press the button again, and the message box will now say var = "" The behavior changes, even though case 2 is never executed in either version of the script. Similar behavior can be demonstrated with other control structures, but this example seems the most disturbing. A little experimentation resulted in my learning the following: 1. The uninitialized value of an undeclared local variable is its name. I already knew that, though I couldn't find it in the documentation. Did I miss it? 2. Apparently, any line of the form "put ... into|before|after ... var" seems to be equivalent to "local var", as far as declaring var is concerned, *even if that line of the script is never executed*. Declarations seem to depend only on order of appearance in the script text. I guess that means they're not really true commands, since they have nothing to do with execution. I couldn't find a description of this in the documentation. Did I miss it? 3. Moreover, this doesn't seem right to me. Having the uninitialized value of a variable vary in this way is a little disconcerting, and if I had a choice, I'd prefer it always to be empty -- the default declaration value. That way, jugging the order of cases, as above, and similar changes would have no effect. That seems much more reasonable. Presumably though, the present behavior has been around for a very long time. Is there a reason for it being this way? RR From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk Sun Mar 9 05:36:01 2003 From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg) Date: Sun Mar 9 05:36:01 2003 Subject: Goofy button behavior In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 2:12 pm -0500 8/3/03, Ken Norris wrote: >Howdy, > >I have a button which is not part of a group, and never was. It shows its >own selection handles, not group selection handles, with "Select Grouped >Controls" off, the same as other buttons which are not grouped. If I select >buttons which are grouped in that case, it shows the group's selection >handles. > >All OK so far? OK, now watch this (here's the problem): > >It is executing the script of a group. In fact it is mixing the script of a >group to which it does not belong (in fact, it is not grouped at all) with >its own script. > >What's going on and how do I fix it. I guess the group's background behavior is set to true. So if an event (mouseUp for example) is not handled in the button, it will be passed to the group (background). Depending on circumstances, you can do one of the following: -- turn off "backgroundBehavior" in the group -- in the group script, enclose handlers with a condition like this: on mouseUp if the owner of the target is me then ##normal stuff here end if end mouseUp -- catch the events in the non-grouped objects (probably not such a practical approach) Cheers Dave From valetia at mac.com Sun Mar 9 07:46:01 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Sun Mar 9 07:46:01 2003 Subject: List View GUI In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hey Brad, > Is there a preexisting way in Rev to build a list view GUI, with > repeating control widgets within a scrollable body? I posted a similar question recently and have received a number of helpful responses. Do a search in the list for "combo-box" and you'll find the thread. You can search the list at: http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com Jan Schenkel has a sample stack that demonstrates how you can include actual repeating control widgets within a scrollable body. You'll find it at: http://www.geocities.com/janschenkel/downloads/checkboxlist.zip If you're just looking to pop-up the exact same menu when clicking within the same column on each line, you can use Ben Rubinstein's technique, which you'll also find in the same thread. Valetia From BradAllen at mac.com Sun Mar 9 11:11:00 2003 From: BradAllen at mac.com (Brad Allen) Date: Sun Mar 9 11:11:00 2003 Subject: List View GUI In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > >Jan Schenkel has a sample stack that demonstrates how you can include actual >repeating control widgets within a scrollable body. You'll find it at: > >http://www.geocities.com/janschenkel/downloads/checkboxlist.zip > Thank you! This sample stack is exhibiting the kind of list view behavior I'm interested in. I didn't realize there was such as thing as a "scrolling group". I will take a close look at how this works. From hardt at u.arizona.edu Sun Mar 9 13:39:03 2003 From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (olli) Date: Sun Mar 9 13:39:03 2003 Subject: crash when building distribution In-Reply-To: <000901c2c22f$bf6fc5a0$50231e3e@Jez2> Message-ID: hi: i am running X 10.2.4. and rev 1.1.1. *every* time i want to build a PPC distribution, RR either crashes or infinitely displays the text in the distributionBuilderWin "saving file ...bla bla". anybody with the same experience? any suggestions? thank you very much. olli. From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au Sun Mar 9 16:59:00 2003 From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan) Date: Sun Mar 9 16:59:00 2003 Subject: Variable uninitialized variable values (or unexpected declarations) In-Reply-To: <200303091701.MAA14392@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: On Monday, Mar 10, 2003, at 04:01 Australia/Sydney, Bob Rasmussen wrote: > I found the following to be rather surprising. > > on mouseUp > switch 1 > case 1 > put "var =" && quote & var & quote > break > case 2 > put "whatever" into var > break > end switch > end mouseUp > > Press the button and the message box will say > var = "var" > However, reverse the cases in the switch so case 2 statements comes > first, press > the button again, and the message box will now say > var = "" > 1. The uninitialized value of an undeclared local variable is its > name. I > already knew that, though I couldn't find it in the documentation. > Did I miss > it? > > 2. Apparently, any line of the form "put ... into|before|after ... > var" seems > to be equivalent to "local var", as far as declaring var is > concerned,.. > > 3. Moreover, this doesn't seem right to me. Having the uninitialized > value of > a variable vary in this way is a little disconcerting, and if I had a > choice, > I'd prefer it always to be empty -- the default declaration value. Bob You may have misapprehended what is happening here. A variable is "declared" in Rev (given no active declaration such as "local var") when you put information into it or get it out (basically). If you otherwise refer to a text string then the compiler treats it as a literal text string until proven otherwise. Thus, your first case statement says "put var" where "var" is an unquoted string not already defined as a variable - it is the string "var". That is, it is _not_ an initial value of the variable var but is a literal string "var". Your second case tells the compiler to create the variable var and set its value to the string "whatever". When the second case is compiled before the first, then the variable var has already been created (and hence initialised to empty/zero) when your case 1 is executed. Thus, var is now interpreted as an empty variable (case 2 not having been executed yet), not a literal string, and displays accordingly. Walk through your code in the actual sequence of considering first the compiler's perspective and then a second time for the run-time perspective. Hope this clarifies things. cheers David > > RR > > > > > > From: Dave Cragg > Date: Sun Mar 9, 2003 21:31:59 Australia/Sydney > To: > Subject: Re: Goofy button behavior > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > > At 2:12 pm -0500 8/3/03, Ken Norris wrote: >> Howdy, >> >> I have a button which is not part of a group, and never was. It shows >> its >> own selection handles, not group selection handles, with "Select >> Grouped >> Controls" off, the same as other buttons which are not grouped. If I >> select >> buttons which are grouped in that case, it shows the group's selection >> handles. >> >> All OK so far? OK, now watch this (here's the problem): >> >> It is executing the script of a group. In fact it is mixing the >> script of a >> group to which it does not belong (in fact, it is not grouped at all) >> with >> its own script. >> >> What's going on and how do I fix it. > > I guess the group's background behavior is set to true. So if an event > (mouseUp for example) is not handled in the button, it will be passed > to the group (background). > > Depending on circumstances, you can do one of the following: > > -- turn off "backgroundBehavior" in the group > > -- in the group script, enclose handlers with a condition like this: > > on mouseUp > if the owner of the target is me then > ##normal stuff here > end if > end mouseUp > > -- catch the events in the non-grouped objects (probably not such a > practical approach) > > Cheers > Dave > > > > From: "valetia at mac.com" > Date: Sun Mar 9, 2003 23:42:52 Australia/Sydney > To: > Subject: Re: List View GUI > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > > Hey Brad, > >> Is there a preexisting way in Rev to build a list view GUI, with >> repeating control widgets within a scrollable body? > > I posted a similar question recently and have received a number of > helpful > responses. > > Do a search in the list for "combo-box" and you'll find the thread. > You can > search the list at: > > http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com > > Jan Schenkel has a sample stack that demonstrates how you can include > actual > repeating control widgets within a scrollable body. You'll find it at: > > http://www.geocities.com/janschenkel/downloads/checkboxlist.zip > > If you're just looking to pop-up the exact same menu when clicking > within > the same column on each line, you can use Ben Rubinstein's technique, > which > you'll also find in the same thread. > > Valetia > > > > > > From: Brad Allen > Date: Mon Mar 10, 2003 03:07:46 Australia/Sydney > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Cc: js.allen at mac.com > Subject: Re: List View GUI > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > >> >> Jan Schenkel has a sample stack that demonstrates how you can include >> actual >> repeating control widgets within a scrollable body. You'll find it at: >> >> http://www.geocities.com/janschenkel/downloads/checkboxlist.zip >> > > Thank you! This sample stack is exhibiting the kind of list view > behavior I'm interested in. I didn't realize there was such as thing > as a "scrolling group". I will take a close look at how this works. > > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Sun Mar 9 17:20:02 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Sun Mar 9 17:20:02 2003 Subject: Inverse-colored custom cursor shows up... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I had this problem when I imported a cursor as an image, then set the visible of the image to false. If I showed the image again (I hid it behind a button), then it stopped showing up as inverse. Don't ask me to explain this, but it is really what happened :-) Sarah On Monday, March 10, 2003, at 07:36 am, valetia at mac.com wrote: > Hi all, > > When I try to use a custom cursor by setting it to a specific image > ID, the > cursor shows up as an inversed version of the image (which itself looks > fine). With the cursor, black shows up instead of white and vice versa. > > The image had been imported into the stack via a PNG file that contains > black, white and transparent pixels. > > How do I get the cursor to show up as an exact replica of the image? > > Valetia > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 9 17:30:03 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 9 17:30:03 2003 Subject: Goofy button behavior In-Reply-To: <200303091702.MAA14453@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 10:31:59 +0000 > From: Dave Cragg > Subject: Re: Goofy button behavior > > At 2:12 pm -0500 8/3/03, Ken Norris wrote: >> Howdy, >> >> I have a button which is not part of a group, and never was. It shows its >> own selection handles, not group selection handles, with "Select Grouped >> Controls" off, the same as other buttons which are not grouped. If I select >> buttons which are grouped in that case, it shows the group's selection >> handles. >> >> All OK so far? OK, now watch this (here's the problem): >> >> It is executing the script of a group. In fact it is mixing the script of a >> group to which it does not belong (in fact, it is not grouped at all) with >> its own script. >> >> What's going on and how do I fix it. > > I guess the group's background behavior is set to true. So if an > event (mouseUp for example) is not handled in the button, it will be > passed to the group (background). ---------- Why? The button does NOT belong to a group at all. > Depending on circumstances, you can do one of the following: > > -- turn off "backgroundBehavior" in the group ---------- I need the bg behavior (or else I wouldn't have it to start with). ---------- > -- in the group script, enclose handlers with a condition like this: > > on mouseUp > if the owner of the target is me then > ##normal stuff here > end if > end mouseUp > > -- catch the events in the non-grouped objects (probably not such a > practical approach) ---------- Ahh. OK. Pretty wonky solution though. I don't think a non-grouped object should execute a group handler at all. I think something is wrong here, and I'd like to find out what it is. I did replace some buttons which were formerly in the group. How do groups store and update info about what objects belong to them? The replaced button in this case was deleted and then recreated from scratch. When I first created it, it did not execute the group handler. After I assigned a new hilitedIcon to it, without the show icon on (because I needed to control how it shows from inside the button script), it suddenly started executing the handler of a bg group. Once again, please understand, the button does NOT belong to any group. Now it shows the icon I assigned according to the script inside it, so it's OK as long as the script is not empty, but if I delete the script, it WILL execute the bg group handler (to which it does not belong) again. There are no mouseUp handlers in the stack or card. I think a bug in the storage update system of the group is causing the problem. Somehow, the group is still treating the button as if belongs to it, even though it doesn't. If a background group uses button NUMBERS rather than object IDs to track its member buttons, that might account for it. Anyone understand how this works? Best regards, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 9 17:50:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 9 17:50:00 2003 Subject: List View GUI In-Reply-To: <200303091702.MAA14453@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 15:45:29 -0600 > From: Brad Allen > Subject: List View GUI > > Is there a preexisting way in Rev to build a list view GUI, with > repeating control widgets within a scrollable body? > > Any ideas on this will be appreciated...thanks. ---------- I'm not a FileMaker user, but I am interested in your project from the aspect of emulating the list view GUI. Check out the Image Library (Development menu), and then check out the imageSource property. You can make images that emulate the 'look and feel' of the FileMaker list view GUI and work them into a scrollable field. Will that work for you? HTH, Ken N. From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Sun Mar 9 23:03:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Sun Mar 9 23:03:01 2003 Subject: Can I call a function that is in a different script? Message-ID: At 12:01 -0500 2003/03/09, Richard Gaskin wrote: > > Suppose I have a function defined in some field's script. Can I call >> it from a handler in another field's script? > >See the call commond. That seems to be for handlers; I needed a function because I need the return result. In fact, "call" is almost like "send", and in my case "call" would be precisely wrong, because I want a function result based on local data of the other handler, not of the calling handler, the way "call" would imply. The Son of Thunder had the winning idea on http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/metacard/tips/scrp001.htm -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From signe.sanne at roman.uib.no Mon Mar 10 02:03:01 2003 From: signe.sanne at roman.uib.no (Signe Marie Sanne) Date: Mon Mar 10 02:03:01 2003 Subject: sentences as items In-Reply-To: <20030307173939.69384.qmail@web20419.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030307173939.69384.qmail@web20419.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: >You can do it one of two ways. I am using .rtf files >and reading them in at run-time so that I have styled >text. What I first did was use the command "set the >clipboardData["text"] to NumToChar(160)" in the Rev >Message Box. Then I opened my text editor and pasted >where necessary. It worked well. But then I moved my >file to the Mac. Because it's a higher ASCII >character, it didn't display right on the Mac. So >what I ended up doing was putting some other lower >ASCII character like "~" (or anything that's not very >likely) in my files instead of the actual delimiter >character. I would suggest using "#" as delimiter since you find it easily (in the same way and place) on the keyboard for both Windows and Mac. -- 1. amanuensis Signe Marie Sanne e-mail: signe.sanne at roman.uib.no Romansk Institutt tel: +47 55 58 21 27 Oysteins gt. 1 5007 Bergen http://www.hf.uib.no/hfolk/mlab/hjem/default.html Norway From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 10 02:10:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Mon Mar 10 02:10:01 2003 Subject: Can I call a function that is in a different script? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030310070652.42734.qmail@web20004.mail.yahoo.com> --- Victor Eijkhout wrote: > At 12:01 -0500 2003/03/09, Richard Gaskin > wrote: > > > Suppose I have a function defined in some > field's script. Can I call > >> it from a handler in another field's > script? > > > >See the call commond. > > That seems to be for handlers; I needed a > function because I need the > return result. > > In fact, "call" is almost like "send", and in > my case "call" would be > precisely wrong, because I want a function > result based on local data > of the other handler, not of the calling > handler, the way "call" > would imply. i remember a workaround from somewhere that "sent" a handler with parameters to a script which had a function the handler. how the data was returned, i disremember. maybe a global or the result. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From janschenkel at yahoo.com Mon Mar 10 03:54:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Mon Mar 10 03:54:01 2003 Subject: Can I call a function that is in a different script? In-Reply-To: <20030310070652.42734.qmail@web20004.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20030310085054.94541.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> --- erik hansen wrote: > > --- Victor Eijkhout wrote: > > At 12:01 -0500 2003/03/09, Richard Gaskin > > wrote: > > > > Suppose I have a function defined in some > > field's script. Can I call > > >> it from a handler in another field's > > script? > > > > > >See the call commond. > > > > That seems to be for handlers; I needed a > > function because I need the > > return result. > > > > In fact, "call" is almost like "send", and in > > my case "call" would be > > precisely wrong, because I want a function > > result based on local data > > of the other handler, not of the calling > > handler, the way "call" > > would imply. > > i remember a workaround from somewhere > that "sent" a handler with parameters to a > script which had a function the handler. > > how the data was returned, i disremember. > maybe a global or the result. > > ===== > erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org > Why not just use the 'value' function ? It has a second parameter that lets you determine in the context of which object it should be executed. Example : get value("Foo()", fld "Bar") Hope this helped, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From richmond at mail.maclaunch.com Mon Mar 10 04:46:01 2003 From: richmond at mail.maclaunch.com (Mathewson) Date: Mon Mar 10 04:46:01 2003 Subject: what a drag: building 'Music Theory' In-Reply-To: <13C70D00-4F30-11D7-B0AE-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Message-ID: Now for a thorny problem.... If I do a build (Mac OS X) of my 'Music Theory" stack (see user contribs) the targets for the sharps signs stop functioning: this is a bugger. Richmond Mathewson --------------------------------------------------------------- Great Macintosh Products The MacLaunch Store! http://www.maclaunch.com/cgi-launch/store/agora.cgi --------------------------------------------------------------- From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk Mon Mar 10 05:42:01 2003 From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg) Date: Mon Mar 10 05:42:01 2003 Subject: Goofy button behavior In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 2:34 pm -0500 9/3/03, Ken Norris wrote: >> I guess the group's background behavior is set to true. So if an >> event (mouseUp for example) is not handled in the button, it will be >> passed to the group (background). >---------- >Why? The button does NOT belong to a group at all. No, but your group is a background and is now in the message path. control - card - background - stack So if an ungrouped button doesn't have a mouseUp handler, and you click on the button, the mouseUp message will get sent first to the card, and then the background. > I don't think a non-grouped object >should execute a group handler at all. But when you set the backgroundbehavior, the group's script is also the background script. I don't think it's wonky that a background script should catch unhandled messages from controls on the card. What might seem wonky (unintuitive anyway) is that the same mechanism is used to create groups, backgrounds and objects shared by multiple cards. On the other hand, it could be seen as a super-efficient use of the group object. (I think we have this debate every six month or so.) >I think something is wrong here, and >I'd like to find out what it is. Sounds like a job for Inspector Clouseau. :) Cheers Dave From benr_mc at cogapp.com Mon Mar 10 05:50:05 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Mon Mar 10 05:50:05 2003 Subject: using arrays in custom properties Message-ID: I'm storing an array in a custom property of an object. Storing and retrieving items is fine. But I'm having no luck wiping them. Let's say that I've got a price list object, and I want to have a custom property array linking 'specials' to their special prices. One day fruit is on special offer: put "23.99" into the specialPrices["Bananas"] of btn "PriceChecker" put "9.99" into the specialPrices["Apples"] of btn "PriceChecker" The next day, vegetables are on offer: put "5.50" into the specialPrices["Potatoes"] of btn "PriceChecker" put "5.99" into the specialPrices["Turnips"] of btn "PriceChecker" Now if I inspect the custom property 'specialPrices', it has all four items listed, when I really only wanted the most recent two. I want a way that I can start afresh, without caring what went before. If specialPrices was a global variable, I can wipe out the array by doing: put empty into specialPrices or even delete variable specialPrices How can I do something similar in the case of a customProperty which is an array? If I tried put empty into the specialPrices of btn "PriceChecker" ...I would just create a new item in the 'customKeys' array, with key "specialPrices", value empty. The "specialPrices" array would be unchanged. If I tried delete variable the specialPrices of btn "PriceChecker" delete variable specialPrices of btn "PriceChecker" delete the specialPrices of btn "PriceChecker" ... I would (did!) get a syntax error. If I know the keys of the specialPrices array, I could at least put empty into each one, which is sub-optimal but still not too bad... but I haven't even found the syntax for that. It's not: put the keys of the specialPrices of btn "PriceChecker" All help gratefully received! TIA, Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From janschenkel at yahoo.com Mon Mar 10 06:30:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Mon Mar 10 06:30:01 2003 Subject: using arrays in custom properties In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030310112632.39785.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com> --- Ben Rubinstein wrote: > I'm storing an array in a custom property of an > object. Storing and > retrieving items is fine. But I'm having no luck > wiping them. > > Let's say that I've got a price list object, and I > want to have a custom > property array linking 'specials' to their special > prices. One day fruit is > on special offer: > > put "23.99" into the specialPrices["Bananas"] of > btn "PriceChecker" > put "9.99" into the specialPrices["Apples"] of > btn "PriceChecker" > > The next day, vegetables are on offer: > > put "5.50" into the specialPrices["Potatoes"] of > btn "PriceChecker" > put "5.99" into the specialPrices["Turnips"] of > btn "PriceChecker" > > Now if I inspect the custom property > 'specialPrices', it has all four items > listed, when I really only wanted the most recent > two. > > I want a way that I can start afresh, without caring > what went before. If > specialPrices was a global variable, I can wipe out > the array by doing: > put empty into specialPrices > > or even > delete variable specialPrices > > How can I do something similar in the case of a > customProperty which is an > array? If I tried > put empty into the specialPrices of btn > "PriceChecker" > > ...I would just create a new item in the > 'customKeys' array, with key > "specialPrices", value empty. The "specialPrices" > array would be unchanged. > > If I tried > delete variable the specialPrices of btn > "PriceChecker" > delete variable specialPrices of btn > "PriceChecker" > delete the specialPrices of btn "PriceChecker" > > ... I would (did!) get a syntax error. > > If I know the keys of the specialPrices array, I > could at least put empty > into each one, which is sub-optimal but still not > too bad... but I haven't > even found the syntax for that. It's not: > put the keys of the specialPrices of btn > "PriceChecker" > > All help gratefully received! > > TIA, > > Ben Rubinstein Hi Ben, Have a look at the following entries in the Transcript Dictionary: - customProperties - customPropertySet Here's what I would do in your case : -- setup the keys you want to keep put "Potatoes,Turnips" into tGoodKeys -- switch the customPropertySet set the customPropertySet of btn "PriceChecker" to \ "specialPrices" -- retrieve the keys put the customProperties into tOldProperties put the keys of tOldProperties into tOldKeys repeat for each line tKey in tOldKeys -- check if we want to keep if tKey is among the items of tGoodKeys then put tOldProperties[tKey] into tNewProperties[tKey] end if end repeat -- update the customProperties of this set set the customProperties of btn "PriceChecker" to \ tNewProperties -- reset the customPropertySet of the btn set the customPropertySet of btn "PriceChecker" to \ empty -- now add the other specialPrices[] properties -- ... Hope this helped, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From benr_mc at cogapp.com Mon Mar 10 07:17:01 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Mon Mar 10 07:17:01 2003 Subject: mystery exception In-Reply-To: <899EC7C8-50DE-11D7-9401-000A9567A3E6@swcp.com> Message-ID: on 7/3/03 8:51 pm, Dar Scott wrote > On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 01:15 PM, Alex Rice wrote: > >> The "Error Reporting" checkbox on the resources tab of the Distro >> builder? Yes, I included it. And this handler was failing silently >> until I wrapped it in a try/catch statement. How can I tell what other >> handlers area failing silently? I'm a unclear on the concept of how >> the Error Reporting dialogs are supposed to work (or why they wouldn't >> work) > > I have had the same problem. And I suspect the same reason--I don't > know how to use the error reporting dialogs. > > The error string that a catch gets is not very helpful. I asked some detailed questions on this list six months ago, about apparent errors in the error string that catch gets, and inconsistencies between the documentation and the reality: http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2002-September/007691.html Unfortunately I never had any response. But my message did report some experimental findings, which anyone struggling in this area might find it useful to read. FWIW, although there are a lot of problems with this, it is possible with to use the data to get some clues about where the problem is. And in so far as Alex's problem was happening in the standalone, not the IDE, it's most likely to be one of two things: - a "do" statement exceeding the 'starter kit' limitation - a library or DLL which is not included in the standalone Hope this helps, Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From jhurley at infostations.com Mon Mar 10 07:39:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Mon Mar 10 07:39:01 2003 Subject: sentences as items In-Reply-To: <200303101051.FAA26991@www.runrev.com> References: <200303101051.FAA26991@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > >Message: 7 >Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 08:00:14 +0100 >To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >From: Signe Marie Sanne >Subject: Re: sentences as items >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > >>You can do it one of two ways. I am using .rtf files >>and reading them in at run-time so that I have styled >>text. What I first did was use the command "set the >>clipboardData["text"] to NumToChar(160)" in the Rev >>Message Box. Then I opened my text editor and pasted >>where necessary. It worked well. But then I moved my >>file to the Mac. Because it's a higher ASCII >>character, it didn't display right on the Mac. So >>what I ended up doing was putting some other lower >>ASCII character like "~" (or anything that's not very >>likely) in my files instead of the actual delimiter >>character. > >I would suggest using "#" as delimiter since you find it easily (in >the same way and place) on the keyboard for both Windows and Mac. >-- > >1. amanuensis Signe Marie Sanne e-mail: signe.sanne at roman.uib.no >Romansk Institutt tel: +47 55 58 21 27 >Oysteins gt. 1 >5007 Bergen http://www.hf.uib.no/hfolk/mlab/hjem/default.html >Norway > >--__--__-- Since the objective is to treat sentences as items, it might be easier to just use the period as the delimiter. (Unless of course there are decimals within the text and then you will have to deal with these separately no matter what delimiter you choose.) With the period as delimiter you could either place a period after each question mark and exclamation point manually as you have been, or, more simply, do it programatically as follows: replace "?" with "?." in tText -- Note the period. replace "!" with "!." in tText Then perform the text manipulations with each sentence as an item. When this is completed you would replace "?." with "?" in tText replace "!." with "!" in tText Jim From benr_mc at cogapp.com Mon Mar 10 08:18:01 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Mon Mar 10 08:18:01 2003 Subject: using arrays in custom properties In-Reply-To: <20030310112632.39785.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Jan, Thanks for this. To summarise, what it amounts to is that given an array custom property called "x", to be reinitialised, - set the customPropertySet of the object to "x" - create a new array - set the customProperties of the object to the new array - set the customPropertySet of the object to empty At the end of this switcheroo, the old array that was the "x" property of the object has been deleted, and replaced with the new one. Wacky! I guess this is almost too obscure to be in the Cookbook - but perhaps it could be appended to the "How to... delete a custom property" article. Since sending my message, and before receiving yours, I did at least find (by digging into the revPropertiesPalette scripts) how to get the keys of a custom property array. The answer is that 'customKeys' can be used in an array syntax, so that whereas the customKeys of btn "PriceChecker" returns the keys of the current custom property set (that is, the names of the non-array custom properties); the customKeys["specialPrices"] of btn "PriceChecker" returns the keys of the array custom property 'specialPrices'. I don't believe this is documented (at least not in the 'customKeys' entry in the Transcript Dictionary) - that would definitely be reasonable. Thanks again, Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Mon Mar 10 09:33:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Mon Mar 10 09:33:01 2003 Subject: Can I call a function that is in a different script? In-Reply-To: <20030310085054.94541.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030310085054.94541.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: At 0:50 -0800 2003/03/10, Jan Schenkel wrote: >Why not just use the 'value' function ? That's what the sons of thunder suggested. It works for me. -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From don-pederson at utk.edu Mon Mar 10 10:00:01 2003 From: don-pederson at utk.edu (Don Pederson) Date: Mon Mar 10 10:00:01 2003 Subject: Fixed window position Message-ID: How do I make a window which is centered on the monitor screen non-moveable? If user tries to move the window it should snap back to the correct position or not be moveable at all. Thanks -- Dr. Donald Pederson School of Music University of Tennessee 1741 Volunteer Blvd. Knoxville, TN 37996 don-pederson at utk.edu (865) 974-7550 From k_major at os.surf2000.de Mon Mar 10 10:25:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Mon Mar 10 10:25:01 2003 Subject: Fixed window position In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <36CE66FF-530C-11D7-ACDC-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Hi Don, > How do I make a window which is centered on the monitor screen > non-moveable? If user tries to move the window it should snap back to > the > correct position or not be moveable at all. > > Thanks > -- > Dr. Donald Pederson > School of Music > University of Tennessee > 1741 Volunteer Blvd. > Knoxville, TN 37996 > don-pederson at utk.edu > (865) 974-7550 ti know 2 solutions for that problem... 1. Put this into your stack-script and folks will not find a handle on your window to move it around :-) on preopenstack set the decorations of me to ("empty") set the loc of me to the screenloc ... end preopenstack 2. Do the snap-back :-) (See the dox for "movestack") Put this somewhere into your stack-script and you are prepared, too :-) on movestack set the loc of this stack to the screenloc end movestack Check it out... You have to see this in action to believe it... ;-) Hope that helps... Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From k_major at os.surf2000.de Mon Mar 10 10:50:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Mon Mar 10 10:50:01 2003 Subject: Fixed window position In-Reply-To: <36CE66FF-530C-11D7-ACDC-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Message-ID: Hi Don, sorry a bad typo occured... > ... > i know 2 solutions for that problem... > > 1. Put this into your stack-script and folks will not find a handle > on your window to move it around :-) > > on preopenstack > set the decorations of me to empty ### no quotes and no parenthesis ### But they are needed when setting the decorations ### to something else like: set the decorations of this stack to ("title")... ... Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From alrice at ARCplanning.com Mon Mar 10 12:26:00 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Mon Mar 10 12:26:00 2003 Subject: OT: where will runrev be in 5 years? Message-ID: My opinion: Runrev is in a great position because of 1) Linux and Mac OS support and 2) Internet protocols and XML support. This article might be interesting for RunRev developers. It's long, but chock full of interesting analysis: http://www.aaxnet.com/editor/edit029.html Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From rcozens at pon.net Mon Mar 10 14:46:01 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Mon Mar 10 14:46:01 2003 Subject: OT: where will runrev be in 5 years? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >This article might be interesting for RunRev developers. It's long, >but chock full of interesting analysis: > >http://www.aaxnet.com/editor/edit029.html I second Alex's recommendation. -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From mail at richard-hillen.de Mon Mar 10 15:48:01 2003 From: mail at richard-hillen.de (R. Hillen) Date: Mon Mar 10 15:48:01 2003 Subject: Read From locked files under WinNT Message-ID: <044816DF-5339-11D7-AD0A-000393854988@richard-hillen.de> Hello, I wrote a minimal program to read textfiles: "answer file, open file, read from file, put it into fld xxx, close file" and made a standalone for Windows using RunRev 1.1.1 on MacOSX. On two WindowsComputer (WinNT, Win2000) I had a simple TextFile to test it and it all was ok: the data were read! Next I tried to read a text file, which was locked, as it came from a measurement-system by floppy (write protected, as I learned from the file-properties) and got the message, that the file couldnt be read. I unlocked the file and the file could be read again. But why? On both machines we use a Sandbox-Program, "Surfin Shield", which said in Admin-Mode" The program tries to write to the registry. This is not allowed!" So I wonder, why such a simple programm wants to write to the registry? Any Ideas? Thanx in advance! Richard Hillen From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 10 15:50:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 10 15:50:01 2003 Subject: Goofy button behavior In-Reply-To: <200303101051.FAA26933@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 10:38:11 +0000 > From: Dave Cragg > Subject: Re: Goofy button behavior > But when you set the backgroundbehavior, the group's script is also > the background script. ---------- Are you sure? I don't see that a background is the same as a group. I thought there is a difference, i.e., there can be more than one group with bg behavior. Does this mean all groups with bg behavior excute each other's scripts? ---------- > I don't think it's wonky that a background > script should catch unhandled messages from controls on the card. ---------- No, but that there may be more than one group with background behavior. OK, I have 47 buttons in a group with bg behavior. The intention is to have its mouseUp handler work for ONLY the objects assigned to that group. IOW, the background behavior is intended for group(s) to show up on all the cards. Since there is really no such thing as a "background script", I expect the separate groups to act like controls, i.e., retain independent scripts operable only by the objects which belong to each. There are also 2 large images (800x600) which are in 2 separate groups, also with bg behavior (no scripts). So if I have 16 separate groups with bg behavior and different mouseUp handlers in each group, any non-grouped button with an empty script will execute all 16 different handlers? This is a difficult concept for me. That might be useful in some cases, but what it looks like is that I should go ahead and put a mouseUp handler in each of the 47 buttons of the group which all call a group handler (seems redundant). Or maybe I should put the other buttons, which each have different handlers, in their own bg group with no script. Would they still try to run the scripts of other bg groups if the script of the group to which they belong is empty? What if a button belonging to another group WITH bg behavior has no script. What will it do with regard to mouseUp handlers which are in other bg groups? I just can't seem to get my brain wrapped around how groups with bg behavior work. It seems that there is no hierarchy between groups which all have background behavior, since there is not really a background entity with a script. I really need a 3D map, some kind of visual representation of how it works, cuz I'm still not gettin' it. Ken N. From ambassador at fourthworld.com Mon Mar 10 16:12:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Mon Mar 10 16:12:01 2003 Subject: Read From locked files under WinNT In-Reply-To: <044816DF-5339-11D7-AD0A-000393854988@richard-hillen.de> Message-ID: R. Hillen wrote: > Hello, > > I wrote a minimal program to read textfiles: "answer file, open file, > read from file, put it into fld xxx, close file" and made a standalone > for Windows using RunRev 1.1.1 on MacOSX. > > On two WindowsComputer (WinNT, Win2000) I had a simple TextFile to test > it and it all was ok: the data were read! > > Next I tried to read a text file, which was locked, as it came from a > measurement-system by floppy (write protected, as I learned from the > file-properties) and got the message, that the file couldnt be read. > I unlocked the file and the file could be read again. > > But why? > > On both machines we use a Sandbox-Program, "Surfin Shield", which said > in Admin-Mode" The program tries to write to the registry. This is not > allowed!" > > So I wonder, why such a simple programm wants to write to the registry? > > Any Ideas? What is the code you're using to read the file? Specifically, are you opening the file for read only, or are you also attempting to get write permission? To open a file for read only, use: open file tMyFilePath for read Or more simply, you can open, read, and close the file in one line by referring to it as a local URL: put url ("file:"*tMyFilePath) into tMyVar -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From ambassador at fourthworld.com Mon Mar 10 16:12:09 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Mon Mar 10 16:12:09 2003 Subject: Goofy button behavior In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ken Norris wrote: > ********** >> Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 10:38:11 +0000 >> From: Dave Cragg >> Subject: Re: Goofy button behavior > >> But when you set the backgroundbehavior, the group's script is also >> the background script. > ---------- > Are you sure? I don't see that a background is the same as a group. I > thought there is a difference, i.e., there can be more than one group with > bg behavior. Does this mean all groups with bg behavior excute each other's > scripts? > ---------- >> I don't think it's wonky that a background >> script should catch unhandled messages from controls on the card. > ---------- > No, but that there may be more than one group with background behavior. > > OK, I have 47 buttons in a group with bg behavior. The intention is to have > its mouseUp handler work for ONLY the objects assigned to that group. IOW, > the background behavior is intended for group(s) to show up on all the > cards. Since there is really no such thing as a "background script", I > expect the separate groups to act like controls, i.e., retain independent > scripts operable only by the objects which belong to each. There are also 2 > large images (800x600) which are in 2 separate groups, also with bg behavior > (no scripts). > > So if I have 16 separate groups with bg behavior and different mouseUp > handlers in each group, any non-grouped button with an empty script will > execute all 16 different handlers? This is a difficult concept for me. > > That might be useful in some cases, but what it looks like is that I should > go ahead and put a mouseUp handler in each of the 47 buttons of the group > which all call a group handler (seems redundant). Or maybe I should put the > other buttons, which each have different handlers, in their own bg group > with no script. Would they still try to run the scripts of other bg groups > if the script of the group to which they belong is empty? What if a button > belonging to another group WITH bg behavior has no script. What will it do > with regard to mouseUp handlers which are in other bg groups? > > I just can't seem to get my brain wrapped around how groups with bg behavior > work. It seems that there is no hierarchy between groups which all have > background behavior, since there is not really a background entity with a > script. I really need a 3D map, some kind of visual representation of how it > works, cuz I'm still not gettin' it. To avoid code redundancy, there must be a way to handle this at the stack level in one handler. Do each of the 16 groups do completely different things in response to mouseUp, or is there any common behavior among them? I'm picturing something like this, in the stack script: on mouseUp switch the short name of the owner of the target -- the group name case "GroupName1" DoSomething break case "GroupName2" DoSomethingElse break end switch end mouseUp If you prefer to keep the scripts specific to each group inside the group objects themselves, you could do something like this at the stack level: on mouseUp send "DoMyFunkyGrooveThang" to the owner of the target end mouseUp Life's too short to put that many small scripts in every button object. :) -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From janschenkel at yahoo.com Mon Mar 10 16:20:00 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Mon Mar 10 16:20:00 2003 Subject: Read From locked files under WinNT In-Reply-To: <044816DF-5339-11D7-AD0A-000393854988@richard-hillen.de> Message-ID: <20030310211654.58247.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com> --- "R. Hillen" wrote: > Hello, > > I wrote a minimal program to read textfiles: "answer > file, open file, > read from file, put it into fld xxx, close file" and > made a standalone > for Windows using RunRev 1.1.1 on MacOSX. > > On two WindowsComputer (WinNT, Win2000) I had a > simple TextFile to test > it and it all was ok: the data were read! > > Next I tried to read a text file, which was locked, > as it came from a > measurement-system by floppy (write protected, as I > learned from the > file-properties) and got the message, that the file > couldnt be read. > I unlocked the file and the file could be read > again. > > But why? > > On both machines we use a Sandbox-Program, "Surfin > Shield", which said > in Admin-Mode" The program tries to write to the > registry. This is not > allowed!" > > So I wonder, why such a simple programm wants to > write to the registry? > > Any Ideas? > > Thanx in advance! > > Richard Hillen > Hi Richard, If you re-read the entry for 'open file' in the Transcript DIctionary, you'll see a paragraph that says: "If you don't specify a form, the file is opened for update." As you can't open a locked file for update, the file can't be opened. Why your sandox-program claims you're messing in the regitry, is a mistery to me, however. Hope this helped, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From alrice at ARCplanning.com Mon Mar 10 16:35:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Mon Mar 10 16:35:01 2003 Subject: mystery exception In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Monday, March 10, 2003, at 05:13 AM, Ben Rubinstein wrote: > And in so far as Alex's problem was happening in the standalone, not > the IDE, it's most > likely to be one of two things: > - a "do" statement exceeding the 'starter kit' limitation > - a library or DLL which is not included in the standalone Unfortunately neither of those could be the cause for me. Using a licensed Revolution, and not using any .dlls or externals. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 10 17:11:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Mon Mar 10 17:11:01 2003 Subject: Can I call a function that is in a different script? In-Reply-To: <20030310085054.94541.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20030310220714.25589.qmail@web20006.mail.yahoo.com> --- Jan Schenkel wrote: > Why not just use the 'value' function ? It has > a > second parameter that lets you determine in the > context of which object it should be executed. > Example > : > get value("Foo()", fld "Bar") this always works when fld "Bar" is in a different stack? or is it safer to: get value("Foo()", fld "Bar" of stack "snafu")? ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 10 17:11:56 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Mon Mar 10 17:11:56 2003 Subject: Can I call a function that is in a different script? In-Reply-To: <20030310085054.94541.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20030310220717.32870.qmail@web20005.mail.yahoo.com> --- Jan Schenkel wrote: > Why not just use the 'value' function ? It has > a > second parameter that lets you determine in the > context of which object it should be executed. > Example > : > get value("Foo()", fld "Bar") this always works when fld "Bar" is in a different stack? or is it safer to: get value("Foo()", fld "Bar" of stack "snafu")? ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From janschenkel at yahoo.com Mon Mar 10 17:17:02 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Mon Mar 10 17:17:02 2003 Subject: Can I call a function that is in a different script? In-Reply-To: <20030310220717.32870.qmail@web20005.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20030310221321.66503.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com> --- erik hansen wrote: > > --- Jan Schenkel wrote: > > > Why not just use the 'value' function ? It has > > a > > second parameter that lets you determine in the > > context of which object it should be executed. > > Example > > : > > get value("Foo()", fld "Bar") > > this always works when fld "Bar" is in a > different stack? or is it safer to: > > get value("Foo()", fld "Bar" of stack "snafu")? > > > ===== > erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org > Hi Erik, This particular example would require that field "Bar" is on the same card in the same stack. Of course, if you want, you can always refer to a field in another stack in memory. Hope this helped, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 10 17:24:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Mon Mar 10 17:24:01 2003 Subject: Can I call a function that is in a different script? In-Reply-To: <20030310221321.66503.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20030310222029.35384.qmail@web20005.mail.yahoo.com> --- Jan Schenkel wrote: > > > Why not just use the 'value' function ? It > has a > > > second parameter that lets you determine in > the context of which object it should be > executed. > > > Example > > > : > > > get value("Foo()", fld "Bar") > > > > this always works when fld "Bar" is in a > > different stack? or is it safer to: > > > > get value("Foo()", fld "Bar" of stack > "snafu")? > Hi Erik, > > This particular example would require that > field "Bar" > is on the same card in the same stack. Of > course, if > you want, you can always refer to a field in > another stack in memory. > > Hope this helped, > > Jan Schenkel. sure did! i asked instead of just trying it, because things can differ occording to setups... ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From alrice at ARCplanning.com Mon Mar 10 18:11:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Mon Mar 10 18:11:01 2003 Subject: please explain "Error Reporting" checkbox (was mystery exception) Message-ID: <0DBEAF4A-534D-11D7-83CB-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Is the "Error Reporting" checkbox on the Distribution builder known to work? I created a simple test script which is just a single line: do "nonesense" In the IDE, it correctly generates a popup error dialog "no such handler etc". However, when I build a standalone of this test stack, on OS X and on Windows 2000, no errors are generated when executing the script. The Error Reporting checkbox was selected. What is going on here? Either I'm completely missing the point of the "Error Reporting" checkbox, or it is just plain broken. I've had a look at the Distribution Builder code and it apparently clones the stacks "execution error" and "revErrorDisplay" and puts them into the build. Ben and Dar: if you look at the card's script in license.rev stack, revErrorDisplay substack, you will see code for parsing the cryptic comma-seperated integers into a readable error message. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From PMDA at earthlink.net Mon Mar 10 18:56:01 2003 From: PMDA at earthlink.net (Tariel Gogoberidze) Date: Mon Mar 10 18:56:01 2003 Subject: using arrays in custom properties Message-ID: > Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 13:13:42 +0000 > Subject: Re: using arrays in custom properties > From: Ben Rubinstein > > Jan, > > Thanks for this. > > To summarise, what it amounts to is that given an array custom property > called "x", to be reinitialised, > - set the customPropertySet of the object to "x" > - create a new array > - set the customProperties of the object to the new array > - set the customPropertySet of the object to empty or as alternative you can use set the customkeys["x"] of object to empty or set the customkeys["x"] of object to NewArray I guess one can delete the NAME of individual customPropertySet [x] from objects custom property sets by doing the following... get custompropertySets of object --(watch "s" at the end) delete line 1 of it -- or whatever line you need to delete set custompropertySets of object to it but I never fully tested this myself best regards Tariel From depstein at att.net Mon Mar 10 19:27:00 2003 From: depstein at att.net (David Epstein) Date: Mon Mar 10 19:27:00 2003 Subject: using arrays in custom properties In-Reply-To: <200303101051.FAA26933@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: The first comments on this question puzzled me, as they involved setting custom property SETS, whereas the question seems only to deal with custom properties themselves. I may be missing something, but most of the commands quoted below cause an error in MC 2.4 because they try to "put" xxx into a custom property rather than "set" the custom property to xxx. To empty any of the elements of the array that it has been "set" to, the property should be written to a variable, the adjustments made in that variable, and then the property "set" to the value of the variable. e.g., put the specialPrices of btn "PriceChecker" into holder delete holder["Apples"] put "5.50" into holder["Potatoes"] set the sepcialPrices of btn "PriceChecker" to holder Does this do the job? David Epstein > I'm storing an array in a custom property of an object. Storing and > retrieving items is fine. But I'm having no luck wiping them. > > Let's say that I've got a price list object, and I want to have a custom > property array linking 'specials' to their special prices. One day fruit is > on special offer: > > put "23.99" into the specialPrices["Bananas"] of btn "PriceChecker" > put "9.99" into the specialPrices["Apples"] of btn "PriceChecker" > > The next day, vegetables are on offer: > > put "5.50" into the specialPrices["Potatoes"] of btn "PriceChecker" > put "5.99" into the specialPrices["Turnips"] of btn "PriceChecker" > > Now if I inspect the custom property 'specialPrices', it has all four items > listed, when I really only wanted the most recent two. > > I want a way that I can start afresh, without caring what went before. If > specialPrices was a global variable, I can wipe out the array by doing: > put empty into specialPrices > > or even > delete variable specialPrices > > How can I do something similar in the case of a customProperty which is an > array? From alrice at ARCplanning.com Mon Mar 10 19:52:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Mon Mar 10 19:52:01 2003 Subject: mystery exception In-Reply-To: <31668555-50D3-11D7-8616-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: <31563CA2-535B-11D7-83CB-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 12:30 PM, Alex Rice wrote: > I am getting an exception that only happens in my standalone, not in > the IDE. Does anyone recognize this exception & have a clue for me? > The exception message is > > 91,425,31 > 77,425,31 > 443,425,5,false > 529,425,1,false I finally tracked down this exception- and of course in retrospect it was moronic: I was setting properties of a stack that did not exist yet. It's weird that in the standalone the handler quit on OS X, but continued on Windows. BTW here is my meager attempt at rolling my own errordialog. Are there any public domain ones? I'm not really clear on the intended use of the error display stacks that are included with Rev. on errorDialog pErrContents put pErrContents after message -- in IDE for debugging put item 4 of the last line of pErrContents into tObject put empty into tErrorString try repeat for each line l in (line 1 to -2 of pErrContents) put "Error description: " && line (item 1 of l) \ of the cErrorsList of cd 1 of stack "REVErrorDisplay" & cr after tErrorString put word 1 to -1 of line (item 2 of l) of the script of tObject & cr after tErrorString put "Line:" && item 2 of l && "Character:" && item 3 of l & cr after tErrorString put "Value:" && item 4 of l & cr & cr after tErrorString end repeat catch pErrContents2 -- failed to parse the error codes -- display what we could parse, if any answer warning "Application error:" & linefeed & linefeed & pErrContents & \ linefeed & linefeed & \ tErrorString exit errorDialog end try answer warning "Application error:" & linefeed & linefeed & tErrorString end errorDialog Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From rcozens at pon.net Mon Mar 10 23:58:00 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Mon Mar 10 23:58:00 2003 Subject: Does Send To Program Work? Message-ID: Hi All, I'd like to hear from one person who can confirm that "send .. to program" works. Scenario: I start a RunRev standalone, "IPC_Server". I start RunRev on the same computer. From the message box I type 'send "Quit" to program "IPC_Server"' result: no such program I launch clip2Gif and type 'send "Quit" to program "clip2Gif"' result: no such program Again from the message box, 'send "Quit" to program "Finder"' result: got error -1702 when sending apple event [1702 = invald data] Mac OS 9, RR v1.5A7 -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 11 00:03:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 11 00:03:00 2003 Subject: Multiple background group hierarchy (was Goofy button behavior) In-Reply-To: <200303102357.SAA09436@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 13:09:03 -0800 > Subject: Re: Goofy button behavior > From: Richard Gaskin > To avoid code redundancy, there must be a way to handle this at the stack > level in one handler. ---------- I agree, but my lack of conceptual understanding is causing some enmity between scripts. Backgrounds and groups seem incongrous to me, i.e., I can understand backgrounds because of HC, and I can understand groups in Rev, but when I mix them together, stuff tends to blow up. ---------- > Do each of the 16 groups do completely different things in response to > mouseUp, or is there any common behavior among them? ---------- This is semi-hypothetical. I actually have 4 background groups at this time, but it's certainly conceivable that I might have 16. The question is, how do I get various groups of buttons to do the same general things in each group with each group different, and still have all of them available on all cards, i.e., background behavior? ---------- > I'm picturing something like this, in the stack script: > > on mouseUp > switch the short name of the owner of the target -- the group name > case "GroupName1" > DoSomething > break > case "GroupName2" > DoSomethingElse > break > end switch > end mouseUp ---------- You may be onto something. The switch/case concept is new to me, I'll have to play around with it to see how it works, but what I'm really interested in is the "owner of the target" thing. I haven't gotten into that much, except windows in HC, before now. What I'm getting from your example is that the mouseUp catches the name of the group to which the button belongs, then executes that set of statements, rather like a shortcut through a bunch of nested if/then statements, as opposed to operating on the group handlers. Is this correct? ---------- > If you prefer to keep the scripts specific to each group inside the group > objects themselves, you could do something like this at the stack level: > > on mouseUp > send "DoMyFunkyGrooveThang" to the owner of the target > end mouseUp > > Life's too short to put that many small scripts in every button object. :) ---------- The Rev way of using the "send" command is a little different, too. I assume the string in quotes is actually a handler name which will execute only within the group the target belongs to, correct? Thanks for the help, Ken N. From kray at sonsothunder.com Tue Mar 11 00:32:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Tue Mar 11 00:32:01 2003 Subject: Does Send To Program Work? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <001801c2e78f$0fe76e00$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Rob, I'm currently using it in OS 10.2 to send custom messages between standalones. I'm using MC 2.4.3 on which Rev 1.5A7 is based (I believe). The only difference is I'm using "without reply", as in: put "DoMyStuff" into pMessage put "MyStandalone" into pApp send pMessage to program pApp without reply if the result is not empty then answer "Error in send" end if Hope this helps you track it down, Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Rob Cozens > Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003 10:56 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Does Send To Program Work? > > > Hi All, > > I'd like to hear from one person who can confirm that "send .. to > program" works. > > Scenario: > > I start a RunRev standalone, "IPC_Server". > > I start RunRev on the same computer. > > From the message box I type 'send "Quit" to program "IPC_Server"' > result: no such program > > I launch clip2Gif and type 'send "Quit" to program "clip2Gif"' > result: no such program > > Again from the message box, 'send "Quit" to program "Finder"' > result: got error -1702 when sending apple event [1702 = invald data] > > Mac OS 9, RR v1.5A7 > -- > > Rob Cozens > CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm > > "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; > Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." > > from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From kray at sonsothunder.com Tue Mar 11 00:39:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Tue Mar 11 00:39:01 2003 Subject: Multiple background group hierarchy (was Goofy button behavior) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <001901c2e790$086d8fa0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> > I agree, but my lack of conceptual understanding is causing > some enmity between scripts. Backgrounds and groups seem > incongrous to me, i.e., I can understand backgrounds because > of HC, and I can understand groups in Rev, but when I mix > them together, stuff tends to blow up. You're not the first one. ;-) Seriously, if you don't think of background behavior relative to the way things worked in HC, but think of them as "shared groups" vs. "unshared groups" it makes the conceptual map click a bit better. Actually, the backgroundBehavior is *separate* from whether a group is shared among cards... its just that Rev turns the backgroundBehavior ON when it places a shared group on a new card (I believe). > This is semi-hypothetical. I actually have 4 background > groups at this time, but it's certainly conceivable that I > might have 16. The question is, how do I get various groups > of buttons to do the same general things in each group with > each group different, and still have all of them available on > all cards, i.e., background behavior? Well, technically you can share a group among cards in a stack, but leave the backgroundBehavior off. What this does is cause the objects inside the group to pass messages to the group as its parent, but other objects on the card(s) won't pass their messages to that group because it does not have "background behavior". > ---------- > > I'm picturing something like this, in the stack script: > > > > on mouseUp > > switch the short name of the owner of the target -- the group name > > case "GroupName1" DoSomething > > break > > case "GroupName2" > > DoSomethingElse > > break > > end switch > > end mouseUp > ---------- > You may be onto something. The switch/case concept is new to > me, I'll have to play around with it to see how it works, but > what I'm really interested in is the "owner of the target" > thing. I haven't gotten into that much, except windows in HC, > before now. If you MUST keep the backgroundBehavior on, I generally use the magic phrase "if the owner of the target is me then" to indicate only objects that it owns, and not any other objects. So for example if you had a group whose backgroundbehavior is on, and had code that said: on mouseUp if the owner of the target is me then -- take action else pass mouseUp end if end mouseUp This would cause clicks on objects *outside* the group to go to the group, but since those objects are not "owned" by the group, it falls to the "else" clause and passes the mouseUp up the hierarchy. Hope this helps, Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From kray at sonsothunder.com Tue Mar 11 00:43:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Tue Mar 11 00:43:01 2003 Subject: Anti-Spam Suggestion In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <001a01c2e790$931551b0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Just an FYI that a lot of mail rules/spam checkers filter messages based on contents. I almost didn't see this message because one of my mail rules assumes that anything with "xxx" in the subject or body is adult and should go right to the trash. So I'd suggest for everyone to keep this kind of stuff in mind when posting to the list. Thanks, Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > David Epstein > Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003 6:23 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: using arrays in custom properties > > > The first comments on this question puzzled me, as they > involved setting custom property SETS, whereas the question > seems only to deal with custom properties themselves. I may > be missing something, but most of the commands quoted below > cause an error in MC 2.4 because they try to "put" xxx into a > custom property rather than "set" the custom property to xxx. > To empty any of the elements of the array that it has been > "set" to, the property should be written to a variable, the > adjustments made in that variable, and then the property > "set" to the value of the variable. > > e.g., > > put the specialPrices of btn "PriceChecker" into holder > delete holder["Apples"] > put "5.50" into holder["Potatoes"] > set the sepcialPrices of btn "PriceChecker" to holder > > Does this do the job? > > David Epstein > > > > > I'm storing an array in a custom property of an object. > Storing and > > retrieving items is fine. But I'm having no luck wiping them. > > > > Let's say that I've got a price list object, and I want to have a > > custom property array linking 'specials' to their special > prices. One > > day fruit is on special offer: > > > > put "23.99" into the specialPrices["Bananas"] of btn "PriceChecker" > > put "9.99" into the specialPrices["Apples"] of btn "PriceChecker" > > > > The next day, vegetables are on offer: > > > > put "5.50" into the specialPrices["Potatoes"] of btn "PriceChecker" > > put "5.99" into the specialPrices["Turnips"] of btn "PriceChecker" > > > > Now if I inspect the custom property 'specialPrices', it > has all four > > items listed, when I really only wanted the most recent two. > > > > I want a way that I can start afresh, without caring what > went before. > > If specialPrices was a global variable, I can wipe out the array by > > doing: put empty into specialPrices > > > > or even > > delete variable specialPrices > > > > How can I do something similar in the case of a > customProperty which > > is an array? > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From ambassador at fourthworld.com Tue Mar 11 00:48:00 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Tue Mar 11 00:48:00 2003 Subject: Multiple background group hierarchy (was Goofy button behavior) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ken Norris wrote: > ********** >> Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 13:09:03 -0800 >> Subject: Re: Goofy button behavior >> From: Richard Gaskin > > >> To avoid code redundancy, there must be a way to handle this at the stack >> level in one handler. > ---------- > I agree, but my lack of conceptual understanding is causing some enmity > between scripts. Backgrounds and groups seem incongrous to me, i.e., I can > understand backgrounds because of HC, and I can understand groups in Rev, > but when I mix them together, stuff tends to blow up. FWIW, I almost never use "background" scripts these days. They're useful for the subset of cases in which you want a handler shared among multiple cards but not all cards; for all other uses I tend toward stack scripts or libraries ("start using"). > ---------- >> Do each of the 16 groups do completely different things in response to >> mouseUp, or is there any common behavior among them? > ---------- > This is semi-hypothetical. I actually have 4 background groups at this time, > but it's certainly conceivable that I might have 16. The question is, how do > I get various groups of buttons to do the same general things in each group > with each group different, and still have all of them available on all > cards, i.e., background behavior? I think the "case" approach may give you a useful mix of some common functionality and some shared functionality, with the extra benefit of keeping your code tidily in one place. :) > ---------- >> I'm picturing something like this, in the stack script: >> >> on mouseUp >> switch the short name of the owner of the target -- the group name >> case "GroupName1" >> DoSomething >> break >> case "GroupName2" >> DoSomethingElse >> break >> end switch >> end mouseUp > ---------- > You may be onto something. The switch/case concept is new to me, I'll have > to play around with it to see how it works, but what I'm really interested > in is the "owner of the target" thing. I haven't gotten into that much, > except windows in HC, before now. Take a look at the long ID of a grouped control: button id 10041 of group id 10042 of card id 10001 of stack "whatever.mc" The owner of an object is the containing object, so getting the owner of a grouped control is equivalent to getting the target and then delete word 1 to 4 of it. Very handy in many instances. > What I'm getting from your example is that the mouseUp catches the name of > the group to which the button belongs, then executes that set of statements, > rather like a shortcut through a bunch of nested if/then statements, as > opposed to operating on the group handlers. Is this correct? Correct. By adding common statements before and after the case block, you reduce redundant code among objects. You could also use if-then, but case has some unique features that are worth becoming familiar with, such as its "fall through" in which cases not ending in "break" continue through the next case, allowing you to greater flexibility with how conditions are applied. > ---------- >> If you prefer to keep the scripts specific to each group inside the group >> objects themselves, you could do something like this at the stack level: >> >> on mouseUp >> send "DoMyFunkyGrooveThang" to the owner of the target >> end mouseUp >> >> Life's too short to put that many small scripts in every button object. :) > ---------- > The Rev way of using the "send" command is a little different, too. I assume > the string in quotes is actually a handler name which will execute only > within the group the target belongs to, correct? Yes. The quotes are only truly necessary if you're working with the explicitVars global property set to true; otherwise they are optional, as in HC. But as with HC, quoting literal strings is a good habit since it saves the interpreter the time needed to compare the string against its list of variables before deciding its not one and should instead be treated literally. And personally, I find code easier to read when literals are quoted, but I'm kinda OCD that way, as I tend to put parentheses around all conditional expressions as well, whether required for presedence ordering or not, if only to help them stand out visually when skimming code. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Tue Mar 11 00:56:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Tue Mar 11 00:56:01 2003 Subject: Does Send To Program Work? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2A6F7C48-5385-11D7-AE18-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> It works for me when send messages to Rev standalones on the same computer, back I have had no success sending to other programs or to any programs on networked Macs. I get error -1701 if networking and -1708 of trying to send to other apps (e.g. Finder) on my own computer. This is with OS X 10.2.4 and Rev 2 pre-beta 2. Is send to program supposed to work with other applications? I know many other apps are AppleEvent aware, so surely it should work. And if so, how do you get it to work over a network? Sorry - haven't answered your question, just added to it :-( Sarah On Tuesday, March 11, 2003, at 02:57 pm, Rob Cozens wrote: > Hi All, > > I'd like to hear from one person who can confirm that "send .. to > program" works. > > Scenario: > > I start a RunRev standalone, "IPC_Server". > > I start RunRev on the same computer. > > From the message box I type 'send "Quit" to program "IPC_Server"' > result: no such program > > I launch clip2Gif and type 'send "Quit" to program "clip2Gif"' > result: no such program > > Again from the message box, 'send "Quit" to program "Finder"' > result: got error -1702 when sending apple event [1702 = invald data] > > Mac OS 9, RR v1.5A7 > -- > > Rob Cozens > CCW, Serendipity Software Company > http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm > > "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; > Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." > > from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Tue Mar 11 01:14:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Tue Mar 11 01:14:01 2003 Subject: Saving data stacks Message-ID: I normally build standalones with separate sub-stacks so my data can be saved in the stacks rather than having to mess around with separate files. The sub-stacks appear in a folder inside my application folder and being a Mac user, I just throw the whole thing into my Application folder and it works fine. From some recent posts, I gather that if I did the equivalent on a Windows system, there is a chance (depending on who is logged in) that the Applications (or equivalent) folder would be write-protected. That being so, I would rather store my sub-stacks in the Documents folder, but how will my standalone know where to find them? The only idea I have been able to come up with is to have all the stacks built into the main app and when I need to save one, clone it and then use the the specialFolderPath function to locate the Documents folder and save there. Then I would be left with a lot of messy stack addressing issues which I think can be solved by adding the path of the data stack to "the stackFiles". It all seems like a lot of trouble to have to go to. Maybe I would be better telling people to install into the Documents folder? Anyone else got any suggestions? Cheers, Sarah From don-pederson at utk.edu Tue Mar 11 04:05:03 2003 From: don-pederson at utk.edu (Don Pederson) Date: Tue Mar 11 04:05:03 2003 Subject: Lock screen position of a stack or window Message-ID: How do I keep users from moving the window around on the monitor screen. I would like to lock the position centered on the monitor screen. Thanks, Don -- Dr. Donald Pederson School of Music University of Tennessee 1741 Volunteer Blvd. Knoxville, TN 37996 don-pederson at utk.edu (865) 974-7550 From pa.lindgren at chello.se Tue Mar 11 04:05:52 2003 From: pa.lindgren at chello.se (P=?ISO-8859-1?B?5A==?=r Lindgren) Date: Tue Mar 11 04:05:52 2003 Subject: Displaying lists of numbers in a field, Column handling, Externals in OS X Message-ID: Hi, this simple script raises two questions: put 0 into myOutput repeat with i = 1 to 4000 put space & i after myOutput end repeat put myOutput into cd fld "new field 1" Why isn?t all numbers displayed? The field stops wrap around at number 1887? Why is wrap around only possible when there is a SPACE in the text? If the itemDelimiter in myOutput is COMMA there is no wrap around at all? These problems seem to occur in all editions of Revolution. _________________ Externals and Revolution for OS X XFCN, XCMDs that works fine in OS 9 can?t be used with revolution 1.1.1 for OS X. Is it necessary to recompile them or is it another problem? _________________ Will there be functions for retrieving and inserting columns built into the scripting language? Regards Paer Lindgren From pierre.bernaert at mac.com Tue Mar 11 04:06:03 2003 From: pierre.bernaert at mac.com (Pierre Bernaert) Date: Tue Mar 11 04:06:03 2003 Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?R=E9p_:_Sort,__Find,_RawKeyDown_..._/_diacritical?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?_problems._?= Message-ID: <7407D58B-51B5-11D7-8F4F-000A27AF1BBC@mac.com> Thanks to the readers who already gave me some guide lines. Of course I didn't went though all of them yet, but they gave me the feeling that I have to give a more precise idea of what I'm looking for. I'm not an language specialist but I can give a more precise description of what I'm expecting. I look for something coherent, in other words: For the SORT Command. After having sorted containers by a sort key, I expect that a logic applied to two sort keys would agree to the fact that Argument 1 is <= to Argument 2 and so on. This is not the case to day for RR with the Sort Type International (Not mentioned in the Transcript Dictionary): RR Sort "Elephant,El?phant,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,?uf,Oeuf,?uf,oeuf,Tigre,z? bre,Z?bre" international gives: z?bre,Z?bre,Tigre,Oeuf,oeuf,?uf,?uf,?l?phant,?l?phant,?lephant,El?phant, Elephant Comparing each word with the following one gives 8 errors. RR sort without international gives: Elephant,El?phant,Oeuf,oeuf,Tigre,z?bre,Z?bre,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant ,?uf,?uf Comparing each word with the following one gives no errors but, finding ?l?phant after z?bre and Z?bre is too bad ! . HC sort of the same list with International gives: Elephant,El?phant,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,?uf,Oeuf,oeuf,?uf,Tigre,Z?b re,z?bre Comparing each word with the following one gives no errors HC Sort without international gives : Elephant,El?phant,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,Oeuf,oeuf,?uf,?uf,Tigre,z?b re,Z?bre (HC considers Z?bre = z?bre and keeps the original sequence) Comparing each word with the following one gives one error "oeuf > ?uf "; To me there is no doubt I can find a useful logic in the way Hypercard reacts but I wonder how a user will react if I have to tell him that it's normal to find the card "El?phant " after the card "Tigre" which is after the card "Z?bre" OR to find the card "El?phant" after the card Z?bre. For the FIND command I'm using the fact that FIND can be used to find a word anywhere in any field of a stack (As mentioned into the Transcript Dictionary ) . As the command Find "?l?phant" will not find "Elephant" it just means that I can't trust the reply and I don't see what kind of logic can be applied to bypass it unless being huge... May be I'm wrong and I hope so ... Thanks to every one for helping Pierre -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text/enriched Size: 2515 bytes Desc: not available URL: From al.herremans at infonie.be Tue Mar 11 04:06:16 2003 From: al.herremans at infonie.be (Albert Herremans) Date: Tue Mar 11 04:06:16 2003 Subject: lost icons Message-ID: <000c01c2e655$87ffeba0$b8f8c950@x7r6b3> I am a brand new, not sophisticated Revolution user, using the Starter Kit I developped my first, very simple, application and built a standalone one. Everything works fine, including my buttons, but the icons have not been included in the building up of the standalone application! the buttons look empty... what do I need to do in ordre to get the icons included in the building procedure? thank you in advance for any help Albert -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From peter.fink at tiscali.ch Tue Mar 11 04:06:29 2003 From: peter.fink at tiscali.ch (Peter Fink) Date: Tue Mar 11 04:06:29 2003 Subject: release date Message-ID: <000001c2e730$3d130ba0$020ca8c0@ego> I did not follow the RR discussion for a while, therefore: When will Runtime revolution 2.0 be released ? Could it be in March 2003? Peter Fink -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ambassador at fourthworld.com Tue Mar 11 04:16:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Tue Mar 11 04:16:01 2003 Subject: Lock screen position of a stack or window In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Don Pederson wrote: > How do I keep users from moving the window around on the monitor screen. I > would like to lock the position centered on the monitor screen. You can remove the drag bar by setting the decorations of the stack to none. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From wmb at internettrainer.com Tue Mar 11 05:21:00 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Tue Mar 11 05:21:00 2003 Subject: release date In-Reply-To: <000001c2e730$3d130ba0$020ca8c0@ego> Message-ID: On Monday, Mar 10, 2003, at 19:09 Europe/Vienna, Peter Fink wrote: > I did not follow the?RR discussion for a while, therefore: > When will Runtime revolution 2.0 be?released ?? Could it be in March > 2003? > If you start praying now... - maybee! Bitte keine html mails an diese liste. Danke ;) regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From scott at tactilemedia.com Tue Mar 11 06:06:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Tue Mar 11 06:06:01 2003 Subject: Saving data stacks In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Recently, Sarah wrote: > I normally build standalones with separate sub-stacks so my data can be > saved in the stacks rather than having to mess around with separate > files. The sub-stacks appear in a folder inside my application folder > and being a Mac user, I just throw the whole thing into my Application > folder and it works fine. > > From some recent posts, I gather that if I did the equivalent on a > Windows system, there is a chance (depending on who is logged in) that > the Applications (or equivalent) folder would be write-protected. That > being so, I would rather store my sub-stacks in the Documents folder, > but how will my standalone know where to find them? I believe the specialFolderPath function will return the path to the Documents folder on Windows. Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design Email: scott at tactilemedia.com Web: www.tactilemedia.com From valetia at mac.com Tue Mar 11 07:20:00 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Tue Mar 11 07:20:00 2003 Subject: Displaying lists of numbers in a field, Column handling, Externals in OS X In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > put 0 into myOutput > repeat with i = 1 to 4000 > put space & i after myOutput > end repeat > put myOutput into cd fld "new field 1" > > Why isn?t all numbers displayed? The field stops wrap around at number 1887? Here are some more strange observations that I'm getting when I try out that script: 1. While only 1887 numbers are shown in the field, the field actually *does* correctly store all 4000 numbers. It's just that 2000+ of them don't actually show up on the screen. 2. Changing the upper limit also changes how many numbers are actually displayed in the field. For instance, if you change the limit from 4000 to 3000, the field would display a total of 873 numbers. Valetia From kevin at runrev.com Tue Mar 11 08:22:01 2003 From: kevin at runrev.com (Kevin Miller) Date: Tue Mar 11 08:22:01 2003 Subject: Pre-beta 4 Message-ID: Is up at http://www.runrev.com/revolution/previews/ This is the last pre-beta before beta. We have Mac Classic / X and Windows built, Linux to follow. Kevin Kevin Miller Runtime Revolution Limited: Software at the Speed of Thought Tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165. Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707. From benr_mc at cogapp.com Tue Mar 11 08:53:01 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Tue Mar 11 08:53:01 2003 Subject: mystery exception In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 10/3/03 9:31 pm, Alex Rice wrote > On Monday, March 10, 2003, at 05:13 AM, Ben Rubinstein wrote: >> And in so far as Alex's problem was happening in the standalone, not >> the IDE, it's most >> likely to be one of two things: >> - a "do" statement exceeding the 'starter kit' limitation >> - a library or DLL which is not included in the standalone > > Unfortunately neither of those could be the cause for me. Using a > licensed Revolution, and not using any .dlls or externals. (I know from Alex's separate message that he's found this problem, and that's great; but... ) be warned - the fact that you are using a licensed copy of Revolution does not mean that your standalone can't encounter a problem caused by >> - a "do" statement exceeding the 'starter kit' limitation The point is that your IDE is licensed; you can compile scripts without limit, and build a standalone with those compiled scripts in. But that standalone is now operating under the same limitations as a starter kit, that is, it cannot compile scripts greater than 10 statements. I've been bitten by exactly this in the past. I do lots of things that manipulate data tables represented as tab+return file/blocks of text, with a first line which is the field names. From HC days, I had a nice function which took such a line, and returned some HyperTalk statements which assigned indexes to variables based on each name, so that I could avoid hard-wiring column indexes into the code, and make the code more readable. So my functions would include the statement do makeAccessVars("vd", line 1 of datatable) The code that was actually passed to 'do' might be put 1 into vdID put 2 into vdName put 3 into vdAddress This function travelled with me as I transitioned to Revolution. I had a system which I used internally - no problems; compiled as a standalone and sent to some clients - no problems; then one day sent to a client where it fell over mysteriously. They sent me their data, and I could process it with no problems - of course I was using the IDE. Eventually I discovered the problem - they were processing a table with more than 10 (or whatever the number is) fields. Running in the IDE, this was fine. But in the standalone, when my code executed the do makeAccessVars("vd", line 1 of datatable) statement, it was actually attempting to compile a script with more than 10 statements in it; and quite properly halted with the error 'license limits exceeeded'. So... if you use 'do', or change the script of objects on the fly, be aware that code which works fine in the IDE will be subject to limitations in a standalone. Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From switchedon at hsj.com Tue Mar 11 09:35:00 2003 From: switchedon at hsj.com (Simtech Publications) Date: Tue Mar 11 09:35:00 2003 Subject: start using [stack name] In-Reply-To: <200303110616.BAA15111@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Greetings: I'm trying to find a Rev equivalent to HyperCard's "start using [stack name]" statement so I can store all the sounds for my current project in a single stack. I've searched through the online docs and can't seem to come up with anything. Does Rev support this feature? Cheers... Bill Lynn, Publisher Simtech Publications http://www.hsj.com From switchedon at hsj.com Tue Mar 11 09:35:20 2003 From: switchedon at hsj.com (Simtech Publications) Date: Tue Mar 11 09:35:20 2003 Subject: Limiting stand-alone use to a certain amount of trials/time In-Reply-To: <200303110616.BAA15111@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Greetings: I'm developing demos of my stackware for download from my web site. Since these are commercial products I want to either limit the number of times or the number of days the demos will run. I'm sure this topic has come up in the past. I don't want to rekindle a debate about whether or not it's practical to do this or that it's something that most people will be able to defeat. I would, however, like to hear from anyone who has tried it or is currently doing it successfully. Any advice, including the pitfalls, differences between platforms (Mac vs Win), problems relateed to Mac OS X permissions, etc. Cheers... Bill Lynn, Publisher Simtech Publications http://www.hsj.com From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Tue Mar 11 10:52:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Tue Mar 11 10:52:01 2003 Subject: start using [stack name] In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E6E0559.3020102@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/11/03 8:28 AM, Simtech Publications wrote: > Greetings: > > I'm trying to find a Rev equivalent to HyperCard's "start using [stack > name]" statement so I can store all the sounds for my current project in a > single stack. I've searched through the online docs and can't seem to come > up with anything. Does Rev support this feature? Yes, with identical syntax. You may need to pass a full path name though, if the stack isn't in the same folder with the engine. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From mphasak at hotmail.com Tue Mar 11 10:52:21 2003 From: mphasak at hotmail.com (Michael Hasak) Date: Tue Mar 11 10:52:21 2003 Subject: can't import from file in OSX? Message-ID: >From: Bj?rnke von Gierke > >>>get the fifth line of URL >>>"file:/Users/guest/Desktop/radmindgui/ps_output" >>>put it into field theOutput >> >>hmm... this should work as far as I see it... maybe there are no five >>lines in that file? >>maybe wanna quote the field name (for excluding all possible errors): >>put it into field "theOutput" >> The problem was not specifying the hard drive as the first element of the path. So "file:/Macintosh HD/Users/guest/Desktop/radmindgui/ps_output" works. Mike _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From benr_mc at cogapp.com Tue Mar 11 11:31:01 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Tue Mar 11 11:31:01 2003 Subject: using arrays in custom properties In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 10/3/03 11:51 pm, Tariel Gogoberidze wrote > or as alternative you can use > > set the customkeys["x"] of object to empty > or > set the customkeys["x"] of object to NewArray I've tested this - it has no apparent effect. Has it worked for you? TIA, Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From rcozens at pon.net Tue Mar 11 11:44:01 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Tue Mar 11 11:44:01 2003 Subject: Does Send To Program Work? In-Reply-To: <2A6F7C48-5385-11D7-AE18-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> References: <2A6F7C48-5385-11D7-AE18-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Message-ID: Thanks to Sarah & Ken for their input. I'll keep playing with this and let you know if & when I find a solution. -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From rcozens at pon.net Tue Mar 11 11:44:18 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Tue Mar 11 11:44:18 2003 Subject: Pre-beta 4 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >Is up at http://www.runrev.com/revolution/previews/ Hi Kevin, A heads up, FWIW: I purposely use older versions of Web browsers so that I have an idea what my html looks like to people using older versions. When I visit the URL & follow the links in Netscape 4.6, I get nothing but a header when I get to the download page. IE 4.5 did display the page, and I'll be testing pb4 soon. -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From rcozens at pon.net Tue Mar 11 11:44:29 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Tue Mar 11 11:44:29 2003 Subject: Does Send To Program Work? In-Reply-To: <2A6F7C48-5385-11D7-AE18-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> References: <2A6F7C48-5385-11D7-AE18-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Message-ID: >Is send to program supposed to work with other applications? I know >many other apps are AppleEvent aware, so surely it should work. And >if so, how do you get it to work over a network? Sarah, You answered question 1 yourself. Once I find the root of my problem, I'll have an answer to question 2... and possibly the Rev IPC group will have a library you can use to do this. -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From bornstein at designeq.com Tue Mar 11 12:19:01 2003 From: bornstein at designeq.com (Howard Bornstein) Date: Tue Mar 11 12:19:01 2003 Subject: Pre-beta 4:-Mac OS PPC engine doesn't download Message-ID: <200303111715.h2BHFQ67003565@ms-smtp-01.nyroc.rr.com> >This is the last pre-beta before beta. We have Mac Classic / The distribution builder fails when trying to download the engine for Mac OS PPC (not included with the pre-beta). I copied over the engine from the pre-beta 2 build and it worked, but I don't know if there are any changes in the (missing) pre-beta 4 engine. Howard Bornstein ____________________ D E S I G N E Q www.designeq.com From benr_mc at cogapp.com Tue Mar 11 12:20:01 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Tue Mar 11 12:20:01 2003 Subject: using arrays in custom properties In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 11/3/03 12:22 am, David Epstein wrote > The first comments on this question puzzled me, as they involved setting > custom property SETS, whereas the question seems only to deal with custom > properties themselves. I think this reflected on a confusion I had. My understanding was that one could think of custom properties in three steps (let's say, one could learn about them by three observations): a) objects can have custom properties: set the abc of object x to y b) these custom properties can be arrays, in which case the syntax is set the abc[k] of object x to y c) custom properties can be grouped in sets, allowing one for example to have one set of custom properties for the English version of an app, another for the French version. I didn't really care about the last of these three observations. As far as I was concerned, my question related to the second; I had no interest in custom property sets, I was just interested in custom properties which happened to be arrays. I said: > I'm storing an array in a custom property of an object. Like you, my first reaction to the initial responses was that they had got the wrong end of the stick. But before I wrote back saying 'thanks very much, but this isn't what I'm asking' I actually tried some of the suggestions, and realised it worked... So, I'm now coming to see - or at least believe in - a different model. JEANNE OR SOMEONE PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I'M STILL IN ERROR! What I now believe is something like this: a) objects can have named arrays associated with them. These arrays are known as 'custom property sets'. They are accessed using the syntax set the abc[k] of object x to y b) one of these arrays can be set as the default, for which there is a special syntax, in which you don't need to specify the name of the array, Such that (if the 'abc' array is set as the default) set the k of object x to y is equivalent to set the abc["k"] of object x to y (note the quotes!) c) ...and then there are some minor details, as follows: - some extra syntax: the 'customKeys' property returns the keys of the current 'default' array. Setting the 'customKeys' deletes or creates keys accordingly - newly created keys have empty values. - one of these arrays, initially the 'default' array, has no name. You can only access this array when it is the default array, using the secondary syntax noted above. - some extra syntax: the 'customPropertySet' property is the mechanism for selecting which array is to be the 'default' array (where empty refers to the 'set with no name'). - some extra syntax: the 'customPropertySets' is a property which returns the list of arrays (not counting the one with no name); and which allows you to effectively delete one or more of the existing arrays. In other words, rather than there being two things (custom properties, and custom property sets); or even three things (simple custom properties, array custom properties, and custom property sets); there is only thing: custom property sets, which are arrays. I don't know if this model is exactly right. It certainly seems to correspond better with the observed behaviour, and gives me a better basis for predicting the effect of different code, than the one I had before. I'd be interested in comments from those more experienced in these matters...! Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From mail at richard-hillen.de Tue Mar 11 12:45:01 2003 From: mail at richard-hillen.de (R. Hillen) Date: Tue Mar 11 12:45:01 2003 Subject: Read From locked files under WinNT In-Reply-To: <200303102358.SAA09539@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hello, Richard I opened, but not opened for read. That was the fault. Thank you! Richard Hillen. > > Message: 5 > Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 13:08:27 -0800 > Subject: Re: Read From locked files under WinNT > From: Richard Gaskin > To: > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > R. Hillen wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> I wrote a minimal program to read textfiles: "answer file, open file, >> read from file, put it into fld xxx, close file" and made a standalone >> for Windows using RunRev 1.1.1 on MacOSX. >> >> On two WindowsComputer (WinNT, Win2000) I had a simple TextFile to >> test >> it and it all was ok: the data were read! >> >> Next I tried to read a text file, which was locked, as it came from a >> measurement-system by floppy (write protected, as I learned from the >> file-properties) and got the message, that the file couldnt be read. >> I unlocked the file and the file could be read again. >> >> But why? >> >> On both machines we use a Sandbox-Program, "Surfin Shield", which said >> in Admin-Mode" The program tries to write to the registry. This is >> not >> allowed!" >> >> So I wonder, why such a simple programm wants to write to the >> registry? >> >> Any Ideas? > > What is the code you're using to read the file? > > Specifically, are you opening the file for read only, or are you also > attempting to get write permission? > > To open a file for read only, use: > > open file tMyFilePath for read > > Or more simply, you can open, read, and close the file in one line by > referring to it as a local URL: > > put url ("file:"*tMyFilePath) into tMyVar > > -- > Richard Gaskin > Fourth World Media Corporation > Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site > ___________________________________________________________ > Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com > Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From kray at sonsothunder.com Tue Mar 11 13:32:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Tue Mar 11 13:32:01 2003 Subject: lost icons In-Reply-To: <000c01c2e655$87ffeba0$b8f8c950@x7r6b3> Message-ID: <004e01c2e7fb$f57d91d0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Albert, If you assigned icons from the icon library, you'll need to go to the Resources tab in the Distribution Builder and check the box for "Icon Libraries", and then select the library(ies) you need to build into your standalone. (I'm assuming you're using Rev 1.1.1) Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ -----Original Message----- From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Albert Herremans Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 10:03 AM To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com Subject: lost icons I am a brand new, not sophisticated Revolution user, using the Starter Kit I developped my first, very simple, application and built a standalone one. Everything works fine, including my buttons, but the icons have not been included in the building up of the standalone application! the buttons look empty... what do I need to do in ordre to get the icons included in the building procedure? thank you in advance for any help Albert -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 11 13:44:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 11 13:44:01 2003 Subject: Multiple background group hierarchy In-Reply-To: <200303110616.BAA15092@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** Thanks Richard, ---------- > Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 21:44:43 -0800 > Subject: Re: Multiple background group hierarchy (was Goofy button > behavior) > From: Richard Gaskin > FWIW, I almost never use "background" scripts these days. They're useful > for the subset of cases in which you want a handler shared among multiple > cards but not all cards; for all other uses I tend toward stack scripts or > libraries ("start using"). ----------SNIP > I think the "case" approach may give you a useful mix of some common > functionality and some shared functionality, with the extra benefit of > keeping your code tidily in one place. :) ----------SNIP > Take a look at the long ID of a grouped control: > > button id 10041 of group id 10042 of card id 10001 of stack "whatever.mc" > > The owner of an object is the containing object, so getting the owner of a > grouped control is equivalent to getting the target and then delete word 1 > to 4 of it. Very handy in many instances. ---------- Yes, I've noticed some posted scripts that do this. Can you please give a brief description of why/where you would use such a technique as opposed to getting the owner of a grouped control? ----------SNIP >> rather like a shortcut through a bunch of nested if/then statements, as >> opposed to operating on the group handlers. Is this correct? > > Correct. By adding common statements before and after the case block, you > reduce redundant code among objects. > > You could also use if-then, but case has some unique features that are worth > becoming familiar with, such as its "fall through" in which cases not ending > in "break" continue through the next case, allowing you to greater > flexibility with how conditions are applied. ---------- I really like this concept, but as I said, it's new to me. Thanks. ---------- >>I assume >> the string in quotes is actually a handler name which will execute only >> within the group the target belongs to, correct? > > Yes. > > The quotes are only truly necessary if you're working with the explicitVars > global property set to true; otherwise they are optional, as in HC. But as > with HC, quoting literal strings is a good habit since it saves the > interpreter the time needed to compare the string against its list of > variables before deciding its not one and should instead be treated > literally. > > And personally, I find code easier to read when literals are quoted, but I'm > kinda OCD that way, as I tend to put parentheses around all conditional > expressions as well, whether required for presedence ordering or not, if > only to help them stand out visually when skimming code. ---------- I agree with the above. I have the same habits, which must've carried over from my early ATARI BASIC days (now stepping out of the WayBack Machine :+)) Thanks again, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 11 13:54:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 11 13:54:01 2003 Subject: start using [stack name] In-Reply-To: <200303111436.JAA24020@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 09:28:07 -0500 > Subject: start using [stack name] > From: Simtech Publications > > Greetings: > > I'm trying to find a Rev equivalent to HyperCard's "start using [stack > name]" statement so I can store all the sounds for my current project in a > single stack. I've searched through the online docs and can't seem to come > up with anything. Does Rev support this feature? ---------- Hello, Well, I don't know how you could have missed it, but it's right there in the Transcript Dictionary under "start using". HTH, Ken N. From ambassador at fourthworld.com Tue Mar 11 14:14:02 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Tue Mar 11 14:14:02 2003 Subject: Multiple background group hierarchy In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ken Norris wrote: >> Take a look at the long ID of a grouped control: >> >> button id 10041 of group id 10042 of card id 10001 of stack "whatever.mc" >> >> The owner of an object is the containing object, so getting the owner of a >> grouped control is equivalent to getting the target and then delete word 1 >> to 4 of it. Very handy in many instances. > ---------- > Yes, I've noticed some posted scripts that do this. Can you please give a > brief description of why/where you would use such a technique as opposed to > getting the owner of a grouped control? I'll have to leave that to Scott Raney. If memory serves he once made a post about how it might be more reliable to use the latter method, but I've had such good results with "the owner" that I rarely bother. Scott - under what circumstances is using "the owner" suboptimal? -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From trevor at mangomultimedia.com Tue Mar 11 15:34:01 2003 From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore) Date: Tue Mar 11 15:34:01 2003 Subject: Editing a SWF file? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5C676624-5400-11D7-AC2C-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com> I am playing around with editing parts of SWF files that I have created. Eventually I would like to be able to change the size of the SWF file from within a Revolution program. Right now I'm just trying to change the version number. If I open the SWF file in a hex editor I can change the 4th bit (I think it is the 4th bit, this is new territory for me) and that changes the SWF version number. So is doing this kind of thing possible from within Revolution and if so does anyone have any hints as to where I would start with something like this (websites, books, etc, samples, etc.). So far I can get the SWF file into a variable and write it to a new file, it's all the stuff in between I can't figure out :) Thanks, Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Multimedia trevor at mangomultimedia.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 11 16:05:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 11 16:05:01 2003 Subject: Saving data stacks In-Reply-To: <200303110616.BAA15092@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 16:09:19 +1000 > Subject: Saving data stacks > From: Sarah ----------SNIP > From some recent posts, I gather that if I did the equivalent on a > Windows system, there is a chance (depending on who is logged in) that > the Applications (or equivalent) folder would be write-protected. ----------SNIP > It all seems like a lot of trouble to have to go to. Maybe I would be > better telling people to install into the Documents folder? Anyone else > got any suggestions? ---------- I'm looking for answers to this as well. The best suggestion might be to get on a Windows machine with Rev aboard, then look where Rev puts its own stuff. HTH, Ken N. From PMDA at earthlink.net Tue Mar 11 19:14:01 2003 From: PMDA at earthlink.net (Tariel Gogoberidze) Date: Tue Mar 11 19:14:01 2003 Subject: using arrays in custom properties Message-ID: Message: 3 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 16:27:37 +0000 Subject: Re: using arrays in custom properties From: Ben Rubinstein To: Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com on Tue, 11 Mar 2003 16:27:37, Ben Rubinstein wrote >>on 10/3/03 11:51 pm, Tariel Gogoberidze wrote >> >> or as alternative you can use >> >> set the customkeys["x"] of object to empty >> or >> set the customkeys["x"] of object to NewArray >I've tested this - it has no apparent effect. Has it worked for you? Oops, I'm using it with MC 2.4.2 and up. You are right, on MC 2.3.x engine used by rev 1.x set the customkeys["x"] of object to empty would not work. Anyway, the following script is tested and should work with engine version 2.4.2 and up In the script of the button... on mouseUp answer "please choose" with "Create custom sets" or "Empty custom set" or "Delete custom set" or "Cancel" if it is "Create custom sets" then repeat with j= 1 to 10 put "Set1Array"&j into x repeat with i= 1 to 10 put "Set1ArrayElement"&j&"."&i into line i of tElements end repeat set the Set1[x] of me to tElements end repeat repeat with j= 1 to 10 put "Set2Array"&j into x repeat with i= 1 to 10 put "Set2ArrayElement"&j&"."&i into line i of tElements end repeat set the Set2[x] of me to tElements end repeat else if it is "Empty custom set" then set the customkeys["Array1data"] of me to empty set the customkeys["Array2data"] of me to empty ## works with MC 2.4.2 and up else if it is "Delete custom set" then get the customPropertySets of me delete line 1 of it set the customPropertySets of me to it ## this works even with MC 2.3.x end if end mouseUp best regards Tariel From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 11 19:54:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 11 19:54:01 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: <200303110616.BAA15092@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 21:44:43 -0800 > Subject: Re: Multiple background group hierarchy (was Goofy button > behavior) > From: Richard Gaskin > I think the "case" approach may give you a useful mix of some common > functionality and some shared functionality, with the extra benefit of > keeping your code tidily in one place. :) > >> ---------- >>> I'm picturing something like this, in the stack script: >>> >>> on mouseUp >>> switch the short name of the owner of the target -- the group name >>> case "GroupName1" >>> DoSomething >>> break >>> case "GroupName2" >>> DoSomethingElse >>> break >>> end switch >>> end mouseUp ---------- I went back to the "Hello World" tutorial to check on the "switch" command set in the Help menu, which looks like this (when you finish altering it): on menuPick pWhich switch pWhich case "Help" answer "You really need help with this?" break case "About" answer "Hello World, written by me!" break end switch end menuPick What I discovered is that the Menu manager failed to set up the Help menu with the switch commands properly. I went through it twice to be sure and the Help menu should have 2 items, i.e., "Help" and "About"...but it doesn't. Instead, the Help menu has 3 items: "About Baloon Help...", "Show Baloons", and "Help" The "About Baloon Help..." and "Show Baloons" are the normal Mac items in that menu, which also show in the Rev IDE menu. The plain "About" item which the Menu Manager says is supposed to be there is NOT THERE... And so, the only menu item which works according to the script (see above) written through the Menu Manager is the "Help" item, which throws the proper answer dialog. But the "About" item is missing altogether. What's going on? Has this been discussed before? (not sure what to search on in the archives for it). TIA, Ken N. From wouter.abraham at pi.be Tue Mar 11 20:13:01 2003 From: wouter.abraham at pi.be (Wouter Abraham) Date: Tue Mar 11 20:13:01 2003 Subject: Finding and sorting by diacriticals again Message-ID: <2ED7BFFB-5427-11D7-80C2-000502990960@pi.be> > Re: Finding and sorting by diacriticals > > * From: Ben Rubinstein > * Subject: Re: Finding and sorting by diacriticals > * Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 06:46:09 -0800 > > on 3/5/03 11:18 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote > > > I wrote a HyperTalk handler to perform an offset function that's > sensitive > > to both diacriticals and capitalization: > > Out of interest, can you explain in what ways the 'caseSensitive' > property > falls short in this regard? > > I've had some problems with that property myself, but (without having > tried > it) I would have expected that it would do what was required here. If > we > can establish what it's not doing, perhaps we can press for some > changes or > an additional function. I think this is a very common need. > > Ben Rubinstein | Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 > http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 > > > Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical problems. > > * From: Pierre > * Subject: Sort, Find, RawKeyDown ... / diacritical problems. > * Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2003 02:47:18 -0800 > Hi all, I couldn't find it in the Metacard Reference nor in the Transcript Language Dictionary of Revolution, but as a matter of fact the sort command is also caseSensitive. Meaning, if the caseSensitive is set to true the sort order may vary, but not always in a consistent way. A little investigation in the way the sort order varies, can give a clue about how the sort algorithm was conceived and when to use it or not. For example: the string "a,b,c,d,e,f,g,h,i,j,k,l,A,B,C,D,E,F,G,H,I,J,K,L,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,? ,?,?" sort in rev 1.1.1 gives "a,A,b,B,c,C,d,D,e,E,f,F,g,G,h,H,i,I,j,J,k,K,l,L,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,? ,?,?" caseSensitive sort in rev 1.1.1 gives "A,B,C,D,E,F,G,H,I,J,K,L,a,b,c,d,e,f,g,h,i,j,k,l,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,? ,?,?" sort in mc 2.4.3 gives "a,A,b,B,c,C,d,D,e,E,f,F,g,G,h,H,i,I,j,J,k,K,l,L,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,? ,?,?" caseSensitive sort in mc 2.4.3 gives "A,B,C,D,E,F,G,H,I,J,K,L,a,b,c,d,e,f,g,h,i,j,k,l,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,? ,?,?" international sort in rev 1.1.1 gives "?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,L,K,J,I,H,G,F,E,D,C,B,A,l,k,j,i,h,g,f,e,d,c ,b,a" caseSensitive international sort in rev 1.1.1 gives "?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,L,K,J,I,H,G,F,E,D,C,B,A,l,k,j,i,h,g,f,e,d,c ,b,a" international sort in mc 2.4.3 gives "a,A,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,b,B,c,C,d,D,e,E,f,F,g,G,h,H,i,I,j,J,k,K ,l,L" caseSensitive international sort in mc 2.4.3 gives "A,?,?,?,?,?,?,a,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,B,b,C,c,D,d,E,e,F,f,G,g,H,h,I,i,J,j,K,k ,L,l" Often the build in sort order is not what we would like to see after a sort. So an idea for a little function emerges. The example is made for comma delimited lists, but is easily adapted for other cases. To make it work, take a button and make a custom property called SortOrder. Put the desired sort order into it. Use the following format as this is easier to edit (the script will make one long string of it). For example: 0123456789 Aa?????????????? Bb Cc?? Dd Ee???????? Ff Gg Hh Ii???????? Jj Kk Ll Mm Nn?? Oo?????????????? Pp Qq Rr Ss Tt Uu???????? Vv Ww Xx Yy?? Zz function ctnSort pTextToSort get the SortOrder of me #### that is if the custom property is also in the same object as the script repeat for each line kk in it put kk after so end repeat set the caseSensitive to true #### important to make the offset function work correctly repeat for each item ii in pTextToSort repeat for each char cc in ii put offset(cc,so) & space after tempVar end repeat delete last char of tempVar put tempVar & "," & ii & cr after theSorter put "" into tempVar end repeat sort lines of theSorter numeric by first item of each repeat for each line ll in theSorter put item 2 of ll & "," after theResult end repeat delete last char of theResult return theResult end ctnSort By the way, if the caseSensitive is set to true the find command will find the right "?lephant" among "?uf,Elephant,El?phant,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,Tigre," Have a nice night, WA From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Tue Mar 11 20:18:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Tue Mar 11 20:18:01 2003 Subject: Script Debugger default line selection In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030312011415.99297.qmail@web20006.mail.yahoo.com> in MC i was able to set the Script Debugger to select the stack (top line), not the card (second line) as a default. most of my handlers are in stack scripts, not card scripts. despite a good script searcher, jqSearchScripts.mc, i could not figure it out. has anyone made this adjustment? TIA ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From monte at sweattechnologies.com Tue Mar 11 20:19:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Tue Mar 11 20:19:01 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > What's going on? Has this been discussed before? (not sure what > to search on > in the archives for it). The About menu gets moved to it's correct spot under the apple menu (application menu in OS X). Cheers Monte From ambassador at fourthworld.com Tue Mar 11 20:27:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Tue Mar 11 20:27:01 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ken Norris wrote: > ********** >> Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 21:44:43 -0800 >> Subject: Re: Multiple background group hierarchy (was Goofy button >> behavior) >> From: Richard Gaskin > >> I think the "case" approach may give you a useful mix of some common >> functionality and some shared functionality, with the extra benefit of >> keeping your code tidily in one place. :) >> >>> ---------- >>>> I'm picturing something like this, in the stack script: >>>> >>>> on mouseUp >>>> switch the short name of the owner of the target -- the group name >>>> case "GroupName1" >>>> DoSomething >>>> break >>>> case "GroupName2" >>>> DoSomethingElse >>>> break >>>> end switch >>>> end mouseUp > ---------- > I went back to the "Hello World" tutorial to check on the "switch" command > set in the Help menu, which looks like this (when you finish altering it): > > on menuPick pWhich > switch pWhich > case "Help" > answer "You really need help with this?" > break > case "About" > answer "Hello World, written by me!" > break > end switch > end menuPick > > > What I discovered is that the Menu manager failed to set up the Help menu > with the switch commands properly. I went through it twice to be sure and > the Help menu should have 2 items, i.e., "Help" and "About"...but it > doesn't. > > Instead, the Help menu has 3 items: "About Baloon Help...", "Show Baloons", > and "Help" > > The "About Baloon Help..." and "Show Baloons" are the normal Mac items in > that menu, which also show in the Rev IDE menu. The plain "About" item which > the Menu Manager says is supposed to be there is NOT THERE... > > And so, the only menu item which works according to the script (see above) > written through the Menu Manager is the "Help" item, which throws the proper > answer dialog. But the "About" item is missing altogether. > > What's going on? Has this been discussed before? (not sure what to search on > in the archives for it). If you're on a Mac, the About should be appearing as the first item under the Apple menu. If it's not there I'll see that it's fixed in the next revision. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From ambassador at fourthworld.com Tue Mar 11 20:30:00 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Tue Mar 11 20:30:00 2003 Subject: Finding and sorting by diacriticals again In-Reply-To: <2ED7BFFB-5427-11D7-80C2-000502990960@pi.be> Message-ID: Wouter Abraham wrote: > Put the desired sort order into it. Use the following format as this is > easier to edit (the script will make one long string of it). > For example: > > 0123456789 > Aa?????????????? > Bb > Cc?? > Dd > Ee???????? > Ff > Gg > Hh > Ii???????? > Jj > Kk > Ll > Mm > Nn?? > Oo?????????????? > Pp > Qq > Rr > Ss > Tt > Uu???????? > Vv > Ww > Xx > Yy?? > Zz > > > function ctnSort pTextToSort > get the SortOrder of me #### that is if the custom > property is also in the same object as the script > repeat for each line kk in it > put kk after so > end repeat > set the caseSensitive to true #### important to make the offset > function work correctly > repeat for each item ii in pTextToSort > repeat for each char cc in ii > put offset(cc,so) & space after tempVar > end repeat > delete last char of tempVar > put tempVar & "," & ii & cr after theSorter > put "" into tempVar > end repeat > sort lines of theSorter numeric by first item of each > repeat for each line ll in theSorter > put item 2 of ll & "," after theResult > end repeat > delete last char of theResult > return theResult > end ctnSort Way cool. Thanks for posting that. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From alrice at ARCplanning.com Tue Mar 11 21:04:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Tue Mar 11 21:04:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5FBCCC9A-542E-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Tuesday, March 11, 2003, at 06:49 AM, Ben Rubinstein wrote: > > So... if you use 'do', or change the script of objects on the fly, be > aware > that code which works fine in the IDE will be subject to limitations > in a > standalone. Ack! I did not know this. Just to see if I am understanding correctly: as long as no single call to "do", or "value" (or other functions that compile transcript on the fly), no single call exceeds 10 lines them I'm OK in a standalone? Now I see this issue IS mentioned in the Transcript Dictionary for the do command. Now I have read the License Agreement.rtf and it's pretty clearly spelled out there. But RunRev, you are covered in the License Agreement; why cripple standalone compiled apps? Clearly the feature-limited Starter Kit IDE is a good thing. I just don't fully understand why the need to cripple standalone apps. Just to provide active insurance for what the license permits- so nobody will go out and create a Transcript interpreter with a cool IDE? I feel kinda dumb for using Revolution for ~5 months and not realizing this until now. Here are some thoughts. 1) I think it's ever-so-slightly misleading for Runrev to claim on their website, feature list: "Royalty-free distribution" "Pay once, deliver anywhere." Maybe that should be amended - "subject to certain dynamic compiling features." 2) Make the Distribution Builder somewhat aware of the issue. "Hrm, you seem do be using the do command a lot. Are you aware of license restrictions on standalone apps and compiling scripts?" 3) This should be in red block letters at the top of the documentation for the do command, for lazy folk like me who don't always read license agreements. ;-) Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From switchedon at hsj.com Tue Mar 11 21:45:01 2003 From: switchedon at hsj.com (switchedon at hsj.com) Date: Tue Mar 11 21:45:01 2003 Subject: start using [stack name] In-Reply-To: <200303120055.TAA06388@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > Well, I don't know how you could have missed it, but it's right there > in the Transcript Dictionary under "start using". Well I'll be damned! There it is right there. I must have had a major brain fart. Cheers... Bill Lynn Simtech Publications www.hsj.com From monte at sweattechnologies.com Tue Mar 11 23:11:00 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Tue Mar 11 23:11:00 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: <5FBCCC9A-542E-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: Hi Alex The thing you need to remember is that when you distribute a standalone you are actually distributing the engine. If rev removes thes restrictions then who's to stop someone building a standalone that starts the rev IDE and allows script editing. Just be thankful you don't have to pay a royalty. Does your app rely on dynamic compiling? Can you split your code into 10 line chunks? Monte > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Alex Rice > Sent: Wednesday, 12 March 2003 12:30 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: license issues (was mystery exception) > > > > On Tuesday, March 11, 2003, at 06:49 AM, Ben Rubinstein wrote: > > > > So... if you use 'do', or change the script of objects on the fly, be > > aware > > that code which works fine in the IDE will be subject to limitations > > in a > > standalone. > > Ack! I did not know this. Just to see if I am understanding correctly: > as long as no single call to "do", or "value" (or other functions that > compile transcript on the fly), no single call exceeds 10 lines them > I'm OK in a standalone? > > Now I see this issue IS mentioned in the Transcript Dictionary for the > do command. Now I have read the License Agreement.rtf and it's pretty > clearly spelled out there. > > But RunRev, you are covered in the License Agreement; why cripple > standalone compiled apps? Clearly the feature-limited Starter Kit IDE > is a good thing. I just don't fully understand why the need to cripple > standalone apps. Just to provide active insurance for what the license > permits- so nobody will go out and create a Transcript interpreter with > a cool IDE? > > I feel kinda dumb for using Revolution for ~5 months and not realizing > this until now. Here are some thoughts. > > 1) I think it's ever-so-slightly misleading for Runrev to claim on > their website, feature list: > "Royalty-free distribution" > "Pay once, deliver anywhere." > Maybe that should be amended - "subject to certain dynamic compiling > features." > > 2) Make the Distribution Builder somewhat aware of the issue. "Hrm, you > seem do be using the do command a lot. Are you aware of license > restrictions on standalone apps and compiling scripts?" > > 3) This should be in red block letters at the top of the documentation > for the do command, for lazy folk like me who don't always read license > agreements. ;-) > > Alex Rice, Software Developer > Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. > alrice at ARCplanning.com > alrice at swcp.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 11 23:23:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 11 23:23:01 2003 Subject: Rev as CGI In-Reply-To: <200303120055.TAA06379@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hello list. I'll bet this was discussed before, but I can't find anything with CGI in the archives. Actually what I want to do is build a simplified browser and emailer to accommodate people with severe physical and perhaps some mental deficits. Can it be done in Rev? I will also accept any answers/discussion offlist as well, so feel free. TIA, Ken N. From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Tue Mar 11 23:47:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Tue Mar 11 23:47:01 2003 Subject: [ANN] New web page Message-ID: Hello everyone, I have now established my own Revolution web site with links to my freely available Revolution projects and utilities. Please drop by and have a look :-) The address is: http://www.troz.net/Rev/ Cheers, Sarah From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Wed Mar 12 01:02:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Wed Mar 12 01:02:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: <5FBCCC9A-542E-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> References: <5FBCCC9A-542E-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: <3E6ECC9F.4030403@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/11/03 8:00 PM, Alex Rice wrote: > Clearly the feature-limited Starter Kit IDE is > a good thing. I just don't fully understand why the need to cripple > standalone apps. Just to provide active insurance for what the license > permits- so nobody will go out and create a Transcript interpreter with > a cool IDE? Yes. Among other things. The script limitation is a permanent part of the engine. The magic licensing key that unlocks the developer's copy is not stored with the engine. Standalones revert to the default, restricted behavior after they are built. Now think about this for a minute. If your standalone were unlocked, yes, someone might create a competing IDE. But even if they just used your standalone to create their own software, that is one less copy that Runtime would sell. You and I, as developers, are staking our future on this technology. We should *want* Runtime to guard their product, sell lots of copies, and have a huge customer base so they will survive to be there for us. Why would anyone pay for a developer copy when any old standalone with a message box was fully functional? The script limitation is the one, single, sole, solitary, and only protection that Runtime has. There's also the issue of abstract versus reality. In the 16 or more years in which I have been writing x-talk scripts, I can honestly say I have never once needed an 11-line "value" function. I can't imagine the convoluted script that would require something like that. I can't even imagine a script where the syntax would work out. I suppose someone might want to plop a whole field's worth of script into a "do" command, but not only is that rarely necessary, there are ways to break the code up if it really is required. Only it hardly ever is. I've never needed a "do" statement that long. In practice, I think you will find the script limitation to be a completely minor inconvenience, worthy of almost no consideration at all, except as a great big chunk of insurance against the future for all of us. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From Esa.Kivela at ncrc.fi Wed Mar 12 01:31:01 2003 From: Esa.Kivela at ncrc.fi (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Esa_Kivel=E4?=) Date: Wed Mar 12 01:31:01 2003 Subject: VS: [ANN] New web page Message-ID: <961D94BBE7448D4C8E4440CB7920D9E02AD692@ktk7.ad.kuluttajatutkimuskeskus.fi> > -----Alkuper?inen viesti----- > L?hett?j?: Sarah [mailto:sarahr at genesearch.com.au] > L?hetetty: 12. maaliskuuta 2003 6:41 > Vastaanottaja: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Aihe: [ANN] New web page > > > Hello everyone, Greetings > > I have now established my own Revolution web site with links to my > freely available Revolution projects and utilities. > Please drop by and have a look :-) > > The address is: http://www.troz.net/Rev/ Looks great :-) EsaK From yvescoppe at skynet.be Wed Mar 12 01:46:01 2003 From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE) Date: Wed Mar 12 01:46:01 2003 Subject: [ANN] New web page In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >Hello everyone, > >I have now established my own Revolution web site with links to my >freely available Revolution projects and utilities. >Please drop by and have a look :-) > >The address is: http://www.troz.net/Rev/ > Very good ! Cheers -- Greetings. Yves COPPE Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be From brasmussen at earthlink.net Wed Mar 12 02:10:01 2003 From: brasmussen at earthlink.net (Bob Rasmussen) Date: Wed Mar 12 02:10:01 2003 Subject: Variable uninitialized variable values (or unexpected declarations) References: <200303101051.FAA26886@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <3E6EDC83.E43B5E69@earthlink.net> David Vaughan wrote: > You may have misapprehended what is happening here. I suppose if I misapprehended anything it was thinking of "var" as having been declared a local variable by simply referring to it in any context whatsoever. By this thinking "var" appears to be an implicitly declared variable with its name as its value, as opposed to being a literal string that just happens to be missing some quotation marks. Given the sloppiness of the syntax, a little extra documentation would be helpful. > A variable is > "declared" in Rev (given no active declaration such as "local var") > when you put information into it or get it out (basically). Not "get it out", I think, or it would have been declared by "case 1" as well, and all would have been sublime. Nevertheless, that's precisely the point. Nothing was put into or gotten out of "var" by "case 2" because the statements in that case were never executed. It was the existence alone of a "put" statement referring to "var", not the execution of it, that was sufficient to declare the variable. I'm hard pressed to think of another language where the scoping rules are so loosely tied to execution structure. And when you combine these odd scoping rules with the literal/variable confusion, the result is quite peculiar. Again, some extra documentation would help. > If you otherwise refer to a text string then the compiler treats it as a > literal text string until proven otherwise. Thus, your first case > statement says "put var" where "var" is an unquoted string not already > defined as a variable - it is the string "var". That is, it is _not_ an > initial value of the variable var but is a literal string "var". > > Your second case tells the compiler to create the variable var and set > its value to the string "whatever". When the second case is compiled > before the first, then the variable var has already been created (and > hence initialised to empty/zero) when your case 1 is executed. Thus, > var is now interpreted as an empty variable (case 2 not having been > executed yet), not a literal string, and displays accordingly. > > Walk through your code in the actual sequence of considering first the > compiler's perspective and then a second time for the run-time > perspective. It seems to me that the compiler, in recognizing an implicit local variable, should make its scope the entire handler, just as it does when the variable is declared explicitly. The following script, for example, will not compile. on mouseUp put "var =" && quote & var & quote local var end mouseUp Error description: local: name shadows another variable or constant However, this script does compile. on mouseUp put "var =" && quote & var & quote put "whatever" into var end mouseUp I guess not all declarations are created equal. In this latter example, the compiler is apparently willing to treat "var" as a literal in the first statement, and as a local variable in the second. In the first example it was not, even though that one was more transparent in its meaning. My mistake in thinking of "var" as always a variable was due, I think, to hoping the compiler was not so capricious. I shall continue to puzzle about the rationale behind all of this. However, in self defense I plan from now on to "set the explicitVariables to true" (or should that now be ' ... to "true" '?) as an attempt to impose some order (if I can get it to work). Thanks for your help. RR > > > Hope this clarifies things. > > cheers > David From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 12 02:35:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 12 02:35:01 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: <200303120647.BAA13871@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: "Monte Goulding" > Subject: RE: Menu manager/switch problem > Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 11:45:20 +1030 > > >> What's going on? Has this been discussed before? (not sure what >> to search on >> in the archives for it). > > The About menu gets moved to it's correct spot under the apple menu > (application menu in OS X). ---------- ??? That makes no sense. I didn't edit the Apple menu, I edited the Help menu. Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 12 02:55:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 12 02:55:01 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: <200303120647.BAA13871@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 17:24:08 -0800 > Subject: Re: Menu manager/switch problem > From: Richard Gaskin > > Ken Norris wrote: > >> What's going on? Has this been discussed before? (not sure what to search on >> in the archives for it). > > If you're on a Mac, the About should be appearing as the first item under > the Apple menu. If it's not there I'll see that it's fixed in the next > revision. ---------- OK, but I'm tellin' ya, I didn't edit the Apple menu, I edited the Help menu. Why should an item edited in the Help menu, regardless of what name it has, end up in another (Apple) menu? IMHO, that's crazy %) Ken N. From mazzapaolo at libero.it Wed Mar 12 03:12:01 2003 From: mazzapaolo at libero.it (paolo mazza) Date: Wed Mar 12 03:12:01 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: In Mac OSX he about menu gets moved to the APPLE menu and submenu "help" in the help menu disappear. I think there is a bug. A work around I found for this problem is to use other names for submenus in the Help menu. For example: Documentation the a divider line About I do not know why, but it works, Ciao , Paolo Mercoled?, 12 Mar 2003, alle 05:39 Europe/Rome, Ken Norris ha scritto: > ********** >> From: "Monte Goulding" >> Subject: RE: Menu manager/switch problem >> Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 11:45:20 +1030 >> >> >>> What's going on? Has this been discussed before? (not sure what >>> to search on >>> in the archives for it). >> >> The About menu gets moved to it's correct spot under the apple menu >> (application menu in OS X). > ---------- > ??? That makes no sense. I didn't edit the Apple menu, I edited the > Help > menu. > > Ken N. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 12 03:20:00 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 12 03:20:00 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ken Norris wrote: > ********** >> Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 17:24:08 -0800 >> Subject: Re: Menu manager/switch problem >> From: Richard Gaskin >> >> Ken Norris wrote: >> >>> What's going on? Has this been discussed before? (not sure what to search on >>> in the archives for it). >> >> If you're on a Mac, the About should be appearing as the first item under >> the Apple menu. If it's not there I'll see that it's fixed in the next >> revision. > ---------- > OK, but I'm tellin' ya, I didn't edit the Apple menu, I edited the Help > menu. Why should an item edited in the Help menu, regardless of what name it > has, end up in another (Apple) menu? IMHO, that's crazy %) Once again, the engine compensates for Apple's unique ways: all other modern OSes don't have an Apple menu, placing the About item as the last item in the Help menu. In a Mac-specific tool like SuperCard, it makes sense to have an Apple menu, but if a multi-platform app this would complicate menu handling, requiring you to build three different sets of menus: One for Mac Classic, one for OS X, and another for all other OSes. The solution is simplicity itself, if a little counter-intuitive intially: the engine automatically moves the last item of the Help menu to become the first item in the Apple menu in Mac Classic, and becomes the first item in the application's menu under OS X. As with the stack resizing automatically to hide the meny group on Mac, this approach lets you build one menu bar and it will work on all platforms without additional scripting. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de Wed Mar 12 04:16:00 2003 From: rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de (Robert Brenstein) Date: Wed Mar 12 04:16:00 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: <3E6ECC9F.4030403@hyperactivesw.com> References: <5FBCCC9A-542E-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> <3E6ECC9F.4030403@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: >Now think about this for a minute. If your standalone were unlocked, >yes, someone might create a competing IDE. But even if they just >used your standalone to create their own software, that is one less >copy that Runtime would sell. You and I, as developers, are staking >our future on this technology. We should *want* Runtime to guard >their product, sell lots of copies, and have a huge customer base so >they will survive to be there for us. Why would anyone pay for a >developer copy when any old standalone with a message box was fully >functional? > >The script limitation is the one, single, sole, solitary, and only >protection that Runtime has. All true but how easy is it to use the engine of a standalone to couple it with full development GUI to produce new products? Is message box really fully functional in standalones? If so, I rather have no message box than do limit. I also think that while distributing an unlocked engine could lead to problems you describe, it should be possible to couple the engine to a specific standalone, for example by requiring the stacks in the standalone to pass the license key with certain calls. Such an approach would allow us to realize the unfullfilled promise of being able to distribute any! MC/Rev-based standalone without it being crippled by this restriction. And I agree with Alex that this should be clearly spelled out. I have actually found about this restriction when producing a test version of a standalone program (see below) -- after I paid for the license. I was quite upset. Fortunately, that specific program was not the only reason for me to buy the dev environment. >There's also the issue of abstract versus reality. In the 16 or more >years in which I have been writing x-talk scripts, I can honestly >say I have never once needed an 11-line "value" function. I can't >imagine the convoluted script that would require something like >that. I can't even imagine a script where the syntax would work out. >I suppose someone might want to plop a whole field's worth of script >into a "do" command, but not only is that rarely necessary, there >are ways to break the code up if it really is required. Only it >hardly ever is. I've never needed a "do" statement that long. > >In practice, I think you will find the script limitation to be a >completely minor inconvenience, worthy of almost no consideration at >all, except as a great big chunk of insurance against the future for >all of us. Well, this may be true for most people but it can be a show stopper for some. Consider a scientific application that involves modelling or function fitting. I have written such a program some years ago (sold as shareware) and would love to recreate it with MC/Rev (users still ask for it but the old code stopped working with OS 8). It requires users entering complex math functions that program matches to the provided set of experimental data, calculating statistical fit and producing graphical output. It would be trivial to run it through "do", but the 10-line limit is a killer. The only alternative I see is to write my own interpreter/compiler in MetaTalk but that ain't so trivial and slows things down. Of course, another alternative is to have each user buy their own copy of MC or Rev but that would be akin to asking users of programs written in C to buy CodeWarrior (although I am sure that MC/Rev folks would love it). Robert Brenstein From yvescoppe at skynet.be Wed Mar 12 05:00:01 2003 From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE) Date: Wed Mar 12 05:00:01 2003 Subject: splash screen Message-ID: Hi, I'm in problems with a very simple question but find no way... I'd like a stack (main stack) with a splash screen then 1 substack in fact a substack with data i can save So I'd lik when I open the standalone that the splash screen comes on, shows for 2 seconds then disappears and go to the substack "B" on this substack "B", there is a btn "Quit" when I hit the btn, the substack "B" save and close show once again the splash screen stack for 2 seconds and then quit I write a preopenstack handler in the splash screen stack to do the job but the splash screen comes again on the screen !! so can someone tell me how todefiitively handle a splash screen and the go automatically to a substack without having the splash screen on the screen ! thank you. -- Greetings. Yves COPPE Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 12 05:21:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 12 05:21:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Robert Brenstein wrote: >> In practice, I think you will find the script limitation to be a >> completely minor inconvenience, worthy of almost no consideration at >> all, except as a great big chunk of insurance against the future for >> all of us. > > Well, this may be true for most people but it can be a show stopper > for some. Consider a scientific application that involves modelling > or function fitting. I have written such a program some years ago > (sold as shareware) and would love to recreate it with MC/Rev (users > still ask for it but the old code stopped working with OS 8). It > requires users entering complex math functions that program matches > to the provided set of experimental data, calculating statistical fit > and producing graphical output. It would be trivial to run it through > "do", but the 10-line limit is a killer. The only alternative I see > is to write my own interpreter/compiler in MetaTalk but that ain't so > trivial and slows things down. Precisely. If all you wanted to do was give away a 12-year effort in crafting a highly optimized scripting engine by just slapping a five-minute UI on it, you'd have to work a litte harder than that. Moreover, as a scripting product it would face the same challenges in documentation, training, and support as Transcript itself. Given the relatively few people who enjoy scripting in any given gene pool, such a product might not do as well as one that offers equivalent functionality through point-and-click. For the very small set of tasks that truly require "do", taking a moment to break them into 10-line chunks would suffice for many of them; more complex needs will require more effort, but they should anyway: Trancript is a great general-purpose language, but is it optimal for statistical modelling? Could there be another language design that is more effective for that task than Transcript? And could it compete with Mathematica? You'd probably want simpler variable assignments than "put", and tons of custom functions, in addition to ways to load and parse the input data, etc. If they truly need wide open general scripting, the various pricing options for Rev make such power affordable. But you can't expect to pay once and then turn around and deliver Transcript as a whole to your end users. Think of how easy it would be to make an alternative authoring tool without such limits. I've seen this happen with another xTalk, and it became a direct competitor that took a good many sales away from the tool that made it possible. Admittedly I'm having a tough time thinking of a commercially viable opportunity for an app that truly needs dynamic scripting and doesn't compete with Rev.... -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Wed Mar 12 05:40:01 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Wed Mar 12 05:40:01 2003 Subject: start using [stack name] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <958CFFA4-5476-11D7-8B00-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> Others have answered the start using question, but no one's mentioned this yet: if your sounds are at all large, you should consider storing them separately, not in any stack at all. HyperCard and Rev behave differently in this respect: when Revolution opens a stack it loads the whole thing into memory. This doesn't lend itself to using stacks as storage. The positive, in case you're curious, is improved performance. On Tuesday, March 11, 2003, at 06:28 AM, Simtech Publications wrote: > I'm trying to find a Rev equivalent to HyperCard's "start using [stack > name]" statement so I can store all the sounds for my current project > in a > single stack. regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From valetia at mac.com Wed Mar 12 06:17:00 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Wed Mar 12 06:17:00 2003 Subject: Running Flash animation within RR In-Reply-To: <958CFFA4-5476-11D7-8B00-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> Message-ID: Hi all, What's the easiest way to display flash animation from within a RR standalone? A quick step-by-step guide would be great. Thanks! Valetia From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 12 06:26:00 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 12 06:26:00 2003 Subject: Running Flash animation within RR In-Reply-To: Message-ID: valetia at mac.com wrote: > What's the easiest way to display flash animation from within a RR > standalone? A quick step-by-step guide would be great. Thanks! Just put a player on your card and let QuickTim handle the rest... -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From k_major at os.surf2000.de Wed Mar 12 07:11:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Wed Mar 12 07:11:01 2003 Subject: splash screen In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <702FA544-5483-11D7-BE9F-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Bonjour Yves, ca va bien? > Hi, > > > I'm in problems with a very simple question but find no way... > > I'd like a stack (main stack) with a splash screen > then 1 substack in fact a substack with data i can save Attention: a substack is part of another (main) stack and if you make a standalone out of that stack, not only that mainstack cannot be saved but also all its substacks can't!!! So i am sure you mean a SEPARATE stack (file) :-) > So I'd lik when I open the standalone that the splash screen comes on, > shows for 2 seconds then disappears and go to the substack "B" > > on this substack "B", there is a btn "Quit" > when I hit the btn, the substack "B" save and close > show once again the splash screen stack for 2 seconds and then quit > > I write a preopenstack handler in the splash screen stack to do the job > but the splash screen comes again on the screen !! > > so can someone tell me how todefiitively handle a splash screen and > the go automatically to a substack without having the splash screen on > the screen ! > > thank you. > -- > Greetings. > > Yves COPPE try to use a global as a marker for the fact that the "splash" has already been opened for the first time :-) Like this: Stack A ("El splasho", also know as "THE STANDALONE" ;-): on openstack global onlyonce if onlyonce = true then wait 2 secs quit else wait 2 secs toplevel stack "B" close stack "A" end if end openstack Right after launching the app, the global "onlyonce" IS empty and thus <> true, but the second time not... ;-) ########################## Now the button "Quit" in stack "B": on mouseup global onlyonce put true into onlyonce ### !!! see above save this stack go stack "A" close stack "B" end mouseup Hope that helps. Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From yvescoppe at skynet.be Wed Mar 12 07:27:01 2003 From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE) Date: Wed Mar 12 07:27:01 2003 Subject: Finding and sorting by diacriticals again In-Reply-To: <2ED7BFFB-5427-11D7-80C2-000502990960@pi.be> References: <2ED7BFFB-5427-11D7-80C2-000502990960@pi.be> Message-ID: Hello, wouter Abraham gave us a fantastic international sort handler for a list of items This is his same handler but for a list (of lines) (for those who are newbies in RR) So it can easily be used for sorting in other languages as f.ex. French (as for me) don't forget the custom property : SortOrder the list of this property was given in the original script. function ctnSort pTextToSort get the SortOrder of me repeat for each line kk in it put kk after so end repeat set the caseSensitive to true repeat for each line ii in pTextToSort repeat for each char cc in ii put offset(cc,so) & space after tempVar end repeat delete last char of tempVar put tempVar & "," & ii & cr after theSorter put "" into tempVar end repeat sort lines of theSorter numeric by first item of each repeat for each line ll in theSorter put item 2 of ll & cr after theResult end repeat return char 1 to -2 of theResult end ctnSort Thank to the author of this wonderful, powerful, easy and quick script -- Greetings. Yves COPPE Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be From rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de Wed Mar 12 07:36:01 2003 From: rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de (Robert Brenstein) Date: Wed Mar 12 07:36:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > >If all you wanted to do was give away a 12-year effort in crafting a highly >optimized scripting engine by just slapping a five-minute UI on it, you'd >have to work a litte harder than that. > >Moreover, as a scripting product it would face the same challenges in >documentation, training, and support as Transcript itself. > >Given the relatively few people who enjoy scripting in any given gene pool, >such a product might not do as well as one that offers equivalent >functionality through point-and-click. > >For the very small set of tasks that truly require "do", taking a moment to >break them into 10-line chunks would suffice for many of them; more complex >needs will require more effort, but they should anyway: Trancript is a >great general-purpose language, but is it optimal for statistical modelling? >Could there be another language design that is more effective for that task >than Transcript? And could it compete with Mathematica? > >You'd probably want simpler variable assignments than "put", and tons of >custom functions, in addition to ways to load and parse the input data, etc. > >If they truly need wide open general scripting, the various pricing options >for Rev make such power affordable. > >But you can't expect to pay once and then turn around and deliver Transcript >as a whole to your end users. Think of how easy it would be to make an >alternative authoring tool without such limits. I've seen this happen with >another xTalk, and it became a direct competitor that took a good many sales >away from the tool that made it possible. > >Admittedly I'm having a tough time thinking of a commercially viable >opportunity for an app that truly needs dynamic scripting and doesn't >compete with Rev.... > >-- > Richard Gaskin > Fourth World Media Corporation > Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site Mathematica is no competition. Yes, users would not use put directly but my parser would convert their code into proper Transcript. No, I do not want open general scripting and I don't see how one can easily make an alternative authoring tool. If a do is executed within a context of my handler, not everything will run. In this specific project I would parse user input anyway to make sure it meets my requirements, so I could check for any illegal calls, but I'd want to use do for efficiency of execution (data is read separately so it is not a concern here). In my view, I'd not be opening full Transcript to end users. I agree, though, that a malicious programmer could release such a general-purpose tool. However, if a license key was required and embedded, then this would be traceable and prosecutable. Robert From mcompanys at mac.com Wed Mar 12 11:01:01 2003 From: mcompanys at mac.com (Emmanuel Companys) Date: Wed Mar 12 11:01:01 2003 Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re:_R=E9p_:_Sort,__Find,_RawKeyDown_..._/_diacrit?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?ical_problems._?= In-Reply-To: <7407D58B-51B5-11D7-8F4F-000A27AF1BBC@mac.com> Message-ID: <449954FC-54A3-11D7-9EF5-003065A81762@mac.com> I have proposed my solution to this problem in several posts. This solution, working for any language (provide we have the appropriate script), is used in my stack Polylexis, (9 languages lexicon) downloadable from my iDisk public folder. Upon request I can mail a copy of my posts, and eventually my stack as well. Manuel Le samedi, 8 mars 2003, ? 23:29 Europe/Paris, Pierre Bernaert a ?crit : > Thanks to the readers who already gave me some guide lines. > > Of course I didn't went though all of them yet, but they gave me the > feeling that I have to give a more precise idea of what I'm looking > for. > > I'm not an language specialist but I can give a more precise > description of what I'm expecting. > I look for something coherent, in other words: > > For the SORT Command. > > After having sorted containers by a sort key, I expect that a logic > applied to two sort keys would agree to the fact that Argument 1 is <= > to Argument 2 and so on. > > This is not the case to day for RR with the Sort Type International > (Not mentioned in the Transcript Dictionary): > > RR Sort > "Elephant,El?phant,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,?uf,Oeuf,?uf,oeuf,Tigre,z > ?bre,Z?bre" international gives: > > z?bre,Z?bre,Tigre,Oeuf,oeuf,?uf,?uf,?l?phant,?l?phant,?lephant,El?phant > ,Elephant > Comparing each word with the following one gives 8 errors. > > RR sort without international gives: > > Elephant,El?phant,Oeuf,oeuf,Tigre,z?bre,Z?bre,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phan > t,?uf,?uf > Comparing each word with the following one gives no errors but, > finding ?l?phant after z?bre and Z?bre is too bad ! . > > HC sort of the same list with International gives: > > Elephant,El?phant,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,?uf,Oeuf,oeuf,?uf,Tigre,Z? > bre,z?bre > Comparing each word with the following one gives no errors > > HC Sort without international gives : > > Elephant,El?phant,?lephant,?l?phant,?l?phant,Oeuf,oeuf,?uf,?uf,Tigre,z? > bre,Z?bre (HC considers Z?bre = z?bre and keeps the original sequence) > Comparing each word with the following one gives one error "oeuf > > ?uf "; > > To me there is no doubt I can find a useful logic in the way Hypercard > reacts but I wonder how a user will react if I have to tell him that > it's normal to find the card "El?phant " after the card "Tigre" which > is after the card "Z?bre" OR to find the card "El?phant" after the > card Z?bre. > > For the FIND command I'm using the fact that FIND can be used to find > a word anywhere in any field of a stack (As mentioned into the > Transcript Dictionary ) . > > As the command Find "?l?phant" will not find "Elephant" it just means > that I can't trust the reply and I don't see what kind of logic can be > applied to bypass it unless being huge... > May be I'm wrong and I hope so ... > > Thanks to every one for helping > > Pierre -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text/enriched Size: 2939 bytes Desc: not available URL: From alrice at ARCplanning.com Wed Mar 12 11:08:00 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Wed Mar 12 11:08:00 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5C32118E-54A4-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Tuesday, March 11, 2003, at 09:07 PM, Monte Goulding wrote: > The thing you need to remember is that when you distribute a > standalone you > are actually distributing the engine. If rev removes thes restrictions > then > who's to stop someone building a standalone that starts the rev IDE and > allows script editing. I understand the concern. It seems very far-fetched, but a concern nonetheless. > Just be thankful you don't have to pay a royalty. > > Does your app rely on dynamic compiling? Can you split your code into > 10 > line chunks? No, my app doesn't use dynamic compiling very much. Only one line, in one handler. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Wed Mar 12 11:21:00 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Wed Mar 12 11:21:00 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E6F5D97.3040104@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/11/03 10:39 PM, Ken Norris wrote: >>The About menu gets moved to it's correct spot under the apple menu >>(application menu in OS X). > > ---------- > ??? That makes no sense. I didn't edit the Apple menu, I edited the Help > menu. You are thinking too Mac-centric. No other platform moves its About menu around like the Mac. Everywhere else, the About is under the Help menu. It is a convenience that Revolution transparently handles the various positions of the Macintosh About menu for you, since the position is different even between OS 9 and OS X. By placing the About item under the Help menu, your stack will display properly on any OS and you won't ever have to think about it. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Wed Mar 12 11:32:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Wed Mar 12 11:32:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: References: <5FBCCC9A-542E-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> <3E6ECC9F.4030403@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: <3E6F605A.9000306@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/12/03 3:08 AM, Robert Brenstein wrote: > All true but how easy is it to use the engine of a standalone to couple > it with full development GUI to produce new products? Is message box > really fully functional in standalones? As it is now, no. But if there were no script limit, yes, it would be. The message box executes its own "do" statement. All you'd have to do would be to copy any script from the starter kit and paste it into the message box to gain full functionality. Or just type any long series of script statements into the message box and hit the enter key. You wouldn't have the GUI, but you could do anything the engine can do. > If so, I rather have no message box than do limit. The problem with this is that the message box is just a stack. If there were no script limits, the user could just type a script into a field in any stack, then put "do me" into the field script. Maybe what you mean is that you'd prefer that no script editing be allowed except in licensed copies -- but that would make a starter kit pretty hard to produce. > Consider a scientific application that involves modelling or > function fitting. I have written such a program some years ago (sold as > shareware) and would love to recreate it with MC/Rev (users still ask > for it but the old code stopped working with OS 8). It requires users > entering complex math functions that program matches to the provided set > of experimental data, calculating statistical fit and producing > graphical output. It would be trivial to run it through "do", but the > 10-line limit is a killer. Would you be willing to post an example of a "do" statement that is difficult or impossible to accomplish within the current 10-line limit? I think it might be interesting for the list to see if the problem is really insurmountable. And if we can bypass the problem it might give some folks an idea of how to accomodate script limits without sacrificing useability. Sounds like an interesting challenge to me. I confess that I have not had to use any more than a single-line "do" statement in years and I have trouble imagining where I'd need one. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From alrice at ARCplanning.com Wed Mar 12 11:38:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Wed Mar 12 11:38:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: <3E6ECC9F.4030403@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: <97C9DDBA-54A8-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Tuesday, March 11, 2003, at 10:58 PM, J. Landman Gay wrote: > > The script limitation is the one, single, sole, solitary, and only > protection that Runtime has. I understand. > There's also the issue of abstract versus reality. In the 16 or more > years in which I have been writing x-talk scripts, I can honestly say > I have never once needed an 11-line "value" function. I can't imagine > the convoluted script that would require something like that. I agree in general. It's not an inconvenience for me. But there are plenty of legitimate uses for dynamic compilation, otherwise the eval-like commands (do,value) would not exist in transcript/perl/ruby/lisp/scheme/rexx/tcl and others! There was a whole generation of AI researchers and LISP programmers who learned that self-modifying code is a way to do some pretty cool stuff. I'm not really one of those people, but I think it's worth noting. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From wouter.abraham at pi.be Wed Mar 12 11:40:01 2003 From: wouter.abraham at pi.be (Wouter Abraham) Date: Wed Mar 12 11:40:01 2003 Subject: Finding and sorting by diacriticals again Message-ID: > function ctnSort pTextToSort > get the SortOrder of me #### that is if the custom property is also in > the same object as the script > repeat for each line kk in it > put kk after so > end repeat > set the caseSensitive to true #### important to make the offset > function work correctly > repeat for each item ii in pTextToSort > repeat for each char cc in ii > put offset(cc,so) & space after tempVar > end repeat > delete last char of tempVar > put tempVar & "," & ii & cr after theSorter > put "" into tempVar > end repeat > sort lines of theSorter numeric by first item of each > repeat for each line ll in theSorter > put item 2 of ll & "," after theResult > end repeat > delete last char of theResult > return theResult > end ctnSort > > Way cool. Thanks for posting that. > > -- > Richard Gaskin > Fourth World Media Corporation > Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site Hi again, After a 4W_MetaBench-like test (tnx mr. Gaskin your name made me think about it :^) the previous function should be changed to : function ctnSort pTextToSort get fld "thetable" repeat for each line kk in it put kk after so -- sortOrder end repeat set the caseSensitive to the hilite of button "caseSensitive" repeat for each item ii in pTextToSort repeat for each char cc in ii put offset(cc,so) & space after tempvar #### caseSensitive function end repeat delete last char of tempvar put tempvar & cr after thesorter put "" into tempvar end repeat sort lines of thesorter numeric repeat for each line ll in thesorter ##### changed repeat for each word ww in ll put char ww of so after theresult end repeat put "," after theresult end repeat ##### til here :^) delete last char of theresult return theresult end ctnSort Afterthought: This is only a remedy until the sort command gets "fixed" in the mc-engine to so that it can come up to real speed. May be it would be nice to have it extended to something were the user has the choice between the build in sort order or his own Have a nice day, WA From kray at sonsothunder.com Wed Mar 12 12:04:00 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Wed Mar 12 12:04:00 2003 Subject: splash screen In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <002901c2e8b8$9afaf640$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Yves, You should make two stacks, one for the splash screen and one for your stack where you can save data. This is because you can't save data back to a standalone or to any substacks IN a standalone. So you'd do something like this: -- script of splash screen standalone on openStack send "Continue" to me in 2 seconds end openStack on Continue open stack "Main.rev" quit end Continue Put them both in the same folder and this should work. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of yves COPPE > Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 3:57 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: splash screen > > > Hi, > > > I'm in problems with a very simple question but find no way... > > I'd like a stack (main stack) with a splash screen > then 1 substack in fact a substack with data i can save > > So I'd lik when I open the standalone that the splash screen comes > on, shows for 2 seconds then disappears and go to the substack "B" > > on this substack "B", there is a btn "Quit" > when I hit the btn, the substack "B" save and close > show once again the splash screen stack for 2 seconds and then quit > > I write a preopenstack handler in the splash screen stack to > do the job but the splash screen comes again on the screen !! > > so can someone tell me how todefiitively handle a splash screen and > the go automatically to a substack without having the splash screen > on the screen ! > > thank you. > -- > Greetings. > > Yves COPPE > > Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Wed Mar 12 12:04:25 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Wed Mar 12 12:04:25 2003 Subject: Finding and sorting by diacriticals again In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E6F6774.7020304@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/12/03 10:36 AM, Wouter Abraham wrote: > May be it would be nice to have it extended to something were the user > has the choice between the build in sort order or his own You can already do something like this, using a custom sort function. I posted an example to the list a while ago, and you can find it in the archives, or at www.sonsothunder.com in the developer's tip section under "scripting tips": scrp004 - Using Sort to Rearrange the Contents of Each Line in a List. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From k_major at os.surf2000.de Wed Mar 12 12:58:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Wed Mar 12 12:58:01 2003 Subject: splash screen In-Reply-To: <002901c2e8b8$9afaf640$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: Hi Ken, > Yves, > > You should make two stacks, one for the splash screen and one for your > stack where you can save data. This is because you can't save data back > to a standalone or to any substacks IN a standalone. So you'd do > something like this: > > -- script of splash screen standalone > on openStack > send "Continue" to me in 2 seconds > end openStack > > on Continue > open stack "Main.rev" > quit > end Continue > > Put them both in the same folder and this should work. quit ??? C'mon Ray... ;-) I am sure you mean something like: close stack "A", don't you? > Ken Ray Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 12 13:24:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 12 13:24:00 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: <200303121212.HAA22275@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 00:16:31 -0800 > Subject: Re: Menu manager/switch problem > From: Richard Gaskin > > Ken Norris wrote: > >> OK, but I'm tellin' ya, I didn't edit the Apple menu, I edited the Help >> menu. Why should an item edited in the Help menu, regardless of what name it >> has, end up in another (Apple) menu? IMHO, that's crazy %) > > Once again, the engine compensates for Apple's unique ways: all other > modern OSes don't have an Apple menu, placing the About item as the last > item in the Help menu. ---------- Well, the Menu Manger tutorial _says_ it's supposed to be the last item of the Help menu, which is where I put it. The shift it made to the Apple menu was totally unexpected and not mentioned or explained in any way. How on earth will we know if and when the engine does things like that if it isn't made obvious in the docs? ---------- > In a Mac-specific tool like SuperCard, it makes sense to have an Apple menu, > but if a multi-platform app this would complicate menu handling, requiring > you to build three different sets of menus: One for Mac Classic, one for OS > X, and another for all other OSes. ---------- I understand, but I think that would be OK. The Menu Manager has the Mac OS choice. If I hadn't clicked that would it go where I put it? What other menu shifts might that cause to happen? Does the shift-to-Apple-menu always happen to the LAST EDITED item of the Help menu? Or does it happen to ANY item of the Help menu named "About"? Or does it happen ONLY IF the last item of the Help menu is the word "About"? ---------- > The solution is simplicity itself, if a little counter-intuitive intially: > the engine automatically moves the last item of the Help menu to become the > first item in the Apple menu in Mac Classic, and becomes the first item in > the application's menu under OS X. ---------- OK, but this is the first I've heard about that. The docs don't say anything about it, so how would we know? In fact, as I mentioned, the Menu Manager tutorial leads us to believe otherwise. ---------- > As with the stack resizing automatically to hide the meny group on Mac, this > approach lets you build one menu bar and it will work on all platforms > without additional scripting. ---------- Yes, I'm beginning to understand that. Also, there seems to be anomalies in stack resizing/menubars for full screen windows which can only be prevented by setting it in preOpenStack. Just a warning to others. I like Rev a lot. It's a truly awesome RAD tool, but because of xplatform abilities it apparently does unexpected things from time to time. Is there a list with explanations of _all_of the known "compensating" shifts which the engine makes between platforms so we can have a way of knowing what to expect? Thanks so much for your patience. All the best, Ken N. From kray at sonsothunder.com Wed Mar 12 13:36:00 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Wed Mar 12 13:36:00 2003 Subject: splash screen In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <003201c2e8c5$baf7f990$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> > > on Continue > > open stack "Main.rev" > > quit > > end Continue > > > > Put them both in the same folder and this should work. > > quit ??? > > C'mon Ray... ;-) > > I am sure you mean something like: > close stack "A", don't you? Whoops! I've been doing too much work with multiple standalones instead of a standalone and other stacks. Right you are, Major! ;-) Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 12 13:38:08 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 12 13:38:08 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Robert Brenstein wrote: > No, I do not want open general scripting and I don't see how one can > easily make an alternative authoring tool. If a do is executed within > a context of my handler, not everything will run. In this specific > project I would parse user input anyway to make sure it meets my > requirements, so I could check for any illegal calls, but I'd want to > use do for efficiency of execution (data is read separately so it is > not a concern here). I'll bet there's a way to do it in Rev (if you'll pardon the pun), script limits and all. In some ways it's a lot like the non-asynch mouse messages: for a while there was a lot of talk that handlers dependent on polling mouse evebnts were impossible to rewrite using mouseMove, but with a little help from others on this list such handlers were rewritten and people moved forward with their work. While not likely to be a one-liner, my hunch is there's no project authored in HC that can't be at least as useful authored in Rev. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 12 13:47:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 12 13:47:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: <97C9DDBA-54A8-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: Alex Rice wrote: > There was a whole generation of AI researchers and LISP programmers who > learned that self-modifying code is a way to do some pretty cool stuff. > I'm not really one of those people, but I think it's worth noting. Many of the benefits of those languages can be had by programming in Transcript. But with that level of programming it seems reasonable that the researchr would pick up a license -- at the edu price it's quite affordable. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Wed Mar 12 14:23:01 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Wed Mar 12 14:23:01 2003 Subject: databases and Rev Message-ID: <20030312191926.84962.qmail@web20419.mail.yahoo.com> Just wondering what some of you have used for databases with your Revolution apps? I'm looking for something that will run on Windows and Mac and will work for both a stand-alone single-user version and and a network multi-user version. I've done quite a bit of research on this, and still haven't found the perfect solution. Maybe that's because one doesn't exist. :-) But I would like to know what some of you have used in the past (mySQL, Oracle, PostgreSQL, Valentina, etc.) I am aware that Valentina does not currently have a client/server version, but that Paradigma Software is working on it. Any suggestions and/or experiences would be very helpful. Thank you, Chris Sheffield Read Naturally __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Wed Mar 12 14:46:00 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Wed Mar 12 14:46:00 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: <97C9DDBA-54A8-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> References: <97C9DDBA-54A8-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: >There was a whole generation of AI researchers and LISP programmers >who learned that self-modifying code is a way to do some pretty cool >stuff. Not to mention anonynous lambda expressions. I can easily see myself writing a 10 line dynamically compiled function if I got back into that style of programming again. -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From alrice at ARCplanning.com Wed Mar 12 15:04:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Wed Mar 12 15:04:01 2003 Subject: anecdotal evidence that Rev is great Message-ID: <5CB2B7A8-54C5-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> I wrote an app in Realbasic (having about 1 year experience in realbasic at start) I rewrote the app in Revolution. (having 0 months of experience in revolution at start) My boss has recently remarked that the Revolution version of the app "looks better" and "seems more solid" than the realbasic version. I have to say I agree :-) We can argue Realbasic vs. Revolution on technical marks, ad infinitum, but these kind of subjective things count for a lot. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Wed Mar 12 15:07:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Wed Mar 12 15:07:01 2003 Subject: Pricing. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >But with that level of programming it seems reasonable that the >researchr would pick up a license -- at the edu price it's quite affordable. Hm? The educational (single user) price is 1.5 times the small business price. I'm a university educator, but the affordable ($99) price is only for K12 educators. It seems the only option for me, a educational / hobby / freeware programmer is the $300 a year for a small business license. I bought 1.1.1 as a HC crossgrade more than a year ago. I've sent RR about a dozen stacks that crash their system. I have not seen any bug fix releases, so I guess I can hack my way around the bugs, or pay $300. I! do! not! like! this! -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 12 16:20:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 12 16:20:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Victor Eijkhout wrote: >> There was a whole generation of AI researchers and LISP programmers >> who learned that self-modifying code is a way to do some pretty cool >> stuff. > > Not to mention anonynous lambda expressions. I can easily see myself > writing a 10 line dynamically compiled function if I got back into > that style of programming again. And you'd be able to do so within Rev's current scriptlimits. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 12 16:22:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 12 16:22:01 2003 Subject: Pricing. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Victor Eijkhout wrote: >> But with that level of programming it seems reasonable that the >> researchr would pick up a license -- at the edu price it's quite affordable. > > Hm? The educational (single user) price is 1.5 times the small > business price. I'm a university educator, but the affordable ($99) > price is only for K12 educators. > > It seems the only option for me, a educational / hobby / freeware > programmer is the $300 a year for a small business license. I bought > 1.1.1 as a HC crossgrade more than a year ago. I've sent RR about a > dozen stacks that crash their system. I have not seen any bug fix > releases, so I guess I can hack my way around the bugs, or pay $300. > I! do! not! like! this! Post the script in question and lt's see what we can do to have it work within Rev's current script limits. In more than five years working with that engine, I've yet to find a worthy problem for which there was no worthy solution. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 12 16:22:09 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 12 16:22:09 2003 Subject: anecdotal evidence that Rev is great In-Reply-To: <5CB2B7A8-54C5-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: Alex Rice wrote: > I wrote an app in Realbasic (having about 1 year experience in > realbasic at start) > I rewrote the app in Revolution. (having 0 months of experience in > revolution at start) > > My boss has recently remarked that the Revolution version of the app > "looks better" and "seems more solid" than the realbasic version. I > have to say I agree :-) > > We can argue Realbasic vs. Revolution on technical marks, ad infinitum, > but these kind of subjective things count for a lot. I'm curious: how much time did it take you to write each version? -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 12 16:57:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 12 16:57:01 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: <200303121701.MAA28589@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 10:17:27 -0600 > From: "J. Landman Gay" > Organization: HyperActive Software > Subject: Re: Menu manager/switch problem > > On 3/11/03 10:39 PM, Ken Norris wrote: >> ??? That makes no sense. I didn't edit the Apple menu, I edited the Help >> menu. > > You are thinking too Mac-centric. No other platform moves its About menu > around like the Mac. Everywhere else, the About is under the Help menu. > It is a convenience that Revolution transparently handles the various > positions of the Macintosh About menu for you, since the position is > different even between OS 9 and OS X. By placing the About item under > the Help menu, your stack will display properly on any OS and you won't > ever have to think about it. ---------- It's just that there is nothing in the docs to tell us this is what happens, so I wasn't expecting it. There's probably other stuff like that, too. I'm looking for that list. Thanks much, Ken N. From alrice at ARCplanning.com Wed Mar 12 17:10:00 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Wed Mar 12 17:10:00 2003 Subject: anecdotal evidence that Rev is great In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wednesday, March 12, 2003, at 02:19 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote: > I'm curious: how much time did it take you to write each version? Roughly the same amount of time... but it's kind of a skewed measure because the project requirements and screens were pretty well ironed out by the time I started on the Revolution version. Also, in the Revolution version I am using expert system software (CLIPS), called via shell(), to perform calculations, whereas in the realbasic version I had written all the calculations in realbasic. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From rogerguay at centurytel.net Wed Mar 12 17:22:01 2003 From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay) Date: Wed Mar 12 17:22:01 2003 Subject: How do you refer to "this group"? Message-ID: <97482FE6-54D8-11D7-9F9D-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Please, someone tell me: I have a group of 3 to 5 controls. How can I control that group by scripting an object in it. e.g. "put the id of this group" does not work. What I ultimately want is for the group to follow the mouseLoc and, if the opetionKey is down, to delete the group. TIA, Roger From alrice at ARCplanning.com Wed Mar 12 17:23:00 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Wed Mar 12 17:23:00 2003 Subject: anecdotal evidence that Rev is great In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wednesday, March 12, 2003, at 03:06 PM, Alex Rice wrote: > ... > in the Revolution version I am using expert system software (CLIPS), > called via shell(), to perform calculations, whereas in the realbasic > version I had written all the calculations in realbasic. BTW this is not because the backend wouldn't have been possible in Revolution. It would have been just as feasible in Rev or Realbasic. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From jeanne at runrev.com Wed Mar 12 17:24:01 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Wed Mar 12 17:24:01 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: References: <200303121212.HAA22275@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: At 7:29 AM -0800 3/12/03, Ken Norris wrote: >Well, the Menu Manger tutorial _says_ it's supposed to be the last item of >the Help menu, which is where I put it. The shift it made to the Apple menu >was totally unexpected and not mentioned or explained in any way. How on >earth will we know if and when the engine does things like that if it isn't >made obvious in the docs? Page 8 of the Menu Manager tutorial says: "The File menu contains a Quit item, and the Help menu contains Help and About, as well as a menu divider line. We'll leave these menu items as they are. (On Mac OS systems, the last item in the Help menu is actually displayed as the first item in the Apple menu.)" This behavior and the reason for it are also discussed at some length in "About menus and the menu bar". Now, short of creating a special "neon" text style for the docs, tailored to each reader (which I'm starting to think I'm going to have to do.... ;-) -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development http://www.runrev.com/ From scott at tactilemedia.com Wed Mar 12 17:27:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Wed Mar 12 17:27:01 2003 Subject: How do you refer to "this group"? In-Reply-To: <97482FE6-54D8-11D7-9F9D-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Message-ID: Recently, "Roger Guay" wrote: > Please, someone tell me: I have a group of 3 to 5 controls. How can I > control that group by scripting an object in it. e.g. "put the id of > this group" does not work. What I ultimately want is for the group to > follow the mouseLoc and, if the opetionKey is down, to delete the group. Try "the owner of me". Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design ----- E: scott at tactilemedia.com W: http://www.tactilemedia.com From monte at sweattechnologies.com Wed Mar 12 17:34:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Wed Mar 12 17:34:01 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > It's just that there is nothing in the docs to tell us this is > what happens, > so I wasn't expecting it. There's probably other stuff like that, too. I'm > looking for that list. > Hi Ken Look at Revolution Encyclopedia > menus and the menu bar > Menu Bars on Mac OS and OS X Systems Cheers Monte From jiml at netrin.com Wed Mar 12 17:51:03 2003 From: jiml at netrin.com (Jim Lambert) Date: Wed Mar 12 17:51:03 2003 Subject: CGI again In-Reply-To: <200303122158.QAA05507@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Now, don't laugh. I'm trying to use Apple's Personal Web Sharing(PWS) under OS 9.2 to do CGI with Rev and having little luck. Yes, I know that it's possible to build a complete server in rev bypassing PWS entirely. But I thought I'd try the antique, torturous, head-splitting way first! Tried to set up Actions to launch Revolution first at suffix .cgi then .rev Neither seemed to work. I use plain text files ending in .cgi or .rev containing rev startup scripts. Put an alias to Revolution in the same folder as the cgi script and Allow aliases to open items of outside the Web folder. Since there's no default cgi-bin folder in PWS how does one handle a CGI script's engine invocation: #!/home/httpd/cgi-bin/revolution ? Is that line even necessary with the Actions monkeybusiness? Regardless of suffix, Rev doesn't launch. Thinking that Applescript may be involved I made sure Applescript was enabled along with Standard Scripting Additions. So I tried pre-launching it. Nada. Just 'A CGI or internal server component could not complete the requested action.' I checked the list's archives, Rev Web ring sites, and found lots of great information on doing this under Unix, Linux and Jaguar, but not much for classic mac. Your advice is much appreciated. Jim Lambert From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 12 17:54:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 12 17:54:01 2003 Subject: How do you refer to "this group"? In-Reply-To: <97482FE6-54D8-11D7-9F9D-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Message-ID: Roger Guay wrote: > Please, someone tell me: I have a group of 3 to 5 controls. How can I > control that group by scripting an object in it. e.g. "put the id of > this group" does not work. What I ultimately want is for the group to > follow the mouseLoc and, if the opetionKey is down, to delete the group. Try "the owner of the tsrget" and see if that does what you need in your context. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 12 18:03:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 12 18:03:01 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ken Norris wrote: >> You are thinking too Mac-centric. No other platform moves its About menu >> around like the Mac. Everywhere else, the About is under the Help menu. >> It is a convenience that Revolution transparently handles the various >> positions of the Macintosh About menu for you, since the position is >> different even between OS 9 and OS X. By placing the About item under >> the Help menu, your stack will display properly on any OS and you won't >> ever have to think about it. > ---------- > It's just that there is nothing in the docs to tell us this is what happens, > so I wasn't expecting it. There's probably other stuff like that, too. I'm > looking for that list. I remember how hard it was for me to learn SuperCard when I came from a background in HyperCard, and years later how hard Ken, Christopher Watson, and myself worked to deliver one of the most comprehensive sets of docs for an authoring tool ever at the time, only to find how hard it was even after we delivered them for folks to readily find everything they needed. With complex systems like authoring tools, experience is the best teacher. Since I came into Rev from MetaCard years before, I'm less familiar with Rev's docs, but generally find them far better than MC's, and roughly on par with SuperCard's (there's a great many more tokens to document in Rev, so the Rev docs have generally more stuff overall). Knowing Jeanne's thoroughness (it was, after all, her HyperCard book that we used as the inspiration for form and breadth when we rewote SuperCard's docs), I took a look in the docs to see what I could find on this subject. Here's what I did: 1. In Rev's menu bar, I chose Help->Revolution Documentation 2. In the list on the front card of that stack, I chose "Menus", which brings up a list of topics on the right. In that list, assuming I had no experience with Rev, I simply chose the first item, "About...menus and the menu bar", thinking it might provide a good overview from which I could explore other details as needed. 3. In that section is a subsection titled "Menu Bars on Mac OS and OS X Systems", which describes the behavior in question, with more detail and more concisely than even the discussion here on this list. Ken and I once had the pleasure of working under the same manager, a man of impecible character and unusual insight. I found myself frustrated with learning Gain Momentum, since it was not only a larger and more complex xTalk than I'd known before (20 volumes of manuals stacked three feet high), but it also required me to learn Unix at the same time. It was a lot to bite off at once, and after coming from years of solid SuperCard mastery I was frustrated with finding myself nearly completely ignorant, starting at the very bottom of the learning curve all over again. I took my concerns to my manager, and here's what he told me: If you plant a seed today and pour ten thousand gallons of water on it, you still won't have a tree tommorrow. Some things simply take time and patience, and learning is definitely more of a process than an event. This is especially difficult when coming from another tool, and compounded when that tool rests in the relative comfort of a single operating system: For years you've grown into a comfortable mastery of the tool, and over time the "learning muscle" in some respects atrophies. Observing myself with both learning new tools and with physical therapy after a hiking accident last year, I know how hard it is to reverse atrophy. But as my physical therapist reminded me, "movement begets movement": every small effort made in a direction of growth has a compounded effect over time. Initially there are few measurable results, and such work begins as an act of faith and will. But over time, with the encouragement of others who've crossed that mountain before you, you have to trust that it's achievable. And after a while your results will provide all the encouragement you'll need, and may even serve to inspire others as they begin the same path. So please be patient with yourself, and try to be patient with the docs. They're not perfect, but frankly they are among the most comprehensive you'll find, even when compared to the big publishers like Adobe and Macromedia. In nearly evry case, I'll stake my reputation on the assertion that the topic is covered in Jeanne's docs. And for those few cases where a topic is not in a clear place or even more rare, not covered at all, a brief note to her will see it corrected as soon as possible, and a note to this list will put you on the right track immediately. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From alrice at ARCplanning.com Wed Mar 12 18:24:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Wed Mar 12 18:24:01 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <309A98FC-54E1-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Wednesday, March 12, 2003, at 02:40 PM, Jeanne A. E. DeVoto wrote: > > Now, short of creating a special "neon" text style for the docs, > tailored > to each reader (which I'm starting to think I'm going to have to > do.... ;-) Maybe hack htmlText to support the tag? :-) Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de Wed Mar 12 18:54:00 2003 From: rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de (Robert Brenstein) Date: Wed Mar 12 18:54:00 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: <3E6F605A.9000306@hyperactivesw.com> References: <5FBCCC9A-542E-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> <3E6ECC9F.4030403@hyperactivesw.com> <3E6F605A.9000306@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: >On 3/12/03 3:08 AM, Robert Brenstein wrote: > >>All true but how easy is it to use the engine of a standalone to >>couple it with full development GUI to produce new products? Is >>message box really fully functional in standalones? > >As it is now, no. But if there were no script limit, yes, it would >be. The message box executes its own "do" statement. All you'd have >to do would be to copy any script from the starter kit and paste it >into the message box to gain full functionality. Or just type any >long series of script statements into the message box and hit the >enter key. You wouldn't have the GUI, but you could do anything the >engine can do. And you think that this can't be stopped by using the license key within a standalone? > >>If so, I rather have no message box than do limit. > >The problem with this is that the message box is just a stack. If >there were no script limits, the user could just type a script into >a field in any stack, then put "do me" into the field script. Maybe >what you mean is that you'd prefer that no script editing be allowed >except in licensed copies -- but that would make a starter kit >pretty hard to produce. Can one add a new field script when the scripting is password-protected as it should in standalones? >Would you be willing to post an example of a "do" statement that is >difficult or impossible to accomplish within the current 10-line >limit? I think it might be interesting for the list to see if the >problem is really insurmountable. And if we can bypass the problem >it might give some folks an idea of how to accomodate script limits >without sacrificing useability. Sounds like an interesting challenge >to me. I confess that I have not had to use any more than a >single-line "do" statement in years and I have trouble imagining >where I'd need one. I do not have an example of such a do, but functions I am talking about are like declarations a[1] = 1,const; a[2] = 1,var; a[3] = 1,var; limits a[2] > 0; begin y:= exp(-x/a[1])*cos(x*a[2])*a[3]; end; This is a trivial (decay) function with just three parameters and 1 independent and 1 dependent variable. Imagine something along these lines, though, but more complex, let's say with 10 or 15 parameters and a set of equations with 12 or 15 independent variables. This has to be converted into a series of Transcript statements which would be executed for each data point in a loop. Ah, and most analyses require providing equations for derivatives yet. Robert From rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de Wed Mar 12 18:54:11 2003 From: rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de (Robert Brenstein) Date: Wed Mar 12 18:54:11 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > >While not likely to be a one-liner, my hunch is there's no project authored >in HC that can't be at least as useful authored in Rev. > But I never said this is coming from HC. My original program was in Fortran and was parsing the provided equations into a pseudo-code that was executed in a do fashion. Robert From rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de Wed Mar 12 19:14:00 2003 From: rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de (Robert Brenstein) Date: Wed Mar 12 19:14:00 2003 Subject: CGI again In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >Now, don't laugh. > >I'm trying to use Apple's Personal Web Sharing(PWS) under OS 9.2 to do CGI >with Rev and having little luck. Yes, I know that it's possible to build a >complete server in rev bypassing PWS entirely. But I thought I'd try the >antique, torturous, head-splitting way first! > Don't use PWS. The free MacHTTP is much much better. And save yourself some trouble by fetching a cgi starter kit for Classic Mac OS from http://www.robelko.com/metacard/starter-cgi.html Robert Brenstein From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 12 19:42:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 12 19:42:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Robert Brenstein wrote: >> >> While not likely to be a one-liner, my hunch is there's no project authored >> in HC that can't be at least as useful authored in Rev. >> > > But I never said this is coming from HC. My original program was in > Fortran and was parsing the provided equations into a pseudo-code > that was executed in a do fashion. Just the same, if you've started porting it to Rev and have encountered problems, this list can be very helpful with things like that. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From kray at sonsothunder.com Wed Mar 12 21:38:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Wed Mar 12 21:38:01 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <006701c2e908$fa075570$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Well said! Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > Richard Gaskin > Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 5:00 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: Menu manager/switch problem > > > Ken Norris wrote: > > >> You are thinking too Mac-centric. No other platform moves > its About > >> menu around like the Mac. Everywhere else, the About is under the > >> Help menu. It is a convenience that Revolution > transparently handles > >> the various positions of the Macintosh About menu for you, > since the > >> position is different even between OS 9 and OS X. By placing the > >> About item under the Help menu, your stack will display > properly on > >> any OS and you won't ever have to think about it. > > ---------- > > It's just that there is nothing in the docs to tell us this is what > > happens, so I wasn't expecting it. There's probably other > stuff like > > that, too. I'm looking for that list. > > I remember how hard it was for me to learn SuperCard when I > came from a background in HyperCard, and years later how hard > Ken, Christopher Watson, and myself worked to deliver one of > the most comprehensive sets of docs for an authoring tool > ever at the time, only to find how hard it was even after we > delivered them for folks to readily find everything they > needed. With complex systems like authoring tools, > experience is the best teacher. > > Since I came into Rev from MetaCard years before, I'm less > familiar with Rev's docs, but generally find them far better > than MC's, and roughly on par with SuperCard's (there's a > great many more tokens to document in Rev, so the Rev docs > have generally more stuff overall). > > Knowing Jeanne's thoroughness (it was, after all, her > HyperCard book that we used as the inspiration for form and > breadth when we rewote SuperCard's docs), I took a look in > the docs to see what I could find on this subject. > > Here's what I did: > > 1. In Rev's menu bar, I chose Help->Revolution Documentation > > 2. In the list on the front card of that stack, I chose > "Menus", which brings up a list of topics on the right. In > that list, assuming I had no experience with Rev, I simply > chose the first item, "About...menus and the menu bar", > thinking it might provide a good overview from which I could > explore other details as needed. > > 3. In that section is a subsection titled "Menu Bars on Mac > OS and OS X Systems", which describes the behavior in > question, with more detail and more concisely than even the > discussion here on this list. > > > Ken and I once had the pleasure of working under the same > manager, a man of impecible character and unusual insight. I > found myself frustrated with learning Gain Momentum, since it > was not only a larger and more complex xTalk than I'd known > before (20 volumes of manuals stacked three feet high), but > it also required me to learn Unix at the same time. It was a > lot to bite off at once, and after coming from years of solid > SuperCard mastery I was frustrated with finding myself nearly > completely ignorant, starting at the very bottom of the > learning curve all over again. I took my concerns to my > manager, and here's what he told me: > > If you plant a seed today and pour ten thousand gallons of water > on it, you still won't have a tree tommorrow. > > Some things simply take time and patience, and learning is > definitely more of a process than an event. This is > especially difficult when coming from another tool, and > compounded when that tool rests in the relative comfort of a > single operating system: For years you've grown into a > comfortable mastery of the tool, and over time the "learning > muscle" in some respects atrophies. > > Observing myself with both learning new tools and with > physical therapy after a hiking accident last year, I know > how hard it is to reverse atrophy. But as my physical > therapist reminded me, "movement begets movement": every > small effort made in a direction of growth has a compounded > effect over time. Initially there are few measurable > results, and such work begins as an act of faith and will. > But over time, with the encouragement of others who've > crossed that mountain before you, you have to trust that it's > achievable. And after a while your results will provide all > the encouragement you'll need, and may even serve to inspire > others as they begin the same path. > > So please be patient with yourself, and try to be patient > with the docs. They're not perfect, but frankly they are > among the most comprehensive you'll find, even when compared > to the big publishers like Adobe and Macromedia. > > In nearly evry case, I'll stake my reputation on the > assertion that the topic is covered in Jeanne's docs. And > for those few cases where a topic is not in a clear place or > even more rare, not covered at all, a brief note to her will > see it corrected as soon as possible, and a note to this list > will put you on the right track immediately. > > -- > Richard Gaskin > Fourth World Media Corporation > Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site > ___________________________________________________________ > Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com > Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From jiml at netrin.com Wed Mar 12 22:20:01 2003 From: jiml at netrin.com (Jim Lambert) Date: Wed Mar 12 22:20:01 2003 Subject: CGI again In-Reply-To: <200303130239.VAA13489@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Thanks. Jim Lambert From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 12 23:21:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 12 23:21:01 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: <200303130239.VAA13470@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 13:40:12 -0800 > From: "Jeanne A. E. DeVoto" > Subject: Re: Menu manager/switch problem > Page 8 of the Menu Manager tutorial says: > > "The File menu contains a Quit item, and the Help menu contains Help and > About, as well as a menu divider line. We'll leave these menu items as they > are. (On Mac OS systems, the last item in the Help menu is actually > displayed as the first item in the Apple menu.)" ---------- By golly, you're right! There it is! I went through those pages 4 times and still didn't see it. Must have been the parentheses that blinded me. My sincere apologies. ----------- > This behavior and the reason for it are also discussed at some length in > "About menus and the menu bar". ---------- I just went there to look and it did take awhile to find it, i.e., it's pretty far down. I remember going to look awhile back, but I mistook the "Find article" box to mean it would search the page, but it doesn't. What I should have done, in hindsight, was to use in the message box. Since the "Find" menu item like HC has was gone, I didn't even think about typing it into the Message box because of a 15 year-old HC habit, you see. Any possibility of putting a "Find" feature in? ---------- > Now, short of creating a special "neon" text style for the docs, tailored > to each reader (which I'm starting to think I'm going to have to do.... ;-) ---------- Nahhh...only for idiots like me who can't tell when they've been in front of a computer screen too long and go blind. Thanks, Ken N. From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu Wed Mar 12 23:30:01 2003 From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry) Date: Wed Mar 12 23:30:01 2003 Subject: Pricing. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: My understanding is that university educators are also eligible for the ed pricing; that it's the institutional pricing area where it matters if you are K-12 or higher ed. Am I wrong? Judy On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Victor Eijkhout wrote: > >But with that level of programming it seems reasonable that the > >researchr would pick up a license -- at the edu price it's quite affordable. > > Hm? The educational (single user) price is 1.5 times the small > business price. I'm a university educator, but the affordable ($99) > price is only for K12 educators. From curry at pair.com Wed Mar 12 23:42:01 2003 From: curry at pair.com (curry) Date: Wed Mar 12 23:42:01 2003 Subject: Animation freeze In-Reply-To: <200303130239.VAA13489@www.runrev.com> References: <200303130239.VAA13489@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Has anyone ever made an arcade style game in Rev, or anything else that used a lot of animations with "move without waiting" and "send in time"? I can't post the scripts as-is, I'd have to try to make a simpler script to post it here, but what I've seen with two or three different projects is that Rev can unexpectedly freeze visually, until you press Command-period one or more times to interrupt it. I'm not using any "wait until" statements, just "move" and "send". Has anyone experienced this type of freezing and does anyone know a good way to avoid it or workaround? Thanks, Curry From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Wed Mar 12 23:44:00 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Wed Mar 12 23:44:00 2003 Subject: mystery exception In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Of course, you could code something like: repeat for each line L in textToDo do L end repeat On Tuesday, March 11, 2003, at 05:49 AM, Ben Rubinstein wrote: > The code that was actually passed to 'do' might be > put 1 into vdID > put 2 into vdName > put 3 into vdAddress > regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Wed Mar 12 23:48:01 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Wed Mar 12 23:48:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <74FE5D02-550E-11D7-942C-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> Any method that required positive enforcement (allowing stacks to do something to disable the script length limits) would be far more vulnerable than the current setup where the engine is inherently limited without the license key. I'm currently doing a great deal of experimentation with do and value (in support of my research into Lisp), and I'm not finding the script length limits to be an obstacle at all. On Wednesday, March 12, 2003, at 01:08 AM, Robert Brenstein wrote: > All true but how easy is it to use the engine of a standalone to > couple it with full development GUI to produce new products? Is > message box really fully functional in standalones? If so, I rather > have no message box than do limit. I also think that while > distributing an unlocked engine could lead to problems you describe, > it should be possible to couple the engine to a specific standalone, > for example by requiring the stacks in the standalone to pass the > license key with certain calls. Such an approach would allow us to > realize the unfullfilled promise of being able to distribute any! > MC/Rev-based standalone without it being crippled by this restriction. > regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Wed Mar 12 23:52:01 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Wed Mar 12 23:52:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1D13AF50-550F-11D7-942C-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> On Wednesday, March 12, 2003, at 01:08 AM, Robert Brenstein wrote: > Well, this may be true for most people but it can be a show stopper > for some. Consider a scientific application that involves modelling or > function fitting. I have written such a program some years ago (sold > as shareware) and would love to recreate it with MC/Rev (users still > ask for it but the old code stopped working with OS 8). It requires > users entering complex math functions that program matches to the > provided set of experimental data, calculating statistical fit and > producing graphical output. It would be trivial to run it through > "do", but the 10-line limit is a killer. The only alternative I see is > to write my own interpreter/compiler in MetaTalk but that ain't so > trivial and slows things down. Of course, another alternative is to > have each user buy their own copy of MC or Rev but that would be akin > to asking users of programs written in C to buy CodeWarrior (although > I am sure that MC/Rev folks would love it). I'm facing the same situation in trying to implement Lisp-like functionality in Revolution. A functional approach to coding is making the script-length-limits into only a minor issue. The alternative would be to approach RunRev about a special license. I don't know whether it would be possible, but it seems like a win-win to me. regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Thu Mar 13 00:41:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Thu Mar 13 00:41:01 2003 Subject: Reading the docs (was Menu manager/switch problem) In-Reply-To: <200303130239.VAA13470@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 15:00:06 -0800 > Subject: Re: Menu manager/switch problem > From: Richard Gaskin > > I remember how hard it was for me to learn SuperCard when I came from a > background in HyperCard, and years later how hard Ken, Christopher Watson, > and myself worked to deliver one of the most comprehensive sets of docs for > an authoring tool ever at the time, only to find how hard it was even after > we delivered them for folks to readily find everything they needed. With > complex systems like authoring tools, experience is the best teacher. ----------snip > If you plant a seed today and pour ten thousand gallons of water > on it, you still won't have a tree tommorrow. ---------- Very well put. ----------snip > In nearly evry case, I'll stake my reputation on the assertion that the > topic is covered in Jeanne's docs. ----------snip You've put it very well, Richard. The snipped parts in this post are worth reading in yours, and I'd encourage anyone new to Rev to read it. I apologized to Jeanne...I'm aware of her thoroughness, too. I think I was just too long at the machine trying to "pour ten thousand gallons of water" on the seed. I find online docs difficult to deal with because they cover up the work, and I end up trying to toggle the docs off and on, back and forth, which is time consuming. I have never had to do that so intensively before because there was always extensive printed manuals available for HC, and I could just leave them open to the page while I read and worked the scripts. I do have my old PB onboard which I maybe able to use for docs reading, but it's too slow and doesn't seem to have enough memory to run the docs. Another alternate way would be to have a dual monitor output where I can move the docs windows onto another monitor. Is anyone else doing things that way? Best regards, Ken N. From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Thu Mar 13 00:42:00 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Thu Mar 13 00:42:00 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: <3E6F605A.9000306@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: <19E9E174-5516-11D7-942C-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> This isn't an example from someone's "do" command, but here is a single line of script that produces the 99 bottles of beer song. It requires LispLib to run, but LispLib could be included when a standalone is built -- it doesn't require modification at runtime. put drotatef(cr,2,\ subf(cr,"You go to the store and buy some more,","-1",\ distributef(cr,\ format(setf(b,"<*> bottles of beer") & setf(w," on the wall")\ & ".\n\n" & b & w & ",\n" & b & ".\nYou take one down, pass it around"),\ expandf("99-1 No")))) More details are at: http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs/99BottlesOfBeer On Wednesday, March 12, 2003, at 08:29 AM, J. Landman Gay wrote: > Would you be willing to post an example of a "do" statement that is > difficult or impossible to accomplish within the current 10-line > limit? I think it might be interesting for the list to see if the > problem is really insurmountable. And if we can bypass the problem it > might give some folks an idea of how to accomodate script limits > without sacrificing useability. Sounds like an interesting challenge > to me. I confess that I have not had to use any more than a > single-line "do" statement in years and I have trouble imagining where > I'd need one. > regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From scott at tactilemedia.com Thu Mar 13 00:46:03 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Thu Mar 13 00:46:03 2003 Subject: Animation freeze In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 3/12/03 8:36 PM, "curry" wrote: > Has anyone ever made an arcade style game in Rev, or anything else > that used a lot of animations with "move without waiting" and "send > in time"? > > I can't post the scripts as-is, I'd have to try to make a simpler > script to post it here, but what I've seen with two or three > different projects is that Rev can unexpectedly freeze visually, > until you press Command-period one or more times to interrupt it. Since you say you can cancel out of your script operation, it sounds like some move event and/or script in your stack is not completing and as such is preventing the rest of your scripts from executing. > I'm not using any "wait until" statements, just "move" and "send". > > Has anyone experienced this type of freezing and does anyone know a > good way to avoid it or workaround? I once built a stack that moved about 40 animated GIFs up and down the screen simultaneously. Worked great on Macs and most PCs but brought some Win98 machines to their knees with errors. However, I never ran into any kind of freezing problem. When moving many individual objects, I've found it's effective to give the objects their own "intelligence": give each object it's own script (based on a master script) that allows it to determine where it is at all times and how it should behave; don't try to control many objects from a central script. Another thing you can try is to replace your move commands with looping positioning statements, for example: on moveMe set the left of me to the left of me + 2 send "moveMe" to me in 50 milliseconds end moveMe A side benefit I've noticed is that, in some cases, this type of script creates smoother on-screen movement than using the move command (your mileage may vary). Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director, Tactile Media From BradAllen at mac.com Thu Mar 13 00:48:00 2003 From: BradAllen at mac.com (Brad Allen) Date: Thu Mar 13 00:48:00 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: <5FBCCC9A-542E-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> References: <5FBCCC9A-542E-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: >On Tuesday, March 11, 2003, at 06:49 AM, Ben Rubinstein wrote: >> >>So... if you use 'do', or change the script of objects on the fly, be aware >>that code which works fine in the IDE will be subject to limitations in a >>standalone. > >Ack! I did not know this. Just to see if I am understanding >correctly: as long as no single call to "do", or "value" (or other >functions that compile transcript on the fly), no single call >exceeds 10 lines them I'm OK in a standalone? What if the "do" command is within a repeat loop that executes more than 10 times? Would that be equivalent to passing a parameter containing more than 10 lines? From kray at sonsothunder.com Thu Mar 13 01:15:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Thu Mar 13 01:15:01 2003 Subject: Reading the docs (was Menu manager/switch problem) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <008101c2e927$50969f40$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> > Another alternate way would be to have a dual monitor output > where I can move the docs windows onto another monitor. > > Is anyone else doing things that way? Actually, I'm using the plain text version of the docs and doing searches with my text editor when I need to look something up. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From ambassador at fourthworld.com Thu Mar 13 02:28:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Thu Mar 13 02:28:01 2003 Subject: Reading the docs (was Menu manager/switch problem) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thank you for your very generous words, Ken. > I find online docs difficult to deal with because they cover up the work, > and I end up trying to toggle the docs off and on, back and forth, which is > time consuming. I have never had to do that so intensively before because > there was always extensive printed manuals available for HC, and I could > just leave them open to the page while I read and worked the scripts. > > I do have my old PB onboard which I maybe able to use for docs reading, but > it's too slow and doesn't seem to have enough memory to run the docs. > > Another alternate way would be to have a dual monitor output where I can > move the docs windows onto another monitor. > > Is anyone else doing things that way? I used a dual-monitor system for a while, but for my own workflow a single 19" per system has been enough, and CRT prices are in freefall: - I just picked up a ViewSonic for the Linux box at Fry's for $250. Another option is printing, if you can spare the ink cartridges. :) I think Geoff Canyon has a stack that exports the Rev docs as RTF for printing - Geoff, what's the URL? -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From jeanne at runrev.com Thu Mar 13 03:39:00 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Thu Mar 13 03:39:00 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: <309A98FC-54E1-11D7-847C-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> References: Message-ID: At 3:20 PM -0800 3/12/03, Alex Rice wrote: >On Wednesday, March 12, 2003, at 02:40 PM, Jeanne A. E. DeVoto wrote: >> Now, short of creating a special "neon" text style for the docs > >Maybe hack htmlText to support the tag? :-) Hmmm... you know... actually, I could write a cookbook recipe to blink the... Whew. That was close. ;-) -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development http://www.runrev.com/ From jeanne at runrev.com Thu Mar 13 03:39:16 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Thu Mar 13 03:39:16 2003 Subject: menu paradigm of Rev/MC and other goofiness In-Reply-To: Message-ID: At 6:45 AM -0800 3/5/03, Ivers, Doug E wrote: >Does anyone have an example they could send me in which a >menubar menu is a stack? You can't make a stack menu into a menubar menu, I'm afraid. (I suppose you could fake it on Windows, since there the menu bar is inside the window. But not on Mac OS/OS X.) -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development http://www.runrev.com/ From jeanne at runrev.com Thu Mar 13 03:39:27 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Thu Mar 13 03:39:27 2003 Subject: standardize window locations In-Reply-To: Message-ID: At 6:49 PM -0800 3/2/03, Tim Hart wrote: >Is there a way to keep windows in a certain place when switching from >stack to a substack. I am closing the stack when going to a substack. >I want to windows to show up in the same place. Any ideas? In addition to Richard's suggestion of changing the stack's rect on preOpenStack, you can go to the substack in the same window as the main stack: go stack "My substack" in window "My main stack" -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development http://www.runrev.com/ From jeanne at runrev.com Thu Mar 13 03:39:40 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Thu Mar 13 03:39:40 2003 Subject: StartUp handler on Windows In-Reply-To: <20030308234446.60790.qmail@web20006.mail.yahoo.com> References: Message-ID: At 3:44 PM -0800 3/8/03, erik hansen wrote: >is there a tutorial on plugins? Not yet but I plan one. There is already some additional documentation (mostly in How Tos). -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development http://www.runrev.com/ From jeanne at runrev.com Thu Mar 13 03:39:54 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Thu Mar 13 03:39:54 2003 Subject: Menu manager/switch problem In-Reply-To: References: <200303130239.VAA13470@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: At 5:25 PM -0800 3/12/03, Ken Norris wrote: >By golly, you're right! There it is! I went through those pages 4 times and >still didn't see it. Must have been the parentheses that blinded me. My >sincere apologies. No problem. It can be easy to miss things (and I was worried for a minute there that it wasn't mentioned - it's also easy for me to forget to mention things that I take for granted). -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development http://www.runrev.com/ From jeanne at runrev.com Thu Mar 13 03:40:09 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Thu Mar 13 03:40:09 2003 Subject: using arrays in custom properties In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 9:16 AM -0800 3/11/03, Ben Rubinstein wrote: >> I'm storing an array in a custom property of an object. [...] >So, I'm now coming to see - or at least believe in - a different model. >JEANNE OR SOMEONE PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I'M STILL IN ERROR! What I now >believe is something like this: > > a) objects can have named arrays associated with them. These arrays > are known as 'custom property sets'. They are accessed using the syntax > set the abc[k] of object x to y > > b) one of these arrays can be set as the default, for which there is a > special syntax, in which you don't need to specify the name of the > array, Such that (if the 'abc' array is set as the default) > set the k of object x to y > > is equivalent to > set the abc["k"] of object x to y That's one way to think of it, and certainly isn't incorrect. Another way that might be somewhat clearer is this: 1. Objects can have custom properties associated with them. These custom properties cannot be arrays - only scalar values. 2. Custom properties can be grouped into custom property sets. 3. You can refer to a custom property in any custom property set using array notation, so for practical purposes, you can think of a custom property set as an array. I beefed up the custom properties article in the encyclopedia recently - here's what I wrote about this: ---- Using array notation with custom properties All the custom properties in a custom property set form an array. The array's name is the custom property set name, and the elements of the array are the individual custom properties in that custom property set. Using array notation, you can refer to custom properties that aren't in the current custom property set, without changing the object's customPropertySet property. For example, suppose a button has a custom property named "myProp" which is in a custom property set called "mySet". To refer to this custom property regardless of which custom property set is active, use a statement like one of the following: get the mySet["myProp"] of button 1 set the mySet["myProp"] of the target to 20 ---- The important fact, I think, is that when you say put "23.99" into the specialPrices["Bananas"] of btn "PriceChecker" you're actually creating a custom property set, with the custom property "Bananas". -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development http://www.runrev.com/ From heather at runrev.com Thu Mar 13 04:35:01 2003 From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams) Date: Thu Mar 13 04:35:01 2003 Subject: Pricing. In-Reply-To: <200303130841.DAA22583@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > Message: 3 > Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 20:26:30 -0800 (PST) > From: Judy Perry > To: > Subject: Re: Pricing. > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > My understanding is that university educators are also eligible for the ed > pricing; that it's the institutional pricing area where it matters if you > are K-12 or higher ed. > > Am I wrong? Only partly. In general, individual university *students* are eligible for the $99 license. Normally, university lecturers must purchase the full Educational Edition, at $497.50. If you are teaching K12 teachers or a multimedia course we will extend the K12 multiuser licensing to your class. This is known in the company as a "Judy Perry Special" :-) Regards, Heather > > Judy -- Heather Williams Runtime Revolution Ltd. Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought From heather at runrev.com Thu Mar 13 04:50:00 2003 From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams) Date: Thu Mar 13 04:50:00 2003 Subject: T-Shirt and Mug Competition Winners! Message-ID: Greetings! Thank you all for your entries and for taking the time to vote. I'm pleased to announce we have a clear winner for the T-shirt design. Please raise your glasses to Norbert K?hlthau, for his winning design number 6! This, in case you don't remember, is the "One tool to rule them all" selection. For the mug, there was less of a lead, but number 1 still has it. So, a toast for Bj?rnke von Gierke as well. (In coffee of course.) I'll be in touch with you both regarding prizes. I'll get these designs uploaded to cafepress asap, and then you can all rush to purchase these items from the comfort and convenience of your legitimate places of work. Regards, Heather -- Heather Williams Runtime Revolution Ltd. Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought From brad at activadesign.com Thu Mar 13 07:50:01 2003 From: brad at activadesign.com (Bradley Borch) Date: Thu Mar 13 07:50:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1190 - 12 msgs In-Reply-To: <200303121212.HAA22306@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: On Wednesday, March 12, 2003, at 07:12 AM, Richard Gaskin wrote: > >> What's the easiest way to display flash animation from within a RR >> standalone? A quick step-by-step guide would be great. Thanks! > > Just put a player on your card and let QuickTim handle the rest... Valetia, There are some limitations. I've run tests in 1.1.1 and 2 pre-beta (though not the very latest) and uncovered some quirky behavior. 1.1.1 ran animations VERY slowly, but handled mouse actions well. V2 ran animations well, but took the SWF within Rev took several seconds to respond to mouseDown actions, I still haven't figured out how to pass commands from an SWF within Rev to the Rev player (as you can with an SWF in Director using Lingo, or a browser using JavaScrip, with the getURL command). So if you're just using flash to create motion onscreen, you should be OK. If I could get Rev to see these commands from an SWF as QT I can see Rev being a really useful tool for me -- Flash as modular eye candy, with the ease and cross-platform capabilities of Rev. Brad From benr_mc at cogapp.com Thu Mar 13 08:01:01 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Thu Mar 13 08:01:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: (Sorry Geoff; this was one of those emails that I wrote a few days ago but never sent - I write quite a lot of messages, and then leave them a while before I choose whether to send them - if I think they won't add anything useful to what's already quite a noisy list, I don't - in this case many others jumped into the discussion, so I left it. I wasn't raising the 'do makeAccessVars' issue to say that I had a problem; only to illustrate how one can be caught out with something that works in the IDE in all cases, works in a standalone in some cases, but may one day encounter a case in the standalone which fails, possibly silently, because of the starter kit limits.) Yes; it was a bit of a bummer when I found this problem. But now that I know about it, it's not been a showstopper for me. For example, I rewrote the "makeAccessVars" function that I described so that instead of returning a single line of semi-colon delimited statements it returned them semi-colon delimited, in groups of five (jic) to a line. (In retrospect I don't know why I bothered grouping them...) Existing code that called "do makeAccessVars(...)" still worked. The code that was potentially dealing with many cases just had to be replaced with "repeat for each line x in makeAccessVars(...)/do x/end repeat". Not a huge hassle; and amply made up for by the many ways in which Transcript gives me new and better features top do my work. Indeed, this particular requirement I would often now prefer to handle by making an array mapping column names to indexes (if only 'split' worked correctly!) - which is to say that because Transcript is so rich, there are many many choices of how to achieve things. If I ignored the IDE situation, and just pretended that 'do' in Transcript, unlike in HyperTalk, was _always_ limited to 10 statements; and that this was a disadvantage, part of a small list that includes things like losing the 'dial' command; and compare this list to the list of ways in which Transcript improves on HyperTalk... richer control structures, looping by chunk, arrays, no script limits, script locals, local properties, object properties, direct manipulation of binary data... and that's even before you look outside the language to see the richer range of controls, groups, substacks etc; and that's even before you go into special areas of functionality like databases, image manipulation, internet access... When I consider all that, I this minor limitation doesn't bother me much. So, if your work is mostly intended to end up as standalones, I think this is just one of those thinks you need to be aware of, like the need to build in particular resources, think about where your default folder is, not depend on saving changes in your main stack file. And then I'd move on. (and if you're really bothered by the limit, note that you can perform multiple "do"s, and they retain the context. So in many cases, if you're really convinced you need to use a created on the fly script of more than 10 statements, you may be able to just "do" it a few lines at a time. Ie: do "put 23 into x" do "put x" will put 23.) Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From yvescoppe at skynet.be Thu Mar 13 08:13:01 2003 From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE) Date: Thu Mar 13 08:13:01 2003 Subject: DragDrop Message-ID: Hi, 1) Drag and drop I began to "play" with 2.0 pre beta I found this version very much more interesting than the previous So I'd like to make something new I've a LOCKED list fld "A" and a LOCKED list fld "B". I want to drag one line of plain text from A -> B the (plain) text should disappear from the A list and appears in B list And I'd like the cursor changes when I click on a line fo fld "A" to show the drag and drop may start untiil the mouse is released.. Can someone explain me how to proceed ?? 2) on Mac OS X I'd like to have a window (a stack) with the "alu" decoration (like iTunes or iPhoto) How to do it ?? I've tried with the new WindowShape, but didn't find the trick... Thank you for answering those "pre-release" questions.... But I'm sure it will give interest for many people. Cheers. -- Greetings. Yves COPPE Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be From jhurley at infostations.com Thu Mar 13 08:13:10 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Thu Mar 13 08:13:10 2003 Subject: Pricing. In-Reply-To: <200303130841.DAA22583@www.runrev.com> References: <200303130841.DAA22583@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: >Judy Perry >To: >Subject: Re: Pricing. >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > >My understanding is that university educators are also eligible for the ed >pricing; that it's the institutional pricing area where it matters if you >are K-12 or higher ed. > >Am I wrong? > >Judy > >On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Victor Eijkhout wrote: > >> >But with that level of programming it seems reasonable that the > > >researchr would pick up a license -- at the edu price it's quite >affordable. >> > > Hm? The educational (single user) price is 1.5 times the small > > business price. I'm a university educator, but the affordable ($99) > > price is only for K12 educators. > >--__--__-- Judy is right. I started with a educator's license, even though I am retired university faculty. As a matter of fact I originally submitted an application to MetaCard for a professional license, but received an invitation from Scott Raney (seeing that my return address was Univ. of Calif.) to consider an educator's license. Jim From livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk Thu Mar 13 09:10:00 2003 From: livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk (livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk) Date: Thu Mar 13 09:10:00 2003 Subject: Subject: Reading the docs (was Menu manager/switch problem) Message-ID: <1bc6201c2e969$af5d9960$748017ac@blueyonder.net> On Wed, 12 Mar 2003 21:46:18 -0500, Ken Norris wrote: ********** > Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 15:00:06 -0800 > Subject: Re: Menu manager/switch problem > From: Richard Gaskin > > I remember how hard it was for me to learn SuperCard when I came from a > background in HyperCard, and years later how hard Ken, Christopher Watson, > and myself worked to deliver one of the most comprehensive sets of docs for > an authoring tool ever at the time, only to find how hard it was even after > we delivered them for folks to readily find everything they needed. With > complex systems like authoring tools, experience is the best teacher. ----------snip > If you plant a seed today and pour ten thousand gallons of water > on it, you still won't have a tree tommorrow. ---------- Very well put. ----------snip > In nearly evry case, I'll stake my reputation on the assertion that the > topic is covered in Jeanne's docs. ----------snip You've put it very well, Richard. The snipped parts in this post are worth reading in yours, and I'd encourage anyone new to Rev to read it. I apologized to Jeanne...I'm aware of her thoroughness, too. I think I was just too long at the machine trying to "pour ten thousand gallons of water" on the seed. I find online docs difficult to deal with because they cover up the work, and I end up trying to toggle the docs off and on, back and forth, which is time consuming. I have never had to do that so intensively before because there was always extensive printed manuals available for HC, and I could just leave them open to the page while I read and worked the scripts. I do have my old PB onboard which I maybe able to use for docs reading, but it's too slow and doesn't seem to have enough memory to run the docs. Another alternate way would be to have a dual monitor output where I can move the docs windows onto another monitor. Is anyone else doing things that way? Hi Ken I'm going through exactly the same process as you, and like you I am an admirer of the existing docs and I appreciate the wise words of Richard - but nevertheless I'm frustrated that I miss things all the time. One difficulty about having apparently comprehensive online docs is that you're tempted to look up things only when you need them, rather than reading round the subject. I think I've said before that when I learned SuperCard (seems like a lot of years ago now), I read the whole of the printed documentation twice. Of course I didn't retain it in detail, but it put a great deal of stuff in the back of my mind to feed subsequent thoughts like "yes, I know I read about a way to do that, and maybe I can recall a scrap of vocabulary or syntax that can help me retrieve it". I have still not done this with Rev (it would be a daunting task, starting with the load on my current printer, since my very old 20-page-a-minute laser has finally bit the dust); but it might well be worth it. Graham Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK & France From livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk Thu Mar 13 09:11:01 2003 From: livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk (livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk) Date: Thu Mar 13 09:11:01 2003 Subject: menu paradigm of Rev/MC and other goofiness Message-ID: <1bc8a01c2e969$f40855a0$748017ac@blueyonder.net> on Thu, 13 Mar 2003 00:03:31 -0800, "Jeanne A. E. DeVoto" wrote: At 6:45 AM -0800 3/5/03, Ivers, Doug E wrote: >Does anyone have an example they could send me in which a >menubar menu is a stack? You can't make a stack menu into a menubar menu, I'm afraid. (I suppose you could fake it on Windows, since there the menu bar is inside the window. But not on Mac OS/OS X.) Ah! That's illuminating! I'd read about stack menus in the docs, and in fact never wanted to use one, but I always vaguely thought that indeed it was an alternative way of creating a menubar menu (as I come from a Mac background) and wondered why anyone would do it. Now I know that a stack menu can't be a menubar menu, and it would be 'faking it' if it was so used in Windows, so I'm completely foxed as to what sort of menu it can be. Obviously there is some other kind of menu that I never use. Pardon my complete dumbness on this one, but can anyone give me an example of when and why you would use a stack menu? TIA Graham Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK & France From rcozens at pon.net Thu Mar 13 09:27:03 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Thu Mar 13 09:27:03 2003 Subject: databases and Rev In-Reply-To: <20030312191926.84962.qmail@web20419.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030312191926.84962.qmail@web20419.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: >I'm looking for >something that will run on Windows and Mac and will >work for both a stand-alone single-user version and >and a network multi-user version. Hi Chris, FWIW, there is a small group headed by Jan Shenkel currently working on a published standard & library for interprocess communications in RunRev. My promise to the group was that I would create an open source, client/server version of Serendipity Database--Binary if the group provided the basic underlying PPC communications capabilities. We are currently testing version 0.000001 of the IPC library, and I began yesterday to rewrite the SDB handlers in Serendipity Library. The single-user SDB handlers were designed so a client/server version would be plug-compatible in terms of syntax; so I hope my efforts won't take more than a few weeks. If you would like to evaluate the single user version of SDB, download Serendipity Library at . If you are interested in following the progress of the client/server version, contact me privately. If you would like to participate in the Rev IPC group, contact Jan Shenkel privately. -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de Thu Mar 13 09:31:00 2003 From: rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de (Robert Brenstein) Date: Thu Mar 13 09:31:00 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >If all you wanted to do was give away a 12-year effort in crafting a highly >optimized scripting engine by just slapping a five-minute UI on it, you'd >have to work a litte harder than that. > >Admittedly I'm having a tough time thinking of a commercially viable >opportunity for an app that truly needs dynamic scripting and doesn't >compete with Rev.... > I don't really want to prolong this thread but you guys seem to think that I would want to produce a generic application that allows to run any transcript code user wants, an evil program that will run Rev to bankrupcy. May be I have not clearly conveyed my use but your assumptions are far from reality. I have the same vested interest in MC and Rev prospering for years as you do. Admitedly, the application of do in my project would be kinda unusual and very few people may indeed need it. However, I don't think my desired usage is illegitimate or endangers Rev as a product in any way. Users in my case would enter code that is more like Fortran or Pascal which I convert internally into (reasonably complex) Transcript and execute via do. However, there is no way to have this internally generated code under 10 lines since multiple repeat loops are involved. Furthermore, the starting point of this thread was that MC/Revolution's license explicitely allows me to produce and distribute standalones without any further royalties. Using Revolution, you can deliver powerful, fully-featured applications on all major platforms - quickly, easily, and royalty-free. Unfortunately, the engine imposes the limit on the do length in those -- the fact of which is not clearly stated up front. This is also evidenced by a number of people admitting the surprise when they found it out the hard way, although in their cases it was not a showstopper. This discussion should be not as much about my shareware program ruining 12-year effort but about false/misleading advertising. Also, suggesting that users of my program get own Rev licenses is a bit silly -- if my users were required to do so, why any other Rev-based shareware programs should be different? Are WebMerge users required to purchase Rev or MC? >For the very small set of tasks that truly require "do", taking a moment to >break them into 10-line chunks would suffice for many of them; more complex >needs will require more effort, but they should anyway: Executing code in 10-line chunks is not a solution for me because of (anticipated) significant degradation of performance and because of repeat loops within that cod (I haven't tested but I doubt that I can have begin repeat and end repeat in different do statements). >The problem with this is that the message box is just a stack. If >there were no script limits, the user could just type a script into >a field in any stack, then put "do me" into the field script. But then what stops users from running 10 lines at a time in a loop rather than simple "do me"? The fact is that MC and Rev folks do not mind people using the limited stack for fairly complex stuff, and they explicitely allow us to use starter kit to produce and distribute commercial applications. There are publically available tips and tricks how to do that. It is just sad that at the same time they do not provide means of overcoming this do restriction for legitimate uses in standalone applications (even if this was on case by case basis). Robert From Doug_Ivers at lord.com Thu Mar 13 09:35:00 2003 From: Doug_Ivers at lord.com (Ivers, Doug E) Date: Thu Mar 13 09:35:00 2003 Subject: Graphic object <-- mouseDown? Message-ID: Don't graphic objects respond to mouseUp, mouseDown, mouseMove, etc.? Where would I find this in the docs? -- D -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ludovic.thebault at laposte.net Thu Mar 13 09:38:03 2003 From: ludovic.thebault at laposte.net (Ludovic Thebault) Date: Thu Mar 13 09:38:03 2003 Subject: How change the rect of an image on an other card ? Message-ID: <3E7096C8.3050500@laposte.net> Hello, I've made a little stack to make a basic slideshow. I use this script to "magnify" little pictures, but it doesn't works: show image 1 of next cd set the filename of image 1 of next cd to line (random(the number of lines of the files)) of the files get the rect of image 1 of next cd repeat with n=1 to 4 put (item n of it*0.5)+item n of it into item n of it end repeat set the rect of image 1 of next cd to it set the loc of image 1 of next cd to the screenloc visual effect dissolve go next cd But if i replace 'image 1 of next cd' by 'image 1 of this cd' the script works. Same problem with Rev 1.1.1r2 and Rev 2.0p4 any idea ? Thanks From Doug_Ivers at lord.com Thu Mar 13 09:45:01 2003 From: Doug_Ivers at lord.com (Ivers, Doug E) Date: Thu Mar 13 09:45:01 2003 Subject: Try my functions In-Reply-To: Message-ID: You may find the following functions useful, if not in themselves, then perhaps they will help you in terms of style. I typically use these functions in other functions that need to check argument types prior to usage. Note that forceBoolean has both a function form and a command form. Same for forceInteger. You may see this as overkill, but it can improve readability and conciseness in the calling code. In my former Java days, I learned to write tester functions. These are not just for debugging, but also for providing usage examples. Type the tester name into the messagebox to exercise the functions. Suggestions for improvements are requested. -- D function forceBoolean B,defaultB -- if no defaultB, defaults to false -- alt: (B = true) or value(B = true) -- sometimes sufficient and more appropriate if (B <> true and B <> false) then return (defaultB = true) -- don't assume defaultB is a boolean else return B end forceBoolean on forceBoolean @B,defaultB put forceBoolean(B,defaultB) into B end forceBoolean on testForceBoolean answer "forceBoolean(b) = "& forceBoolean(b) put "t" into b2 forceBoolean b2,true answer "forceBoolean b2 = "& b2 end testForceBoolean function forceInteger N lowestN highestN -- lowestN <= highestN is not verified herein -- trunc() used, round() is an alternative if (N is not a number) then put 0 into N if (lowestN is a number and N < lowestN) then return trunc(lowestN) if (highestN is a number and N > highestN) then return trunc(highestN) return trunc(N) end forceInteger on forceInteger @N lowestN highestN put forceInteger(N,lowestN,highestN) into N end forceInteger on testForceInteger answer "forceInteger(1.234) = "& forceInteger(1.234) answer format("forceInteger(\"int\") = ")& forceInteger("int") answer "forceInteger(-4.4,2,5) = "& forceInteger(-4.4,2,5) answer "forceInteger(4.4,-5,-1) = "& forceInteger(4.4,-5,-1) put 1.234 into int forceInteger int answer "forceInteger 1.234 = "& int put -4.4 into int forceInteger int,2 answer "forceInteger -4.4,2 = "& int end testForceInteger function isInteger N lowestN highestN -- lowestN <= highestN is not verified herein if (N is not an integer) then return false if (lowestN is a number and N < lowestN) then return false if (highestN is a number and N > highestN) then return false return true end isInteger on testIsInteger answer "isInteger(5,9) = "& isInteger(5,9) answer "isInteger(5,,9) = "& isInteger(5,,9) answer "isInteger(1.23) = "& isInteger(1.23) end testIsInteger From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Thu Mar 13 09:47:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Thu Mar 13 09:47:01 2003 Subject: Pricing. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 9:31 +0000 2003/03/13, Heather Williams wrote: >Normally, university lecturers must purchase the full >Educational Edition, at $497.50. How do you justify charging more to a university lecturer than to a small business? Is there any reason for me as a university lecturer not to pick up the business license? -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From rcozens at pon.net Thu Mar 13 10:05:01 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Thu Mar 13 10:05:01 2003 Subject: How change the rect of an image on an other card ? In-Reply-To: <3E7096C8.3050500@laposte.net> References: <3E7096C8.3050500@laposte.net> Message-ID: >any idea ? Thanks Hi Ludovic, put (the number of this card)+1 into nextCd -- test for last card??? >show image 1 of card nextCd >set the filename of image 1 of card nextCd to line (random(the >number of lines of the files)) of the files >get the rect of image 1 of card nextCd >repeat with n=1 to 4 > put (item n of it*0.5)+item n of it into item n of it >end repeat >set the rect of image 1 of card nextCd to it >set the loc of image 1 of card nextCd to the screenloc >visual effect dissolve >go next cd > Hope this helps. -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From heather at runrev.com Thu Mar 13 10:18:01 2003 From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams) Date: Thu Mar 13 10:18:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: <200303131432.JAA31531@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 15:08:01 +0100 > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > From: Robert Brenstein > Subject: Re: license issues (was mystery exception) > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > >> If all you wanted to do was give away a 12-year effort in crafting a highly >> optimized scripting engine by just slapping a five-minute UI on it, you'd >> have to work a litte harder than that. >> >> Admittedly I'm having a tough time thinking of a commercially viable >> opportunity for an app that truly needs dynamic scripting and doesn't >> compete with Rev.... >> > > I don't really want to prolong this thread but you guys seem to think > that I would want to produce a generic application that allows to run > any transcript code user wants, an evil program that will run Rev to > bankrupcy. Easy there. I don't think anyone thinks this of you. They've merely been explaining the reasoning behind the way the licensing works. After all, it would actually only take one ill intentioned or unscrupulous person to achieve this, if we didn't have some sort of restriction to prevent it. > > Furthermore, the starting point of this thread was that > MC/Revolution's license explicitely allows me to produce and > distribute standalones without any further royalties. > > Using Revolution, you can deliver powerful, fully-featured > applications on all major platforms - quickly, easily, and > royalty-free. Correct. It does. A standalone in Rev has the restriction that it cannot be used for full programming and development. > > Unfortunately, the engine imposes the limit on the do length in those > -- the fact of which is not clearly stated up front. This is also > evidenced by a number of people admitting the surprise when they > found it out the hard way, although in their cases it was not a > showstopper. This discussion should be not as much about my shareware > program ruining 12-year effort but about false/misleading advertising. Ok, here you have a point. This issue should not come as a surprise to established users, and I will see what can be done to clarify our terms, conditions and licensing text on the website and in the docs. Part of the problem here is that many people do not read long, boring, licensing text. > > But then what stops users from running 10 lines at a time in a loop > rather than simple "do me"? The fact is that MC and Rev folks do not > mind people using the limited stack for fairly complex stuff, and > they explicitely allow us to use starter kit to produce and > distribute commercial applications. There are publically available > tips and tricks how to do that. > Yes, but it is harder, slower, and in time serious developers prefer to buy a license. It works pretty well. Those that it truly is not worthwhile for to buy a license can still work in the starter kit. > It is just sad that at the same time they do not provide means of > overcoming this do restriction for legitimate uses in standalone > applications (even if this was on case by case basis). Try asking us. You never know, we might be able to come to some arrangement. Regards, Heather > > Robert -- Heather Williams Runtime Revolution Ltd. Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought From rcozens at pon.net Thu Mar 13 10:27:00 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Thu Mar 13 10:27:00 2003 Subject: databases and Rev In-Reply-To: References: <20030312191926.84962.qmail@web20419.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: >If you are interested in following the progress of the client/server >version, contact me privately. Chris, et al: If you would really like to make this happen ASAP, the best thing you could do would be to join Jan's IPC group & help us test the IPC Library: janschenkel at yahoo.com -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From k_major at os.surf2000.de Thu Mar 13 10:37:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Thu Mar 13 10:37:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1190 - 12 msgs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <56F81D7C-5569-11D7-AF57-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Hi Bradley, hi Valetia, > ... > Valetia, > > There are some limitations. I've run tests in 1.1.1 and 2 pre-beta > (though not the very latest) and > uncovered some quirky behavior. 1.1.1 ran animations VERY slowly, but > handled mouse actions > well. V2 ran animations well, but took the SWF within Rev took several > seconds to respond to > mouseDown actions, I think it also depends on what version of QT you have installed. I remember that only version 6 supports all sounds in Flash-files. Most of the Flash-files i played with QT 5 were silent... > I still haven't figured out how to pass commands from an SWF within Rev > to the Rev player (as you can with an SWF in Director using Lingo, or > a browser > using JavaScrip, with the getURL command). There is only one chance to do this and it requires another software :-( With "LIveStage Pro" (maybe other QT editors can do that, too) you can add a "qtdebugstr" message to objects/sprites/flash-buttons in a QT movie. And that "qtdebugstr" can be trapped in RR (see the docs) like this in the script of a player: on qtdebugstr thestring switch thestring case "you hit me" add 1 to fld "hits" break ... > So if you're just using flash to create motion onscreen, you should be > OK. If I could get Rev > to see these commands from an SWF as QT I can see Rev being a really > useful tool for me -- > Flash as modular eye candy, with the ease and cross-platform > capabilities of Rev. > > Brad Hope that helps (at least a bit ;-) Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From k_major at os.surf2000.de Thu Mar 13 10:37:11 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Thu Mar 13 10:37:11 2003 Subject: DragDrop In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <640E7F7C-5569-11D7-AF57-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Bon jour Yves, > Hi, > > 1) Drag and drop > I began to "play" with 2.0 pre beta > I found this version very much more interesting than the previous > > So I'd like to make something new > > I've a LOCKED list fld "A" and a LOCKED list fld "B". > I want to drag one line of plain text from A -> B > the (plain) text should disappear from the A list and appears in B list > And I'd like the cursor changes when I click on a line fo fld "A" to > show the drag and drop may start untiil the mouse is released.. > > Can someone explain me how to proceed ?? I would also like to know that :-) > 2) on Mac OS X I'd like to have a window (a stack) with the "alu" > decoration (like iTunes or iPhoto) > How to do it ?? I've tried with the new WindowShape, but didn't find > the trick... Since this is an OS X only feature, this will not be supported by RR. You will have to use images for this purpose. Maybe a small one to set as a bg-pattern... > Thank you for answering those "pre-release" questions.... > But I'm sure it will give interest for many people. > > Greetings. > > Yves COPPE Au revoir... Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From yvescoppe at skynet.be Thu Mar 13 11:30:01 2003 From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE) Date: Thu Mar 13 11:30:01 2003 Subject: DragDrop In-Reply-To: <640E7F7C-5569-11D7-AF57-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> References: <640E7F7C-5569-11D7-AF57-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Message-ID: >Bon jour Yves, > >>Hi, >> >>1) Drag and drop >>I began to "play" with 2.0 pre beta >>I found this version very much more interesting than the previous >> >>So I'd like to make something new >> >>I've a LOCKED list fld "A" and a LOCKED list fld "B". >>I want to drag one line of plain text from A -> B >>the (plain) text should disappear from the A list and appears in B list >>And I'd like the cursor changes when I click on a line fo fld "A" >>to show the drag and drop may start untiil the mouse is released.. >> >>Can someone explain me how to proceed ?? > >I would also like to know that :-) I hope we find someone who can explain that ;-) Cheers. -- Greetings. Yves COPPE Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be From janschenkel at yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 12:04:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Thu Mar 13 12:04:01 2003 Subject: DragDrop In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030313170034.48224.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> --- yves COPPE wrote: > >Bon jour Yves, > > > >>Hi, > >> > >>1) Drag and drop > >>I began to "play" with 2.0 pre beta > >>I found this version very much more interesting > than the previous > >> > >>So I'd like to make something new > >> > >>I've a LOCKED list fld "A" and a LOCKED list fld > "B". > >>I want to drag one line of plain text from A -> B > >>the (plain) text should disappear from the A list > and appears in B list > >>And I'd like the cursor changes when I click on a > line fo fld "A" > >>to show the drag and drop may start untiil the > mouse is released.. > >> > >>Can someone explain me how to proceed ?? > > > >I would also like to know that :-) > > > I hope we find someone who can explain that ;-) > > Cheers. > -- > Greetings. > > Yves COPPE Hi Yves, Klaus et al, I have something in the pipeline for just that purpose. It works for the following: - drag'n'drop between two separate pre-determined fields - drag'n'drop within a single field The thing I'd still like to add is drag'n'drop between fields and rearranging within the fields at the same time. That's why I was hoping that drag'n'drop with list fields was planned in RR 2.0, but I don't know whether or not it is one of the 'to be finalised' items. However, if you want, I can clean up what I have and host it on my geocities site later today. Which reminds me: does anyone have custom cursors with an 'open' hand and a 'closed' hand to show that you can drag the content, and that you've grabbed it ? If you, Klaus or anyone else can give me those, I'll incorporate them. Best regards, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From ludovic.thebault at laposte.net Thu Mar 13 12:31:01 2003 From: ludovic.thebault at laposte.net (Ludovic Thebault) Date: Thu Mar 13 12:31:01 2003 Subject: How change the rect of an image on an other card ? In-Reply-To: References: <3E7096C8.3050500@laposte.net> Message-ID: <3E70BF8A.6090603@laposte.net> Rob Cozens a ?crit: >> any idea ? Thanks > > put (the number of this card)+1 into nextCd -- test for last card??? I put my script in a 'repeat until the mouse is down', so it's not necessary to test the next cd. > Hope this helps. Nope, i try with your script but anything change. Sorry. From janschenkel at yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 12:38:02 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Thu Mar 13 12:38:02 2003 Subject: How change the rect of an image on an other card ? In-Reply-To: <3E7096C8.3050500@laposte.net> Message-ID: <20030313173458.83195.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com> --- Ludovic Thebault wrote: > Hello, > > I've made a little stack to make a basic slideshow. > I use this script to "magnify" little pictures, but > it doesn't works: > > show image 1 of next cd > set the filename of image 1 of next cd to line > (random(the number of > lines of the files)) of the files > get the rect of image 1 of next cd > repeat with n=1 to 4 > put (item n of it*0.5)+item n of it into item n of > it > end repeat > set the rect of image 1 of next cd to it > set the loc of image 1 of next cd to the screenloc > visual effect dissolve > go next cd > > But if i replace 'image 1 of next cd' by 'image 1 of > this cd' the script > works. Same problem with Rev 1.1.1r2 and Rev 2.0p4 > > any idea ? Thanks > Bonjour Ludovic, The problem is that you can't just refer to the next card, other than in the construct 'go next card'. You'll have to refer to the next card by its name, ID, or number. And work from there. In this case, you could also lock the screen, go to the next card, do all the dirty stuff, and then unlock with visual yadda yadda. Hope this helped, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From heather at runrev.com Thu Mar 13 12:44:02 2003 From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams) Date: Thu Mar 13 12:44:02 2003 Subject: Pricing In-Reply-To: <200303131701.MAA05233@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > Message: 4 > Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 09:34:23 -0500 > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > From: Victor Eijkhout > Subject: Re: Pricing. > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > At 9:31 +0000 2003/03/13, Heather Williams wrote: >> Normally, university lecturers must purchase the full >> Educational Edition, at $497.50. > > How do you justify charging more to a university lecturer than to a > small business? Is there any reason for me as a university lecturer > not to pick up the business license? It's not a straight like for like comparison. The Edu license gives full database connectivity and a year's email technical support. You can buy a Small Business license, but you can't buy it through the university, it has to be a private purchase. I think any further discussion of licensing should come direct to me, or you can always check out the licensing faq's on our website, Regards, Heather -- Heather Williams Runtime Revolution Ltd. Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought From k_major at os.surf2000.de Thu Mar 13 12:53:00 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Thu Mar 13 12:53:00 2003 Subject: DragDrop In-Reply-To: <20030313170034.48224.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4E58CA70-557C-11D7-AF57-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Hi Jan, > > Hi Yves, Klaus et al, > > I have something in the pipeline for just that > ... > fields and rearranging within the fields at the same > time. Way cooooool... > ... > Which reminds me: does anyone have custom cursors with > an 'open' hand and a 'closed' hand to show that you > can drag the content, and that you've grabbed it ? If > you, Klaus or anyone else can give me those, I'll > incorporate them. I will search my archives :-) > Best regards, Tot dan... > Jan Schenkel. Groetjes Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From pixelbird at interisland.net Thu Mar 13 12:53:10 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Thu Mar 13 12:53:10 2003 Subject: menu paradigm of Rev/MC and other goofiness In-Reply-To: <200303131432.JAA31516@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk > Subject: RE: menu paradigm of Rev/MC and other goofiness > Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 14:07:59 -0000 > Ah! That's illuminating! I'd read about stack menus in the docs, and in fact > never wanted to use one, but I always vaguely thought that indeed it was an > alternative way of creating a menubar menu (as I come from a Mac background) > and wondered why anyone would do it. Now I know that a stack menu can't be a > menubar menu, and it would be 'faking it' if it was so used in Windows, so I'm > completely foxed as to what sort of menu it can be. > Obviously there is some > other kind of menu that I never use. Pardon my complete dumbness on this one, > but can anyone give me an example of when and why you would use a stack menu? ---------- Stack menus are stacks with menu behavior. Think of them as popup stacks. Usually you would show them with a button, but you don't have to (do it from a mouseUp in a group or stack script). You could "place" them in the menubar if you want to. You would use them when you would want to do something you can't do with ordinary popup/pulldown menus. For example, instead of popping up a list of textual menu choices, you want to pop up a menu of images (photos, drawings, etc.). See the docs. Follow this route: Help menu > Revolution Documentation (Development Guide) > Menus (under Development Guide) > About > menus and the menubar > Stack Menus (Revoulution Encyclopedia...last section near the bottom). HTH, Ken N. From yvescoppe at skynet.be Thu Mar 13 12:57:01 2003 From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE) Date: Thu Mar 13 12:57:01 2003 Subject: DragDrop In-Reply-To: <20030313170034.48224.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030313170034.48224.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: >Hi Yves, Klaus et al, > >I have something in the pipeline for just that >purpose. It works for the following: >- drag'n'drop between two separate pre-determined >fields >- drag'n'drop within a single field >The thing I'd still like to add is drag'n'drop between >fields and rearranging within the fields at the same >time. > >That's why I was hoping that drag'n'drop with list >fields was planned in RR 2.0, but I don't know whether >or not it is one of the 'to be finalised' items. >However, if you want, I can clean up what I have and >host it on my geocities site later today. > >Which reminds me: does anyone have custom cursors with >an 'open' hand and a 'closed' hand to show that you >can drag the content, and that you've grabbed it ? If >you, Klaus or anyone else can give me those, I'll >incorporate them. > Super, let me know when it is ready and the adress of your site where we can download your stack... -- Greetings. Yves COPPE Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be From jeanne at runrev.com Thu Mar 13 13:00:02 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Thu Mar 13 13:00:02 2003 Subject: Graphic object <-- mouseDown? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: At 6:31 AM -0800 3/13/03, Ivers, Doug E wrote: >Don t graphic objects respond to mouseUp, mouseDown, mouseMove, etc.? Yes. > Where would I find this in the docs? Take a look at the top of the dictionary page for "mouseDown" (etc.). It specifies there which objects the message applies too. (This is also the case for properties.) -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development http://www.runrev.com/ From jeanne at runrev.com Thu Mar 13 13:00:12 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Thu Mar 13 13:00:12 2003 Subject: menu paradigm of Rev/MC and other goofiness In-Reply-To: <1bc8a01c2e969$f40855a0$748017ac@blueyonder.net> Message-ID: At 6:07 AM -0800 3/13/03, livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk wrote: >on Thu, 13 Mar 2003 00:03:31 -0800, "Jeanne A. E. DeVoto" > wrote: >At 6:45 AM -0800 3/5/03, Ivers, Doug E wrote: >>Does anyone have an example they could send me in which a >>menubar menu is a stack? > >>You can't make a stack menu into a menubar menu, I'm afraid. >Now I know that a stack menu can't be a menubar menu, and it >would be 'faking it' if it was so used in Windows, so I'm completely >foxed as to what sort of menu it can be. Obviously there is some >other kind of menu that I never use. Pardon my complete dumbness >on this one, but can anyone give me an example of when and why >you would use a stack menu? You can use them for popup menus, option menus, and pulldown menus inside a window. (One place to see a stack menu in action is to look at the Stack tab in the 1.1.1 Stack Properties palette. The menu that appears when you click "Window Decorations" is a stack menu.) The advantage of stack menus is that you have complete freedom regarding layout; you can create a multiple-column menu, a menu whose menu items are images, etc. They're more complicated to create than button menus, since you need to create a stack to hold the menu instead of just entering the list of menu items into a button, but they are much more flexible. -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development http://www.runrev.com/ From ambassador at fourthworld.com Thu Mar 13 13:31:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Thu Mar 13 13:31:01 2003 Subject: menu paradigm of Rev/MC and other goofiness In-Reply-To: <1bc8a01c2e969$f40855a0$748017ac@blueyonder.net> Message-ID: livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk wrote: > can anyone give me an example of when and why you would use a stack menu? I use them mstly for contextual menus. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Thu Mar 13 13:48:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Thu Mar 13 13:48:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E70D19D.6030203@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/13/03 8:08 AM, Robert Brenstein wrote: > I don't really want to prolong this thread but you guys seem to think > that I would want to produce a generic application that allows to run > any transcript code user wants, an evil program that will run Rev to > bankrupcy. I hope I didn't give that impression -- there is no way I'd ever suspect that of you. My point was just that eventually somebody would do it if it were possible. Of the folks who currently use Revolution, I don't believe any of us would sabotage Runtime. What I think might be more likely is that someone who hasn't paid for a license would discover that they could use almost any existing standalone to do full development work, if the script restrictions weren't in place. It would be cumbersome and awkward to work within the confines of the commandline, but someone would do it. During my work in the AOL HyperCard forum I saw lots of youngsters do exactly that with the HyperCard player so they wouldn't have to buy HyperCard. There were four or five different versions of HyperCard GUIs that did a fairly effective job of working around the HC player limitations. Those standalones were some of our most-downloaded software. If there is a way around it, they will try. So no, I wasn't accusing you in any way, or anyone else on this list. I just know after years working with those kids on AOL that if piracy is possible, they will do it. Jacque -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From jeanne at runrev.com Thu Mar 13 13:58:03 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Thu Mar 13 13:58:03 2003 Subject: Pricing. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 6:34 AM -0800 3/13/03, Victor Eijkhout wrote: >At 9:31 +0000 2003/03/13, Heather Williams wrote: >>Normally, university lecturers must purchase the full >>Educational Edition, at $497.50. > >How do you justify charging more to a university lecturer than to a >small business? Is there any reason for me as a university lecturer >not to pick up the business license? The education license is actually a half-price Pro license, and includes the Pro-only features like full database access (other than ODBC) and tech support that you don't get with a small business license. So if you want to use those features, the edu license is a better deal. -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - Software at the Speed of Thought http://www.runrev.com/ From scott at tactilemedia.com Thu Mar 13 14:02:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Thu Mar 13 14:02:01 2003 Subject: menu paradigm of Rev/MC and other goofiness In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > can anyone give me an example of when and why you would use a stack menu? - a menu with images - a numerically positioned/sized menu - a menu with custom script behavior Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design ----- E: scott at tactilemedia.com W: http://www.tactilemedia.com From brad at activadesign.com Thu Mar 13 14:12:01 2003 From: brad at activadesign.com (Bradley Borch) Date: Thu Mar 13 14:12:01 2003 Subject: More Flash (was use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1196 - 10 msgs) In-Reply-To: <200303131701.MAA05233@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <2AC2D248-5587-11D7-BADC-000393DBAE7A@activadesign.com> On Thursday, March 13, 2003, at 12:01 PM, Klaus wrote: > With "LIveStage Pro" (maybe other QT editors can do that, too) you can > add a "qtdebugstr" > message to objects/sprites/flash-buttons in a QT movie. From the Flash MX documentation: "You can also use the fscommand action to pass messages to Macromedia Director, or to Visual Basic, Visual C++, and other programs that can host ActiveX controls." Does Rev support ActiveX controls? Is this how QT interacts with Rev? If I'm playing an SWF as a QT in Rev, does the QT layer trap the commands? Still not sure how this works, but it seems there should be some way to do it. Brad From kray at sonsothunder.com Thu Mar 13 15:56:02 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Thu Mar 13 15:56:02 2003 Subject: How change the rect of an image on an other card ? In-Reply-To: <3E7096C8.3050500@laposte.net> Message-ID: <004b01c2e9a2$7db0aea0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Ludovic, You need to set the lockLocation of the image to true before you set its rect. I don't know why (since if I run your script with a button instead of an image I don't need to do anything special), but it DOES work if you set the lockLoc to true. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > Ludovic Thebault > Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2003 8:34 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: How change the rect of an image on an other card ? > > > Hello, > > I've made a little stack to make a basic slideshow. > I use this script to "magnify" little pictures, but it doesn't works: > > show image 1 of next cd > set the filename of image 1 of next cd to line (random(the number of > lines of the files)) of the files > get the rect of image 1 of next cd > repeat with n=1 to 4 > put (item n of it*0.5)+item n of it into item n of it > end repeat > set the rect of image 1 of next cd to it > set the loc of image 1 of next cd to the screenloc > visual effect dissolve > go next cd > > But if i replace 'image 1 of next cd' by 'image 1 of this cd' > the script > works. Same problem with Rev 1.1.1r2 and Rev 2.0p4 > > any idea ? Thanks > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu Thu Mar 13 15:59:01 2003 From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry) Date: Thu Mar 13 15:59:01 2003 Subject: Pricing. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Oh, boy, now I AM confused! So it's actually cheaper for me to continue with the SOHO upgrade option than as a university lecturer? And, even more seriously, what are you saying for a labpack? We have 24 or 25 machines. As I've indicated separately to Scott Raney, the department simply WILL NOT pay $5,000 for a labpack. We don't pay that for anything (mostly because we're flooded with MS crapware--all you can eat for all labs, all classes, and even all students for personal/take-home use is $700.) SuperCard, iShell, and MetaCard come in at between $1,200 and $1,500 for 25 licenses. The department knows we're gonna have to buy something for the next year and I'd really rather it was Rev instead of MC. Whaddya say? We probably wouldn't be purchasing until likely near the close of the fiscal year in late May... Thanks, Judy On Thu, 13 Mar 2003, Heather Williams wrote: > > Message: 3 > > Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 20:26:30 -0800 (PST) > > From: Judy Perry > > To: > > Subject: Re: Pricing. > > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > > > My understanding is that university educators are also eligible for the ed > > pricing; that it's the institutional pricing area where it matters if you > > are K-12 or higher ed. > > > > Am I wrong? > > Only partly. In general, individual university *students* are eligible for > the $99 license. Normally, university lecturers must purchase the full > Educational Edition, at $497.50. If you are teaching K12 teachers or a > multimedia course we will extend the K12 multiuser licensing to your class. > This is known in the company as a "Judy Perry Special" > > :-) > > Regards, > > Heather > > > > > > Judy > > -- > Heather Williams > Runtime Revolution Ltd. > Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 > Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From keith at hauck.com Thu Mar 13 16:03:00 2003 From: keith at hauck.com (Keith Whitney) Date: Thu Mar 13 16:03:00 2003 Subject: Grep help - remove HTML tags Message-ID: I'm trying to parse an rss feed and put the title into a list box row. This is working fine: put URL "http://my.server.com/myRSSfeed.rdf" into myVar ...and so is this: set the text of field "myField" to myVar But, when I add this line, the field "myField" is blank: filter field "myField" with "(.*)" Any suggestions? TIA, Keith -- Keith Whitney MIS Director Hauck & Associates, Inc. From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu Thu Mar 13 16:05:04 2003 From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry) Date: Thu Mar 13 16:05:04 2003 Subject: IGNORE LAST POST PLEASE! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Somehow while in between watching child#1 beat child#2 and trying to reply *privately* to Heather, I screwed up and sent it to the list instead. :( Judy On Thu, 13 Mar 2003, Judy Perry wrote: > Oh, boy, now I AM confused! From k_major at os.surf2000.de Thu Mar 13 16:05:15 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Thu Mar 13 16:05:15 2003 Subject: How change the rect of an image on an other card ? In-Reply-To: <004b01c2e9a2$7db0aea0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: <42D09012-5597-11D7-AF57-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Hi Ken, > Ludovic, > > You need to set the lockLocation of the image to true before you set > its > rect. I don't know why (since if I run your script with a button > instead > of an image I don't need to do anything special), maybe because an image resets to its original (formatted) size if it is not "locklocked" and you leave the card it is on and come back... (Don't we all love these situations when we forgot to "locklock" a very fine formatted group? ;-) In this case you already have leaved and you only come back. (??? ;-) Well, ehm... you know what i mean :-) And a button can be resized and will not be reset... > but it DOES work if > you set the lockLoc to true. > > Ken Ray > Sons of Thunder Software > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ Have a nice evening... Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From ambassador at fourthworld.com Thu Mar 13 16:14:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Thu Mar 13 16:14:01 2003 Subject: Grep help - remove HTML tags In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Keith Whitney wrote: > I'm trying to parse an rss feed and put the title into a list box row. > > This is working fine: > put URL "http://my.server.com/myRSSfeed.rdf" into myVar > > ...and so is this: > set the text of field "myField" to myVar > > But, when I add this line, the field "myField" is blank: > filter field "myField" with "(.*)" > > Any suggestions? set the htmltext of fld "MyField" to tMyVar get the text of fld "MyField" -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From don-pederson at utk.edu Thu Mar 13 16:19:00 2003 From: don-pederson at utk.edu (Don Pederson) Date: Thu Mar 13 16:19:00 2003 Subject: Playback speed of Tracks 3 and 4 in Midibuilder Message-ID: Does anyone know how to fix the playback rate for tracks 3 and 4 of Midibuilder? They play back at double the tempo - half notes in tracks 1 and 2 if entered the same way in tracks 3 and 4 play back as half the value of tracks 1 and 2. Sometimes there is a rather loud glitch or pop when you begin to play an example. Otherwise, the program works very well. -- Dr. Donald Pederson School of Music University of Tennessee 1741 Volunteer Blvd. Knoxville, TN 37996 don-pederson at utk.edu (865) 974-7550 From janschenkel at yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 16:49:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Thu Mar 13 16:49:01 2003 Subject: DragDrop In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030313214528.48497.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com> --- yves COPPE wrote: > >Hi Yves, Klaus et al, > > > >I have something in the pipeline for just that > >purpose. It works for the following: > >- drag'n'drop between two separate pre-determined > >fields > >- drag'n'drop within a single field > >The thing I'd still like to add is drag'n'drop > between > >fields and rearranging within the fields at the > same > >time. > > > >That's why I was hoping that drag'n'drop with list > >fields was planned in RR 2.0, but I don't know > whether > >or not it is one of the 'to be finalised' items. > >However, if you want, I can clean up what I have > and > >host it on my geocities site later today. > > > >Which reminds me: does anyone have custom cursors > with > >an 'open' hand and a 'closed' hand to show that you > >can drag the content, and that you've grabbed it ? > If > >you, Klaus or anyone else can give me those, I'll > >incorporate them. > > > > > Super, let me know when it is ready and the adress > of your site where > we can download your stack... > -- > Greetings. > > Yves COPPE > Hi Yves, Klaus et al. Well I did a final check to see if everything I had implemented actually worked well, and it passed my test so I guess you guys can play around with it now. Here's a direct link for your downloading pleasures: http://www.geocities.com/janschenkel/downloads/dragdroplist.rev If things don't work as expected, or if you have any suggestions or something to contribute, don't hesitate to mail me directly. Best regards, Jan Schenkel. PS to those of you wondering what else is in my test-code vault : more will come as I find the time to clean things up ; let's just say I've had plenty of fun with fields and buttons. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From curry at pair.com Thu Mar 13 18:10:03 2003 From: curry at pair.com (curry) Date: Thu Mar 13 18:10:03 2003 Subject: Animation freeze In-Reply-To: <200303130841.DAA22583@www.runrev.com> References: <200303130841.DAA22583@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Scott Rossi wrote: >Since you say you can cancel out of your script operation, it sounds like >some move event and/or script in your stack is not completing and as such is >preventing the rest of your scripts from executing. Thanks. Well, I'll see if I can come up with a good example script that demonstrates this behavior. Curry From alrice at ARCplanning.com Thu Mar 13 19:34:03 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Thu Mar 13 19:34:03 2003 Subject: Animation freeze In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3B3F9A4E-55B4-11D7-BFCB-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Wednesday, March 12, 2003, at 09:36 PM, curry wrote: > Has anyone ever made an arcade style game in Rev, or anything else > that used a lot of animations with "move without waiting" and "send in > time"? Here is a related question: Are there any sprite kits/libraries for Revolution? Stuff like edge-detection and physics? I think the animation manager looks pretty cool, but a sprite kit would be a good complementary feature to the animation manager. (getting lots of ideas for shareware whilst doing this austere business application in Rev.) Alex From pixelbird at interisland.net Thu Mar 13 20:43:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Thu Mar 13 20:43:01 2003 Subject: Graphic object <-- mouseDown? In-Reply-To: <200303131701.MAA05219@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Subject: Graphic object <-- mouseDown? > Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 09:31:20 -0500 > From: "Ivers, Doug E" > Don't graphic objects respond to mouseUp, mouseDown, mouseMove, etc.? ---------- Yep. ---------- > Where would I find this in the docs? ---------- First...please change your email settings for this list to "Plain", w'e're getting it in MIME format with all the extra junk. Thanks. Check out this route: Help menu > Revolution Documentation > Development Guide > Developing with Revolution > About > Revolution for new developers > Stacks and Objects All graphics are objects and are scriptable just like any other control. Choose a Graphic Tool and make a graphic object, then choose the Arrow Tool and double-click it. See, you get its dialog just like a button. Click on the "Script" tab and it will open the script editor. Write a short script like: on mouseMove x,y put x,y end mouseMove ...Then choose the Browse Tool. As soon as you move the mouse inside the graphic it will open the message box and display changing mouse coordinates as long as it's inside the graphic. HTH, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Thu Mar 13 20:50:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Thu Mar 13 20:50:01 2003 Subject: Archive links In-Reply-To: <200303131701.MAA05219@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hey list... Checkout the new archive links in the list header. Pretty cool, huh? Ken N. From yvescoppe at skynet.be Fri Mar 14 02:18:01 2003 From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE) Date: Fri Mar 14 02:18:01 2003 Subject: DragDrop In-Reply-To: <20030313214528.48497.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030313214528.48497.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: >Well I did a final check to see if everything I had >implemented actually worked well, and it passed my >test so I guess you guys can play around with it now. >Here's a direct link for your downloading pleasures: >http://www.geocities.com/janschenkel/downloads/dragdroplist.rev > >If things don't work as expected, or if you have any >suggestions or something to contribute, don't hesitate >to mail me directly. > >Best regards, > >Jan Schenkel. > >PS to those of you wondering what else is in my >test-code vault : more will come as I find the time to >clean things up ; let's just say I've had plenty of >fun with fields and buttons. > Hi Jan It's wonderful, wonderful, wonderful.... and it works with Rev 1.1.1 on Mac OS X.... It's wonderful, wonderful, wonderful....:-)) Thank you very much I'm waiting impatiently for your other promised stuffs...(plenty of fun as you say...) -- Greetings. Yves COPPE Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Fri Mar 14 03:25:01 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Fri Mar 14 03:25:01 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <102957B9-55F6-11D7-942C-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> If anything I've said came across as an attack on you, that wasn't my intent. That said: On Thursday, March 13, 2003, at 06:08 AM, Robert Brenstein wrote: > Admitedly, the application of do in my project would be kinda unusual > and very few people may indeed need it. However, I don't think my > desired usage is illegitimate or endangers Rev as a product in any > way. Users in my case would enter code that is more like Fortran or > Pascal which I convert internally into (reasonably complex) Transcript > and execute via do. However, there is no way to have this internally > generated code under 10 lines since multiple repeat loops are > involved. I'm just getting started with it, but check out LispLib: http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs/lisplib I can almost guarantee you'll be able to work within the 10 line limit. In fact you'll have lines left over. ;-) > Furthermore, the starting point of this thread was that > MC/Revolution's license explicitely allows me to produce and > distribute standalones without any further royalties. > > Using Revolution, you can deliver powerful, fully-featured > applications on all major platforms - quickly, easily, and > royalty-free. > > Unfortunately, the engine imposes the limit on the do length in those > -- the fact of which is not clearly stated up front. This is also > evidenced by a number of people admitting the surprise when they found > it out the hard way, although in their cases it was not a showstopper. > This discussion should be not as much about my shareware program > ruining 12-year effort but about false/misleading advertising. "Royalty-free" means without having to pay extra. It has nothing to do with features or capabilities. As an example, Adobe Acrobat allows you to create and distribute PDFs royalty free. The person who receives them, using Acrobat Reader, has a dramatically limited ability to modify the PDF you send them. That doesn't make the claim of royalty free distribution false or misleading. > Also, suggesting that users of my program get own Rev licenses is a > bit silly -- if my users were required to do so, why any other > Rev-based shareware programs should be different? Are WebMerge users > required to purchase Rev or MC? Again, this is like saying that because I have a QuickTime Pro license, anyone I send a QuickTime movie to should be able to edit it the same way I can, whether they have a license or not. The suggestion above would solve your problem. I assume that's the reason it was made. > >> For the very small set of tasks that truly require "do", taking a >> moment to >> break them into 10-line chunks would suffice for many of them; more >> complex >> needs will require more effort, but they should anyway: > > Executing code in 10-line chunks is not a solution for me because of > (anticipated) significant degradation of performance and because of > repeat loops within that cod (I haven't tested but I doubt that I can > have begin repeat and end repeat in different do statements). You can't have repeat and end repeat in different do statements, that's true. But you likely don't need to. Further, you are likely to be surprised by the performance. Revolution is fast, even using Do. regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de Fri Mar 14 04:08:02 2003 From: rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de (Robert Brenstein) Date: Fri Mar 14 04:08:02 2003 Subject: license issues (was mystery exception) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thank you Heather for a voice of reason and clarifications. I hope you find a reasonable way to warn about the restrictions on standalones without scaring users uneccessarily. I will see about pursuing my project later on. Robert Brenstein > > Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 15:08:01 +0100 >> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >> From: Robert Brenstein >> Subject: Re: license issues (was mystery exception) >> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >> >>> If all you wanted to do was give away a 12-year effort in crafting a highly >>> optimized scripting engine by just slapping a five-minute UI on it, you'd >>> have to work a litte harder than that. >>> >>> Admittedly I'm having a tough time thinking of a commercially viable >>> opportunity for an app that truly needs dynamic scripting and doesn't >>> compete with Rev.... >>> >> >> I don't really want to prolong this thread but you guys seem to think >> that I would want to produce a generic application that allows to run >> any transcript code user wants, an evil program that will run Rev to >> bankrupcy. > >Easy there. I don't think anyone thinks this of you. They've merely been >explaining the reasoning behind the way the licensing works. After all, it >would actually only take one ill intentioned or unscrupulous person to >achieve this, if we didn't have some sort of restriction to prevent it. > > > >> >> Furthermore, the starting point of this thread was that >> MC/Revolution's license explicitely allows me to produce and >> distribute standalones without any further royalties. >> >> Using Revolution, you can deliver powerful, fully-featured >> applications on all major platforms - quickly, easily, and >> royalty-free. > >Correct. It does. A standalone in Rev has the restriction that it cannot be >used for full programming and development. > >> >> Unfortunately, the engine imposes the limit on the do length in those >> -- the fact of which is not clearly stated up front. This is also >> evidenced by a number of people admitting the surprise when they >> found it out the hard way, although in their cases it was not a >> showstopper. This discussion should be not as much about my shareware >> program ruining 12-year effort but about false/misleading advertising. > >Ok, here you have a point. This issue should not come as a surprise to >established users, and I will see what can be done to clarify our terms, >conditions and licensing text on the website and in the docs. Part of the >problem here is that many people do not read long, boring, licensing text. > > > >> >> But then what stops users from running 10 lines at a time in a loop >> rather than simple "do me"? The fact is that MC and Rev folks do not >> mind people using the limited stack for fairly complex stuff, and >> they explicitely allow us to use starter kit to produce and >> distribute commercial applications. There are publically available >> tips and tricks how to do that. >> >Yes, but it is harder, slower, and in time serious developers prefer to buy >a license. It works pretty well. Those that it truly is not worthwhile for >to buy a license can still work in the starter kit. > >> It is just sad that at the same time they do not provide means of >> overcoming this do restriction for legitimate uses in standalone >> applications (even if this was on case by case basis). > >Try asking us. You never know, we might be able to come to some arrangement. > >Regards, > >Heather > >> >> Robert > >-- >Heather Williams >Runtime Revolution Ltd. >Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 >Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought > >_______________________________________________ >use-revolution mailing list >use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From janschenkel at yahoo.com Fri Mar 14 05:18:00 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Fri Mar 14 05:18:00 2003 Subject: DragDrop In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030314101421.57701.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com> >Well I did a final check to see if everything I had >implemented actually worked well, and it passed my >test so I guess you guys can play around with it now. And then I inserted an incorrect link. How profoundly smart. So, in an attempt to save a bit of face, here's another direct link for your downloading pleasures: http://www.geocities.com/janschenkel/downloads/dragdroplist.zip ---- I just toyed around with it under RunRev 2 pb4 running on MacOS X, and it seems to work just fine. However, the colours aren't what they're supposed to for a MacOS app, but I'm sure that's not too much of a burden: - change the colours of field "DragFld" to something more appropriate - tinker the script of the btn "DragShield" where it says "set the textColor of ..." On the bright side, as I was looking at the color controls, which indeed seem to lack effect, I discovered two custom cursors that looked remarkably like what I want. So I'll incorporate those later :) Have a nice day, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From Doug_Ivers at lord.com Fri Mar 14 07:05:00 2003 From: Doug_Ivers at lord.com (Ivers, Doug E) Date: Fri Mar 14 07:05:00 2003 Subject: Graphic object <-- mouseDown? Message-ID: Ok, seems to be working now. Maybe I had some kind of error in my script... -- D From timothy.hart5 at verizon.net Fri Mar 14 09:30:00 2003 From: timothy.hart5 at verizon.net (Tim Hart) Date: Fri Mar 14 09:30:00 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev Message-ID: So now that Supercard 4 is out. What are your opinions? I was reading in MacWorld and they kind of made a stab at Rev for waiting so long to release 2. I have to say it is funny. I mean what is the hold up. I don't mean to be a jerk but I don't see how they could possibly miss their original announcement by 4 months of just bug fixing. What is going on? From keith at hauck.com Fri Mar 14 09:50:00 2003 From: keith at hauck.com (Keith Whitney) Date: Fri Mar 14 09:50:00 2003 Subject: Grep help - remove HTML tags Message-ID: >> I'm trying to parse an rss feed and put the title into a list box row. >> >> This is working fine: >> put URL "http://my.server.com/myRSSfeed.rdf" into myVar >> >> ...and so is this: >> set the text of field "myField" to myVar >> >> But, when I add this line, the field "myField" is blank: >> filter field "myField" with "(.*)" >> >> Any suggestions? > > set the htmltext of fld "MyField" to tMyVar > get the text of fld "MyField" > > > -- > Richard Gaskin > Fourth World Media Corporation > Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site > ___________________________________________________________ > Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com > Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc Thanks for the reply! What I neglected to explain clearly was rather than simply stripping the HTML tags and displaying in a field, I want to separate the tagged text into different variables for placement into different elements (titles in a list field, content in a different field, etc.) -- Keith Whitney MIS Director Hauck & Associates, Inc. | http://www.hauck.com/ From janschenkel at yahoo.com Fri Mar 14 10:11:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Fri Mar 14 10:11:01 2003 Subject: Grep help - remove HTML tags In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030314150806.95745.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com> --- Keith Whitney wrote: > >> I'm trying to parse an rss feed and put the title > into a list box row. > >> > >> This is working fine: > >> put URL "http://my.server.com/myRSSfeed.rdf" into > myVar > >> > >> ...and so is this: > >> set the text of field "myField" to myVar > >> > >> But, when I add this line, the field "myField" is > blank: > >> filter field "myField" with "(.*)" > >> > >> Any suggestions? > > > > set the htmltext of fld "MyField" to tMyVar > > get the text of fld "MyField" > > > > > > -- > > Richard Gaskin > > Fourth World Media Corporation > > Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database > on any site > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Ambassador at FourthWorld.com > http://www.FourthWorld.com > > Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: > FourthWorldInc > > > Thanks for the reply! What I neglected to explain > clearly was rather > than simply stripping the HTML tags and displaying > in a field, I want > to separate the tagged text into different variables > for placement into > different elements (titles in a list field, content > in a different > field, etc.) > > -- > Keith Whitney Hi Keith, Maybe this is a task for the XML-library in RunRev 2 ? Of course it's not 'final' yet, but the pre-beta could help you a long way. Best regards, Jan Schenkel. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From rcozens at pon.net Fri Mar 14 11:18:01 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Fri Mar 14 11:18:01 2003 Subject: How change the rect of an image on an other card ? Message-ID: >any idea ? Thanks Hi again, Ludovic, Perhaps a simpler alternative (in the stack script)?: on preOpenCard show image 1 set the filename of image 1 line (random(the number of lines of the files)) of the files get the rect of image 1 repeat with n=1 to 4 put (item n of it*0.5)+item n of it into item n of it end repeat set the rect of image 1 to it set the loc of image 1 to the screenloc end preOpenCard that leaves >visual effect dissolve >go next cd In your original script. Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu Fri Mar 14 11:22:00 2003 From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry) Date: Fri Mar 14 11:22:00 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I guess MacWorld is forgetting how many years it took to get from SC 3.x to SC4 being out the door and shipping. Not to stab at SC, as I'm glad that they're alive, well and in the market... but for a while it looked to the outside observer as if SC 4 was NEVER coming. Judy On Fri, 14 Mar 2003, Tim Hart wrote: > So now that Supercard 4 is out. What are your opinions? I was reading > in MacWorld and they kind of made a stab at Rev for waiting so long to > release 2. I have to say it is funny. I mean what is the hold up. I > don't mean to be a jerk but I don't see how they could possibly miss > their original announcement by 4 months of just bug fixing. What is > going on? From janschenkel at yahoo.com Fri Mar 14 11:23:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Fri Mar 14 11:23:01 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030314161952.6443.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> --- Tim Hart wrote: > So now that Supercard 4 is out. What are your > opinions? I was reading > in MacWorld and they kind of made a stab at Rev for > waiting so long to > release 2. I have to say it is funny. I mean what > is the hold up. I > don't mean to be a jerk but I don't see how they > could possibly miss > their original announcement by 4 months of just bug > fixing. What is > going on? > Well, Til, let's see how a group of developers usually ends up in this type of situation : - have a large number of users all asking for extensions for their particular field of work - worst-case scenario extension to this is when you have a bunch of salespeople promising heaven on earth without having a clue as to how much work is needed - have a huge load of brilliant ideas yourself and feel the urge to squeeze them all in - make quick prototypes and horribly underestimate the time needed to not only fully develop them, but also to debug them and subsequently polish the thing 'till it shines - realise late in the project that you'll have to change the line up for either short-term or long-term compatibility - be dependent on another vendor for core technology (MetaCard 2.5 is still in beta, and I don't think that was exactly planned either) - have to find work-arounds for limitations, bugs and incompatibilities at OS level - interrupt your schedule for work that will bring in cash right away rather than getting sucked dry by a project that is already behind schedule - feel the competition breathing down your neck and the subsequent additional feature creep - mix in pressure from a few more angles, and see some people actually underperforming because of it - add bugs because of all this, and you get a very tough product development cycle Of course I have no clue which of the above applies to RunRev. However, having been in the business myself for some time, whilst keeping my eyes open, has shown that the above in some cases culminates in projects that have spun out of control and need the plug pulled (Pink/Taligent/Copland anyone?) However, the fact that we've seen a steady stream of pre-beta updates lately goes to show that no panic is needed. As eager as anyone here on this list to get my grubby little paws on the final version, I have no doubt we'll see a solid upgrade emerging soon. And having been dependent on Microsoft development tools in the past, I'd rather they take their time to do it right, not just ship it. Just my two euro-cents, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From janschenkel at yahoo.com Fri Mar 14 11:38:00 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Fri Mar 14 11:38:00 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <20030314161952.6443.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20030314163452.50754.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com> --- Jan Schenkel wrote: > --- Tim Hart wrote: > > So now that Supercard 4 is out. What are your > > opinions? I was reading > > in MacWorld and they kind of made a stab at Rev > for > > waiting so long to > > release 2. I have to say it is funny. I mean > what > > is the hold up. I > > don't mean to be a jerk but I don't see how they > > could possibly miss > > their original announcement by 4 months of just > bug > > fixing. What is > > going on? > > > > Well, Tim, let's see how a group of developers > usually > ends up in this type of situation : > - have a large number of users all asking for > extensions for their particular field of work > - worst-case scenario extension to this is when you > have a bunch of salespeople promising heaven on > earth > without having a clue as to how much work is needed > - have a huge load of brilliant ideas yourself and > feel the urge to squeeze them all in > - make quick prototypes and horribly underestimate > the > time needed to not only fully develop them, but also > to debug them and subsequently polish the thing > 'till > it shines > - realise late in the project that you'll have to > change the line up for either short-term or > long-term > compatibility > - be dependent on another vendor for core technology > (MetaCard 2.5 is still in beta, and I don't think > that > was exactly planned either) > - have to find work-arounds for limitations, bugs > and > incompatibilities at OS level > - interrupt your schedule for work that will bring > in > cash right away rather than getting sucked dry by a > project that is already behind schedule > - feel the competition breathing down your neck and > the subsequent additional feature creep > - mix in pressure from a few more angles, and see > some > people actually underperforming because of it > - add bugs because of all this, and you get a very > tough product development cycle > And in all this, I haven't even touched the surface of personnel change -- again, no indication of that happening over at RunRev HQ ; but another factor that can seriously impact the development cycle. It's a shame one can't _really_ make software at the speed of thought. Though some tools make it a lot easier indeed. Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From alrice at ARCplanning.com Fri Mar 14 12:17:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Fri Mar 14 12:17:01 2003 Subject: Grep help - remove HTML tags In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3E210501-5640-11D7-9BC4-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Friday, March 14, 2003, at 07:46 AM, Keith Whitney wrote: > Thanks for the reply! What I neglected to explain clearly was rather > than simply stripping the HTML tags and displaying in a field, I want > to separate the tagged text into different variables for placement > into different elements (titles in a list field, content in a > different field, etc.) Regex support in Rev can do this. I think your filter command: filter field "myField" with "(.*)" is using a Regex but filter only supports wildcards, not actual regex. Try something like this put "alksj dqwlkj ea jsdkljsa fu l klejqw lkejqw" into tHtmlContent put empty into tTitle -- don't forget this get matchText(tHtmlContent, "(.*)", tTitle) put tTitle into fld "myField" I agree with the other poster, a real XML parser would be a better way to go. What if the HTML is mixed case soemthing? Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From ttasovac at princeton.edu Fri Mar 14 13:15:00 2003 From: ttasovac at princeton.edu (Toma Tasovac) Date: Fri Mar 14 13:15:00 2003 Subject: preBeta4 prob Message-ID: I am having problems with the latest "preBeta." It refuses to put the content of a txt file into a variable. I'm doing the simplest possible thing: put url "file:filename" into tVariable but that just doesn't happen. I've tried the message box with: put url "file:filename" and i couldn't see the content of the file, no error message, nothing. The same files work ok with 1.1.1. Has anybody by any chance experienced the same problem? Any suggestion on how I could twist Revolution's arm into reading my files? All best, Toma From scott at tactilemedia.com Fri Mar 14 13:37:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Fri Mar 14 13:37:01 2003 Subject: preBeta4 prob In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Recently, "Toma Tasovac" wrote: > I am having problems with the latest "preBeta." It refuses to put the > content of a txt file into a variable. I'm doing the simplest possible > thing: > > put url "file:filename" into tVariable > > but that just doesn't happen. I've tried the message box with: > > put url "file:filename" > > and i couldn't see the content of the file, no error message, nothing. > The same files work ok with 1.1.1. > > Has anybody by any chance experienced the same problem? Any suggestion > on how I could twist Revolution's arm into reading my files? If you're using a variable "filename" as your file path, the syntax would be: put url ("file:" & filename) into tVariable Not sure if this is the actual problem -- just an option. Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design ----- E: scott at tactilemedia.com W: http://www.tactilemedia.com From chilton at tca.net Fri Mar 14 13:37:18 2003 From: chilton at tca.net (Chilton Webb) Date: Fri Mar 14 13:37:18 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <200303141701.MAA32766@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hi Judy, On Friday, March 14, 2003, at 11:01 AM, Judy Perry wrote: > I guess MacWorld is forgetting how many years it took to get from SC > 3.x to SC4 being out the door and shipping. Not to stab at SC, as I'm > glad that they're alive, well and in the market... but for a while it > looked to the outside observer as if SC 4 was NEVER coming. I believe it's a difference in the demands of the users. Because SC has been around so long, if SC4 shipped with *any* major bugs, it would be seen a major failure on the part of the SuperCard team, so the development cycle for this version was considerably longer than I think anyone hoped it would be. But the finished product was worth the wait. SC's installed user base is not as tolerant of the development team's mistakes as users are on this list. -Chilton From whitney at hauck.com Fri Mar 14 13:41:03 2003 From: whitney at hauck.com (Keith Whitney) Date: Fri Mar 14 13:41:03 2003 Subject: Grep help - remove HTML tags Message-ID: <78BC91AD-562B-11D7-80F8-0003937617B4@hauck.com> >> I'm trying to parse an rss feed and put the title into a list box row. >> >> This is working fine: >> put URL "http://my.server.com/myRSSfeed.rdf" into myVar >> >> ...and so is this: >> set the text of field "myField" to myVar >> >> But, when I add this line, the field "myField" is blank: >> filter field "myField" with "(.*)" >> >> Any suggestions? > > set the htmltext of fld "MyField" to tMyVar > get the text of fld "MyField" > > > -- > Richard Gaskin > Fourth World Media Corporation > Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site > ___________________________________________________________ > Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com > Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc Thanks for the reply! What I neglected to explain clearly was rather than simply stripping the HTML tags and displaying in a field, I want to separate the tagged text into different variables for placement into different elements (titles in a list field, content in a different field, etc.) -- Keith Whitney MIS Director Hauck & Associates, Inc. | http://www.hauck.com/ From ttasovac at princeton.edu Fri Mar 14 13:59:01 2003 From: ttasovac at princeton.edu (Toma Tasovac) Date: Fri Mar 14 13:59:01 2003 Subject: preBeta4 prob In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1356F8EE-564E-11D7-B4D9-000393D60E0C@princeton.edu> No, Scott, there is no variable in the file path -- it's the actual file i'm referring to. Also, I forgot to mention I was using 10.2.4 On Friday, March 14, 2003, at 07:33 PM, Scott Rossi wrote: > > If you're using a variable "filename" as your file path, the syntax > would > be: > > put url ("file:" & filename) into tVariable From janschenkel at yahoo.com Fri Mar 14 14:05:00 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Fri Mar 14 14:05:00 2003 Subject: preBeta4 prob In-Reply-To: <1356F8EE-564E-11D7-B4D9-000393D60E0C@princeton.edu> Message-ID: <20030314190119.71394.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com> --- Toma Tasovac wrote: > No, Scott, there is no variable in the file path -- > it's the actual > file i'm referring to. > > Also, I forgot to mention I was using 10.2.4 > > On Friday, March 14, 2003, at 07:33 PM, Scott Rossi > wrote: > > > > If you're using a variable "filename" as your file > path, the syntax > > would > > be: > > > > put url ("file:" & filename) into tVariable > Hi Toma, Have you tried this ? answer file "Read which file?" put URL ("file:"&it) It's quite possible you're missing some part of the filepath. Hope this helpes you track down the problem. Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From kray at sonsothunder.com Fri Mar 14 14:25:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Fri Mar 14 14:25:01 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <00d201c2ea5e$d2a131c0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Hey, Chilton! I haven't seen you on this list; I guess you're just lurking, eh? ;-) > I believe it's a difference in the demands of the users. > Because SC has > been around so long, if SC4 shipped with *any* major bugs, it > would be > seen a major failure on the part of the SuperCard team, so the > development cycle for this version was considerably longer > than I think > anyone hoped it would be. But the finished product was worth the wait. Since nothing had been heard from SC in the public arena after Allegiant's demise (if I remember correctly), it was also very important for media coverage that the next major upgrade be pretty bug free. This is most likely why Rev 2.0 has been taking so long as well; 1.1.1 was the last version to be covered in the media, and knowing that 2.0 is a next major upgrade, it is important to make sure all the major bugs are squashed. > SC's installed user base is not as tolerant of the development team's > mistakes as users are on this list. That's what I like about the users on this list; they are more forgiving than most. I know dozens of SC users who "jumped ship" earlier than I would have expected in the early 3.x days because of Allegiant's failed Windows promises... I was working for Allegiant at the time, so I had first hand experience. Of course, this was the marketing team and not the development team, so I guess it's a bit different... Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From kray at sonsothunder.com Fri Mar 14 14:28:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Fri Mar 14 14:28:01 2003 Subject: Grep help - remove HTML tags In-Reply-To: <78BC91AD-562B-11D7-80F8-0003937617B4@hauck.com> Message-ID: <00d301c2ea5f$455e5d00$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Keith, If you're using the Pre-Beta of 2.0, you can use my XML Library to locate and extract tagged text (if it's in XML format). http://www.sonsothunder.com/products/metacard/xmllib.htm The Basic version for reading XML is free, so you might want to DL it and see if it suits your needs. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > Keith Whitney > Sent: Friday, March 14, 2003 8:45 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: Grep help - remove HTML tags > > > >> I'm trying to parse an rss feed and put the title into a list box > >> row. > >> > >> This is working fine: > >> put URL "http://my.server.com/myRSSfeed.rdf" into myVar > >> > >> ...and so is this: > >> set the text of field "myField" to myVar > >> > >> But, when I add this line, the field "myField" is blank: > filter field > >> "myField" with "(.*)" > >> > >> Any suggestions? > > > > set the htmltext of fld "MyField" to tMyVar > > get the text of fld "MyField" > > > > > > -- > > Richard Gaskin > > Fourth World Media Corporation > > Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com > > Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc > > > Thanks for the reply! What I neglected to explain clearly was rather > than simply stripping the HTML tags and displaying in a field, I want > to separate the tagged text into different variables for > placement into > different elements (titles in a list field, content in a different > field, etc.) > > -- > Keith Whitney > MIS Director > Hauck & Associates, Inc. | http://www.hauck.com/ > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From ambassador at fourthworld.com Fri Mar 14 15:12:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Fri Mar 14 15:12:01 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Tim Hart wrote: > So now that Supercard 4 is out. What are your opinions? I was reading > in MacWorld and they kind of made a stab at Rev for waiting so long to > release 2. I have to say it is funny. My Rev-based product also got a 4.5-mouse review in that magazine just a month earlier, so I read it with great enthusiasm. Yet I couldn't find a reference to Rev's ship date there, only a reference that Rev and RealBASIC are also in the market, and the reviewer seemed unclear that Rev has been shipping for OS X and Windows (he forgot to mention Linux and UNIX) for quite some time now, and of course relative performance was never brought up. > I mean what is the hold up. I don't mean to be a jerk but I don't see > how they could possibly miss their original announcement by 4 months > of just bug fixing. What is going on? I'm confident that as a long-time xTalker you recognize, as Mark Lucas himself has said, that it's valuable for all xTalk products to support others in different niches. As long as your question is motivated by a sincere interest in using Rev 2.0 I'm sure no one here would accuse you of being a "jerk". Thus far the shift from Rev 1.x to 2.0 is moving faster than SC 3.x to 4.0, so any problem lies more with Rev's rush to announce ship dates prematurely than any actual engineering issue. What Rev 2.0 features are holding up your work? I'll bet we could come up with some acceptable alternatives to keep your project moving forward in the meantime. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From ambassador at fourthworld.com Fri Mar 14 16:38:00 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Fri Mar 14 16:38:00 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Chilton Webb wrote: > I believe it's a difference in the demands of the users. Because SC has > been around so long, if SC4 shipped with *any* major bugs, it would be > seen a major failure on the part of the SuperCard team, so the > development cycle for this version was considerably longer than I think > anyone hoped it would be. But the finished product was worth the wait. > > SC's installed user base is not as tolerant of the development team's > mistakes as users are on this list. I think you may be underestimating the supportiveness of the SC community: searching for "bug" in the SC list archives brought up a few hundred messages, and the conversations there seemed very friendly and supportive of Mark Lucas' excellent work. One nice thing about this community is that posts related to other tools are never filtered out, so sincere posts with information useful to the readers here are always welcome. Along those lines, here's today's rambling sermon from Brother Richard of the Church of xTalk (you can stop reading here if you have useful things to do with your time): I've shipped software with nearly every xTalk product on the market spanning about 15 years, and in all that time the only two people who seemed to readily grasp the value of multiple xTalk implementations were Charlie Jackson (founder of Silicon Beach Software, SC's first publisher) and Jean Louis Gassee (former Apple technology director). Back in 1989, Jackson and Gassee announced an effort to promote standardization among xTalks (I still have that MacWeek clipping somewhere in my filing cabinet). This important move was later killed by Apple for reasons not unlike the short-sightedness that eventually caused them to kill HyperCard itself. Meanwhile, Microsoft was prototyping VisualBasic on a Mac in SuperCard, and their commitment to high-level development over the years has often been cited as a contributing factor to their hegemony. But Apple's short-sightedness need not be ours. Show me another language family that has chunk expressions and I'll show you as few lines of code as we xTalkers enjoy every day. Show me another language family that allows full runtime editing with no compile-run cycle, and I'll show you a workflow with orders of magnitude greater productivity over more cumbersome alternatives. Ironically, the most popular scripting language in the world is JavaScript, used not only in Web development but also in the IDEs for a great many major packages from Adobe, Macromedia, and others. I say "ironically" because the language was never designed for widespread use: it was a weekend project by a Netscape engineer that got rushed into the browser when the marketing staff heard about it. All too C-like, it is a needlessly cumbersome and tedious language design, fine for compilation but uniquely inefficient for real-time interpretation (see Osterhaut, ). In a world where most scripters are accustomed to working much harder than they need to, writing dozens of lines for one-liners us xTalkers take for granted, xTalk is all too often seen as "too good to be true", or more specifically, "too much fun to be powerful". These perceptions affect all xTalks, and completely miss the point of good scripting language design: ideally, a scripter is writing as few lines as possible, letting the highly-optimized object code in the interpreter handle most of it. It's just not smart to walk through a string of characters keeping track of white space when you could be writing "get word 2 of line 3". At a glance, xTalk appears verbose to programmers familiar with C++ and Java, but that's only at a glance: while the language does extend Pascal's preference for readability to an even more productive level, generally speaking you'll need only a line or two of an xTalk to accomplish what would take dozens, sometimes hundreds, of lines in C++ or Java (compare "start player 1" to what you'd need to play a QT movie on Mac Classic, OS X, and Windows using C++). To fight the FUD ("Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt" for those of you who don't frequent Usenet ), it benefits all xTalkers to recognize that the more implementations of xTalk that exist the better it is for all of us in promoting the benefits of this language family. Offhand, it seems there are four xTalks shipping, each with a different market focus: ToolBook - as a Wiindows-specific tool, it does things like direct API calls that are pretty nifty if you can afford it and need the API. SuperCard - As a Mac-only tool, it offers some attractive options for developers who can deploy solely to that OS. MetaCard - The first truly multi-platform xTalk with a spartan UI well-suited for its UNIX-centric customer base. Revolution - The next stage of evolution for the MetaCard engine, offering the same support for deployment to nearly all modern computers with a more feature-rich UI than MC. None of these products is exactly like the others, each addressing a different focus its users find satisfying. But all of them share the same grace and ease inherent in xTalk, and collectively they make a powerful statement about a very differnt way of developing software than most of the world has yet known. So I would encourage all xTalkers, regardless of dialect preference, to consider this larger view rather than nit-picking among ourselves. As Scott Raney says, "Let a thousand flowers bloom". With a few hundred million computers on the planet, there's plenty of room for all of us. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From kray at sonsothunder.com Fri Mar 14 17:53:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Fri Mar 14 17:53:01 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <001901c2ea7b$ead5eac0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> > Show me another language family that has chunk expressions > and I'll show you as few lines of code as we xTalkers enjoy > every day. Quite true, and here's an example: Revolution: ----------- answer (item 4 of "Chunk,Expressions,Are,Cool") Visual Basic: ------------- MsgBox GetItem("Chunk,Expressions,Are,Cool",4) Public Function GetItem(ByVal tData As Variant, ByVal tItemNum As Integer) startChar = 1 countitem = 0 Done = False tDelim = "," tData = tData & tDelim While Done = False charOff = InStr(startChar, tData, tDelim) If charOff = 0 Then 'Encountered end of data before hitting line tLineNum GetItem = "-1" Done = True Else countitem = countitem + 1 If countitem = tItemNum Then If charOff = startChar Then 'Empty item GetItem = "" Done = True Else GetItem = Mid$(tData, startChar, (charOff - startChar)) Done = True End If Else startChar = charOff + 1 'Deals with the crlf End If End If Wend tData = Left$(tData, Len(tData) - 1) End Function The VB function above was one of a library of "xTalk" functions I wrote back in the late 90's in order to attempt to even get *close* to xTalk chunking capability in VB. Arguably it can be tightened up a bit, but you get the idea... Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Fri Mar 14 18:44:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Fri Mar 14 18:44:01 2003 Subject: case sensitivity; even in tests ?! Message-ID: I have no particular preference whether identifiers should be case sensitive, but I'm not amused that put "a" is "A" gives "true". Is there a test for case sensitive equality? Other than through chartonum ? Efficiency is not that important in this application so I can take that tiny hit, but it's not really elegant. -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From bvg at mac.com Fri Mar 14 19:02:01 2003 From: bvg at mac.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?=) Date: Fri Mar 14 19:02:01 2003 Subject: case sensitivity; even in tests ?! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: set the caseSensitive to true put "a" is "A" results in: false On Samstag, M?r 15, 2003, at 00:38 Europe/Zurich, Victor Eijkhout wrote: > I have no particular preference whether identifiers should be case > sensitive, but I'm not amused that > > put "a" is "A" > > gives "true". Is there a test for case sensitive equality? Other than > through chartonum ? > > Efficiency is not that important in this application so I can take > that tiny hit, but it's not really elegant. > -- > Victor Eijkhout > tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) > http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From jiml at netrin.com Fri Mar 14 19:33:01 2003 From: jiml at netrin.com (Jim Lambert) Date: Fri Mar 14 19:33:01 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <200303142254.RAA09046@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Rev. Richard, that's a most concisely written 'sermon' on xTalk. Amen, Brother, I believe! I wouldn't be surprised if JavaScript was the most popular language of any type. (not counting Markup Languages as programming languages.) Amen, again. I've never understood why needless complexity always seems to trump elegant simplicity in the world of computing. Jim Lambert From rogerguay at centurytel.net Fri Mar 14 20:15:01 2003 From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay) Date: Fri Mar 14 20:15:01 2003 Subject: Some help, please! Message-ID: <18E03D2C-5683-11D7-A186-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Can anyone tell me why this script doesn't work? if the CommandKey is down then set the defaultFolder to "/Hard Disk/Applications/GetIt" Launch "TextEdit" end if also, if I try "Launch "TextEdit"" in the message box, I get an error -43. TIA, Roger From kkaufman at snet.net Fri Mar 14 20:16:01 2003 From: kkaufman at snet.net (Kurt Kaufman) Date: Fri Mar 14 20:16:01 2003 Subject: Playback speed of Tracks 3 and 4 in Midibuilder Message-ID: <4477AE09-5683-11D7-8BD8-0003936D1F12@snet.net> Don Pederson wrote: "Does anyone know how to fix the playback rate for tracks 3 and 4 of Midibuilder? They play back at double the tempo - half notes in tracks 1 and 2 if entered the same way in tracks 3 and 4 play back as half the value of tracks 1 and 2. Sometimes there is a rather loud glitch or pop when you begin to play an example. Otherwise, the program works very well." Don, Which platform are you using? MIDI Builder was written using Rev. 1.1.1 on Mac OS X, but in my tests on Mac OS 9, Windows 98 and Windows 2000 I did not encounter any of the aforementioned problems. Try this simple test: With all the default settings, play 4 middle C quarter notes on track one, switch to track 2 and play 4 E quarter notes, switch to track 3 and play 4 G quarter notes, and finally switch to track 4 and play 4 Bb quarter notes. You should hear 4 C7 chords as quarter notes. (I just tried this test on Mac OS X 10.2.4, QT 6.1, Rev. 1.1.1 with expected results). Please make sure that the version of MIDI Builder you are testing is "020915". Also, I have not tested it with the latest pre-beta versions of Revolution, but I will make sure that it works properly with the final release of Rev 2.0. You can also contact me off-list if you would like. -Kurt From ambassador at fourthworld.com Fri Mar 14 20:26:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Fri Mar 14 20:26:01 2003 Subject: Some help, please! In-Reply-To: <18E03D2C-5683-11D7-A186-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Message-ID: Roger Guay wrote: > if the CommandKey is down then > set the defaultFolder to "/Hard Disk/Applications/GetIt" > Launch "TextEdit" > end if > > also, if I try "Launch "TextEdit"" in the message box, I get an error > -43. Err -43is "file not found" Try this in the Message Box: put exists("/Hard Disk/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit") -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From todd at geistinteractive.com Fri Mar 14 20:36:01 2003 From: todd at geistinteractive.com (Todd Geist) Date: Fri Mar 14 20:36:01 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2F964024-5686-11D7-9D0E-00306544A95E@geistinteractive.com> On Friday, March 14, 2003, at 05:22 PM, Jim Lambert wrote: > Amen, again. > I've never understood why needless complexity always seems to trump > elegant > simplicity in the world of computing. Because needless complexity allows more people to make money. Todd From kkaufman at snet.net Fri Mar 14 20:43:00 2003 From: kkaufman at snet.net (Kurt Kaufman) Date: Fri Mar 14 20:43:00 2003 Subject: complexity (was: Supercard vs. Rev) Message-ID: <0AFB297A-5687-11D7-96BB-0003936D1F12@snet.net> > I've never understood why needless complexity always seems to trump > elegant > simplicity in the world of computing. It may be that people in general are inclined to stay with what is initially learned or what is familiar, regardless of its level of complexity. -Kurt From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Fri Mar 14 20:54:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Fri Mar 14 20:54:01 2003 Subject: Is there a reverse video mode for text in fields? Message-ID: The man page for "textstyle" lists a couple of possibilities, but not inverse video. The keywords "inverse" and "reverse" don't seem to apply to text. -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From chilton at tca.net Fri Mar 14 21:25:01 2003 From: chilton at tca.net (Chilton Webb) Date: Fri Mar 14 21:25:01 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <200303142254.RAA09007@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: First, Ken says... > Hey, Chilton! > > I haven't seen you on this list; I guess you're just lurking, eh? ;-) How quickly one is forgotten when they are quiet ;-) I've been here since roughly a week after Rev shipped 1.0. But this is one of the lists I read in my spare time, which I don't have a lot of these days. For the last two years I've been working on a product for a client, the final version of which shipped this morning. So I've got a bit of time on my hands again. > Tim Hart wrote: >> I mean what is the hold up. I don't mean to be a jerk but I don't see >> how they could possibly miss their original announcement by 4 months >> of just bug fixing. What is going on? > Richard Gaskin responded: > I'm confident that as a long-time xTalker you recognize, as Mark Lucas > himself has said, that it's valuable for all xTalk products to support > others in different niches. As long as your question is motivated by a > sincere interest in using Rev 2.0 I'm sure no one here would accuse > you of > being a "jerk". On list, this is probably true. Off list, I'm sure he's received about as many flames as I have the few times I've posted anything that puts Rev in a bad light. Apparently I'm everything from a 'typical Mac (expletive deleted)', to a SuperCard Bigot. Hopefully he'll make off a bit better. > Thus far the shift from Rev 1.x to 2.0 is moving faster than SC 3.x to > 4.0, > so any problem lies more with Rev's rush to announce ship dates > prematurely > than any actual engineering issue. This is true, but there are fewer underlying issues they're faced with as well (Raney gets to handle the heavy lifting on the engine), so this is likely entirely due to making sure the bugs are worked out. Always a good thing, in my book. >> Chilton Webb said... >> I believe it's a difference in the demands of the users. Because SC >> has >> been around so long, if SC4 shipped with *any* major bugs, it would be >> seen a major failure on the part of the SuperCard team, so the >> development cycle for this version was considerably longer than I >> think >> anyone hoped it would be. But the finished product was worth the wait. >> >> SC's installed user base is not as tolerant of the development team's >> mistakes as users are on this list. > Richard Gaskin responded: > I think you may be underestimating the supportiveness of the SC > community: > searching for "bug" in the SC list archives brought up a few hundred > messages, and the conversations there seemed very friendly and > supportive of > Mark Lucas' excellent work. Yes, but had he shipped SC4 with a bug that crashed everything under Jaguar, he'd never hear the end of it. Right now, there is not a shipping version of Revolution that is entirely safe in Jaguar, unless you can work with the old-style MacOS appearance for things. > One nice thing about this community is that posts related to other > tools are > never filtered out, so sincere posts with information useful to the > readers > here are always welcome. I'd question your use of the word 'welcome' here. This list is just as bad about flaming people as any other I've been on, the main difference is that the flames are kept off-list. Which is probably a good thing. But I've seen a few Rev users flamed by their own, for lesser things than pointing out the 4 month slip in the 2.0 release date. As far as I know, the only person filtered from the SC list is Scott Raney, who has a long history of posting blatant ads for MetaCard as a 'solution' to a problem in SC (while this is funny, it isn't always helpful). And it's not limited to SuperCard. He had a bit of a reputation for this on other lists as well, especially on Usenet. Scott Simon's decision to filter Raney was at the request of a number of users, and not one he wanted to do, from what I can tell. Now, it is possible that my above statements paint my perception of Raney in a bad way. But that's not actually the case. I have nothing but respect for his product and his abilities. It's his method of interacting with his competition that I find fault in, but not necessarily even that. It's more that he's very good at being a competitor, which is something quite lacking in the industry right now. One key aspect of being a good competitor is annoying your competition. -Chilton From edutec at sympatico.ca Fri Mar 14 22:25:01 2003 From: edutec at sympatico.ca (edutec) Date: Fri Mar 14 22:25:01 2003 Subject: Ironic [was: Supercard vs. Rev] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Ironically, the most popular scripting language in the world is JavaScript, > used not only in Web development but also in the IDEs for a great many major > packages from Adobe, Macromedia, and others. I say "ironically" because the > language was never designed for widespread use: it was a weekend project by > a Netscape engineer that got rushed into the browser when the marketing > staff heard about it. All too C-like, it is a needlessly cumbersome and > tedious language design, fine for compilation but uniquely inefficient for > real-time interpretation (see Osterhaut, > ). Brendan Eich offers some insights in the foreword to Danny Goodman's Javascript Bible, 4th edition. "As JavaScript's creator, I would like to say a few words about where JavaScript has been, where it is going [...] Although the 'natural language' syntax of HyperTalk was fresh in my mind after a friend lent me 'The Complete HyperCard Handbook by some fellow named Goodman, the Next Big Thing weighed heavier, especially in light of another goal: scripting Java applets. If the scripting language resembled Java, then those programmers who made the jump from JavaScript to Java would welcome similarities in syntax. But insisting on Java's class and type declarations, or on a semicolon after each statement when a line ending would do, were out of the question -- scripting for most people is about writing short snippets of code, quickly and without fuss." Eich has the opportunity to use a natural language syntax for a scripting language that would make HTML dynamic. Instead, he opts for a "Java-lite syntax", as he calls it, to ease the learning curve of those migrating from JavaScript to Java. What a missed opportunity! Now tune in on the discussion at http://kmirror.deskmod.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=14 and read through the thread "This will probably be unpopular, but..." Discomfort with "Java-lite syntax" raises the specter of VBscript, before winding around to x-talk (specifically Revolution). There is collective shrug from the creator of Konfabulator that, er, well, we used JavaScript because it is the scripting language used by Adobe and Macromedia so it should be easier for designer-types. Another missed opportunity! (Move over for a moment, Rich. Rev. Rog is about to take the pulpit.) If x-talk can be integrated with HTML (HTML + CSS + x-talk) and people can come to think outside the browser (nod to Richard), then the plain-language revolution (!) can flourish. -- Roger Kenyon From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Fri Mar 14 23:00:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Fri Mar 14 23:00:01 2003 Subject: Is there a reverse video mode for text in fields? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >The man page for "textstyle" lists a couple of possibilities, but >not inverse video. The keywords "inverse" and "reverse" don't seem >to apply to text. Flip "backgroundcolor" and "foregroundcolor". And don't misspell it "colour". We apologise for the interruption. -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From ambassador at fourthworld.com Fri Mar 14 23:32:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Fri Mar 14 23:32:01 2003 Subject: Ironic [was: Supercard vs. Rev] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Roger Kenyon wrote: > Now tune in on the discussion at > http://kmirror.deskmod.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=14 > and read through the thread "This will probably be unpopular, but..." > > Discomfort with "Java-lite syntax" raises the specter of VBscript, before > winding around to x-talk (specifically Revolution). > > There is collective shrug from the creator of Konfabulator that, er, well, > we used JavaScript because it is the scripting language used by Adobe and > Macromedia so it should be easier for designer-types. > > Another missed opportunity! :: sigh :: That's an interesting thread there. Thanks for posting that. Who's the poster there under the screen name "Noreen"? I don't recall her here, but she seemed very enthusiastic about Rev. It's nice to se the word spreading. > (Move over for a moment, Rich. Rev. Rog is about to take the pulpit.) > > If x-talk can be integrated with HTML (HTML + CSS + x-talk) and people can > come to think outside the browser (nod to Richard), then the plain-language > revolution (!) can flourish. Amen, Brother Roger. Testify! We're partway there with Rev's htmlText and url handling, but there's a ways to go. CSS is a bear to get out of Rev, and harder still to put in. But with XML libraries, built-in CDATA (ISO 8859-1 translation), libURL, and built-in gzip, there are many, many avenues waiting to be explored even now.... -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From pixelbird at interisland.net Fri Mar 14 23:35:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Fri Mar 14 23:35:01 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <200303141701.MAA32766@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 08:19:52 -0800 (PST) > From: Jan Schenkel > Subject: Re: Supercard vs. Rev > I have no > doubt we'll see a solid upgrade emerging soon. > And having been dependent on Microsoft development > tools in the past, I'd rather they take their time to > do it right, not just ship it. ---------- AMEN!! For myself, I have no problem whacking my patience into submission now for the benefit of not having it tried over and over down the road. Remember, SuperCard is not xplatform, so it only has 1/2 the problems to account for, and it's been a long time since the last upgrade. OTOH, I still wish Supercard the best. There's still room at the table. Ken N. From jeanne at runrev.com Fri Mar 14 23:53:01 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Fri Mar 14 23:53:01 2003 Subject: Is there a reverse video mode for text in fields? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: At 5:46 PM -0800 3/14/03, Victor Eijkhout wrote: >The man page for "textstyle" lists a couple of possibilities, but not >inverse video. The keywords "inverse" and "reverse" don't seem to >apply to text. They don't. However, you can set the backgroundColor as well as the foregroundColor for text chunks, so you can do something like this for a reverse video effect: set the backgroundColor of word 3 of field "Stuff" to black set the textColor of word 3 of field "Stuff" to white -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - Software at the Speed of Thought http://www.runrev.com/ From valetia at mac.com Sat Mar 15 03:45:01 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Sat Mar 15 03:45:01 2003 Subject: Checking for an Internet Connection In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi all, What would be a good way to check if a user is currently connected to the Internet, that doesn't rely that specific web sites be online? Valetia From heather at runrev.com Sat Mar 15 06:07:01 2003 From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams) Date: Sat Mar 15 06:07:01 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <200303150454.XAA17041@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > Message: 10 > Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 20:06:58 -0600 > Subject: Re: Supercard vs. Rev > From: Chilton Webb > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > >> Richard Gaskin responded: >> I'm confident that as a long-time xTalker you recognize, as Mark Lucas >> himself has said, that it's valuable for all xTalk products to support >> others in different niches. As long as your question is motivated by a >> sincere interest in using Rev 2.0 I'm sure no one here would accuse >> you of >> being a "jerk". > On list, this is probably true. Off list, I'm sure he's received about > as many flames as I have the few times I've posted anything that puts > Rev in a bad light. Apparently I'm everything from a 'typical Mac > (expletive deleted)', to a SuperCard Bigot. Hopefully he'll make off a > bit better. Hi Chilton. Welcome. If you've been lurking on this list for so long, you must have some idea by now of it's ethos. I have no control over what is said off list. I could wish that everyone would get along in tolerance and harmony, but this is the real world, people have egos, agendas, and opinions, all of which they are entitled to. However, by virtue of being appointed listmom, I do have some control over what is said onlist. This type of personal discussion is definitely not welcome, and not part of the remit of this list. We are here to discuss Revolution. This can encompass discussing other tools, even competing tools, I don't have a problem with that. What I have a problem with is the kind of post that makes personal remarks about people, does not advance the cause of anybody's programming abilities, and is likely to cause a flame war on list. I object to flame wars on list. So please, by all means post to the list. If you have useful comparisons to make with SuperCard, make them. If you have comments on programming style, syntax, the future of xTalk... Great. Personal remarks, please keep off list. > >> Thus far the shift from Rev 1.x to 2.0 is moving faster than SC 3.x to >> 4.0, >> so any problem lies more with Rev's rush to announce ship dates >> prematurely >> than any actual engineering issue. > This is true, but there are fewer underlying issues they're faced with > as well (Raney gets to handle the heavy lifting on the engine), so this > is likely entirely due to making sure the bugs are worked out. Always a > good thing, in my book. This is not entirely an accurate statement. Runtime work very closely with Scott Raney. We have an engineer entirely dedicated to working on the engine. > >>> Chilton Webb said... >>> I believe it's a difference in the demands of the users. Because SC >>> has >>> been around so long, if SC4 shipped with *any* major bugs, it would be >>> seen a major failure on the part of the SuperCard team, so the >>> development cycle for this version was considerably longer than I >>> think >>> anyone hoped it would be. But the finished product was worth the wait. >>> >>> SC's installed user base is not as tolerant of the development team's >>> mistakes as users are on this list. >> Richard Gaskin responded: >> I think you may be underestimating the supportiveness of the SC >> community: >> searching for "bug" in the SC list archives brought up a few hundred >> messages, and the conversations there seemed very friendly and >> supportive of >> Mark Lucas' excellent work. > Yes, but had he shipped SC4 with a bug that crashed everything under > Jaguar, he'd never hear the end of it. Right now, there is not a > shipping version of Revolution that is entirely safe in Jaguar, unless > you can work with the old-style MacOS appearance for things. Which does render it safe under Jaguar. So you can work with that operating system, as well as Windows, Linux and Unix systems. We don't have the luxury of putting one operating system first and making everything perfect only on that one system. That said, 2.0 will eliminate this particular problem. > >> One nice thing about this community is that posts related to other >> tools are >> never filtered out, so sincere posts with information useful to the >> readers >> here are always welcome. > I'd question your use of the word 'welcome' here. This list is just as > bad about flaming people as any other I've been on, the main difference > is that the flames are kept off-list. See remarks above... I guess if someone posts something controversial to the remit of this list, they can expect to get responses to it. All I can do is ensure the war does not take over the function of this list which is, as I said, to discuss Revolution. > Which is probably a good thing. > But I've seen a few Rev users flamed by their own, for lesser things > than pointing out the 4 month slip in the 2.0 release date. Guys. We are as aware as anyone of the slip in release date. We could scarcely have overlooked it. Every morning I field messages in my inbox inquiring about the release date for 2.0. What can I tell you? We will ship 2.0 just as soon as it is finished. You can see from the current beta that we are making progress. 2.0 will be worth the wait. Could we try perhaps for a shift in perception here? Rather than mourning our lost Novembers, could we look forward to a nearly finished major upgrade? Warm regards Heather PS Any flames anyone was thinking of posting in response to this particular thread, by all means send them to me. Personally. NOT TO THE LIST. I have a flameproof suit in my wardrobe, right next the listmom hat. -- Heather Williams Runtime Revolution Ltd. Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought From malte.brill at t-online.de Sat Mar 15 06:39:01 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Sat Mar 15 06:39:01 2003 Subject: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field In-Reply-To: <200303110616.BAA15149@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hi, Sorry for bringing this up again. I have been thinking about this for a while and found a solution that works for me. Hope I don?t bother you with this, so I post a small report on what I did here. If you are interested, I can send you the stack off-list. I created an image in Photoshop Elements. Each bar 14 Pix heigh, 20 bars. Created a fld in rev. Imported the image, grouped it, checked lock location and size for the group, moved group behind field, set the opaque of fld to false. Set the rect of the group to the rect of the field. Set the effective Textheight to 14 pix. Put the following into the card Script: ----------------------------------------------------------------- global loop,correct,twoLines,skipline on opencard put 1 into loop put the effective textHeight of fld "theField"*10 into skipline put the effective textHeight of fld "theField"*2 into twoLines put skipline into correct set the vscroll of fld "theField" to 0 set the vscroll of grp "theImage" to twolines end opencard ------------------------------------------------------------------ Put the following into the script of the field: ------------------------------------------------------------------ global loop,correct,skipline,twolines on scrollbardrag if correct-the vscroll of me<=0 then put loop+1 into loop put loop*skipline into correct end if if the vscroll of me+skipline-correct<0 then put loop-1 into loop put loop*skipline into correct end if put the vscroll of me+skipline-correct+twoLines into groupScroll set the vscroll of grp "theImage" to groupScroll end scrollbardrag ------------------------------------------------------------------- Typed send opencard to this card in the messagebox to initialize. This works pretty well in 1.1.1 even though it needs a bit extra scripting, if you want to set the vscroll of the field via script. It looks a bit cheesy on PreBeta 4. (Seems like in PB4 <= is only treated as < and the = part gets lost.) The fld should not heigher as half the height of the image-2*the effective textheight (as 2 lines are added to get rid of the cheesy vscroll=0 position) I guess all of you allready have a satisfying solution, but I wanted to share this with you. Regards, Malte From valetia at mac.com Sat Mar 15 06:54:00 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Sat Mar 15 06:54:00 2003 Subject: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Malte, > I have been thinking about this for a while and found a solution that works > for me. Hope I don?t bother you with this, so I post a small report on what > I did here. Thanks for sharing this! It's always good to have multiple methods to play with. :-) Valetia From diskot123 at juno.com Sat Mar 15 09:36:04 2003 From: diskot123 at juno.com (Tuviah M Snyder) Date: Sat Mar 15 09:36:04 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev Message-ID: <20030315.093145.1768.4.diskot123@juno.com> >Remember, SuperCard is not xplatform, so it only has 1/2 the problems to >account for, and it's been a long time since the last upgrade. OTOH, I still >wish Supercard the best. There's still room at the table. Well Rev does support Unix. There are also a number of mac technologies such as using QT to display all images that can't be used if it is to remain ' write once, and run anywhere'. At least we are not as bad a Java though, and you don't suffer because of it (ie. lowest common denominator). We are continually adding those platform specific technologies that people need. We are also not at the mercy of any one technology. For example the XML stuff was not implemented using Apple's or Microsoft's new XML parsers but by wrapping classes around a widely available, standard and popular XML library. I don't think it's any wonder that Apple has used KHTML in creating Safari. JavaScript is nice, it's typeless, supports some sort of OOP, but hell to debug with (at least it was 2 years ago). I remember building web sites using it, and saying wow-wee look guys the little image is moving up and down, using a timer! Tuviah Snyder Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development From valetia at mac.com Sat Mar 15 10:28:00 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Sat Mar 15 10:28:00 2003 Subject: Establishing a Secure Connection In-Reply-To: <20030315.093145.1768.4.diskot123@juno.com> Message-ID: Hi all, How do you establish a secure connection over the Internet from within a standalone? Valetia From jhurley at infostations.com Sat Mar 15 11:27:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Sat Mar 15 11:27:01 2003 Subject: RGB triplet for color names In-Reply-To: <200303150454.XAA17041@www.runrev.com> References: <200303150454.XAA17041@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Does anyone know how to get the RGB color triplet for a given color name? For example the Color Names window shows ForestGreen to be 34,139,34 How would I get those numbers programmatically, that is without going through the Color Names window? That is Put theRGB("ForestGreen") into theForestGreenTriplet Or whatever. Much appreciated, Jim From katir at hindu.org Sat Mar 15 13:00:01 2003 From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami) Date: Sat Mar 15 13:00:01 2003 Subject: field text leading-text height In-Reply-To: Message-ID: FYI option to set the field text leading "fixed, height" seems to be missing in the pre-Beta 4 field properties. Also, I know it is not "officially" a button property but I have used the text height property for buttons also and it really helps in getting the text of the button name nicely aligned vertically. Can you add that to button properties? On Tuesday, March 11, 2003, at 03:18 AM, Kevin Miller wrote: > Is up at http://www.runrev.com/revolution/previews/ > > This is the last pre-beta before beta. We have Mac Classic / X and > Windows > built, Linux to follow. > > Kevin > > Kevin Miller > Runtime Revolution Limited: Software at the Speed of Thought > Tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165. Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From jeanne at runrev.com Sat Mar 15 14:56:03 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Sat Mar 15 14:56:03 2003 Subject: RGB triplet for color names In-Reply-To: References: <200303150454.XAA17041@www.runrev.com> <200303150454.XAA17041@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: At 8:25 AM -0800 3/15/03, Jim Hurley wrote: >Does anyone know how to get the RGB color triplet for a given color name? Here's a way that relies on a trick discovered by (if I remember correctly) Ken Ray: function RGBFromColorName theColor if theColor is not a color then return "Error: not a color" -- create a temporary object for the color transformation: create invisible button if the result is not empty then return "Error" set the backgroundColor of last button to theColor -- transform the color using the backgroundPixel trick: set the backgroundPixel of last button to \ the backgroundPixel of last button -- the button's backgroundColor is now RGB: get the backgroundColor of last button delete last button -- don't need the temp object any more -- the create command automatically chose the pointer -- tool, so change it back: send "choose browse tool" to me in 10 milliseconds return it end RGBFromColorName -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - Software at the Speed of Thought http://www.runrev.com/ From alrice at ARCplanning.com Sat Mar 15 14:57:00 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Sat Mar 15 14:57:00 2003 Subject: wondering about widgets Message-ID: I'm curious how Rev displays it's widgets on various platforms. On Mac OS, clearly it has the "Appearance Manager" option which is drawing native widgets. Also the text smoothing is clearly native MacOS stuff. On Mac there's the Emulated Mac OS. Emulated Windows, Emulated UNIX. On Win32- are those native widgets or emulated? On Linux/Unix- are the widgets emulated, or are Rev apps linked with Motif, KDE, GTK or something to draw native widgets? Thanks, Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From sanke at hrz.uni-kassel.de Sat Mar 15 15:11:01 2003 From: sanke at hrz.uni-kassel.de (Wilhelm Sanke) Date: Sat Mar 15 15:11:01 2003 Subject: RGB triplet for color names Message-ID: <3E7388D5.2ABCF1C@hrz.uni-kassel.de> On Sat, 15 Mar 2003 Jim Hurley wrote: > Does anyone know how to get the RGB color triplet for a given color name? > > For example the Color Names window shows ForestGreen to be 34,139,34 > > How would I get those numbers programmatically, that is without going > through the Color Names window? > > That is > > Put theRGB("ForestGreen") into theForestGreenTriplet > > Or whatever. > > Much appreciated, > > Jim > Hallo Jim, You have first to set the backcolor of a - preferably hidden - control to the colorname and then retrieve the RGB value by means of the backpixel property. There was a short discussion on this list about such questions at the beginning of last December. One possibility: Write a "ColorToRGB" handler and create a field "hiddenfield" "on colorToRGB which set the backcolor of fld "hiddenfield" to which get the effective backPixel of fld "hiddenfield" set the backPixel of field "Hiddenfield" to it put the backcolor of fld "Hiddenfield" into anyColorVar end colorToRGB" then use this handler anywhere in your scripts on mouseup ColorToRGB cyan # or whatever colorname you want to convert put anyColorVar" # or do whatever you like with anyColorVar end mouseup If you use both handler in a single script put "local anyColorVar" at the top of the script. If you put the "colorToRGB" handler elsewhere, maybe into the card script, you have of course to declare global variables (Excuse me if I am being redundant here). Regards, Wilhelm Sanke From ambassador at fourthworld.com Sat Mar 15 15:17:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Sat Mar 15 15:17:01 2003 Subject: wondering about widgets In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Alex Rice wrote: > On Mac OS, clearly it has the "Appearance Manager" option which is > drawing native widgets. Also the text smoothing is clearly native MacOS > stuff. On Mac there's the Emulated Mac OS. Emulated Windows, Emulated > UNIX. > > On Win32- are those native widgets or emulated? > > On Linux/Unix- are the widgets emulated, or are Rev apps linked with > Motif, KDE, GTK or something to draw native widgets? Win and Lunix/UNIX are emulated. Win uses the Win95 appearance standards, and Linux/UNIX uses Motif. I'm told that there's an interest in supporting native appearances on Windows XP, but do not know the satus -- Kevin? With the many varied APIs among window managers in UNIX, it seems unlikely Rev will be able to hook into them gracefully until they standardize. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From edutec at sympatico.ca Sat Mar 15 15:36:01 2003 From: edutec at sympatico.ca (edutec) Date: Sat Mar 15 15:36:01 2003 Subject: Thinking Inside-out of the Browser Message-ID: How can I get a web page to display inside a Revolution stack? I can't run a Revolution stack inside a web browser, so I would like to display web pages inside a Rev stack. My inspiration for this is Richard's RevNet and NoteTaker from AquaMinds. You have to try this with NoteTaker to get a sense of the potential power. Using the demo (http://www.aquaminds.com/download.jsp), select File > New, drag and drop any URL, then select View > Web Page Contents. That's it! A live web page running inside NoteTaker. Now imagine a template Rev stack preloaded with network management scripts to make connections, load pages, go back one page, reload current pages, and the like. It could have a console or floating palette for web navigation. Imagine this template stack, just for the moment, like an open book. When the stack is launches, the right side loads a pre-selected live web page. On the left side is the graphical interface for a specific Revolution project. For example, if the project is a tutorial on music, then the left page looks something like the Shakobox.rev stack. The project works by interacting with web pages, FTP, or other net services. The user has instant familiarity of web browsing within a Rev stack and the stack author is able to leverage internet resources to complement the particular project. Thus, one can focus on the content of a project with the relative ease of Transcript without concern for dHTML. That's not only thinking outside the browser, its putting the browser inside the stack. There would be no need for a browser plug in. The stack doesn't plug into a browser; the web page displays into the stack. The stack becomes a browser, albeit simplified. Now back to my original request, how can I get a web page to display inside a Revolution stack? -- Roger Kenyon __________________________________________________________ ThinkLink: http://www.riverwoodpub.com/educatio.htm Not everything is black & white: some things have to be read. From alrice at ARCplanning.com Sat Mar 15 15:49:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Sat Mar 15 15:49:01 2003 Subject: wondering about widgets In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <08E9311A-5727-11D7-9304-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Saturday, March 15, 2003, at 01:13 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote: > Win and Lunix/UNIX are emulated. Win uses the Win95 appearance > standards, > and Linux/UNIX uses Motif. > > I'm told that there's an interest in supporting native appearances on > Windows XP, but do not know the satus -- Kevin? Do you mean emulating whatever Windows theme is selected by the user in WinXP? That sounds cool. If you mean actually linking to the API and doing native widgets on XP- yikes - by the time it's finished, Microsoft will have introduced it's new application frameworks and it will be deprecated. Better to keep it emulated. > With the many varied APIs among window managers in UNIX, it seems > unlikely > Rev will be able to hook into them gracefully until they standardize. Yeah... on the UNIX side it would be good to emulate KDE and GNOME, since those seem to be the two main desktop standards now. A lot of younger UNIX users, Linux users, probably don't even know what Motif is! Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From ambassador at fourthworld.com Sat Mar 15 17:18:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Sat Mar 15 17:18:01 2003 Subject: Thinking Inside-out of the Browser In-Reply-To: Message-ID: edutec wrote: > Now back to my original request, how can I get a web page to display inside > a Revolution stack? Since we're still in the relatively early phase of the Web, so much content is interwoven with form that the task of displaying Web pages is daunting. Only a small handful of organizations have ever attempted it, far fewer have actually shipped, and I believe none of them are full compliant with the W3C standards. Given the many challenges, if the Rev engine attenmpted to do it right they would need a separate staff just for that one component. However, it might be possible to provide hooks for Microsoft's IE object and Apple's HTML Rendering Library to do most of the work (is there acorollary for Mozilla on Linux?), but even that far simpler approach has many challenges, not the least of which would be ensuring that all the required components are installed properly. I'll leave it to Kevin to tell is if or when thsat's on the priority list. In the meantime I've been using the browser as a helper app for displaying Web pages, and use the Rev-based app for everything else. Net-deliverable media seems to be migrating toward what could be called "formless content", initially driven by the demands of wireless handheld devices. SOAP, RDF, RSS, XMSG, WML, SMIL, etc. are relatively simple XML-based content containers, leaving the presentation of the content up to the client device -- in our case, Rev (SMIL is a bit of an exception but since SMIL 1.0 can be easily displayed in a QT player object it's worth mentioning). I'm writing an RSS library, initially designed as part of WebMerge 2.3 but in the interest of the community some form of it will likely be available for free use by Rev developers, along with a newsfeed database and viewer to demomonstrate how to work with the RSS spec (if I get time I'll add a simple RSS generator that will create a summary feed for any site). RSS and other RDF-based formats are a good place to start thinking about ideal scenarios for applying Rev's unique strengths (http, ftp, ISO 8859-1 translation, rapid on-the-fly contruction of objects) and weaknesses (CSS and JavaScript wpould be close to impossible to implement fully in Transcript alone). Lots of good RDF info can be found here: You may also find this intriguing -- note the use of the "card" metaphor: Decks and Cards WML pages are often called "decks". A deck contains a set of cards. A card element can contain text, markup, links, input-fields, tasks, images and more. Cards can be related to each other with links.? :) -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From Revinfo1155 at aol.com Sat Mar 15 18:49:00 2003 From: Revinfo1155 at aol.com (Revinfo1155 at aol.com) Date: Sat Mar 15 18:49:00 2003 Subject: Sounds Message-ID: <1a2.11e59903.2ba5150f@aol.com> I want to experiment with sounds in a stack but don't know where to begin. Does rev have any built-in sounds other than the beep. Where do you get sounds and how do you get them into the stack? Jack -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From monte at sweattechnologies.com Sat Mar 15 20:20:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Sat Mar 15 20:20:01 2003 Subject: RGB triplet for color names In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > > Does anyone know how to get the RGB color triplet for a given color name? > Hello Jim Along with the various sugggestions you have already had you can use my free libColor library. It has one public function: libColor_Convert(pColorReference, pConvertTo, [pConvertFrom]) pConvertFrom is optional as the code can work out what type of color reference you are using. It can convert to and from all of rev's color formats and some others. See sweattechnologies.com/rev for more info. Cheers Monte From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Sat Mar 15 21:54:01 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Sat Mar 15 21:54:01 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0E440672-575A-11D7-8EF5-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> On the Revolution mailing list, on Friday, March 14, 2003, at 06:26 AM, Tim Hart wrote: > So now that Supercard 4 is out. What are your opinions? I was > reading in MacWorld and they kind of made a stab at Rev for waiting so > long to release 2. I have to say it is funny. I mean what is the > hold up. I don't mean to be a jerk but I don't see how they could > possibly miss their original announcement by 4 months of just bug > fixing. What is going on? As always happens when a topic like this comes up, there was some lively debate, a few questions of character, and not much positive result. When this happened on the REALbasic list last year, I posted a couple pages on a wiki server with room for opinion. The result was actually halfway decent, so I've done the same for SuperCard/Revolution. The home page for discussion is at: http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs/revolutionAndSuperCard Right now there isn't much there, but that's the beauty of a wiki: _anyone_ can edit the pages. There is no authorization required, no permission needed. There are two pages linked from the above URL: one for SuperCard's strengths, and another for Revolution's. Feel free to browse, and be sure to click the Edit link and add your two cents. Please be civil. For those unfamiliar with the concept, a wiki is supposed to be a polite commons. We get the respect we give. If you're curious, here's the current state of the Revolution and REALbasic comparison: http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs/revolutionAndRealbasic It could stand an update, especially in light of REALbasic 5.0, so if you know anything on the subject, dig in there as well. regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From kkaufman at snet.net Sat Mar 15 22:03:00 2003 From: kkaufman at snet.net (Kurt Kaufman) Date: Sat Mar 15 22:03:00 2003 Subject: Sounds Message-ID: <4C7D2246-575B-11D7-81F7-0003936D1F12@snet.net> "I want to experiment with sounds in a stack but don't know where to begin. Does rev have any built-in sounds other than the beep. Where do you get sounds and how do you get them into the stack?" See the transcript dictionary entries for "import" and "play". You would import an existing AIFF, WAV or AU type sound file as an audioclip and then play that audioclip. Alternately, you could use the QuickTime player object from which you could reference a sound file (of many more types than just those listed above) external to your stack. If none of the above makes sense to you, first see the "Images and Multimedia" section of the Revolution Development Guide. Kurt From chipp at chipp.com Sat Mar 15 22:20:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (chipp at chipp.com) Date: Sat Mar 15 22:20:01 2003 Subject: Thinking Inside-out of the Browser Message-ID: <4910-22003301631552857@M2W097.mail2web.com> You might want to take a look at LEO. At this time, only for PC's... http://www.altuit.com/webs/leo/leobrowser/default.htm best, Chipp Original Message: ----------------- From: edutec edutec at sympatico.ca Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 15:32:54 -0500 To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com Subject: Thinking Inside-out of the Browser How can I get a web page to display inside a Revolution stack? I can't run a Revolution stack inside a web browser, so I would like to display web pages inside a Rev stack. My inspiration for this is Richard's RevNet and NoteTaker from AquaMinds. You have to try this with NoteTaker to get a sense of the potential power. Using the demo (http://www.aquaminds.com/download.jsp), select File > New, drag and drop any URL, then select View > Web Page Contents. That's it! A live web page running inside NoteTaker. Now imagine a template Rev stack preloaded with network management scripts to make connections, load pages, go back one page, reload current pages, and the like. It could have a console or floating palette for web navigation. Imagine this template stack, just for the moment, like an open book. When the stack is launches, the right side loads a pre-selected live web page. On the left side is the graphical interface for a specific Revolution project. For example, if the project is a tutorial on music, then the left page looks something like the Shakobox.rev stack. The project works by interacting with web pages, FTP, or other net services. The user has instant familiarity of web browsing within a Rev stack and the stack author is able to leverage internet resources to complement the particular project. Thus, one can focus on the content of a project with the relative ease of Transcript without concern for dHTML. That's not only thinking outside the browser, its putting the browser inside the stack. There would be no need for a browser plug in. The stack doesn't plug into a browser; the web page displays into the stack. The stack becomes a browser, albeit simplified. Now back to my original request, how can I get a web page to display inside a Revolution stack? -- Roger Kenyon __________________________________________________________ ThinkLink: http://www.riverwoodpub.com/educatio.htm Not everything is black & white: some things have to be read. _______________________________________________ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution at lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From chilton at tca.net Sat Mar 15 22:38:01 2003 From: chilton at tca.net (Chilton Webb) Date: Sat Mar 15 22:38:01 2003 Subject: [SC] Re: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <0E440672-575A-11D7-8EF5-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> Message-ID: <944B627E-5760-11D7-8060-0003938AEC10@tca.net> Hi Geoff, On Saturday, March 15, 2003, at 08:50 PM, Geoff Canyon wrote: > On the Revolution mailing list, on Friday, March 14, 2003, at 06:26 AM, > Tim Hart wrote: > >> So now that Supercard 4 is out. What are your opinions? I was >> reading in MacWorld and they kind of made a stab at Rev for waiting so >> long to release 2. I have to say it is funny. I mean what is the >> hold up. I don't mean to be a jerk but I don't see how they could >> possibly miss their original announcement by 4 months of just bug >> fixing. What is going on? > > As always happens when a topic like this comes up, there was some > lively debate, a few questions of character, and not much positive > result. When this happened on the REALbasic list last year, I posted a > couple pages on a wiki server with room for opinion. The result was > actually halfway decent, so I've done the same for > SuperCard/Revolution. The home page for discussion is at: > > http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs/revolutionAndSuperCard The problem here is that REALBasic's users became apathetic to this site a few days after it went live, and Revolution's users did not. The arguments became suddenly very one-sided, and still are, to a large degree. Furthermore (due to the nature of Wiki, I assume), entire sections have been erased to cover up how some people feel about the discussion. As of right now, there is no shipping version of Revolution that is fully compatible with Jaguar. That's the OS that I use on all of my systems, and the OS used by all of my clients, and their users. The betas do exist, but they are still betas. And no, expecting Mac users using Jaguar to set Revolution's UI to use OS9's appearance, is NOT acceptable. Once Rev 2.0 actually ships, then this will be a valid discussion. Hey, if it sounds like I'm being unfair, keep in mind that until SC4 actually shipped, the Rev users were saying the same things about the SuperCard betas. I'll be glad to compare shipping products to shipping products, on the current MacOS. It's just that doing so puts Rev in a very unfair place. -Chilton From pixelbird at interisland.net Sat Mar 15 22:49:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sat Mar 15 22:49:01 2003 Subject: Unwanted tool switch In-Reply-To: <200303160321.WAA04211@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hi list The following is a handler which loads an image, but causes the tool to switch from Browse tool to Pointer tool. As you see I even put in a command to switch it to the Browse tool, but it fails to execute, and the thing switches to the Pointer tool anyway. on mouseUp set the defaultFolder to "Doggies" lock screen import paint from file "Brandy1.jpg" set the layer of image "Brandy1.jpg" to 2 unlock screen choose browse tool end mouseUp What should I do? TIA, Ken N. From ambassador at fourthworld.com Sat Mar 15 23:04:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Sat Mar 15 23:04:01 2003 Subject: [SC] Re: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <944B627E-5760-11D7-8060-0003938AEC10@tca.net> Message-ID: Chilton Webb wrote: > Once Rev 2.0 actually ships, then this will be a valid discussion. Hey, > if it sounds like I'm being unfair, keep in mind that until SC4 > actually shipped, the Rev users were saying the same things about the > SuperCard betas. How many of them went to the SC list and made their only post in that community a knock of the host product? The Read Me for SC 4.0.1 also describes "long-standing" crashing bugs. This doesn't mean that Mark Lucas is a slacker, nor does Rev's bugs mean that they are slackers. It simply means that both are software products, and just about all software always has at least a few bugs (and if they have to deal with Apple's schizoid Carbon API, they may have more than a few ). I tried to present an opportunity for us all to continue this discussion on common ground, but thus far your only two posts seem to want to take things in very different direction. I can't remember the last time a disparaging comment was made about SC here..... Meanwhile, I'm using MetaCard and my cross-platform product got the same rating in MacWorld as SC just a month before (March, p45), so clearly any OS X problems are easily fixable as soon as Rev updates their engine. What exactly are you here to contribute? -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From kray at sonsothunder.com Sat Mar 15 23:12:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Sat Mar 15 23:12:01 2003 Subject: [SC] Re: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <944B627E-5760-11D7-8060-0003938AEC10@tca.net> Message-ID: <008901c2eb71$bb790ea0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> > As of right now, there is no shipping version of Revolution that is > fully compatible with Jaguar. That's the OS that I use on all of my > systems, and the OS used by all of my clients, and their users. The > betas do exist, but they are still betas. And no, expecting Mac users > using Jaguar to set Revolution's UI to use OS9's appearance, is NOT > acceptable. > > Once Rev 2.0 actually ships, then this will be a valid > discussion. Hey, > if it sounds like I'm being unfair, keep in mind that until SC4 > actually shipped, the Rev users were saying the same things about the > SuperCard betas. I'll be glad to compare shipping products to > shipping > products, on the current MacOS. It's just that doing so puts Rev in a > very unfair place. True. Keep in mind that the "shipping version" of Revolution is 1.1.1, which is a year old, and based on the 2.4.1 MetaCard engine. There have been a couple of significant upgrades to MetaCard since then (2.4.2 and 2.4.3), along with the 2.5 betas. Rev 2.0 will be based on the latest MC engine (2.5) which brings the solid Jaguar support that MC users have been enjoying since it came out with 2.4.3 and it's Mach-O format. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From pixelbird at interisland.net Sat Mar 15 23:35:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sat Mar 15 23:35:01 2003 Subject: How to switch out background group images In-Reply-To: <200303160321.WAA04211@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Howdy, I have a stack in which part of its UI involves the ability to choose and load a background group image from a set of image files as a preference. The images are designed to register precisely with a set of transparent buttons, and the group set to layer 1. The preference also needs to load a set of corresponding hilite icons for the buttons. The idea is to be able to switch images of the background group and hilite icons. If I use the standalone to open a regular stack, when I update fields or write new cards and then save, it will save the background image group too. I can't figure out how I would clear them and replace them with a different set. The question is, if I use a standalone, how do I do it? Note: One of my ideas was to use the standalone because all we 'd have to do is to check the preference stack data on startup, pull the saved image name and import the image to a bg group. It won't save the image when we close, which is what we want with the images. However, the problem then arises with how to search, load, and update the cards from data stacks. Not very convenient. TIA for any ideas. Ken N. From alrice at ARCplanning.com Sat Mar 15 23:59:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Sat Mar 15 23:59:01 2003 Subject: [SC] Re: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <944B627E-5760-11D7-8060-0003938AEC10@tca.net> Message-ID: <93DE7226-576B-11D7-ABC7-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Chilton, I enjoy reading the insights of you old-school xtalk developers. On Saturday, March 15, 2003, at 08:37 PM, Chilton Webb wrote: > The problem here is that REALBasic's users became apathetic to this > site a few days after it went live, and Revolution's users did not. > The arguments became suddenly very one-sided, and still are, to a > large degree. Furthermore (due to the nature of Wiki, I assume), > entire sections have been erased to cover up how some people feel > about the discussion. The only sections that were erased, that I am aware of (and I didn't do the erasing) was a realbasic user that posted something to the effect of "stup1d l00zers... revolution developers are just too dumb to use any other tool." > As of right now, there is no shipping version of Revolution that is > fully compatible with Jaguar. That's the OS that I use on all of my > systems, and the OS used by all of my clients, and their users. The > betas do exist, but they are still betas. And no, expecting Mac users > using Jaguar to set Revolution's UI to use OS9's appearance, is NOT > acceptable. I don't understand. Do you mean your clients are working with the IDE, or with built apps? If the former, then I can see how it would uncomfortable saying "erm... you have to select mac os emulated each time you launch it, or it will crash". If the latter, IMHO it's not that big of a deal. It has not stopped me from developing in Rev 1.1.1 on OS X, full-time for the last 6 months. I would classify Rev 1.1.1's problems with OS X as minor inconveniences. There are 3 things I'm aware of: 1) Select Mac OS emulated when I launch Rev IDE (for built apps, running Appearance Mgr is fine) 2) Workaround for the shell() command using applescript 3) Rev does not build app bundles, but app bundles are easy to create by hand in the Finder. All in all, Rev is relatively solid for a 1.x product. 'course I'm biased because I'm a recovering realbasic user Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Sun Mar 16 00:09:01 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Sun Mar 16 00:09:01 2003 Subject: [SC] Re: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <944B627E-5760-11D7-8060-0003938AEC10@tca.net> Message-ID: You know, I got the same hostile reaction from some of the REALbasic crowd at the time. Others simply contributed to the wiki. Responses below: On Saturday, March 15, 2003, at 07:37 PM, Chilton Webb wrote: > Hi Geoff, > > On Saturday, March 15, 2003, at 08:50 PM, Geoff Canyon wrote: > >> On the Revolution mailing list, on Friday, March 14, 2003, at 06:26 >> AM, >> Tim Hart wrote: >> >>> So now that Supercard 4 is out. What are your opinions? I was >>> reading in MacWorld and they kind of made a stab at Rev for waiting >>> so >>> long to release 2. I have to say it is funny. I mean what is the >>> hold up. I don't mean to be a jerk but I don't see how they could >>> possibly miss their original announcement by 4 months of just bug >>> fixing. What is going on? >> >> As always happens when a topic like this comes up, there was some >> lively debate, a few questions of character, and not much positive >> result. When this happened on the REALbasic list last year, I posted a >> couple pages on a wiki server with room for opinion. The result was >> actually halfway decent, so I've done the same for >> SuperCard/Revolution. The home page for discussion is at: >> >> http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs/revolutionAndSuperCard > > The problem here is that REALBasic's users became apathetic to this > site a few days after it went live, and Revolution's users did not. > The arguments became suddenly very one-sided, and still are, to a > large degree. Furthermore (due to the nature of Wiki, I assume), > entire sections have been erased to cover up how some people feel > about the discussion. It's funny that you say this. The entire history of both pages, complete with dates and diff files, is available right there. Unless you are accusing me of manipulating the server directly, the entire content of _every_ post to those pages is available right now to anyone who cares to look. All I ever did was remove the "REALbasic SUX!" entries. If you find a place where I or anyone removed "entire sections," then put it back ;-) I can't help the importance people placed on the debate. There was a firestorm on the RB list, and it wasn't the first I had seen, so I put up the pages, so that maybe the next time people could just send a questioner to the wiki and be done with it. I have never posted to either list to remind people to update the wiki. Until now, that is. I considered cross posting this to the REALbasic NUG as well, but it seemed too off-topic for them. The next time someone brings up Rev on the RB list if I catch it, I'll point out the wiki pages. If you feel the RB crowd needs to be reminded now, then post to the RB NUG to do so. > > As of right now, there is no shipping version of Revolution that is > fully compatible with Jaguar. That's the OS that I use on all of my > systems, and the OS used by all of my clients, and their users. The > betas do exist, but they are still betas. And no, expecting Mac users > using Jaguar to set Revolution's UI to use OS9's appearance, is NOT > acceptable. Fine, post that to the wiki. That's what it's for. Posting to the mailing lists means that someone who shows up tomorrow never sees it. > > Once Rev 2.0 actually ships, then this will be a valid discussion. > Hey, if it sounds like I'm being unfair, keep in mind that until SC4 > actually shipped, the Rev users were saying the same things about the > SuperCard betas. I'll be glad to compare shipping products to shipping > products, on the current MacOS. It's just that doing so puts Rev in a > very unfair place. How is posting this to the mailing list any better? Either way, you're saying that when comparing shipping versions, Rev is inferior. You're entitled to your opinion, and there's no reason not to put it on the wiki where people have the ability to respond directly instead of through a thread. regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From curry at pair.com Sun Mar 16 01:00:01 2003 From: curry at pair.com (curry) Date: Sun Mar 16 01:00:01 2003 Subject: Rev math In-Reply-To: <200303160322.WAA04313@www.runrev.com> References: <200303160322.WAA04313@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Rather than rounding off neatly, it seems that the end of calculations in Revolution that exceed the limit cannot be trusted after a certain digit. For example, try in the message box: 22222222222222222222+1 (That's twenty two's before the +1) From trying it out with some operations, it looks like about 16 digits (whole or decimal) can be trusted. Using the 16th digit as a rounder, that would mean 15 digits usable answer. My question is, can we trust about that number of digits for all types of calculations? And are there any plans to change the way Revolution handles this? Thanks, Curry From jiml at netrin.com Sun Mar 16 01:12:00 2003 From: jiml at netrin.com (Jim Lambert) Date: Sun Mar 16 01:12:00 2003 Subject: Thinking Inside-out of the Browser In-Reply-To: <200303160322.WAA04313@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: This relates to the question Bradley Borch recently asked, "Does Rev support ActiveX controls? " The answer is no. As Jan Schenkel once wrote, "one of the key things should be to avoid the ActiveX nightmare and keep things as open and portable amongst platforms as possible." Macromedia's Director provides half-*ssed support of ActiveX on Windows. I've sucessfully embedded IE, RealPlayer and WindowsMediaPlayer this way. There are 3rd-party XTRAs (kinda like our XCMDs) that let you embed a browser into Win or Mac Director EXEs. Some clever coder could probably write a Rev external that acted as a shim between Rev and ActiveX controls. Of course, your app would then be Windows, but if that's all you need... If Rev's HTML renderer were just a teensy bit more compliant it'd be fine for displaying simple webpages that had to do double duty - say, within a Rev app and on a site. That'd work on any platform and be somewhat like a basic browser within Rev. Frankly, I'd rather see Rev inside a browser a la shockwave or flash. Jim Lambert From jeanne at runrev.com Sun Mar 16 03:19:01 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Sun Mar 16 03:19:01 2003 Subject: Unwanted tool switch In-Reply-To: References: <200303160321.WAA04211@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: At 4:54 PM -0800 3/15/03, Ken Norris wrote: >The following is a handler which loads an image, but causes the tool to >switch from Browse tool to Pointer tool. As you see I even put in a command >to switch it to the Browse tool, but it fails to execute, and the thing >switches to the Pointer tool anyway. Replace the line choose browse tool with send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds and it should work. -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - Software at the Speed of Thought http://www.runrev.com/ From carette.pierre-marie at wanadoo.fr Sun Mar 16 03:49:01 2003 From: carette.pierre-marie at wanadoo.fr (Pierre-Marie CARETTE) Date: Sun Mar 16 03:49:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1203 - 13 msgs In-Reply-To: <200303160323.WAA04351@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <8A93312E-578B-11D7-9B97-003065A335E6@wanadoo.fr> bonjour !! From mcdomi at free.fr Sun Mar 16 06:03:01 2003 From: mcdomi at free.fr (Domi) Date: Sun Mar 16 06:03:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1203 - 13 msgs In-Reply-To: <8A93312E-578B-11D7-9B97-003065A335E6@wanadoo.fr> Message-ID: <1frwv82.1gt0w3v1r799kwM%mcdomi@free.fr> > bonjour !! ben, salut, coco !!! -- comment ?a va par chez toi ? From wmb at internettrainer.com Sun Mar 16 06:29:00 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Sun Mar 16 06:29:00 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Friday, Mar 14, 2003, at 21:09 Europe/Vienna, Richard Gaskin wrote: > My Rev-based product also got a 4.5-mouse review in that magazine just > a > month earlier, so I read it with great enthusiasm. If its existing product, what I know becaus its really great... than it must have been build with 1.1.1 So I have some questions..: Is it really revbased, revmade, and revbuild...? Or revbased, MCmade, and(!)MC-build...? Or maybee revbased, revmade, and(!)MC-build...? ... regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From wmb at internettrainer.com Sun Mar 16 07:26:01 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Sun Mar 16 07:26:01 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Friday, Mar 14, 2003, at 21:09 Europe/Vienna, Richard Gaskin wrote: > My Rev-based product also got a 4.5-mouse review in that magazine just > a > month earlier, so I read it with great enthusiasm. If its existing product, what I know becaus its really great... than it must have been build with 1.1.1 So I have some questions..: Is it really revbased, revmade, and revbuild...? Or revbased, MCmade, and(!)MC-build...? Or maybee revbased, revmade, and(!)MC-build...? ... regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From janschenkel at yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 07:43:10 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Sun Mar 16 07:43:10 2003 Subject: Does Send To Program Work? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030316123941.58860.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> --- Rob Cozens wrote: > Hi All, > > I'd like to hear from one person who can confirm > that "send .. to > program" works. > > Scenario: > > I start a RunRev standalone, "IPC_Server". > > I start RunRev on the same computer. > > From the message box I type 'send "Quit" to program > "IPC_Server"' > result: no such program > > I launch clip2Gif and type 'send "Quit" to program > "clip2Gif"' > result: no such program > > Again from the message box, 'send "Quit" to program > "Finder"' > result: got error -1702 when sending apple event > [1702 = invald data] > > Mac OS 9, RR v1.5A7 > -- > > Rob Cozens Hi Rob, It took me a while to test various combinations, but here are my conclusions for RunRev 1.1.1: 1) 'send to program ... with reply' - problem: results in an error upon execution - solution: omit the optional 'with result' clause - note: 'without reply' doesn't result in an error 2) 'answer program' doesn't work in MC/RR - known issue, due to limitations in the Carbon API - solution: do "choose application" as AppleScript - note: would still be handy if it were included 2) 'send to program' on the same machine works, but 'send to program' where the program is on a remote machine doesn't work - i tried it on a variation of machines, but the error is always "no such program" - solution: AppleScript to the rescue ! there is a little-known method of sending 'raw' apple events from within AppleScript, so the trick is to wrap it as an AppleScript of the form: tell application "Foo" of machine "Bar" <> "Hello there!" & return end tell in which << and >> are to be replacd by their single-char equivalents for MacOS (ASCII- 199 and 200). So here's a sample code that works : on SelectProgramAndSendAE pAEclass, pAEid, pAEdata do "choose application" as AppleScript put the result into tResult if tResult is "execution error" then return "Cancel" else put tResult into tProgram -- looks like: application "Foo" of machine "Bar" put "tell" && tProgram & return into tAScript put numToChar(199) & "event" && pAEclass & pAEid \ & numToChar(200) && pAEdata && "& return" & \ return after tAScript put "end tell" & return after tAScript do tAScript as AppleScript return the result end SelectProgramAndSendAE - note: this was very messy to debug, and I crashed my iBook several times before I got it right. - warning: if the application on the other side is a RunRev-built one, make sure you 'pass' any AppleEvent message that you don't handle with a 'reply', or you risk freezing up the client-side computer. I also tested the same code with pre-beta 4, with equal results. So in conclusion: yes, this is a definite bug, and I don't like the workaround, but at least there is one. Scott or Kevin, could this be fixed for MetaCard 2.5 / RunRev 2.0? Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From mike at cyber-ny.com Sun Mar 16 08:58:00 2003 From: mike at cyber-ny.com (Mike Brown) Date: Sun Mar 16 08:58:00 2003 Subject: Sounds In-Reply-To: <4C7D2246-575B-11D7-81F7-0003936D1F12@snet.net> Message-ID: Jack, If you are looking for sound files to use for testing, go to this search site: http://www.findsounds.com/ You can search for free sound files in several formats including AIFF and WAV. Best, Mike Mike Brown Cyber-NY Interactive 212-475-2721 1-888-70-CYBER mike at cyber-ny.com On 3/15/03 9:59 PM, wrote: > "I want to experiment with sounds in a stack but don't know where to > begin. > Does rev have any built-in sounds other than the beep. Where do you get > sounds and how do you get them into the stack?" > From jhurley at infostations.com Sun Mar 16 09:41:00 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Sun Mar 16 09:41:00 2003 Subject: RGB triplet for color names In-Reply-To: <200303160322.WAA04313@www.runrev.com> References: <200303160322.WAA04313@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Much thanks to Jeanne, Wilhelm, and Monte for their solutions to my "Color name" to "RGB" numbers, question. I am especially grateful that you went the extra mile to provide specific code, and even an entire library! An ounce of code is worth a pound of narrative. Jim From rcozens at pon.net Sun Mar 16 09:55:02 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Sun Mar 16 09:55:02 2003 Subject: Does Send To Program Work? In-Reply-To: <20030316123941.58860.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030316123941.58860.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: >It took me a while to test various combinations, but >here are my conclusions for RunRev 1.1.1: Jan, et al: I have not tested this extensively in 2.0b4; but send to program from the message box still gives errors. So we seem to have reached the same conclusion: send to program does NOT work correctly. -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From dsc at swcp.com Sun Mar 16 10:18:01 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Sun Mar 16 10:18:01 2003 Subject: Rev math In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Saturday, March 15, 2003, at 10:54 PM, curry wrote: > From trying it out with some operations, it looks like about 16 digits > (whole or decimal) can be trusted. Using the 16th digit as a rounder, > that would mean 15 digits usable answer. > > My question is, can we trust about that number of digits for all types > of calculations? Yes. Use 14. (49 bits floating point) Use less if you need exact equality. In many cases one can think of all values except arrays as strings. However, when you press limits like this, that may not be sufficient. The result of arithmetic is stored internally as floating point. It is still floating point when used in subsequent arithmetic, but a copy converted to a string is used in non-arithmetic operations. A consequence is that you may also lose digits when a number is converted to string based on the numberFormat property. This happens when an operation needs a string. This includes concatenation (&) as well as a few operations that you might not realize are converting (such as send). You might also see some interesting rounding in some arithmetic. This is because the rounding is based on a binary point. This is mitigated somewhat with a (standard) laxness in numerical equality. However, that laxness may also cause surprises. Note that in some operations (such as base conversion and in bit-logical operations, I think), you are limited to 31 or 32 bits. > And are there any plans to change the way Revolution handles this? I have no inside knowledge of this, so my comment is pure speculation. I do not expect this will change any time soon. One reason is the natural inertia of such things. It works just fine for people who use Rev arithmetic, a group self-selected because the arithmetic does what they want. Another is compatible semantics among platforms; this is implemented using hardware (where I have used it) and the change (advance) should work across the primary platforms. There are three directions a change might occur. The simplest is simply more precision. I think this most likely should a change occur. I wouldn't be surprised if representation changed from 8 byte fp to 16 byte fp in the next five years. The second is the use of a decimal point. This is not likely to occur if it involves a decrease in precision or a multifold decrease in speed. (It is commonly assumed that this requires a decimal internal representation such as BCD; this is not true.) The third is a paradigm shift such as indefinite precision. I doubt this will occur. Since you can safely work with a 12 digit integer (say), you can use that as a building block to build other types of numbers. I would do this rather than wait for a change. Dar Scott From rcozens at pon.net Sun Mar 16 11:16:07 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Sun Mar 16 11:16:07 2003 Subject: [X post]Re: Does Send To Program Work? Message-ID: >send to program does NOT work correctly. In addition to "program does not exist" errors, I occasionally get errors -1702 (data in an Apple event could not be read) or -1708 (event wasn't handled by an Apple event handler). Perhaps RR or the MC engine (or moi?) isn't formatting the AEs correctly? -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From rogerguay at centurytel.net Sun Mar 16 13:17:03 2003 From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay) Date: Sun Mar 16 13:17:03 2003 Subject: Launch command In-Reply-To: <200303150454.XAA17027@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <13372FFA-57DB-11D7-9CCD-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Thanks for your reply, Richard. I get a false when I type "put exists("/Hard Disk/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit")" into the message box, yet I know that It's in there. I also tried "put exists("/Macintosh HD/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit")" since that is the tittle of my hard drive, but to no avail. Any ideas? Thanks, Roger On Friday, March 14, 2003, at 08:54 PM, use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote: > Message: 6 > Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 17:22:45 -0800 > Subject: Re: Some help, please! > From: Richard Gaskin > To: > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > Roger Guay wrote: > >> if the CommandKey is down then >> set the defaultFolder to "/Hard Disk/Applications/GetIt" >> Launch "TextEdit" >> end if >> >> also, if I try "Launch "TextEdit"" in the message box, I get an error >> -43. > > Err -43is "file not found" > > Try this in the Message Box: > > put exists("/Hard Disk/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit") > > > -- > Richard Gaskin > Fourth World Media Corporation > Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site > ___________________________________________________________ From ttasovac at princeton.edu Sun Mar 16 13:47:01 2003 From: ttasovac at princeton.edu (Toma Tasovac) Date: Sun Mar 16 13:47:01 2003 Subject: Launch command In-Reply-To: <13372FFA-57DB-11D7-9CCD-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Message-ID: on my system: launch "/HD/Applications/TextEdit" will result in error -43 launch "/HD/Application/TextEdit.app" will launch it correctly but put exists will result in false with both TextEdit and TextEdit.app strange, eh? in any case, if your goal is to launch TextEdit, just add .app (I missed your first posting, so I'm not sure if that's what you were looking for...) Toma On Sunday, March 16, 2003, at 07:14 PM, Roger Guay wrote: >> put exists("/Hard Disk/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit") From raney at metacard.com Sun Mar 16 14:09:01 2003 From: raney at metacard.com (Scott Raney) Date: Sun Mar 16 14:09:01 2003 Subject: [SC] Re: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <200303161227.HAA19062@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 15 Mar 2003 Chilton Webb wrote: (snip) > Once Rev 2.0 actually ships, then this will be a valid discussion. At least on the RR mailing list. As for the SC mailing list, posts that mention competing products are specifically prohibited by the list owner (who has censored my posts to that list on more than one occasion), even when their purpose is to correct misinformation posted by other people. Regards, Scott > -Chilton ******************************************************** Scott Raney raney at metacard.com http://www.metacard.com MetaCard: You know, there's an easier way to do that... From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk Sun Mar 16 14:15:00 2003 From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg) Date: Sun Mar 16 14:15:00 2003 Subject: Launch command In-Reply-To: <13372FFA-57DB-11D7-9CCD-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> References: <13372FFA-57DB-11D7-9CCD-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Message-ID: At 10:14 am -0800 16/3/03, Roger Guay wrote: >Thanks for your reply, Richard. I get a false when I type "put >exists("/Hard Disk/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit")" into the message >box, yet I know that It's in there. I also tried "put >exists("/Macintosh HD/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit")" since that is >the tittle of my hard drive, but to no avail. Any ideas? What happens with this? launch "/Macintosh HD/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit.app" Cheers Dave From xslaugh at hotmail.com Sun Mar 16 14:20:01 2003 From: xslaugh at hotmail.com (Scott Slaugh) Date: Sun Mar 16 14:20:01 2003 Subject: Does Send To Program Work? Message-ID: >>It took me a while to test various combinations, but >>here are my conclusions for RunRev 1.1.1: > >Jan, et al: > >I have not tested this extensively in 2.0b4; but send to program from the >message box still gives errors. So we seem to have reached the same >conclusion: send to program does NOT work correctly. Back when Rev was first in public beta (1.0), I tried using the send to program command to connect to a remote computer. I couldn't get Rev to send messages, but it did correctly receive messages that I sent it from HyperCard. I came to the conclusion that there is some problem in the message sending routine, but that the message receiving routine is fine. Scott Slaugh _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From bornstein at designeq.com Sun Mar 16 15:05:01 2003 From: bornstein at designeq.com (Howard Bornstein) Date: Sun Mar 16 15:05:01 2003 Subject: Can't add file extension in Windows Message-ID: <200303162001.h2GK1L67019560@ms-smtp-01.nyroc.rr.com> I'm running into a baffling problem when trying to export a jpeg file under Windows XP. I explicitly name the file with a ".jpg" extension, but the dot never appears in the filename. Here's the code: put the short name of image 1 into imageName put ".jpg" after imagename ask file "Save the chart as..." with gGraphDefaultFolder&"/"&imagename with filter "JPEG file,*.jpg" Let's say that imagename="NewChart". The filename that appears in the directory save box is "NewChartjpg" However, if I put this statement directly following the Ask File statement: put gGraphDefaultFolder&"/"&imagename It prints out "/NewChart.jpg" Why is the period being deleted from the filename in the Save dialog box? This works fine under the Mac OS, btw. ***New test*** OK, this is good. It turns out that if I add a period at the end of the filename (e.g. "NewChart.jpg." then the filename appears correctly in the Save dialog box ("NewChart.jpg"). The final period is dropped and the extension shows up correctly. On the Mac, the extra dot does appear. So, I can code around this, but my intuition is that this should work the same across platforms. Anyone have an idea what is going on? Thanks, Howard Bornstein ____________________ D E S I G N E Q www.designeq.com From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Sun Mar 16 15:08:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Sun Mar 16 15:08:01 2003 Subject: Unwanted tool switch In-Reply-To: References: <200303160321.WAA04211@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds Actually, right now I have a stack where I put this after a "clone" command, and it still switches to point mode in the sense the arrow becomes active in the tools palet, however Rev stays in browse mode. Really bizarre. A better solution is to put "lock messages" / "unlock messages" around the new/clone/whatever command. At least, *I* found this a better solution. There may be side effects that I simply haven't run into. -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Sun Mar 16 15:09:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Sun Mar 16 15:09:01 2003 Subject: Rev math In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >There are three directions a change might occur. The simplest is >simply more precision. I think this most likely should a change >occur. I wouldn't be surprised if representation changed from 8 >byte fp to 16 byte fp in the next five years. The second is the use >of a decimal point. This is not likely to occur if it involves a >decrease in precision or a multifold decrease in speed. (It is >commonly assumed that this requires a decimal internal >representation such as BCD; this is not true.) The third is a >paradigm shift such as indefinite precision. I doubt this will >occur. Actually, there are packages for infinite precision that rr could simply link to (doesn't the Gnu Scientific Library have it?). My guess is that that would be easier than doubling hte precision. Given that we are already using double precision, do chips have native instructions for quad precision? It could be that that would be quite hard to add. -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From dsc at swcp.com Sun Mar 16 15:41:01 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Sun Mar 16 15:41:01 2003 Subject: Rev math In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1D835628-57EF-11D7-947A-000A9567A3E6@swcp.com> On Sunday, March 16, 2003, at 01:03 PM, Victor Eijkhout wrote: > Actually, there are packages for infinite precision that rr could > simply link to (doesn't the Gnu Scientific Library have it?). Do you mean math externals? Building externals may be the best way to go. I wouldn't remove scripted functions from the options yet, if one is experimenting with fancy arithmetic. Or hybrids. Do you mean a change in underlying Revolution arithmetic? I think implementation is the least of the problems with such a change. > My guess is that that would be easier than doubling hte precision. > Given that we are already using double precision, do chips have native > instructions for quad precision? It could be that that would be quite > hard to add. My wild guess is that either hardware arithmetic or general hardware performance might make this attractive within five years. By saying "wouldn't be surprised" I don't intend this to be a strong statement. I think it more likely than decimal point arithmetic, which I would rather see. Dar Scott From chipp at chipp.com Sun Mar 16 16:13:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (chipp at chipp.com) Date: Sun Mar 16 16:13:01 2003 Subject: [SC] Re: Supercard vs. Rev Message-ID: <48270-22003301621923131@M2W034.mail2web.com> Chilton, I was a SuperCard beta tester for version 1.0. I knew all those guys, Charlie Jackson, Chris Watson, Bill Applegate, Stuart Henigson and really enjoyed using the program. Unfortunately, in 96, because of client demands, we started using PC's (the MAC CD-ROM market was too small) and had to switch to a different development environment. I've always thought SC a fine product -- and have had many off-list discussions about it with folks like Ken Ray and Richard Gaskin. I've been using RR for well over a year now, and frankly, I can't remember one SC bashing comment on this list during that time. Course, I'm not monitoring the SC list (I assume there is one), and if I were, I sure wouldn't be trying to bash them. I think all of these tools deserve as much support as possible! It's not a big market -- and no one I know of has gotten rich selling development tools ;-) -Chipp Chilton writes: "Once Rev 2.0 actually ships, then this will be a valid discussion. Hey, if it sounds like I'm being unfair, keep in mind that until SC4 actually shipped, the Rev users were saying the same things about the SuperCard betas. I'll be glad to compare shipping products to shipping products, on the current MacOS. It's just that doing so puts Rev in a very unfair place. -Chilton" _______________________________________________ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution at lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From kray at sonsothunder.com Sun Mar 16 16:33:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Sun Mar 16 16:33:01 2003 Subject: Can't add file extension in Windows In-Reply-To: <200303162001.h2GK1L67019560@ms-smtp-01.nyroc.rr.com> Message-ID: <00ca01c2ec03$1b991730$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Good question... I ran your code below (using "the directory" for gGraphDefaultFolder) and it worked fine for me. Perhaps it's an OS issue? What Windows version are you experiencing this on? Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > Howard Bornstein > Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 2:02 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Can't add file extension in Windows > > > I'm running into a baffling problem when trying to export a jpeg file > under Windows XP. I explicitly name the file with a ".jpg" > extension, but > the dot never appears in the filename. > > Here's the code: > > put the short name of image 1 into imageName > > put ".jpg" after imagename > > ask file "Save the chart as..." with > gGraphDefaultFolder&"/"&imagename > with filter "JPEG file,*.jpg" > > > Let's say that imagename="NewChart". The filename that appears in the > directory save box is "NewChartjpg" > > However, if I put this statement directly following the Ask File > statement: > > put gGraphDefaultFolder&"/"&imagename > > It prints out "/NewChart.jpg" > > Why is the period being deleted from the filename in the Save > dialog box? > This works fine under the Mac OS, btw. > > ***New test*** > > OK, this is good. It turns out that if I add a period at the > end of the > filename (e.g. "NewChart.jpg." then the filename appears > correctly in the > Save dialog box ("NewChart.jpg"). The final period is dropped and the > extension shows up correctly. On the Mac, the extra dot does > appear. So, > I can code around this, but my intuition is that this should work the > same across platforms. Anyone have an idea what is going on? > > Thanks, > > Howard Bornstein > ____________________ > D E S I G N E Q > www.designeq.com _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From janschenkel at yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 16:37:00 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Sun Mar 16 16:37:00 2003 Subject: Unwanted tool switch In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030316213338.40873.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com> --- Victor Eijkhout wrote: > > send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 > milliseconds > > Actually, right now I have a stack where I put this > after a "clone" > command, and it still switches to point mode in the > sense the arrow > becomes active in the tools palet, however Rev stays > in browse mode. > Really bizarre. > > A better solution is to put "lock messages" / > "unlock messages" > around the new/clone/whatever command. > > At least, *I* found this a better solution. There > may be side effects > that I simply haven't run into. > -- > Victor Eijkhout Hi Victor, RunRev traps the newCard, newButton, etc. messages for a few reasons: to set default rectangle and similar properties (if you just click, instead of dragging a rectangle), and to update its properties palette, the application browser, and the like. So the only 'real' side-effect would be that these don't get an update. However, that shouldn't be life-threatening ;-) Jan Shcnekel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au Sun Mar 16 16:55:01 2003 From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan) Date: Sun Mar 16 16:55:01 2003 Subject: [SC] Re: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <200303161227.HAA19029@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <8626732F-57F9-11D7-BB67-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au> On Sunday, Mar 16, 2003, at 23:27 Australia/Sydney, Chilton Webb wrote: > And no, expecting Mac users using Jaguar to set Revolution's UI to use > OS9's appearance, is NOT acceptable. Chilton, I presume you were not attempting to be a little deceptive so I take it the above simply represents an error or unfamiliarity with Rev. You can correct your comment by changing "users" to "developers", because users are unaffected, using Appearance Manager under Rev with no problems at all. For completeness you should also add a reference to yourself after "unacceptable" as I appear to be only one of very many Jaguar users who have found Revolution quite acceptable ever since Jaguar emerged. That it is open to improvement is, in my humble but rather extensive experience, not unique to this software, which on balance serves me more effectively and more pleasantly than do its principal competitors. regards David > > -Chilton From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 16 16:57:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 16 16:57:00 2003 Subject: Unwanted tool switch In-Reply-To: <200303161227.HAA19048@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 00:11:30 -0800 > From: "Jeanne A. E. DeVoto" > Subject: Re: Unwanted tool switch > > At 4:54 PM -0800 3/15/03, Ken Norris wrote: >> The following is a handler which loads an image, but causes the tool to >> switch from Browse tool to Pointer tool. As you see I even put in a command >> to switch it to the Browse tool, but it fails to execute, and the thing >> switches to the Pointer tool anyway. > > Replace the line > > choose browse tool > > with > > send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds ---------- OK, thanks. Yes it works, but I need to understand it. Why must I use this command, and why 20 milliseconds as opposed to 5 millisecionds or 40 mmilliseconds? Ken N. From jeanne at runrev.com Sun Mar 16 17:25:01 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Sun Mar 16 17:25:01 2003 Subject: Unwanted tool switch In-Reply-To: References: <200303161227.HAA19048@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: At 11:02 AM -0800 3/16/03, Ken Norris wrote: >> send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds >---------- >OK, thanks. Yes it works, but I need to understand it. > >Why must I use this command, and why 20 milliseconds as opposed to 5 >millisecionds or 40 mmilliseconds? 20 milliseconds is arbitrary. (Too-short times don't seem to work on slower machines.) As for why you need to delay the command instead of just writing "choose browse tool", this is a workaround to a "nuance" of Rev. I'm not sure exactly what causes the simple choose command to fail under these circumstances. -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - Software at the Speed of Thought http://www.runrev.com/ From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 16 18:42:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 16 18:42:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1205 - 6 msgs In-Reply-To: <200303161701.MAA24501@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 08:55:16 -0500 > Subject: Re: Sounds > From: Mike Brown > > Jack, > > If you are looking for sound files to use for testing, go to this search > site: > > http://www.findsounds.com/ ---------- Also, the Pan recently uploaded a bunch of sounds, but they're for Macs and may need to be converted: Ken N. From jhurley at infostations.com Sun Mar 16 19:02:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Sun Mar 16 19:02:01 2003 Subject: Unwanted tool switch In-Reply-To: <200303162226.RAA01176@www.runrev.com> References: <200303162226.RAA01176@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > >At 11:02 AM -0800 3/16/03, Ken Norris wrote: >>> send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds >>---------- >>OK, thanks. Yes it works, but I need to understand it. >> >>Why must I use this command, and why 20 milliseconds as opposed to 5 >>millisecionds or 40 mmilliseconds? > >20 milliseconds is arbitrary. (Too-short times don't seem to work on slower >machines.) > >As for why you need to delay the command instead of just writing "choose >browse tool", this is a workaround to a "nuance" of Rev. I'm not sure >exactly what causes the simple choose command to fail under these >circumstances. > Ken, The only time I have had this problem and had to resort to "send .... in 10 millisecond" was after a "create" command (create field,or button or graphic or whatever) or in effect creating an image by importing an image file. Otherwise a simple "choose the browse tool" works. This will surely go away in 2.0 ' Jim From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 16 20:14:02 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 16 20:14:02 2003 Subject: Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files In-Reply-To: <200303161227.HAA19048@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Howdy, Note: I didn't get any response so I'll repost (same with the last time I tried to find answers about this problem). BTW, it seems that others who have questions on these types of subjects don't get answers either. The problems with external file referencing, data stacks, images, etc., with respect to manipulation of stack content seems to get very little response. I've been fighting with how to deal with this for weeks. At this point I'll take any advice, from sage absolutism to wild guesses ;+) I'm going to rewrite what I want to do: 1) Use a standalone as a UI with external data stacks, image resource, and sound resource files. 2) Be able to load the standalone UI with images and sounds into background groups from available files, via a Preferences stack where the current file names are stored. 3) Be able to switch the bg group images and sound prefs from the Preferences stack and have them immediately changed in the standalone UI (and automatically saved to the Prefs stack). 4) Be able to either: a) Load a data stack into the standalone UI somehow, and be able to search, manipulate, and update any of the card info, then save it back to the data stack in updated condition (with an option for backup copies). or.. b) Search, manipiulate, and update the data stack by _remote control_ (the hard part) from the standalone UI, and save the altered data stack normally. How do I do it? TIA, Ken N. From rogerguay at centurytel.net Sun Mar 16 20:30:01 2003 From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay) Date: Sun Mar 16 20:30:01 2003 Subject: Launch Command Message-ID: <81B77373-5817-11D7-8EBA-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Thanks to all for your prompt reply, but nothing works! I've tried: Launch "/Hard Disk/Applications/TextEdit.app" Launch "/HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" Launch "/Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" Launch "/Macintosh HD/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit.app" Launch "/HD/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit.app" Launch "/Hard Disk/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit.app" I have assured myself that I do have a copy of TextEdit in the Aplications folder. I then tried putting a copy of TextEdit on the desktop and one in the RunRev application Folder and tried: Launch "TextEdit.app" Nothing works. Bummer!!! Any other suggestions? Cheers, Roger From bvg at mac.com Sun Mar 16 20:39:00 2003 From: bvg at mac.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?=) Date: Sun Mar 16 20:39:00 2003 Subject: Launch Command In-Reply-To: <81B77373-5817-11D7-8EBA-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Message-ID: launch "/applications/textedit.app" this works for me On Montag, M?r 17, 2003, at 02:26 Europe/Zurich, Roger Guay wrote: > Thanks to all for your prompt reply, but nothing works! I've tried: > > Launch "/Hard Disk/Applications/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/Macintosh HD/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/HD/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/Hard Disk/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit.app" > > I have assured myself that I do have a copy of TextEdit in the > Aplications folder. I then tried putting a copy of TextEdit on the > desktop and one in the RunRev application Folder and tried: > > Launch "TextEdit.app" > > Nothing works. Bummer!!! Any other suggestions? > > Cheers, Roger > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Sun Mar 16 20:46:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Sun Mar 16 20:46:01 2003 Subject: Bug or feature? or: Don't I love the mechanics of expansion Message-ID: This bug took me an hour or two to find. I don't think I like it. on tt arg put arg end tt on t set the aaa of me to "a" put 1 into a send "tt" && the aaa of me to me end t Guess what the outcome of `send "t" to field "whatever" is... Reading the man page for "send". It says (I couldn't manage to cut/paste from the dictionary. is that possible?) "If the message is more than one word, it must be enclosed in double quotes". That is clearly not true in the above case. It also says "Any parameters are evaluted", giving as example. That is less than the whole truth: based on this I would write which of course is completely incorrect. Anyway, solution: send "tt" && quote & the aaa of me & quote I guess the correct statement would be "send expr to : the "expr" is an expression that yields a string of the form "command arg1,arg2,...". The "argn" expressions are evaluated in the corrent context, and the resulting command is sent to the whatever handler." Ok, quiz time: what is the output of on t arg1,arg2 put arg1 end t on tt set the aa of me to 3,4 send "t" && the aa of me to me end tt (I guess, for clarity, another clause is could be added in the above definition.) -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Sun Mar 16 20:50:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Sun Mar 16 20:50:01 2003 Subject: Launch Command In-Reply-To: <81B77373-5817-11D7-8EBA-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> References: <81B77373-5817-11D7-8EBA-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Message-ID: >Thanks to all for your prompt reply, but nothing works! I've tried: > > Launch "/Hard Disk/Applications/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" What's the name of your drive? "Hard Disk", "HD", or "Macintosh HD"? Whichever it is, the other two of course won't work. If it's a name with a space, just for the heck of it try escaping the space: "Macintosh\ HD". -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From bvg at mac.com Sun Mar 16 21:08:01 2003 From: bvg at mac.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?=) Date: Sun Mar 16 21:08:01 2003 Subject: Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files In-Reply-To: Message-ID: There is an option in the distribution builder to make all substacks into separate files. One can put preferences into a textfile with the various text handling capabilities. There are many ressources on that topic online available : the first tip of the week: http://runrev.com/revolution/developers/articles/tipoftheweek/1.html the runrev mailing archive (must search): http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/ sons of thunder tips: http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/metacard/tips/stk001.htm rev newby board: http://www.mailping.net/cgi-bin/yabb/ YaBB.cgi?board=questions;action=display;num=1037506133 also there are some topics within the documentation about this: About... main stacks, substacks, and the organization of a stack file. Why... can't I save a Stack? Why... aren't window positions saved in my application? mainStack save The reason why this doesn't get answered anymore is probably that so many people do not search, but first ask for information (and do not ask again, because they found their answers trough searching). Coupled with the fact that this Question comes back again and again, this leads to a certain fatigue of these in knowledge (at least that is my theory)... have fun Bj?rnke von Gierke On Sonntag, M?r 16, 2003, at 23:19 Europe/Zurich, Ken Norris wrote: > Howdy, > > Note: I didn't get any response so I'll repost (same with the last > time I > tried to find answers about this problem). BTW, it seems that others > who > have questions on these types of subjects don't get answers either. The > problems with external file referencing, data stacks, images, etc., > with > respect to manipulation of stack content seems to get very little > response. > I've been fighting with how to deal with this for weeks. At this point > I'll > take any advice, from sage absolutism to wild guesses ;+) I'm going to > rewrite what I want to do: > > 1) Use a standalone as a UI with external data stacks, image resource, > and > sound resource files. > > 2) Be able to load the standalone UI with images and sounds into > background > groups from available files, via a Preferences stack where the current > file > names are stored. > > 3) Be able to switch the bg group images and sound prefs from the > Preferences stack and have them immediately changed in the standalone > UI > (and automatically saved to the Prefs stack). > > 4) Be able to either: > > a) Load a data stack into the standalone UI somehow, and be able to > search, > manipulate, and update any of the card info, then save it back to the > data > stack in updated condition (with an option for backup copies). > > or.. > > b) Search, manipiulate, and update the data stack by _remote control_ > (the > hard part) from the standalone UI, and save the altered data stack > normally. > > How do I do it? > > TIA, > Ken N. > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From ambassador at fourthworld.com Sun Mar 16 21:13:00 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Sun Mar 16 21:13:00 2003 Subject: Launch command In-Reply-To: <13372FFA-57DB-11D7-9CCD-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Message-ID: Roger Guay wrote: > Thanks for your reply, Richard. I get a false when I type "put > exists("/Hard Disk/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit")" into the message box, > yet I know that It's in there. I also tried "put exists("/Macintosh > HD/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit")" since that is the tittle of my hard > drive, but to no avail. Any ideas? Try this, and compare the result with your original path: answer file "Select TexEdit:"; put it -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From mailjjt at bellsouth.net Sun Mar 16 21:21:02 2003 From: mailjjt at bellsouth.net (John J. Theobald) Date: Sun Mar 16 21:21:02 2003 Subject: Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files References: Message-ID: <3E753081.8070904@bellsouth.net> Ken Norris wrote: > Howdy, > > Note: I didn't get any response so I'll repost (same with the last time I > tried to find answers about this problem). BTW, it seems that others who > have questions on these types of subjects don't get answers either. The > problems with external file referencing, data stacks, images, etc., with > respect to manipulation of stack content seems to get very little response. > I've been fighting with how to deal with this for weeks. At this point I'll > take any advice, from sage absolutism to wild guesses ;+) I'm going to > rewrite what I want to do: > > 1) Use a standalone as a UI with external data stacks, image resource, and > sound resource files. > > 2) Be able to load the standalone UI with images and sounds into background > groups from available files, via a Preferences stack where the current file > names are stored. > > 3) Be able to switch the bg group images and sound prefs from the > Preferences stack and have them immediately changed in the standalone UI > (and automatically saved to the Prefs stack). > > 4) Be able to either: > > a) Load a data stack into the standalone UI somehow, and be able to search, > manipulate, and update any of the card info, then save it back to the data > stack in updated condition (with an option for backup copies). > > or.. > > b) Search, manipiulate, and update the data stack by _remote control_ (the > hard part) from the standalone UI, and save the altered data stack normally. > > How do I do it? > > TIA, > Ken N. > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > Well, I can't answer all of your questions because as I used to tell my students, "You retain more by doing it yourself than by me telling you how to do it." I'm no expert by any means, but below is a snippet I use that incorporates some of what you seem to be attempting. Maybe you can glean something from this: on mouseUp lock screen put the filename of this stack into tfilepath set the itemdel to "/" put empty into the last item of tfilepath set the directory to tfilepath & "/lib/" put the short name of this stack into thisstack set the defaultStack to "m1.lib" set the passkey of this stack to "somepassword" open card 2 put image "image2" into image "images" of stack thisstack close this stack set the defaultStack to "mymainstack" set dontuseQTEffects to true show image "images" with visual effect dissolve unlock screen end mouseUp I use a library directory to store password protected stacks (libraries) that contain images or data I use in my main stack. To retrieve an image from the file m1.lib and bring it into my main stack I use the above code. Here is a brief description of what is happening: 1. lock screen while the file is being retrieved 2. get the path of the current main stack 3. set the delimeter to "/" for path manipulation 4. drop the filename of the stack from the path so only the parent directory remains 5. append the "lib" directory to the parent directory (now we have the lib subdirectory) 6. record the name of the current stack into a variable "thisstack" 7. change the default stack to the one in the lib directory with the needed image, in this case m1.lib (note it does not have to end in .rev or .mc) All execution defaults to this stack now (hence the term default stack) 8. Because the stack is password protected, load the passkey property with the password needed to unlock the stack 9. open the card where the image resides 10. put the image into the original main stack referenced in the variable "thisstack" 11. close the library stack 12. set the default stack back to the original main stack 13. use the default metacard effects 14. show the image with an effect 15. unlock the screen to make the image display Note the libraries I use are static and just containers to hold content. If you intend to modify a file or stack (such as a preferences stack) that file or those files can't be part of your main stack, but rather they must be "independent". You can't modify the currently running stack. I believe this is accurate, but others may provide better guidance. Hope this is of some help. Regards, John J. Theoabld From katir at hindu.org Sun Mar 16 21:29:00 2003 From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami) Date: Sun Mar 16 21:29:00 2003 Subject: [SC] Re: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <8626732F-57F9-11D7-BB67-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au> Message-ID: <09C5D590-5820-11D7-9DBD-003065FB9830@hindu.org> Ditto that from a veteran SC (a decade or so? still got projects running, waiting to be ported to rev) user now using Rev. Oh, and Apple's own "mail.app' unexpectedly quits a lot more under Jaguar than Rev ever does even in its latest beta. We're doin' just fine! On Sunday, March 16, 2003, at 11:52 AM, David Vaughan wrote: > I appear to be only one of very many Jaguar users who have found > Revolution quite acceptable ever since Jaguar emerged. That it is open > to improvement is, in my humble but rather extensive experience, not > unique to this software, which on balance serves me more effectively > and more pleasantly than do its principal competitors. From Revinfo1155 at aol.com Sun Mar 16 22:04:01 2003 From: Revinfo1155 at aol.com (Revinfo1155 at aol.com) Date: Sun Mar 16 22:04:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1205 - 6 msgs Message-ID: <12e.25b22409.2ba69451@aol.com> In a message dated 3/16/03 6:40:57 PM, pixelbird at interisland.net writes: > Also, the Pan recently uploaded a bunch of sounds, but they're for Macs and > may need to be converted: > > > > Ken N. > Good Question -Can sounds for hypercard be used in Rev.? Jack -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kray at sonsothunder.com Sun Mar 16 23:17:00 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Sun Mar 16 23:17:00 2003 Subject: Launch Command In-Reply-To: <81B77373-5817-11D7-8EBA-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Message-ID: <00e001c2ec3b$88e2dd70$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Hang on, hang on... if you're running under OS X, applications are really bundles, which are seen as "folders" to Rev; in fact, if you do a simple: answer file "Pick TextEdit";put it you get: /Applications/TextEdit.app/ pass that to the launch command: launch "/Applications/TextEdit.app/" and it launches TextEdit. (BTW, it launches without the trailing slash as well.) In any time when you have a question about problems with file paths, always do the "answer file...; put it" command to see what Rev thinks the filename should be. Try that and let us know if it works or not. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Roger Guay > Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 7:27 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: Launch Command > > > Thanks to all for your prompt reply, but nothing works! I've tried: > > Launch "/Hard Disk/Applications/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/Macintosh HD/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/HD/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/Hard Disk/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit.app" > > I have assured myself that I do have a copy of TextEdit in the > Aplications folder. I then tried putting a copy of TextEdit on the > desktop and one in the RunRev application Folder and tried: > > Launch "TextEdit.app" > > Nothing works. Bummer!!! Any other suggestions? > > Cheers, Roger > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 17 00:09:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 17 00:09:01 2003 Subject: Unwanted tool switch In-Reply-To: <200303170418.XAA08336@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 15:58:36 -0800 > From: Jim Hurley > Subject: Re: Unwanted tool switch > Ken, > > The only time I have had this problem and had to resort to "send .... > in 10 millisecond" was after a "create" command (create field,or > button or graphic or whatever) or in effect creating an image by > importing an image file. > > Otherwise a simple "choose the browse tool" works. This will surely > go away in 2.0 ---------- Nope, it doesn't, that's why I made the original post. Best regards, Ken N. From bornstein at designeq.com Mon Mar 17 00:41:01 2003 From: bornstein at designeq.com (Howard Bornstein) Date: Mon Mar 17 00:41:01 2003 Subject: Can't add file extension in Windows Message-ID: <200303170537.h2H5bp67014333@ms-smtp-01.nyroc.rr.com> >Good question... I ran your code below (using "the directory" for >gGraphDefaultFolder) and it worked fine for me. Perhaps it's an OS >issue? What Windows version are you experiencing this on? I'm running this under Windows XP. What version did you run under? Apparently, under XP, even if you explicitly add ".jpg" to the filename in the save dialog, it deletes it from the file. However, it is smart enough to know it's a jpeg file. In my case, it's got a big fat Q on the icon, representing a Quicktime file. I'm a Mac guy so I'm not up on Windows extensions, but does XP remove (at least from the user's view) file extensions, even though it knows internally what the file type is? Howard Bornstein ____________________ D E S I G N E Q www.designeq.com From scott at tactilemedia.com Mon Mar 17 00:48:00 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Mon Mar 17 00:48:00 2003 Subject: Can't add file extension in Windows In-Reply-To: <200303170537.h2H5bp67014333@ms-smtp-01.nyroc.rr.com> Message-ID: Recently, Howard Bornstein wrote: > I'm a Mac guy so I'm not up on Windows extensions, but does XP remove (at > least from the user's view) file extensions, even though it knows > internally what the file type is? Windows typically requires file extensions. So it sounds like you might have a file display preference enabled on your system: something like "hide file extensions" or similar (it could also be the opposite: a disabled button that reads "show file extensions"). Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design Email: scott at tactilemedia.com Web: www.tactilemedia.com From monte at sweattechnologies.com Mon Mar 17 01:06:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Mon Mar 17 01:06:01 2003 Subject: Can't add file extension in Windows In-Reply-To: <200303170537.h2H5bp67014333@ms-smtp-01.nyroc.rr.com> Message-ID: > I'm a Mac guy so I'm not up on Windows extensions, but does XP remove (at > least from the user's view) file extensions Yes, as does MacOS X under certain circumstances. You can change this by opening an explorer window and choosing tools > folder options.. from the menu then going to the view tab Regards Monte From david at kwinter.ca Mon Mar 17 01:22:01 2003 From: david at kwinter.ca (David Kwinter) Date: Mon Mar 17 01:22:01 2003 Subject: ext_sayString - done handling Message-ID: Hello List, I'm sure this is an easy one for many, the problem being whether or not there is a "with message" or "wait until the speaking is over" technique for handling speaking one thing after another using the external. I have a repeat with the general design: repeat until stopRunning=true repeat for each line thisMsg in serverMessages send "updateMessages" to this stack ext_sayString thisMsg end repeat end repeat Which runs out of control. Sorry if this question is a regular, I have been off-list for a long time and searching the list on the web is painful, thanks, David Kwinter From david at kwinter.ca Mon Mar 17 01:27:00 2003 From: david at kwinter.ca (David Kwinter) Date: Mon Mar 17 01:27:00 2003 Subject: Can't add file extension in Windows In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 3/16/03 11:01 PM, "Monte Goulding" wrote: > >> I'm a Mac guy so I'm not up on Windows extensions, but does XP remove (at >> least from the user's view) file extensions > > Yes, as does MacOS X under certain circumstances. You can change this by > opening an explorer window and choosing tools > folder options.. from the > menu then going to the view tab > > Regards > > Monte > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution By default, Windows XP Home Edition (all I can test) has the option "Hide extensions for known file types" Turned-On. A file with path "c:/test.txt" or "c:/test.text" shows up as "test" and will double-click open with notepad. From bornstein at designeq.com Mon Mar 17 01:36:00 2003 From: bornstein at designeq.com (Howard Bornstein) Date: Mon Mar 17 01:36:00 2003 Subject: Can't add file extension in Windows Message-ID: <200303170632.h2H6WX68008792@ms-smtp-01.nyroc.rr.com> >Windows typically requires file extensions. So it sounds like you might >have a file display preference enabled on your system: something like "hide >file extensions" or similar (it could also be the opposite: a disabled >button that reads "show file extensions"). Bingo! You hit it. I found a switch in the Folders control panel that turned off extensions for common file types. Without this, it's now acting as expected. Thanks Scott! Regards, Howard Bornstein ____________________ D E S I G N E Q www.designeq.com From bornstein at designeq.com Mon Mar 17 01:46:01 2003 From: bornstein at designeq.com (Howard Bornstein) Date: Mon Mar 17 01:46:01 2003 Subject: Can't add file extension in Windows Message-ID: <200303170642.h2H6gfbV023997@ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com> >Yes, as does MacOS X under certain circumstances. You can change this by >opening an explorer window and choosing tools > folder options.. from the >menu then going to the view tab Thanks Monte. I just found this after Scott suggested something similar. Regards, Howard Bornstein ____________________ D E S I G N E Q www.designeq.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 01:48:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Mon Mar 17 01:48:01 2003 Subject: subject: digest, Vol 1 #1203 13 msgs In-Reply-To: <8A93312E-578B-11D7-9B97-003065A335E6@wanadoo.fr> Message-ID: <20030317064443.12708.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com> subject: digest, Vol 1 #1203 13 msgs this subject format makes it slower to edit msgs. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 02:04:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Mon Mar 17 02:04:01 2003 Subject: Animation freeze In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030317070041.64397.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com> --- Scott Rossi wrote: > When moving many individual objects, I've found > it's effective to give the > objects their own "intelligence": give each > object it's own script (based on > a master script) that allows it to determine > where it is at all times and > how it should behave; don't try to control many > objects from a central > script. is there an example anywhere? sounds like neural networking. or artificial life. TIA, Erik ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 17 02:19:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 17 02:19:00 2003 Subject: Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files In-Reply-To: <200303170418.XAA08336@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 03:04:29 +0100 > Subject: Re: Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files > From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?= > > There is an option in the distribution builder to make all substacks > into separate files. ---------- I saw that, but I also read that substacks are in the same file as the main stack. I figured it's a cut and paste sort of thing. I guess, then, that when you call them from a standalone Main, they still behave as substacks. Note: I'm not used to the controls of a standalone Main stack operating on a substack with no controls, because the window of the Main is disabled. It's only because of fast processor speeds that clicking a control in a Main stack works. On my PB 1400, which only has a 133mHz proc, sometimes clicking a control in a Main just activates the window, but doesn't fire a script unless you click it _again_. ---------- > One can put preferences into a textfile with the various text handling > capabilities. ---------- That I understand. ---------- > There are many ressources on that topic online available : > the first tip of the week: > http://runrev.com/revolution/developers/articles/tipoftheweek/1.html ---------- Thank you, I missed that one. I only have dialup service where I am, so it's not like I'm online all the time. ---------- > the runrev mailing archive (must search): > http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/ ---------- Spent quite a lot of time searching there, but I couldn't find out how to switch out my background group images and sounds. I've tried a number of things, but my scripts have failed to work so far. ---------- > sons of thunder tips: > http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/metacard/tips/stk001.htm ---------- I'll check there in a few minutes. ---------- > rev newby board: > http://www.mailping.net/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=questions;action=display ;num =1037506133 ---------- Trouble logging in. I'll try again later. ---------- > also there are some topics within the documentation about this: > About... main stacks, substacks, and the organization of a stack file. > Why... can't I save a Stack? > Why... aren't window positions saved in my application? > mainStack > save ---------- Been there, done that, still trying. I haven't yet seen a script that switches images and sounds in a bg group from a file. Having to toggle the docs open and closed because they cover up my work is frustrating for me. I tried printing them out, but kept running out of paper and gave up. As soon as I get space for my other computer, maybe I'll run them both, one with the docs and the other with my work. ---------- > The reason why this doesn't get answered anymore is probably that so > many people do not search, but first ask for information (and do not > ask again, because they found their answers trough searching). Coupled > with the fact that this Question comes back again and again, this leads > to a certain fatigue of these in knowledge (at least that is my > theory)... ----------- I've been looking as diligently as I can, and tried dozens of scripts. I just haven't successfully replaced images (delete one and import another) in a group under script control so far. Sarah's (large) tip, which I copied into a stack, may help. Best regards, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 17 02:58:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 17 02:58:01 2003 Subject: Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files In-Reply-To: <200303170418.XAA08336@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 21:18:41 -0500 > From: "John J. Theobald" > Subject: Re: Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files > > Well, I can't answer all of your questions because as I used to tell my > students, "You retain more by doing it yourself than by me telling you > how to do it." ----------snip Thanks John. Ya done good ;-) The only thing I don't understand is this: put image "image2" into image "images" of stack thisstack I thought you couldn't put an image into an image. Other than that, it's similar to what I did. I got an image, but I didn't know how to getrid of the one that was already there. Also, I couldn't get the image I brought in to go into the bg group where I need it. Nothing happened. ---------- > Note the libraries I use are static and just containers to hold content. > If you intend to modify a file or stack (such as a preferences stack) > that file or those files can't be part of your main stack, but rather > they must be "independent". You can't modify the currently running > stack. I believe this is accurate, but others may provide better guidance. > > Hope this is of some help. ---------- Yes, thanks so much, Ken N. From scott at tactilemedia.com Mon Mar 17 03:26:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Mon Mar 17 03:26:01 2003 Subject: Animation freeze In-Reply-To: <20030317070041.64397.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Recently, erik hansen wrote: >> When moving many individual objects, I've found >> it's effective to give the >> objects their own "intelligence": give each >> object it's own script (based on >> a master script) that allows it to determine >> where it is at all times and >> how it should behave; don't try to control many >> objects from a central >> script. > > is there an example anywhere? > sounds like neural networking. > or artificial life. It can be. Here's a simple example that demonstrates the "intelligence" principle -- a stack that brings five graphic objects to life and kills them with the push of a button. 1) Create a new stack 2) Create two buttons: "Master" and "Give Life"; position these at the bottom of the card 3) Create 5 small oval draw graphics and position them at various locations on the card 4) Place this script in button "Master": on mouseUp # THIS ALLOWS EASY EDITING OF THE MASTER SCRIPT FOR ALL SPRITE OBJECTS if short name of me is "master" then edit script of me end mouseUp on activateMe set the uAllowLife of me to true set the uRate of me to "3,3" set the uLimits of me to rect of this cd moveMe end activateMe on moveMe if not the uAllowLife of me then exit moveMe # MANAGE HORIZONTAL MOVEMENT if item 1 of the uRate of me > 0 then if right of me > item 3 of the uLimits of me then set the uRate of me to ("-3," & item 2 of the uRate of me) end if else if left of me < item 1 of the uLimits of me then \ set the uRate of me to "3," & item 2 of the uRate of me end if # MANAGE VERTICAL MOVEMENT if item 2 of the uRate of me > 0 then if bottom of me > item 4 of the uLimits of me then set the uRate of me to (item 1 of the uRate of me & ",-3") end if else if top of me < item 2 of the uLimits of me then \ set the uRate of me to (item 1 of the uRate of me & ",3") end if put the loc of me into tLoc add item 1 of the uRate of me to item 1 of tLoc add item 2 of the uRate of me to item 2 of tLoc set loc of me to tLoc send "moveMe" to me in 10 milliseconds end moveMe on killMe set the uAllowLife of me to false end killMe 5) Place this script in button "Give Life": on mouseUp set the uLife of me to not the uLife of me if the uLife of me then repeat with x = 1 to 5 set script of grc x to script of btn master send "activateMe" to grc x in (x*200) milliseconds end repeat else repeat with x = 1 to 5 send "killMe" to grc x end repeat end if end mouseUp ----- Click the "Give Life" button. You should see the ball "sprites" come to life one at a time and bounce. When each ball senses the edge of the screen it will change direction. Click the "Give Life" button again to kill all movement. By adding random/changing values to the move rates and timing, you can create some intricate/organic movement that is handled individually by each sprite being "self aware". Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design Email: scott at tactilemedia.com Web: www.tactilemedia.com From dropboxforspam at yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 04:19:01 2003 From: dropboxforspam at yahoo.com (DropBox ForSpam) Date: Mon Mar 17 04:19:01 2003 Subject: Canceling a libURLftpUpload Message-ID: <20030314191543.53401.qmail@web40513.mail.yahoo.com> After starting a file transfer with libURLftpUpload in rev 1.1.1, how do I abort the transfer? I tried using unload, as that's what the docs seemed to suggest to me, but watching my network traffic I could see that the transfer continued even after the Unload took place. In simpilest form, I started the transfer like this: libURLftpUpload FileData,gFtpUrl,"Done" in my "cancel" Button I used the form: unload url gFtpUrl gFtpUrl is a global, and i checked the value in the Unload handler to be certain that it was correct, so I'm guessing that Unload is not the proper command, or I need to do something else in addition to unload. TIA DB __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From malte.brill at t-online.de Mon Mar 17 04:46:01 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Mon Mar 17 04:46:01 2003 Subject: iTunes-type alternate colored lines in scrolling list field In-Reply-To: <200303110616.BAA15149@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hi, thanks to Yves Coppe for the very interesting off list discussion on this subject. It helped me getting rid of the last cheesyness of my script. Now it works quite perfect for me on 1.1.1 Merci Yves!!! :-) I?ll update my report here. No changes in the card script: ----------------------------------------------------------------- global loop,correct,twoLines,skipline on opencard put 1 into loop put the effective textHeight of fld "theField"*10 into skipline put the effective textHeight of fld "theField"*2 into twoLines put skipline into correct set the vscroll of fld "theField" to 0 set the vscroll of grp "theImage" to twolines end opencard ------------------------------------------------------------------ Change the script of the field to the following: ------------------------------------------------------------------ global loop,correct,skipline,twolines global loop,correct,skipline,twolines on scrollbardrag if correct-the vscroll of me<=0 then repeat until correct-the vscroll of me>=0 put loop+1 into loop put loop*skipline into correct end repeat end if if the vscroll of me+skipline-correct<0 then repeat until the vscroll of me+skipline-correct>0 put loop-1 into loop put loop*skipline into correct end repeat end if put the vscroll of me+skipline-correct+twoLines into groupScroll set the vscroll of grp "theImage" to groupScroll end scrollbardrag ------------------------------------------------------------------- Now it is possible to set the vscroll of the field via script and the scroll of the group is adapted automaticly. I would suggest changing the globals to custom properties, if you need more than one field with alternating lines. If you want to calculate how many bars your image must have to display correctly, you need at last as many bars that are needed to fill the height of your field+12 bars. I would add another 2 bars to the image, just to be sure. :-) Regards, Malte From rolfk at vetvir.unizh.ch Mon Mar 17 07:22:00 2003 From: rolfk at vetvir.unizh.ch (Rolf Kocherhans) Date: Mon Mar 17 07:22:00 2003 Subject: Drag & Drop Message-ID: <9ED3841C-5872-11D7-8CDE-003065EEE22E@vetvir.unizh.ch> Can anyone explain what has to be scripted to have a Stack, where one can drop a File from the Finder into an img grc and then, the Stack would put the path of the droped file into the message box. From rolfk at vetvir.unizh.ch Mon Mar 17 07:26:01 2003 From: rolfk at vetvir.unizh.ch (Rolf Kocherhans) Date: Mon Mar 17 07:26:01 2003 Subject: TCP/IP number and Port Check Message-ID: <1CC594CA-5873-11D7-8CDE-003065EEE22E@vetvir.unizh.ch> Has anyone already made a script which checks a field if a user has entered a correct TCP/IP address ? Also does anyone know from where to where portnumbers go ? Cheers Rolf From capellan2000 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 07:30:02 2003 From: capellan2000 at yahoo.com (Alejandro Tejada) Date: Mon Mar 17 07:30:02 2003 Subject: Searching the archives with Google In-Reply-To: <200303170947.EAA16901@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <20030317122643.10066.qmail@web40501.mail.yahoo.com> In the header of every Digest: > and search the archives for this list using > this link: > > But Google only returns messages until an uncertain date. Most recent posting never appear. How can this be fixed? Thanks in advance. Alejandro ===== Useful sites: http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/metacard/tips/ and /revolution/tips/ http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/metacard/ and /use-revolution/ http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From k_major at os.surf2000.de Mon Mar 17 07:42:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Mon Mar 17 07:42:01 2003 Subject: Drag & Drop In-Reply-To: <9ED3841C-5872-11D7-8CDE-003065EEE22E@vetvir.unizh.ch> Message-ID: <9D714BD6-5875-11D7-A713-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Hi Rolf, > Can anyone explain what has to be scripted to have a Stack, where > one can drop a File from the Finder into an img grc and then, > the Stack would put the path of the droped file into the message box. here is a simple handler that i put into the card-script of my drag'n'drop test stack (only one card ;-)... It requires an image, a field and a player: Very basic, but should gt you started :-) on dragenter set the acceptdrop to true end dragenter on dragdrop put the dragdata ## That's it... This line will put the path = dragdata into the msg. ## Then after i check where to put the files, if at all... switch char -4 to -1 of the dragdata ## the suffix! case ".gif" case ".jpg" case ".png" set the fileame of img 1 to the dragdata break case ".txt" put url("file:" & the dragdata) into fld 1 break case ".rtf" set the rtftext of fld 1 to url("file:" & the dragdata) break case ".mov" case ".swf" case ".avi" case ".mpg" set the filename of player 1 to the dragdata break end switch end dragdrop Hope that helps... Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From miscdas at boxfrog.com Mon Mar 17 08:07:01 2003 From: miscdas at boxfrog.com (miscdas at boxfrog.com) Date: Mon Mar 17 08:07:01 2003 Subject: Can't add file extension in Windows In-Reply-To: <200303170537.h2H5bp67014333@ms-smtp-01.nyroc.rr.com> References: <200303170537.h2H5bp67014333@ms-smtp-01.nyroc.rr.com> Message-ID: <20030317130358.39429.qmail@www.boxfrog.com> Howard Bornstein writes: [snip] > Apparently, under XP, even if you explicitly add ".jpg" to the filename > in the save dialog, it deletes it from the file. > > I'm a Mac guy so I'm not up on Windows extensions, but does XP remove (at > least from the user's view) file extensions, even though it knows > internally what the file type is? > =========== Windoze management, in their infinite Wisdom regarding what users SHOULD see by default , decided that showing file extensions is a bad idea in general. Therefore, the default mode is for extensions (at least for "known file types") to be turned off. The extensions are NOT DELETED; they are simply not displayed. Also, the default display setting for the file information for System and Hidden files is to not be displayed. So, be aware that if you think you are "hiding" a file by setting its attribute to hidden, you don't hide it from everyone. miscdas From mailjjt at bellsouth.net Mon Mar 17 08:13:00 2003 From: mailjjt at bellsouth.net (John J. Theobald) Date: Mon Mar 17 08:13:00 2003 Subject: Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files References: Message-ID: <3E75C97C.4090002@bellsouth.net> Ken Norris wrote: > ********** > >>Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 21:18:41 -0500 >>From: "John J. Theobald" >>Subject: Re: Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files >> >>Well, I can't answer all of your questions because as I used to tell my >>students, "You retain more by doing it yourself than by me telling you >>how to do it." >> > ----------snip > Thanks John. Ya done good ;-) > > The only thing I don't understand is this: > > put image "image2" into image "images" of stack thisstack > > I thought you couldn't put an image into an image. > > Other than that, it's similar to what I did. I got an image, but I didn't > know how to getrid of the one that was already there. > > Also, I couldn't get the image I brought in to go into the bg group where I > need it. Nothing happened. > ---------- > >>Note the libraries I use are static and just containers to hold content. >>If you intend to modify a file or stack (such as a preferences stack) >>that file or those files can't be part of your main stack, but rather >>they must be "independent". You can't modify the currently running >>stack. I believe this is accurate, but others may provide better guidance. >> >>Hope this is of some help. >> > ---------- > Yes, thanks so much, > Ken N. > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > You can put an image into an image as long as they are the same geometry (their formatted width and height are the same). This just does a simple pixel for pixel replacement. If they are not the same you need to manipulate them to get them into the same geometry. You can imagine it would be difficult to take a 1000 pixel image and put it in a 100 pixel image container ... there would be definite loss of quality. If you do it this way you don't need to get rid of the one that is already there, as the code implies. I preset all of my images using Photoshop or Debabelizer. As for the background group, that is a little beyond me, as I don't use them. I use groups, but not with background behavior. If I were doing this with an ordinary group, I would just replace the image object in my group as above. I don't see why this would not work with bg behavior turned on, but perhaps others have more insight. Good Luck! John J. Theobald From claus at dreischer.de Mon Mar 17 10:35:01 2003 From: claus at dreischer.de (claus at dreischer.de) Date: Mon Mar 17 10:35:01 2003 Subject: AW: TCP/IP number and Port Check Message-ID: <20030317153056.6A07581A2@voodoo.strato-webmail.de> --- Urspr?ngliche Nachricht --- Datum: 17.03.2003 13:22 Von: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com An: Use Revolution Betreff: TCP/IP number and Port Check Hi Rolf, ... > Also does anyone know from where to where portnumbers go ? Portnumber range is up to 65535. If you have a linux box, you can see the services behind these numbers in the /etc/services/ file, IIRC. > Cheers > Rolf Gru?, Claus. From malte.brill at t-online.de Mon Mar 17 10:38:00 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Mon Mar 17 10:38:00 2003 Subject: Searching the archives with Google In-Reply-To: <200303111436.JAA24132@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: >But Google only returns messages until an >uncertain date. Most recent posting never >appear. >How can this be fixed? >Thanks in advance. >Alejandro Hi Alejandro, I guess this is due to the googlebot spidering the archives not often enough. I guess a scripted search function would be nice. If I recall it right UDI had something like this. Regards, Malte From jhurley at infostations.com Mon Mar 17 10:39:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Mon Mar 17 10:39:01 2003 Subject: Unwanted tool switch In-Reply-To: <200303170947.EAA16901@www.runrev.com> References: <200303170947.EAA16901@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > > Ken, >> >> The only time I have had this problem and had to resort to "send .... >> in 10 millisecond" was after a "create" command (create field,or >> button or graphic or whatever) or in effect creating an image by >> importing an image file. >> >> Otherwise a simple "choose the browse tool" works. This will surely >> go away in 2.0 >---------- >Nope, it doesn't, that's why I made the original post. > >Best regards, >Ken N. Ken, If you remove the line "import paint from file "Brandy1.jpg", do you still wind up with the pointer tool? As I said, the only time this happens to me is when you "create" something, or *effectively* create something using "import paint..." Or did you mean that it hasn't been fixed in the 2.0 pre-beta? That would be surprising! Jim Hurley From claus at dreischer.de Mon Mar 17 10:40:01 2003 From: claus at dreischer.de (claus at dreischer.de) Date: Mon Mar 17 10:40:01 2003 Subject: AW: Drag & Drop Message-ID: <20030317153646.7C0A681A2@voodoo.strato-webmail.de> --- Urspr?ngliche Nachricht --- Datum: 17.03.2003 13:40 Von: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com An: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com Betreff: Re: Drag & Drop > Hi Rolf, > > > Can anyone explain what has to be scripted to have a Stack, where > > one can drop a File from the Finder into an img grc and then, > > the Stack would put the path of the droped file into the message box. > > here is a simple handler that i put into the card-script of my > drag'n'drop test stack (only one card ;-)... > > It requires an image, a field and a player: > Very basic, but should gt you started :-) > > > on dragenter > set the acceptdrop to true > end dragenter > > on dragdrop > put the dragdata > ## That's it... This line will put the path = dragdata into the msg. > ## Then after i check where to put the files, if at all... > ... Hi Klaus, have you tested this on an linux box? I have the problem that drag&drop does not work on linux, but it does work on windows. Any idea? > Regards > > Klaus Major Gru?, Claus. From BradAllen at mac.com Mon Mar 17 11:13:00 2003 From: BradAllen at mac.com (Brad Allen) Date: Mon Mar 17 11:13:00 2003 Subject: database security In-Reply-To: <1D59A0.6AA%malte.brill@t-online.de> References: <1D59A0.6AA%malte.brill@t-online.de> Message-ID: I'm starting a project involving Rev 1.1.1r2 as a GUI front end to a mySQL database which needs to work for remote users across the Internet. I'm currently at the proof of concept stage, and need to know whether this kind of connection can be handled securely by Rev. The mySQL security guidelines http://www.mysql.com/doc/en/General_security.html strongly recommend against sending clear text across the Internet: "# Do not transmit plain (unencrypted) data over the Internet. These data are accessible to everyone who has the time and ability to intercept it and use it for their own purposes. Instead, use an encrypted protocol such as SSL or SSH. MySQL supports internal SSL connections as of Version 4.0.0. SSH port-forwarding can be used to create an encrypted (and compressed) tunnel for the communication." Does Rev use a secure protocol to send and receive data from a mySQL server? Thanks! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com Mon Mar 17 11:14:03 2003 From: Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com (Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com) Date: Mon Mar 17 11:14:03 2003 Subject: Drag & Drop Message-ID: > here is a simple handler that i put into the card-script of my > drag'n'drop test stack (only one card ;-)... > > It requires an image, a field and a player: > Very basic, but should gt you started :-) Klaus, I copied your dragDrop script into a card script, created a field, an image, and a player. All of it works except the image. When I drag a .jpg or a .gif, etc. onto the button, the image never shows up. I am using pre-beta2. Roger Eller roger.e.eller at sealedair.com From k_major at os.surf2000.de Mon Mar 17 12:20:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Mon Mar 17 12:20:01 2003 Subject: AW: Drag & Drop In-Reply-To: <20030317153646.7C0A681A2@voodoo.strato-webmail.de> Message-ID: <6DAF4B36-589C-11D7-A713-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Hi Claus, > ... > Hi Klaus, > have you tested this on an linux box? > > I have the problem that drag&drop does not work on linux, > but it does work on windows. Any idea? Sorry, i have just a mac and a win box available... > Gru?, > Claus. Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From k_major at os.surf2000.de Mon Mar 17 12:24:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Mon Mar 17 12:24:01 2003 Subject: Drag & Drop In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Roger, >> here is a simple handler that i put into the card-script of my >> drag'n'drop test stack (only one card ;-)... >> It requires an image, a field and a player: >> Very basic, but should gt you started :-) > > Klaus, > > I copied your dragDrop script into a card script, created a field, an > image, and a player. All of it works except the image. When I drag a > .jpg > or a .gif, etc. onto the button, the image never shows up. I am using > pre-beta2. hmm... works here and work for Claus, too... The syntax is correct but it's apre-beta, isn't it ;-) Remember that my script only works with one single file and not with more than one file or even folder(s)! > Roger Eller > roger.e.eller at sealedair.com Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From heather at runrev.com Mon Mar 17 12:33:01 2003 From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams) Date: Mon Mar 17 12:33:01 2003 Subject: T-Shirts now available Message-ID: Greetings! By the power of popular demand, you have achieved Revolution T-Shirts! You can now order these, and a range of other products, from http://www.cafeshop.com/runrev Happy shopping! Regards, Heather -- Heather Williams Runtime Revolution Ltd. Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Mon Mar 17 12:39:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Mon Mar 17 12:39:01 2003 Subject: T-Shirts now available In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >Greetings! > >By the power of popular demand, you have achieved Revolution T-Shirts! You >can now order these, and a range of other products, from > >http://www.cafeshop.com/runrev Not found, and cafeshop itself is up for sale... Google-de-google Ah. http://www.cafeshops.com/runrev -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Mon Mar 17 12:41:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Mon Mar 17 12:41:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1205 - 6 msgs In-Reply-To: <12e.25b22409.2ba69451@aol.com> References: <12e.25b22409.2ba69451@aol.com> Message-ID: <3E7607DD.70003@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/16/03 9:00 PM, Revinfo1155 at aol.com wrote: > Good Question -Can sounds for hypercard be used in Rev.? Yes, but they'd need to be converted to WAV, au, or AIF format first. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Mon Mar 17 12:52:39 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Mon Mar 17 12:52:39 2003 Subject: Shakobox update Message-ID: <3E760A97.8030407@hyperactivesw.com> A revised version of Shakobox, the HyperCard-style musical notation stack, has been uploaded to: This version works around a bug in the MetaCard engine that caused installation of the PlayCommand Agent application to fail on machines running Mac OS 9. If you plan to run Shakobox only on an OS X machine then you don't need this update. However, if you want to distribute the PlayCommand Agent app in your own stacks, the revised scripts should be used for your installations and you should download this update. There are no other changes to the stack, outside of working around the installation problem. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From heather at runrev.com Mon Mar 17 13:50:01 2003 From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams) Date: Mon Mar 17 13:50:01 2003 Subject: T-shirts url Message-ID: Ahem. That should have been http://www.cafeshops.com/runrev Apologies, Heather -- Heather Williams Runtime Revolution Ltd. Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought From chipp at chipp.com Mon Mar 17 14:33:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Mon Mar 17 14:33:01 2003 Subject: Can't add file extension in Windows In-Reply-To: <20030317130358.39429.qmail@www.boxfrog.com> Message-ID: Indeed, miscdas is right on. To enable the viewing of extensions on WinXP, go to any 'finder'type window, click the tools -> folder options then under 'Files and Folders' -> 'Hidden Files and Folders' check the 'Show hidden files and folders' radio button. -Chipp > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of > miscdas at boxfrog.com > Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 7:04 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: Can't add file extension in Windows > > > Howard Bornstein writes: > [snip] > > Apparently, under XP, even if you explicitly add ".jpg" to the filename > > in the save dialog, it deletes it from the file. > > > > I'm a Mac guy so I'm not up on Windows extensions, but does XP > remove (at > > least from the user's view) file extensions, even though it knows > > internally what the file type is? > > > =========== > Windoze management, in their infinite Wisdom regarding what users > SHOULD see > by default , decided that showing file extensions is a bad idea > in general. > Therefore, the default mode is for extensions (at least for "known file > types") to be turned off. The extensions are NOT DELETED; they are simply > not displayed. Also, the default display setting for the file information > for System and Hidden files is to not be displayed. So, be aware > that if you > think you are "hiding" a file by setting its attribute to hidden, > you don't > hide it from everyone. > > miscdas > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk Mon Mar 17 15:22:03 2003 From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg) Date: Mon Mar 17 15:22:03 2003 Subject: Canceling a libURLftpUpload In-Reply-To: <20030314191543.53401.qmail@web40513.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030314191543.53401.qmail@web40513.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: At 11:15 am -0800 14/3/03, DropBox ForSpam wrote: >After starting a file transfer with libURLftpUpload in >rev 1.1.1, how do I abort the transfer? I tried using >unload, as that's what the docs seemed to suggest to >me, but watching my network traffic I could see that >the transfer continued even after the Unload took >place. > >In simpilest form, I started the transfer like this: > >libURLftpUpload FileData,gFtpUrl,"Done" > >in my "cancel" Button I used the form: > >unload url gFtpUrl > >gFtpUrl is a global, and i checked the value in the >Unload handler to be certain that it was correct, so >I'm guessing that Unload is not the proper command, or >I need to do something else in addition to unload. >TIA > >DB You're doing the right thing. However, you should probably try with the latest version of libUrl (1.0.9). There was a problem with the unload feature in an earlier version (can't remember which one offhand) which could prevent it working in certain circumstances. Let me know if you still have problems with the latest version. You can get the updater here: BTW, this version of libUrl is included with the current pre-beta of Rev 2.0. Cheers Dave From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 17 15:26:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 17 15:26:00 2003 Subject: Replacing group images (was Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files) In-Reply-To: <200303171701.MAA29679@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 08:11:24 -0500 > From: "John J. Theobald" > Subject: Re: Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files > > You can put an image into an image as long as they are the same geometry > (their formatted width and height are the same). ---------- Yes, I finally got it to import an image as Iwanted (see script). ---------- > As for the background group, that is a little beyond me, as I don't use > them. I use groups, but not with background behavior. If I were doing > this with an ordinary group, I would just replace the image object in my > group as above. I don't see why this would not work with bg behavior > turned on, but perhaps others have more insight. ---------- Me either, but even without bg bahavior on, I'm still unable to replace images under script control. Here's the script: on mouseUp set the defaultFolder to "Doggies" answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" lock screen import paint from file it set itemDel to "/" put image (last item of it) into image "myImage" delete image (last item of it) start editing group "myImageGroup" create image "myImage" in group "myImageGroup" stop editing group unlock screen send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds end mouseUp ....when it executes, I end up with an empty background group window. When I select the stack window in the Window menu (which is already checked BTW), it goes away and I see the image in the stack, but it's not the group, its the image. The group (myImageGroup) is there, according to the Application Overview, but there's nothing in it. Why doesn't the [start editing] command place the image into the group? TIA, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 17 16:13:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 17 16:13:01 2003 Subject: Unwanted tool switch In-Reply-To: <200303171701.MAA29679@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 07:37:24 -0800 > From: Jim Hurley > Subject: Re: Unwanted tool switch > Ken, > > If you remove the line > > "import paint from file "Brandy1.jpg", > > do you still wind up with the pointer tool? > > As I said, the only time this happens to me is when you "create" > something, or *effectively* create something using "import paint..." ---------- OK, but of course there's no practical point in removing a necessary line of code. I suppose it's just a detail ('nuance' as Jeanne put it) to know. I guess the ticket is to know when Rev does something that it takes time to complete 'behind the scenes', probably only comes with experience, as I haven't run across anything that addresses this specific issue. ---------- > Or did you mean that it hasn't been fixed in the 2.0 pre-beta? That > would be surprising! ---------- No. I realized what it looked like when I read it back online. Too late by then, sorry. Thanks, Ken N. From mailjjt at bellsouth.net Mon Mar 17 16:15:00 2003 From: mailjjt at bellsouth.net (John J. Theobald) Date: Mon Mar 17 16:15:00 2003 Subject: Replacing group images (was Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files) References: Message-ID: <3E763A66.9070809@bellsouth.net> Ken Norris wrote: > ********** > >>Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 08:11:24 -0500 >>From: "John J. Theobald" >>Subject: Re: Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files >> >>You can put an image into an image as long as they are the same geometry >>(their formatted width and height are the same). >> > ---------- > Yes, I finally got it to import an image as Iwanted (see script). > ---------- > >>As for the background group, that is a little beyond me, as I don't use >>them. I use groups, but not with background behavior. If I were doing >>this with an ordinary group, I would just replace the image object in my >>group as above. I don't see why this would not work with bg behavior >>turned on, but perhaps others have more insight. >> > ---------- > Me either, but even without bg bahavior on, I'm still unable to replace > images under script control. > > Here's the script: > > on mouseUp > set the defaultFolder to "Doggies" > answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" > lock screen > import paint from file it > set itemDel to "/" > put image (last item of it) into image "myImage" > delete image (last item of it) > start editing group "myImageGroup" > create image "myImage" in group "myImageGroup" > stop editing group > unlock screen > send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds > end mouseUp > > ....when it executes, I end up with an empty background group window. When I > select the stack window in the Window menu (which is already checked BTW), > it goes away and I see the image in the stack, but it's not the group, its > the image. The group (myImageGroup) is there, according to the Application > Overview, but there's nothing in it. > > Why doesn't the [start editing] command place the image into the group? > > TIA, > Ken N. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > Hmmm ... if I am following this correctly, you probably have 2 images named "myimage", one from the "put" and one from the "create", although the "create" one probably has no content. Try doing the "put" AFTER the "create" (actually after the stop editing group). This should "put" the "it" image into the newly "create"d "myImage" in "myImageGroup" John J. Theobald From curry at pair.com Mon Mar 17 16:41:00 2003 From: curry at pair.com (curry) Date: Mon Mar 17 16:41:00 2003 Subject: Rev math In-Reply-To: <200303161702.MAA24532@www.runrev.com> References: <200303161702.MAA24532@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: I wrote: > My question is, can we trust about that number of digits for all types > of calculations? Dar Scott wrote: >Yes. Use 14. (49 bits floating point) Use less if you need exact >equality. Thanks, Dar. So, does that mean we can take numbers of any length, go ahead and perform the operation, and then trust the result to 14 digits, or do we first have to first preprocess the operands to a certain number of digits according to the type of operation? Thanks, Curry From switchedon at hsj.com Mon Mar 17 17:02:02 2003 From: switchedon at hsj.com (switchedon at hsj.com) Date: Mon Mar 17 17:02:02 2003 Subject: [SC] Re: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <200303162226.RAA01176@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > As for the SC mailing list, posts that mention competing products > are specifically prohibited by the list owner (who has censored my > posts to that list on more than one occasion) That's certainly not my idea of a public discussion group. Sounds more like a strictly moderated propaganda vehicle to me. And if that comment represents the first instance of SuperCard bashing on this list I want the credit. Cheers... Bill Lynn Simtech Publications www.hsj.com From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Mon Mar 17 17:23:00 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Mon Mar 17 17:23:00 2003 Subject: Rev math In-Reply-To: References: <200303161702.MAA24532@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: >>Yes. Use 14. (49 bits floating point) Use less if you need exact >>equality. > >Thanks, Dar. So, does that mean we can take numbers of any length, >go ahead and perform the operation, and then trust the result to 14 >digits, Well, the usual roundoff error analysis of floating point arithmetic still applies. You can always come up with computations that completely lose your accuracy. For instance, suppose that a=0.12345678901234 is the result of a computation and is accurate to these 14 digits, and b=0.12345678901233 is likewise accurate to 14 digits, then a-b is 0.10000000000000 times 10-to-the-minus-fourteen, but it's only accurate to one digit. > or do we first have to first preprocess the operands to a certain >number of digits according to the type of operation? No, you must avoid operations that are inherently inaccurate. For instance, in the formula for the solutions of a quadratic equation only one of the plus/minus possibilities is guaranteed to be accurate. For a stable computation of the second you need to use a different formula completely. Numerical accuracy is not trivial. Most people don't see it until they take a (graduate?) course in numerical mathematics or computational computer science. -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From kray at sonsothunder.com Mon Mar 17 17:25:02 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Mon Mar 17 17:25:02 2003 Subject: ext_sayString - done handling In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <004c01c2ecd3$7afada30$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> > I'm sure this is an easy one for many, the problem being > whether or not there is a "with message" or "wait until the > speaking is over" technique for handling speaking one thing > after another using the external. I have a repeat with the > general design: > > repeat until stopRunning=true > repeat for each line thisMsg in serverMessages > > send "updateMessages" to this stack > ext_sayString thisMsg > > end repeat > end repeat > > > Which runs out of control. One possible problem is the "repeat until stopRunning = true"; I don't see where stopRunning is set at all, and even if it was, the second repeat line should do it (meaning you don't need the first repeat unless you're repeating all the phrases multiple times). The only thing I don't know is whether the external is "blocking" (that is, it doesn't go on to the next line of script until it has finished speaking); my guess is that it isn't which is probably the reason for it running out of control. It hits the "ext_sayString" command, executes it, and then as it is speaking it moves on to the next repeat. You should check to see if there is some return value from ext_saystring you can use to determine if you need to keep going or not. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From david at kwinter.ca Mon Mar 17 17:41:01 2003 From: david at kwinter.ca (David Kwinter) Date: Mon Mar 17 17:41:01 2003 Subject: ext_sayString - done handling In-Reply-To: <004c01c2ecd3$7afada30$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: > you're repeating all the phrases multiple times). The only thing I don't > know is whether the external is "blocking" (that is, it doesn't go on to > the next line of script until it has finished speaking); my guess is > that it isn't which is probably the reason for it running out of > control. It hits the "ext_sayString" command, executes it, and then as Yes, it is not blocking. > it is speaking it moves on to the next repeat. You should check to see > if there is some return value from ext_saystring you can use to > determine if you need to keep going or not. It only returns a "false" if there is a speech manager problem, nothing actually useful. From kray at sonsothunder.com Mon Mar 17 18:16:00 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Mon Mar 17 18:16:00 2003 Subject: ext_sayString - done handling In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <005301c2ecda$99e51cb0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> > > you're repeating all the phrases multiple times). The only thing I > > don't know is whether the external is "blocking" (that is, > it doesn't > > go on to the next line of script until it has finished > speaking); my > > guess is that it isn't which is probably the reason for it > running out > > of control. It hits the "ext_sayString" command, executes > it, and then > > as > > Yes, it is not blocking. That's the problem, then. Is there any possibility you can concatenate the speech strings and just execute ext_sayString once? Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Mon Mar 17 18:26:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Mon Mar 17 18:26:01 2003 Subject: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. Message-ID: In other words, I consider this a bug. on mouseup send "t 1" to me end mouseup on t a set the a of me to "bar" end t Guess what property gets set on mouseup? And what's worse, I don't see how I can hack my way around it, because is illegal. Ok, take a different name for the parameter, but I want to use logical sounding names. -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From ambassador at fourthworld.com Mon Mar 17 18:42:00 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Mon Mar 17 18:42:00 2003 Subject: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Victor Eijkhout wrote: > In other words, I consider this a bug. > > on mouseup > send "t 1" to me > end mouseup > > on t a > set the a of me to "bar" > end t > > Guess what property gets set on mouseup? > > And what's worse, I don't see how I can hack my way around it, > because is illegal. Ok, take a different name for > the parameter, but I want to use logical sounding names. A function named "t" with a parameter named "a" makes their use self-evident? Using any keyword in an invalid form will cause an error. You'll find your code working well -- and possibly easier to read and maintain -- using these popular naming conventions for variables and parameters: -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From jhurley at infostations.com Mon Mar 17 18:45:00 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Mon Mar 17 18:45:00 2003 Subject: Card size on the PC In-Reply-To: <200303172226.RAA06962@www.runrev.com> References: <200303172226.RAA06962@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: I have discovered that the height of my cards on my PC are limited to 617. These are stacks created on my Mac where they were the card heights were 650 or larger. I'm afraid I am in alien territory here on the PC. Is there some constraint on card size on the PC? I see nothing in the preferences. Thanks, Jim From curry at pair.com Mon Mar 17 18:48:00 2003 From: curry at pair.com (curry) Date: Mon Mar 17 18:48:00 2003 Subject: Rev math In-Reply-To: <200303172226.RAA06962@www.runrev.com> References: <200303172226.RAA06962@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: >No, you must avoid operations that are inherently inaccurate. For >instance, in the formula for the solutions of a quadratic equation >only one of the plus/minus possibilities is guaranteed to be >accurate. For a stable computation of the second you need to use a >different formula completely. Thanks to the explanations and try some more examples, I've got it now as far as the purposes I need it for. I'm thinking of using user input for operands of fairly simple calculations, so right now I won't need to worry too much about the kind of situations you mentioned such as using the result of one calculation for another and the cumulative loss in accuracy. So for basic purposes, we can choose to limit or process user input or not for display purposes, but it will be just as accurate to use the raw number going into the calculation. Then we just round at an appropriate place. Sounds good to me. Best wishes, Curry From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Mon Mar 17 18:50:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Mon Mar 17 18:50:01 2003 Subject: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >A function named "t" with a parameter named "a" makes their use >self-evident? Well no, that was just a toy example. > >Using any keyword in an invalid form will cause an error. So I'm finding out. But it's weird: according to the man page the "something" of something can only be given as a keyword, it's not an expression that is evaluated to give that keyword (wouldn't it be cool if that was the case?), so why is expansion/substitution being applied to it? (I'm spoiled: I'm used to TeX where expansion mechanisms are abstruse, but extremely logical.) -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From david at kwinter.ca Mon Mar 17 18:52:01 2003 From: david at kwinter.ca (David Kwinter) Date: Mon Mar 17 18:52:01 2003 Subject: ext_sayString - done handling In-Reply-To: <005301c2ecda$99e51cb0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: > That's the problem, then. Is there any possibility you can concatenate > the speech strings and just execute ext_sayString once? I have some wireless headphones and would enjoy doing other things while keeping tabs on my computers.. As the messages update, I can't prepare them all beforehand. I figure the workaround is to wait say 60 seconds after each speech, but it'll cut off the long messages and there'll be "dead-air" in between the short ones. From monte at sweattechnologies.com Mon Mar 17 18:55:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Mon Mar 17 18:55:01 2003 Subject: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Victor > > In other words, I consider this a bug. I think you woud be the only one > > on mouseup > send "t 1" to me > end mouseup > > on t a > set the a of me to "bar" > end t Just think if you couldn't do this then you wouldn't be able to do something like: repeat with X=1 to 4 put "MyData"&X into tGet put the tGet of me into tData -- manipulate tData set the tGet of me to tData end repeat Yes it's a feature and it's a very powerful one > > Guess what property gets set on mouseup? > > And what's worse, I don't see how I can hack my way around it, > because is illegal. Ok, take a different name for > the parameter, but I want to use logical sounding names. > There is a standard that many people on this list use where: - parameter names are prefixed with p - custom properties are prefixed with c or u - local variables in the script scope are prefixed with l - temporary variables (handler scope) are prefixed with t - global variables are prefixed with g - a new one that I don't use is arrays are prefixed with a Regards Monte From diskot123 at juno.com Mon Mar 17 19:04:01 2003 From: diskot123 at juno.com (Tuviah M Snyder) Date: Mon Mar 17 19:04:01 2003 Subject: ext_sayString Message-ID: <20030317.185912.1032.15.diskot123@juno.com> >You should check to see >if there is some return value from ext_saystring you can use to >determine if you need to keep going or not. check out the new revIsSpeaking function in 2.0 Tuviah Snyder Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development From devin_asay at byu.edu Mon Mar 17 19:17:23 2003 From: devin_asay at byu.edu (Devin Asay) Date: Mon Mar 17 19:17:23 2003 Subject: trapping quit Message-ID: I'm not getting something. I want to trap the quit message and do some stuff before my program quits. I finally settled on trying the shutdownRequest message. When I handle it and pass it in the development environment, it works as expected: it does the stuff I want it to do then quits Revolution. But when I compile the stack as a standalone, the shutdownRequest message gets executed, but the quit never happens. I even tried adding an explicit quit call to the shutdownRequest handler. The resultant standalone still will not quit. I read the dictionary entries for both shutdown and shutdownRequest. The latter seemed to be the one I wanted, but as I said, it's not working. The descriptions of both are a little sketchy, so maybe I'm not understanding something. Can someone shed some light on how these messages work and what is the best way to intercept then pass on a quit call. Jeanne? Devin Devin Asay Humanities Technology and Research Support Center Brigham Young University From Revinfo1155 at aol.com Mon Mar 17 19:18:01 2003 From: Revinfo1155 at aol.com (Revinfo1155 at aol.com) Date: Mon Mar 17 19:18:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1205 - 6 msgs Message-ID: <12.2e7a1299.2ba7bedd@aol.com> In a message dated 3/17/03 12:40:35 PM, jacque at hyperactivesw.com writes: > > Good Question -Can sounds for hypercard be used in Rev.? > > Yes, but they'd need to be converted to WAV, au, or AIF format first. > > -- > Jacqueline Landman Gay? ? ? ?? |? ?? jacque at hyperactivesw.com > HyperActive Software? ? ? ? ?? |? ?? http://www.hyperactivesw.com > > How does one do the conversion? jack -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 19:46:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Mon Mar 17 19:46:01 2003 Subject: T-Shirts now available In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030318004223.37662.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com> i got this: Not Found The requested URL /runrev was not found on this server. Apache/1.3.9 Server at www.cafeshop.com Port 80 ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From monte at sweattechnologies.com Mon Mar 17 19:50:00 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Mon Mar 17 19:50:00 2003 Subject: OS X & answer file Message-ID: Hi All Has anyone else noticed that OS X.2 is associating files with apps correctly but not giving them the type codes when importing from PC???? That means that in the finder the file looks right but when you do answer file or ask file they are disabled. This is very frustrating for the user. Is this something that apple should be fixing or is it part of phasing out the resource fork so Rev needs to handle the situation? Regards Monte From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 19:57:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Mon Mar 17 19:57:01 2003 Subject: Animation freeze In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030318005326.39061.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com> --- Scott Rossi wrote: > > is there an example anywhere? > > sounds like neural networking. > > or artificial life. > > It can be. Here's a simple example that > demonstrates the "intelligence" > principle -- a stack that brings five graphic > objects to life and kills them > with the push of a button. > > 1) Create a new stack > > 2) Create two buttons: "Master" and "Give > Life"; position these at the > bottom of the card > > 3) Create 5 small oval draw graphics and > position them at various locations > on the card > > 4) Place this script in button "Master": > on mouseUp > # THIS ALLOWS EASY EDITING OF THE MASTER > SCRIPT FOR ALL SPRITE OBJECTS > if short name of me is "master" then edit > script of me > end mouseUp > > on activateMe > set the uAllowLife of me to true > set the uRate of me to "3,3" > set the uLimits of me to rect of this cd > moveMe > end activateMe > > on moveMe > if not the uAllowLife of me then exit moveMe > # MANAGE HORIZONTAL MOVEMENT > if item 1 of the uRate of me > 0 then > if right of me > item 3 of the uLimits of > me then > set the uRate of me to ("-3," & item 2 of > the uRate of me) > end if > else > if left of me < item 1 of the uLimits of me > then \ > set the uRate of me to "3," & item 2 of > the uRate of me > end if > # MANAGE VERTICAL MOVEMENT > if item 2 of the uRate of me > 0 then > if bottom of me > item 4 of the uLimits of > me then > set the uRate of me to (item 1 of the > uRate of me & ",-3") > end if > else > if top of me < item 2 of the uLimits of me > then \ > set the uRate of me to (item 1 of the > uRate of me & ",3") > end if > put the loc of me into tLoc > add item 1 of the uRate of me to item 1 of > tLoc > add item 2 of the uRate of me to item 2 of > tLoc > set loc of me to tLoc > send "moveMe" to me in 10 milliseconds > end moveMe > > on killMe > set the uAllowLife of me to false > end killMe > > > 5) Place this script in button "Give Life": > on mouseUp > set the uLife of me to not the uLife of me > if the uLife of me then > repeat with x = 1 to 5 > set script of grc x to script of btn > master > send "activateMe" to grc x in (x*200) > milliseconds > end repeat > else > repeat with x = 1 to 5 > send "killMe" to grc x > end repeat > end if > end mouseUp > > ----- > > Click the "Give Life" button. You should see > the ball "sprites" come to > life one at a time and bounce. When each ball > senses the edge of the screen > it will change direction. Click the "Give > Life" button again to kill all > movement. By adding random/changing values to > the move rates and timing, > you can create some intricate/organic movement > that is handled individually > by each sprite being "self aware". thanks, this will take time to ponder. there must be a tie in with Turtle Graphics. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 19:59:00 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Mon Mar 17 19:59:00 2003 Subject: Shakobox update In-Reply-To: <3E760A97.8030407@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: <20030318005545.85926.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com> --- "J. Landman Gay" wrote: > A revised version of Shakobox, the > HyperCard-style musical notation > stack, has been uploaded to: > > > > This version works around a bug in the MetaCard > engine that caused > installation of the PlayCommand Agent > application to fail on machines > running Mac OS 9. If you plan to run Shakobox > only on an OS X machine > then you don't need this update. However, if > you want to distribute the > PlayCommand Agent app in your own stacks, the > revised scripts should be > used for your installations and you should > download this update. > > There are no other changes to the stack, > outside of working around the > installation problem. nice job. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 20:05:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Mon Mar 17 20:05:01 2003 Subject: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030318010219.91592.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com> --- Monte Goulding wrote: > There is a standard that many people on this > list use where: > - parameter names are prefixed with p > - custom properties are prefixed with c or u > - local variables in the script scope are > prefixed with l > - temporary variables (handler scope) are > prefixed with t > - global variables are prefixed with g > - a new one that I don't use is arrays are > prefixed with a thanks for clarifying that. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Mon Mar 17 20:42:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Mon Mar 17 20:42:01 2003 Subject: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >Yes it's a feature and it's a very powerful one Ok, I'll accept that. But the man page is wrong: it says (and I still don't know how to cut/paste from the documentation; is that possible?) "The property is a built-in property name or a custom property name." That should be "is a property name, or a variable or parameter having a property name as value". Agree? Or does this follow from some statement in the manual that I haven't found yet? -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From monte at sweattechnologies.com Mon Mar 17 21:16:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Mon Mar 17 21:16:01 2003 Subject: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > But the man page is wrong: it says (and I still don't know how to > cut/paste from the documentation; is that possible?) "The > property is a built-in property name or a custom property > name." > > That should be "is a property name, or a variable or parameter having > a property name as value". > > Agree? I agree that some parts of coding in Transcript take a little getting used to. I'm not sure it adds to the clarity of the user guide though. It seems more logical to always assume variables will be evaluated prior to script execution. Is there a situation when this doesn't happen? Monte From curry at pair.com Mon Mar 17 22:03:01 2003 From: curry at pair.com (curry) Date: Mon Mar 17 22:03:01 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <1047901060.276.6141.m12@yahoogroups.com> References: <1047901060.276.6141.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: I think it's too bad there's so little "love" shown between different xCard environment developers, and to a lesser extent (more goodwill) their users. :-) I've heard about things like Linux desktop conferences where vendors of different products work together to inform the public about what's available now, to the common good and the advancement of their shared interests and market although they have competing products. Descendants of HyperCard are certainly receiving less attention than they deserve in the world based on their practical merits, so who knows, it might be productive sometime if users or even the companies which produce the xCard products would do something like this. Why not an xCard product and scripting conference for companies, developers, and the public? (Of course, the first thing is to find good words for calling it, if something is better than "xCard" which I don't think is great for consumers.) Also, from my perspective, I just invest time and money, not my ego or sense of self-esteem and security, into the product I use. In private conversation I've discussed with others about the need for people to convince themselves that they are using the right product and have made the right decision in the "road" they've taken with a product. I think this probably affects some people in all user communities and I've seen confirmation of this behavior in many places. I suppose it's a type of loyalty to others which relates back to yourself because of investment. That tendency obviously is there in the mind for a reason and has a valid place, as long as it doesn't get out of hand, but as a user that has chosen one path I don't mind hearing a bit about the other "road" and that could be a good thing if it is productive and not too negative, and some of that will depend on responses as well as what is being responded to. Just as some collaboration between competitors with xTalk products might help to advance xTalk itself and raise awareness for customers and developers, some communication between users (or even the companies, theoretically although they don't seem too friendly looking at their messages toward each other ;-) might help users and the products. SuperCard and Revolution both have strengths and weaknesses that we cannot deny, and there's really no reason to feel that one has to be vindicated in order to breath easy and continue to use it. Which one is better depends on which strengths and weaknesses you are enthusiastic about and willing to live with, and what are your needs and priorities in using the product. (If you have a lot of money and a wide variety of needs, you can have both!) I think everyone will benefit by both products improving. Some discussions maybe do not belong on the lists and should be elsewhere, and that's up the companies and list owners, but it seems some, such as "what's the best way for a product to accomplish this task" or "should we have this feature, or something else, comparing to the feature of the other product" would be very relevant. As far as RealBasic goes (since it was also mentioned) it has many neat and unique features, but if the choice is available, I like to work with something based on what I admire and believe is the preferable or superior way to do something (the paradigm coming from HyperCard) rather than what I see as the standardized but not necessarily more deserving way that people have been forced to accept (the method coming from Microsoft). You can see the pattern of what becomes standardized vs. what is best everywhere--JavaScript was mentioned on the Rev list, and in the past there were discussions about alternatives to the C language before everyone gave in and shut up about it. I see RB as a lot more than the standard because of its innovations and style, and think it's a good useful product, but I still have to very much prefer using xTalk products and getting the benefits of the xTalk advantages as long as they can deliver the features I need. Best wishes to all those using Revolution and SuperCard and I hope that xCard in general has increasing success that it deserves according to its features! Curry From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Mon Mar 17 22:20:21 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Mon Mar 17 22:20:21 2003 Subject: TCP/IP number and Port Check In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2A5E7BEC-58EE-11D7-928D-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> On Monday, March 17, 2003, at 10:32 pm, Rolf Kocherhans wrote: > Has anyone already made a script which checks a field if a user has > entered a correct > TCP/IP address ? I haven't but 2 approaches spring to mind: 1. try using the hostnameToAddress function to see if the IP number translates to a valid server name. 2. as #1 won't give any answer with an invalid entry, blank entry or one that isn't registered e.g. a local network address, you could write a function that checked that there were 4 sections separated by periods and that each was a number between 0 and 255. > > Also does anyone know from where to where portnumbers go ? here is a link to a site that lists the currently assigned port numbers: http://www.iana.org/assignments/port-numbers Cheers, Sarah From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Mon Mar 17 22:35:00 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Mon Mar 17 22:35:00 2003 Subject: Bug or feature? or: Don't I love the mechanics of expansion In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <16B1C4F2-58F2-11D7-B9E5-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> Exactly one step of evaluation is performed. So if you say send "tt the aaa of me" it will in fact work, and result in "a" being put. When you say send tt && the aaa of me What happens is that tt && the aaa of me is resolved (by the && operator) into "tt a" which is then passed to the evaluator for that one step of evaluation, which results in "a" being interpreted as a variable, resulting in 1 in the message box. On Sunday, March 16, 2003, at 05:42 PM, Victor Eijkhout wrote: > This bug took me an hour or two to find. I don't think I like it. > > on tt arg > put arg > end tt > > on t > set the aaa of me to "a" > put 1 into a > send "tt" && the aaa of me to me > end t > > > Guess what the outcome of `send "t" to field "whatever" is... > > Reading the man page for "send". It says (I couldn't manage to > cut/paste from the dictionary. is that possible?) "If the message is > more than one word, it must be enclosed in double quotes". That is > clearly not true in the above case. > > It also says "Any parameters are evaluted", giving 1+1"> as example. That is less than the whole truth: based on this I > would write which of course is completely > incorrect. > > Anyway, solution: > > send "tt" && quote & the aaa of me & quote > > I guess the correct statement would be > > "send expr to : > > the "expr" is an expression that yields a string of the form "command > arg1,arg2,...". The "argn" expressions are evaluated in the corrent > context, and the resulting command is sent to the whatever handler." > > Ok, quiz time: what is the output of > > on t arg1,arg2 > put arg1 > end t > > on tt > set the aa of me to 3,4 > send "t" && the aa of me to me > end tt > > (I guess, for clarity, another clause is could be added in the above > definition.) > -- > Victor Eijkhout > tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) > http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From kkaufman at snet.net Mon Mar 17 23:06:01 2003 From: kkaufman at snet.net (Kurt Kaufman) Date: Mon Mar 17 23:06:01 2003 Subject: ext_sayString (somewhat OT) Message-ID: <74F0F559-58F6-11D7-8FF6-0003936D1F12@snet.net> Tuviah Snyder wrote: "check out the new revIsSpeaking function in 2.0" Does anyone know if the text-to-speech voices can be manipulated with in-line commands the way it was possible to do so under Mac OS 9 and 10.0.x? For instance, since OS 10.1, they no longer respond to pitch stipulations in such a way as to allow them to "sing". An example: paste the following into SimpleText under Mac OS 9 and the voices sing a well-known song; do the same in TextEdit on OS 10.1 or newer and it doesn't work. [[cmnt For most satisfactory results, use one of the following voices: Princess; Kathy; Junior; Fred; Ralph; Trinoids; Zarvox ]] [[pmod 0]] [[pbas 59]][[rate 100]]i [[pbas 60]][[rate 300]]would [[pbas 62]][[rate 100]]while [[pbas 59]][[rate 200]]ah [[pbas 55]][[rate 100]]way [[pbas 57]][[rate 200]]the [[pbas 59]][[rate 200]]ow [[pbas 55]][[rate 50]]ers [[pbas 57]][[rate 200]]cuhn [[pbas 59]][[rate 100]]vir [[pbas 55]][[rate 200]]sing [[pbas 52]][[rate 100]]with [[pbas 54]][[rate 200]]the [[pbas 55]][[rate 200]]flauw [[pbas 52]][[rate 50]]ers [[pbas 50]][[rate 200]]cun [[pbas 50]][[rate 100]]sult [[pbas 50]][[rate 200]]ting [[pbas 50]][[rate 100]]with [[pbas 50]][[rate 200]]the [[pbas 50]][[rate 50]]rain [[cmnt]] [[slnc 500]] [[cmnt]] [[slnc 500]] [[cmnt]] [[slnc 500]] [[pbas 55]][[rate 100]]and [[pbas 54]][[rate 200]]my [[pbas 52]][[rate 50]]head [[pbas 64]][[rate 100]]ide [[pbas 62]][[rate 200]]be [[pbas 60]][[rate 100]]scrat [[pbas 59]][[rate 200]]chin [[pbas 57]][[rate 100]]while [[rate 10000]]u, [[pbas 55]][[rate 200]]my [[pbas 54]][[rate 100]]thoughts [[pbas 54]][[rate 200]]were [[pbas 66]][[rate 100]]biz [[pbas 64]][[rate 200]]zee [[pbas 62]][[rate 100]]hatch [[pbas 60]][[rate 200]]chin [[pbas 59]][[rate 100]]if [[pbas 57]][[rate 200]]i [[pbas 55]][[rate 100]]own [[pbas 55]][[rate 200]]lee [[pbas 55]][[rate 200]]had [[pbas 55]][[rate 200]]ah [[pbas 55]][[rate 25]]brain From chipp at chipp.com Mon Mar 17 23:36:00 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Mon Mar 17 23:36:00 2003 Subject: Card size on the PC In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Jim just a thought... check the windowboundingrect of the stack best, Chipp > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Jim Hurley > Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 5:42 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Card size on the PC > > > I have discovered that the height of my cards on my PC are limited to > 617. These are stacks created on my Mac where they were the card > heights were 650 or larger. > > I'm afraid I am in alien territory here on the PC. Is there some > constraint on card size on the PC? I see nothing in the preferences. > > Thanks, > > Jim > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Tue Mar 18 00:21:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Tue Mar 18 00:21:01 2003 Subject: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > It seems >more logical to always assume variables will be evaluated prior to script >execution. Yes, but the man page doesn't say that it's a variable: it says that the property thing in the "set" statement is the name of a property. The name. Not "a variable evaluating to a name". And I think that needs to be pointed out explicitly, because the obvious possibilities are 1/ only the actual name is allowed 2/ any expression giving a name. I don't understand at all why here only a name or a variable is allowed. -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Tue Mar 18 00:56:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Tue Mar 18 00:56:01 2003 Subject: Sound conversions [Was: Re: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1205] In-Reply-To: <12.2e7a1299.2ba7bedd@aol.com> References: <12.2e7a1299.2ba7bedd@aol.com> Message-ID: <3E76B447.8070609@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/17/03 6:14 PM, Revinfo1155 at aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 3/17/03 12:40:35 PM, jacque at hyperactivesw.com writes: > >>>Good Question -Can sounds for hypercard be used in Rev.? >> >>Yes, but they'd need to be converted to WAV, au, or AIF format first. > > How does one do the conversion? With a third-party sound program. There are several commercial apps and there may be some shareware ones. QuickTime Pro will do it too. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 00:59:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 00:59:00 2003 Subject: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. In-Reply-To: <200303180100.UAA13858@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 15:38:38 -0800 > Subject: Re: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. > From: Richard Gaskin > > Victor Eijkhout wrote: > >> but I want to use logical sounding names. ---------- > A function named "t" with a parameter named "a" makes their use > self-evident? ---------- No kiddin'...what if there was a need to debug or update in 4 or 5 months after writing a few thousand lines of code elsewhere? How on earth could you tell what they represent? ---------snip > You'll find your code working well -- and possibly easier to read and > maintain -- using these popular naming conventions for variables and > parameters: ---------- Agreed. I probably do a few things differently (e.g., if counting through objects I use bNum for buttons, lNum for lines, etc.), but they still make sense (and would to most). Whenever someone asks me about scripting conventions I send them there. I'm personally grateful you have that site, Richard, and keep it updated. Best regards, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 01:14:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 01:14:01 2003 Subject: ext_sayString In-Reply-To: <200303180100.UAA13858@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********* > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 18:59:09 -0500 > Subject: ext_sayString > From: Tuviah M Snyder > >> You should check to see >> if there is some return value from ext_saystring you can use to >> determine if you need to keep going or not. > check out the new revIsSpeaking function in 2.0 ---------- Really? I haven't bothered to D/L it yet because I don't have time for bug-hunting. But sound feedback and TTS is critical to many of my apps. Thanks for the heads-up. Ken N. From monte at sweattechnologies.com Tue Mar 18 01:20:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Tue Mar 18 01:20:01 2003 Subject: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > It seems > >more logical to always assume variables will be evaluated prior to script > >execution. > > Yes, but the man page doesn't say that it's a variable: it says that > the property thing in the "set" statement is the name of a > property. The name. Not "a variable evaluating to a name". And I > think that needs to be pointed out explicitly, because the obvious > possibilities are 1/ only the actual name is allowed 2/ any > expression giving a name. I don't understand at all why here only a > name or a variable is allowed. You are right. I don't see why if the engine can evaluate a variable it can't also evaluate an expression. All I know is that you get a compile time error if you put an expression there. Perhaps it should be feature requested??? Monte From kray at sonsothunder.com Tue Mar 18 01:58:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Tue Mar 18 01:58:01 2003 Subject: OS X & answer file In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <009c01c2ed1b$23b72420$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Yes, I've noticed that periodically. It isn't consistent in my experience, but it's damn annoying. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > Monte Goulding > Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 6:47 PM > To: Rev List > Subject: OS X & answer file > > > > Hi All > > Has anyone else noticed that OS X.2 is associating files with > apps correctly but not giving them the type codes when > importing from PC???? That means that in the finder the file > looks right but when you do answer file or ask file they are > disabled. This is very frustrating for the user. > > Is this something that apple should be fixing or is it part > of phasing out the resource fork so Rev needs to handle the situation? > > Regards > > Monte > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 02:01:05 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 02:01:05 2003 Subject: Replacing group images In-Reply-To: <200303172226.RAA06936@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: *********** > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 16:13:10 -0500 > From: "John J. Theobald" > Subject: Re: Replacing group images (was Standalone UI's, data stacks, > image files) > Hmmm ... if I am following this correctly, you probably have 2 images > named "myimage", one from the "put" and one from the "create", although > the "create" one probably has no content. ---------- That has merit. I'll check the images further to see if they are there. The import brings it in, and putting it into the previous image changes causes the previous image to be deleted (what I wanted); it starts up with a 'bluescreen' graphic-turned-image named "myImage". I guess I should do it the way you did so I don't end up with 2 images and have to delete one. My code isn't elegant (I'm into elegant scripts, but not I'm not there in Rev yet), but it's simple and I can tell what happened in that part. ---------- > Try doing the "put" AFTER the "create" (actually after the stop editing > group). This should "put" the "it" image into the newly "create"d > "myImage" in "myImageGroup" ---------- I see where your going with this, but I think I already tried it. One of the earlier things I did was assign the bluescreen image under the name "myImage" to the background group "myImageGroup", but it couldn't find "myImage" when I tried to write the new image into it. I guess I just have to keep playing with it until it works. Thanks, Ken N. From janschenkel at yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 02:19:01 2003 From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel) Date: Tue Mar 18 02:19:01 2003 Subject: Replacing group images [OT] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030318071614.99642.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com> --- Ken Norris wrote: > > [snip] > > it starts up with a > 'bluescreen' graphic-turned-image named "myImage". > > [snip] > > Thanks, > Ken N. > Hi Ken, My my, a blue screen at startup... That will inspire confidence in your application. *grin* Are you sure you want people auto-moving towards the Ctrl-Alt-Del combination? Just teasing you, of course. However, just like one should avoid flashing red images (for the epileptic among computer users) programmers in general should avoid 'well-known signs of trouble'. Have a nice day, Jan Schenkel. ===== "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time." (La Rochefoucauld) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From alrice at ARCplanning.com Tue Mar 18 03:03:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Tue Mar 18 03:03:01 2003 Subject: OS X & answer file In-Reply-To: <009c01c2ed1b$23b72420$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: <8AB42688-5917-11D7-976E-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Monday, March 17, 2003, at 11:53 PM, Ken Ray wrote: > Yes, I've noticed that periodically. It isn't consistent in my > experience, but it's damn annoying. There were are a lot of debates about this on cocoa-dev and macosx-dev and such mailing lists. I think Apple's concept of how to deal with file-to-application bindings was evolving right up till the release of Jaguar, so now you have this kind of schizoid situation where some developers do extensions only, some do creator codes only, and some do both. If Rev were to try to accommodate, and I think it should, (every time I check out a .rev file out my version control system, it's creator code gets stripped, and it's not available in Rev's open dialog) Here is a good model to follow: Cocoa has macros for an open file dialog, with filters for file extensions AND creator codes. There is what seems like a combinatorial explosion of file types for the programmer :-) but it does the job. int result; NSArray *fileTypes = [NSArray arrayWithObjects: @"png", @"jpg", @"jpeg", @"tiff", @"tif", @"pdf", @"eps", @"gif", @"pict", @"bmp", NSFileTypeForHFSTypeCode( 'PNG' ), NSFileTypeForHFSTypeCode( 'PGNf' ), NSFileTypeForHFSTypeCode( 'JPEG' ), NSFileTypeForHFSTypeCode( 'TIFF' ), NSFileTypeForHFSTypeCode( 'PDF' ), NSFileTypeForHFSTypeCode( 'GIFf' ), NSFileTypeForHFSTypeCode( 'PICT' ), nil]; NSOpenPanel *oPanel = [NSOpenPanel openPanel]; result = [oPanel runModalForTypes: fileTypes]; Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 03:09:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 03:09:01 2003 Subject: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. In-Reply-To: <200303180659.BAA21329@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ************ > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 20:39:08 -0500 > From: Victor Eijkhout > Subject: RE: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. > > (and I still don't know how to > cut/paste from the documentation; is that possible?) ---------- Option/drag puts any text in the docs into the cilpboard. HTH, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 03:23:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 03:23:01 2003 Subject: Stuck in "Background" window In-Reply-To: <200303180659.BAA21329@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Well here I go again. This thing keeps ending up in the stack's background window instead of the card window. on mouseUp set the defaultFolder to "Doggies" answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" lock screen import paint from file it set itemDel to "/" cut image (last item of it) start editing group "myImageGroup" paste image (last item of it) send "stop editing" to me in 20 milliseconds open window "Practice1" -- **Even with this unlock screen send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds end mouseUp ...any ideas? TIA, Ken N. From malte.brill at t-online.de Tue Mar 18 04:10:02 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Tue Mar 18 04:10:02 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303172227.RAA07016@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hi List, this one goes out to the math experts. How does one compute the area ( I hope it is the correct Term for flaecheninhalt in german) of a polygon with n sides. (That would get me started.) I want to extract all lines of 2 polygons by analysing their points, evaluate the area of each of them with some magic formula I don?t know ;-) and to figure out the area of the smallest polygon surrounding both of them. Any help will be greatly apprecheated! Regards, Malte From luigi.di-martino at ntlworld.com Tue Mar 18 04:14:01 2003 From: luigi.di-martino at ntlworld.com (Luigi Di Martino) Date: Tue Mar 18 04:14:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available Message-ID: <002001c2ecda$92968980$e7cc0150@lou8hr2yeio1dm> Hi I've just joined the list and it was mainly, for now anyway, because of this question about Midi. I was wondering if you could answer for me if it is possible to map a midi note to another midi note. For example, can a scale be represented as midi numbers, like 64 66 68 69 etc, signifying C D E F, and then to map that to 70 72 73 as the output, for example? So an input note (the key pressed on the piano keyboard for example) gets outputted as a different note. I can see that perhaps code can be written into a standalone midi file processor and, when a midi file is imported into it, can change the output of the midi file, and these changes can be saved to another midi file. If you could help me answer this question and whether Revolution will allow me to do this I would be very grateful. I would like to get an application together that does things like this to midi files and then to take that into a sequencer. Or perhaps I can build a midi sequencer with Revolution? As you would have gathered I am very new to programming! Thank you Lui --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release Date: 27/01/2003 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From malte.brill at t-online.de Tue Mar 18 04:58:01 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Tue Mar 18 04:58:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons [OT] In-Reply-To: <200303172227.RAA07016@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hi list, I hope you don?t mind this silly off topic post, but sometimes it is quite teasing not being a native speaker. >Any help will be greatly apprecheated! *Lol* Sorry, I mean appreciated. I don?t want to cheat you afterwards, really! (apres cheated haha.) Think I?m getting nuts with all of this math. Regards, Malte From wouter.abraham at pi.be Tue Mar 18 07:07:01 2003 From: wouter.abraham at pi.be (wouter) Date: Tue Mar 18 07:07:01 2003 Subject: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. Message-ID: <6903E0A5-5939-11D7-8890-000502990960@pi.be> > Bug or feature? or: Don't I love the mechanics of expansion > > * From: Victor Eijkhout > * Subject: Bug or feature? or: Don't I love the mechanics of > expansion > * Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 17:42:18 -0800 > > This bug took me an hour or two to find. I don't think I like it. > > on tt arg > put arg > end tt > > > on t > set the aaa of me to "a" > put 1 into a > send "tt" && the aaa of me to me > end t > ---snip > Anyway, solution: > > send "tt" && quote & the aaa of me & quote > ------snip > on t arg1,arg2 > put arg1 > end t > > > on tt > set the aa of me to 3,4 > send "t" && the aa of me to me > end tt > > > (I guess, for clarity, another clause is could be added in the above > definition.) > -- > Victor Eijkhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) > http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ > _______________________________________________ Hi Victor, AFAICS it is all very consistent. No bug at all. In the first handler : on tt arg put arg end tt on t set the aaa of me to "a" ##### makes a custom property called "aaa" and the char "a" is put into it put 1 into a ##### a variable "a" is initiated with "1" send "tt" && the aaa of me to me ##### the send command resolves to send "tt" && "a" ##### In this case there is also a variable a which contains "1" so this variable is passed end t if one uses : send "tt" && quote & the aaa of me & quote then the output is "a" If "3,4" is put into a then the output of this handler is "3,4" One can see that the params are resolved 1 time (hope I used the right expression as I am not a pro) In the next case : on t arg1,arg2 put arg1 end t on tt set the aa of me to 3,4 send "t" && the aa of me to me end tt The custom property is set to "3,4" The send command is resolved to send "tt" && "3,4" which is as if passing 2 parameters If one replaces set the aa of me to "3,4" with set the aa of me to "3 - 4" then the send command resolves to send "tt" && "-1" Try this : on t arg1,arg2,arg3 put arg1 && arg2 && arg3 end t on tt set the aa of me to "a,b" put "3,4" into a send "t" && the aa of me to me end tt then the send command resolves to send "t" && "3,4,b" > If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. > > * From: Victor Eijkhout > * Subject: If this is a feature, it's a nasty one. > * Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 15:22:12 -0800 > > In other words, I consider this a bug. > > on mouseup > send "t 1" to me > end mouseup > > > on t a > set the a of me to "bar" > end t > > > Guess what property gets set on mouseup? > > And what's worse, I don't see how I can hack my way around it, because > is illegal. Ok, take a different name for the > parameter, but I want to use logical sounding names. The above case : on mouseup send "t 1" to me end mouseup on t a set the a of me to "bar" end t Here a custom property is created with the name contained in a. In this case if a custom property has a number as name or even a space as name then it can only be called by a variable containing the number or the space. on t a set the a of me to "bar" put the a of me ##### or put 1 into b; put the b of me end t So as you can see it is rather consistent ( and if I'm wrong, shoot me :-) Have a nice day, WA From kkaufman at snet.net Tue Mar 18 08:10:01 2003 From: kkaufman at snet.net (Kurt Kaufman) Date: Tue Mar 18 08:10:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available Message-ID: <6DE127EA-5942-11D7-B37C-0003936D1F12@snet.net> >>>I was wondering if you could answer for me if = it is possible to map a midi note to another midi note. For example, can = a scale be represented as midi numbers, like 64 66 68 69 etc, signifying = C D E F, and then to map that to 70 72 73 as the output, for example? So = an input note (the key pressed on the piano keyboard for example) gets = outputted as a different note. <<< This would not be difficult, as a transposition mechanism would simply add to or subtract from a given note number. This would be done "at the top", i.e. immediately upon input, or, if a series of note numbers is saved in a container such as a field or variable, before the series is translated into MIDI data. >>>I can see that perhaps code can be = written into a standalone midi file processor and, when a midi file is = imported into it, can change the output of the midi file, and these = changes can be saved to another midi file. <<< Here's the difficult part though: it's much more straightforward to create a MIDI file from piano-style keyboard entry or HyperCard-style representations than it is to import an external MIDI file (as I've mentioned before, many MIDI files contain proprietary and/or hardware-specific data which would have to be filtered out). However, in the long run, MIDI file import would probably be the way to go, as opposed to a HyperCard-style shorthand, since the core of the "Standard MIDI File" (SMF) is a generally accepted way to share MIDI data. If the goal is to enable transfer of data only between applications that "understand" the HyperCard-style shorthand, then the job is likely considerably easier. In any case, since you mentioned that you are new to programming, I have to say that I don't think that working with MIDI is a reasonable first programming project (unless you already understand how MIDI works). Once you get familiar with Revolution, take a look at the MIDI Builder stack (included with Revolution 2), and you might get some ideas as to how to implement the first part of your question, above. HTH, Kurt From kevin at runrev.com Tue Mar 18 09:03:00 2003 From: kevin at runrev.com (Kevin Miller) Date: Tue Mar 18 09:03:00 2003 Subject: OS X & answer file In-Reply-To: <8AB42688-5917-11D7-976E-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: On 18/3/03 7:59 am, Alex Rice wrote: > If Rev were to try to accommodate, and I think it should, (every time I > check out a .rev file out my version control system, it's creator code > gets stripped, and it's not available in Rev's open dialog) Here is a > good model to follow: Saving the stack will restore the creator type. You can bypass the File menu problem in 2.0 by holding down the option key when choosing open. We're looking at a way to allow handling both the .rev extension and the file type together in that dialog, but I don't know for sure if it will make the cut for 2.0 or not. Kevin Kevin Miller Runtime Revolution Limited: Software at the Speed of Thought Tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165. Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707. From mirrorman54 at hotmail.com Tue Mar 18 09:24:01 2003 From: mirrorman54 at hotmail.com (Luigi Di Martino) Date: Tue Mar 18 09:24:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available Message-ID: Hi Kurt Thanks ever so much for your explanation. Your last paragraph especially has made my mind up to go get the Revolution 2.0. I will download the beta version and wait for any other releases. My goal is to build an application for messing around with midi, where I can map one chord, say, and have it come out as an entirely other chord (but to a set of logical rules), or to make hybrid scales from other well known scales. I am doing this because of some information I found when music is mirrored. I tried getting on with Visual Basic but it is not as easy as the Revolutuion language which I am getting more confident about as I do the tutorials. Lui >From: Kurt Kaufman >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >Subject: Scripted musical notation available Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 >08:06:27 -0500 > > >>>I was wondering if you could answer for me if = >it is possible to map a midi note to another midi note. For example, can = >a scale be represented as midi numbers, like 64 66 68 69 etc, signifying = >C D E F, and then to map that to 70 72 73 as the output, for example? So = >an input note (the key pressed on the piano keyboard for example) gets = >outputted as a different note. <<< > >This would not be difficult, as a transposition mechanism would simply add >to or subtract from a given note number. This would be done "at the top", >i.e. immediately upon input, or, if a series of note numbers is saved in a >container such as a field or variable, before the series is translated into >MIDI data. > > >>>I can see that perhaps code can be = >written into a standalone midi file processor and, when a midi file is = >imported into it, can change the output of the midi file, and these = >changes can be saved to another midi file. <<< > > >Here's the difficult part though: it's much more straightforward to create >a MIDI file from piano-style keyboard entry or HyperCard-style >representations than it is to import an external MIDI file (as I've >mentioned before, many MIDI files contain proprietary and/or >hardware-specific data which would have to be filtered out). However, in >the long run, MIDI file import would probably be the way to go, as opposed >to a HyperCard-style shorthand, since the core of the "Standard MIDI File" >(SMF) is a generally accepted way to share MIDI data. >If the goal is to enable transfer of data only between applications that >"understand" the HyperCard-style shorthand, then the job is likely >considerably easier. > >In any case, since you mentioned that you are new to programming, I have to >say that I don't think that working with MIDI is a reasonable first >programming project (unless you already understand how MIDI works). Once >you get familiar with Revolution, take a look at the MIDI Builder stack >(included with Revolution 2), and you might get some ideas as to how to >implement the first part of your question, above. > >HTH, >Kurt > >_______________________________________________ >use-revolution mailing list >use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution _________________________________________________________________ Stay in touch with MSN Messenger http://messenger.msn.co.uk From richmond at mail.maclaunch.com Tue Mar 18 09:37:00 2003 From: richmond at mail.maclaunch.com (Mathewson) Date: Tue Mar 18 09:37:00 2003 Subject: Importing Mainstacks ? Message-ID: Does anybody know if it is possible to import a mainstack as a substack of another mainstack? Probably this question has been asked many times before.............. It would save a lot of work. Richmond Mathewson --------------------------------------------------------------- Great Macintosh Products The MacLaunch Store! http://www.maclaunch.com/cgi-launch/store/agora.cgi --------------------------------------------------------------- From RGould8 at aol.com Tue Mar 18 09:48:01 2003 From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com) Date: Tue Mar 18 09:48:01 2003 Subject: Way to put PPPoE status in menubar? Message-ID: <181.1870b717.2ba88ac5@aol.com> I'm trying to figure out how to get Revolution to put the PPPoE status in the menubar in Mac OS X. (Basically mimicing what happens if the user were to check the "show PPP status in menubar" checkbox in the networking pane). After digging around in the web for a bit, I read that this will do the trick in the terminal window: /System/Library/CoreServices/Menu Extras/PPPoE.menu However, when I go into the "Library" folder, I don't see this CoreServices directory. I'm assuming if I can get this working in terminal, then there's a way to get AppleScript to make a call to the terminal from Revolution to execute the command. Anyone have an idea of what this syntax might look like? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From brad at activadesign.com Tue Mar 18 09:52:01 2003 From: brad at activadesign.com (Bradley Borch) Date: Tue Mar 18 09:52:01 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: <200303181425.JAA29648@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <90B35C30-5950-11D7-8CC8-000393DBAE7A@activadesign.com> Somebody responded earlier regarding getting Flash to talk to Rev. Apparently there's a QTdebug hook built for LSP users. Flash documentation also mentions communicating to host apps via ActiveX. Sorry for the ignorance, but is there some documentation that discusses how these layers work together (Rev-specific or otherwise)? PS As I've said before, I'd be excited about using Rev if I could imbed Flash files for animation and interfaces. If I'm the only one interested in this I'll shut up and lurk ;-] From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 10:38:01 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Tue Mar 18 10:38:01 2003 Subject: Rev and mySQL Message-ID: <20030318153428.47295.qmail@web20422.mail.yahoo.com> Does anyone have a good example of using Revolution with a mySQL database? I'm looking specifically for something that uses embedded mySQL because we'd like the database to be as transparent as possible. We don't want to require that users start up a database server anytime they want to run our program. Granted this can be done at boot up, but it's an extra installation step that we'd rather not have to go through. Anyway, I'm not extremely familiar with mySQL or how it works. I just read a little about the embedded features and it piqued my interest. I'm not sure if this is even possible with Revolution. If anyone has anything they could share, I'd be very grateful. Thanks, Chris Sheffield Read Naturally __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From kray at sonsothunder.com Tue Mar 18 10:52:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Tue Mar 18 10:52:01 2003 Subject: OS X & answer file In-Reply-To: <8AB42688-5917-11D7-976E-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: <00d001c2ed65$cb8dc1a0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> > > Yes, I've noticed that periodically. It isn't consistent in my > > experience, but it's damn annoying. > > There were are a lot of debates about this on cocoa-dev and > macosx-dev > and such mailing lists. I think Apple's concept of how to deal with > file-to-application bindings was evolving right up till the > release of > Jaguar, so now you have this kind of schizoid situation where some > developers do extensions only, some do creator codes only, > and some do > both. And if it was only Rev, I wouldn't have that much of a problem, but it's happened to me in Excel on Office X; I go to open a tab-delimited text file and the open dialog shows it grayed out like it can't be selected, but it *is* selectable, and when I do so I can open the file. Go figure... Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From kray at sonsothunder.com Tue Mar 18 10:56:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Tue Mar 18 10:56:01 2003 Subject: Importing Mainstacks ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <00d101c2ed66$56bd7860$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> If you're trying to end up with substacks that have their own substacks, I'm sorry, but you're SOL; substacks can't have substacks. If you try to do make a mainstack with substacks as a substack of another mainstack, you will most likely get it "flattened" (i.e. both the mainstack you're importing along with its substacks all become substacks of the mainstack). Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Mathewson > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 7:47 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Importing Mainstacks ? > > > Does anybody know if it is possible to import a mainstack as > a substack of another mainstack? > > Probably this question has been asked many times before.............. > > It would save a lot of work. > > Richmond Mathewson > --------------------------------------------------------------- > Great Macintosh Products > The MacLaunch Store! > http://www.maclaunch.com/cgi-> launch/store/agora.cgi > > > --------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From kray at sonsothunder.com Tue Mar 18 11:10:00 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Tue Mar 18 11:10:00 2003 Subject: Way to put PPPoE status in menubar? In-Reply-To: <181.1870b717.2ba88ac5@aol.com> Message-ID: <00d201c2ed68$51afc290$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> You can do it this way with Rev 2: on mouseUp set the hideConsoleWindows to true get shell("open " & quote & "/System/Library/CoreServices/Menu Extras/PPPoE.menu" & quote) end mouseUp Works for me in 10.2.4, Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ -----Original Message----- From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of RGould8 at aol.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 8:44 AM To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com Subject: Way to put PPPoE status in menubar? I'm trying to figure out how to get Revolution to put the PPPoE status in the menubar in Mac OS X. (Basically mimicing what happens if the user were to check the "show PPP status in menubar" checkbox in the networking pane). After digging around in the web for a bit, I read that this will do the trick in the terminal window: /System/Library/CoreServices/Menu Extras/PPPoE.menu However, when I go into the "Library" folder, I don't see this CoreServices directory. I'm assuming if I can get this working in terminal, then there's a way to get AppleScript to make a call to the terminal from Revolution to execute the command. Anyone have an idea of what this syntax might look like? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jhurley at infostations.com Tue Mar 18 11:12:00 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Tue Mar 18 11:12:00 2003 Subject: Card size on the PC In-Reply-To: <200303180659.BAA21338@www.runrev.com> References: <200303180659.BAA21338@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > >Jim Hurley wrote: > > I have discovered that the height of my cards on my PC are limited to >> 617. These are stacks created on my Mac where they were the card >> heights were 650 or larger. >> >> I'm afraid I am in alien territory here on the PC. Is there some >> constraint on card size on the PC? I see nothing in the preferences. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Jim > >Chipp Walters wrote: > > >Jim > >just a thought... > >check the windowboundingrect of the stack > >best, > >Chipp Chipp, Thank you so much. You relieved me of much frustration. No matter how hard I pulled down on the resizing icon, I could not make the card longer. I never ran into this problem on the Mac. The windowboundingrect is larger on the Mac than on the PC in order to accommodate the difference between the menu bar and the task bar. Jim From jhurley at infostations.com Tue Mar 18 11:17:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Tue Mar 18 11:17:01 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: <200303180659.BAA21338@www.runrev.com> References: <200303180659.BAA21338@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: As many have said, there is one positive aspects to the variety of xCard application and that is the variety of features available. SuperCard remains valuable to me for its ability to export vector graphics, something not yet available in MC or RR due to cross-platform issues. But my fingers are crossed. Jim From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Tue Mar 18 11:25:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Tue Mar 18 11:25:01 2003 Subject: Stuck in "Background" window In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E77479D.2030409@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/17/03 11:28 PM, Ken Norris wrote: > Well here I go again. This thing keeps ending up in the stack's background > window instead of the card window. > > on mouseUp > set the defaultFolder to "Doggies" > answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" > lock screen > import paint from file it > set itemDel to "/" > cut image (last item of it) > start editing group "myImageGroup" > paste image (last item of it) > send "stop editing" to me in 20 milliseconds > open window "Practice1" -- **Even with this > unlock screen > send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds > end mouseUp > > ...any ideas? The "stop editing" command needs a background reference. It should be "stop editing bg 'myImageGroup'", or "stop editing this bg". Also, I don't think you need to "send" the "stop editing" command, it should just work inline, but I haven't tested it. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From RGould8 at aol.com Tue Mar 18 13:04:01 2003 From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com) Date: Tue Mar 18 13:04:01 2003 Subject: Way to put PPPoE status in menubar? Message-ID: <104.2a71aab3.2ba8b89a@aol.com> Thanks! This is just what I'm looking for, except one thing - - - since this is for a commercial application, I can't use the beta of Rev 2. If I can just get this working in Applescript, then I can get this working in Rev 1.1.1 with the Applescript PowerAdd-ons OSAX to make calls to the unix shell. The problem I'm having is that if I do: Shell "open /System/Library/CoreServices/Menu Extras/PPPoE.menu" in Applescript, it gives me this error: No such file: /System/Library/CoreServices/Menu This makes me think that AppleScript doesn't like the space after the word "Menu". AppleScript also doesn't like when I put quotes in the shell command like this: Shell (open "/System/Library/CoreServices/Menu Extras/PPPoE.menu") it then says "can't open file due to AppleEvent error". So unfortunately, this is turning more into an AppleScript problem as opposed to a Revolution problem, but either way, I'm still somewhat stuck. Any advice is appreciated. In a message dated 3/18/03 11:13:35 AM, kray at sonsothunder.com writes: > > You can do it this way with Rev 2: > > ? > > on mouseUp > > ? set the hideConsoleWindows to true > > ? get shell("open " & quote & "/System/Library/CoreServices/Menu > Extras/PPPoE.menu" & quote) > > end mouseUp > > ? > > Works for me in 10.2.4, > > ? > > > Ken Ray > Sons of Thunder Software > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of RGould8 at aol.com > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 8:44 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Way to put PPPoE status in menubar? > > > I'm trying to figure out how to get Revolution to put the PPPoE status in > the menubar in Mac OS X.? (Basically mimicing what happens if the user were > to check the "show PPP status in menubar" checkbox in the networking pane). > > After digging around in the web for a bit, I read that this will do the > trick in the terminal window: > > /System/Library/CoreServices/Menu Extras/PPPoE.menu > > However, when I go into the "Library" folder, I don't see this CoreServices > directory.? I'm assuming if I can get this working in terminal, then > there's a way to get AppleScript to make a call to the terminal from > Revolution to execute the command.? Anyone have an idea of what this syntax > might look like? > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dsc at swcp.com Tue Mar 18 13:08:01 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Tue Mar 18 13:08:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <29B98284-596C-11D7-8BC9-000A9567A3E6@swcp.com> On Tuesday, March 18, 2003, at 02:06 AM, Malte Brill wrote: > I want to extract all lines of 2 polygons by analysing their points, > evaluate the area of each of them with some magic formula I don?t know > ;-) Figure out how to get the area of a triangle. Then come up with a way to methodically break up a polygon into triangles. Add up the areas of those. > and to figure out the area of the smallest polygon surrounding both of > them. Do you mean a smallest polygon that contains exactly the union of the points in the two polygons? (If the polygons do not overlap this might include a thin bridge with no area.) Or do you mean the smallest _convex_ polygon such that all points in the two polygons are in the generated polygon? (By convex, I mean all angles at corners are <= 180 degrees, that there are no "dents" in the sides.) Dar Scott From kray at sonsothunder.com Tue Mar 18 15:13:07 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:13:07 2003 Subject: Way to put PPPoE status in menubar? In-Reply-To: <104.2a71aab3.2ba8b89a@aol.com> Message-ID: <000f01c2ed7a$5e720940$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> You need to put quotes around the file path because "Menu Extras" is two words. You'll notice I did that in the Rev code; you'll need to do that in the AppleScript code instead. (Oh, and one last thing... I just noticed your posts and my reply was in HTML - I've converted this response to plain text and you should tweak your email client to only send plain text posts to the list.) Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ -----Original Message----- From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of RGould8 at aol.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 12:00 PM To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com Subject: Re: Way to put PPPoE status in menubar? Thanks! This is just what I'm looking for, except one thing - - - since this is for a commercial application, I can't use the beta of Rev 2. If I can just get this working in Applescript, then I can get this working in Rev 1.1.1 with the Applescript PowerAdd-ons OSAX to make calls to the unix shell. The problem I'm having is that if I do: Shell "open /System/Library/CoreServices/Menu Extras/PPPoE.menu" in Applescript, it gives me this error: No such file: /System/Library/CoreServices/Menu This makes me think that AppleScript doesn't like the space after the word "Menu". AppleScript also doesn't like when I put quotes in the shell command like this: Shell (open "/System/Library/CoreServices/Menu Extras/PPPoE.menu") it then says "can't open file due to AppleEvent error". So unfortunately, this is turning more into an AppleScript problem as opposed to a Revolution problem, but either way, I'm still somewhat stuck. Any advice is appreciated. In a message dated 3/18/03 11:13:35 AM, kray at sonsothunder.com writes: You can do it this way with Rev 2: on mouseUp set the hideConsoleWindows to true get shell("open " & quote & "/System/Library/CoreServices/Menu Extras/PPPoE.menu" & quote) end mouseUp Works for me in 10.2.4, Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ -----Original Message----- From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of RGould8 at aol.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 8:44 AM To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com Subject: Way to put PPPoE status in menubar? I'm trying to figure out how to get Revolution to put the PPPoE status in the menubar in Mac OS X. (Basically mimicing what happens if the user were to check the "show PPP status in menubar" checkbox in the networking pane). After digging around in the web for a bit, I read that this will do the trick in the terminal window: /System/Library/CoreServices/Menu Extras/PPPoE.menu However, when I go into the "Library" folder, I don't see this CoreServices directory. I'm assuming if I can get this working in terminal, then there's a way to get AppleScript to make a call to the terminal from Revolution to execute the command. Anyone have an idea of what this syntax might look like? From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 15:13:45 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:13:45 2003 Subject: Replacing group images [OT] In-Reply-To: <200303181425.JAA29634@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 23:16:14 -0800 (PST) > From: Jan Schenkel > Subject: Re: Replacing group images [OT] > Hi Ken, > > My my, a blue screen at startup... That will inspire > confidence in your application. *grin* > Are you sure you want people auto-moving towards the > Ctrl-Alt-Del combination? > > Just teasing you, of course. However, just like one > should avoid flashing red images (for the epileptic > among computer users) programmers in general should > avoid 'well-known signs of trouble'. ---------- No, no. You don't understand. 1) This is strictly a little 4 inch practice stack to experiment with replacing background group images from image files. It's not a real program. No one will see it but me. 2) The 'bluescreen' is just a background graphic-turned-image, there for the purpose of telling where a layer is. If it still shows, then the image definitely didn't replace it. If it's missing altogether with no imported image, then something moved or deleted it. If the imported image shows, then either it's over the bluescreen background group, or it replaced it (what I want). ...stuff like that. Besides, I'm a Mac user. I've never seen a bluescreen that indicates trouble of any kind ;-) Also, it's a standard used in the film and video industry (and used to be in early Amiga computer video) for SFX, as a backdrop to shoot out images. You shoot scenes in the studio with the blue background, then REPLACE the blue with other images which gives the impression the foreground figures are acting somehere they never were. Now, how about the actual problem? How do I replace background group images from files? I've been working on this for days, with only partial successes here and there. Best regards, Ken N. From ambassador at fourthworld.com Tue Mar 18 15:14:23 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:14:23 2003 Subject: Supercard vs. Rev In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Jim Hurley wrote: > SuperCard remains valuable to me for its ability to export vector > graphics, something not yet available in MC or RR due to > cross-platform issues. But my fingers are crossed. Have you seen the SVG Exporter for Rev? You'll find it in the Stacks listing in RevNet. It's jus a proof-of-concept at the moment, but if you have time on your hands you could flesh it out into something useful (to the degree that you can find programs that read SVG, that is ). -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From scott at tactilemedia.com Tue Mar 18 15:20:29 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:20:29 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: <90B35C30-5950-11D7-8CC8-000393DBAE7A@activadesign.com> Message-ID: > As I've said before, I'd be excited about using Rev if I could imbed > Flash files for animation and interfaces. If I'm the only one > interested in this I'll shut up and lurk ;-] I don't think you're the only one interested, I think there's simply the problem of reliability. As far as I know, the interactive side of Flash has never worked well under QuickTime, until maybe recently with QT 6. Even then, I seem to recall some folks saying that clicks and other mouse events do not always get processed reliably or can happen slowly. There may also be an issue of version (there was in the past): does QT6 support FlashMX or Flash 5? But in terms of animation, you should be set; just make sure you allow for the brief QT initialization delay when starting up your stack. The interesting thing is, you can do much of what Flash offers natively within Rev. The only major elements really missing are built-in anti-aliasing, morphing and of course compression, but otherwise, you can do some decent animation/effects. (With the help of Rich Hertz, I put together an ease-in function that seems to work pretty well for moving objects. When time permits, we'll post a demo.) I think many folks would like to use Flash within Rev/MC as long as the performance is there. Perhaps you might try some additional experiments and report back to the list. Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design ----- E: scott at tactilemedia.com W: http://www.tactilemedia.com From alrice at ARCplanning.com Tue Mar 18 15:22:41 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:22:41 2003 Subject: OS X & answer file In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <97DEBDFE-597E-11D7-8A8A-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Tuesday, March 18, 2003, at 06:47 AM, Kevin Miller wrote: > > Saving the stack will restore the creator type. You can bypass the > File > menu problem in 2.0 by holding down the option key when choosing open. > We're looking at a way to allow handling both the .rev extension and > the > file type together in that dialog, but I don't know for sure if it > will make > the cut for 2.0 or not. > In 1.1.1 I found that I can work around this by opening Rev first, then double-clicking on my stack file in the Finder. This opens the stack in Rev, then I can save, and proceed. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 15:24:54 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:24:54 2003 Subject: Stuck in "Background" window In-Reply-To: <200303181701.MAA03316@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:21:49 -0600 > From: "J. Landman Gay" > Organization: HyperActive Software > Subject: Re: Stuck in "Background" window > > On 3/17/03 11:28 PM, Ken Norris wrote: >> Well here I go again. This thing keeps ending up in the stack's background >> window instead of the card window. >> >> on mouseUp >> set the defaultFolder to "Doggies" >> answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" >> lock screen >> import paint from file it >> set itemDel to "/" >> cut image (last item of it) >> start editing group "myImageGroup" >> paste image (last item of it) >> send "stop editing" to me in 20 milliseconds >> open window "Practice1" -- **Even with this >> unlock screen >> send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds >> end mouseUp >> >> ...any ideas? > > The "stop editing" command needs a background reference. It should be > "stop editing bg 'myImageGroup'", or "stop editing this bg". ---------- According to the docs, you don't need that unless you are closing a background other than the one you're currently working on, but I will certainly try it... OK, it had no effect. The thing still ends up in the background window. ---------- > Also, I > don't think you need to "send" the "stop editing" command, it should > just work inline, but I haven't tested it. ---------- Probably true. It wasn't like that to start with. I was just fishing for a cure. That made no difference either. I tried replacing the line with: 1) stop editing group "myImageGroup" then: 2) send "stop editing group myImageGroup" to me in 20 milliseconds then: 3_) stop editing (like it was originally) Also I tried a number of commands which should have closed the background window, opened the "Practice1" window , etc. None affected it at all. What I end up with _every time_ is a window in the place of the stack window with a titlebar that says: [ Practice1(background"myIma... ] In the Rev UI, I can make it go away by clicking "Practice1" in the "Window" menu, which is ALREADY checked. This brings back my stack window in editing mode (pointer) which indicates the script is quitting at the "stop editing" command without an error, but at least it shows the background with the proper image installed. Now (get this), while stuck in the background window, if I click the 'browse' tool, the background window disappears, and the image is behind the buttons. NOTE: I said the IMAGE. The imported image is there (which was supposed to be grouped), and the original graphic image is under it, but the background group is empty and inaccessible (although the Application overview says it's still there). All I want to do is be able to _replace_ a background group image with another image from a file, under script control. I'm beginning to think it cannot be done. I've tried everything I can find or think of. I have spent at least 40 houirs poring over the docs, archives, emailing the list, trying all kinds of methods, and rewriting, bending and twisting scripts until I have blisters on my fingers. Still no success. If it _can_ be done, it shouldn't be this difficult. Am I really trying to do something that's never been done before? Hard to believe. Thanks, Ken N. From alrice at ARCplanning.com Tue Mar 18 15:26:13 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:26:13 2003 Subject: Rev and mySQL In-Reply-To: <20030318153428.47295.qmail@web20422.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3630B0B4-597F-11D7-8A8A-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Tuesday, March 18, 2003, at 08:34 AM, Chris Sheffield wrote: > Anyway, I'm not extremely familiar with mySQL or how > it works. I just read a little about the embedded > features and it piqued my interest. I'm not sure if > this is even possible with Revolution. If anyone has > anything they could share, I'd be very grateful. I'm pretty sure that the mysql support in Rev is client-side only and doesn't support embedding the mysql engine. You might want to look into Valentina instead- because it IS a single-user embedded database. Also, have you looked into using custom properties of a data stack? It's not SQL but very flexible and quick, and doesn't rely on any extra libraries or anything. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From jhurley at infostations.com Tue Mar 18 15:28:29 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:28:29 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303181425.JAA29648@www.runrev.com> References: <200303181425.JAA29648@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > >Message: 6 >Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:06:57 +0100 >Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons >From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) >To: >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > >Hi List, > > >this one goes out to the math experts. >How does one compute the area ( I hope it is the correct Term for >flaecheninhalt in german) of a polygon with n sides. > >(That would get me started.) > >I want to extract all lines of 2 polygons by analysing their points, >evaluate the area of each of them with some magic formula I don?t know ;-) >and to figure out the area of the smallest polygon surrounding both of them. > >Any help will be greatly apprecheated! > >Regards, > >Malte > Hi Malte, I'm not quite sure what you have in mind. Are these "regular" polygons? But the following might help get you started. Put a list of points (x,y coordinates) which defined the polygon into field 1. The run the following: on mouseUp put field 1 into tList put 0 into area put line 1 of tList into pOld repeat with i = 1 to the number of lines in tList put line i of tList into pNew add thisToArea(pNew,pOld) to area put pNew into pOld end repeat put area end mouseUp function thisToArea ptNew,ptOld put item 1 of ptNew into xNew put item 2 of ptNew into yNew put item 1 of ptOld into xOld put item 2 of ptOld into yOld return -(xNew - xOld)*(yNew + yOld)/2 end thisToArea The area will be found in the message box. For example if field 1 contains the following: 0,0 100,0 100,100 0,100 0,0 The area should be 10,000 Depending on what you have in mind, this might be much easier using Turtle Graphics. Hope this gets you going. Jim From rogerguay at centurytel.net Tue Mar 18 15:45:01 2003 From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:45:01 2003 Subject: Launch Command In-Reply-To: <200303170418.XAA08336@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > Thanks to all for your prompt reply, but nothing works! I've tried: > > Launch "/Hard Disk/Applications/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/Macintosh HD/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/HD/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit.app" > Launch "/Hard Disk/Applications/GetIt/TextEdit.app" > > I have assured myself that I do have a copy of TextEdit in the > Aplications folder. I then tried putting a copy of TextEdit on the > desktop and one in the RunRev application Folder and tried: > > Launch "TextEdit.app" > > Nothing works. Bummer!!! Any other suggestions? > > Cheers, Roger > > > > --__--__-- > > Message: 5 > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 02:35:31 +0100 > Subject: Re: Launch Command > From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?= > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > launch "/applications/textedit.app" > > > What's the name of your drive? "Hard Disk", "HD", or "Macintosh HD"? > Whichever it is, the other two of course won't work. > > If it's a name with a space, just for the heck of it try escaping the > space: "Macintosh\ HD". > -- > Victor Eijkhout > tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) > http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ > > > answer file "Select TexEdit:"; put it > > -- > Richard Gaskin > Fourth World Media Corporation > Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site > > Message: 13 > From: "Ken Ray" > To: > Subject: RE: Launch Command > Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 22:13:09 -0600 > Organization: Sons of Thunder Software > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > Hang on, hang on... if you're running under OS X, applications are > really bundles, which are seen as "folders" to Rev; in fact, if you do > a > simple: > > answer file "Pick TextEdit";put it > > you get: > > /Applications/TextEdit.app/ > > pass that to the launch command: > > launch "/Applications/TextEdit.app/" > > and it launches TextEdit. (BTW, it launches without the trailing slash > as well.) > > In any time when you have a question about problems with file paths, > always do the "answer file...; put it" command to see what Rev thinks > the filename should be. > > Try that and let us know if it works or not. > > Ken Ray > Sons of Thunder Software > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > Again, thanks to all for your help in this problem. When I try "answer fileTextEdit; put it" or "answer fileTextEdit.app; put it", I get the "Pick" window with the Desktop hilited. If I navigate back to the "Applications" folder in this "Pick" window, none of the applications are clickable, i.e. they are dimmed! Furthermore, launch "/Applications/TextEdit.app/" doesn't work. Also, my Hard Disk is labeled Macintosh HD, and I've tried using every suggested variation of addressing the Hard Disk. Nothing works . . . .Major Bummer!! Any other suggestions? Thanks, Roger From Cubist at aol.com Tue Mar 18 15:46:02 2003 From: Cubist at aol.com (Cubist at aol.com) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:46:02 2003 Subject: Stuck in "Background" window Message-ID: <1dc.5605e78.2ba8deaa@aol.com> sez pixelbird at interisland.net: >All I want to do is be able to _replace_ a background group image with >another image from a file, under script control. I can't say I've followed all of your travails on this problem, but here is a possible pointer to a solution, which you may or may not have thought of already: Since you're having trouble with a "background group" image, try the replace-under-script-control thing on an image that's *not* part of a background group. If that works, the next thing to try is ungroup the background group, *then* replace the image, and re-group the group's elements. Hope this helps... From k_major at os.surf2000.de Tue Mar 18 15:49:00 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:49:00 2003 Subject: Replacing group images (was Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Ken, > ... > Here's the script: > > on mouseUp > set the defaultFolder to "Doggies" > answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" > lock screen > import paint from file it > set itemDel to "/" > put image (last item of it) into image "myImage" > delete image (last item of it) > start editing group "myImageGroup" > create image "myImage" in group "myImageGroup" this will create an empty image in that group... Might work if you put the line: put image (last item of it) into img "myImage" after that... But see below ;-) > stop editing group > unlock screen > send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds > end mouseUp > > ....when it executes, I end up with an empty background group window. > When I > select the stack window in the Window menu (which is already checked > BTW), > it goes away and I see the image in the stack, but it's not the group, > its > the image. The group (myImageGroup) is there, according to the > Application > Overview, but there's nothing in it. > > Why doesn't the [start editing] command place the image into the group? > > TIA, > Ken N. i hope i understand you right. You want to "replace" the image "myImage" in group/background "myImageGroup" with another image that the user has choosen? Imported image and not referenced? In that case: > on mouseUp > set the defaultFolder to "Doggies" > answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" if the result is not "cancel" then put url("binfile:" & it) into img "myImage" end if end mouseup I hope i got it right... (It was just too easy ;-) When using this technique (put url"binfile... into img xxx) the images do NOT need to be of the same dimensions!!! Hope this helps. Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Tue Mar 18 15:51:04 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:51:04 2003 Subject: Stuck in "Background" window In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E77860C.10009@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/18/03 11:13 AM, Ken Norris wrote: > I tried replacing the line with: > > 1) stop editing group "myImageGroup" > > then: > > 2) send "stop editing group myImageGroup" to me in 20 milliseconds > > then: > > 3_) stop editing (like it was originally) None of those will work. When you want to stop editing a background, you have to refer to it as "background" (just like in HC), not "group". During background editing, the group you are editing is no longer a group, per se. Use this syntax eactly: stop editing bg "myImageGroup" -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From jhurley at infostations.com Tue Mar 18 15:54:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:54:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons Message-ID: P.S. Malte, One caveat. The algorithm in my previous message assumes the polygon is simply connected--all points accessible without crossing the boundary. It calculates the area of a polygon transversed in the counter-clockwise sense as positive, and negative if transversed in the clockwise sense. Thus the area of a symmetric figure eight-like polygon would be zero. But this complication can be overcome if it is an issue. Jim From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Tue Mar 18 15:59:00 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Tue Mar 18 15:59:00 2003 Subject: Stuck in "Background" window In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E7787E5.6050801@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/18/03 11:13 AM, Ken Norris wrote: > All I want to do is be able to _replace_ a background group image with > another image from a file, under script control. I think you are making it too hard. You don't need all that background editing business. This works for me: get "/HD/Folder/mySample.gif" put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 Note the use of "binfile" rather than plain "file". The replacement is instant. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From kray at sonsothunder.com Tue Mar 18 16:03:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Tue Mar 18 16:03:01 2003 Subject: Launch Command In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <002e01c2ed91$4bafd2d0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> > Again, thanks to all for your help in this problem. When I > try "answer > fileTextEdit; put it" or "answer fileTextEdit.app; put it", I get the > "Pick" window with the Desktop hilited. First of all, it's not: answer fileTextEdit OR answer fileTextEdit.app; put it it's: answer file "TextEdit";put it are you concatenating this? > If I navigate back to the > "Applications" folder in this "Pick" window, none of the applications > are clickable, i.e. they are dimmed! Furthermore, launch > "/Applications/TextEdit.app/" doesn't work. Also, my Hard Disk is > labeled Macintosh HD, and I've tried using every suggested > variation of > addressing the Hard Disk. Nothing works . . . .Major Bummer!! Any > other suggestions? OK. A couple of basic questions: 1) What OS are you running? 2) What verison of Revolution are you using? Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From k_major at os.surf2000.de Tue Mar 18 16:08:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Tue Mar 18 16:08:01 2003 Subject: Replacing group images (was Standalone UI's, data stacks, image files) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <82200E9F-5985-11D7-AB68-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Hi Ken, in addition to my last mail here some suggestions that will might make "edit background..." obsolete during runtime... The image "myImage" should already be part of the group "MyImageGroup" even if it is still empty. That way you can use my script to "put url"binfile:..." to get a new image. Instead of deleting that image (you did not mention it, but it sounds like) you could: ... put empty into img "myImage" ... Has the same effect, but no need for struggling with "edit group xxx" ;-) Hope that helps. Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 16:09:01 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Tue Mar 18 16:09:01 2003 Subject: Rev and mySQL In-Reply-To: <3630B0B4-597F-11D7-8A8A-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: <20030318210541.10683.qmail@web20414.mail.yahoo.com> Alex, Thanks for responding. I have looked into Valentina as well. I've tried getting it to work and can't. I've tried just doing a simple test to see if I can connect to a Valentina database, but the functions are failing. I'm thinking that Rev is not finding the external as it should be. Any hints there? Do you have any working examples? I've read in the docs that you can use the Rev built-in database functions or use the functions in the Valentina external, but I can't get either one to work. There's a file in the Revolution folder called Valentina Engine. Is this the external, or do I need to download something else? There was an example I saw on using custom properties in a stack to store data. Actually, I think it used an external stack and created a card for each "record". It was interesting, and it might work. My problem is that we're developing software that comes in two versions: a stand-alone single-user and a multi-user network version. In the future we'd also like to have a web version. So there's a very good possibility that there will be multiple concurrent users of my software. This is the reason for checking into mySQL, but I'd like a solution that will work for all versions. I'd rather not have to use two different databases if possible. I know that Paradima Software is currently working on a client/server version of Valentina, but I can't even get the single-user version to work right. I'm probably just doing something wrong. Valentina's docs are a bit cryptic to me. If anyone has any working examples, I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks again, Chris Sheffield Read Naturally --- Alex Rice wrote: > > On Tuesday, March 18, 2003, at 08:34 AM, Chris > Sheffield wrote: > > Anyway, I'm not extremely familiar with mySQL or > how > > it works. I just read a little about the embedded > > features and it piqued my interest. I'm not sure > if > > this is even possible with Revolution. If anyone > has > > anything they could share, I'd be very grateful. > > I'm pretty sure that the mysql support in Rev is > client-side only and > doesn't support embedding the mysql engine. > > You might want to look into Valentina instead- > because it IS a > single-user embedded database. > > Also, have you looked into using custom properties > of a data stack? > It's not SQL but very flexible and quick, and > doesn't rely on any extra > libraries or anything. > > Alex Rice, Software Developer > Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. > alrice at ARCplanning.com > alrice at swcp.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk Tue Mar 18 16:10:01 2003 From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg) Date: Tue Mar 18 16:10:01 2003 Subject: Stuck in "Background" window In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 12:13 pm -0500 18/3/03, Ken Norris wrote: >All I want to do is be able to _replace_ a background group image with >another image from a file, under script control. If this is really all you want to do ... Assumption: you already have your group which contains an image named "myImage". (And there is no other image named "myImage" on the current card.) answer file "" ##add whatever filters you need if it <> empty then put url ("binfile:" & it) into image "myImage" end if Cheers Dave From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 16:10:22 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 16:10:22 2003 Subject: Replacing file images in background groups In-Reply-To: <200303180659.BAA21329@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Howdy, Still trying. Why doesn't this work (nothing happens)? on mouseUp set the defaultFolder to "Doggies" set itemDel to "/" answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" lock screen delete image "bluescreen" in background "myImageGroup" create image (last item of it) in background "myImageGroup" unlock screen send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds end mouseUp TIA, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 16:21:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 16:21:01 2003 Subject: Stuck in "Background" window In-Reply-To: <200303182027.PAA16444@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > What I end up with _every time_ is a window in the place of the stack window > with a titlebar that says: > > [ Practice1(background"myIma... ] > > In the Rev UI, I can make it go away by clicking "Practice1" in the "Window" > menu, which is ALREADY checked. This brings back my stack window in editing > mode (pointer) which indicates the script is quitting at the "stop editing" > command without an error, but at least it shows the background with the > proper image installed. ---------- Oh, yes, also by clicking "Stop Editing" in the "Object" menu. Ken N. From miscdas at boxfrog.com Tue Mar 18 16:23:01 2003 From: miscdas at boxfrog.com (miscdas at boxfrog.com) Date: Tue Mar 18 16:23:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: References: <200303181425.JAA29648@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <20030318212027.71562.qmail@www.boxfrog.com> >> Message: 6 >> Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:06:57 +0100 >> Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons >> From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) >> To: >> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >> >> Hi List, >> >> >> this one goes out to the math experts. >> How does one compute the area ( I hope it is the correct Term for >> flaecheninhalt in german) of a polygon with n sides. >> >> >> Any help will be greatly apprecheated! >> >> Regards, >> >> Malte >> ============= Herr Brill, If you are dealing only with regular polygons, see the following: http://www.efunda.com/math/areas/RegularPolygonGen.cfm miscdas From sims at ezpzapps.com Tue Mar 18 16:26:00 2003 From: sims at ezpzapps.com (sims) Date: Tue Mar 18 16:26:00 2003 Subject: Launch Command In-Reply-To: <002e01c2ed91$4bafd2d0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> References: <002e01c2ed91$4bafd2d0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: > >> If I navigate back to the >> "Applications" folder in this "Pick" window, none of the applications > > are clickable, i.e. they are dimmed! Try this: do "choose file" as applescript put the result Then fiddle with the result as needed. atb sims -- ----------------------------------------------------------- http://EZPZapps.com info at EZPZapps.com Software - Internet Development - Consulting From rogerguay at centurytel.net Tue Mar 18 16:57:01 2003 From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay) Date: Tue Mar 18 16:57:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1216 - 14 msgs In-Reply-To: <200303182124.QAA23634@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <1F74BCEB-598C-11D7-9D11-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> > First of all, it's not: > > answer fileTextEdit > > OR > > answer fileTextEdit.app; put it > > it's: > > answer file "TextEdit";put it > > are you concatenating this? I'm using answer file "TextEdit";put it I am not concatenating it. It results in the "Pick" window with no applications clickable etc. What I said earlier . .. > >> If I navigate back to the >> "Applications" folder in this "Pick" window, none of the applications >> are clickable, i.e. they are dimmed! Furthermore, launch >> "/Applications/TextEdit.app/" doesn't work. Also, my Hard Disk is >> labeled Macintosh HD, and I've tried using every suggested >> variation of >> addressing the Hard Disk. Nothing works . . . .Major Bummer!! Any >> other suggestions? > > OK. A couple of basic questions: > > 1) What OS are you running? I'm using OS X v. 10.2.4 > > 2) What verison of Revolution are you using? I'm using Revolution v.1.1.1 Still to no avail. Thanks for your continued help. Roger > > Ken Ray > Sons of Thunder Software > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > From monte at sweattechnologies.com Tue Mar 18 17:21:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Tue Mar 18 17:21:01 2003 Subject: OS X & answer file In-Reply-To: <97DEBDFE-597E-11D7-8A8A-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: > > > > Saving the stack will restore the creator type. You can bypass the > > File > > menu problem in 2.0 by holding down the option key when choosing open. > > We're looking at a way to allow handling both the .rev extension and > > the > > file type together in that dialog, but I don't know for sure if it > > will make > > the cut for 2.0 or not. > > > In 1.1.1 I found that I can work around this by opening Rev first, then > double-clicking on my stack file in the Finder. This opens the stack in > Rev, then I can save, and proceed. > It's great to see the Rev folks are already working on this. Thanks for everyone's comments. Personally I hope that a cross-platform syntax for ask and answer file comes out of this as it seems unnecessary for us to allways script this. Something like: answer file "Open a file:" with filter "*.txt" or type "TEXT" Cheers Monte From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Tue Mar 18 17:31:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Tue Mar 18 17:31:01 2003 Subject: Importing Mainstacks ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Yes. First backup both stack files, just in case :-) Open both stack files and then set the mainStack of the one you want to move to the mainStack of the other file. e.g. Suppose you have 2 files: one has stacks "Main1", "Sub1", Sub2" and the other just has "Main2". Open both files and bring the "Main2" stack to the front. In the message box type: set the mainStack of this stack to "Main1" Then save and "Main2" will now be a substack of "Main1" If you have Rev 2 prebeta 4, you can also do this from a popup menu on the stack inspector palette. Cheers, Sarah On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 12:37 am, Mathewson wrote: > Does anybody know if it is possible to import a mainstack as > a substack of another mainstack? > > Probably this question has been asked many times > before.............. > > It would save a lot of work. > > Richmond Mathewson > --------------------------------------------------------------- > Great Macintosh Products > The MacLaunch Store! > http://www.maclaunch.com/cgi-launch/store/agora.cgi > --------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 17:38:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 17:38:01 2003 Subject: Stuck in "Background" window In-Reply-To: <200303182124.QAA23634@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 14:48:12 -0600 > From: "J. Landman Gay" > Organization: HyperActive Software > Subject: Re: Stuck in "Background" window > Use this syntax eactly: > > stop editing bg "myImageGroup" ---------- Nope. Here it is with the change: on mouseUp set the defaultFolder to "Doggies" answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" lock screen import paint from file it set itemDel to "/" cut image (last item of it) start editing bg "myImageGroup" paste image (last item of it) stop editing bg "myImageGroup" unlock screen send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds end mouseUp When I look in the Objects menu, "Stop Editing" is still shown. If I click it all is OK. It is still refusing to obey the command and ends up in the background window every time. Ken N. From rpresender at earthlink.net Tue Mar 18 17:58:01 2003 From: rpresender at earthlink.net (Robert Presender) Date: Tue Mar 18 17:58:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons Message-ID: Hi, The following is copied from Mathematical Tables from Hand Book of Chemistry and Physics. The area of a regular polygon with n sides of length l = 1/4n(l squared) (cot 180/n) The area of a circumscribed polygon = n(r squared)tan(pi/n) where pi = 3.14 and r = the radius of the circumscribed circle = (l/2)cosec(180/n) Sorry the above is not in strictly math format.. Hope this helps. Regards ... Bob From curry at pair.com Tue Mar 18 18:17:00 2003 From: curry at pair.com (curry) Date: Tue Mar 18 18:17:00 2003 Subject: ext_sayString (somewhat OT) In-Reply-To: <200303180659.BAA21338@www.runrev.com> References: <200303180659.BAA21338@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: >Does anyone know if the text-to-speech voices can be manipulated with >in-line commands the way it was possible to do so under Mac OS 9 and >10.0.x? That kind of scared me, knowing how Apple yanks out things recklessly--but looks like no need to worry, try it in Rev with the ext_saystring--it worked for me just now, OS 10.1. Curry From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 18:18:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 18:18:00 2003 Subject: Finally, that's it!!!! (was [Stuck in "Background" window] and related) In-Reply-To: <200303182124.QAA23634@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: *********** > Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 14:56:05 -0600 > From: "J. Landman Gay" > Organization: HyperActive Software > Subject: Re: Stuck in "Background" window > > On 3/18/03 11:13 AM, Ken Norris wrote: > >> All I want to do is be able to _replace_ a background group image with >> another image from a file, under script control. > > I think you are making it too hard. You don't need all that background > editing business. This works for me: > > get "/HD/Folder/mySample.gif" > put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 > > Note the use of "binfile" rather than plain "file". The replacement is > instant. ---------- Halleluja!!! I knew there was a simpler method. That's what I've been looking for! I don't understand the concept of "binfile". Why must I use that ? Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 18:28:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 18:28:01 2003 Subject: Replacing group images (was Standalone UI's, data stacks, image In-Reply-To: <200303182124.QAA23634@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 21:47:22 +0100 > Subject: Re: Replacing group images (was Standalone UI's, data stacks, image > files) > From: Klaus Major > Imported image and not referenced? ----------- Sure. It doen't matter because it goes into a standalone in the end. Whenever I close the stack it disappears anyway. The end result I'll be doing is establish a default startup image, and have others available from preferences to switch with it ----------- > In that case: > >> on mouseUp >> set the defaultFolder to "Doggies" >> answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" > if the result is not "cancel" then > put url("binfile:" & it) into img "myImage" > end if > end mouseup > > I hope i got it right... > (It was just too easy ;-) ---------- Yep. I followed Jacque's (with a mod) which is similar and it worked! Any reason we can't use the same format for sounds, or even data (text, numbers, etc.)? That way I could develop a script with filters that can search fro anything I plug in. Thanks, Ken N. From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 18:31:00 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Tue Mar 18 18:31:00 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030318232818.19881.qmail@web20002.mail.yahoo.com> --- Luigi Di Martino wrote: > Hi Kurt > > Thanks ever so much for your explanation. Your > last paragraph especially has made my mind > up to go get the Revolution 2.0. > Lui try this: http://www.shopperturnpike.com/usefulsoftware/midi_format.html "this table shows the structure of a MIDI file of the type constructed by the "MIDI Builder" plugin for Runtime Revolution." Kurt === good choice Luigi. i have started a "listlet" on hard core MIDI issues in Rev. if anything is remotely of interest to the regular Rev list then it can come here. if it as arcane and specific as the above URL that Kurt contributed then it might be more easily handler off-list. as soon as i get a little extra time, there will be info on my RunRev Fanzine website page. Erik ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 18:40:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 18:40:01 2003 Subject: Finally That's it!!! (Replacing group images, etc.) In-Reply-To: <200303182124.QAA23634@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: MEGA-THANKS everyone for your help (John, Klaus, Cubist, et al, and especially Jacque). I knew there had to be an easy answer. Now that I have the basic answer I can move on to where it will actually be used. Whew! Once I set the image in the right layer of my concept stack, this is what worked perfectly: on mouseUp set the defaultFolder to "Doggies" -- this could be different. answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" -- this too. put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds end mouseUp Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 18:44:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 18:44:01 2003 Subject: Stuck in "Background" window In-Reply-To: <200303182124.QAA23634@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: *********** > Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 21:06:36 +0000 > From: Dave Cragg > Subject: Re: Stuck in "Background" window > > At 12:13 pm -0500 18/3/03, Ken Norris wrote: > >> All I want to do is be able to _replace_ a background group image with >> another image from a file, under script control. > > If this is really all you want to do ... > > Assumption: you already have your group which contains an image named > "myImage". (And there is no other image named "myImage" on the > current card.) > > answer file "" ##add whatever filters you need > if it <> empty then > put url ("binfile:" & it) into image "myImage" > end if ---------- Almost there. Thanks, you were on the right track. I don't understand the "binfile:" concept and didn't know how to write it into a background group. Thanks, Ken N. > > Cheers > Dave From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Tue Mar 18 18:52:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Tue Mar 18 18:52:01 2003 Subject: Finally, that's it!!!! (was [Stuck in "Background" window] and related) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E77B07A.6030601@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/18/03 2:23 PM, Ken Norris wrote: I don't understand the concept of "binfile". Why must I use > that ? It's short for "binary file", which is what images are. "File" is for plain text files only. Other kinds of files are binaries. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From rcozens at pon.net Tue Mar 18 19:44:01 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Tue Mar 18 19:44:01 2003 Subject: Finally, that's it!!!! (was [Stuck in "Background" window] and related) In-Reply-To: <3E77B07A.6030601@hyperactivesw.com> References: <3E77B07A.6030601@hyperactivesw.com> Message-ID: >I don't understand the concept of "binfile". Why must I use >>that ? > >It's short for "binary file", which is what images are. "File" is >for plain text files only. Other kinds of files are binaries. One further distinction: reading a text file as "file" automatically converts line endings for the specific platform to returns, & writing to "file" converts returns to platform-specific line delimiters; whereas reading & writing "binfile" preserves the line endings in the text. -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From trevor at mangomultimedia.com Tue Mar 18 20:50:00 2003 From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore) Date: Tue Mar 18 20:50:00 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Tuesday, March 18, 2003, at 02:43 PM, Scott Rossi wrote: >> As I've said before, I'd be excited about using Rev if I could imbed >> Flash files for animation and interfaces. If I'm the only one >> interested in this I'll shut up and lurk ;-] > > I don't think you're the only one interested, I think there's simply > the > problem of reliability. As far as I know, the interactive side of > Flash has > never worked well under QuickTime, until maybe recently with QT 6. > Even > then, I seem to recall some folks saying that clicks and other mouse > events > do not always get processed reliably or can happen slowly. There may > also > be an issue of version (there was in the past): does QT6 support > FlashMX or > Flash 5? But in terms of animation, you should be set; just make sure > you > allow for the brief QT initialization delay when starting up your > stack. FYI - QuickTime 6 supports Flash 5 content and it can be used reliably. I create wired QT movies using LiveStage Proefessional and use Flash in QuickTime projects for interface elements such as menus generated from XML files. Load http://www.mangomultimedia.com/clients/devore/blueplayer.mov into QuickTime Player 6 for a simple example of a Flash menu created dynamically from an XML file. Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Multimedia trevor at mangomultimedia.com From trevor at mangomultimedia.com Tue Mar 18 20:55:02 2003 From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore) Date: Tue Mar 18 20:55:02 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: <90B35C30-5950-11D7-8CC8-000393DBAE7A@activadesign.com> Message-ID: <5EC14332-59AD-11D7-9E94-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com> On Tuesday, March 18, 2003, at 09:47 AM, Bradley Borch wrote: > Somebody responded earlier regarding getting Flash to talk to Rev. > Apparently there's a QTdebug hook built for LSP users. Flash > documentation also mentions communicating to host apps via ActiveX. > Sorry for the ignorance, but is there some documentation that > discusses how these layers work together (Rev-specific or otherwise)? Using Flash, QuickTime and LiveStage Professional you can have buttons and frame loaded events within the Flash trigger DebugStr messages. These debugStr messages can be captured from within Revolution using: on QTDebugStr string your code here end QTDebugStr If you need to use Flash within Revolution and have access to LiveStage Professional I could send you some examples. > PS As I've said before, I'd be excited about using Rev if I could > imbed Flash files for animation and interfaces. If I'm the only one > interested in this I'll shut up and lurk ;-] Being able to use Flash animations natively in Revolution would be very nice. Using it within QuickTime is a suitable workaround for now. Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Multimedia trevor at mangomultimedia.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 18 21:39:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 18 21:39:01 2003 Subject: Finally, that's it!!!! In-Reply-To: <200303190156.UAA32651@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:49:14 -0600 > From: "J. Landman Gay" > Organization: HyperActive Software > Subject: Re: Finally, that's it!!!! (was [Stuck in "Background" window] and > related) > It's short for "binary file", which is what images are. "File" is for > plain text files only. Other kinds of files are binaries. ---------- OK, so, movies and sound files too, right? That involves the other feedback options I need to bring in. Ken N. From jacque at hyperactivesw.com Tue Mar 18 23:34:01 2003 From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay) Date: Tue Mar 18 23:34:01 2003 Subject: Finally, that's it!!!! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E77F281.6090005@hyperactivesw.com> On 3/18/03 5:44 PM, Ken Norris wrote: >>It's short for "binary file", which is what images are. "File" is for >>plain text files only. Other kinds of files are binaries. > > ---------- > OK, so, movies and sound files too, right? That involves the other feedback > options I need to bring in. Yes, they are binaries too, but that's not how you load those. For movies, you set the filename of a player object to the movie file path, and for sounds, you can either use the "play" command, or else use a player object for those too. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com From rogerguay at centurytel.net Tue Mar 18 23:39:01 2003 From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay) Date: Tue Mar 18 23:39:01 2003 Subject: Launch Command In-Reply-To: <200303190156.UAA32651@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <48E0F640-59C4-11D7-858F-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> On Tuesday, March 18, 2003, at 05:56 PM, use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote: > do "choose file" as applescript > put the result Ok, At least I can get the result: "Macintosh HD:Applications:TextEdit.app:" If I then type: launch "Macintosh HD:Applications:TextEdit.app:" into the message box, I get error-35. What the heck is going on??? Thanks, Roger From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Wed Mar 19 00:49:00 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Wed Mar 19 00:49:00 2003 Subject: Launch Command In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <07FFD2F2-59CE-11D7-928D-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> In order to be consistent across all platforms, Revolution uses a slash "/" as the delimiter for file paths, in your case over-riding the normal Mac colon ":". Now that you have located the application, I think the following should work: launch "Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" (Rev 1.1.1) or launch "/Applications/TextEdit.app" (Rev 2.0) Note that because of the peculiar nature of OS X application bundles, checking for the existence of a file will fail. Check instead for a folder if you are looking for an application. e.g. there is a file "Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" -- false there is a folder "Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" -- true Hope this helps, Sarah On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 02:43 pm, Roger Guay wrote: > > On Tuesday, March 18, 2003, at 05:56 PM, > use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote: > >> do "choose file" as applescript >> put the result > > Ok, At least I can get the result: "Macintosh > HD:Applications:TextEdit.app:" > > If I then type: > > launch "Macintosh HD:Applications:TextEdit.app:" > > into the message box, I get error-35. What the heck is going on??? > > Thanks, Roger > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From david at kwinter.ca Wed Mar 19 02:46:00 2003 From: david at kwinter.ca (David Kwinter) Date: Wed Mar 19 02:46:00 2003 Subject: Shakobox BeatMachine - great fun Message-ID: Today I made a beat machine for revolution, I was inspired while giving Shakobox a look - a wonderful tool, for which I hold high regard. Free to download: http://www.kwinter.ca/BeatMachine.rev It requires you have Shakobox downloaded and OPEN in revolution to run. This was a one-day-effort so there is no save/open and there are tons of enhancements yet to be made. Regardless, it works reasonably well - it's a must-see for all techno and hip-hop lovin Revolutionaries. Features: - 128 instruments - pitch, velocity, duration adjustable notes - nine tracks - free Known bug: You have to manually choose the "browse" tool after creating a new "instance" of a beat in a track - a fix for this would be nice, anyone? Recommendation: 1152x768 minimum screen resolution. Updates to come, enjoy! To Download Shakobox refer to the earlier post: ------ Forwarded Message From: "J. Landman Gay" Organization: HyperActive Software Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 11:49:11 -0600 To: Revolution Mailing List , metacard list Subject: Shakobox update A revised version of Shakobox, the HyperCard-style musical notation stack, has been uploaded to: This version works around a bug in the MetaCard engine that caused installation of the PlayCommand Agent application to fail on machines running Mac OS 9. If you plan to run Shakobox only on an OS X machine then you don't need this update. However, if you want to distribute the PlayCommand Agent app in your own stacks, the revised scripts should be used for your installations and you should download this update. There are no other changes to the stack, outside of working around the installation problem. -- Jacqueline Landman Gay | jacque at hyperactivesw.com HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com _______________________________________________ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution at lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ------ End of Forwarded Message From degbert at mac.com Wed Mar 19 03:32:01 2003 From: degbert at mac.com (David Egbert) Date: Wed Mar 19 03:32:01 2003 Subject: Copy Variable to Clipboard? Message-ID: I'm having trouble copying text from a variable to the clipboard. I suppose I could put the contents of the variable into a field that's on a stack off screen and then copy it. Is there a better way to do this? TIA! -- Dave Egbert From baccheschi at tin.it Wed Mar 19 04:57:00 2003 From: baccheschi at tin.it (baccheschi at tin.it) Date: Wed Mar 19 04:57:00 2003 Subject: questions Message-ID: Please is it possible to "dial" like in HyperCrd ? Is it possible to Open URL ? Many thanks mario baccheschi From GernotL at t-online.de Wed Mar 19 04:57:28 2003 From: GernotL at t-online.de (Gernot Lorenz) Date: Wed Mar 19 04:57:28 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E779D12.7070507@rz-online.de> Malte Brill wrote: >Hi List, > > >this one goes out to the math experts. >How does one compute the area ( I hope it is the correct Term for >flaecheninhalt in german) of a polygon with n sides. > >(That would get me started.) > >I want to extract all lines of 2 polygons by analysing their points, >evaluate the area of each of them with some magic formula I don?t know ;-) >and to figure out the area of the smallest polygon surrounding both of them. > > > Hallo Malte, wenn sich das Polygon nicht schneidet, geht es folgenderma?en: Es wird in Dreiecke zerlegt (man nimmt ein Polygonpunkt und verbindet ihn mit allen anderen); angenommen, die Koordinaten der 3 Eckpunkte sind (ax,ay), (bx,by) und (cx,cy) dann gilt f?r den Fl?cheninhalt: F = [ax*(by - cy) + bx*(cy - ay) + cx*(ay - by)]/2. Diese Berechnung mu? nun f?r alle entstandenen Dreiecke durchgef?hrt und die Ergebnisse addiert werden. In English: If the polygon does not cross itself, the following method helps: the polygon has to be divided into triangulars (choose one point of the polygon and connect it with all the others); supposed, the coordinates of the three triangular points are (ax,ay), (bx,by) und (cx,cy), then the area F will be calculated with [ax*(by - cy) + bx*(cy - ay) + cx*(ay - by)]/2. This has to be done for all the triangulars and the areas have be added and give the total area. ( I know, bad English from "old Europe") Gru? Gernot >_______________________________________________ >use-revolution mailing list >use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > >. > > > From GernotL at t-online.de Wed Mar 19 04:57:42 2003 From: GernotL at t-online.de (Gernot Lorenz) Date: Wed Mar 19 04:57:42 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons Message-ID: <3E779EAF.9020600@rz-online.de> Malte Brill wrote: > Hi List, > > > this one goes out to the math experts. > How does one compute the area ( I hope it is the correct Term for > flaecheninhalt in german) of a polygon with n sides. > > (That would get me started.) > > I want to extract all lines of 2 polygons by analysing their points, > evaluate the area of each of them with some magic formula I don?t know ;-) > and to figure out the area of the smallest polygon surrounding both of > them. > > > Hallo Malte, wenn sich das Polygon nicht schneidet, geht es folgenderma?en: Es wird in Dreiecke zerlegt (man nimmt ein Polygonpunkt und verbindet ihn mit allen anderen); angenommen, die Koordinaten der 3 Eckpunkte sind (ax,ay), (bx,by) und (cx,cy) dann gilt f?r den Fl?cheninhalt: F = [ax*(by - cy) + bx*(cy - ay) + cx*(ay - by)]/2. Diese Berechnung mu? nun f?r alle entstandenen Dreiecke durchgef?hrt und die Ergebnisse addiert werden. In English: If the polygon does not cross itself, the following method helps: the polygon has to be divided into triangulars (choose one point of the polygon and connect it with all the others); supposed, the coordinates of the three triangular points are (ax,ay), (bx,by) und (cx,cy), then the area F will be calculated with [ax*(by - cy) + bx*(cy - ay) + cx*(ay - by)]/2. This has to be done for all the triangulars and the areas have be added and give the total area. ( I know, bad English from "old Europe") Gru? Gernot -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: wink_n.gif Type: image/gif Size: 139 bytes Desc: not available URL: From malte.brill at t-online.de Wed Mar 19 05:08:00 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Wed Mar 19 05:08:00 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303182124.QAA23668@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hi Dar,Jim,Mr. Miscdas, Bob, Gernot and all! Thank you very much for your replys. I really appreciate this. Dar wrote: >Do you mean a smallest polygon that contains exactly the union of the >points in the two polygons? (If the polygons do not overlap this might >include a thin bridge with no area.) A thin bridge would be o.k. Jim wrote: >Depending on what you have in mind, this might be much easier using >Turtle Graphics. >Hope this gets you going. Thanks for your code Jim! A very good start! I?m still experimenting with collision detection. I would like to try the following: -Create a Polygon with n-sides around my sprites. Compute the area of each polygon. -Store it in a custom property to make checking faster. -Check: intersect(SpriteX,SpriteY) -True: Compute the area of the union of polyX,polyY -Smaller than both areas summed -> Objects collided. If I had a neat algorithm for that job, I think it could be quite fast. But I am not that what one calls a math-person so I don?t know how to teach Rev what I want to do. Could one base something like this on Turtle Graphics? >One caveat. The algorithm in my previous message assumes the polygon >is simply connected--all points accessible without crossing the >boundary. It calculates the area of a polygon transversed in the >counter-clockwise sense as positive, and negative if transversed in >the clockwise sense. Thus the area of a symmetric figure eight-like >polygon would be zero. >But this complication can be overcome if it is an issue. This shouldn?t be an issue. I just have to be careful creating my polys. :-) Mr. Miscdas wrote: >If you are dealing only with regular polygons, see the following: >http://www.efunda.com/math/areas/RegularPolygonGen.cfm Thanks a lot for that link. Bob wrote: >The area of a regular polygon with n sides of length l = >1/4n(l squared) (cot 180/n) >The area of a circumscribed polygon = n(r squared)tan(pi/n) where pi = >3.14 and >r = the radius of the circumscribed circle = (l/2)cosec(180/n) >Sorry the above is not in strictly math format. Thanks for the information. I guess the first assumes all sides have the same length. That?s a bit problematic for me. It?s a pitty, but I don?t understand the 2nd one. I guess it assumes calculating a circle around the Poly, containing all points of it. But how do I get the circle? What does cosec mean? Thanks to Gernot for the explanation in german. Danke! Es hilft auserordentlich ein so komplexes Thema in der eigenen Sprache zu diskutieren. For the none germans:it really helps discussing such a complex topic in ones own language :-) Thanks for helping me so much, but I guess I will need some time to figure out a method to do what I want, so this has to wait until I have finished my Player-app. Regards, Malte From k_major at os.surf2000.de Wed Mar 19 05:48:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Wed Mar 19 05:48:01 2003 Subject: Finally That's it!!! (Replacing group images, etc.) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <157D56A2-59F8-11D7-BDBE-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Hi Ken, > MEGA-THANKS everyone for your help (John, Klaus, Cubist, et al, and > especially Jacque). I knew there had to be an easy answer. Now that I > have > the basic answer I can move on to where it will actually be used. Whew! > > Once I set the image in the right layer of my concept stack, this is > what > worked perfectly: > > on mouseUp > set the defaultFolder to "Doggies" -- this could be different. > answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" -- this too. > put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 > send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds i think that this line is obsolete now. (send "...") > end mouseUp > Ken N. Regards From wmb at internettrainer.com Wed Mar 19 05:51:01 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Wed Mar 19 05:51:01 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: <5EC14332-59AD-11D7-9E94-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com> Message-ID: <2BF88791-59F8-11D7-9FE6-003065430226@internettrainer.com> On Wednesday, Mar 19, 2003, at 02:51 Europe/Vienna, Trevor DeVore wrote: > Being able to use Flash animations natively in Revolution would be > very nice. Using it within QuickTime is a suitable workaround for > now. right!! This would br very, very, nice!!!! regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From mirrorman54 at hotmail.com Wed Mar 19 07:36:01 2003 From: mirrorman54 at hotmail.com (Luigi Di Martino) Date: Wed Mar 19 07:36:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available Message-ID: Hi Thank you Kurt and Erik for the useful insights. I won't give up trying to get my head around how to program, although I fear it will take me longer than my patience will allow. The shakabox (beat machine) idea is moving me closer to what I'd like to do. The main area that I will need to learn is how to map one midi note to another. Then to instruct the program to perform some other duties, like "take musical phrase around the intervals 1 3 #5", and "transpose circle of 5ths up by the ratio of a Comma (80:81)" . Basically I want a piece of software that allows me to compose my 'mirror' music ideas. In 1997 a programmer did build me a basic mirroring program, called The Mirrormaker. It does the midi mapping. I am no longer in touch with the programmer and have no access to the code, and it was written for only windows anyway. If anyone is interested in hearing a few I have over a thousand midi files that I have mirrored with this software. To get the software to perform more scripts is what I would love to learn to do, but I have to start at the beginning again and find out about the mapping of notes. Should I perhaps concentrate on the design of a program and find a programmer willing to write the code for such a design? Or perhaps someone can recommend me a cool book that is easy to understand (for dunces!) Thanks for reading Lui >From: erik hansen >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >Subject: Re: Scripted musical notation available >Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 15:28:18 -0800 (PST) > > >--- Luigi Di Martino >wrote: > > Hi Kurt > > > > Thanks ever so much for your explanation. Your > > last paragraph especially has made my mind > > up to go get the Revolution 2.0. > > Lui > >try this: >http://www.shopperturnpike.com/usefulsoftware/midi_format.html > >"this table shows the structure of a MIDI file of >the type constructed by the "MIDI Builder" plugin >for Runtime Revolution." > >Kurt > >=== > >good choice Luigi. i have started a "listlet" on >hard core MIDI issues in Rev. if anything is >remotely of interest to the regular Rev list then >it can come here. if it as arcane and specific as >the above URL that Kurt contributed then it might >be more easily handler off-list. > >as soon as i get a little extra time, there will >be info on my RunRev Fanzine website page. > >Erik > > >===== >erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org > >__________________________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! >http://platinum.yahoo.com >_______________________________________________ >use-revolution mailing list >use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution _________________________________________________________________ Surf together with new Shared Browsing http://join.msn.com/?page=features/browse&pgmarket=en-gb&XAPID=74&DI=1059 From benr_mc at cogapp.com Wed Mar 19 08:02:00 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Wed Mar 19 08:02:00 2003 Subject: Bug or feature? or: Don't I love the mechanics of expansion In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 17/3/03 1:42 am, Victor Eijkhout wrote > Reading the man page for "send". It says (I couldn't manage to > cut/paste from the dictionary. is that possible?) Geoff's responded on your main point, explaining how what looks like runaway expansion is actually quite reasonable and predictable. But in answer to your question: hold down the option (alt) key and run the mouse over the text you want to grab: it will be placed in your clipboard. It isn't intuitive, but it's handy and it works! (It's documented in the 'tips' stack - not sure if it's anywhere else. I find that it's worth flipping all the way through the tips stack every now and then - something usually catches my eye that wasn't relevant to me the last time, but is now. Also, I have it set to show me a tip once a day - that's often enough to be useful, but not so often it's annoying if I'm having a bad day..) regards, Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From benr_mc at cogapp.com Wed Mar 19 08:02:22 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Wed Mar 19 08:02:22 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 18/3/03 7:43 pm, Scott Rossi wrote > I don't think you're the only one interested, I think there's simply the > problem of reliability. As far as I know, the interactive side of Flash has > never worked well under QuickTime, until maybe recently with QT 6. Even > then, I seem to recall some folks saying that clicks and other mouse events > do not always get processed reliably or can happen slowly. FYI and FWIW: we've used QuickTime to handle Flash in our shell, with DebugStr for callbacks, using QT5/Flash 4. Never had any problems with it. Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From benr_mc at cogapp.com Wed Mar 19 08:02:35 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Wed Mar 19 08:02:35 2003 Subject: Grep help - remove HTML tags In-Reply-To: <3E210501-5640-11D7-9BC4-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: on 14/3/03 5:13 pm, Alex Rice wrote > I agree with the other poster, a real XML parser would be a better way > to go. What if the HTML is mixed case soemthing? Depending on the source of the content - I doubt it! If the HTML being parsed comes 'from the wild', there's a 99% chance that it's irregular - not well-formed HTML, let alone XHTML or XML. And I'd wouldn't have thought that mixed case would be an issue with matchText - IIRC, it's case insensitive unless specifically asked not to be. Whereas XML on the other hand is defined by spec to be case-sensitive; so a 'proper' parser, if behaving 'correctly', should choke on the above example - whereas Keith would probably rather it accepted it. Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From benr_mc at cogapp.com Wed Mar 19 08:33:00 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Wed Mar 19 08:33:00 2003 Subject: Thinking Inside-out of the Browser In-Reply-To: <4910-22003301631552857@M2W097.mail2web.com> Message-ID: on 16/3/03 3:15 am, chipp at chipp.com wrote > You might want to take a look at LEO. > > At this time, only for PC's... > > http://www.altuit.com/webs/leo/leobrowser/default.htm > Chipp, Is Leo (or rather altBrowser.dll) built round Microsoft's IE object? Or some other common code base? Or is it a completely custom coded browser? And do you have any concrete plans at this time for a Mac equivalent? regards, Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From benr_mc at cogapp.com Wed Mar 19 08:37:01 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Wed Mar 19 08:37:01 2003 Subject: Thinking Inside-out of the Browser In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 16/3/03 6:01 am, Jim Lambert wrote > If Rev's HTML renderer were just a teensy bit more compliant it'd be fine > for displaying simple webpages that had to do double duty - say, within a > Rev app and on a site. That'd work on any platform and be somewhat like a > basic browser within Rev. Oh, please don't do this. I really want to campaign for the htmlText keyword to be deprecated, and an alias (eg "markedUpText") added and pushed. The htmlText property is an excellent and handy way to get or set text with all the stylistic attributes at once; but I'd prefer it was documented as using a set of conventions that just happened to resemble HTML. It isn't an HTML renderer, and I don't think it ever will or should be; and of course, because Rev supports a number of text attributes that aren't in HTML, so the conventions supported by the 'htmlText' property include some things that just aren't HTML. An HTML render object, or a browser object, would be a splendid thing. But I wouldn't want it to be built directly in Rev/MC (huge diversion of critical engineering resources on to a never ending path); and it shouldn't be confused with the handy property for accessing styled text of a field. Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From jhurley at infostations.com Wed Mar 19 08:39:00 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Wed Mar 19 08:39:00 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303191237.HAA10200@www.runrev.com> References: <200303191237.HAA10200@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: >Malte wrote: > >I?m still experimenting with collision detection. I would like to try the >following: > >-Create a Polygon with n-sides around my sprites. Compute the area of each > polygon. >-Store it in a custom property to make checking faster. >-Check: intersect(SpriteX,SpriteY) >-True: Compute the area of the union of polyX,polyY >-Smaller than both areas summed -> Objects collided. > >If I had a neat algorithm for that job, I think it could be quite fast. Malte, I think I have a better understanding of what you are trying to achieve. I don't think it is particularly valuable to calculate areas. In collision detection you need to know whether there are overlapping interior points of the two areas. This is rather complex for arbitrarily shaped polygons. Could you settle for making each sprite a circle, perhaps of differing diameters? In this way you would only need to determine whether their centers were closer than the sum of the radii, a very simple task. The radii could be custom properties of the sprites. Jim From wmb at internettrainer.com Wed Mar 19 08:52:00 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Wed Mar 19 08:52:00 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <3E779D12.7070507@rz-online.de> Message-ID: On Tuesday, Mar 18, 2003, at 23:26 Europe/Vienna, Gernot Lorenz wrote: > ( I know, bad English from "old Europe") but good brain!! regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From malte.brill at t-online.de Wed Mar 19 09:06:01 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Wed Mar 19 09:06:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1215 - 9 msgs In-Reply-To: <200303182028.PAA16641@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Jim wrote: >Malte, >I think I have a better understanding of what you are trying to >achieve. I don't think it is particularly valuable to calculate >areas. In collision detection you need to know whether there are >overlapping interior points of the two areas. This is rather complex >for arbitrarily shaped polygons. Could you settle for making each >sprite a circle, perhaps of differing diameters? In this way you >would only need to determine whether their centers were closer than >the sum of the radii, a very simple task. The radii could be custom >properties of the sprites. >Jim Sorrowly my objejcts are (or at last will be) more complex than circles. For circle-circle/circle-wall collisions I check the distance using: sqrt((obj1.x-obj2.x)^2+(obj1.y-obj2.y)^2) I thought if I would have the area of the two polygons and their union is smaller than their sum, the polys must have collided (in 2D Space). Am I wrong here? Thanks for your support, Malte From malte.brill at t-online.de Wed Mar 19 09:10:01 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Wed Mar 19 09:10:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303182028.PAA16641@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: My excuses to the list for the wrong header in my previous post. Hitting reply and Copy and paste can be a snakepit. :-) Jim wrote: >Malte, >I think I have a better understanding of what you are trying to >achieve. I don't think it is particularly valuable to calculate >areas. In collision detection you need to know whether there are >overlapping interior points of the two areas. This is rather complex >for arbitrarily shaped polygons. Could you settle for making each >sprite a circle, perhaps of differing diameters? In this way you >would only need to determine whether their centers were closer than >the sum of the radii, a very simple task. The radii could be custom >properties of the sprites. >Jim Sorrowly my objejcts are (or at last will be) more complex than circles. For circle-circle/circle-wall collisions I check the distance using: sqrt((obj1.x-obj2.x)^2+(obj1.y-obj2.y)^2) I thought if I would have the area of the two polygons and their union is smaller than their sum, the polys must have collided (in 2D Space). Am I wrong here? Thanks for your support, Malte From miscdas at boxfrog.com Wed Mar 19 09:51:01 2003 From: miscdas at boxfrog.com (miscdas at boxfrog.com) Date: Wed Mar 19 09:51:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030319144757.48002.qmail@www.boxfrog.com> Malte Brill writes: [snip] > I?m still experimenting with collision detection. I would like to try the > following: > > -Create a Polygon with n-sides around my sprites. Compute the area of each > polygon. > -Store it in a custom property to make checking faster. > -Check: intersect(SpriteX,SpriteY) > -True: Compute the area of the union of polyX,polyY > -Smaller than both areas summed -> Objects collided. > > If I had a neat algorithm for that job, I think it could be quite fast. > >>If you are dealing only with regular polygons, see the following: >>http://www.efunda.com/math/areas/RegularPolygonGen.cfm > Regards, > > Malte > ========== Herr Brill, It appears you have decided to go a more difficult route of using irregular polygons. I suspect this is because you want to draw an irregular polygon to enclose your Sprite. Check this link; you may decide to use regular polygons instead. http://mathforum.org/library/drmath/view/52053.html (By the way, think of a circle as a regular polygon with an infinite number of sides with the length of a side infinitely small.) Now that you mentioned Sprites and collision detection, did you look at the intersect function? It seems to me that you could simply test the inersect of each of the sprites with each other. If for some reason the sprintes are not objects that the intersect can be determined, then drawing your polygon around the sprites and then testing the intersect for each polygon will get you collision detection. From rogerguay at centurytel.net Wed Mar 19 10:11:01 2003 From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay) Date: Wed Mar 19 10:11:01 2003 Subject: Launch Command In-Reply-To: <200303191237.HAA10186@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <7FC5DA1D-5A1C-11D7-9482-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Thanks, Sarah. You've joined this thread on the second or third revolution. I started with slashes (/) and I've known all along where the application is, but I can't get the Launch Command to work. launch "Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" does not work on my OSX 10.2.4 running Revolution 1.1.1. I guess no one else has this problem and I must appear to be a nut case. Oh well!! Roger Message: 4 > Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 15:45:46 +1000 > Subject: Re: Launch Command > From: Sarah > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > In order to be consistent across all platforms, Revolution uses a slash > "/" as the delimiter for file paths, in your case over-riding the > normal Mac colon ":". > > Now that you have located the application, I think the following should > work: > launch "Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" (Rev 1.1.1) > or launch "/Applications/TextEdit.app" (Rev 2.0) > > Note that because of the peculiar nature of OS X application bundles, > checking for the existence of a file will fail. Check instead for a > folder if you are looking for an application. > > e.g. there is a file "Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" -- false > there is a folder "Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" -- true > > Hope this helps, > Sarah > > > On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 02:43 pm, Roger Guay wrote: > >> >> On Tuesday, March 18, 2003, at 05:56 PM, >> use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote: >> >>> do "choose file" as applescript >>> put the result >> >> Ok, At least I can get the result: "Macintosh >> HD:Applications:TextEdit.app:" >> >> If I then type: >> >> launch "Macintosh HD:Applications:TextEdit.app:" >> >> into the message box, I get error-35. What the heck is going on??? >> >> Thanks, Roger > > From malte.brill at t-online.de Wed Mar 19 10:12:01 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Wed Mar 19 10:12:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303191237.HAA10253@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Thanks again for the link Mr. Miscdas. Mr Miscdas wrote: >Now that you mentioned Sprites and collision detection, did you look at the >intersect function? It seems to me that you could simply test the inersect >of each of the sprites with each other. If for some reason the sprintes are >not objects that the intersect can be determined, then drawing your polygon >around the sprites and then testing the intersect for each polygon will get >you collision detection. If I don?t do something essential wrong this won?t work. The intersect function seems only to check the bounding rectangle of an object. So this is not very precise. (I check at start using the intersect function for the rough part of the collision detection.) Perhaps I should follow the tips that were suggested on this list a few month earlier checking the image- and maskdata of the objects and look if their values are bigger than a certain threshhold. Thank you, Malte From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Wed Mar 19 11:09:01 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Wed Mar 19 11:09:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: If you're looking for collision detection, I think it would be faster to check the line segments of polygon A against the line segments of polygon B to see if any of them intersect. If they do, there's a collision. There may be a faster way than that, but I think at least that it would be faster than computing the areas. But before you even do that, you should come up with a rough, simple calculation that will tell you there is no collision, or that you need to do the more exact test. So for example, if polygon A has no point more than 30 pixels away from its loc, and polygon B has no point more than 25 pixels away from its loc, then your first calculation would be the distance between the loc of A and the loc of B; if it's more than 55 pixels, there is no intersection. If it's less, then you do the more exact calculation. On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 02:04 AM, Malte Brill wrote: > -Smaller than both areas summed -> Objects collided. > > If I had a neat algorithm for that job, I think it could be quite fast. > regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From miscdas at boxfrog.com Wed Mar 19 11:21:01 2003 From: miscdas at boxfrog.com (miscdas at boxfrog.com) Date: Wed Mar 19 11:21:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030319161842.17019.qmail@www.boxfrog.com> Malte Brill writes: [snip] > Thanks again for the link Mr. Miscdas. > > Mr Miscdas wrote: > >>Now that you mentioned Sprites and collision detection, did you look at the >>intersect function? > If I don?t do something essential wrong this won?t work. The intersect > function seems only to check the bounding rectangle of an object.(I check at start using the intersect function for the > rough part of the collision detection.) You are correct; I had fogotten that the graphic objects actually have a bounding rectangle rather than being bounded by the displayed line. > Perhaps I should follow the tips that were suggested on this list a few > month earlier checking the image- and maskdata of the objects and look if > their values are bigger than a certain threshhold. Yes, this would probably be a better solution for you in the long run. > > Thank you, > > Malte miscdas From scott at tactilemedia.com Wed Mar 19 11:43:03 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Wed Mar 19 11:43:03 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: <2BF88791-59F8-11D7-9FE6-003065430226@internettrainer.com> Message-ID: >> Being able to use Flash animations natively in Revolution would be >> very nice. Using it within QuickTime is a suitable workaround for now. Just curious, what would be the benefit of running Flash natively within Rev? You can build a standalone Flash projector so you can already build Flash applications. Personally, I would rather see Rev updated with some of Flash's features: text and graphic antialiasing, draw object transparency, multichannel sound (not using QT), rotatable text, etc. Why use two separate tools to get the job done when you could use one? Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design Email: scott at tactilemedia.com Web: www.tactilemedia.com From benr_mc at cogapp.com Wed Mar 19 11:51:00 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Wed Mar 19 11:51:00 2003 Subject: How to ping? Message-ID: Actually I don't even want to ping as such, just establish whether a network device is up and running. We're having problems with a router that keeps rebooting; and as a first step would like to monitor it so that we can track how often and when this is happening: in order to establish how serious the problem is, so we can see if there is a pattern that might give us a clue as to the source of the problem, and to give us a baseline so that if we're reduced to trial and error, we can see whether we're making matters better or worse. So, two alternative questions: - how could I (can I?) code a 'ping' function in Rev? - what is the lowest impact method that I could use, in Revolution, to probe a network device? Ideally I'd set up a stack on a spare machine to be probing every 60 seconds or so (it takes just under two minutes for the router to reboot, and I don't know at what point in the process it becomes visible on the network, so any longer than this might actually miss a rebooting incident); so I don't want to use massive resources to do it. Any help, suggestions, code fragments etc gratefully received, TIA, Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From k_major at os.surf2000.de Wed Mar 19 12:22:00 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Wed Mar 19 12:22:00 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0897F800-5A2F-11D7-BDBE-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Hi all, >>> Being able to use Flash animations natively in Revolution would be >>> very nice. Using it within QuickTime is a suitable workaround for >>> now. > ... > Personally, I would rather see Rev updated with some of Flash's > features: > text and graphic antialiasing, draw object transparency, multichannel > sound > (not using QT), rotatable text, etc. Yes, exactly! And mybe some options for scaling an object WHILE it is moving along a path. OK, this can be done by heavy scripting, but speed and smoothness is another thing... ;-) Oh, and some "curves" (not necessarily bezier) would be fine :-) (For animation paths...) ...and "draw"-text would be lovely, too... ...and...and...and... > Why use two separate tools to get the > job done when you could use one? Yo. :-) > Regards, > > Scott Rossi > Creative Director Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From jyrki.kanerva at mediakeel.com Wed Mar 19 12:35:00 2003 From: jyrki.kanerva at mediakeel.com (Jyrki Kanerva) Date: Wed Mar 19 12:35:00 2003 Subject: Launch Command Message-ID: <016e01c2ee3f$1d29e370$9536ba50@usermpxylg1xja> Just a guess, but try "/Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" (first char is a slash before the drive name). Regards, Jyrki K ---- ... but I can't get the Launch Command to work. launch "Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" does not work ... ------ From dsc at swcp.com Wed Mar 19 12:36:05 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Wed Mar 19 12:36:05 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ah, this is really an intersection problem. The idea of seeing if the area of the union of two sets of points defined by two polygons decreases is pretty clever. However, I am not smart enough to see how to do that without doing the same work as intersection calculation and then much more. I'm going to keep it in mind, because it might be handy some time. On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 08:08 AM, Malte Brill wrote: > > Perhaps I should follow the tips that were suggested on this list a few > month earlier checking the image- and maskdata of the objects and look > if > their values are bigger than a certain threshhold. If you are using images, that may is the way to go. If you are using polygons or associate polygon data with an image consider this: I'm guessing that two polygons intersect if (and only if) at least one of these are true: 1. Some edge of one polygon intersects with an edge of the other polygon. 2. An arbitrary point of one polygon is inside the other polygon. If your polygons are moving when colliding and can't start out overlapping, then maybe you can get by without the second test. That is because the only time the second is true and the first is not is when one polygon is completely enclosed in the other. If collisions are always detected before that happens then you don't need to test for that. 1. Some edge of one intersects with an edge of the other. When you iterate through all edges, be sure to include the last one, that is, the one from the last point to the first point. Consider an edge as a line segment. Two line segments intersect if the lines that include them intersect and the point of intersection is on a segment. The test for the latter can be simplified to the x component of the point being within the two x components of the end points of the segment. The intersection test not only tests for intersection, but also comes up with the x component of the point for the second part of the above test. To create this test apply algebra to come up with the formula for a line defined by two points. Then solve the system of equations formed by two of those. Watch out for dividing by zero (or near zero); the lines do not intersect in that case. Test for zero in the code. Watch out for vertical lines. 2. The first point of one is inside the other polygon. This doesn't have to be done for all points, I think, because of test #1. This may have to be done in two parts. Once for a point of the first and again for a point of the second. I don't know the best test of whether a point is in a polygon. Here is a wild guess. First, break the polygon into triangles. (Since the polygon can be concave, you can't assume every corner is convex; that is, you can't chop triangles off the polygon in any order.) You may want to do this once and save it. Then see if the point is in any of the triangles. A point is in a triangle when it is a neighbor of each corner of the triangle. (I just made up the term "neighbor".) A point is a neighbor of a point that is a corner of a triangle if it is on the same side of the partition of the plane formed by the line including the side opposite the point. A first try for a method: To determine which side a point is on see whether its y component is greater than the value obtained when plugging the x component into the y= form of the formula for the line, but you may need to handle a vertical line as a special case. With a little thought you may come up with a general test. This is a little more work than the other because of breaking the polygon into triangles, so if you can get by without it, that would be good. If you are using a polygon as a rough model for an image, you might be better off using a set of rectangles to represent the object for collision detection purposes. (This is, I admit, a rougher model.) In this case, two objects overlap if any test-rectangle of one overlaps a test-rectangle of the other. The time it takes to make a test goes up with the square of the number of sides in a typical polygon. Dar Scott From dsc at swcp.com Wed Mar 19 12:43:01 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Wed Mar 19 12:43:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 09:05 AM, Geoff Canyon wrote: > But before you even do that, you should come up with a rough, simple > calculation that will tell you there is no collision, or that you need > to do the more exact test. So for example, if polygon A has no point > more than 30 pixels away from its loc, and polygon B has no point more > than 25 pixels away from its loc, then your first calculation would be > the distance between the loc of A and the loc of B; if it's more than > 55 pixels, there is no intersection. If it's less, then you do the > more exact calculation. A rough test is a very good idea, especially if there are lots of objects that might collide. An alternate rough test is the bounding rectangle overlap. > If you're looking for collision detection, I think it would be faster > to check the line segments of polygon A against the line segments of > polygon B to see if any of them intersect. If they do, there's a > collision. There may be a faster way than that, but I think at least > that it would be faster than computing the areas. Ah, I just mailed off the same idea. There is a hole. That is the case of one being completely inside the other. I covered that in my mailing, but it may not be needed. Dar Scott From jhurley at infostations.com Wed Mar 19 12:49:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Wed Mar 19 12:49:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303191644.LAA18758@www.runrev.com> References: <200303191644.LAA18758@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > >Message: 13 >Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 08:05:48 -0800 >Subject: Re: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons >From: Geoff Canyon >To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > >If you're looking for collision detection, I think it would be faster >to check the line segments of polygon A against the line segments of >polygon B to see if any of them intersect. If they do, there's a >collision. There may be a faster way than that, but I think at least >that it would be faster than computing the areas. Malte and Geoff, I like Geoff's suggestion of checking whether any two line segments intersect. (The actual values for the areas doesn't tell you much.) I wrote the function below for my Turtle Graphics but it works here as well. It determines the intersection point of any two line segments (defined by their end points) function intersection p1,p2,pp1,pp2 put item 1 of p1 into x1 put item 2 of p1 into y1 put item 1 of p2 into x2 put item 2 of p2 into y2 put item 1 of pp1 into xp1 put item 2 of pp1 into yp1 put item 1 of pp2 into xp2 put item 2 of pp2 into yp2 if x1 = x2 or xp1 = xp2 then if x1 = x2 then return x1&comma&yp2 + (x1-xp2)*(yp2-yp1)/(xp2-xp1) else return xp2&comma& y2 + (xp1-x2)*(y2-y1)/(x2-x1) end if end if put yp2 - y2 + x2*(y2-y1)/(x2 - x1) - xp2*(yp2 - yp1)/(xp2 - xp1) into numerator put ((y2 - y1)/(x2 - x1) -(yp2 - yp1)/(xp2-xp1)) into denominator --Notice that the denominator blows up if x1 = x2 or xp1=xp2 and so is treated above. put numerator / denominator into x put y2 + (x-x2) *(y2-y1)/(x2-x1) into y return x & comma & y end intersection Once you have the intersection point, you need to be sure it does not lie beyond the line segments. This could be done as follows. Let p be the point of intersection. Consider one line segment with end points a & b. Calculate the following three distances: ap, bp, and ab. The point p lies between a and b if ap and bp are both less than ab. (If the intersection point lies between the end points of the one line segment, it will lie between the end points of the other as well.) But you have to do this for each line segment pair. If there are n line segments in one sprite and m in the other, there will be n*m potential intersections. Heavy!!! If it were me, I would just fake it by calling it a collision if the distances between their centers (locs) are less than a specified number. But I am a person of loose morals. Jim From trevor at mangomultimedia.com Wed Mar 19 12:50:00 2003 From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore) Date: Wed Mar 19 12:50:00 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 11:43 AM, Scott Rossi wrote: >>> Being able to use Flash animations natively in Revolution would be >>> very nice. Using it within QuickTime is a suitable workaround for >>> now. > > Just curious, what would be the benefit of running Flash natively > within > Rev? You can build a standalone Flash projector so you can already > build > Flash applications. Flash projectors by themselves are very limited in what they can do when it comes to interacting with the operating system. You need to buy 3rd party tools to even begin to have system level functionality. If you've seen things like Britannica's DVD they have a cool example of integrating Flash with their Knowledge Navigator (I think that is the name). > Personally, I would rather see Rev updated with some of Flash's > features: > text and graphic antialiasing, draw object transparency, multichannel > sound > (not using QT), rotatable text, etc. Why use two separate tools to > get the > job done when you could use one? It would be nice to have Rev be able to do the things that Flash does but Flash is a very powerful vector animation tool and recreating the useful things it can do would be a lot of work. I like using the best tools for the job when they can be integrated together. Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Multimedia trevor at mangomultimedia.com From dsc at swcp.com Wed Mar 19 12:56:00 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Wed Mar 19 12:56:00 2003 Subject: How to ping? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <97526DD6-5A33-11D7-8599-000A9567A3E6@swcp.com> On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 09:46 AM, Ben Rubinstein wrote: > So, two alternative questions: > - how could I (can I?) code a 'ping' function in Rev? Use shell. > - what is the lowest impact method that I could use, in > Revolution, to > probe a network device? If you can have two telnet sessions at the same time on your router, then do an open test to that port. Be sure and close it. The two is so your usual maintenance and the testing do not interfere. If it has http control and you never use it, then use that port instead. There has been some discussion on how to make an open timeout. (Use send.) In your case you may not need that; don't bother with callbacks in that case. If you don't create an open timeout, then the open will timeout in 21 seconds on some Windows (maybe all) and 75 seconds on OS X. (There may be ways to avoid dedicating a computer.) Dar From wmb at internettrainer.com Wed Mar 19 13:03:03 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Wed Mar 19 13:03:03 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <06B1B0EB-5A3D-11D7-BFBF-003065430226@internettrainer.com> On Wednesday, Mar 19, 2003, at 17:43 Europe/Vienna, Scott Rossi wrote: >>> Being able to use Flash animations natively in Revolution would be >>> very nice. Using it within QuickTime is a suitable workaround for >>> now. > > Just curious, what would be the benefit of running Flash natively > within > Rev? You can build a standalone Flash projector so you can already > build > Flash applications. A Lot... 1) running any swf files WITHOUT the need of Qucktime!!! 2) handling flash files WITHOUT a Flash projector!!! 3) manipulate swf files, which have been made in other tools which can export swf (a lot), in rev WITHOUT the need of Qucktime and WITHOUT a Flash projector... Or its possible to run the projector in a rev card or in a textfile in a card? If yes, please, please tell me how... (f.e. Quarbon exports swf files (compressed) which could run from the disk the web or any other medium, directly in rev. No matter if on the clients PC QT is installed or not... 4) running (converted to flash format) QT files also WITHOUT the need of Qucktime!!! only some of the benefits just from the head... > > Personally, I would rather see Rev updated with some of Flash's > features: > text and graphic antialiasing, draw object transparency, multichannel > sound > (not using QT), rotatable text, etc. Why use two separate tools to > get the > job done when you could use one? Why do you need this when you can run swf files, prepared perfectly in other tool which are better than rev for that job, "natively" in rev? Thats like have an "full featured" grafical html editor, replacing Photoshop, to manipulate al kind of images in the editor without the need of PH... (We say in german to this kind of things: thats not fish nor meat..) There are about 200 Mio Pcs out there in the world. Correct me if I m wrong. On about 30-50 Mio of them QT is installed. Thats a lot. But there are a rest of 150-170 Mio. I use rev for MM apps, because I dont have to think if the Enduser has QT installed, is able to do that or not... If not I could use any of these real great QT tools... just my 2 cents regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From jhurley at infostations.com Wed Mar 19 13:07:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Wed Mar 19 13:07:01 2003 Subject: Exporting vector graphics In-Reply-To: <200303182027.PAA16522@www.runrev.com> References: <200303182027.PAA16522@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: >Richard Gaskin wrote: > >Have you seen the SVG Exporter for Rev? You'll find it in the Stacks >listing in RevNet. > >It's jus a proof-of-concept at the moment, but if you have time on your >hands you could flesh it out into something useful (to the degree that you >can find programs that read SVG, that is ). > >-- Richard, Thanks for this. I wasn't aware. Scott Raney has said that he might consider implementing SVG in MC, if it were to gain wider acceptance. But it is a low priority for him. Before I dig into this, do you know of any Mac graphics applications which accept SVG format? I have check FreeHand and Canvas and neither of these do. Jim From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 19 13:09:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 19 13:09:01 2003 Subject: Shakobox BeatMachine - great fun In-Reply-To: <200303191237.HAA10186@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 00:43:12 -0700 > Subject: Shakobox BeatMachine - great fun > From: David Kwinter > > Known bug: > You have to manually choose the "browse" tool after creating a new > "instance" of a beat in a track - a fix for this would be nice, anyone? ----------- send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds. Ken N. From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 19 13:30:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 19 13:30:01 2003 Subject: Launch Command In-Reply-To: <016e01c2ee3f$1d29e370$9536ba50@usermpxylg1xja> Message-ID: Jyrki Kanerva wrote: > Just a guess, but try "/Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" > (first char is a slash before the drive name). Since we're talking about OS X, remember that Apple added one more way in which the OS differs from how all other OSes work, in this case by deceiving the user: In most cases, a *.app appears to be - and by default acts like - a file, but it is not. It is a folder, inside of which may be any number of other files and folders. With TexEdit, if your .app is at the location given above the path to the actual executable is: /Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app/Contents/MacOS/Tex-Edit Plus.Carbon The name of the actual executable can be obtained from parsing the .plist file within the bundle. When writing code to launch apps, this latest Apple anomaly requires you to special-case an exception for OS X; in all other OSes, a file is a file and a folder is a folder, including Mac Classic (pre-CarbonLib). -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com Wed Mar 19 13:30:27 2003 From: Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com (Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com) Date: Wed Mar 19 13:30:27 2003 Subject: Exporting vector graphics Message-ID: >>Richard Gaskin wrote: >> >>Have you seen the SVG Exporter for Rev? You'll find it in the Stacks >>listing in RevNet. >> >>It's jus a proof-of-concept at the moment, but if you have time on your >>hands you could flesh it out into something useful (to the degree that you >>can find programs that read SVG, that is ). >> >>-- > > Richard, > > Thanks for this. I wasn't aware. > > Scott Raney has said that he might consider implementing SVG in MC, > if it were to gain wider acceptance. But it is a low priority for him. > > Before I dig into this, do you know of any Mac graphics applications > which accept SVG format? I have check FreeHand and Canvas and neither > of these do. > > Jim How about the DXF format? Most Mac graphics apps can import these, and having this capability would open the doors to CAD systems as well. Roger From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 19 13:34:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 19 13:34:01 2003 Subject: questions In-Reply-To: <200303191237.HAA10186@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: baccheschi at tin.it > Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 14:41:17 +0100 > Subject: questions > > Please > is it possible to "dial" like in HyperCrd ? ---------- No "dial" command. You will need to address the modem and issue an AT command to it, but I haven't tried that. That's why my dialing stuff is still in HC under OS 9.1, and will remain there until Rev comes up with something comparable. Sorry I couldn't help more, but there are quite a few posts under the thread "Revolution telephony" in the archives. You can do a Google search of the archives by clicking ---------- > Is it possible to Open URL ? ---------- Please take a look at the Transcript Dictionary under the Help menu. Where it says "Find term", type "url". All will become clear ;+) Ken N. From kray at sonsothunder.com Wed Mar 19 13:34:14 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Wed Mar 19 13:34:14 2003 Subject: questions In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000701c2ee45$8adcde80$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Yes to both questions, see the tip at: "Dialing a Phone Number with the modem: Port" http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_port001 and you can use the revGoURL following command to go to a url (it can be a http: or mailto: link): revGoURL("http://www.sonsothunder.com/") Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > baccheschi at tin.it > Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 7:41 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: questions > > > Please > is it possible to "dial" like in HyperCrd ? > Is it possible to Open URL ? > Many thanks > mario baccheschi _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From brad at activadesign.com Wed Mar 19 13:38:03 2003 From: brad at activadesign.com (Bradley Borch) Date: Wed Mar 19 13:38:03 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: <200303191644.LAA18758@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <5AE33DAA-5A39-11D7-9CC6-000393DBAE7A@activadesign.com> > FYI and FWIW: we've used QuickTime to handle Flash in our shell, with > DebugStr for callbacks, using QT5/Flash 4. Never had any problems > with it. Did you use LiveStage to create the DebugStr hooks? That's a lot of $$ for just that feature. I'd love to find a way around that. > > Just curious, what would be the benefit of running Flash natively > within > Rev? You can build a standalone Flash projector so you can already > build > Flash applications. > > Personally, I would rather see Rev updated with some of Flash's > features: > text and graphic antialiasing, draw object transparency, multichannel > sound > (not using QT), rotatable text, etc. Why use two separate tools to > get the > job done when you could use one? I do a lot of multimedia for presentations/education. Flash is great at these, with anti-aliasing, a timeline, etc. So, for example, I can create a dozen or so animations as standalone modules. The beauty of this is that these modules can be much smaller than QuickTime video, using the compression of Flash, and they can be embedded in a web page or, with a few tweaks for less compression/higher quality, included in a Director project on CD. However, I really dislike Director and think it's terribly clumsy. Most of pro developers use very little of the timeline capabilities of Director for most projects, as they wind up being very card-like. The way it's done is to create a script in Director that says "go the frame", essentially telling Director to stand still. Most of the control comes through swapping media, using Lingo. The point is that if I could get the same functionality out of Rev, I'd be very happy. Happy to leave Macromedia's $800 upgrades behind. Happy to gain a new, intuitive development environment with commands that make my life easier (the replaceText?? command in Rev requires a loop and five lines in Director to complete the same thing, e.g.) Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see the same features in Rev, but the modularity of the Flash anims is what makes it work for me. From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 19 13:43:00 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 19 13:43:00 2003 Subject: Exporting vector graphics In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Jim Hurley wrote: > Before I dig into this, do you know of any Mac graphics applications > which accept SVG format? I have check FreeHand and Canvas and neither > of these do. Sorry, couldn't tell ya'. I know Adobe is one of the few companies pushing hard for adoption, as Macromedia would likely prefer not to see Flash unseated by an open standard. But visiting the Adobe site to see if the latest Illustrator imports SVG seemed impossible: all meaty information about product specs for Illustrator there appear restricted to downloadable PDFs; little information in available directly on the Web. At Macromedia's site I could find only an aticle about how to write your own SVG importer for Flash, not a confidence builder that they're serious about supporting this open standard anytime soon. I'm sure there are other tools that work with SVG, but until these two major players get behind it across their product lines its future remains in doubt. :( -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 19 13:47:00 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 19 13:47:00 2003 Subject: Exporting vector graphics In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Jim Hurley wrote: > Before I dig into this, do you know of any Mac graphics applications > which accept SVG format? I have check FreeHand and Canvas and neither > of these do. I also found this list of native SVG editors at the W3C site: It seems from that list that Illustrator 10 does export to SVG, so it seems reasonable that it imports it as well. Most of the other tools there seem to be relatively obscure UNIX packages. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From mark at bcesouth.com Wed Mar 19 13:49:01 2003 From: mark at bcesouth.com (Mark Paris) Date: Wed Mar 19 13:49:01 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX References: <5AE33DAA-5A39-11D7-9CC6-000393DBAE7A@activadesign.com> Message-ID: <00bf01c2ee47$e7ac1b60$d86600d8@superior> Yes, could someone post some sample code of how to talk to flash via quicktime via RR? The best thing I have seen thus far was a post from Gary Rathbone about using RR as a server application, similar to his (most excellent) excel web query demo. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bradley Borch" To: Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2003 1:34 PM Subject: Re: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX > > FYI and FWIW: we've used QuickTime to handle Flash in our shell, with > > DebugStr for callbacks, using QT5/Flash 4. Never had any problems > > with it. > > Did you use LiveStage to create the DebugStr hooks? That's a lot of $$ > for just that feature. I'd love to find a way around that. > > > > Just curious, what would be the benefit of running Flash natively > > within > > Rev? You can build a standalone Flash projector so you can already > > build > > Flash applications. > > > > Personally, I would rather see Rev updated with some of Flash's > > features: > > text and graphic antialiasing, draw object transparency, multichannel > > sound > > (not using QT), rotatable text, etc. Why use two separate tools to > > get the > > job done when you could use one? > > I do a lot of multimedia for presentations/education. Flash is great at > these, with anti-aliasing, a timeline, etc. So, for example, I can > create a dozen or so animations as standalone modules. The beauty of > this is that these modules can be much smaller than QuickTime video, > using the compression of Flash, and they can be embedded in a web page > or, with a few tweaks for less compression/higher quality, included in > a Director project on CD. > > However, I really dislike Director and think it's terribly clumsy. Most > of pro developers use very little of the timeline capabilities of > Director for most projects, as they wind up being very card-like. The > way it's done is to create a script in Director that says "go the > frame", essentially telling Director to stand still. Most of the > control comes through swapping media, using Lingo. > > The point is that if I could get the same functionality out of Rev, I'd > be very happy. Happy to leave Macromedia's $800 upgrades behind. Happy > to gain a new, intuitive development environment with commands that > make my life easier (the replaceText?? command in Rev requires a loop > and five lines in Director to complete the same thing, e.g.) Don't get > me wrong, I'd love to see the same features in Rev, but the modularity > of the Flash anims is what makes it work for me. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From mailjjt at bellsouth.net Wed Mar 19 14:03:00 2003 From: mailjjt at bellsouth.net (John J. Theobald) Date: Wed Mar 19 14:03:00 2003 Subject: Exporting vector graphics References: Message-ID: <3E78BE59.3060406@bellsouth.net> Richard Gaskin wrote: > Jim Hurley wrote: > > >>Before I dig into this, do you know of any Mac graphics applications >>which accept SVG format? I have check FreeHand and Canvas and neither >>of these do. >> > > I also found this list of native SVG editors at the W3C site: > > > > It seems from that list that Illustrator 10 does export to SVG, so it seems > reasonable that it imports it as well. > > Most of the other tools there seem to be relatively obscure UNIX packages. > > I use Illustrator 10. It imports SVG as well as exports it. I too have conversed with Scott about SVG support as a replacement for DPS (which clearly has gone the way of the dinosaur). Scott said it is straightforward to plug in a library for the file format. The challenge is making the objects scriptable. We all know Scott loves a challenge. :-) The ox may not finish his work today, but the earth is patient. John J. Theobald From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 19 14:20:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 19 14:20:00 2003 Subject: Wrong folder In-Reply-To: <200303191237.HAA10186@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Howdy, Why is this setting the folder to the Desktop instead of the folder "Doggies"? set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Revolution 1.1.1 Classic/Doggies" Ken N. From alrice at ARCplanning.com Wed Mar 19 14:29:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Wed Mar 19 14:29:01 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: <0897F800-5A2F-11D7-BDBE-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Message-ID: <93C1A820-5A40-11D7-B8B7-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 10:20 AM, Klaus Major wrote: > And mybe some options for scaling an object WHILE it is moving along a > path. > OK, this can be done by heavy scripting, but speed and smoothness is > another thing... ;-) Rev's animation manager does tweening of both location and scaling. (not sure if that's the correct use of the verb "tween" :-) > ...and...and...and.. Hehe. When I first looked at the Rev animation mgr, I thought it was vaguely reminiscent of Flash, with it's timeline. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 19 14:33:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 19 14:33:00 2003 Subject: Finally That's it!!! (Replacing group images, etc.) In-Reply-To: <200303191237.HAA10186@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ************ > Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 11:46:47 +0100 > Subject: Re: Finally That's it!!! (Replacing group images, etc.) > From: Klaus Major > >> send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds > > i think that this line is obsolete now. (send "...") ---------- You're right, but what makes the difference? I mean, how do we tell when we have to stall a command to catch up? Ken N. From mailjjt at bellsouth.net Wed Mar 19 14:58:00 2003 From: mailjjt at bellsouth.net (John J. Theobald) Date: Wed Mar 19 14:58:00 2003 Subject: Exporting vector graphics References: Message-ID: <3E78CB46.1090904@bellsouth.net> Richard Gaskin wrote: > Jim Hurley wrote: > > >>Before I dig into this, do you know of any Mac graphics applications >>which accept SVG format? I have check FreeHand and Canvas and neither >>of these do. >> > > I also found this list of native SVG editors at the W3C site: > > > > It seems from that list that Illustrator 10 does export to SVG, so it seems > reasonable that it imports it as well. > > Most of the other tools there seem to be relatively obscure UNIX packages. > > I use Illustrator 10. It imports SVG as well as exports it. I too have conversed with Scott about SVG support as a replacement for DPS (which clearly has gone the way of the dinosaur). Scott said it is straightforward to plug in a library for the file format. The challenge is making the objects scriptable. We all know Scott loves a challenge. :-) The ox may not finish his work today, but the earth is patient. John J. Theobald From benr_mc at cogapp.com Wed Mar 19 14:59:00 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Wed Mar 19 14:59:00 2003 Subject: How to ping? In-Reply-To: <97526DD6-5A33-11D7-8599-000A9567A3E6@swcp.com> Message-ID: Dar, Thanks for your reply. >> - how could I (can I?) code a 'ping' function in Rev? > > Use shell. I foolishly forgot to mention that the spare computers that I have available are Mac OS 9 (or earlier!) so I don't think shell is an option here. >> - what is the lowest impact method that I could use, in >> Revolution, to >> probe a network device? > > If you can have two telnet sessions at the same time on your router, > then do an open test to that port. Be sure and close it. The two is > so your usual maintenance and the testing do not interfere. > > If it has http control and you never use it, then use that port instead. > > There has been some discussion on how to make an open timeout. (Use > send.) In your case you may not need that; don't bother with callbacks > in that case. If you don't create an open timeout, then the open will > timeout in 21 seconds on some Windows (maybe all) and 75 seconds on OS > X. That sounds like my best option - I'll have to check if the telnet sessions would be an issue - we keep a console running from the router's serial port, so I hope that would be unaffected. I haven't operated with sockets before, so please bear with me while I push a bit further: My guess is that if, if I can find a spare telnet or http port that doesn't muck anything else up, I can get away with something like the following: * doing an open socket to the appropriate port, with an ID that I can match to the time I attempted the open * if the open succeeds, I close the socket and check how long it took to open - I would assume (though testing should demonstrate) that when things are operating normally this should take a few seconds at most. If it's much longer, I'll record this as an failure (or at least amber condition) * if the open fails with 'socketError' then I can record this as a failure Does this sound like a plan? What I'm unclear about is whether there are conditions in which the open can fail without socketError? And if so is there likely to be a problem if this is repeated thousands of times a day? Also, the docs are unclear as to how I can access the ID that I can optionally specify when opening the socket. Presumably this is appended to the parameter to the callback message? (Forgive me if your response is to "try it and you'll see", but I'm no longer at the office.) Thanks again for your help, Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From scott at tactilemedia.com Wed Mar 19 15:09:02 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Wed Mar 19 15:09:02 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Recently, Trevor DeVore wrote: >> Personally, I would rather see Rev updated with some of Flash's >> features: >> text and graphic antialiasing, draw object transparency, multichannel >> sound >> (not using QT), rotatable text, etc. Why use two separate tools to >> get the >> job done when you could use one? > > It would be nice to have Rev be able to do the things that Flash does > but Flash is a very powerful vector animation tool and recreating the > useful things it can do would be a lot of work. There's no denying it would be great to have full Flash available within Rev/MC, though in my work I often find that the nature of a job drives what used. For example, projects that do a great deal of OS interaction usually don't require powerful vector animation (in fact, users will say this gets in the way of accomplishing their tasks). Likewise, heavy animation projects are often end results in themselves, without demanding OS interaction. Thus you might be find that in the overall scheme of things, the work needed to achieve your goal is less than what you imagined. > I like using the best > tools for the job when they can be integrated together. Don't we all. :-) Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design Email: scott at tactilemedia.com Web: www.tactilemedia.com From scott at tactilemedia.com Wed Mar 19 15:21:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Wed Mar 19 15:21:01 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: <06B1B0EB-5A3D-11D7-BFBF-003065430226@internettrainer.com> Message-ID: Recently, Wolfgang M. Bereuter wrote: >> Just curious, what would be the benefit of running Flash natively >> within >> Rev? You can build a standalone Flash projector so you can already >> build >> Flash applications. > A Lot... > 1) running any swf files WITHOUT the need of Qucktime!!! OK, but then what will drive Flash? Even Flash requires an engine, so you will need something external to drive it, or add significant overhead to the Rev/MC engine to drive Flash. Seems a little excessive. > 2) handling flash files WITHOUT a Flash projector!!! Again, *something* needs to play Flash, whether it's internal or external. > 3) manipulate swf files, which have been made in other tools which can > export swf (a lot), in rev > WITHOUT the need of Qucktime and WITHOUT a Flash projector... > Or its possible to run the projector in a rev card or in a textfile in > a card? > If yes, please, please tell me how... > (f.e. Quarbon exports swf files (compressed) which could run from the > disk the web or any other medium, directly in rev. No matter if on the > clients PC QT is installed or not... If you're suggesting Rev/MC be able to edit Flash movies, I'm sure some folks would find that useful, but this seems pretty demanding for companies without the development resources of Macromedia behind them. Look how long it took Adobe to release LiveMotion and even then, it will always be lagging behind Macromedia in terms of parity/features. > 4) running (converted to flash format) QT files also WITHOUT the need > of Qucktime!!! See 1 and 2 above. >> Personally, I would rather see Rev updated with some of Flash's >> features: >> text and graphic antialiasing, draw object transparency, multichannel >> sound >> (not using QT), rotatable text, etc. Why use two separate tools to >> get the >> job done when you could use one? > > Why do you need this when you can run swf files, prepared perfectly in > other tool which are better than rev for that job, "natively" in rev? > Thats like have an "full featured" grafical html editor, replacing > Photoshop, to manipulate al kind of images in the editor without the > need of PH... > (We say in german to this kind of things: thats not fish nor meat..) I will be the first to say I might be wrong but I expect that the folks developing Rev/MC already have their hands full developing/supporting the current product, much less adding support for a new environment. And I'm not disagreeing with any of the sentiments expressed about how great it would be to Flash available. I'm suggesting that maybe it would be more feasible for the developers to extend Rev/MC's current capabilities to be somewhat on par with Flash. Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design Email: scott at tactilemedia.com Web: www.tactilemedia.com From k_major at os.surf2000.de Wed Mar 19 15:31:01 2003 From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major) Date: Wed Mar 19 15:31:01 2003 Subject: Finally That's it!!! (Replacing group images, etc.) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <6BDEC6E2-5A49-11D7-BDBE-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de> Hi Ken, > ************ >> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 11:46:47 +0100 >> Subject: Re: Finally That's it!!! (Replacing group images, etc.) >> From: Klaus Major >> >>> send "choose browse tool" to me in 20 milliseconds >> >> i think that this line is obsolete now. (send "...") > ---------- > You're right, but what makes the difference? > > I mean, how do we tell when we have to stall a command to catch up? I am not sure, but i think if "create xyz" is involved in your scripts, the engine switches to the pointer-tool automatically. (Yes, did some testing and i looks like that's the point...) So you have to reset the browser-tool in these cases. > Ken N. Regards Klaus Major k_major at os.surf2000.de From trevor at mangomultimedia.com Wed Mar 19 16:01:01 2003 From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore) Date: Wed Mar 19 16:01:01 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <79559D2E-5A4D-11D7-9E94-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com> On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 03:09 PM, Scott Rossi wrote: > > There's no denying it would be great to have full Flash available > within > Rev/MC, though in my work I often find that the nature of a job drives > what > used. For example, projects that do a great deal of OS interaction > usually > don't require powerful vector animation (in fact, users will say this > gets > in the way of accomplishing their tasks). Likewise, heavy animation > projects are often end results in themselves, without demanding OS > interaction. Thus you might be find that in the overall scheme of > things, > the work needed to achieve your goal is less than what you imagined. I wouldn't use Flash for doing complex character animation and the like from within Rev. I would use Flash and it's ability to create beautiful, scalable animation from data that I can pass to it. Using dynamic Flash to enhance a interactive media based application opens up new ways of presenting information to the end-user. It is the same reason I would love to see Inter-movie communication between QuickTime movies in Revolution (something people don't know much about but which is very powerful). It opens up avenues that either were not available before or which are much easier using these specialized technologies. Like I said before though, I think being able to use Flash from within QuickTime is acceptable for now. I have the tools that allow me to use Flash -> QuickTime -> Revoluation when the need arises. I am not saying that Revolution development should all be spent on SWF integration, I think it would be a welcomed feature though. Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Multimedia trevor at mangomultimedia.com From dsc at swcp.com Wed Mar 19 16:15:01 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Wed Mar 19 16:15:01 2003 Subject: How to ping? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <6786746E-5A4F-11D7-8599-000A9567A3E6@swcp.com> Mac OS 9 or earlier, huh? If no shell to ping, you might use appleScript to a utility. Otherwise... On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 12:55 PM, Ben Rubinstein wrote: > Does this sound like a plan? If you can put up with the delays in no-response failure, then you can try it without callbacks. You will almost always get one of three responses: Success. Error because of rejection. Open timeout. If using a telnet port does not interfere with the serial link you are using then, you won't get the rejection. Thus... Off the top of my head (this probably needs fixing; I very rarely use blocking I/O): function routerUp ipAddress local routerID put ipAddress & ":23" into routerID open socket routerID if result() is empty then close socket routerID return true else return false end if end routerUp If you will be using the telnet for maintenance or the serial control blocks it, then you might try an open to a non-existing port and test between a rejection and a timeout. With a few tests you should see the difference in result() or sysError(). Or you might discriminate on time. (A rejection may be artificially delayed; it is delayed 9 seconds on Windows.) Note, if the router has filtering, it might be set up to run stealth even from the inside, in which case you won't get a rejection and this won't work. > What I'm unclear about is whether there are > conditions in which the open can fail without socketError? If there are, I expect they will show up in result(). On OS X, some will show up as a socketClosed callback instead of socketError, so I'd watch out for Mac OS. If the old Mac takes a long time to timeout, you might want to use callbacks and maybe send to work on timing. Also, if you want to be doing other things at the same time, you don't want to use blocking calls. (I very rarely use blocking calls.) If you are checking dozens of routers, then you will want to use callbacks. > And if so is > there likely to be a problem if this is repeated thousands of times a > day? There should not be, but there might be if your system has a memory leak or a port leak. If you run into problems, you might automate a reboot every night. > Also, the docs are unclear as to how I can access the ID that I can > optionally specify when opening the socket. Presumably this is > appended to > the parameter to the callback message? Yes. > (Forgive me if your response is to > "try it and you'll see", but I'm no longer at the office.) To be comfortable with this you might want to look yourself at result(), sysError(), and time for several cases, anyway. As a wimp, I would. Dar Scott From dsc at swcp.com Wed Mar 19 17:37:00 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Wed Mar 19 17:37:00 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 10:47 AM, Jim Hurley wrote: > But you have to do this for each line segment pair. If there are n > line segments in one sprite and m in the other, there will be n*m > potential intersections. Heavy!!! > > If it were me, I would just fake it by calling it a collision if the > distances between their centers (locs) are less than a specified > number. But I am a person of loose morals. And I tend to legalistic. There may be a way to mix styles. If we limit our attention to the intersection of the bounding rectangles of the two polygons, then we can eliminate those line segments that do not intersect or are otherwise not "near" the intersection rectangle. In the worse case this is more work, but on the average it should be less "heavy". Use your "loose morals" to come up with "near". While daydreaming I got to wondering of an approach to both the "loose morals" and the "legalistic" approach. In this approach we consider the intersection rectangle of the bounding rectangles. Each control, be it image or graphic or whatever, that can be considered in collisions can be asked a question. Controls you make might answer simply and quickly. Controls I make might answer exactly and slowly. The the collision function for two controls looks at the intersection rectangle and based on that asks questions of the controls to decide whether there is a collision. Because this is somewhat object-oriented, it is possible to customize the function or handler that responds to questions. If you have only a small set of classes of controls involved, then writing a brute-force script for each one may be the simplest and fastest way to go. Some fast moving controls might look into the future slightly to answer the question. I realize the abstract & obscure description is hard to follow. Here are a couple more specific ways to do this. One way to ask a question is to send a message and look for the result in a few global variables. In the examples below, a transparency value or a transparency interval can be returned. However, for simplicity I'm going to use a boolean value or a boolean interval (a pair in which "huh?" is represented as "true, false", true is represented as "true, true" and false is represented as "false, false"). In the discussion true is considered greater than false. First, I'll describe a simple point test method and then a region test method (with an interval answer). For the point test method, the question asked of each control is "Is this point inside your shape?" Then to detect collision, I simply test some interesting subset of points in the intersecting rectangle looking for one in which the answer is true for both. Candidates for the subset might be all, the corners, the edges, a grid, or some random combination of points from those as sculptured by some designer with "loose morals" who knows the application. Note that on your control, you can use a circle model and, on my control, I can use a more complicated model. Warning. The next method uses recursion. For the region test method, a more complicated question is asked. "Given a rectangle, if the above question is asked for every point in the rectangle, what would be the max and min answers?" If the shape does not intersect with the rectangle, an answer of "false, false" is given. If the rectangle is completely within the shape, then an answer of "true, true" is returned. Otherwise, "true, false" is returned. (The handler may "lie" and return "true, false" as long as it supplies a definitive answer for a smaller rectangle, should this tend to give better performance.) The shape may not answer "true, false" for a trivially small rectangle (whatever that is), that is, a most small rectangle. The collision detector will start with the intersection rectangle and ask each shape the question and may recursively break up the rectangle and ask more questions as needed. If either shape returns "false, false" for a rectangle, there is no collision. If both shapes return "true, true" then there is is a collision. Otherwise the rectangle is broken into two rectangles about equal shape and most squarish. If either of those show a collision then the original rectangle shows a collision. This can be faster if controls are good at returning "true, true" or "false, false", thus allowing the search to be narrowed down enough to more than offset the extra cost of computing the region result. I think that will be normally the case, but if overlapping rectangles are usually small then a brute force point test may be faster. (I find it interesting that I considered a similar method recently when kibitzing on Bible search methods. There must be some general approach.) Dar Scott From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au Wed Mar 19 17:39:01 2003 From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan) Date: Wed Mar 19 17:39:01 2003 Subject: Ping In-Reply-To: <200303191701.MAA19977@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <2FDA0581-5A5B-11D7-B592-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au> On Thursday, Mar 20, 2003, at 04:01 Australia/Sydney, Ben Rubinstein wrote: > Ben I saw that you were discussing with Dar using Open in Rev, as your spare machines are OS 9, but if you have an OS X machine a low overhead way to do this is to write a very short shell script in OS X to ping, append the output to a log file and sleep for half to one minute. Run that in background at low priority and it will be unnoticeable in any circumstance. A cron job or the next sentence's Rev app can keep the log to a day's data. On a spare OS 9 machine, write your Rev app which parses the host's log, analyses and presents events. I personally would find this simpler, given your resources, compared with fiddling with open, close and timeouts, as everything is short to write and will work immediately. regards David > > Actually I don't even want to ping as such, just establish whether a > network > device is up and running. We're having problems with a router that > keeps > rebooting; and as a first step would like to monitor it so that we can > track > how often and when this is happening: in order to establish how > serious the > problem is, so we can see if there is a pattern that might give us a > clue as > to the source of the problem, and to give us a baseline so that if > we're > reduced to trial and error, we can see whether we're making matters > better > or worse. > > So, two alternative questions: > - how could I (can I?) code a 'ping' function in Rev? > - what is the lowest impact method that I could use, in > Revolution, to > probe a network device? > > Ideally I'd set up a stack on a spare machine to be probing every 60 > seconds > or so (it takes just under two minutes for the router to reboot, and I > don't > know at what point in the process it becomes visible on the network, > so any > longer than this might actually miss a rebooting incident); so I don't > want > to use massive resources to do it. > > Any help, suggestions, code fragments etc gratefully received, > > TIA, > > Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com > Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 > http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Wed Mar 19 17:52:00 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Wed Mar 19 17:52:00 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030319224838.57438.qmail@web20004.mail.yahoo.com> --- Luigi Di Martino wrote: > Hi > > Thank you Kurt and Erik for the useful > insights. I won't give up trying to > get my head around how to program, although I > fear it will take me longer > than my patience will allow. The shakabox (beat > machine) idea is moving me > closer to what I'd like to do. like learning music by way of a piece you really like, find a program that grabs you, then use the Developement menu > Script Debug Mode to walk through each step keeping track of what happens to the variables. > Should I perhaps concentrate on the design of a > program and find a > programmer willing to write the code for such a > design? good luck. best you know something about code. > Or perhaps someone > can recommend me a cool book that is easy to > understand (for dunces!) begining: Danny Goodman's Hypertalk 2.2 effort intermediate to advanced: "HyperTalk: The Book" by Jeanne De Voto et.al. (spelling may vary). ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From trevor at mangomultimedia.com Wed Mar 19 18:19:00 2003 From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore) Date: Wed Mar 19 18:19:00 2003 Subject: dealing with bits and signed integers in Revolution In-Reply-To: <79559D2E-5A4D-11D7-9E94-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com> Message-ID: I have been experimenting with reading in binary data and manipulating it. This is my first attempt at dealing with binary data and I have a couple of questions that I was hoping someone with more experience in this area could help with. 1) I haven't found any way to do bitshifting (<< and >>). Does Rev have an equivalent function? 2) In the files I have been reading in I have to deal with signed 15 bit integers. I need to be able to read these integers as base 10 numbers and then convert base 10 numbers into a signed 15 bit integer. I wrote a small function that uses two's complement for reading them but I was wondering if there was an easier way? 3) The files I am reading store the information using Big-Endian. Let's says I was reading in a 4 byte unsigned integer. Currently I am doing something resembling the following: -- get binary data binaryDecode("B8B8B8B8", myBinaryData, opt1, opt2, opt3, opt4) -- Big-Endian conversion put opt4 & opt3 & opt2 & opt1 into opt It doesn't seem like this is the most efficient way to do this? Any suggestions? If anyone has tips on any of these items I would really appreciate it. Thanks, Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Multimedia trevor at mangomultimedia.com From kray at sonsothunder.com Wed Mar 19 18:31:00 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Wed Mar 19 18:31:00 2003 Subject: Wrong folder In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <004601c2ee6f$07f914a0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Ken, try adding a trailing "/" to your path; Rev might be a bit particular about that... Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Ken Norris > Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2003 10:26 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Wrong folder > > > Howdy, > > Why is this setting the folder to the Desktop instead of the > folder "Doggies"? > > set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Revolution 1.1.1 > Classic/Doggies" > > Ken N. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Wed Mar 19 18:45:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Wed Mar 19 18:45:01 2003 Subject: Launch Command In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4B2F92D2-5A64-11D7-928D-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Hi Roger, I have actually been following this thread, but before it had seemed to me that your copy of TextEdit was in a folder called "GetIt". When your AppleScript confirmed that is was really in your normal Applications folder, it seemed that you had just been looking in the wrong place :-) Now you have got me intrigued, so I wrote some scripts to help you work out what is going on. If you want me to send my demo stack, let me know: Create a new stack and make 2 fields and 2 buttons: In field 1, put the following Applescript: tell application "Finder" choose file with prompt "Find TextEdit" end tell Leave field 2 empty. Set button 1's script to: on mouseUp do fld 1 as AppleScript put the result into appPath replace ":" with "/" in appPath replace quote with "" in appPath delete word 1 of appPath -- alias delete last char of appPath -- : put "/" before appPath put appPath into fld 2 launch appPath put the result end mouseUp Set button 2's script to: on mouseUp launch fld 2 end mouseUp (Usually I would give me field's descriptive names, but as this is only a test, I didn't bother.) Now click button 1 - you should get a standard file selector dialog box. Choose TextEdit and click "OK". TextEdit should launch and the correct Revolution path to it should go into field 2. If you quit TextEdit and then click button 2, TextEdit should launch automatically without any file selection. Using AppleScript's file selector works better for OS X app since it seems to understand better that they need to be treated as files event though they are really applications. Let's hope it works this time :-) Sarah On Thursday, March 20, 2003, at 01:14 am, Roger Guay wrote: > Thanks, Sarah. You've joined this thread on the second or third > revolution. I started with slashes (/) and I've known all along where > the application is, but I can't get the Launch Command to work. > launch "Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" does not work on my > OSX 10.2.4 running Revolution 1.1.1. I guess no one else has this > problem and I must appear to be a nut case. Oh well!! > > Roger > > Message: 4 >> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 15:45:46 +1000 >> Subject: Re: Launch Command >> From: Sarah >> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >> >> In order to be consistent across all platforms, Revolution uses a >> slash >> "/" as the delimiter for file paths, in your case over-riding the >> normal Mac colon ":". >> >> Now that you have located the application, I think the following >> should >> work: >> launch "Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" (Rev 1.1.1) >> or launch "/Applications/TextEdit.app" (Rev 2.0) >> >> Note that because of the peculiar nature of OS X application bundles, >> checking for the existence of a file will fail. Check instead for a >> folder if you are looking for an application. >> >> e.g. there is a file "Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" -- >> false >> there is a folder "Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" -- true >> >> Hope this helps, >> Sarah >> >> >> On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 02:43 pm, Roger Guay wrote: >> >>> >>> On Tuesday, March 18, 2003, at 05:56 PM, >>> use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote: >>> >>>> do "choose file" as applescript >>>> put the result >>> >>> Ok, At least I can get the result: "Macintosh >>> HD:Applications:TextEdit.app:" >>> >>> If I then type: >>> >>> launch "Macintosh HD:Applications:TextEdit.app:" >>> >>> into the message box, I get error-35. What the heck is going on??? >>> >>> Thanks, Roger >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From alrice at ARCplanning.com Wed Mar 19 19:01:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Wed Mar 19 19:01:01 2003 Subject: xtalk books (was Re: Scripted musical notation available) In-Reply-To: <20030319224838.57438.qmail@web20004.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <9C0D6B08-5A66-11D7-9FAC-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 03:48 PM, erik hansen wrote: > begining: Danny Goodman's Hypertalk 2.2 effort > intermediate to advanced: "HyperTalk: The Book" > by Jeanne De Voto et.al. (spelling may vary). > The Rev External SDK mentions "You may also find one of the HyperCard books that cover externals useful." Is the De Voto, Kamins, Winkler book the one being referred to? Thanks, Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From benr_mc at cogapp.com Wed Mar 19 19:04:01 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Wed Mar 19 19:04:01 2003 Subject: Ping In-Reply-To: <2FDA0581-5A5B-11D7-B592-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au> Message-ID: on 19/3/03 10:36 pm, David Vaughan wrote > I saw that you were discussing with Dar using Open in Rev, as your > spare machines are OS 9, but if you have an OS X machine a low overhead > way to do this is to write a very short shell script in OS X to ping, > append the output to a log file and sleep for half to one minute. Run > that in background at low priority and it will be unnoticeable in any > circumstance. A cron job or the next sentence's Rev app can keep the > log to a day's data. On a spare OS 9 machine, write your Rev app which > parses the host's log, analyses and presents events. I personally would > find this simpler, given your resources, compared with fiddling with > open, close and timeouts, as everything is short to write and will work > immediately. David, Thanks for your input. If I had an OS X machine running 24/7 I'm sure you're right that this would be the best solution - unfortunately right now the only OS X machines we have are a couple of powerbooks, frequently out of the office etc. Whereas ancient 68K and PPC machines are ten a penny in our hovel. However, a dodgy server may be transitioning to OS X shortly, so I might see if we can hang on for that - simpler and spending less time fiddling on this rocker cover problem is definitely an advantage. I'll probably try a short period of fiddling, and if I'm not getting anywhere, will take your advice. regards, Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From benr_mc at cogapp.com Wed Mar 19 19:04:14 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Wed Mar 19 19:04:14 2003 Subject: How to ping? In-Reply-To: <6786746E-5A4F-11D7-8599-000A9567A3E6@swcp.com> Message-ID: on 19/3/03 9:11 pm, Dar Scott wrote > If you can put up with the delays in no-response failure, then you can > try it without callbacks. > > You will almost always get one of three responses: Success. Error > because of rejection. Open timeout. > > If using a telnet port does not interfere with the serial link you are > using then, you won't get the rejection. > [snip] Aha! I think this explains some of my confusion. Looking at the docs there is no mention of any results - it appeared that everything was by callbacks. (cough) jeanne? (cough). > To be comfortable with this you might want to look yourself at > result(), sysError(), and time for several cases, anyway. As a wimp, I > would. absolutely. I'm going to stop sending theoretical mails now until I can get back to the office and actually try some things. Thanks to you and David for your assistance. Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From mirrorman54 at hotmail.com Wed Mar 19 19:16:01 2003 From: mirrorman54 at hotmail.com (Luigi Di Martino) Date: Wed Mar 19 19:16:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available Message-ID: Thanks Erik, I will try and find this book you suggest. Programming is actually very enjoyable....so far! I got into the animation and stuff and also snooping on all the code. Actually got the "hello World" text bouncing off all the corners as if it had one whisky too many! I will stick with Revolution too, as it has a good vibe about it. Please keep me in touch with your fanzine efforts. Lui >From: erik hansen >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >Subject: Re: Scripted musical notation available >Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 14:48:38 -0800 (PST) > > >--- Luigi Di Martino >wrote: > > Hi > > > > Thank you Kurt and Erik for the useful > > insights. I won't give up trying to > > get my head around how to program, although I > > fear it will take me longer > > than my patience will allow. The shakabox (beat > > machine) idea is moving me > > closer to what I'd like to do. > >like learning music by way of a piece you really >like, find a program that grabs you, then use the >Developement menu > Script Debug Mode to walk >through each step keeping track of what happens >to the variables. > > > Should I perhaps concentrate on the design of a > > program and find a > > programmer willing to write the code for such a > > design? > >good luck. best you know something about code. > > > Or perhaps someone > > can recommend me a cool book that is easy to > > understand (for dunces!) > >begining: Danny Goodman's Hypertalk 2.2 effort >intermediate to advanced: "HyperTalk: The Book" >by Jeanne De Voto et.al. (spelling may vary). > > >===== >erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org > >__________________________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! >http://platinum.yahoo.com >_______________________________________________ >use-revolution mailing list >use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution _________________________________________________________________ Stay in touch with absent friends - get MSN Messenger http://messenger.msn.co.uk From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Wed Mar 19 19:35:00 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Wed Mar 19 19:35:00 2003 Subject: xtalk books (was Re: Scripted musical notation available) In-Reply-To: <9C0D6B08-5A66-11D7-9FAC-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: <20030320003203.39587.qmail@web20009.mail.yahoo.com> --- Alex Rice wrote: > > begining: Danny Goodman's Hypertalk 2.2 > effort > > intermediate to advanced: "HyperTalk: The > Book" > > by Jeanne De Voto et.al. (spelling may vary). > > > The Rev External SDK mentions "You may also > find one of the HyperCard > books that cover externals useful." > > Is the De Voto, Kamins, Winkler book the one > being referred to? correct! ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From alrice at ARCplanning.com Wed Mar 19 19:41:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Wed Mar 19 19:41:01 2003 Subject: xtalk books Message-ID: <35574F24-5A6C-11D7-9FAC-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> The External SDK says "Externals can be written in languages other than C as long as they pass data using C data structures, but no APIs are available for other languages in this release. The current API is compatible with the API supported by Apple's HyperCard 1.2" Is this API actually available anywhere- and would be of any use for someone learning to write externals? Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Wed Mar 19 19:49:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Wed Mar 19 19:49:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030320004617.58684.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com> --- Luigi Di Martino wrote: > Thanks Erik, I will try and find this book you > suggest. Programming is > actually very enjoyable....so far! I got into > the animation and stuff and > also snooping on all the code. Actually got the > "hello World" text bouncing > off all the corners as if it had one whisky too > many! I will stick with > Revolution too, as it has a good vibe about it. > > Please keep me in touch with your fanzine > efforts. "fanzine" is what i call a page on my website. there are Mexican Folklorico, Salsa, Black Gospel and Kabarett fanzines. the Old European Teutons are especially bizarre. in the future i hope to use Rev on websites to send video to dancers who can study at home, maximizing expensive rehearsal time. as well as for the fun of it. there are 30 half hour episodes of Street Dancers Alternative To Violence, my community tv show. that will have to await developments, but the idea that students might be motivated to step-read code by programs that do things that excite them, is my guiding light. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From rogerguay at centurytel.net Wed Mar 19 20:08:01 2003 From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay) Date: Wed Mar 19 20:08:01 2003 Subject: Launch Command In-Reply-To: <200303191835.NAA25986@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <02593B84-5A70-11D7-9482-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Thank you, Thank you, Thank you. Launch "/Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" works! The first slash character is the key. The Launch Command lives!! Thank you, Thank you, Thank you. Roger (over and out!) > Message: 2 > From: "Jyrki Kanerva" > To: > Subject: Re: Launch Command > Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 19:43:55 +0200 > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > Just a guess, but try "/Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" > (first char is a slash before the drive name). > > Regards, > > Jyrki K > > Message: 11 > Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 10:26:24 -0800 > Subject: Re: Launch Command > From: Richard Gaskin > To: > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > Jyrki Kanerva wrote: > >> Just a guess, but try "/Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app" >> (first char is a slash before the drive name). > > Since we're talking about OS X, remember that Apple added one more way > in > which the OS differs from how all other OSes work, in this case by > deceiving > the user: > > In most cases, a *.app appears to be - and by default acts like - a > file, > but it is not. It is a folder, inside of which may be any number of > other > files and folders. > > With TexEdit, if your .app is at the location given above the path to > the > actual executable is: > > /Macintosh HD/Applications/TextEdit.app/Contents/MacOS/Tex-Edit > Plus.Carbon > > The name of the actual executable can be obtained from parsing the > .plist > file within the bundle. > > When writing code to launch apps, this latest Apple anomaly requires > you to > special-case an exception for OS X; in all other OSes, a file is a > file and > a folder is a folder, including Mac Classic (pre-CarbonLib). > > -- > Richard Gaskin > Fourth World Media Corporation > Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site From rogerguay at centurytel.net Wed Mar 19 20:26:01 2003 From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay) Date: Wed Mar 19 20:26:01 2003 Subject: Launch Command In-Reply-To: <200303200002.TAA05377@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <6E07977B-5A72-11D7-9482-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net> Very good, Sarah. You may have seen my previous response. This works as well and the secrete is the leading /. Thanks to all again . . . Launch lives!! Cheers, Roger > Message: 9 > Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 09:41:23 +1000 > Subject: Re: Launch Command > From: Sarah > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > Hi Roger, > > I have actually been following this thread, but before it had seemed to > me that your copy of TextEdit was in a folder called "GetIt". When your > AppleScript confirmed that is was really in your normal Applications > folder, it seemed that you had just been looking in the wrong place :-) > > Now you have got me intrigued, so I wrote some scripts to help you work > out what is going on. If you want me to send my demo stack, let me > know: > > Create a new stack and make 2 fields and 2 buttons: > In field 1, put the following Applescript: > tell application "Finder" > choose file with prompt "Find TextEdit" > end tell > > Leave field 2 empty. > > Set button 1's script to: > on mouseUp > do fld 1 as AppleScript > put the result into appPath > replace ":" with "/" in appPath > replace quote with "" in appPath > delete word 1 of appPath -- alias > delete last char of appPath -- : > put "/" before appPath > put appPath into fld 2 > > launch appPath > put the result > end mouseUp > > Set button 2's script to: > on mouseUp > launch fld 2 > end mouseUp > > (Usually I would give me field's descriptive names, but as this is only > a test, I didn't bother.) > > Now click button 1 - you should get a standard file selector dialog > box. Choose TextEdit and click "OK". TextEdit should launch and the > correct Revolution path to it should go into field 2. If you quit > TextEdit and then click button 2, TextEdit should launch automatically > without any file selection. > > Using AppleScript's file selector works better for OS X app since it > seems to understand better that they need to be treated as files event > though they are really applications. > > Let's hope it works this time :-) > Sarah > From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 19 20:47:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 19 20:47:01 2003 Subject: Finally That's it!!! (Replacing group images, etc.) In-Reply-To: <200303200002.TAA05377@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 21:29:01 +0100 > Subject: Re: Finally That's it!!! (Replacing group images, etc.) > From: Klaus Major > I am not sure, but i think if "create xyz" is involved in your scripts, > the engine > switches to the pointer-tool automatically. > > (Yes, did some testing and i looks like that's the point...) > > So you have to reset the browser-tool in these cases. ---------- Well, the script we're speaking of is "creating" an image on the screen. I guess it has to more to do with creating a control or something. Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 19 20:57:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 19 20:57:01 2003 Subject: Wrong folder In-Reply-To: <200303200002.TAA05377@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: "Ken Ray" > Subject: RE: Wrong folder > Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 17:26:51 -0600 > Organization: Sons of Thunder Software > > Ken, try adding a trailing "/" to your path; Rev might be a bit > particular about that... ---------- Nope. Didin't work. Here's the whole script: on mouseUp set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Revolution 1.1.1 Classic/Doggies/" answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 end mouseUp ...shows me the Desktop list. It looks fine to me, so I have no clue where to go from here. Ken N. ------------ >> -----Original Message----- >> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com >> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Ken Norris >> Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2003 10:26 AM >> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >> Subject: Wrong folder >> >> >> Howdy, >> >> Why is this setting the folder to the Desktop instead of the >> folder "Doggies"? >> >> set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Revolution 1.1.1 >> Classic/Doggies" >> >> Ken N. From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Wed Mar 19 20:57:18 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Wed Mar 19 20:57:18 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 09:40 AM, Dar Scott wrote: > Ah, I just mailed off the same idea. There is a hole. That is the > case of one being completely inside the other. I covered that in my > mailing, but it may not be needed. > Good catch. I just though of an alternative: There is a fairly simple and quick test to see if a point is inside a polygon of any shape: from the point, draw an imaginary horizontal line either to the right or left, to infinity. Get the formula for that line, and figure out how many line segments of the polygon it intersects. If it intersects an odd number, the point is inside the polygon. If it intersects an even number, the point is outside the polygon. It's a fairly fast check because the formula for a horizontal line is easy to work with/find intersections with. You have to watch out if the point has the same y component as any of the endpoints of the polygon -- that reverses the answer, I believe. So, using that test, you test points from each of the polygons to see if they are inside of each other. You have to test points from both polygons, since the pointy bit of either could be sticking into the other, without any points of the other being inside the first. The first point you find that is inside the other, you have a hit and you exit. The tricky bit is figuring out which points to test -- don't test them all, it's too much work. But that's optimization, left as an exercise for the reader ;-) regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From monte at sweattechnologies.com Wed Mar 19 21:14:00 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Wed Mar 19 21:14:00 2003 Subject: Wrong folder In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > Ken, try adding a trailing "/" to your path; Rev might be a bit > > particular about that... > ---------- > Nope. Didin't work. Here's the whole script: > > on mouseUp > set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Revolution 1.1.1 > Classic/Doggies/" > answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" > put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 > end mouseUp > > ...shows me the Desktop list. It looks fine to me, so I have no clue where > to go from here. > Hi Try: on mouseUp answer file empty with "/Macintosh HD/Revolution 1.1.1 Classic/Doggies/" with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 end mouseUp Regards Monte From jhurley at infostations.com Wed Mar 19 21:44:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Wed Mar 19 21:44:01 2003 Subject: Exporting vector graphics In-Reply-To: <200303192022.PAA32007@www.runrev.com> References: <200303192022.PAA32007@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > Richard Gaskin wrote: > >Sorry, couldn't tell ya'. I know Adobe is one of the few companies pushing >hard for adoption, as Macromedia would likely prefer not to see Flash >unseated by an open standard. > >But visiting the Adobe site to see if the latest Illustrator imports SVG >seemed impossible: all meaty information about product specs for >Illustrator there appear restricted to downloadable PDFs; little information >in available directly on the Web. > >At Macromedia's site I could find only an aticle about how to write your own >SVG importer for Flash, not a confidence builder that they're serious about >supporting this open standard anytime soon. > >I'm sure there are other tools that work with SVG, but until these two major >players get behind it across their product lines its future remains in >doubt. :( > Richard, Thanks for all the good research. I checked out the site you cited. I'm sure you noticed that John Theobald says he uses SVG on Illustrator. I think I see the solution to this dilemma: Proprietary open standards. Jim From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Wed Mar 19 21:47:00 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Wed Mar 19 21:47:00 2003 Subject: Wrong folder In-Reply-To: Message-ID: What about adding a line to check if the folder exists and asking for it to be selected if not: if there is a folder "/Macintosh HD/Revolution 1.1.1 Classic/Doggies/" then set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Revolution 1.1.1 Classic/Doggies/" else answer folder "Please select the picture folder:" set the defaultFolder to it end if This would also tell you if there was something wrong with your original folder path. Sarah >> Ken, try adding a trailing "/" to your path; Rev might be a bit >> particular about that... > ---------- > Nope. Didin't work. Here's the whole script: > > on mouseUp > set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Revolution 1.1.1 > Classic/Doggies/" > answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" > put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 > end mouseUp > > ...shows me the Desktop list. It looks fine to me, so I have no clue > where > to go from here. > > Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 19 22:03:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 19 22:03:00 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: <200303192022.PAA31996@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 13:34:01 -0500 > Subject: Re: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX > From: Bradley Borch ----------snip > I do a lot of multimedia for presentations/education. Flash is great at > these, with anti-aliasing, a timeline, etc. So, for example, I can > create a dozen or so animations as standalone modules. ----------snip I'm very interested in this line of work. I want to go back to school and get a degree. My two major thrusts will be: Long term healthcare training, and Christian education. I've looked over Director and think it's great, but custom scripting it looks like a nightmare compared to what I'm used to, plus it's expensive. ---------- > The point is that if I could get the same functionality out of Rev, I'd > be very happy. Happy to leave Macromedia's $800 upgrades behind. Happy > to gain a new, intuitive development environment with commands that > make my life easier ---------- Makes plenty of sense to me, too. Rev looks like it has all the basic tools to shape a multimedia environment for just what you suggest, All that's needed is better QT and Flash control plugins. If I had the experience and know-how I'd do it. All the best, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 19 22:12:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 19 22:12:01 2003 Subject: Wrong folder In-Reply-To: <200303200248.VAA11644@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: "Monte Goulding" > To: > Subject: RE: Wrong folder > Try: > > on mouseUp > answer file empty with "/Macintosh HD/Revolution 1.1.1 Classic/Doggies/" > with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" > put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 > end mouseUp ---------- Nope, still opens to the Desktop list. Thanks for trying, though, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 19 22:57:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 19 22:57:00 2003 Subject: Wrong folder In-Reply-To: <200303200248.VAA11644@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 12:42:49 +1000 > Subject: Re: Wrong folder > From: Sarah > > What about adding a line to check if the folder exists and asking for > it to be selected if not: > > if there is a folder "/Macintosh HD/Revolution 1.1.1 Classic/Doggies/" > then > set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Revolution 1.1.1 > Classic/Doggies/" > else > answer folder "Please select the picture folder:" > set the defaultFolder to it > end if > > This would also tell you if there was something wrong with your > original folder path. ---------- Well, you're p[artiallyright about that! It made me look at what was actually happening, and it became obvious that, since the Rev folder is on the DT, I forgot to include the DT (it's a folder too...duhh). So, I added it in, but then it would only go as far as the Rev folder. I was getting frustrated so I moved the folder, Rev stack, images, and all, out of the Rev folder to the DT. Now it reads: on mouseUp set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Desktop/Doggies/" answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 end mouseUp ...works OK so far. I kept "set the defaultFolder..." to start with even though it means an extra line, becaiuse it's easier to keep track of and change if necessary. Does anyone have a utility for tracking filepaths? Filepaths can be cornnn-fusin'! ;-) Thanks so much, Ken N. From monte at sweattechnologies.com Wed Mar 19 23:19:00 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Wed Mar 19 23:19:00 2003 Subject: Wrong folder In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > > Try: > > > > on mouseUp > > answer file empty with "/Macintosh HD/Revolution 1.1.1 Classic/Doggies/" > > with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" > > put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 > > end mouseUp > ---------- > Nope, still opens to the Desktop list. > Maybe it's silent protest about the fact you are using a file extension filter instead of a type code???? Just from some minor testing it looks as though it will open at the last place it navigated to and opened a file from unless you specify the full path of a file (not folder). Quite a nice feature when you think about it. Personally if I were asking the user to choose a file only from a specific folder I'd just use the files function to get a list and present that to the user. Failing that you could always use the first JPEG in the list as a default choice. Monte From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 19 23:33:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 19 23:33:01 2003 Subject: Rev/browser/emailer In-Reply-To: <200303200248.VAA11644@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Just muttering away about how to make the impossible possible. I want to get my onscreen keyboards to type into a "live" browser, i.e., to act in place of the real keyboard. I've seen apps that do that, but most are quite expensive and don't offer the options I intend to have. Is there any way to get Rev to run in any browser? TIA, Ken N. From scott at tactilemedia.com Wed Mar 19 23:51:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Wed Mar 19 23:51:01 2003 Subject: Rev/browser/emailer In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Recently, Ken Norris wrote: > I want to get my onscreen keyboards to type into a "live" browser, i.e., to > act in place of the real keyboard. I've seen apps that do that, but most are > quite expensive and don't offer the options I intend to have. > > Is there any way to get Rev to run in any browser? No. Some options are: 1a) Create an app in which a user can enter a URL and then launch the URL within a browser. 1b) Related to option 1 above: have the user establish a Rev app as a helper app for their browser. Then establish a "home" link or similar that auto launches your Rev app when linked to via the browser which in turn allows launching of a URL (a bit demanding but doable). 2) Take a look at Chip Walter's Leo at www.altuit.com which allows embedding of a browser within the Win version of Rev. 3) Look into Flash to create a browser-based keyboard/launcher. Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design Email: scott at tactilemedia.com Web: www.tactilemedia.com From yvescoppe at skynet.be Thu Mar 20 01:59:01 2003 From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE) Date: Thu Mar 20 01:59:01 2003 Subject: file type Message-ID: Hi, a macintosh question : I have a script which build the path to a file (an image) I get something like "Macintosh HD/.../.../imageName" Since on the mac there are files without extensions (.xxx) how can I check in the script if the image is a jpg file type ?? Thanks. -- Greetings. Yves COPPE Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be From scott at tactilemedia.com Thu Mar 20 02:37:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Thu Mar 20 02:37:01 2003 Subject: file type In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Recently, yves COPPE wrote: > a macintosh question : > > I have a script which build the path to a file (an image) > I get something like "Macintosh HD/.../.../imageName" > > Since on the mac there are files without extensions (.xxx) > how can I check in the script if the image is a jpg file type ?? One way: 1) get the detailed file list of the directory where the JPEG is stored 2) extract the creator/type info (item 11) from the line containing your file Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design Email: scott at tactilemedia.com Web: www.tactilemedia.com From yvescoppe at skynet.be Thu Mar 20 03:06:01 2003 From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE) Date: Thu Mar 20 03:06:01 2003 Subject: file type In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >Recently, yves COPPE wrote: > >> a macintosh question : >> >> I have a script which build the path to a file (an image) >> I get something like "Macintosh HD/.../.../imageName" >> >> Since on the mac there are files without extensions (.xxx) >> how can I check in the script if the image is a jpg file type ?? > >One way: > >1) get the detailed file list of the directory where the JPEG is stored > >2) extract the creator/type info (item 11) from the line containing your >file > >Regards, > OK, works fine. Thank you. -- Greetings. Yves COPPE Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be From chipp at chipp.com Thu Mar 20 04:09:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Thu Mar 20 04:09:01 2003 Subject: mouseUp vs mouseDoubleUp? Message-ID: I'm in a bit in a quandry... I want to do separate things for the mouseUp and mouseDoubleUp messages in a field. Here's a simple handler for a single button on a new stack... on mouseUp put "got One" & cr after msg end mouseUp on mouseDoubleUp put "got two" & cr after msg end mouseDoubleUp Sometimes the mouseDoubleUp fires first, sometimes the mouseUp fires first. But they always BOTH fire. How can I control the order, which I need to be able to do to create separate functions for each of the messages? (XP 1.8GHz) -Chipp PS According to the docs...this shouldn't happen: "Add a mouseDoubleUp handler that calls the mouseUp handler. If the user clicks rapidly twice, the second click sends a mouseDoubleUp message instead of mouseUp. Capturing the mouseDoubleUp message ensures that the object receives a separate mouseUp message for each click" --------------------- Chipp Walters Altuit, inc. http://www.altuit.com http://www.chipp.com --------------------- From valetia at mac.com Thu Mar 20 05:47:01 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Thu Mar 20 05:47:01 2003 Subject: Auto-Opening a Downloaded File in a Standalone? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: How do you create a file that will automatically open in a standalone that you've created when you click its download link from a browser? The method(s) need to work on both Macs and PCs... TIA, Valetia From jhurley at infostations.com Thu Mar 20 07:13:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Thu Mar 20 07:13:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303200002.TAA05391@www.runrev.com> References: <200303200002.TAA05391@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > > >On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 10:47 AM, Jim Hurley wrote: > >> But you have to do this for each line segment pair. If there are n >> line segments in one sprite and m in the other, there will be n*m >> potential intersections. Heavy!!! >> >> If it were me, I would just fake it by calling it a collision if the >> distances between their centers (locs) are less than a specified >> number. But I am a person of loose morals. >Dar Scott wrote: >And I tend to legalistic. > >There may be a way to mix styles. If we limit our attention to the >intersection of the bounding rectangles of the two polygons, then we >can eliminate those line segments that do not intersect or are >otherwise not "near" the intersection rectangle. In the worse case >this is more work, but on the average it should be less "heavy". Use >your "loose morals" to come up with "near". > (snip) Dar, You have obviously given this a lot of thought! And I'm sure you are right about a two pronged approach being the right one: First check to see if the locs are close enough that it is *possible* for the two polygon boundaries to intersect, and, if so, then check to see if any of the line segments do indeed intersect; this would define a collision. Jim From BradAllen at mac.com Thu Mar 20 09:35:00 2003 From: BradAllen at mac.com (Brad Allen) Date: Thu Mar 20 09:35:00 2003 Subject: database security In-Reply-To: References: <1D59A0.6AA%malte.brill@t-online.de> Message-ID: I think my original email on this may have come through with some unintended formatting which obscured my basic question: Does Rev use a secure protocol to transmit data to and from a mySQL server, or do I need to make special security arrangements through other means such as a VPN? Thanks! >I'm starting a project involving Rev 1.1.1r2 as a GUI front end to a >mySQL database which needs to work for remote users across the >Internet. I'm currently at the proof of concept stage, and need to >know whether this kind of connection can be handled securely by Rev. > >The mySQL security guidelines >http://www.mysql.com/doc/en/General_security.html strongly recommend >against sending clear text across the Internet: > >"# Do not transmit plain (unencrypted) data over the Internet. These >data are accessible to everyone who has the time and ability to >intercept it and use it for their own purposes. Instead, use an >encrypted protocol such as SSL or SSH. MySQL supports internal SSL >connections as of Version 4.0.0. SSH port-forwarding can be used to >create an encrypted (and compressed) tunnel for the communication." > >Does Rev use a secure protocol to send and receive data from a mySQL server? > >Thanks! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bernard at hubrisys.com Thu Mar 20 09:35:40 2003 From: bernard at hubrisys.com (Bernard Sauterel) Date: Thu Mar 20 09:35:40 2003 Subject: Use of Revolution ... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Greetings I am evaluating differents tools in order to develop a financial application (I also looked at RealBasic, Omnis Studio, 4D) : Some requirements / caracteristics : - stand alone application, not Internet based - lot of data and calculation on that data - many different kinds of reports - 2D/3D graphics I like the Revolution concept and features, but I am not sure it will allow me to fulfill the above requirements. Also needed is cross-plateform, "double-clickable application" simplicity, ease of use and productivity of the IDE, GUI builder: here I know that Revolution will fit. I would appreciate any comments, opinions from the existing community. Thanks in advance Bernard Sauterel From livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk Thu Mar 20 09:52:01 2003 From: livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk (Graham Samuel) Date: Thu Mar 20 09:52:01 2003 Subject: trapping quit Message-ID: I've been slightly out of circulation lately, but my scan thru all the recent digests didn't come up with any reply to the following: On Mon, 17 Mar 2003 17:08:48 -0700, Devin Asay wrote: > >I'm not getting something. I want to trap the quit message and do some >stuff before my program quits. I finally settled on trying the >shutdownRequest message. When I handle it and pass it in the >development environment, it works as expected: it does the stuff I want >it to do then quits Revolution. But when I compile the stack as a >standalone, the shutdownRequest message gets executed, but the quit >never happens. I even tried adding an explicit quit call to the >shutdownRequest handler. The resultant standalone still will not quit. > >I read the dictionary entries for both shutdown and shutdownRequest. >The latter seemed to be the one I wanted, but as I said, it's not >working. The descriptions of both are a little sketchy, so maybe I'm >not understanding something. Can someone shed some light on how these >messages work and what is the best way to intercept then pass on a quit >call. Jeanne? Sadly, I can't answer the question, but can only add a supplementary: if the OS forces the app to quit, does an RR standalone get a 'shutdownRequest' message? If so, it would prevent Mac apps from having to handle the 'quit' AppleEvent in order to shut down in good order, and it would prevent the ignorant of Windows and Unix (i.e. me) from having to understand what the drill is when an app is killed by the OS. I am willing to experiment, but I thought I would also see if anyone has any experience of this. For me the issue is that in the Mac at least, a program is obliged to shut down in good order when called upon to do so, for example by avoiding insisting on user response (this is not the same as structuring a program to put itself back into good order when restarted after a crash, which is just good programming practice); not sure what the etiquette is for other OSs. Hoping for enlightenment Graham -- ------------------------------------------------------------------- Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK & France From mirrorman54 at hotmail.com Thu Mar 20 09:55:03 2003 From: mirrorman54 at hotmail.com (Luigi Di Martino) Date: Thu Mar 20 09:55:03 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available Message-ID: Hi Erik >that will have to await developments, but the >idea that students might be motivated to >step-read code by programs that do things that >excite them, is my guiding light. Take a chance And dance with me Turn around And set us free Wear a smile Light the sky Move to Love Will never die Just checked out your website and I see what you mean. You didn't mention Hank! Dancing is something I have always enjoyed, and I wish you the best with your ideas, which I like the sound of. Due to the current state of affairs at the moment I am going to take a break and go record some anti-war/pro-peace songs..:-) Lui >From: erik hansen >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >Subject: Re: Scripted musical notation available >Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 16:46:17 -0800 (PST) > >--- Luigi Di Martino >wrote: > > Thanks Erik, I will try and find this book you > > suggest. Programming is > > actually very enjoyable....so far! I got into > > the animation and stuff and > > also snooping on all the code. Actually got the > > "hello World" text bouncing > > off all the corners as if it had one whisky too > > many! I will stick with > > Revolution too, as it has a good vibe about it. > > > > Please keep me in touch with your fanzine > > efforts. > >"fanzine" is what i call a page on my website. >there are Mexican Folklorico, Salsa, Black >Gospel and Kabarett fanzines. the Old European >Teutons are especially bizarre. > >in the future i hope to use Rev on websites to >send video to dancers who can study at home, >maximizing expensive rehearsal time. as well as >for the fun of it. there are 30 half hour >episodes of Street Dancers Alternative To >Violence, my community tv show. > >that will have to await developments, but the >idea that students might be motivated to >step-read code by programs that do things that >excite them, is my guiding light. > >===== >erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org > >__________________________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! >http://platinum.yahoo.com >_______________________________________________ >use-revolution mailing list >use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself with cool emoticons http://messenger.msn.co.uk From eudio at chabashira.co.jp Thu Mar 20 09:57:01 2003 From: eudio at chabashira.co.jp (UDI) Date: Thu Mar 20 09:57:01 2003 Subject: Extracting log? Message-ID: <20030320145350.11904@mail.chabashira.co.jp> I downloaded a archive of this list. http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2003-February.txt.gz But I can't extract from this file. Is there a person knowing a solution on MacOS9? UDI eudio at chabashira.co.jp http://member.nifty.ne.jp/UDI/ From harrison at all-auctions.com Thu Mar 20 10:19:01 2003 From: harrison at all-auctions.com (Rick Harrison) Date: Thu Mar 20 10:19:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 07:32 AM, Luigi Di Martino wrote: > Hi > > Thank you Kurt and Erik for the useful insights. I won't give up > trying to get my head around how to program, although I fear it will > take me longer than my patience will allow. The shakabox (beat > machine) idea is moving me closer to what I'd like to do. The main > area that I will need to learn is how to map one midi note to another. > Then to instruct the program to perform some other duties, like "take > musical phrase around the intervals 1 3 #5", and "transpose circle of > 5ths up by the ratio of a Comma (80:81)" . Basically I want a piece of > software that allows me to compose my 'mirror' music ideas. > > In 1997 a programmer did build me a basic mirroring program, called > The Mirrormaker. It does the midi mapping. I am no longer in touch > with the programmer and have no access to the code, and it was written > for only windows anyway. If anyone is interested in hearing a few I > have over a thousand midi files that I have mirrored with this > software. To get the software to perform more scripts is what I would > love to learn to do, but I have to start at the beginning again and > find out about the mapping of notes. > > Should I perhaps concentrate on the design of a program and find a > programmer willing to write the code for such a design? Or perhaps > someone can recommend me a cool book that is easy to understand (for > dunces!) > > Thanks for reading > Lui Flipping other's music to create a "new" piece is not original. I once heard of a student who thought he'd flip his professor's doctoral composition so that he wouldn't have to do much work. What came out was Beethoven's 9th! It can be fun for a while, flipping Christmas music is hysterical! Wouldn't you rather be creative on your own? Cheers, Rick Harrison From kray at sonsothunder.com Thu Mar 20 10:28:00 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Thu Mar 20 10:28:00 2003 Subject: trapping quit In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <003b01c2eef4$b9b939b0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> > For me the issue is that in the Mac at least, a program is obliged to > shut down in good order when called upon to do so, for example by > avoiding insisting on user response (this is not the same as > structuring a program to put itself back into good order when > restarted after a crash, which is just good programming practice); > not sure what the etiquette is for other OSs. Well, I ran a test where I made a simple standalone with traps in the stack script for "closeStack", "closeStackRequest", "shutdown" and "shutdownRequest", and had each one write a file to the "C:" drive if they were triggered. I then ran the standalone, and chose Shutdown from the Start menu in Windows 98. After it shutdown and I restarted, none of the files had been written (and 'yes', I did test it to make sure it would write before I ran this test). So it appears that you can't trap Windows shutting down... has anyone had any other experience with this that can shed some light on the subject? Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From menno at libero.it Thu Mar 20 10:38:01 2003 From: menno at libero.it (Piero Menno') Date: Thu Mar 20 10:38:01 2003 Subject: Extracting log? In-Reply-To: <20030320145350.11904@mail.chabashira.co.jp> References: <20030320145350.11904@mail.chabashira.co.jp> Message-ID: Hi, try with stuffit expander, which is free and it is included in stuffit standard at the url: http://www.stuffit.com/stuffit/lite/ Bye >I downloaded a archive of this list. > http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2003-February.txt.gz >But I can't extract from this file. >Is there a person knowing a solution on MacOS9? > >UDI >eudio at chabashira.co.jp >http://member.nifty.ne.jp/UDI/ >_______________________________________________ >use-revolution mailing list >use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From mirrorman54 at hotmail.com Thu Mar 20 10:44:00 2003 From: mirrorman54 at hotmail.com (Luigi Di Martino) Date: Thu Mar 20 10:44:00 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available Message-ID: Hi Rick That is assuming you have the right idea on what I want to do with my flipping! By what you have said I'm afraid you do not, although mirroring well known oieces of music is a side effect. Mirror music has been around for a lot of years and I have read one or two books on it. I have a book on the subject of mirror music too and none of it is based on any information I have seen before. That is the reason that I am keen to build a program that deals with these new things. They include merging the scales with the Vedic square, which contains the same hidden structures that are evident on the "mirror" side of scales. These structures are also plottable on the Tzolkin grid and can be run along with the Fibonacci numbers, and of course much has already been done with the Fibinacci numbers in a musical sense. However they have never been associated with a unique hidden mirror musical structure, which is what I am learning to base compositions on. I have also merged these structures with the alphabet and associated notes to letters that shows the alphabet also contains the same axis points leading to the same hidden structure. My favorite christmas mirror has to be 'Twelve days of Christmas'! But 'Born to be wild' sounds so discordant. Thanks Lui >From: Rick Harrison >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >Subject: Re: Scripted musical notation available >Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 10:16:00 -0500 > > >On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 07:32 AM, Luigi Di Martino wrote: > >>Hi >> >>Thank you Kurt and Erik for the useful insights. I won't give up trying to >>get my head around how to program, although I fear it will take me longer >>than my patience will allow. The shakabox (beat machine) idea is moving me >>closer to what I'd like to do. The main area that I will need to learn is >>how to map one midi note to another. Then to instruct the program to >>perform some other duties, like "take musical phrase around the intervals >>1 3 #5", and "transpose circle of 5ths up by the ratio of a Comma (80:81)" >>. Basically I want a piece of software that allows me to compose my >>'mirror' music ideas. >> >>In 1997 a programmer did build me a basic mirroring program, called The >>Mirrormaker. It does the midi mapping. I am no longer in touch with the >>programmer and have no access to the code, and it was written for only >>windows anyway. If anyone is interested in hearing a few I have over a >>thousand midi files that I have mirrored with this software. To get the >>software to perform more scripts is what I would love to learn to do, but >>I have to start at the beginning again and find out about the mapping of >>notes. >> >>Should I perhaps concentrate on the design of a program and find a >>programmer willing to write the code for such a design? Or perhaps someone >>can recommend me a cool book that is easy to understand (for dunces!) >> >>Thanks for reading >>Lui > >Flipping other's music to create a "new" piece is not original. >I once heard of a student who thought he'd flip his professor's >doctoral composition so that he wouldn't have to do much work. >What came out was Beethoven's 9th! > >It can be fun for a while, flipping Christmas music is hysterical! > >Wouldn't you rather be creative on your own? > >Cheers, > >Rick Harrison > >_______________________________________________ >use-revolution mailing list >use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself with cool emoticons http://messenger.msn.co.uk From devin_asay at byu.edu Thu Mar 20 10:54:02 2003 From: devin_asay at byu.edu (Devin Asay) Date: Thu Mar 20 10:54:02 2003 Subject: trapping quit Message-ID: <51851313-5AEB-11D7-8B11-0030654E23A2@byu.edu> Okay, I've done some more experimenting, and it appears as though the shutdownRequest message IS getting sent when I invoke the quit message in my standalone app (Mac OS X). Apparently what had been happening was that an unrelated command in the shutdown sequence was failing, which in effect aborted the whole shutdownRequest handler. Now, being an old HyperCarder, I expect the standalone to complain loudly and cryptically that something failed. However, in Revolution, outside of the development environment there is no error reporting, so what happened instead was...nothing. After I went back into the development environment and tracked down a sneaky bug, then re-compiled everything started working as advertised. Now--and this is the origin of my bug--why is it I can't refer to a group in a stack script handler without specifying a card in connection with the group? Surely the stack knows about all of its groups. But if I try to refer to a group from the shutdownRequest handler, which is in the stack script, it works IF I happen to be on a card that has that group placed on it. However, if I am on a card that does not have that group placed on it when the handler is invoked, the reference to the group fails. Solution: always include a card in the group reference; i.e., show group "navBtns" of card "menu" instead of plain old show group "navBtns". Devin Asay Humanities Technology and Research Support Center Brigham Young University From wmb at internettrainer.com Thu Mar 20 11:03:00 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Thu Mar 20 11:03:00 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wednesday, Mar 19, 2003, at 21:20 Europe/Vienna, Scott Rossi wrote: > I will be the first to say I might be wrong but I expect that the folks > developing Rev/MC already have their hands full developing/supporting > the > current product, much less adding support for a new environment. And > I'm > not disagreeing with any of the sentiments expressed about how great it > would be to Flash available. I'm suggesting that maybe it would be > more > feasible for the developers to extend Rev/MC's current capabilities to > be > somewhat on par with Flash. Agree!!! But this > what would be the benefit of running Flash natively within > Rev? was your question ;)) I did not say thats "the" feature we need urgently... Later on it would be very, very nice. And nobody like me is waiting so long time for a ready tool a stable engine... So, thats what we need first...! regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From wmb at internettrainer.com Thu Mar 20 11:12:00 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Thu Mar 20 11:12:00 2003 Subject: Flash/QTdebug/ActiveX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <32874E77-5AEE-11D7-AE06-003065430226@internettrainer.com> On Wednesday, Mar 19, 2003, at 21:20 Europe/Vienna, Scott Rossi wrote: >> 1) running any swf files WITHOUT the need of Qucktime!!! > > OK, but then what will drive Flash? Even Flash requires an engine, so > you > will need something external to drive it, or add significant overhead > to the > Rev/MC engine to drive Flash. Seems a little excessive. > > >> 2) handling flash files WITHOUT a Flash projector!!! > > Again, *something* needs to play Flash, whether it's internal or > external. A Plug in? A external? The next engine? I dont know... I m not the programming expert. I only said what would be nice for a MM dev tool... regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From eudio at chabashira.co.jp Thu Mar 20 11:41:01 2003 From: eudio at chabashira.co.jp (UDI) Date: Thu Mar 20 11:41:01 2003 Subject: Extracting log? In-Reply-To: References: <20030320145350.11904@mail.chabashira.co.jp> Message-ID: <20030320163739.7346@mail.chabashira.co.jp> Thank you for a reply StuffIt Expander5.5 didn't act. (An error occurs) 7.x are necessary? Piero Menno wrote: >Hi, >try with stuffit expander, which is free and it is included in >stuffit standard at the url: > >http://www.stuffit.com/stuffit/lite/ > >Bye > > > >>I downloaded a archive of this list. >> http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2003-February.txt.gz >>But I can't extract from this file. >>Is there a person knowing a solution on MacOS9? UDI eudio at chabashira.co.jp http://member.nifty.ne.jp/UDI/ From menno at libero.it Thu Mar 20 11:59:02 2003 From: menno at libero.it (Piero Menno') Date: Thu Mar 20 11:59:02 2003 Subject: Extracting log? In-Reply-To: <20030320163739.7346@mail.chabashira.co.jp> References: <20030320145350.11904@mail.chabashira.co.jp> <20030320163739.7346@mail.chabashira.co.jp> Message-ID: Hi >Thank you for a reply >StuffIt Expander5.5 didn't act. (An error occurs) >7.x are necessary? Yes, but there are other utilities to extract a .gz file under MacOS 9, if you can't use Stuffit 7.x You can find them at www.versiontracker.com searching "gz" in the MacOS tab. (For example there is MacGzip...) Good luck Piero >Piero Menno wrote: >>Hi, >>try with stuffit expander, which is free and it is included in >>stuffit standard at the url: >> >>http://www.stuffit.com/stuffit/lite/ >> >>Bye >> >> >> >>>I downloaded a archive of this list. > >> http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2003-February.txt.gz >>>But I can't extract from this file. >>>Is there a person knowing a solution on MacOS9? > > >UDI >eudio at chabashira.co.jp >http://member.nifty.ne.jp/UDI/ >_______________________________________________ >use-revolution mailing list >use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From pixelbird at interisland.net Thu Mar 20 12:03:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Thu Mar 20 12:03:01 2003 Subject: trapping quit In-Reply-To: <200303201453.JAA24118@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 14:47:39 +0000 > From: Graham Samuel > Subject: Re: trapping quit > > I've been slightly out of circulation lately, but my scan thru all > the recent digests didn't come up with any reply to the following: > > On Mon, 17 Mar 2003 17:08:48 -0700, Devin Asay wrote: >> >> I'm not getting something. I want to trap the quit message and do some >> stuff before my program quits. I finally settled on trying the >> shutdownRequest message. When I handle it and pass it in the >> development environment, it works as expected: it does the stuff I want >> it to do then quits Revolution. But when I compile the stack as a >> standalone, the shutdownRequest message gets executed, but the quit >> never happens. I even tried adding an explicit quit call to the >> shutdownRequest handler. The resultant standalone still will not quit. ---------- Hi Graham, How about: send "quit" to Revolution ...just an idea. Ken N. From alrice at ARCplanning.com Thu Mar 20 12:28:03 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Thu Mar 20 12:28:03 2003 Subject: dll ignorance In-Reply-To: <7105941E-F991-11D6-9A91-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com> Message-ID: On Saturday, November 16, 2002, at 11:30 AM, Dar Scott wrote: > > Also, you can hope, as I do, that someone will pop up and say, "Oh! I > have a generic dll-glue stack!" BTW- there is such a beast for Python- a Python module that can load any .dll and any call functions in it. No special interface required in the .dll. The same thing could be done in Rev, I'm sure. Somehow. http://www.nightmare.com/software.html (see modules calldll and dynwin) Python and Rev have similar levels of dynamicity (is that a word?), so it might be possible to do a "port" of this calldll stuff into Rev. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From malte.brill at t-online.de Thu Mar 20 12:32:00 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Thu Mar 20 12:32:00 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303200002.TAA05446@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: I hope this post won?t appear twice. I seem to be having trouble with my email client... Thanks to all of you for replying. I really appreciate your help a lot. Even though I start thinking I?m not smart enough to code a solution on my own at the moment, you gave me many good thoughts to play around with. I guess I need to take some extra lessons in math before I play around with the expert stuff. :-) I have to put working on my codebase aside for a while, as I need to finish my current project urgently (deadline is next week and there is a lot of work left). Even though I doubt using polygons (or at last the area of them) is usefull for collision detection the way I imagined it, I learned a lot of this discussion. I?m still very interested in computing areas of polygons and their unions, so if someone happens to set up a stack showing some different approaches, I would love to see it. Again, thank you. You are great. :-) Malte From eudio at chabashira.co.jp Thu Mar 20 12:34:01 2003 From: eudio at chabashira.co.jp (UDI) Date: Thu Mar 20 12:34:01 2003 Subject: Extracting log? In-Reply-To: References: <20030320145350.11904@mail.chabashira.co.jp> <20030320163739.7346@mail.chabashira.co.jp> Message-ID: <20030320173037.9340@mail.chabashira.co.jp> StuffIt Expander 5.5 ->error ZipIt 1.3.1 ->error MacGzip 1.1.3 ->error Ummm, Isn't this file broken? http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2003-February.txt.gz UDI eudio at chabashira.co.jp http://member.nifty.ne.jp/UDI/ From benr_mc at cogapp.com Thu Mar 20 12:58:01 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Thu Mar 20 12:58:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 20/3/03 4:24 pm, Malte Brill wrote > Even though I start thinking I?m not smart enough to code a solution on my own > at the moment > ...snip... > I'm still very interested in computing areas of polygons and their unions I know this is no use for intersection testing, but for other possible - non time critical - requirements to calculate areas of polygons, Mr Crude Approach just can't help mentioning an alternative to the fascinating algorithms discussed, namely: let Scott do the hard work. That is, get Rev to draw the polygon (or polygons), solid colour, against a different solid colour background. Import a snapshot. Read the image data. Count pixels of the appropriate colour. Result: area of polygon or union of polygons. No maths training needed! (Except addition.) To calculate area of intersection, use two colours and an ink effect! There. I've said it. Now I feel dirty and ashamed and will crawl off and hide. Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From benr_mc at cogapp.com Thu Mar 20 12:58:26 2003 From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein) Date: Thu Mar 20 12:58:26 2003 Subject: How to ping? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dar, Thanks for your help. Open socket for telnet/close again; works just great. Typically takes "0" seconds. When the router crashes, it's reported as taken 148 seconds. Very simple, meets my needs just great. Cheers, Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 From dsc at swcp.com Thu Mar 20 13:28:00 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Thu Mar 20 13:28:00 2003 Subject: How to ping? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4BF21985-5B01-11D7-A0B0-000A9567A3E6@swcp.com> On Thursday, March 20, 2003, at 10:54 AM, Ben Rubinstein wrote: > Thanks for your help. Open socket for telnet/close again; works just > great. > Typically takes "0" seconds. When the router crashes, it's reported as > taken 148 seconds. Very simple, meets my needs just great. Cool! If you ever need to chop that 148 seconds down, ask again. Dar From zelston at aol.com Thu Mar 20 14:13:01 2003 From: zelston at aol.com (Zac Elston) Date: Thu Mar 20 14:13:01 2003 Subject: can revolution apps run without a gui? In-Reply-To: <200303201701.MAA30839@www.runrev.com> References: <200303201701.MAA30839@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <3E7A11C3.5020305@aol.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Thu Mar 20 17:07:01 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Thu Mar 20 17:07:01 2003 Subject: revdb_movenext Message-ID: <20030320220359.9287.qmail@web20416.mail.yahoo.com> I'm trying to use this function but Rev keeps giving me a "can't find handler" error and refers to this function. Here's my code: on mouseUp global dbID global cursorID if dbID <> empty then if cursorID <> empty then put revdb_closecursor(cursorID) into cursorID end if put revdb_query(dbID, field "query") into cursorID if cursorID is not an integer then answer "An error occurred: " & cursorID exit to top else answer revdb_columnbyname(cursorID, "idNum") && revdb_columnbyname(cursorID, "text") answer revdb_columnnames(cursorID) answer "Current record is " & revdb_currentrecord(cursorID) revdb_movenext(cursorID) answer revdb_columnbyname(cursorID, "idNum") && revdb_columnbyname(cursorID, "text") answer revdb_columnnames(cursorID) end if end if end mouseUp I'm simply clicking a button after entering a basic SELECT query into field "query". The query seems to execute just fine. I don't get the error until I try to move to the next record. There are two records in my database. I'm using Valentina. I'm simply doing a quick test to see if I can successfully navigate through a recordset that has been returned from a query. If anyone can help, please help me. :-) Chris Sheffield Read Naturally __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From diskot123 at juno.com Thu Mar 20 17:58:00 2003 From: diskot123 at juno.com (Tuviah M Snyder) Date: Thu Mar 20 17:58:00 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1225 - 15 msgs Message-ID: <20030320.175356.1056.5.diskot123@juno.com> >I think my original email on this may have come through with some >unintended formatting which obscured my basic question: Does Rev use >a secure protocol to transmit data to and from a mySQL server, or do >I need to make special security arrangements through other means such >as a VPN? Will be supported in 2.0. MySQL supports SSL, I'll simply modify revdb_connect to support that, and compression. Tuviah Snyder Runtime Revolution Limited - Software at the Speed of Thought From monte at sweattechnologies.com Thu Mar 20 18:11:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Thu Mar 20 18:11:01 2003 Subject: Use of Revolution ... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Bernard Depending on the amount of data you may want to look at a db back end. The 3D graphics is the only curly one. Do you mean real 3D or just charts with a 3D look? Monte > > Greetings > > I am evaluating differents tools in order to develop a financial > application (I also looked at RealBasic, Omnis Studio, 4D) : > > Some requirements / caracteristics : > - stand alone application, not Internet based > - lot of data and calculation on that data > - many different kinds of reports > - 2D/3D graphics > > I like the Revolution concept and features, but I am not sure > it will allow me to fulfill the above requirements. > > Also needed is cross-plateform, "double-clickable application" > simplicity, ease of use and productivity of the IDE, GUI builder: > here I know that Revolution will fit. > > I would appreciate any comments, opinions from the existing > community. > > Thanks in advance > > Bernard Sauterel > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Thu Mar 20 18:52:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Thu Mar 20 18:52:01 2003 Subject: Extracting log? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <56BD28CE-5B2D-11D7-928D-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> It certainly behaves as if the file is corrupt in some way. BTW: Rev has built-in gz compression and expansion capabilities. If you check my website at http://www.troz.net/Rev/ you can download a Rev stack that does both these. Next week there will be a new version for Rev 2 that allows drag & drop :-) Cheers, Sarah On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 03:38 am, UDI wrote: > StuffIt Expander 5.5 ->error > ZipIt 1.3.1 ->error > MacGzip 1.1.3 ->error > > Ummm, Isn't this file broken? > http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2003-February.txt.gz > > > > UDI > eudio at chabashira.co.jp > http://member.nifty.ne.jp/UDI/ > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Thu Mar 20 18:52:27 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Thu Mar 20 18:52:27 2003 Subject: revdb_movenext In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <6B098105-5B2E-11D7-928D-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Chris, I think your problem is that revdb_movenext is a function and when you call a function from within a script, you have to tell it what to do with the result, you can't just have it all on it's own in a line with no other action. I have used something like this: put revdb_movenext(cursorID) into moveOK if moveOK <> true then beep -- error You can also use "get" which puts the result into "it", which can be checked or not, depending on your needs. get revdb_movenext(cursorID) Cheers, Sarah sarahr at genesearch.com.au http://www.troz.net/Rev/ On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 08:07 am, Chris Sheffield wrote: > I'm trying to use this function but Rev keeps giving > me a "can't find handler" error and refers to this > function. Here's my code: > > on mouseUp > global dbID > global cursorID > > if dbID <> empty then > if cursorID <> empty then > put revdb_closecursor(cursorID) into cursorID > end if > > put revdb_query(dbID, field "query") into cursorID > if cursorID is not an integer then > answer "An error occurred: " & cursorID > exit to top > else > answer revdb_columnbyname(cursorID, "idNum") && > revdb_columnbyname(cursorID, "text") > answer revdb_columnnames(cursorID) > answer "Current record is " & > revdb_currentrecord(cursorID) > revdb_movenext(cursorID) > answer revdb_columnbyname(cursorID, "idNum") && > revdb_columnbyname(cursorID, "text") > answer revdb_columnnames(cursorID) > > end if > > end if > > end mouseUp > > I'm simply clicking a button after entering a basic > SELECT query into field "query". The query seems to > execute just fine. I don't get the error until I try > to move to the next record. There are two records in > my database. I'm using Valentina. I'm simply doing a > quick test to see if I can successfully navigate > through a recordset that has been returned from a > query. > > If anyone can help, please help me. :-) > > Chris Sheffield > Read Naturally > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! > http://platinum.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From pixelbird at interisland.net Thu Mar 20 18:56:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Thu Mar 20 18:56:01 2003 Subject: Fiddling in the Frustrating, Finnicky, Full Filepat Fog In-Reply-To: <200303201453.JAA24118@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: OK, so the button handler in my test stack works most of the time (yesterday, the darned thing opened another stack folder which I'd been in before, not the designated folder): on mouseUp set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Desktop/Doggies/" answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 end mouseUp ,,,but then I decided to try the same sequence without the answer list in a stack script in the stack I'm actually developing. It FAILS, i.e., does nothing (no error, nothing) and the image I called never shows up (watch linewraps): on openStack set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Desktop/MyRev_Stacks/Keyboard_Images/" put URL ("binfile:/KybdUp2.JPG/") into img 1 of grp 1 end openStack ...I can't see wghat th edifferenc might be. I've tried a number of combinations for th efilepath, but nothing works. Foghorn anyone? Help please... Ken N. From monte at sweattechnologies.com Thu Mar 20 19:09:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Thu Mar 20 19:09:01 2003 Subject: Fiddling in the Frustrating, Finnicky, Full Filepat Fog In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Try: on openStack set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Desktop/MyRev_Stacks/Keyboard_Images/" put URL ("binfile:KybdUp2.JPG") into img 1 of grp 1 end openStack Monte From malte.brill at t-online.de Thu Mar 20 19:43:01 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Thu Mar 20 19:43:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303200002.TAA05446@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Thanks to all of you for replying. I really appreciate your help a lot. Even though I start thinking I?m not smart enough to code a solution on my own at the moment, you gave me many good thoughts to play around with. I guess I need to take some extra lessons in math before I play around with the expert stuff. :-) I have to put working on my codebase aside for a while, as I need to finish my current project urgently (deadline is next week and there is a lot of work left). Even though I doubt using polygons (or at last the area of them) is usefull for collision detection the way I imagined it, I learned a lot of this discussion. I?m still very interested in computing areas of polygons and their unions, so if someone happens to set up a stack showing some different approaches, I would love to see it. Again, thank you. You are great. :-) Malte From pixelbird at interisland.net Thu Mar 20 19:58:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Thu Mar 20 19:58:01 2003 Subject: Fiddling in the Frustrating, Finnicky, Full Filepath Fog In-Reply-To: <200303201453.JAA24118@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: For the life of me, I can't understand. Why does this work (albeit you have to choose the image file): on openStack set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Desktop/MyRev_Stacks/Keyboard_Images/" answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 end openStack ...the image shows in the background group up as soon as you choose it. ...but this does not work: on openStack set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh HD/Desktop/MyRev_Stacks/Keyboard_Images/" put URL "binfile:/KybdUp2.JPG/" into img 1 of grp 1 end openStack ...the watch shows for a split second, then reverts to the browse hand, but nothing else happens. No image, nothing. Designating the full filepath: put URL "binfile:/Macintosh HD/Desktop/MyRev_Stacks/Keyboard_Images/KybdUp2.JPG/" into img 1 of grp 1 ...fails as well. Why? This is baffling :+/ Ken N. From scott at tactilemedia.com Thu Mar 20 20:06:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Thu Mar 20 20:06:01 2003 Subject: Fiddling in the Frustrating, Finnicky, Full Filepath Fog In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Recently, "Ken Norris" wrote: > For the life of me, I can't understand. Why does this work (albeit you have > to choose the image file): Probably because in all the problem cases you cite, you refer to the filename like this: "KybdUp2.JPG/". You can't have a trailing backslash at the end of the filename. This makes Rev think you're referencing a folder. Try removing the last backslash and see what happens. Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design ----- E: scott at tactilemedia.com W: http://www.tactilemedia.com From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Thu Mar 20 20:14:00 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Thu Mar 20 20:14:00 2003 Subject: Fiddling in the Frustrating, Finnicky, Full Filepath Fog In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ken, When you end the file path with a / you are indicating that you are specifying a folder. In the script that works, check the value of "it" after the answer file. I reckon you will find that it does not end with a slash. One further thing to look out for: as has already been pointed out, Rev 1.1.1 and Rev 2.0 deal with file paths in a different way (at least they do on OS X, I don;t know about the other platforms). In Rev 2, you don't need to specify the name of the HD, so put URL "binfile:/Desktop/MyRev_Stacks/Keyboard_Images/KybdUp2.JPG" into img 1 of grp 1 is the only option that would work. Again, this will be demonstrated if you have a look at what answer file is producing. Cheers, Sarah sarahr at genesearch.com.au http://www.troz.net/Rev/ On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 10:57 am, Ken Norris wrote: > For the life of me, I can't understand. Why does this work (albeit you > have > to choose the image file): > > on openStack > set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh > HD/Desktop/MyRev_Stacks/Keyboard_Images/" > answer file empty with filter "JPEGs,*.jpg" > put url ("binfile:" & it) into img 1 of grp 1 > end openStack > > ...the image shows in the background group up as soon as you choose it. > > ...but this does not work: > > on openStack > set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh > HD/Desktop/MyRev_Stacks/Keyboard_Images/" > put URL "binfile:/KybdUp2.JPG/" into img 1 of grp 1 > end openStack > > ...the watch shows for a split second, then reverts to the browse > hand, but > nothing else happens. No image, nothing. > > Designating the full filepath: > > put URL "binfile:/Macintosh > HD/Desktop/MyRev_Stacks/Keyboard_Images/KybdUp2.JPG/" into img 1 of > grp 1 > > ...fails as well. > > Why? This is baffling :+/ > > Ken N. > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > From jhurley at infostations.com Thu Mar 20 21:02:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Thu Mar 20 21:02:01 2003 Subject: Math question: Collision detection of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303210059.TAA10640@www.runrev.com> References: <200303210059.TAA10640@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > >Malte Brill wrote: > >Thanks to all of you for replying. >I really appreciate your help a lot. Even though I start thinking I?m not >smart enough to code a solution on my own at the moment, you gave me many >good thoughts to play around with. I guess I need to take some extra lessons >in math before I play around with the expert stuff. :-) > >I have to put working on my codebase aside for a while, as I need to finish >my current project urgently (deadline is next week and there is a lot of >work left). > >Even though I doubt using polygons (or at last the area of them) is usefull >for collision detection the way I imagined it, I learned a lot of this >discussion. I?m still very interested in computing areas of polygons and >their unions, so if someone happens to set up a stack showing some different >approaches, I would love to see it. > >Again, > >thank you. You are great. :-) > >Malte Malte, As so happens, I got caught up in the challenge of this problem, a experience which is obviously true for many on this list. I have developed a "concept" stack to test collision detection of arbitrarily shaped polygons. I chose triangle to start with, but the extension to general polygons is straightforward. The stack is called "Colliding polygons.rev" and can be found at: http://home.infostations.net/jhurley/ On the card there are two triangles, a Projectile triangle and a Target triangle. You may drag the "Projectile" triangle about the screen. When any portion of the Projectile triangle touches any point on the Target triangle you get a beep to acknowledge the contact. As a second test, there is a button with allows one to fire the Projectile triangle at the Target triangle. When they touch at any point, the projectile bounces off the target. (There are some interesting situations which arise when the bounce causes a second or third line intersection.) The algorithm consists of finding the intersection of all line segments. The intersection point for each line segment pair are tested to see if they lie within the endpoints of the segments. If so, there is contact. (No effort was made to speed things up with a test for nearness.) (I think it would be much more complex to try to find the onset of a union between the two polygons, and much more computer time. But I am just guessing.) Having done this I confess I think it impractical for games. Although it does run rather smoothly for these two triangle. Thanks, Malte, for introducing us to this interesting challenge. Jim From jiml at netrin.com Thu Mar 20 21:05:00 2003 From: jiml at netrin.com (Jim Lambert) Date: Thu Mar 20 21:05:00 2003 Subject: dll ignorance In-Reply-To: <200303210059.TAA10640@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Like Python, Director has a glueDLL XTRA too. It would be handy to have such a mechanism for Rev. On the other hand, it does go against the grain of cross-platform portability. There's always that tension, isn't there, between native capabilities and external platform-specific solutions? Jim Lambert From pixelbird at interisland.net Thu Mar 20 21:08:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Thu Mar 20 21:08:00 2003 Subject: Fiddling in the Frustrating, Finnicky, Full Filepath Fog In-Reply-To: <200303210059.TAA10562@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: "Monte Goulding" > Subject: RE: Fiddling in the Frustrating, Finnicky, Full Filepath Fog > Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 10:35:43 +1030 > > > Try: > > on openStack > set the defaultFolder to "/Macintosh > HD/Desktop/MyRev_Stacks/Keyboard_Images/" > put URL ("binfile:KybdUp2.JPG") into img 1 of grp 1 > end openStack ---------- Nice try , Monte, but... I copied and pasted it. Nothin', nada, zilch. Ken N. From kray at sonsothunder.com Thu Mar 20 21:53:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Thu Mar 20 21:53:01 2003 Subject: How to ping? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <007c01c2ef54$73c11440$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Ben, Could you post the code that you used so everyone can see what you did? Thanks, Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > Ben Rubinstein > Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2003 11:54 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: How to ping? > > > Dar, > > Thanks for your help. Open socket for telnet/close again; > works just great. Typically takes "0" seconds. When the > router crashes, it's reported as taken 148 seconds. Very > simple, meets my needs just great. > > Cheers, > > Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com > Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 > http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From kray at sonsothunder.com Thu Mar 20 21:54:00 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Thu Mar 20 21:54:00 2003 Subject: can revolution apps run without a gui? In-Reply-To: <3E7A11C3.5020305@aol.com> Message-ID: <007d01c2ef54$95ea5950$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Absolutely. In fact one of Rev's implementations is as a CGI app you'd put on a web server. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ -----Original Message----- From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Zac Elston Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2003 1:09 PM To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com Subject: can revolution apps run without a gui? I'm interested in using revolution to process some system logs in a unix enviroment. While I can write the application to do what I want, on systems that don't have X or a display defined the application fails. can this check be turned off? thanks -zac _______________________________________________ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution at lists.runrev.com http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From monte at sweattechnologies.com Thu Mar 20 22:03:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Thu Mar 20 22:03:01 2003 Subject: Externals & CGI Message-ID: Hi I'm wondering if the 2.0 externals will work for CGI as well???? I'm particularly interested in the XML & MySQL externals. Cheers Monte Goulding B.App.Sc. (Hons.) Executive Director Sweat Technologies email: monte at sweattechnologies.com website: www.sweattechnologies.com mobile (International): +61 421 138 274 (Australia): 0421 138 274 From eudio at chabashira.co.jp Fri Mar 21 00:13:00 2003 From: eudio at chabashira.co.jp (UDI) Date: Fri Mar 21 00:13:00 2003 Subject: Extracting log? In-Reply-To: <56BD28CE-5B2D-11D7-928D-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> References: <56BD28CE-5B2D-11D7-928D-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Message-ID: <20030321051011.7419@mail.chabashira.co.jp> Thanks reply, and nice stacks! But I'm not successful yet. It got an error... Perhaps I think that a file is broken. Did you succeed in extracting somebody? Sarah wrote? >It certainly behaves as if the file is corrupt in some way. > >BTW: Rev has built-in gz compression and expansion capabilities. If you >check my website at http://www.troz.net/Rev/ you can download a Rev >stack that does both these. Next week there will be a new version for >Rev 2 that allows drag & drop :-) > >Cheers, >Sarah > >On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 03:38 am, UDI wrote: > >> StuffIt Expander 5.5 ->error >> ZipIt 1.3.1 ->error >> MacGzip 1.1.3 ->error >> >> Ummm, Isn't this file broken? >> http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2003-February.txt.gz UDI eudio at chabashira.co.jp http://member.nifty.ne.jp/UDI/ From alrice at ARCplanning.com Fri Mar 21 00:37:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Fri Mar 21 00:37:01 2003 Subject: dll ignorance In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thursday, March 20, 2003, at 06:54 PM, Jim Lambert wrote: > > > Like Python, Director has a glueDLL XTRA too. It would be handy to > have such > a mechanism for Rev. On the other hand, it does go against the grain of > cross-platform portability. There's always that tension, isn't there, > between native capabilities and external platform-specific solutions? Yep I guess it's a choice between idealism and getting the job done :-) It wouldn't make Revolution any *less* cross platform. It would open up new possibilities. I like Revolution's pragmatism for the stuff it embraces or will embrace like - print dialogs, ODBC, Aqua sheets, Quicktime, Win32 registry, formatForPrinting - which are all platform specific to some degree. In my case - deliverable is Win32 only - a .dll exists, for the CLIPS expert system - but I'm running shell() commands to get the functionality that's in the .dll - my app would be faster and better if I could just use the .dll It's not a showstopper, just a "wouldn't that be nice" kind thing. I am looking at the source for the Python calldll module. It's not a lot of code, but it's replete with pointer voodoo and assembly code. blech! My C skills are not that good. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Fri Mar 21 01:22:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Fri Mar 21 01:22:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030321061851.39062.qmail@web20002.mail.yahoo.com> --- Luigi Di Martino wrote: > Take a chance > And dance with me > Turn around > And set us free > Wear a smile > Light the sky > Move to Love > Will never die > > Just checked out your website and I see what > you mean. You didn't mention > Hank! Dancing is something I have always > enjoyed, and I wish you the best > with your ideas, which I like the sound of. thanks, Lui. i didn't know they listened to Old Hank in Italia, but am glad to hear it. my Rev dance app. uses images (formerly) buttons to of dancers moving around the screen. rotating the image of a dancer (in a 32 x 32 area) distorted the image, so i just pixeled out quasi-clones facing in 8 directions. i am using separate cards for each iteration, if that is the correct expression, so that directional arrows can be drawn on each card. at the moment all of the "guys" and "dolls" are Mexican Folklorico dancers. there is a group of kids i am videoing extensively and would like to try out the concept of stepping through Rev code to teach them math. an example: my start point for a dancer is 100,100 the destination is 180,140. i can choose to delineate 8 increments (to go with music) so the images will move in increments of -(80/10) on the x axis and -(40/8) on the y axis. right away you have introduced Cartesian coordinates and shown how computers count down the screen. the teaching pros could use this tool in any number of ways. whatever quizes, games, and teaching strategies they like. same thing with the music. everything is number based, and all of the calculations can be stepped through and shown to be very simple if taken one step at a time. a way to combine composition. math and logic. thanks for letting me bend your ear, Erik ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Fri Mar 21 02:45:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Fri Mar 21 02:45:01 2003 Subject: Fiddling in the Frustrating, Finnicky, Full Filepath Fog In-Reply-To: <200303210059.TAA10562@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Got it. Thanks to everyone, Monte, Robert, et al. What I found out was that you can call all folders by name EXCEPT the desktop which MUST be called "Desktop Folder" (note the word "Folder") and nothing else. Ken N. From tiffirgrReverse at ctc.net Fri Mar 21 04:07:02 2003 From: tiffirgrReverse at ctc.net (Raymond E. Griffith) Date: Fri Mar 21 04:07:02 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 3/20/03 12:54 PM, Ben Rubinstein at benr_mc at cogapp.com wrote: > on 20/3/03 4:24 pm, Malte Brill wrote > >> Even though I start thinking I?m not smart enough to code a solution on my >> own >> at the moment >> ...snip... >> I'm still very interested in computing areas of polygons and their unions > > I know this is no use for intersection testing, but for other possible - non > time critical - requirements to calculate areas of polygons, Mr Crude > Approach just can't help mentioning an alternative to the fascinating > algorithms discussed, namely: let Scott do the hard work. > > That is, get Rev to draw the polygon (or polygons), solid colour, against a > different solid colour background. Import a snapshot. Read the image data. > Count pixels of the appropriate colour. Result: area of polygon or union of > polygons. No maths training needed! (Except addition.) To calculate area > of intersection, use two colours and an ink effect! > > There. I've said it. Now I feel dirty and ashamed and will crawl off and > hide. > > Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com > Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 > http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 > Here is a little routine I have written that will accurately calculate the area of irregular polygons so long as there are no crossed lines. You can have irregular shapes as funky as you like and this will work -- provided there are no lines which cross. The math behind this is fascinating. Area returned is in pixels. If you wish to use units as square cm, square inches, etc. it can be appropriately adjusted. function IrPolyArea i put the points of graphic i into k put 0,0 into n repeat for each line i in k add item 1 of i*item 2 of n-item 2 of i *item 1 of n to tsum put i into n end repeat return abs(tsum/2) end IrPolyArea Raymond E. Griffith From bernard at hubrisys.com Fri Mar 21 04:37:01 2003 From: bernard at hubrisys.com (Bernard Sauterel) Date: Fri Mar 21 04:37:01 2003 Subject: Use of Revolution ... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1EA2D47E-5B80-11D7-BF5E-003065C5ACDE@hubrisys.com> Hi Monte > Depending on the amount of data you may want to look at a db back end. > The > 3D graphics is the only curly one. Do you mean real 3D or just charts > with a > 3D look? Charts with 3D look ... I am looking for pre-existing 2D/3D charts components but I didn't see some for Revolution. About a backend, how straight is it to bind it to lists or fields per example ? Only programmatically ? > Monte >> >> Greetings >> >> I am evaluating differents tools in order to develop a financial >> application (I also looked at RealBasic, Omnis Studio, 4D) : >> >> Some requirements / caracteristics : >> - stand alone application, not Internet based >> - lot of data and calculation on that data >> - many different kinds of reports >> - 2D/3D graphics >> >> I like the Revolution concept and features, but I am not sure >> it will allow me to fulfill the above requirements. >> >> Also needed is cross-plateform, "double-clickable application" >> simplicity, ease of use and productivity of the IDE, GUI builder: >> here I know that Revolution will fit. >> >> I would appreciate any comments, opinions from the existing >> community. >> >> Thanks in advance >> >> Bernard Sauterel >> >> _______________________________________________ >> use-revolution mailing list >> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution >> > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From kevin at runrev.com Fri Mar 21 06:30:01 2003 From: kevin at runrev.com (Kevin Miller) Date: Fri Mar 21 06:30:01 2003 Subject: Externals & CGI In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 21/3/03 2:59 am, Monte Goulding wrote: > I'm wondering if the 2.0 externals will work for CGI as well???? I'm > particularly interested in the XML & MySQL externals. Our own external libraries will work in the 2.0 CGI specific engine. So you will be able to do databases and XML. Kevin Kevin Miller Runtime Revolution Limited: Software at the Speed of Thought Tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165. Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707. From heather at runrev.com Fri Mar 21 07:06:01 2003 From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams) Date: Fri Mar 21 07:06:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons Message-ID: One more solution for you all to consider. Tomas had some posting troubles so he asked me to post this for him. > From: Tomas Nally, P.E. on behalf of Tomas Nally, P.E. > Sent: Tue 3/18/2003 9:10 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Cc: > Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons > >> Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:06:57 +0100 >> Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons >> From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) >> >> Hi List, >> >> this one goes out to the math experts. >> How does one compute the area ( I hope it is the correct Term for >> flaecheninhalt in german) of a polygon with n sides. > > Not a math "expert" here, but finding the areas of irregular polygons > was the one of the first things that I did with my very own computer > (a Commodore-64) when I bought it in 1985. (Actually, I wasn't finding > the area of polygons, per se. I was performing numerical integration > to see how close the result would be to the answer when traditional > calculus is used. But that operation is almost identical to finding > the area of a polygon.) > > I'm not too much of a Transcripter, so let me give a BASIC version, > from which a transcript version could be generated. > > -- First, make sure that the x- and y-coordinates of the polygon > -- are stored in an array. Also, the array members should identify > -- the points of the polygon as you trace the polygon CLOCKWISE > -- around it's perimeter. In BASIC, this is how arrays are > -- dimensioned. > > dim x(100) > dim y(100) > > -- Additionally, each differential element of the polygon will have > -- its own differential area, so we need an array for that also. > > dim trapArea(100) > > -- Identify the number of nodes of the polygon. (Or, you might > -- just as well call them "vertices", or "points".) > > n = 20 -- Just an example, here. > > -- Now, going clockwise around the perimeter of the polygon, > -- find the area of the virtual trapezoid under each line segment. > -- A line segment is defined as the segment connecting > -- the ith node and the (i + 1)th node. Do this inside a > -- counted loop. In BASIC, a convenient loop for this is > -- the For...Next loop. > > for i = 1 to (n - 1) -- note that I'm stopping at (n - 1) > x1 = x(i) > y1 = y(i) > x2 = x(i + 1) > y2 = y(i + 1) > trapArea(i) = y1 * (x2 - x1) + (1/2) * (x2 - x1) * (y2 - y1) > next i > > -- This doesn't quite "close the loop" around the perimeter > -- of the polygon. In order to close the loop, we need to > -- find the area under the line segment between the nth > -- node and the very first node. > > x1 = x(n) > y1 = y(n) > x2 = x(1) > y2 = y(1) > trapArea(n) = y1 * (x2 - x1) + (1/2) * (x2 - x1) * (y2 - y1) > > -- Now, we have to add up all the areas of the elements > > TotalArea = 0 > for i = 1 to n > TotalArea = TotalArea + trapArea(i) > next i > > -- When I've discussed this elsewhere, there's usually > -- some skepticism about whether it works. The reason > -- it works is because when the (i + 1)th node is on the > -- right-hand side of the ith node, then trapArea(i) has > -- a positive value. However, as you traverse around > -- the perimeter of the polygon, when the (i + 1)th node > -- is on the left-hand side of the ith node, then the > -- value of trapArea(i) is negative. When you add all > -- of these positive and negative areas, then the result > -- is the area on the interior of the polygon. -- Heather Williams Runtime Revolution Ltd. Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought From malte.brill at t-online.de Fri Mar 21 07:19:01 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Fri Mar 21 07:19:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: <200303180100.UAA13916@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Erik wrote: >in the future i hope to use Rev on websites to >send video to dancers who can study at home, >maximizing expensive rehearsal time. as well as >for the fun of it. there are 30 half hour >episodes of Street Dancers Alternative To >Violence, my community tv show. >that will have to await developments, but the >idea that students might be motivated to >step-read code by programs that do things that >excite them, is my guiding light. @ Erik. I wish you all the best with your project. I was teaching computer-courses in youth centers back in the 80. It is allways a joy to see youth that have aggressions due to their social background getting a perspective. I think it is very important to give youth a place to be, something to do they enjoy and to try creating new fields of interest with them. :-) The technical aspect of what you are trying to do wakes my interest, too. How do you want to deliver your media? As a download or streamed? I have been trying to display media (.mpg video) from the Web in a Stack. Has anyone succeded streaming video directly into rev, without the need of downloading the whole File? In my teststack the player refused playing the video/audio until the file was completely in cache. @Lui: Coding can be lots of fun don?t get frustrated if you get stuck sometimes ( I guess all of us do/did sometimes) If you want to learn more about Rev, the Revolution Newbies board: http://www.mailping.net/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi is also great resource. You might want to take a look at the usercontributions section of runrev, too. Regards, Malte From mirrorman54 at hotmail.com Fri Mar 21 07:31:01 2003 From: mirrorman54 at hotmail.com (Luigi Di Martino) Date: Fri Mar 21 07:31:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available Message-ID: Hi Erik Yes I think I get what it is you are up to now. I love it! It is definately a positive direction to take because it makes what can seem very daunting as a cool bit of fun. Life is for having fun right?!!! A dance orientated program for teaching maths and computor programming would help in obvious ways I can imagine. Beginners need to get excited. Wish I could offer some coding jargon to make my participation here more valid, but I certainly offer you my best wishes at bringing this excellent idea to fruition. I'll hang around and hope to pick up some good tips now and again. I live in Cambridge, England btw...came over here at the age of five, from Naples! Lui >From: erik hansen >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >Subject: Re: Scripted musical notation available >Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 22:18:51 -0800 (PST) > >--- Luigi Di Martino >wrote: > > Take a chance > > And dance with me > > Turn around > > And set us free > > Wear a smile > > Light the sky > > Move to Love > > Will never die > > > > Just checked out your website and I see what > > you mean. You didn't mention > > Hank! Dancing is something I have always > > enjoyed, and I wish you the best > > with your ideas, which I like the sound of. > >thanks, Lui. i didn't know they listened to Old >Hank in Italia, but am glad to hear it. > >my Rev dance app. uses images (formerly) buttons >to of dancers moving around the screen. rotating >the image of a dancer (in a 32 x 32 area) >distorted the image, so i just pixeled out >quasi-clones facing in 8 directions. i am using >separate cards for each iteration, if that is the >correct expression, so that directional arrows >can be drawn on each card. > >at the moment all of the "guys" and "dolls" are >Mexican Folklorico dancers. there is a group of >kids i am videoing extensively and would like to >try out the concept of stepping through Rev code >to teach them math. > >an example: my start point for a dancer is >100,100 the destination is 180,140. i can choose >to delineate 8 increments (to go with music) so >the images will move in increments of -(80/10) on >the x axis and -(40/8) on the y axis. right away >you have introduced Cartesian coordinates and >shown how computers count down the screen. > >the teaching pros could use this tool in any >number of ways. whatever quizes, games, and >teaching strategies they like. > >same thing with the music. everything is number >based, and all of the calculations can be stepped >through and shown to be very simple if taken one >step at a time. a way to combine composition. >math and logic. > >thanks for letting me bend your ear, Erik > >===== >erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org > >__________________________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! >http://platinum.yahoo.com >_______________________________________________ >use-revolution mailing list >use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution _________________________________________________________________ Use MSN Messenger to send music and pics to your friends http://messenger.msn.co.uk From malte.brill at t-online.de Fri Mar 21 07:36:01 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Fri Mar 21 07:36:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303180100.UAA13916@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Thanks a lot again. :-) Jim, your solutions is more than close to what I am lokking for. (I just would need variable numbers of sides and bob is my uncle. I?m really happy, so I don?t know if I can get this silly grin from my face today. ;-) ) I had to put a comment mark on the two scripst, where you call a handler called ct (does it require TG to be present?) The point is, that in the game logic I am thinking of there will never be more than 2 objects colliding. So if I check with the intersect function first this will defenitly be fast enough to run smoothly. Raymond, your code is pretty usefull to. It?s possible that I have to measure areas (create poly above jpeg in runtime, get area of that poly). So this is pretty useful. And thanks totsomas. I?m glad I have a basic understanding of BASIC-Languages, so I will try fiddling around with your code, if you don?t mind. Have a nice Weekend! Regards, Malte From malte.brill at t-online.de Fri Mar 21 07:49:00 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Fri Mar 21 07:49:00 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303180100.UAA13916@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Please excuse my terrible spelling in my last post. Seems as if I left my brain at home today... Thanks a lot again. :-) Jim, your solution is more than close to what I am looking for. (I just would need variable numbers of sides and bob is my uncle. I?m really happy, so I don?t know if I can get this silly grin from my face today. ;-) ) I had to put a comment mark on the two scripts, where you call a handler called ct (does it require TG to be present?) The point is, that in the game logic I am thinking of there will never be more than 2 objects colliding. So if I check with the intersect function first this will defenitly be fast enough to run smoothly. Raymond, your code is pretty usefull to. It?s possible that I have to measure areas (create poly above jpeg in runtime, get area of that poly). So this is pretty useful. And thanks to Tomas. I?m glad I have a basic understanding of BASIC-Languages, so I will try fiddling around with your code, if you don?t mind. Have a nice Weekend! Regards, Malte From richmond at mail.maclaunch.com Fri Mar 21 09:17:01 2003 From: richmond at mail.maclaunch.com (Mathewson) Date: Fri Mar 21 09:17:01 2003 Subject: T-shirts and the Americans Message-ID: Some of us are Scots (RunRev, is, after all, a Scottish thing!) and wonder why we have to order T-shirts from 'over there' - can we not order them from somewhere over here in Pounds Sterling, or, heaven forfend, Euros ? Richmond Mathewson --------------------------------------------------------------- Great Macintosh Products The MacLaunch Store! http://www.maclaunch.com/cgi-launch/store/agora.cgi --------------------------------------------------------------- From jhurley at infostations.com Fri Mar 21 09:25:00 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Fri Mar 21 09:25:00 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303210909.EAA18650@www.runrev.com> References: <200303210909.EAA18650@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > > > Ben Rubinstein | Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com >> Cognitive Applications Ltd | Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600 >> http://www.cogapp.com | Fax : +44 (0)1273-728866 >> > >Here is a little routine I have written that will accurately calculate the >area of irregular polygons so long as there are no crossed lines. You can >have irregular shapes as funky as you like and this will work -- provided >there are no lines which cross. > >The math behind this is fascinating. > >Area returned is in pixels. If you wish to use units as square cm, square >inches, etc. it can be appropriately adjusted. > >function IrPolyArea i > put the points of graphic i into k > put 0,0 into n > repeat for each line i in k > add item 1 of i*item 2 of n-item 2 of i *item 1 of n to tsum > put i into n > end repeat > return abs(tsum/2) >end IrPolyArea > >Raymond E. Griffith > Ray, This is really slick. I had to change the notation as follows before I could decipher your clever algorithm: on function IrPolyArea i put the points of graphic i into tPoints put 0,0 into tPreviousLine repeat for each line tLine in tPoints add item 1 of tLine *item 2 of tPreviousLine - item 2 of tLine *item 1 of tPreviousLine to tsum put tLine into tPreviousLine end repeat return abs(tsum/2) end IrPolyArea Jim From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Fri Mar 21 09:58:05 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Fri Mar 21 09:58:05 2003 Subject: revdb_movenext In-Reply-To: <6B098105-5B2E-11D7-928D-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Message-ID: <20030321145446.76843.qmail@web20422.mail.yahoo.com> That did it. Thanks! I actually though of trying that, but the example in the documentation didn't specify that. I guess I should have known since it's a function. Thanks again, Chris Sheffield Read Naturally --- Sarah wrote: > Chris, > > I think your problem is that revdb_movenext is a > function and when you > call a function from within a script, you have to > tell it what to do > with the result, you can't just have it all on it's > own in a line with > no other action. > > I have used something like this: > put revdb_movenext(cursorID) into moveOK > if moveOK <> true then beep -- error > > You can also use "get" which puts the result into > "it", which can be > checked or not, depending on your needs. > get revdb_movenext(cursorID) > > Cheers, > Sarah > sarahr at genesearch.com.au > http://www.troz.net/Rev/ > > > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From rpresender at earthlink.net Fri Mar 21 10:12:01 2003 From: rpresender at earthlink.net (Robert Presender) Date: Fri Mar 21 10:12:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1E051AAA-5BAF-11D7-B2ED-000393A19046@earthlink.net> Hi Malte, I did a Google search for 'polygon'. This a complicated subject especially when not regular. The following URL's are just a few of what is available showing the complexity. http://www.cs.unc.edu/~dm/CODE/GEM/chapter.html#Haines94 http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/aig/staff/alan/software/ http://www.mathcats.com/explore/polygons.html http://www.polygon-weapons.de/ Suggest a survey of the available Google pages (at lease 12) for those items referencing math polygons. This may help you decide what approach you want to take. On Thursday, March 20, 2003, at 07:46 AM, Malte Brill wrote: > Hi Bob, > >> Yes, these formulae assumes that all sides are of the same length. If >> not, a different approach is needed. Just noted that today's list >> message 1218 topic 8 from Gernot Lorenz shows a different approach. > > It seems working this is all a lot harder as I thought it would be. >>>> The area of a circumscribed polygon = n(r squared)tan(pi/n) where >>>> pi = >>>> 3.14 and >>>> r = the radius of the circumscribed circle = (l/2)cosec(180/n) >> >> Error in above area formula. Should be: n(r squared)tan(180/n) > Thanks for correcting this. :-) >>> This I don?t understand. Does it assume a circle around the polygon? >>> If so >>> how could one calculate that circle? >> >> Yes it assumes a circle around outside of the polygon(of n sides of >> equal length). >> The radius of the circle is given above: r = (1/2)cosec(180/n) >> The area of the circle = 3.14(r squared) >> >> I can also send you formulae for an inscribed circle (inside of the >> polygon). > That would be nice. Even though I haven?t the time to play around with > polys > until my current project is finished I would love to try it afterwards. >>>> Sorry the above is not in strictly math format.. Hope this helps. >>>> Regards ... Bob > >> If answers to your problem is not sufficient, I would be willing to >> try >> to solve it if you can send me a sketch of the polygon(s). >> >> Regards ... Bob >> > Thanks for that offer. I really appreciate it. :-) > To be honest. I did not understand all of the discussion on the list. > So > actually I haven?t got too far. I guess I need rereading all of the > post > quite a few times before I get it. > If you were willing to set up a small stack showing some different > approaches to calculaten areas (and perhaps their unions) I would be > very > grateful. I am not that proficient in scripting to do this. Suggest that you look at the URLs above and then decide what approach you wish to take. Maybe some on the list could then provide further help. > > Thanks for your support, > > Malte > > Regards ... Bob From pixelbird at interisland.net Fri Mar 21 10:52:02 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Fri Mar 21 10:52:02 2003 Subject: Fiddling in the Frustrating, Finnicky, Full Filepath Fo In-Reply-To: <200303210908.EAA18607@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: *********** > Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 17:03:54 -0800 > Subject: Re: Fiddling in the Frustrating, Finnicky, Full Filepath Fog > From: Scott Rossi > Probably because in all the problem cases you cite, you refer to the > filename like this: "KybdUp2.JPG/". > > You can't have a trailing backslash at the end of the filename. This makes > Rev think you're referencing a folder. Try removing the last backslash and > see what happens. ---------- Thanks, Scott, Sarah, etal. Yes, I see. But I tried it both ways and it still didn't work. Robert Brenstein sent me a handler offlist that compared characters, and I found that the problem is in the name of the desktop folder. With other folder names you can call them by their names, but the actual name of the desktop folder is NOT: "Desktop", but rather: "Desktop Folder". You must use both words in its name or it will not be recognized and the path ident will quit. Best regards, Ken N. From mazzapaolo at libero.it Fri Mar 21 11:26:00 2003 From: mazzapaolo at libero.it (=?iso-8859-1?Q?mazzapaolo@liber?=) Date: Fri Mar 21 11:26:00 2003 Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?save_as_-_dialog?= Message-ID: How can I get a dialog similar to the "save as" dialog where user can choose a folder and write the name of a file. Using answer folder I can not insert the name of a file. Ciao Paolo Mazza From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Fri Mar 21 12:10:01 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Fri Mar 21 12:10:01 2003 Subject: custom buttons Message-ID: <20030321170644.57303.qmail@web20418.mail.yahoo.com> Why is it that if I use a transparent button with a custom image, I can't get the button label to look right? If I enter a label such as "Exit" for my button, and select the Show Name property, the label displays below the custom graphic, not centered on it. I can adjust the margins so that the label seems to be centered on the button, but it displays behind the image, not on top of it. Is there any way to make this work. Seems like strange behavior. I need the use of custom buttons, but I'd like to be able to have a built-in button label. Otherwise, I have to create tons of button images (at least three states for each button) with the labels already on them, and then import them into my stack. Is there an easier way to do it? Thanks, Chris Sheffield Read Naturally __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From heather at runrev.com Fri Mar 21 12:19:00 2003 From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams) Date: Fri Mar 21 12:19:00 2003 Subject: T-shirts and the Americans In-Reply-To: <200303211553.KAA27715@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > Message: 8 > From: "Mathewson" > Subject: T-shirts and the Americans > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 08:27:25 -0500 > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > Some of us are Scots (RunRev, is, after all, a Scottish > thing!) and wonder why we have to order T-shirts from 'over > there' - can we not order them from somewhere over here in > Pounds Sterling, or, heaven forfend, Euros ? > > Richmond Mathewson Ideally, yes. However, I have not yet turned up an equivalent service to CafePress in the UK. If anyone can come up with a suitable site, which will allow me to upload the images, offers a shop for our customers, and takes care of the order fulfilment, I will be more than happy to open an account with them. Likewise, for our Australian users, if you can show me a shop, I'll be happy to upload. Regards, Heather -- Heather Williams Runtime Revolution Ltd. Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707 Revolution: Software at the Speed of Thought From dsc at swcp.com Fri Mar 21 12:26:01 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Fri Mar 21 12:26:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thursday, March 20, 2003, at 11:52 AM, Raymond E. Griffith wrote: > Here is a little routine I have written that will accurately calculate > the > area of irregular polygons so long as there are no crossed lines. You > can > have irregular shapes as funky as you like and this will work -- > provided > there are no lines which cross. > > The math behind this is fascinating. I'm impressed. This looks elegant. (I haven't gotten into the math, yet.) The work approaches two multiplies, one subtract and one add per edge. However, if Tomas Nally's method was optimized, it would take only one multiply, one subtract and two adds per edge. (See mail forwarded by Heather.) That is the same number of operations, but if multiplication is much more expensive than addition, then an optimization of Nally's method might be faster. An optimization of Nally's method might be like Ray's only with a line much like this one (off the top of my head): add ((item 1 of tLine) - (item 1 of tPreviousLine)) * ((item 2 of tLine) + (item 2 of tPreviousLine)) to tsum And the tPreviousLine initialization is the last point instead of 0,0. The area added to tsum each cycle is twice the area "under" the line segment or its negation. (I don't know how either would work in weird cases.) Dar Scott From jhurley at infostations.com Fri Mar 21 12:48:00 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Fri Mar 21 12:48:00 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303211553.KAA27715@www.runrev.com> References: <200303211553.KAA27715@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > Tomas Nally, P.E. on behalf of Tomas Nally, P.E. wrote: (snip) > > -- Now, going clockwise around the perimeter of the polygon, > > -- find the area of the virtual trapezoid under each line segment. > > -- A line segment is defined as the segment connecting > > -- the ith node and the (i + 1)th node. Do this inside a > > -- counted loop. In BASIC, a convenient loop for this is > > -- the For...Next loop. > > > > for i = 1 to (n - 1) -- note that I'm stopping at (n - 1) > > x1 = x(i) > > y1 = y(i) > > x2 = x(i + 1) > > y2 = y(i + 1) > > trapArea(i) = y1 * (x2 - x1) + (1/2) * (x2 - x1) * (y2 - y1) > > next i > > > > -- This doesn't quite "close the loop" around the perimeter > > -- of the polygon. In order to close the loop, we need to > > -- find the area under the line segment between the nth > > -- node and the very first node. > > > > x1 = x(n) > > y1 = y(n) > > x2 = x(1) > > y2 = y(1) > > trapArea(n) = y1 * (x2 - x1) + (1/2) * (x2 - x1) * (y2 - y1) > > > > -- Now, we have to add up all the areas of the elements > > > > TotalArea = 0 > > for i = 1 to n > > TotalArea = TotalArea + trapArea(i) > > next i > > (snip) For anyone interested, this BASIC program is equivalent to the Transcript program I posted last Tuesday: on mouseUp put field 1 into tList put 0 into area put line 1 of tList into pOld repeat with i = 1 to the number of lines in tList put line i of tList into pNew add thisToArea(pNew,pOld) to area put pNew into pOld end repeat put area end mouseUp function thisToArea ptNew,ptOld put item 1 of ptNew into xNew put item 2 of ptNew into yNew put item 1 of ptOld into xOld put item 2 of ptOld into yOld return -(xNew - xOld)*(yNew + yOld)/2 end thisToArea And it is also equivalent to the solution posted by Ray Griffith on the last installment of this list, although his is more efficient and nifty as hell. If anyone is interested, this method, sometimes call Newton's approximation, may be extended to calculate the area under any curve by treating the curve as a sequence of straight line segments (open polygon--so to speak). In effect it performs an integration. (When you have a curve which closes on itself, the integral under the closed curve is the *positive* area under the upper portion of the curve, plus the *negative* area under the bottom portion of the curve. The difference is the area inside the curve.) I'm sure that last parenthetical statement is incomprehensible. But sometimes it is wiser to simply abandon hopeless projects rather than attempt redemption. Jim From dan at clearvisiontech.com Fri Mar 21 12:51:00 2003 From: dan at clearvisiontech.com (Dan Friedman) Date: Fri Mar 21 12:51:00 2003 Subject: save as dialog In-Reply-To: <200303211701.MAA30049@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Paolo Mazza, Try: On mouseUp ask file "Save File As:" End mouseUp > How can I get a dialog similar to the "save as" dialog where user can choose a > folder and write the name of a file. > Using answer folder I can not insert the name of a file. > Ciao Paolo Mazza From scott at tactilemedia.com Fri Mar 21 13:07:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Fri Mar 21 13:07:01 2003 Subject: custom buttons In-Reply-To: <20030321170644.57303.qmail@web20418.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Recently, "Chris Sheffield" wrote: > Why is it that if I use a transparent button with a > custom image, I can't get the button label to look > right? If I enter a label such as "Exit" for my > button, and select the Show Name property, the label > displays below the custom graphic, not centered on it. > I can adjust the margins so that the label seems to > be centered on the button, but it displays behind the > image, not on top of it. Is there any way to make > this work. Seems like strange behavior. Looks like that's just the default behavior. An alternate option you can use is to place your transparent button with label (no icon) on a forwqrd layer and place a second button behind it in which you display your button states. This requires that you use two objects for each button but it will provide the effect you want. Otherwise, it's not unusual to place button labels below buttons (a lot of Mac OSX is designed this way). You might want to consider this approach. Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design ----- E: scott at tactilemedia.com W: http://www.tactilemedia.com From dsc at swcp.com Fri Mar 21 13:11:01 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Fri Mar 21 13:11:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <07840DC1-5BC8-11D7-9A3E-000A9567A3E6@swcp.com> On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 10:46 AM, Jim Hurley wrote: > For anyone interested, this BASIC program is equivalent to the > Transcript program I posted last Tuesday: Whoops. I missed that. (My kids call it goldfish-syndrome; my memory is no longer than the time it takes for me to walk around the house.) The comments I just mailed apply to your function as well and even better so. > put line 1 of tList into pOld Should this be -1 to get the last edge? > And it is also equivalent to the solution posted by Ray Griffith on > the last installment of this list, although his is more efficient and > nifty as hell. I guess the algebra corner of my brain is not awake yet; I missed that it was equivalent. (My kids have a name for this, too, but I forgot what it is.) Dar From jhurley at infostations.com Fri Mar 21 13:14:00 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Fri Mar 21 13:14:00 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303211553.KAA27715@www.runrev.com> References: <200303211553.KAA27715@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > >Message: 6 >Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 13:32:29 +0100 >Subject: Re: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons >From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) >To: >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > >Thanks a lot again. :-) > >Jim, >your solutions is more than close to what I am lokking for. (I just would >need variable numbers of sides and bob is my uncle. I?m really happy, so I >don?t know if I can get this silly grin from my face today. ;-) ) >I had to put a comment mark on the two scripst, where you call a handler >called ct (does it require TG to be present?) >The point is, that in the game logic I am thinking of there will never be >more than 2 objects colliding. So if I check with the intersect function >first this will defenitly be fast enough to run smoothly. Sorry about the "ct" line. I forgot that I had a plugin running in the background. "ct" stands for my "clearText" command. I'm happy and surprised this works for you. I have modified it so that it works for polygons of arbitrary number of sides and re-posted it at http://home.infostations.net/jhurley/ under the title: Colliding polygonsRevised.rev Let me know if this works for you. You can speed up or slow the motion of the polygon by changing the values of vx and vy. Jim From dsc at swcp.com Fri Mar 21 13:44:01 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Fri Mar 21 13:44:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 10:23 AM, Dar Scott wrote: > However, if Tomas Nally's method was optimized, it would take only one > multiply, one subtract and two adds per edge. And this applies to Jim's, too. After pondering on this, I think this might be reduced to three arithmetic operations per corner, but it involves 3 adjacent points instead of two. Arithmetic is relatively fast in Transcript, so optimization might be found in other ways. Dar Scott From alrice at ARCplanning.com Fri Mar 21 13:54:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Fri Mar 21 13:54:01 2003 Subject: point is within the rect of object Message-ID: <1075A3B6-5BCE-11D7-A5DC-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Is there a way to do the opposite of "point is within the rect of object". That is, to find the object at a point? I think I've seen a one liner to do this before. Or is it like this? click at point "x,y" get the selectedObject Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Fri Mar 21 14:17:00 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Fri Mar 21 14:17:00 2003 Subject: custom buttons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030321191415.39606.qmail@web20421.mail.yahoo.com> Thanks, Scott. I'll give that a try. Chris Sheffield Read Naturally --- Scott Rossi wrote: > Recently, "Chris Sheffield" wrote: > > > Why is it that if I use a transparent button with > a > > custom image, I can't get the button label to look > > right? If I enter a label such as "Exit" for my > > button, and select the Show Name property, the > label > > displays below the custom graphic, not centered on > it. > > I can adjust the margins so that the label seems > to > > be centered on the button, but it displays behind > the > > image, not on top of it. Is there any way to make > > this work. Seems like strange behavior. > > Looks like that's just the default behavior. An > alternate option you can > use is to place your transparent button with label > (no icon) on a forwqrd > layer and place a second button behind it in which > you display your button > states. This requires that you use two objects for > each button but it will > provide the effect you want. > > Otherwise, it's not unusual to place button labels > below buttons (a lot of > Mac OSX is designed this way). You might want to > consider this approach. > > Regards, > > Scott Rossi > Creative Director > Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design > ----- > E: scott at tactilemedia.com > W: http://www.tactilemedia.com > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From runrev at technetx.com Fri Mar 21 14:31:01 2003 From: runrev at technetx.com (runrev at technetx.com) Date: Fri Mar 21 14:31:01 2003 Subject: Rev and mySQL References: <20030318153428.47295.qmail@web20422.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000a01c2efdf$b5860580$0201a8c0@nh2> I use mysql Server for both web and internal processing along with Revolution as the front end (client server environment) for our company processes. However, I use the ODBC connector vs. the Revolution MYSQL because I do not have that version. To my understanding, the Revolution license that allows direct connect to MYSQL still requires the mysql server version. To use embedded, I figure the use of libmySQL.dll is required, and for the life of me, have not been able to get Revolution 1.1.1 to connect to external windows dll's. I have to revert to RapidQ or any other programming tool to do so. If I could get Revolution to connect to external dll's easily, Revolution would by far be the best darn thing out there for my needs. That feature would satisfy absolutely everything I could ever ask for in a programming environment. Ron Tan This probably didn't answer your question directly, but thought I'd put in my 2 cents. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Sheffield" To: Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 7:34 AM Subject: Rev and mySQL > Does anyone have a good example of using Revolution > with a mySQL database? I'm looking specifically for > something that uses embedded mySQL because we'd like > the database to be as transparent as possible. We > don't want to require that users start up a database > server anytime they want to run our program. Granted > this can be done at boot up, but it's an extra > installation step that we'd rather not have to go > through. > > Anyway, I'm not extremely familiar with mySQL or how > it works. I just read a little about the embedded > features and it piqued my interest. I'm not sure if > this is even possible with Revolution. If anyone has > anything they could share, I'd be very grateful. > > Thanks, > > Chris Sheffield > Read Naturally > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! > http://platinum.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From alrice at ARCplanning.com Fri Mar 21 14:42:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Fri Mar 21 14:42:01 2003 Subject: Rev and mySQL In-Reply-To: <000a01c2efdf$b5860580$0201a8c0@nh2> Message-ID: On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 12:26 PM, runrev at technetx.com wrote: > To use embedded, I figure > the use of libmySQL.dll is required, and for the life of me, have not > been > able to get Revolution 1.1.1 to connect to external windows dll's. Rev cannot connect to any DLL. Although Rev "externals" on Win32 are named something.dll, they have a special interface which defines what functions and messages are available to Rev in the external. Different from other DLLs. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Fri Mar 21 15:43:00 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Fri Mar 21 15:43:00 2003 Subject: setting up password fields Message-ID: <20030321203932.37367.qmail@web20414.mail.yahoo.com> You're all going to be sick of me by the end of the day! :-) I'm just getting into the nitty gritty of my GUI. And since I'm new to Revolution, I've got lots of questions. I know this one has been discussed a while back. I found some posts in an old archive, but I was wondering if anyone has a better (newer) way of setting up a regular field to accept a password entry (i.e. put a '*' in place of each character). I tried some code from an old archive something like: on keydown whichKey global thisPassword put whichKey after thisPassword put "*" after field "passwordField" end keyDown But this doesn't quite work. If the user has to modify what he's typed, or if he highlights the entire password, deletes it, and starts over, the value in thisPassword just keeps building on itself. Does anyone have a solution? Preferably something that handles Delete and Backspace as well? I'd like something that works like "ask password", but in a regular field. Is there any way I can look at the code behind the ask password dialog? Thanks, Chris Sheffield Read Naturally __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From zelston at aol.com Fri Mar 21 15:43:33 2003 From: zelston at aol.com (Zac Elston) Date: Fri Mar 21 15:43:33 2003 Subject: can revolution apps run without a gui? In-Reply-To: <200303210909.EAA18650@www.runrev.com> References: <200303210909.EAA18650@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <3E7B7874.6070901@aol.com> kray at sonsothunder.com wrote: > Absolutely. In fact one of Rev's implementations is as a CGI app you'd > put on a web server. that is a runtime interpreted script like perl and while it will work, it's not exactly what I was asking I want to be able to run a standalone app without a gui on the command line. Can one develop an application in the rev gui enviroment, save it for many OS's and run them as command line apps? thanks -zac From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Fri Mar 21 15:55:00 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Fri Mar 21 15:55:00 2003 Subject: point is within the rect of object In-Reply-To: <1075A3B6-5BCE-11D7-A5DC-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: <20030321205155.55062.qmail@web20006.mail.yahoo.com> Is there a way to do the opposite of "point is within the rect of object". That is, to find the object at a point? I think I've seen a one liner to do this before. Or is it like this? click at point "x,y" get the selectedObject Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com === this would only reach the top object, right? erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dsc at swcp.com Fri Mar 21 16:11:01 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Fri Mar 21 16:11:01 2003 Subject: can revolution apps run without a gui? In-Reply-To: <3E7B7874.6070901@aol.com> Message-ID: <2D8D0DBC-5BE1-11D7-9A3E-000A9567A3E6@swcp.com> On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 01:39 PM, Zac Elston wrote: > I want to be able to run a standalone app without a gui on the command > line. Can one develop an application in the rev gui enviroment, save > it for many OS's and run them as command line apps? On Windows and OS X you can run a standalone from a command line. You can probably do that from linux and unix OSes, too. General command line arg parsing is hard in Windows Rev. You may need to choose to to do one of these: quote all args, quote each arg, or never quote (no spaces in file names etc). I don't think this will change. Parsing is simple in OS X Rev. The application main stack will show unless you do something about that. I have seen some stdin/stdout problems some of which seem to be related to eof vs empty buffer semantics. If you run these from open process with update, your problems will be compounded. Some of these problems may be limited to Windows. Running applications like this seems to be discouraged. You might be better off using the scheme Ken Ray mentioned, but I expect it will have many of these same problems. Dar Scott From jiml at netrin.com Fri Mar 21 17:01:04 2003 From: jiml at netrin.com (Jim Lambert) Date: Fri Mar 21 17:01:04 2003 Subject: setting up password fields In-Reply-To: <200303212044.PAA04741@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: I know it's a dialog not a field but might this excerpt from the Trnscript dictionary help? "The ask password command displays a dialog box like the ask command, but with the characters the user types displayed as asterisks (*) for privacy." Jim Lambert From monte at sweattechnologies.com Fri Mar 21 17:25:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Fri Mar 21 17:25:01 2003 Subject: Externals & CGI In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > I'm wondering if the 2.0 externals will work for CGI as well???? I'm > > particularly interested in the XML & MySQL externals. > > Our own external libraries will work in the 2.0 CGI specific > engine. So you > will be able to do databases and XML. > Great! Thanks Kevin From diskot123 at juno.com Fri Mar 21 17:45:01 2003 From: diskot123 at juno.com (Tuviah M Snyder) Date: Fri Mar 21 17:45:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1231 - 14 msgs Message-ID: <20030321.174134.2392.2.diskot123@juno.com> > Does anyone have a good example of using Revolution > with a mySQL database? I'm looking specifically for > something that uses embedded mySQL because we'd like > the database to be as transparent as possible. We > don't want to require that users start up a database > server anytime they want to run our program. Granted > this can be done at boot up You may want to consider using Valentina as your database if what you are looking for is a good single user local database. RevDB should be able to connect to mySQL regardless of whether it's a embedded or not, you would simply use localhost to connect, and replace libmysql.dll with the embedded version. Database Examples can be found at: http://www.runrev.com/revolution/downloads/developerdownloads/DB Examples.zip Tuviah From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Fri Mar 21 17:47:02 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Fri Mar 21 17:47:02 2003 Subject: setting up password fields In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030321224334.37404.qmail@web20420.mail.yahoo.com> I really would rather not do that if I don't have to. Not only is it kind of ugly, but the dialog pops up over the top of other graphics and text that I have on the screen, which I don't want. Chris Sheffield --- Jim Lambert wrote: > of > setting up a regular field to accept a password > entry > (i.e. put a '*' in place of each character). > > > I know it's a dialog not a field but might this > excerpt from the Trnscript > dictionary help? > > "The ask password command displays a dialog box like > the ask command, but > with the characters the user types displayed as > asterisks (*) for privacy." > > Jim Lambert > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From monte at sweattechnologies.com Fri Mar 21 18:02:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Fri Mar 21 18:02:01 2003 Subject: Use of Revolution ... In-Reply-To: <1EA2D47E-5B80-11D7-BF5E-003065C5ACDE@hubrisys.com> Message-ID: > > > Depending on the amount of data you may want to look at a db back end. > > The > > 3D graphics is the only curly one. Do you mean real 3D or just charts > > with a > > 3D look? > > Charts with 3D look ... I am looking for pre-existing 2D/3D charts > components but I didn't see some for Revolution. I think there is something on the contributor section of the rev site for 2D charts. I personally find it easier to create my own charts when the need arises. You should be able to do 3D look bar charts fairly easily but it is a matter starting from scratch abd building it up with graphical elements. On the plus site you have complete control ;-) > About a backend, how straight is it to bind it to lists or fields per > example ? Only programmatically ? I think rev 2.0 will have improved db features. How much data are we talking about? I have a chart in one app that manipulates 7000 - 10000 records fast enough to use a slider to change a parameter and redraw. You can store data quite efficiently using custom properties. Cheers Monte > > > Monte > >> > >> Greetings > >> > >> I am evaluating differents tools in order to develop a financial > >> application (I also looked at RealBasic, Omnis Studio, 4D) : > >> > >> Some requirements / caracteristics : > >> - stand alone application, not Internet based > >> - lot of data and calculation on that data > >> - many different kinds of reports > >> - 2D/3D graphics > >> > >> I like the Revolution concept and features, but I am not sure > >> it will allow me to fulfill the above requirements. > >> > >> Also needed is cross-plateform, "double-clickable application" > >> simplicity, ease of use and productivity of the IDE, GUI builder: > >> here I know that Revolution will fit. > >> > >> I would appreciate any comments, opinions from the existing > >> community. > >> > >> Thanks in advance > >> > >> Bernard Sauterel > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> use-revolution mailing list > >> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > use-revolution mailing list > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From monte at sweattechnologies.com Fri Mar 21 18:06:02 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Fri Mar 21 18:06:02 2003 Subject: setting up password fields In-Reply-To: <20030321224334.37404.qmail@web20420.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Try typing this in the message box and take what you need: edit the script of cd 1 stack "Ask Dialog" Cheers Monte > > I really would rather not do that if I don't have to. > Not only is it kind of ugly, but the dialog pops up > over the top of other graphics and text that I have on > the screen, which I don't want. > > Chris Sheffield > > --- Jim Lambert wrote: > > > of > > setting up a regular field to accept a password > > entry > > (i.e. put a '*' in place of each character). > > > > > I know it's a dialog not a field but might this > > excerpt from the Trnscript > > dictionary help? > > > > "The ask password command displays a dialog box like > > the ask command, but > > with the characters the user types displayed as > > asterisks (*) for privacy." > > > > Jim Lambert > > > > _______________________________________________ > > use-revolution mailing list > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! > http://platinum.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From chipp at chipp.com Fri Mar 21 18:09:00 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Fri Mar 21 18:09:00 2003 Subject: setting up password fields In-Reply-To: <20030321203932.37367.qmail@web20414.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: on keydown whichKey global thisPassword put whichKey after thisPassword put "*" after field "password" end keyDown on backspaceKey global thisPassword put empty into field "password" put "" into thisPassword end backspaceKey on deleteKey global thisPassword put empty into field "password" put "" into thisPassword end deleteKey on returnInField send mouseUp to btn "Next" end returnInField > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Chris > Sheffield > Sent: Friday, March 21, 2003 2:40 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: setting up password fields > > > You're all going to be sick of me by the end of the > day! :-) I'm just getting into the nitty gritty of > my GUI. And since I'm new to Revolution, I've got > lots of questions. > > I know this one has been discussed a while back. I > found some posts in an old archive, but I was > wondering if anyone has a better (newer) way of > setting up a regular field to accept a password entry > (i.e. put a '*' in place of each character). I tried > some code from an old archive something like: > > on keydown whichKey > global thisPassword > put whichKey after thisPassword > put "*" after field "passwordField" > end keyDown > > But this doesn't quite work. If the user has to > modify what he's typed, or if he highlights the entire > password, deletes it, and starts over, the value in > thisPassword just keeps building on itself. > > Does anyone have a solution? Preferably something > that handles Delete and Backspace as well? I'd like > something that works like "ask password", but in a > regular field. Is there any way I can look at the > code behind the ask password dialog? > > Thanks, > > Chris Sheffield > Read Naturally > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! > http://platinum.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk Fri Mar 21 18:12:01 2003 From: livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk (Graham Samuel) Date: Fri Mar 21 18:12:01 2003 Subject: What's the best way to find out if a file exists? Message-ID: I want to do the most straightforward thing to implement the logic if exists(file someFilePath) then do something else do something else end if I read in the Transcript Dictionary that you can't in fact use the 'exists' construct on files, but that if you open a file for reading and it doesn't exist, the result contains "Can't open that file." Is this the only way to find out if a file exists, and does this result text stay exactly the same in all circumstances for all OS's? As usual, any info gratefully received by Graham -- ------------------------------------------------------------------- Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK & France From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Fri Mar 21 18:13:01 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Fri Mar 21 18:13:01 2003 Subject: setting up password fields In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030321230957.45088.qmail@web20418.mail.yahoo.com> Thanks a ton! That should get me started. Chris Sheffield --- Monte Goulding wrote: > > Try typing this in the message box and take what you > need: > > edit the script of cd 1 stack "Ask Dialog" > > Cheers > > Monte > > > > I really would rather not do that if I don't have > to. > > Not only is it kind of ugly, but the dialog pops > up > > over the top of other graphics and text that I > have on > > the screen, which I don't want. > > > > Chris Sheffield > > > > --- Jim Lambert wrote: > > > way > > > of > > > setting up a regular field to accept a password > > > entry > > > (i.e. put a '*' in place of each character). > > > > > > > I know it's a dialog not a field but might this > > > excerpt from the Trnscript > > > dictionary help? > > > > > > "The ask password command displays a dialog box > like > > > the ask command, but > > > with the characters the user types displayed as > > > asterisks (*) for privacy." > > > > > > Jim Lambert > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > use-revolution mailing list > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > > > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, > live on your desktop! > > http://platinum.yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > > use-revolution mailing list > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk Fri Mar 21 18:14:01 2003 From: livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk (Graham Samuel) Date: Fri Mar 21 18:14:01 2003 Subject: QT player object problems Message-ID: I have a couple of player objects with QT movies in them. My user is allowed to drag these player objects around the screen - during the drag, the movies will not actually be playing. When the user lets go the mouse, the movie begins to play in the loc it's ended up in, This is all very easy to accomplish in RR (for example using the 'grab' command for the dragging), and I can add custom properties to my player object and generally treat it like an image or a grc, apart from two related problems: I can't buffer the player because if I do, RR ignores the masking on the movies, and each one always gets a white rectangle around it (people on the list told me the trick of switching off buffering to allow the transparency to operate); but if buffering is not set, then the drag process is incredibly jerky and slow in any machine below about 500Mhz (I'm talking about Macs here, but I'm sure I'm going to have the same problem on PCs). The only way I've thought of getting around this is to use an image of the (stopped) movie in the drag part of the program, and substitute it with the player object when I want the movie to play. But this will be clumsy, will involve a lot more code, and will give an inferior user experience because the movie will always appear to stop at the same frame, which isn't the case now. Can anyone help with a better idea? Will either of these issues (buffering, speed) go away in 2.0? I have still not ventured into the 2.0 beta. TIA Graham -- ------------------------------------------------------------------- Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK & France From alrice at ARCplanning.com Fri Mar 21 18:53:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Fri Mar 21 18:53:01 2003 Subject: What's the best way to find out if a file exists? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 04:08 PM, Graham Samuel wrote: > if exists(file someFilePath) then > do something > else > do something else > end if See "there is a" operator, which works with files and folders in addition to objects. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Fri Mar 21 19:09:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Fri Mar 21 19:09:01 2003 Subject: Scripted musical notation available In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030322000539.97445.qmail@web20002.mail.yahoo.com> --- Luigi Di Martino wrote: > Hi Erik > > Yes I think I get what it is you are up to now. > I love it! It is definately > a positive direction to take because it makes > what can seem very daunting as > a cool bit of fun. Life is for having fun > right?!!! A dance orientated > program for teaching maths and computor > programming would help in obvious > ways I can imagine. Beginners need to get > excited. thanks a lot, the basic idea of stepping through scripts and watching the mathematical changes increment by increment can apply to ANYthing. turtle graphics was a big help for me with logic and geometry. see Jim Hurley's book. one thing that emerged from writing a demo, was making custom Variable Watchers for just the variables being followed, in a larger font. > I live in Cambridge, England btw...came over > here at the age of five, from Naples! > > Lui Ida Lupino did that! -then made great films with Humphry Bogart. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk Fri Mar 21 19:25:00 2003 From: livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk (Graham Samuel) Date: Fri Mar 21 19:25:00 2003 Subject: What's the best way to find out if a file exists? Message-ID: On Fri, 21 Mar 2003 16:50:18 -0700 Alex Rice wrote (and thanks for the amazingly speedy reply!): > >On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 04:08 PM, Graham Samuel wrote: >> if exists(file someFilePath) then >> do something >> else >> do something else >> end if > >See "there is a" operator, which works with files and folders in >addition to objects. > Dang! I was dimly aware of the "there is a" construct but I thought it was synonymous with "exists" (I might perhaps be forgiven for thinking so...). Anyway, thanks Alex, that's just what I wanted to know! Graham -- ------------------------------------------------------------------- Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK & France From alrice at ARCplanning.com Fri Mar 21 20:00:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Fri Mar 21 20:00:01 2003 Subject: What's the best way to find out if a file exists? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1C2000D6-5C01-11D7-A5DC-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 05:21 PM, Graham Samuel wrote: > Dang! I was dimly aware of the "there is a" construct but I thought it > was synonymous with "exists" (I might perhaps be forgiven for thinking > so...). Anyway, thanks Alex, that's just what I wanted to know! No worries, I went through the same thing. One would think that "exists" and "there is a" would be interchangeable. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk Fri Mar 21 20:34:02 2003 From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg) Date: Fri Mar 21 20:34:02 2003 Subject: setting up password fields In-Reply-To: <20030321203932.37367.qmail@web20414.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030321203932.37367.qmail@web20414.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: At 12:39 pm -0800 21/3/03, Chris Sheffield wrote: >I know this one has been discussed a while back. I >found some posts in an old archive, but I was >wondering if anyone has a better (newer) way of >setting up a regular field to accept a password entry >(i.e. put a '*' in place of each character). I tried >some code from an old archive something like: > >on keydown whichKey > global thisPassword > put whichKey after thisPassword > put "*" after field "passwordField" >end keyDown > >But this doesn't quite work. If the user has to >modify what he's typed, or if he highlights the entire >password, deletes it, and starts over, the value in >thisPassword just keeps building on itself. Here are some scripts I use for this. In this case, the "real" text is stored in a custom property instead of a global. It takes account of cases where the insertion pont is not at the end of the field and when there is a selection. But you would also need to decide whether to allow pasting/cutting in the field, and if so, how to handle it. (I disallow it.) on keyDown pChar if pChar is in "-1234567890abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz" then ##or whatever put word 2 of the selectedChunk into tCh1 put word 4 of the selectedChunk into tCh2 put the cpPassText of me into tPassText if tCh1 > tCh2 then put "*" after char tCh2 of me put pChar after char tCh2 of tPassText else delete char tCh1 to tCh2 of me delete char tCh1 to tCh2 of tPasstext put "*" after char tCh1 -1 of me put pChar after char tCh1 -1 of tPasstext end if set the cpPassText of me to tPassText else beep end if end keyDown on deleteKey put word 2 of the selectedChunk into tCh1 put word 4 of the selectedChunk into tCh2 put the cpPassText of me into tPassText if tCh1 > tCh2 then delete char tCh1 of me delete char tCh1 of tPassText else delete char tCh1 to tch2 of me delete char tCh1 to tch2 of tPassText end if set the cpPassText of me to tPassText end deleteKey on backspaceKey put word 2 of the selectedChunk into tCh1 put word 4 of the selectedChunk into tCh2 put the cpPassText of me into tPassText if tCh1 > tCh2 then delete char tCh2 of me delete char tCh2 of tPassText else delete char tCh1 to tch2 of me delete char tCh1 to tch2 of tPassText end if set the cpPassText of me to tPassText end backspaceKey Cheers Dave From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Fri Mar 21 21:24:00 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Fri Mar 21 21:24:00 2003 Subject: Fiddling in the Frustrating, Finnicky, Full Filepath Fog In-Reply-To: Message-ID: "Desktop Folder" _is_ the folder's name. It's just commonly referred to as the desktop. On Thursday, March 20, 2003, at 08:50 PM, Ken Norris wrote: > Got it. Thanks to everyone, Monte, Robert, et al. > > What I found out was that you can call all folders by name EXCEPT the > desktop which MUST be called "Desktop Folder" (note the word "Folder") > and > nothing else. > > Ken N. regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From jhurley at infostations.com Fri Mar 21 21:49:00 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Fri Mar 21 21:49:00 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303212044.PAA04741@www.runrev.com> References: <200303212044.PAA04741@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: >Jim Hurley wrote: >on mouseUp > put field 1 into tList > put 0 into area > put line 1 of tList into pOld > repeat with i = 1 to the number of lines in tList > put line i of tList into pNew > add thisToArea(pNew,pOld) to area > put pNew into pOld > end repeat > put area >end mouseUp > >function thisToArea ptNew,ptOld > put item 1 of ptNew into xNew > put item 2 of ptNew into yNew > put item 1 of ptOld into xOld > put item 2 of ptOld into yOld > return -(xNew - xOld)*(yNew + yOld)/2 >end thisToArea > > > > put line 1 of tList into pOld > Dar Scott wrote: >Should this be -1 to get the last edge? > Dar, Actually it contributes nothing to the area since the first term in the sum is the area under the line joining the first point with itself; not very smart but, no harm, no foul. It would have been more sensible if I had started the sum with i = 2. Since the last point in the list is identical to the first point (it is a *closed* polygon), the last edge is included by performing the repeat up to the number of lines (points in the polygon) in tList. But a cleaner (and faster) version might be: on mouseUp put field 1 into tList put 0 into area put line 1 of tList into pOld repeat for each line tLine in tList add thisToArea(tLine,pOld) to tArea put tLine into pOld end repeat put tArea end mouseUp But you still get no contribution from the first repeat, but what is 0 among friends. Regards, Jim From dsc at swcp.com Fri Mar 21 22:12:01 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Fri Mar 21 22:12:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <9F686BF8-5C13-11D7-A9FC-000A9567A3E6@swcp.com> On Friday, March 21, 2003, at 07:46 PM, Jim Hurley wrote: > Since the last point in the list is identical to the first point (it > is a *closed* polygon), the last edge is included by performing the > repeat up to the number of lines (points in the polygon) in tList. My error. I had remembered the doc on the points property to say that the difference between closed and not closed is determined by whether the last line is blank or not. I didn't realize the last line would be the same as the first in a closed polygon, so I thought the loop should be initialized with the last. Dar Scott From pixelbird at interisland.net Sat Mar 22 01:51:02 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sat Mar 22 01:51:02 2003 Subject: "Save As" In-Reply-To: <200303211701.MAA30035@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > How can I get a dialog similar to the "save as" dialog where user can choose a > folder and write the name of a file. > Using answer folder I can not insert the name of a file. > Ciao Paolo Mazza ---------- "ask file" See the Dictionary under "ask file" ;+) Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Sat Mar 22 02:41:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sat Mar 22 02:41:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: <200303211553.KAA27686@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 13:15:20 +0100 > Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] > From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) > The technical aspect of what you are trying to do wakes my interest, too. > How do you want to deliver your media? As a download or streamed? I have > been trying to display media (.mpg video) from the Web in a Stack. > Has anyone succeded streaming video directly into rev, without the need of > downloading the whole File? In my teststack the player refused playing the > video/audio until the file was completely in cache. ---------- Sounds like your connection is too slow. If playing a movie or audio file can outrun the incoming stream, it will try to cache whatever it needs to prevent it from stopping midstream, i.e., if your connection is slow (dialup), that may mean 1/2 or more of the file must be buffered in cache first (depending on size). Try reducing the window size (rect) of the player and see what happens. HTH, Ken N. From swedentom2 at telia.com Sat Mar 22 10:06:01 2003 From: swedentom2 at telia.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Tomas_Franz=E9n?=) Date: Sat Mar 22 10:06:01 2003 Subject: Open process Message-ID: <61117700-5C77-11D7-83BA-0003937359B8@telia.com> Hey, This is my script: on mouseup open process "/bin/date" end mouseup Why do I get error -50 as the result? Tomas Franz?n Lighthead Software http://www.lightheadsw.com/ From mazzapaolo at libero.it Sat Mar 22 11:37:01 2003 From: mazzapaolo at libero.it (paolo mazza) Date: Sat Mar 22 11:37:01 2003 Subject: "Save As" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: You are Right... Thank You I have been using "Answer file" and I did not realize the difference. Ciao Paolo Sabato, 22 Mar 2003, alle 04:57 Europe/Rome, Ken Norris ha scritto: > ********** >> How can I get a dialog similar to the "save as" dialog where user can >> choose a >> folder and write the name of a file. >> Using answer folder I can not insert the name of a file. >> Ciao Paolo Mazza > ---------- > "ask file" > > See the Dictionary under "ask file" ;+) > > Ken N. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From pixelbird at interisland.net Sat Mar 22 13:25:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sat Mar 22 13:25:01 2003 Subject: Fiddling in the Frustrating, Finnicky, Full Filepath Fog In-Reply-To: <200303221702.MAA21783@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 18:21:09 -0800 > Subject: Re: Fiddling in the Frustrating, Finnicky, Full Filepath Fog > From: Geoff Canyon > > "Desktop Folder" _is_ the folder's name. It's just commonly referred to > as the desktop. > > On Thursday, March 20, 2003, at 08:50 PM, Ken Norris wrote: > >> Got it. Thanks to everyone, Monte, Robert, et al. >> >> What I found out was that you can call all folders by name EXCEPT the >> desktop which MUST be called "Desktop Folder" (note the word "Folder") >> and >> nothing else. ---------- Yes, well, that's what I meant. I didn't know that, because I don't put the word "Folder" in my folder names. Perhaps it is a good idea/habit to get into. Best regards, Ken N. From dan at clearvisiontech.com Sat Mar 22 14:05:01 2003 From: dan at clearvisiontech.com (Dan Friedman) Date: Sat Mar 22 14:05:01 2003 Subject: Send an eMail attachment? Message-ID: Greetings fellow Revolutionists, Does anyone know a way to send an eMail from a stack that includes an attachment? I see that in RR 2.0 there is a new revMail command that acts like clicking a "mailto:" link in a browser. For me, this would be fine. However, I want to include an attachment also. Is this possible? Thank you in advance, Dan From Revinfo1155 at aol.com Sat Mar 22 14:20:00 2003 From: Revinfo1155 at aol.com (Revinfo1155 at aol.com) Date: Sat Mar 22 14:20:00 2003 Subject: Send an eMail attachment? Message-ID: <1dc.5bb765e.2bae1089@aol.com> In a message dated 3/22/03 2:04:51 PM, dan at clearvisiontech.com writes: > Greetings fellow Revolutionists, > > Does anyone know a way to send an eMail from a stack that includes an > attachment?? I see that in RR 2.0 there is a new revMail command that acts > like clicking a "mailto:" link in a browser.? For me, this would be fine. > However, I want to include an attachment also.? Is this possible? > > Thank you in advance, > Dan > > Here's a button script that works in 1.1.1 on mouseUp revGoURL "mailto:Jack at JackBartlett.com" end mouseUp This opens your regular email program which you can then do attachments etc. Jack -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dan at clearvisiontech.com Sat Mar 22 14:38:00 2003 From: dan at clearvisiontech.com (Dan Friedman) Date: Sat Mar 22 14:38:00 2003 Subject: Send an eMail attachment? Message-ID: Jack, Thanks... But this doesn't solve the problem. *I* want to include the attachment in the eMail. I know that I could have the user add the attachment, but since I know what file needs to be sent, I would like to, at runtime, set that parameter. Thanks, Dan > Here's a button script that works in 1.1.1 > > on mouseUp > revGoURL "mailto:Jack at JackBartlett.com" > end mouseUp > > This opens your regular email program which you can then do attachments etc. > > Jack >> Greetings fellow Revolutionists, >> >> Does anyone know a way to send an eMail from a stack that includes an >> attachment? I see that in RR 2.0 there is a new revMail command that acts >> like clicking a "mailto:" link in a browser. For me, this would be fine. >> However, I want to include an attachment also. Is this possible? >> >> Thank you in advance, >> Dan From pixelbird at interisland.net Sat Mar 22 14:42:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sat Mar 22 14:42:01 2003 Subject: Substack trouble In-Reply-To: <200303221702.MAA21783@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Howdy, I have a substack "devVK.1" When I open it from the msg box like this: open stack "devVK.1" It tries to run the script of the main stack and, of course, throws an error window. I looked in the docs and it suggests putting: on openStack exit openStack end openStack ...into the substacks script, but that will prevent the substack's openStack handler from running, won't it? Also, all the buttons and fieds I created in the substack had lt grey foregrounds, so you can't reads the names or typed tex. I don't understand either of these things. TIA, Ken N. From chipp at chipp.com Sat Mar 22 15:56:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Sat Mar 22 15:56:01 2003 Subject: Substack trouble In-Reply-To: Message-ID: just trap the openStack handler in the substsack... on openStack --do your subStack openStack stuff end openStack > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Ken Norris > Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2003 10:48 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Substack trouble > > > Howdy, > > I have a substack "devVK.1" > > When I open it from the msg box like this: > > open stack "devVK.1" > > It tries to run the script of the main stack and, of course, > throws an error > window. > > I looked in the docs and it suggests putting: > > on openStack > exit openStack > end openStack > > ...into the substacks script, but that will prevent the > substack's openStack > handler from running, won't it? > > Also, all the buttons and fieds I created in the substack had lt grey > foregrounds, so you can't reads the names or typed tex. > > I don't understand either of these things. > > TIA, > Ken N. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From chipp at chipp.com Sat Mar 22 15:56:29 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Sat Mar 22 15:56:29 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ken, Are you saying you can stream a video in RR from an Internet connection? From tsj at unimelb.edu.au Sat Mar 22 16:25:01 2003 From: tsj at unimelb.edu.au (Terry Judd) Date: Sat Mar 22 16:25:01 2003 Subject: QT player object problems In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <41B7E4EA-5C43-11D7-BDCD-000393AEC28C@unimelb.edu.au> On Saturday, March 22, 2003, at 10:10 AM, Graham Samuel wrote: > I have a couple of player objects with QT movies in them. My user is > allowed to drag these player objects around the screen - during the > drag, the movies will not actually be playing. When the user lets go > the mouse, the movie begins to play in the loc it's ended up in, > > This is all very easy to accomplish in RR (for example using the > 'grab' command for the dragging), and I can add custom properties to > my player object and generally treat it like an image or a grc, apart > from two related problems: > > I can't buffer the player because if I do, RR ignores the masking on > the movies, and each one always gets a white rectangle around it > (people on the list told me the trick of switching off buffering to > allow the transparency to operate); but if buffering is not set, then > the drag process is incredibly jerky and slow in any machine below > about 500Mhz (I'm talking about Macs here, but I'm sure I'm going to > have the same problem on PCs). The only way I've thought of getting > around this is to use an image of the (stopped) movie in the drag part > of the program, and substitute it with the player object when I want > the movie to play. But this will be clumsy, will involve a lot more > code, and will give an inferior user experience because the movie will > always appear to stop at the same frame, which isn't the case now. > > Can anyone help with a better idea? Will either of these issues > (buffering, speed) go away in 2.0? I have still not ventured into the > 2.0 beta. Why not forget about dragging the QT altogether and drag an outline graphic that is the same size and shape as your mask instead - you would only have to relocate the QT once on mouseup. I know this might not be ideal but we dragged windows around in pre OSX finders like this for years. Terry... From ambassador at fourthworld.com Sat Mar 22 19:12:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Sat Mar 22 19:12:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Chipp Walters wrote: > Are you saying you can stream a video in RR from an Internet connection? >> From my understanding, you can only assign a filename to a player > object...not a URL. URLs work too -- pretty much anything ypu can throw at Apple's QT Player can be used as the filename for an MC player object. Too bad BBC stopped their QT stream -- I used to watch it in MC every day.... -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Sat Mar 22 19:21:00 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Sat Mar 22 19:21:00 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030323001750.11359.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com> --- Richard Gaskin wrote: > Chipp Walters wrote: > > > Are you saying you can stream a video in RR > from an Internet connection? > >> From my understanding, you can only assign a > filename to a player > > object...not a URL. > > URLs work too -- pretty much anything ypu can > throw at Apple's QT Player can > be used as the filename for an MC player > object. > > Too bad BBC stopped their QT stream -- I used > to watch it in MC every > day... so what does it take to stream your own QT videos to RR users? if this means desktop broadcasting from your own digital camera has arrived, then this is an wondrous new world we live in. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From katir at hindu.org Sat Mar 22 19:36:00 2003 From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami) Date: Sat Mar 22 19:36:00 2003 Subject: Browse file local HTML files on Jaguar Message-ID: <0D06BE87-5CC7-11D7-85E7-000A959D0AC6@hindu.org> Anyone have a solution to this: not a Rev problem really, but an Apple one: The chosen web browser app in the Internet prefs will not, by default, be used as the app to launch any local text file: e.g. "file:///volumes/someMountedServervolume/folder/index.html" Instead the Mac OS is now "forcing" a local text file to be launched in TextEdit, regardless of the internet browser preference selection, even though it is an *.html file. Anyone know a way to force the file to open in a browser. I suppose one could use a Tell application "Omniweb" open some file end tell But I was wondering if someone knows how to config the OS to do this so we can stick with revGoURL? I can't find that old "helpapps" matrix we used to have in OS9... I could just be missing something. Sannyasin Sivakatirswami Himalayan Academy Publications at Kauai's Hindu Monastery katir at hindu.org www.HimalayanAcademy.com, www.HinduismToday.com www.Gurudeva.org www.Hindu.org From ambassador at fourthworld.com Sat Mar 22 20:24:00 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Sat Mar 22 20:24:00 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: <20030323001750.11359.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: erik hansen wrote: > so what does it take to stream your own QT videos > to RR users? if this means desktop broadcasting > from your own digital camera has arrived, then > this is an wondrous new world we live in. Showing a stram is very different from originating one. You can start here: -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From alrice at ARCplanning.com Sun Mar 23 02:19:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Sun Mar 23 02:19:01 2003 Subject: Browse file local HTML files on Jaguar In-Reply-To: <0D06BE87-5CC7-11D7-85E7-000A959D0AC6@hindu.org> Message-ID: <4F02D445-5CFF-11D7-9238-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Saturday, March 22, 2003, at 05:33 PM, Sannyasin Sivakatirswami wrote: > Anyone have a solution to this: not a Rev problem really, but an Apple > one: I don't know if it's Apple's problem either. The C API is called Launch Services, seems poorly documented and I don't know how you can access it from Revolution. I've never seen HTML files open up in TextEdit. I just created a test account on my OS X 10.2 machine and created an empty html document, and by default it opened up in Safari. I *think* a on fresh OS X install they would probably open up with Internet Explorer. But the user can override this via the Finder if they want to. This doesn't change their "default browser" in their preferences, but it does change the action for "file:///" URLs. Maybe the user deserves this fate if they have been messing with their app binding for .html files? If you really think you need to control it, I think your best bet would be using applescript to do something like -search user's defaults for their web browser of choice -get it's path -use applescript to open html file with that browser. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From mazzapaolo at libero.it Sun Mar 23 03:00:01 2003 From: mazzapaolo at libero.it (=?iso-8859-1?Q?mazzapaolo@liber?=) Date: Sun Mar 23 03:00:01 2003 Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Copy_protection?= Message-ID: How can I add to my application a copy protection? I wuold like to distribute my application freely, but I'd like users to ask me for a code when thay need to save their files. Ciao, Paolo Mazza From dan at clearvisiontech.com Sun Mar 23 03:49:01 2003 From: dan at clearvisiontech.com (Dan Friedman) Date: Sun Mar 23 03:49:01 2003 Subject: DLLs Message-ID: Hello, Can anyone see what I'm doing wrong... I have a dll that I want to call. The script that communicates with the DLL is the main stack. I have set the destroyWindow of the stack to true and I have set the externals of the stack to "myDLL.dll" (I can't use a hard coded path because I don't know where the user will install this app). I have closed and reopened the stack as advised in the "destroyWindow" entry in the Transcript Dictionary. Just before I reopen the stack, I set the defaultFolder to the standalone's path so it will find "myDLL.dll". When running in RR, it works fine. However, in a standalone it fails. After futzing with it for over 16 hours, I thought I would write this list and see if any one had any thoughts? Thank you in advance, Dan From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 23 04:36:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 23 04:36:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media In-Reply-To: <200303230850.DAA01555@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 16:17:50 -0800 (PST) > From: erik hansen > Subject: Re: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] > > so what does it take to stream your own QT videos > to RR users? if this means desktop broadcasting > from your own digital camera has arrived, then > this is an wondrous new world we live in. ---------- Sure, but you must do it through a server capable of streaming video, and you need streaming software: Ken N. From gary.rathbone at btclick.com Sun Mar 23 06:04:01 2003 From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone) Date: Sun Mar 23 06:04:01 2003 Subject: Filemaker Pro, Web and Rev Message-ID: <000001c2f12b$52d00f10$0e00000a@server> I've been playing with Filemaker and Rev for a project I'm working on. Basically there's an existing Filemaker database and I want Rev to sit on the server and periodically query it. When I type http://127.0.0.1:68/FMPro?-DB=requests.fp5&-Format=qeds/results.htm&Status=C urrent&-Find into my web browser I get exactly the data returned that I would expect. If I use Rev error Previous request not completed From gary.rathbone at btclick.com Sun Mar 23 06:13:02 2003 From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone) Date: Sun Mar 23 06:13:02 2003 Subject: Filemaker Pro, Web and Rev - Correction Message-ID: <000101c2f12c$b0aa21b0$0e00000a@server> Sorry for the incomplete earlier post...Too early in the morning... Anyway... I've been playing with Filemaker and Rev for a project I'm working on. Basically there's an existing Filemaker database and I want Rev to sit on the server and periodically query it. When I type http://127.0.0.1:68/FMPro?-DB=requests.fp5&-Format=qeds/results.htm&Status=C urrent&-Find into my web browser I get exactly the data returned that I would expect. If I use a button in Rev with a script as below... put "http://127.0.0.1:68/FMPro?-DB=requests.fp5&-Format=qeds/results.htm&Status= Current&-Find" into tURL put URL tURL into fld "tout" put the result into tres The first click works (great!), if I click again it produces nothing, if I click again the result is... error Previous request not completed At this stage I can still type the URL into a browser and get the data returned, which leads me to think that its Rev that's 'stalling'. Any pointers would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Gary Rathbone From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk Sun Mar 23 08:14:01 2003 From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg) Date: Sun Mar 23 08:14:01 2003 Subject: Filemaker Pro, Web and Rev - Correction In-Reply-To: <000101c2f12c$b0aa21b0$0e00000a@server> References: <000101c2f12c$b0aa21b0$0e00000a@server> Message-ID: At 11:09 am +0000 23/3/03, Gary Rathbone wrote: >Sorry for the incomplete earlier post...Too early in the morning... >Anyway... > >I've been playing with Filemaker and Rev for a project I'm working on. >Basically there's an existing Filemaker database and I want Rev to sit on >the server and periodically query it. > >When I type > >http://127.0.0.1:68/FMPro?-DB=requests.fp5&-Format=qeds/results.htm&Status=C >urrent&-Find > >into my web browser I get exactly the data returned that I would expect. > >If I use a button in Rev with a script as below... > >put >"http://127.0.0.1:68/FMPro?-DB=requests.fp5&-Format=qeds/results.htm&Status= >Current&-Find" into tURL >put URL tURL into fld "tout" >put the result into tres > >The first click works (great!), if I click again it produces nothing, if I >click again the result is... >error Previous request not completed It's hard to say exactly what is happening. But until the second click produces a result, any subsequent clicks will produce the error you got. With "get url" (or its equivalents), only one url can be requested at a time. How long did you wait after the second click before clicking again? To know if something has gone wrong, you'll have to wait until at least as long as the socketTimeout interval. If you need to prevent users repeatedly clicking a button that gets a url, you should disable it until the current request has completed. If you still think something is wrong (i.e. there is no result however long you wait), make sure you are using the latest version of liburl (currently 1.0.9). It's available at: Cheers Dave From gary.rathbone at btclick.com Sun Mar 23 10:05:01 2003 From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone) Date: Sun Mar 23 10:05:01 2003 Subject: Filemaker Pro, Web and Rev - Correction In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000401c2f14d$06ad6d40$0e00000a@server> >How long did you wait after the second click before clicking again? >To know if something has gone wrong, you'll have to wait until at >least as long as the socketTimeout interval. I've tried different socketTimeout intervals but the results are the same. > If you still think something is wrong (i.e. there is no result > however long you wait), make sure you are using the latest version of > liburl (currently 1.0.9). It's available at: Thanks, I'll check this. Regards Gary Rathbone From MGreenb551 at aol.com Sun Mar 23 10:09:01 2003 From: MGreenb551 at aol.com (MGreenb551 at aol.com) Date: Sun Mar 23 10:09:01 2003 Subject: Image Refs in Distribution Message-ID: <52E33057.479B9C2C.0B440717@aol.com> I need to send a Rev file distribution to a friend who also has RR but on a different platform. (I'm Win, he's Mac.) The stack has 30 rather large images, so I've referenced the image objects to files off-stack. When I burn a CD to send to my friend, the image objects naturally lose track of the files and therefore show nothing. How can I send this stack on CD in a way that my friend can still view the images? Thanks, Mark Greenberg From rcozens at pon.net Sun Mar 23 10:49:01 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Sun Mar 23 10:49:01 2003 Subject: Image Refs in Distribution In-Reply-To: <52E33057.479B9C2C.0B440717@aol.com> References: <52E33057.479B9C2C.0B440717@aol.com> Message-ID: >How can I send this stack on CD in a way that my friend can still >view the images? Hi Mark, Have your stack set the defaultFolder to the pathname to the folder holding your images on the CD in preOpenStack. -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From jiml at netrin.com Sun Mar 23 13:46:01 2003 From: jiml at netrin.com (Jim Lambert) Date: Sun Mar 23 13:46:01 2003 Subject: Filemaker Pro, Web and Rev - Correction In-Reply-To: <200303231701.MAA13206@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Just guessing, perhaps 'unload' the url before subsequent calls. jim lambert From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 23 17:08:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 23 17:08:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media (a little OT) In-Reply-To: <200303221702.MAA21783@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: on 3/23/03 1:41 AM, Ken Norris at pixelbird at interisland.net wrote: > ********** >> Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 16:17:50 -0800 (PST) >> From: erik hansen >> Subject: Re: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] >> >> so what does it take to stream your own QT videos >> to RR users? if this means desktop broadcasting >> from your own digital camera has arrived, then >> this is an wondrous new world we live in. > ---------- > Sure, but you must do it through a server capable of streaming video, and you > need streaming software: > > > ----------- P.S. The technology seems to be getting close to streaming full length, full screen movies and interactive theatrical quality performances online: Note: If it's QT, will Rev have the possibilty of controlling how we deal with the online sessions? Hmmm...... Ken N. From livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk Sun Mar 23 17:51:01 2003 From: livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk (Graham Samuel) Date: Sun Mar 23 17:51:01 2003 Subject: What is the minimal install process? Message-ID: Last July (I'm amazed it was so long ago) I was asking the list about installers for RR standalones, particularly on Windows. At the time, I was interested in the association between documents and the corresponding applications. Ken Ray gave me a very clear explanation. He ended his message with the words: >If an app has *no* documents, you don't need to make any file >associations, and can simply copy the app to the user's hard disk. My publisher has told me that the particular app I'm developing doesn't need any file associations (it has documents, but these are exclusively opened from within the application); so on the face of it I can follow Ken's advice. However there are a couple of other considerations: 1. As I understand it, there are certain conventional places programs are supposed to go (various flavours of 'Applications' folders in MacOS 9 and 10, presumably the 'Programs' folder in all versions of Windows). I can't guarantee that my user is going to follow my written advice and copy the standalone to one of these special destinations - so do I therefore need an installer to make sure the program turns up in the 'right' place? I don't understand the consequences of putting stuff in the 'wrong' place on any platform. 2. I think (not sure) that in recent versions of Windows and in MacOS 10.x, programs go into folders which in normal situations are write-protected. The 'abnormal' situation is brought about by logging on as an administrator. Again, do I need an installer to help with this process, or will my user get a sufficiently clear indication as to what they've done wrong if they try to copy the app into a protected area? I'm also somewhat concerned about the placing of preference and/or license files, but I think I now know how to get over that one. A search through the list archives reveals that installers have been discussed a few times (there is a good deal of useful info in fact), but AFAIK there has not yet been a definitive description of the best way to go about creating an installer, particularly a multi-platform installer. Is anyone on the list publishing programs with any kind of installer who would care to share their techniques with the rest of us? TIA Graham -- ------------------------------------------------------------------- Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK & France From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Sun Mar 23 17:58:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Sun Mar 23 17:58:01 2003 Subject: Substack trouble In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <72A25BB4-5D82-11D7-928D-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Hi Ken, One solution is to put an empty openStack handler in the stack script of all your substacks. That way they trap the message without passing it on to the main stack. An alternative is to have your mainStack openStack handler check for the name of the topStack and only proceed if it is actually the main stack. A third option is to put the openStack handler in the CARD script of the first card of your main stack. That way it is hidden from sub stacks but will still operate correctly for the main stack. Cheers, Sarah On Sunday, March 23, 2003, at 07:19 am, Ken Norris wrote: > Howdy, > > I have a substack "devVK.1" > > When I open it from the msg box like this: > > open stack "devVK.1" > > It tries to run the script of the main stack and, of course, throws an > error > window. > > I looked in the docs and it suggests putting: > > on openStack > exit openStack > end openStack > > ...into the substacks script, but that will prevent the substack's > openStack > handler from running, won't it? > > Also, all the buttons and fieds I created in the substack had lt grey > foregrounds, so you can't reads the names or typed tex. > > I don't understand either of these things. > > TIA, > Ken N. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 23 18:06:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 23 18:06:01 2003 Subject: Autofile snapshots In-Reply-To: <200303230850.DAA01555@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hi list, How do I take snapsots and put them into a file? As it is, it looks like I'd have to import, cut, paste into PhotoShop (or something) to make a JPEG file out of it, for each one. Since I have at least 80 to do, I'd sure like to automate it somehow. Any ideas? TIA, Ken N. From ambassador at fourthworld.com Sun Mar 23 18:11:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Sun Mar 23 18:11:01 2003 Subject: Substack trouble In-Reply-To: <72A25BB4-5D82-11D7-928D-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Message-ID: > When I open it from the msg box like this: > > open stack "devVK.1" > > It tries to run the script of the main stack and, of course, throws an > error window. > > I looked in the docs and it suggests putting: > > on openStack > exit openStack > end openStack > > ...into the substacks script, but that will prevent the substack's > openStack handler from running, won't it? You may be able to handle this well in just one place: If your mainstack has only one card, or if you know it will always open to the first card, you could just move your mainstack's openstack handler to the card of your mainstack. Another option would be to add a condition to you mainstack's openstack handler: on openstack if (the short name of this stack is "mainstackName") then -- do your stuff here else pass openstack end openStack -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From kray at sonsothunder.com Sun Mar 23 18:13:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Sun Mar 23 18:13:01 2003 Subject: What is the minimal install process? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000b01c2f191$47a0aee0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> > 1. As I understand it, there are certain conventional places programs > are supposed to go (various flavours of 'Applications' folders in > MacOS 9 and 10, presumably the 'Programs' folder in all versions of > Windows). I can't guarantee that my user is going to follow my > written advice and copy the standalone to one of these special > destinations - so do I therefore need an installer to make sure the > program turns up in the 'right' place? I don't understand the > consequences of putting stuff in the 'wrong' place on any platform. On Windows, a person can place your .exe file anywhere on the hard disk they have access to. Depending on how permissions may or may not have been set on the PC, the Windows (or WinNT) directory along with the System directory may be read-only (and more paranoid IT admins may lock down other folders as well, but that's the basics). So technically, as long as they can drag and drop your EXE without getting an error... that's a "good" installation. With that in mind, however, the "appropriate" (and I quote that, since your meaning of 'appropriate' may vary ;-) place to put an executable is in a subdirectory of the Program Files folder, named either (a) according to your company, or (b) according to the name of the application. Also, it is normal to add a shortcut to the Start menu. This makes sure the user doesn't have to go digging down several folders to launch your program. For these reasons, it may well be best to pick up a Windows installer program and use it; there are several out there, and even a couple of free (or shareware) ones. Personally, I like Wise Installer, but it's pricey (although you get A LOT of options). Just my $0.02, Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From alrice at ARCplanning.com Sun Mar 23 18:17:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Sun Mar 23 18:17:01 2003 Subject: What is the minimal install process? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1C0B52C4-5D85-11D7-BEB1-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Sunday, March 23, 2003, at 03:48 PM, Graham Samuel wrote: > Is anyone on the list publishing programs with any kind of installer > who would care to share their techniques with the rest of us? For Mac OS <=9. Donnow. MindVision has some nice installer tools. For OS X, I would recommend distribution of a .dmg disk image with an app bundle in it. To perform the installation, the user drags the app bundle to their Applications folder. Because app bundles are self-contained, it's that easy. It makes an actual installer program annoying and unnecessary. I like DropDMG http://www.c-command.com/dropdmg/ but there are some other more expensive tools. Or you can do it from the command line (create the dmg disk image that is) For Windows, I highly recommend Inno Setup: http://www.jrsoftware.org/isinfo.php . It's a great program that does most of the stuff InstallShield does, but at a tiny fraction of the cost. I'm not sure what you mean about Multiplatform Installer. Each OS has different installation requirements so shouldn't you use an installation technique appropriate for that platform? In general you should allow the user to install the software to wherever they want, by overriding the default. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 23 18:22:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 23 18:22:01 2003 Subject: Send an eMail attachment? In-Reply-To: <200303230850.DAA01555@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 11:48:48 -0800 > Subject: Re: Send an eMail attachment? > From: Dan Friedman > > Jack, > > Thanks... But this doesn't solve the problem. *I* want to include the > attachment in the eMail. I know that I could have the user add the > attachment, but since I know what file needs to be sent, I would like to, at > runtime, set that parameter. ---------- URL calls are just that. AFAIK there is no parameter for attachments. Attachments may have differing file extensions for Windows, compression schemes, etc. These aren't intended to be handled by URL "mailto:" parameters, and even if they could, the parameter type names would probably be different from Emailer to Emailer. if you're using a Mac, rather than using the URL, you might have to write an Apple events routine in AppleScript according to the available AS functions in the AS dictionary of your particular Emailer. There may be other solutions. Ken N. From monte at sweattechnologies.com Sun Mar 23 18:26:00 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Sun Mar 23 18:26:00 2003 Subject: Autofile snapshots In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Ken Download Happy Snaps from my website sweattechnologies.com/rev It will do the work for you if you just want a once off otherwise if you want the functionality in your app you can inspect the scripts. Cheers Monte > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Ken Norris > Sent: Monday, 24 March 2003 6:42 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Autofile snapshots > > > Hi list, > > How do I take snapsots and put them into a file? > > As it is, it looks like I'd have to import, cut, paste into PhotoShop (or > something) to make a JPEG file out of it, for each one. > > Since I have at least 80 to do, I'd sure like to automate it somehow. > > Any ideas? > > TIA, > Ken N. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From monte at sweattechnologies.com Sun Mar 23 18:40:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Sun Mar 23 18:40:01 2003 Subject: What is the minimal install process? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > Last July (I'm amazed it was so long ago) I was asking the list about > installers for RR standalones, particularly on Windows. At the time, > I was interested in the association between documents and the > corresponding applications. Ken Ray gave me a very clear explanation. > He ended his message with the words: > > >If an app has *no* documents, you don't need to make any file > >associations, and can simply copy the app to the user's hard disk. > > My publisher has told me that the particular app I'm developing > doesn't need any file associations (it has documents, but these are > exclusively opened from within the application); so on the face of it > I can follow Ken's advice. However there are a couple of other > considerations: > > 1. As I understand it, there are certain conventional places programs > are supposed to go (various flavours of 'Applications' folders in > MacOS 9 and 10, presumably the 'Programs' folder in all versions of > Windows). I can't guarantee that my user is going to follow my > written advice and copy the standalone to one of these special > destinations - so do I therefore need an installer to make sure the > program turns up in the 'right' place? I don't understand the > consequences of putting stuff in the 'wrong' place on any platform. > > 2. I think (not sure) that in recent versions of Windows and in MacOS > 10.x, programs go into folders which in normal situations are > write-protected. The 'abnormal' situation is brought about by logging > on as an administrator. Again, do I need an installer to help with > this process, or will my user get a sufficiently clear indication as > to what they've done wrong if they try to copy the app into a > protected area? It depends what your market is to what the norm may be. If you are marketing to individual/home users you probably won't have any problem with this issue but if you are going to the education market or medium to large business you will run into this. If you are a system administrator at a school the last thing you want is students installing anything they want onto the systems. I work arounding by saving a copy of critical data in the application data folder. Check out Ken's website for more info on Windows folders. > > I'm also somewhat concerned about the placing of preference and/or > license files, but I think I now know how to get over that one. > > A search through the list archives reveals that installers have been > discussed a few times (there is a good deal of useful info in fact), > but AFAIK there has not yet been a definitive description of the best > way to go about creating an installer, particularly a multi-platform > installer. > > Is anyone on the list publishing programs with any kind of installer > who would care to share their techniques with the rest of us? Look at Install Maker from clickteam for a very cheap solution. It's even free if you leave their add in. It also has great compression. Cheers Monte From tnally at aga-engineers.com Sun Mar 23 18:51:02 2003 From: tnally at aga-engineers.com (Tomas Nally, P.E.) Date: Sun Mar 23 18:51:02 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons Message-ID: Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons >> Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:06:57 +0100 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons > From: malte.brill at t-online.de > (Malte Brill) > > Hi List, > > this one goes out to the math experts. > How does one compute the area ( I hope it is the correct Term for > flaecheninhalt in german) of a polygon with n sides. (Oops. I'm late to this discussion because I had problems submitting a plain text email to the list. Hope this one doesn't html-ize itself...) Not a math "expert" here, but finding the areas of irregular polygons was the one of the first things that I did with my very own computer (a Commodore-64) when I bought it in 1985. (Actually, I wasn't finding the area of polygons, per se. I was performing numerical integration to see how close the result would be to the answer when traditional calculus is used. But that operation is almost identical to finding the area of a polygon.) I'm not too much of a Transcripter, so let me give a BASIC version, from which a transcript version could be generated. -- First, make sure that the x- and y-coordinates of the vertices of the polygon -- are stored in an array. Also, the array members should identify -- the points of the polygon as you trace the polygon CLOCKWISE -- around it's perimeter. In BASIC, this is how arrays are -- dimensioned. dim x(100) dim y(100) -- Additionally, each differential element of the polygon will have -- its own differential area, so we need an array for that also. dim trapArea(100) -- Identify the number of nodes of the polygon. (Or, you might -- just as well call them "vertices", or "points".) n = 20 -- Just an example, here. -- Now, going clockwise around the perimeter of the polygon, -- find the area of the virtual trapezoid under each line segment. -- A line segment is defined as the segment connecting -- the ith node and the (i + 1)th node. Do this inside a -- counted loop. In BASIC, a convenient loop for this is -- the For...Next loop. for i = 1 to (n - 1) -- note that I'm stopping at (n - 1) x1 = x(i) y1 = y(i) x2 = x(i + 1) y2 = y(i + 1) trapArea(i) = y1 * (x2 - x1) + (1/2) * (x2 - x1) * (y2 - y1) next i -- This doesn't quite "close the loop" around the perimeter -- of the polygon. In order to close the loop, we need to -- find the area under the line segment between the nth -- node and the very first node. x1 = x(n) y1 = y(n) x2 = x(1) y2 = y(1) trapArea(n) = y1 * (x2 - x1) + (1/2) * (x2 - x1) * (y2 - y1) -- Now, we have to add up all the areas of the elements TotalArea = 0 for i = 1 to n TotalArea = TotalArea + trapArea(i) next i -- When I've discussed this elsewhere, there's usually -- some skepticism about whether it works. The reason -- it works is because when the (i + 1)th node is on the -- right-hand side of the ith node, then trapArea(i) has -- a positive value. However, as you traverse around -- the perimeter of the polygon, when the (i + 1)th node -- is on the left-hand side of the ith node, then the -- value of trapArea(i) is negative. When you add all -- of these positive and negative areas, then the result -- is the area on the interior of the polygon. -- -- To test it, create a circle with points every 15 degrees -- or so. Then find the area using the code above. It'll -- be pretty close to the area found by A = Pi*R^2. Of -- course, the more points you use around the perimeter -- of the circle, the more the area will converge on the -- "exact" value. -- -- What happens if the order of your points traces the -- perimeter of the polygon in a COUNTERCLOCKWISE -- (or anticlockwise) direction? The area computed will -- simply have a negative value. So, it will be correct -- in magnitude, but opposite in sign. I hope the code above works correctly. Sometimes when I write it "on the fly", I miss something. But the principle is correct. Back in November or December, I wrote a series of posts about this same topic in the Liberty BASIC discussion group on Yahoo. The group seemed unconvinced until I produced the demo that calculated the area of a circle to within a few thousandths of a percent of the "exact" area. ---Nally, New Orleans From kray at sonsothunder.com Sun Mar 23 19:44:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Sun Mar 23 19:44:01 2003 Subject: Send an eMail attachment? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <001601c2f19d$f7158f60$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Dan, Take a look at Shao Sean's libSMTP library; it allows for direct SMTP communications, attachments and more. Go to: http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm and go to the bottom of the Downloads section. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Ken Norris > Sent: Sunday, March 23, 2003 2:28 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: Send an eMail attachment? > > > ********** > > Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 11:48:48 -0800 > > Subject: Re: Send an eMail attachment? > > From: Dan Friedman > > > > Jack, > > > > Thanks... But this doesn't solve the problem. *I* want to > include the > > attachment in the eMail. I know that I could have the user add the > > attachment, but since I know what file needs to be sent, I > would like > > to, at runtime, set that parameter. > ---------- > URL calls are just that. AFAIK there is no parameter for > attachments. Attachments may have differing file extensions > for Windows, compression schemes, etc. These aren't intended > to be handled by URL "mailto:" parameters, and even if they > could, the parameter type names would probably be different > from Emailer to Emailer. > > if you're using a Mac, rather than using the URL, you might > have to write an Apple events routine in AppleScript > according to the available AS functions in the AS dictionary > of your particular Emailer. > > There may be other solutions. > > Ken N. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From chipp at chipp.com Sun Mar 23 19:52:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Sun Mar 23 19:52:01 2003 Subject: DLLs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dan, My guess is you have a path problem. In RR from the msg do: put the externals of this stack to tell you what your stack currently 'thinks' is the path to the dll. If there is any path info other than the name, then it probably won't work. I always set the externals of this stack to "fred.dll" and keep a copy of the fred.dll in the same place as the RunRev application. Then when building a standalone, copy the fred.dll to the same folder as where the standalone runs from. Remember, you can't execute a: set the externals of this stack to "fred.dll" on startup from a runtime. In order for DLL's to work, the external property must be saved with the stack, then launched anew. Hope this helps. Chipp > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Dan Friedman > Sent: Sunday, March 23, 2003 2:59 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: DLLs > > > Hello, > > Can anyone see what I'm doing wrong... > > I have a dll that I want to call. The script that communicates > with the DLL > is the main stack. I have set the destroyWindow of the stack to > true and I > have set the externals of the stack to "myDLL.dll" (I can't use a > hard coded > path because I don't know where the user will install this app). I have > closed and reopened the stack as advised in the "destroyWindow" > entry in the > Transcript Dictionary. Just before I reopen the stack, I set the > defaultFolder to the standalone's path so it will find "myDLL.dll". > > When running in RR, it works fine. However, in a standalone it fails. > > After futzing with it for over 16 hours, I thought I would write this list > and see if any one had any thoughts? > > Thank you in advance, > Dan > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From chipp at chipp.com Sun Mar 23 20:00:00 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Sun Mar 23 20:00:00 2003 Subject: Autofile snapshots In-Reply-To: Message-ID: look at the import snapshot command > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Ken Norris > Sent: Sunday, March 23, 2003 2:12 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Autofile snapshots > > > Hi list, > > How do I take snapsots and put them into a file? > > As it is, it looks like I'd have to import, cut, paste into PhotoShop (or > something) to make a JPEG file out of it, for each one. > > Since I have at least 80 to do, I'd sure like to automate it somehow. > > Any ideas? > > TIA, > Ken N. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From capellan2000 at yahoo.com Sun Mar 23 23:04:01 2003 From: capellan2000 at yahoo.com (Alejandro Tejada) Date: Sun Mar 23 23:04:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303232352.SAA20003@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <20030324040017.614.qmail@web40505.mail.yahoo.com> on Sun, 23 Mar 2003 17:47:10 -0600 "Tomas Nally, P.E." wrote > I'm not too much of a Transcripter, so let me give a > BASIC version, > from which a transcript version could be generated. Geoff Canyon wrote an article comparing RealBasic and RunRev. Maybe him will translate this for us. This is a reminder for me, that I must learn to read another languages. I've already started with Lingo and ActionScript, but must continue with others... Code stays, Development enviroment changes. Alejandro ===== Useful sites: http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/metacard/tips/ and /revolution/tips/ http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/metacard/ and /use-revolution/ http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 23 23:32:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 23 23:32:01 2003 Subject: More snapshot stuff In-Reply-To: <200303232352.SAA19984@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Howdy, I expected the following script to show me an new image of the button (in the 'down' state), but nothing happened. on mouseDown rectSet -- This handler sets the group's rect to the rect of the button show group "kybdDN" import snapshot from the rect of me end mouseDown ...Why not? I tried a number of variations with no success. Ken N. From capellan2000 at yahoo.com Mon Mar 24 00:12:01 2003 From: capellan2000 at yahoo.com (Alejandro Tejada) Date: Mon Mar 24 00:12:01 2003 Subject: Converting Regular graphics in Polygon graphics In-Reply-To: <200303232352.SAA20003@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <20030324050803.64332.qmail@web40502.mail.yahoo.com> Hi fellow list members, I was working in the code to convert regular graphics in polygon graphics. You can see the results in the following file: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/metacard/files/export_regular_polygons.zip You need to have a Yahoo account to download from this group, so a Temporal File area will be a nice addition to this list, too. When you open the file you will notice that there is a big regular graphics in the center of the stack. A smaller graphic is at the left. You change the number of sides using the blue popUp button at the right. The slider lets you change the angle of the graphic. Additionally, when you change the angle, a mouseUp msg is sent to the center regular graphic and an outlined black line polygon graphic is draw around this graphic. As the outline of both graphics are not the same colors, you will notice the slightest differences between both. Although, is almost exact for some angles and some sides, you'll notice when not. But the real problem is the small regular graphic. This graphic was scaled so the polygon that draws around it has to rescale itself and this is were the problems begun. A regular graphic is draw inside a circle, so his rect includes the circle that surround it. When I set the rect of the Polygon graphic to the rect of the regular graphic, the result is a graphic identically proportional but always bigger. The question is: How can I rescale the polygon graphic to fit exactly over the NON proportional scaled regular graphic? In a first attempt, I made a code to fit the Polygon over a regular graphic of 6 sides. It works well for some angles, but not for others. I have not included this code in this file, but if you want to give it a try, I'll send you or post in the list. In my limited math knowledge, a code that works in every situation (all angles for all number of sides) must require to know "exactly" where the vertex fall in the area of the regular graphic. Only in certain angles the vertex of some graphics touch the edges of the rectangle. This is the ideal situation. Any help in this area is welcome, Thanks in advance. Alejandro ===== Useful sites: http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/metacard/tips/ and /revolution/tips/ http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/metacard/ and /use-revolution/ http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk Mon Mar 24 02:53:01 2003 From: livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk (Graham Samuel) Date: Mon Mar 24 02:53:01 2003 Subject: What is the minimal install process? Message-ID: Thanks to all who replied on this (Ken, Alex, Monte). I think I'm being told that a 3rd party installer is best, certainly for Windows, and maybe for Mac. A few comments: On Sun, 23 Mar 2003 16:13:51 -0700, Alex Rice wrote: >[helpful info, for which thanks, then...] >I'm not sure what you mean about Multiplatform Installer. Each OS has >different installation requirements so shouldn't you use an >installation technique appropriate for that platform? I was imagining putting the app on a single ISO 9660 CD, and then letting the user take things from there depending on what he sees on the desktop (essentially one of 2 standalones, each with a different engine). So really there will be at least two installers, I admit (3 if Unix is to be used, but not in my case). I guess I was muddling the install process itself (which must always be platform dependent) and the actions of the app, which I want to consist of a single code base which just finds out at runtime which platform it's on. If one can eliminate any external installer (I now think one can't), then in that sense the app and its install process would both be multiplatform. I expressed myself badly. On Mon, 24 Mar 2003 10:06:53 +1030, "Monte Goulding" wrote: > >It depends what your market is to what the norm may be. If you are marketing >to individual/home users you probably won't have any problem with this issue >but if you are going to the education market or medium to large business you >will run into this. If you are a system administrator at a school the last >thing you want is students installing anything they want onto the systems. Yup, that's my market, more or less. The kids in this case are pretty young, but experience suggests that they will be frighteningly computer-competent. All in all, I think I just have to accept that after the wonderfully smooth process of creating a standalone from within RR, the development brakes then get jammed on while the developer struggles with setting up the installation process. C'est la vie. Thanks again. Graham -- ------------------------------------------------------------------- Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK & France From malte.brill at t-online.de Mon Mar 24 03:54:01 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Mon Mar 24 03:54:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303180659.BAA21425@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Jim wrote: >I'm happy and surprised this works for you. I have modified it so >that it works for polygons of arbitrary number of sides and re-posted >it at >http://home.infostations.net/jhurley/ >under the title: Colliding polygonsRevised.rev >Let me know if this works for you. >You can speed up or slow the motion of the polygon by changing the >values of vx and vy. >Jim Thanks a lot for sharing this. :-) It works pretty well. I hope I can get a in depth look at it next week. (Still have to finish my current Project and only three days left...) Regards, Malte From malte.brill at t-online.de Mon Mar 24 04:06:01 2003 From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill) Date: Mon Mar 24 04:06:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1212 - 14 msgs In-Reply-To: <200303180659.BAA21425@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: So I was doing something wrong, when preparing my media. Richard Gaskin wrote: >Showing a stram is very different from originating one. >You can start here: > Thanks Richard. So now I urgently need to look for an ISP that supports QT-streaming in Germany. Mine doesn?t... :-( Does anybody happen to know some URLs to different streams for testing purposes? I wanted to try some of the different radio streams available in Itunes, but that didn?t work (even though I think I didn?t get the correct URLs.) Thanks a lot, Malte From peter.fink at tiscali.ch Mon Mar 24 04:36:01 2003 From: peter.fink at tiscali.ch (Peter Fink) Date: Mon Mar 24 04:36:01 2003 Subject: runrev 20 alpha4 state Message-ID: <000801c2f04f$782d1be0$020ca8c0@ego> I did not follow the RR discussion for a while. I'd like to ask someone from the community the following. (1) Is RR 2.0alpha4, that is 2.0B0.97, stable enough, from the experience? (1a) at least as stable as 1.1.1r2 -- which is stable? (2) what does it mean: field palette, and other palettes are not available? The field inspector is there. (2a) the color properties are more hard to access than before. (3) where is documentation about version 2.0? At least some deltas would be needed by me. thanks for an answer. peter.fink at tiscali.ch From swedentom at telia.com Mon Mar 24 04:36:22 2003 From: swedentom at telia.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Tomas_Franz=E9n?=) Date: Mon Mar 24 04:36:22 2003 Subject: Open process Message-ID: Hey, This is my script: on mouseup open process "/bin/date" end mouseup Why do I get error -50 as the result? Tomas Franz?n Lighthead Software http://www.lightheadsw.com/ From rgriffit at ctc.net Mon Mar 24 04:36:36 2003 From: rgriffit at ctc.net (Raymond E. Griffith) Date: Mon Mar 24 04:36:36 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 3/21/03 9:46 PM, Jim Hurley at jhurley at infostations.com wrote: >> Jim Hurley wrote: >> on mouseUp >> put field 1 into tList >> put 0 into area >> put line 1 of tList into pOld >> repeat with i = 1 to the number of lines in tList >> put line i of tList into pNew >> add thisToArea(pNew,pOld) to area >> put pNew into pOld >> end repeat >> put area >> end mouseUp >> >> function thisToArea ptNew,ptOld >> put item 1 of ptNew into xNew >> put item 2 of ptNew into yNew >> put item 1 of ptOld into xOld >> put item 2 of ptOld into yOld >> return -(xNew - xOld)*(yNew + yOld)/2 >> end thisToArea >> >> >>> put line 1 of tList into pOld >> > > Dar Scott wrote: > >> Should this be -1 to get the last edge? >> > > > Dar, > > Actually it contributes nothing to the area since the first term in > the sum is the area under the line joining the first point with > itself; not very smart but, no harm, no foul. It would have been > more sensible if I had started the sum with i = 2. > > Since the last point in the list is identical to the first point (it > is a *closed* polygon), the last edge is included by performing the > repeat up to the number of lines (points in the polygon) in tList. > > But a cleaner (and faster) version might be: > > on mouseUp > put field 1 into tList > put 0 into area > put line 1 of tList into pOld > repeat for each line tLine in tList > add thisToArea(tLine,pOld) to tArea > put tLine into pOld > end repeat > put tArea > end mouseUp > > But you still get no contribution from the first repeat, but what is > 0 among friends. > > Regards, > Not quite: you are repeating the first line, but that does not mean that you are closing the loop. Now if you have a filled polygon, the first line and the last line in the points are the same, so you have no problem. OTOH, if you don't have a filled polygon or are simply submitting a set of points, you should do this: put line -1 of tList into pOld This will close the loop, and it is unlikely (though possible) that the contribution will be equal to 0. But the loop *must* be closed. If it is not closed you will likely get the wrong area. Cheers! Raymond From kray at sonsothunder.com Mon Mar 24 10:04:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Mon Mar 24 10:04:01 2003 Subject: Open process In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <005701c2f216$271ab820$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Tomas, If this is on Windows, you need to provide the extension (like "date.exe"). Also, don't forget that the path used by open process is relative to where "the directory" is. What platform are you running this on? Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > Tomas Franz?n > Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2003 9:06 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Open process > > > Hey, > This is my script: > > on mouseup > open process "/bin/date" > end mouseup > > Why do I get error -50 as the result? > > > Tomas Franz?n > Lighthead Software > http://www.lightheadsw.com/ > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From swedentom2 at telia.com Mon Mar 24 11:14:00 2003 From: swedentom2 at telia.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Tomas_Franz=E9n?=) Date: Mon Mar 24 11:14:00 2003 Subject: Open process Message-ID: <42A6068F-5E13-11D7-B797-0003937359B8@telia.com> On m?ndag, mar 24, 2003, at 16:00 Europe/Stockholm, Ken Ray wrote: > What platform are you running this on? Mac OS X. Tomas Franz?n Lighthead Software http://www.lightheadsw.com From alrice at ARCplanning.com Mon Mar 24 11:44:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Mon Mar 24 11:44:01 2003 Subject: runrev 20 alpha4 state In-Reply-To: <000801c2f04f$782d1be0$020ca8c0@ego> Message-ID: <53C11038-5E17-11D7-8E65-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Saturday, March 22, 2003, at 01:45 AM, Peter Fink wrote: > I did not follow the RR discussion for a while. I'd like to ask > someone from > the community the following. > Peter, I've used the pre-beta 4 a little bit so maybe I can answer these questions. > (1) Is RR 2.0alpha4, that is 2.0B0.97, stable enough, from the > experience? > (1a) at least as stable as 1.1.1r2 -- which is stable? Stable enough for what? It probably won't be as stable as 1.1.1 until 2.0 final release. It's stable enough to see the new features, kick the tires, do some testing, etc. But I'm still using 1.1.1 for my day to day work. > (2) what does it mean: field palette, and other palettes are not > available? > The field inspector is there. I think in 2.0 pre-beta 4, all of the palettes are there. The properties inspector is just different than in 1.1.1 so you might have to look around. e.g. the Colors and Patterns tools are now in the properties inspector instead of a floating palette. > (2a) the color properties are more hard to access than before. The toolbar is simplified and cleaned up. It might take a little getting used to. > (3) where is documentation about version 2.0? At least some deltas > would be > needed by me. See What's New.txt in the 2.0 distribution. Also the embedded "Revolution Documentation" has been updated comprehensively. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From ambassador at fourthworld.com Mon Mar 24 12:15:00 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Mon Mar 24 12:15:00 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1212 - 14 msgs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Malte Brill wrote: > > Does anybody happen to know some URLs to different streams for testing > purposes? I wanted to try some of the different radio streams available in > Itunes, but that didn?t work (even though I think I didn?t get the correct > URLs.) I got this NP stream from the QT site: Here's how: 1. Play a stream in Apple's QT Player 2. File->Export, using the option to export to a QT Media Link 3. Open the link file in any text editor -- it's a very simple XML file: -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From jhurley at infostations.com Mon Mar 24 12:40:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Mon Mar 24 12:40:01 2003 Subject: Math question: How to compute the area of polygons In-Reply-To: <200303241615.LAA31308@www.runrev.com> References: <200303241615.LAA31308@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > > >> Jim Hurley wrote: >(snip) > > But you still get no contribution from the first repeat, but what is >> 0 among friends. >> >> Regards, >> >Raymond wrote: >Not quite: you are repeating the first line, but that does not mean that you >are closing the loop. > >Now if you have a filled polygon, the first line and the last line in the >points are the same, so you have no problem. OTOH, if you don't have a >filled polygon or are simply submitting a set of points, you should do this: > >put line -1 of tList into pOld > >This will close the loop, and it is unlikely (though possible) that the >contribution will be equal to 0. > >But the loop *must* be closed. If it is not closed you will likely get the >wrong area. > >Cheers! > >Raymond > Raymond, I try to keep my power dry and my polygons closed. I created them using the polygon tool and then reshaping them using the reshaping tool. That tool forces the polygon (actually the open connected line segments) to close, that is, to add an extra line at the end of the points which is identical to the first line. This assures the accuracy of the area algorithm. BTW: The filled property does not assure that the polygon is closed. The default mode of the polygon tool is to create a filled polygon. You can assign a background color and the open polygon fills with the color. The best way to check the "closedness" is to check the the points in the graphics tab on the properties pallet. This is all very confusing and mostly a matter of semantics. It is awkward to speak of *open* polygons to begin with. A polygon is by definition a closed plane figure bounded by straight lines. What MC and RR mean when they speak of a polygon is actually a "sequence of connected straight line segments." There is no simple mathematical term for this and so this is just another necessary compromise of the scripting language. But you are right, if the first and last lines in the graphics points are not the same you need to deal with this in the area algorithm. Best regard, Jim From dan at clearvisiontech.com Mon Mar 24 12:44:00 2003 From: dan at clearvisiontech.com (Dan Friedman) Date: Mon Mar 24 12:44:00 2003 Subject: Send an eMail attachment? In-Reply-To: <200303241615.LAA31308@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Ken, I found Shao Sean's libSMTP library on the user contributions list... This is what I'm looking for! My only problem is that it takes 28 seconds to send an eMail with a 5307 byte text file attachment. From Outlook (with the same attachment and message), it took about 2 seconds. I wrote an eMail to Shao to see if I am doing something wrong. I'm waiting for his reply. Thank you for the suggestion/reply. This list is a great place to get help. I would like to post more responses to those who need help (when I know the answer), but the "pros" on this list are so on top of it, that by the time I read it, someone has already answered! :) Thanks again, Dan > Take a look at Shao Sean's libSMTP library; it allows for direct SMTP > communications, attachments and more. Go to: > http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm and go to > the bottom of the Downloads section. From dan at clearvisiontech.com Mon Mar 24 12:47:00 2003 From: dan at clearvisiontech.com (Dan Friedman) Date: Mon Mar 24 12:47:00 2003 Subject: DLLs In-Reply-To: <200303241615.LAA31308@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Chipp, I checked the externals of the stack and it looks fine. When I save and rerun it, it works fine. Even in a standalone. However, if I move the standalone to another directory, it fails -- even though I am setting the externals to the correct path, then closing and reopening the stack. What I did was create an "engine" stack that opens the stack file of my project. When I did that, everything started to work! (No code was changed in the project stack) It would seem to me that RR doesn't want you to change the externals of a stack in a standalone (at lease the main stack). I could be out to lunch, but at lease it's working now. Thank you for the suggestion/reply. Dan > Dan, > > My guess is you have a path problem. In RR from the msg do: > > put the externals of this stack > > to tell you what your stack currently 'thinks' is the path to the dll. > > If there is any path info other than the name, then it probably won't work. > I always > > set the externals of this stack to "fred.dll" > > and keep a copy of the fred.dll in the same place as the RunRev application. > Then when building a standalone, copy the fred.dll to the same folder as > where the standalone runs from. Remember, you can't execute a: > > set the externals of this stack to "fred.dll" > > on startup from a runtime. In order for DLL's to work, the external property > must be saved with the stack, then launched anew. > > Hope this helps. > > Chipp From dsc at swcp.com Mon Mar 24 13:31:01 2003 From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott) Date: Mon Mar 24 13:31:01 2003 Subject: motion fusion Message-ID: <63013BCD-5E26-11D7-9FA2-000A9567A3E6@swcp.com> I have a vague memory of someone mentioning use of Revolution in motion fusion experiments or something similar. But, I can't find the mail. Clue? Dar Scott From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 24 13:47:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 24 13:47:01 2003 Subject: Autofile snapshots In-Reply-To: <200303241615.LAA31283@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: "Chipp Walters" > Subject: RE: Autofile snapshots > Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2003 18:57:02 -0600 > > look at the import snapshot command ----------- Yes, that's what I said: ---------- > >> -----Original Message----- >> Sent: Sunday, March 23, 2003 2:12 PM >> Subject: Autofile snapshots >> >> As it is, it looks like I'd have to import, ---------- ...See? Although I didn't mention it, this means I already know about the [import snapshot] command. I'm OK so far, right? What I want to do: I will have a number of different screens available for the same buttons, i.e., create a different look and feel for each. The need for doing this has to do with varying visual deficits of potential users, and is therefore more important than mere "Preference'. I have a background group image which has 'pictures' of buttons in it. The actual buttons are exactly aligned (I call it 'registered') to each of the appropriate areas of the picture. A bunch of the buttons have different functions which mean they must hold icon images separately in these cases, so I decided I may as well make separate icons out of _all_ the buttons. The end-use is to eliminate the large background group image it came from, and replace it by batch-importing the small mages into a standalone to use as icons at runtime, meaning they don't get saved by the standalone, but are called up at runtime by the Preferences, which can be changed at any time. All that means making separate images out of each little 'button picture' of the large image. There will be about 80 of them. The problems are: 1) I have to continue the process in order to make them into separate image files something like this: ---------- >> cut, paste into PhotoShop (or >> something) to make a JPEG file out of it, for each one. ---------- Each image is captured thus from a _section_ of a large background group, image which is actually the rect of each button, then converted. This means I have to change each image thus created into a JPEG image and then put it into a file folder for use as icons, then delete each created image from the stack I used to capture it, because I don't want it saved there. NOTE: Of course, the standalone is not ready for build yet, so I need to keep saving it until it is. There is no sense in keeping the separate icon images there, because it will disturb the process (naming, etc.) I want to test for the standalone operations. ...and ---------- >> Since I have at least 80 to do, I'd sure like to automate it somehow. ---------- 2) Develop a process to help automate it. It would be OK to make a handler that does it when I click the button that now shows the appropriate section of the background image while its down. Hopefully I can somehow use "import snapshot" to do this. So far the "import snapshot" command (which I also posted in another message) looks like this: on mouseDown rectSet -- This handler sets the group's rect to the rect of the button show group "kybdDN" import snapshot from the rect of me -- Is supposed to take a picture of the button in it's 'down' state to use -- as an icon later when he whole process is done. end mouseDown But, it is taking pictures of the stack window, not the button rect, but I haven't found a cure for it so far (I have been trying variations with no success). I'm stuck here right now. Ken N. From RGould8 at aol.com Mon Mar 24 14:36:01 2003 From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com) Date: Mon Mar 24 14:36:01 2003 Subject: Way to set default homepage in Rev? Message-ID: <15f.1dd5f8a2.2bb0b762@aol.com> Can anyone tell me if it's possible to use Revolution to set the user's default homepage in Internet Explorer? (Perhaps there's an AppleScript method that can be called)? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kray at sonsothunder.com Mon Mar 24 14:51:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Mon Mar 24 14:51:01 2003 Subject: Send an eMail attachment? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <007801c2f23e$23a70e00$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Glad I could help, Dan. Please be so kind as to report to the list what Shao said; it would be good for anyone/everyone who is using libSMTP to know the answer to your question... Thanks! Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > Dan Friedman > Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 11:54 AM > To: RunRev Mail List > Subject: RE: Send an eMail attachment? > > > Ken, > > I found Shao Sean's libSMTP library on the user contributions > list... This is what I'm looking for! My only problem is > that it takes 28 seconds to send an eMail with a 5307 byte > text file attachment. From Outlook (with the same attachment > and message), it took about 2 seconds. > > I wrote an eMail to Shao to see if I am doing something > wrong. I'm waiting for his reply. > > Thank you for the suggestion/reply. This list is a great > place to get help. I would like to post more responses to > those who need help (when I know the answer), but the "pros" > on this list are so on top of it, that by the time I read it, > someone has already answered! :) > > Thanks again, > Dan > > > > Take a look at Shao Sean's libSMTP library; it allows for > direct SMTP > > communications, attachments and more. Go to: > > > http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/> revolution.htm > and go to > > the bottom of the Downloads > section. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From bvg at mac.com Mon Mar 24 14:56:01 2003 From: bvg at mac.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?=) Date: Mon Mar 24 14:56:01 2003 Subject: Autofile snapshots In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2049E86E-5E32-11D7-AAFE-003065AD94A4@mac.com> > on mouseDown > rectSet -- This handler sets the group's rect to the rect of the > button > show group "kybdDN" > import snapshot from the rect of me > -- Is supposed to take a picture of the button in it's 'down' state > to use > -- as an icon later when he whole process is done. > end mouseDown I tested your script and the problem is that you did not read the manual ;-) here is a script that works, inclusive exporting and deleting: on mouseDown hide me -- So the button will not cover the group rectSet show group "kybdDN" set the name of the templateImage to "exportMe" -- Needed to export it later import snapshot from rect ( the rect of me ) of window (the windowID of this stack) --you must specify a window, or the screen will be used --Also note differences in syntax to your code export image "exportMe" to file "exported.jpg" as JPEG --Exports as jpg into the defautlFolder, beware of Apple resources! delete image "exportMe" show me --Clean up end mouseDown From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 24 15:01:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 24 15:01:01 2003 Subject: Image Refs in Distribution In-Reply-To: <200303231701.MAA13166@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: MGreenb551 at aol.com > Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2003 10:05:35 -0500 > Subject: Image Refs in Distribution > > I need to send a Rev file distribution to a friend who also has RR but on a > different platform. ---------- I assume you mean you have made it into a Mac standalone...true? ---------- > (I'm Win, he's Mac.) The stack has 30 rather large > images, so I've referenced the image objects to files off-stack. When I burn > a CD to send to my friend, the image objects naturally lose track of the files > and therefore show nothing. How can I send this stack on CD in a way that my > friend can still view the images? > > Thanks, Mark Greenberg ---------- OK, assuming the thing is a Mac standalone: Referenced images always look at the filepath contained in the filename as it appears in the "filename" property of the images. For example, if your standalone and images are now in the Rev folder, the full filename of an image includes the Rev folder in its path. What it means: Don't burn the app file and all image files separately onto the CD. 1) Put the app and all the images into a folder and test it to see if it still works. If it doesn't you need to get out your original development stack, put it in the folder, and re-reference your images. You can check the path with the "filename" property of the images. 2) Once you get it working, re-build your Win distribution standalone and test it. Then rebuild your Mac standalone. 3) Once you as sure as you can be that the standalone is working from the images in the same folder, make copies as necessary, then burn the _folder_ with the app and all the image files inside it, to the CD. NOTE: If your software doesn't allow that, then create an empty folder with the same name on the CD and drag the app and images into it, which should burn them into the folder on the CD. It's critical that the folder on the CD has the same name as the original. There are other methods of calling images from external files into stacks using the URL which I've learned lately, but try the above first. HTH, Ken N. From don-pederson at utk.edu Mon Mar 24 15:24:01 2003 From: don-pederson at utk.edu (Don Pederson) Date: Mon Mar 24 15:24:01 2003 Subject: What is needed to use mySQL on Mac OS9 and OSX Message-ID: Cannot connect to my existing mySQL databases. They do work with Flash and Realbasic, but I have not been able to connect to them with Revolution 1.1.1. What is required? The download site for drivers listed in the Revolution documentation does not get found by the url given. Any help would be greatly appreciated. -- Dr. Donald Pederson School of Music University of Tennessee 1741 Volunteer Blvd. Knoxville, TN 37996 don-pederson at utk.edu (865) 974-7550 From chipp at chipp.com Mon Mar 24 15:49:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Mon Mar 24 15:49:01 2003 Subject: DLLs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dan, You can't save the externals in a standalone, because you can't *write* to a standalone. You must set the externals *before* you build the standalone. best, Chipp > When I save and > rerun it, it works fine. Even in a standalone. However, if I move the > standalone to another directory, it fails -- even though I am setting the > externals to the correct path, then closing and reopening the stack. > > What I did was create an "engine" stack that opens the stack file of my > project. When I did that, everything started to work! (No code > was changed > in the project stack) It would seem to me that RR doesn't want > you to change > the externals of a stack in a standalone (at lease the main > stack). I could > be out to lunch, but at lease it's working now. > > Thank you for the suggestion/reply. > Dan > > From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 24 16:28:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 24 16:28:01 2003 Subject: Send an eMail attachment? In-Reply-To: <200303241615.LAA31283@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: "Ken Ray" > Subject: RE: Send an eMail attachment? > Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2003 18:40:27 -0600 > Organization: Sons of Thunder Software > > Dan, > > Take a look at Shao Sean's libSMTP library; it allows for direct SMTP > communications, attachments and more. Go to: > http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm and go to > the bottom of the Downloads section. ---------- Wow! Wonderful... Shao is some kinda genius. I see that the main engine of his app uses the "socket" commands, which are really foreign ground to me. The Dictionary isn't enough and I can't find any tutorials on the subject. Where can I read about what actually happens with these commands? It would seem that you could build a small browser with them as well. A limited browser and emailer would be welcome additions to the adaptive software I'm building. I haven't been this excited in months!! All the best :+) Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 24 16:33:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 24 16:33:00 2003 Subject: Send an eMail attachment? In-Reply-To: <200303241615.LAA31283@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: *********** > From: "Ken Ray" > Subject: RE: Send an eMail attachment? > Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2003 18:40:27 -0600 > Organization: Sons of Thunder Software > > Dan, > > Take a look at Shao Sean's libSMTP library; it allows for direct SMTP > communications, attachments and more. Go to: > http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm and go to > the bottom of the Downloads section. ---------- P.S. Now all we need is one that can RECEIVE email. If I could find tutorials on handling Rev's socket functions, it seems possible. Ken N. From miscdas at boxfrog.com Mon Mar 24 16:51:01 2003 From: miscdas at boxfrog.com (miscdas at boxfrog.com) Date: Mon Mar 24 16:51:01 2003 Subject: Autofile snapshots In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20030324214859.76066.qmail@www.boxfrog.com> Ken Norris writes: [snip] > What I want to do: > > I will have a number of different screens available for the same buttons, > i.e., create a different look and feel for each. The need for doing this has > to do with varying visual deficits of potential users, and is therefore more > important than mere "Preference'. > > I have a background group image which has 'pictures' of buttons in it. The > actual buttons are exactly aligned (I call it 'registered') to each of the > appropriate areas of the picture. A bunch of the buttons have different > functions which mean they must hold icon images separately in these cases, > so I decided I may as well make separate icons out of _all_ the buttons. > > The end-use is to eliminate the large background group image it came from, > and replace it by batch-importing the small mages into a standalone to use > as icons at runtime, meaning they don't get saved by the standalone, but are > called up at runtime by the Preferences, which can be changed at any time. > > All that means making separate images out of each little 'button picture' of > the large image. There will be about 80 of them. > > Ken N. > ============ Mr. Norris, Just how "large" is the "large background group image"? If it really isn't so large, consider leaving it in your stack and generating on-the-fly, via import snapshot, from it the images needed for the buttons. Whether you generate on-the-fly or do the separate images, the following might help you to determine the rectangle to use for generating the image with import snapshot. If you originally set up the buttons on the background image using a) a regular grid spacing and b) buttons of the same size, then after you determine the rectangle of the first button you can easily add the appropriate offset to determine the rectangle for all other button images. If you must go through them manually, then create a field and put this in the stack script of the stack with the background image from which you need to import snapshots: on mouseDown put the clickLoc & return after field "ImageRects" end mouseDown Now you can get the rect for each button immage you need by clicking the upper left corner of the area on the background image followed by clicking the lower right corner. When you do import snapshot using these rect data and see your selection is off a few pixels, you have the data to tweak. miscdas From monte at sweattechnologies.com Mon Mar 24 16:57:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Mon Mar 24 16:57:01 2003 Subject: Way to set default homepage in Rev? In-Reply-To: <15f.1dd5f8a2.2bb0b762@aol.com> Message-ID: Hi Please post to the list in plain text format. Can anyone tell me if it's possible to use Revolution to set the user's default homepage in Internet Explorer? (Perhaps there's an AppleScript method that can be called)? You should only do this with the users consent but the simplest thing to do would be write out a local html file with the javascript to do it then launch the file. I think you can find the javascript on a number of public sites. Also to anyone else that wants to integrate with payment processing from their apps a simple solution is to do wrote out a html file with
... Interestingly this is how MSN Messenger integrates with hotmail accounts. Cheers Monte From devin_asay at byu.edu Mon Mar 24 17:15:01 2003 From: devin_asay at byu.edu (Devin Asay) Date: Mon Mar 24 17:15:01 2003 Subject: Accessing remote MySQL database In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <83E2947E-5E44-11D7-9F8B-0030654E23A2@byu.edu> I have been through the Rev documentation and the mail list archives, but can't find an answer to this one. I want to access a MySQL database on my OS X server through Revolution. I try the revdb_connect() function, passing the server name, the database name, the user name and password as parameters. But I get back an error message that says "Access denied for user '' (Using password:YES)". Am I doing this right? Can I access a remote MySQL database in this way? The documentation is not specific on this matter. Neither are the archives. Thanks. Devin Asay From raney at metacard.com Mon Mar 24 17:24:01 2003 From: raney at metacard.com (Scott Raney) Date: Mon Mar 24 17:24:01 2003 Subject: Open process In-Reply-To: <200303241615.LAA31308@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 22 Mar 2003 wrote: > Hey, > This is my script: > > on mouseup > open process "/bin/date" > end mouseup > > Why do I get error -50 as the result? Because you can't start up UNIX processes with "launch" or "open process" on Mac OS X, you can only use them with shell(). Which as it turns out is the only thing that would make any sense with simple programs like "/bin/date" anyway because that program doesn't support stdio. We may eventually need to add an option to "open process" on OS X to allow this, but for now it's one of those messy areas that's still stuck in the "MacOS compatibility" box. Regards, Scott > Tomas Franz?n > Lighthead Software > http://www.lightheadsw.com/ ******************************************************** Scott Raney raney at metacard.com http://www.metacard.com MetaCard: You know, there's an easier way to do that... From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Mon Mar 24 18:36:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Mon Mar 24 18:36:01 2003 Subject: Send an eMail attachment? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: If you check the section of Shao's script where he actually sends data to the socket, you'll see that he sends each line individually. If you change this so that the entire file is sent in one hit, you will find a massive increase in speed. Sarah On Tuesday, March 25, 2003, at 03:46 am, Dan Friedman wrote: > Ken, > > I found Shao Sean's libSMTP library on the user contributions list... > This > is what I'm looking for! My only problem is that it takes 28 seconds > to > send an eMail with a 5307 byte text file attachment. From Outlook > (with the > same attachment and message), it took about 2 seconds. > > I wrote an eMail to Shao to see if I am doing something wrong. I'm > waiting > for his reply. > > Thank you for the suggestion/reply. This list is a great place to get > help. > I would like to post more responses to those who need help (when I > know the > answer), but the "pros" on this list are so on top of it, that by the > time I > read it, someone has already answered! :) > > Thanks again, > Dan > > >> Take a look at Shao Sean's libSMTP library; it allows for direct SMTP >> communications, attachments and more. Go to: >> http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm and go to >> the bottom of the Downloads section. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Mon Mar 24 18:40:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Mon Mar 24 18:40:01 2003 Subject: Send an eMail attachment? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <6A1D3817-5E51-11D7-928D-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> I have written an emailer program and in helping someone else recently, I gathered together the scripts to make a demo stack to connect to a POP server and receive mail. It isn't very tidy so I haven't put it on my web page yet, but if anyone wants a pre-release copy, email me off-list. As for dealing with sockets, you need to check the relevant RFCs for whatever protocol you plan to use. Once you open a socket to the correct IP address and port number, you can just send and receive data to and from that socket. Reading the RFCs will give you the syntax you need to send and the details of what comes back. Cheers, Sarah sarahr at genesearch.com.au http://www.troz.net/Rev/ On Tuesday, March 25, 2003, at 07:34 am, Ken Norris wrote: > *********** >> From: "Ken Ray" >> Subject: RE: Send an eMail attachment? >> Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2003 18:40:27 -0600 >> Organization: Sons of Thunder Software >> >> Dan, >> >> Take a look at Shao Sean's libSMTP library; it allows for direct SMTP >> communications, attachments and more. Go to: >> http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm and go to >> the bottom of the Downloads section. > ---------- > P.S. > > Now all we need is one that can RECEIVE email. If I could find > tutorials on > handling Rev's socket functions, it seems possible. > > Ken N. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > From ncouch at mail.airmail.net Mon Mar 24 21:37:01 2003 From: ncouch at mail.airmail.net (ncouch) Date: Mon Mar 24 21:37:01 2003 Subject: Database query and extraction Message-ID: I am building a test app with which I want to do the following: 1) open a file (a csv file) - the records of this database are separated currently by two CR's. 2) search through the file to find a string 3) extract each records which contains that string writing it to another file or field. 4) continue the search until eof. The "open file" and "read from" file commands are straightforward enough. I can find the data, but the extraction (ie everything between the CR"s - two in front of the record and the two after the record). Right now I end up extracting the whole database up to the point where it finds the string I am looking for. How can I extract just the entire record. Anyone have any ideas of what I can use? TIA Nate From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 24 22:02:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 24 22:02:01 2003 Subject: Send an eMail attachment? In-Reply-To: <200303242129.QAA08052@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2003 09:54:01 -0800 > Subject: RE: Send an eMail attachment? > From: Dan Friedman > > Ken, > > I found Shao Sean's libSMTP library on the user contributions list... This > is what I'm looking for! ---------- Yep, me too. It's really pretty cool, but it doesn't _receive_ messages. I need that ability too. ---------- > My only problem is that it takes 28 seconds to > send an eMail with a 5307 byte text file attachment. From Outlook (with the > same attachment and message), it took about 2 seconds. ---------- Maybe OE compressed it? I dunno. I wonder what accounts for it :-/ ---------- > I wrote an eMail to Shao to see if I am doing something wrong. I'm waiting > for his reply. > > Thank you for the suggestion/reply. This list is a great place to get help. > I would like to post more responses to those who need help (when I know the > answer), but the "pros" on this list are so on top of it, that by the time I > read it, someone has already answered! :) ---------- I know. It is an unsually reponsive group, and there's lots of knowledge here. Many were Hypercard programmers for a long time. Ken N. From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Mon Mar 24 22:10:00 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Mon Mar 24 22:10:00 2003 Subject: Database query and extraction In-Reply-To: Message-ID: filter - it's like magic :-) read your file into a variable, copy that to another variable because the filter command is destructive and then use something like: filter myData with "*string to find*" After this the variable will only contain those lines with "string to find" somewhere in the line. And it is REALLY fast. Cheers, Sarah sarahr at genesearch.com.au http://www.troz.net/Rev/ On Tuesday, March 25, 2003, at 12:39 pm, ncouch wrote: > I am building a test app with which I want to do the following: > > 1) open a file (a csv file) > - the records of this database are separated currently by two CR's. > 2) search through the file to find a string > 3) extract each records which contains that string writing it to > another > file or field. > 4) continue the search until eof. > > The "open file" and "read from" file commands are straightforward > enough. > > I can find the data, but the extraction (ie everything between the > CR"s - > two in front of the record and the two after the record). Right now I > end > up extracting the whole database up to the point where it finds the > string I > am looking for. How can I extract just the entire record. > > Anyone have any ideas of what I can use? > > > TIA > > Nate > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 24 23:17:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 24 23:17:01 2003 Subject: Autofile snapshots In-Reply-To: <200303242129.QAA08052@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: *********** > Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2003 20:52:21 +0100 > Subject: Re: Autofile snapshots > From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?= > >> on mouseDown >> rectSet -- This handler sets the group's rect to the rect of the >> button >> show group "kybdDN" >> import snapshot from the rect of me >> -- Is supposed to take a picture of the button in it's 'down' state >> to use >> -- as an icon later when he whole process is done. >> end mouseDown > > I tested your script and the problem is that you did not read the > manual ;-) ---------- Well I did, I just didn't type it quite right. I can't see the dictionary window while I'm typing into a script editor and visa versa, to make comparisons, but I finally see the difference in the syntax now. This has been a major problem for me. I'm always missing stuff when toggling back and forth through the windows. I'm going to set up another computer to view the docs when I get enough space. ---------- > here is a script that works, inclusive exporting and deleting: > on mouseDown > hide me > -- So the button will not cover the group ---------- It won't, not visually anyway. It's transparent. Nothing I've read indicates I have to "uncover" something which is visible anyway. ---------- > rectSet ---------- The above is a handler that sets the rect and scroll of the group to the rect, top, and left of the button of only that part of the group, which exactly matches it to the button position and size. ---------- > show group "kybdDN" ---------- ....shows the image I actually want to get the picture of. ---------- > set the name of the templateImage to "exportMe" > -- Needed to export it later ---------- 'templateImage' is a brand new term to me, i.e., I haven't seen it before, wasn't aware of its existence. Thanks for bringing it up. ---------- > import snapshot from rect ( the rect of me ) of window (the windowID > of this stack) > --you must specify a window, or the screen will be used > --Also note differences in syntax to your code ---------- Yep, I forgot to include the window id, which determines the coordinates from the window rather than the screen, a very cool feature. ---------- > export image "exportMe" to file "exported.jpg" as JPEG > --Exports as jpg into the defautlFolder, beware of Apple resources! ---------- Yeah, well I'll probably put the images in a folder inside the folder with the stack, like the other images (full filepath). > delete image "exportMe" > show me > --Clean up > end mouseDown ---------- Thanks so much for your script. BTW, just so you know, we're receiving your "From" line with spurious stuff. It looks like this (c&p'd from the digest): From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?= Best regards, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 25 00:02:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 25 00:02:01 2003 Subject: Halos In-Reply-To: <200303242129.QAA08052@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hello list, In an onscreen keyboard, I want a 'halo' to appear around transparent buttons (the 'keys') on mouseEnter as a special hilite feature (similar to arming). I'm going to try using a combination of gradients and blend levels. Before I dig into this, I figured I'd ask: Has someone has already done something similar? Ken N. From bvg at mac.com Tue Mar 25 00:15:01 2003 From: bvg at mac.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?=) Date: Tue Mar 25 00:15:01 2003 Subject: Autofile snapshots In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3950637C-5E80-11D7-AAFE-003065AD94A4@mac.com> On Dienstag, M?r 25, 2003, at 02:23 Europe/Zurich, Ken Norris wrote: > ... > Thanks so much for your script. > > BTW, just so you know, we're receiving your "From" line with spurious > stuff. > It looks like this (c&p'd from the digest): > > From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?= that's an easy one. The ISO number is a charset, obviously your email program does not have this particular one, thus showing the ? in my name wrongly. It could also be written as oe, or in revolution htmltext: ö oh and i'm glad I could help Bjoernke From RGould8 at aol.com Tue Mar 25 00:26:01 2003 From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com) Date: Tue Mar 25 00:26:01 2003 Subject: Way to set default homepage in Rev? Message-ID: <1ee.51277e9.2bb1417e@aol.com> Mike - - - thanks for your suggestion to use Javascript to set the user's homepage URL. You are correct - - - I have found a number of free examples on the web of Javascript's that are supposed to permit me to set the user's Internet Explorer default homepage URL. I know that this is now officially a non-Revolution question, since we're now heading down the Javascript-only path, but I have another problem - - - maybe it's because I'm on a Mac, but none of the examples I've seen appear to work. I'm running Mac OS 10.2 and IE 5.2. Can anyone tell me if there's a version of the below script that runs on a Mac, or if the below script runs on your Mac? http://simplythebest.net/scripts/javascript_129.html In a message dated 3/24/03 4:55:41 PM, monte at sweattechnologies.com writes: > > Hi > > Please post to the list in plain text format. > > Can anyone tell me if it's possible to use Revolution to set the user's > default homepage in Internet Explorer?? (Perhaps there's an AppleScript > method that can be called)? > > You should only do this with the users consent but the simplest thing to do > would be write out a local html file with the javascript to do it then > launch the file. I think you can find the javascript on a number of public > sites. > > Also to anyone else that wants to integrate with payment processing from > their apps a simple solution is to do wrote out a html file with > > > ... > > Interestingly this is how MSN Messenger integrates with hotmail accounts. > > Cheers > > Monte > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Tue Mar 25 01:30:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Tue Mar 25 01:30:01 2003 Subject: What is needed to use mySQL on Mac OS9 and OSX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Don, Only the professional license allows Rev to connect to MySQL databases. Is that what you have? Since you can connect using other programming tools, the SQL stuff must be installed correctly and you must be using the correct user name, address, password etc. I use a script like this to make the initial connection: on mouseUp put fld "db user" into dbUser put fld "db password" into dbPass put fld "db path" into dbName put fld "db address" into dbAddr if dbAddr is empty then put "localhost" into dbAddr put revdb_connect("MySQL",dbAddr,dbName,dbUser,dbPass) into dbresult if dbresult is a number then put dbresult into fld "db ID" else answer dbResult end if end mouseUp Try this and see if you can get a connection ID number back. I have only connected to databases installed on my own computer rather than over a network, but it should work much the same. I use OS X and haven't tried any of this under OS 9. Cheers, Sarah sarahr at genesearch.com.au http://www.troz.net/Rev/ On Tuesday, March 25, 2003, at 06:26 am, Don Pederson wrote: > Cannot connect to my existing mySQL databases. They do work with > Flash and > Realbasic, but I have not been able to connect to them with Revolution > 1.1.1. What is required? The download site for drivers listed in the > Revolution documentation does not get found by the url given. > > Any help would be greatly appreciated. > -- > Dr. Donald Pederson > School of Music > University of Tennessee > 1741 Volunteer Blvd. > Knoxville, TN 37996 > don-pederson at utk.edu > (865) 974-7550 > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > From swedentom at telia.com Tue Mar 25 04:21:00 2003 From: swedentom at telia.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Tomas_Franz=E9n?=) Date: Tue Mar 25 04:21:00 2003 Subject: Open process In-Reply-To: <005701c2f216$271ab820$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: On m?ndag, mar 24, 2003, at 16:00 Europe/Stockholm, Ken Ray wrote: > What platform are you running this on? Mac OS X. Tomas Franz?n Lighthead Software http://www.lightheadsw.com From gary.rathbone at btclick.com Tue Mar 25 06:31:01 2003 From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone) Date: Tue Mar 25 06:31:01 2003 Subject: Filemaker Pro, Web and Rev - More Experiments In-Reply-To: <000401c2f14d$06ad6d40$0e00000a@server> Message-ID: <000001c2f2c1$850ff2a0$0e00000a@server> Thought I'd continue posting my experiments / problems as they may be useful to others as well as hoping to find someone to shed some light on whats actually happening. I've got Filemaker running on the same XP box with a Rev query app. I've also got a separate Mac on OSX running the same Rev app. The Rev app is very simple, it consists of a button and two fields. The button script is on mouseup put "http://10.0.0.14:68/FMPro?-DB=requests.fp5&-Format=qeds/results.htm&Status= Current&-Find" into tURL put URL tURL into fld "tRep" put the result&cr into fld "tError" put seconds()&cr after fld "tError" end mouseup When I use the Rev app on the Mac it works great. The expected results are returned time and time again - no problem. When I use the same code on the XP box it works the first time then seems to get 'clogged'. The error returned from the result is "error timeout" or if I click twice quickly then "error Previous request not completed" (this is when clicked within the SocketTimeoutInterval and is what I'd expect). When this happens the Mac app still works fine, which seems to point to FileMaker being OK. OK, now what happens if I put the Filemaker database on the Mac. Changing the IP address in the URL line to the IP address of the Mac results in the following... The Mac app (now on the same box as the Filemaker database) works great - everytime. The XP app (now looking at the FM database across the network) also works - everytime. So, to summarise... FM on Mac FM on XP Rev on Mac OK OK Rev on XP OK BROKEN So three out of the four scenarios work OK, the fourth, which is the combination I need (I'm sure this must be somebody's law, murphy's, sods...) is the one that doesn't work. Any ideas why ? Thanks - and apologies for the long post. Gary Rathbone From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk Tue Mar 25 07:37:01 2003 From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg) Date: Tue Mar 25 07:37:01 2003 Subject: Filemaker Pro, Web and Rev - More Experiments In-Reply-To: <000001c2f2c1$850ff2a0$0e00000a@server> References: <000001c2f2c1$850ff2a0$0e00000a@server> Message-ID: At 11:27 am +0000 25/3/03, Gary Rathbone wrote: >So, to summarise... > > FM on Mac FM on XP >Rev on Mac OK OK >Rev on XP OK BROKEN > >So three out of the four scenarios work OK, the fourth, which is the >combination I need (I'm sure this must be somebody's law, murphy's, sods...) >is the one that doesn't work. > >Any ideas why ? There have been reported problems on Windows when connecting to a server on the localhost from a Rev app. The symptoms are just as you describe. My own experience shows this now works with the current preBeta of version 2.0 (on XP SP1 at least). Cheers Dave From BradAllen at mac.com Tue Mar 25 09:11:01 2003 From: BradAllen at mac.com (Brad Allen) Date: Tue Mar 25 09:11:01 2003 Subject: Accessing remote MySQL database In-Reply-To: <83E2947E-5E44-11D7-9F8B-0030654E23A2@byu.edu> References: <83E2947E-5E44-11D7-9F8B-0030654E23A2@byu.edu> Message-ID: >I have been through the Rev documentation and the mail list >archives, but can't find an answer to this one. > >I want to access a MySQL database on my OS X server through >Revolution. I try the revdb_connect() function, passing the server >name, the database name, the user name and password as parameters. >But I get back an error message that says "Access denied for user >'' (Using password:YES)". > >Am I doing this right? Can I access a remote MySQL database in this >way? The documentation is not specific on this matter. Neither are >the archives. I got stuck for awhile on the same error message. It turns out, as a default, the root mySQL user can only access mySQL from the local machine. For remote access, you should create another user and give it access from the host you'll be connecting from (or if you want that user to be able to connect from any address use '%' under the host column when you create the user.) From wmb at internettrainer.com Tue Mar 25 12:36:01 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Tue Mar 25 12:36:01 2003 Subject: Autofile snapshots In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sunday, Mar 23, 2003, at 21:11 Europe/Vienna, Ken Norris wrote: > How do I take snapsots and put them into a file? > > As it is, it looks like I'd have to import, cut, paste into PhotoShop > (or > something) to make a JPEG file out of it, for each one. > > Since I have at least 80 to do, I'd sure like to automate it somehow. > > Any ideas? Hello Ken, there is an very easy way to do that, if you are on OS9 called: screen catcher. this tool does all for your. Predefine the exact size of the shot )(you can change or move it of course too, but it helps a lot if much shots have the same size..) Then capture it with a short cut or from contextual menue and save it to any folder you define, as any format you like. The best file format for images is the own screen catcher gif format, because it is very small. About third part of an equal PH file and even smaller than GC. I did not find any tool wich can do such small gif in this quality. Unfortunatly its not OSX until now. I still change to OS 9, if I hava a lot of shots to do. Even with Snapz Pro you cant do it so easy. I did thousand of shots in this way... hope this helps a bit regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 25 12:38:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 25 12:38:01 2003 Subject: Autofile snapshots In-Reply-To: <200303250527.AAA15930@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 06:11:24 +0100 > Subject: Re: Autofile snapshots > From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?= > > > On Dienstag, M?r 25, 2003, at 02:23 Europe/Zurich, Ken Norris wrote: > >> ... >> Thanks so much for your script. >> >> BTW, just so you know, we're receiving your "From" line with spurious >> stuff. >> It looks like this (c&p'd from the digest): >> >> From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?= > > that's an easy one. The ISO number is a charset, obviously your email > program does not have this particular one, thus showing the ? in my > name wrongly. It could also be written as oe, or in revolution > htmltext: ö ---------- Ahh. I wonder why not, after all it's Outlook Express, probably the most popular emailer there is. Maybe they have extensible char sets somewhere. Ken N. From jiml at netrin.com Tue Mar 25 12:45:01 2003 From: jiml at netrin.com (Jim Lambert) Date: Tue Mar 25 12:45:01 2003 Subject: Autofile snapshots In-Reply-To: <200303250527.AAA15949@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: FYI ALT-selecting text in the dictionary copies it to the clipboard for easy pasting into a script. jim lambert From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 25 12:55:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 25 12:55:00 2003 Subject: Send an eMail attachment? In-Reply-To: <200303250527.AAA15930@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 09:36:19 +1000 > Subject: Re: Send an eMail attachment? > From: Sarah > > I have written an emailer program and in helping someone else recently, > I gathered together the scripts to make a demo stack to connect to a > POP server and receive mail. It isn't very tidy so I haven't put it on > my web page yet, but if anyone wants a pre-release copy, email me > off-list. ---------- Thanks for the offer, I sent a message. ---------- > As for dealing with sockets, you need to check the relevant RFCs for > whatever protocol you plan to use. Once you open a socket to the > correct IP address and port number, you can just send and receive data > to and from that socket. Reading the RFCs will give you the syntax you > need to send and the details of what comes back. ---------- There are reams of RFC material out there, and I'm not sure what's relevant and what isn't. I hope I can find what I'm looking for without spending too much time, because I'm already overloaded. What I really need is some kind of well-organized tutorial I can get through speedily, but I'm still looking. Thanks, Ken N. From alrice at ARCplanning.com Tue Mar 25 13:21:00 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Tue Mar 25 13:21:00 2003 Subject: [OT] outlook In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2B8A4FE6-5EEE-11D7-B948-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Tuesday, March 25, 2003, at 07:43 AM, Ken Norris wrote: > Ahh. I wonder why not, after all it's Outlook Express, probably the > most > popular emailer there is. Maybe they have extensible char sets > somewhere. It displays correctly on Apple's Mail.app. Oh wait, it was sent using Mail.app as well. :-) Mail.app even displays Kanji and other weird character sets. Kinda bizarre to get spam in foreign character sets. I am highly skeptical of Outlook Express. I worked in technical support for an ISP from 1996-99, when MS Outlook was just being introduced. Because it came bundled with Internet Explorer, people felt they had to use it, even though it was very buggy and non-standards compliant. At that time there were about 5 different "versions" of Outlook all with different names, features and bugs. I assume it's gotten better. But we used to recommend Eudora or Pegasus Mail for Win32 mail clients. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From valetia at mac.com Tue Mar 25 13:51:01 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Tue Mar 25 13:51:01 2003 Subject: Payment Processing (was: Way to set default homepage in Rev?) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Monte, > From: "Monte Goulding" > > Also to anyone else that wants to integrate with payment processing from > their apps a simple solution is to do wrote out a html file with > > > ... Do you mean to have this file loaded into the browser and then have the user continue from there? Or do you mean true integration i.e. as a way to actually perform a secure transmission within the app itself? Either way, how do you retrieve the result of the transmission? Valetia From gary.rathbone at btclick.com Tue Mar 25 14:26:00 2003 From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone) Date: Tue Mar 25 14:26:00 2003 Subject: Filemaker Pro, Web and Rev - Solved ! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001c2f303$d2c0fe30$0e00000a@server> > There have been reported problems on Windows when connecting to a > server on the localhost from a Rev app. The symptoms are just as you > describe. > > My own experience shows this now works with the current preBeta of > version 2.0 (on XP SP1 at least). I've downloaded the latest preBeta from http://www.runrev.com/revolution/previews/downloads.html and the code now works great !!! Many thanks for this Dave. This is going to make a big difference ! >>So three out of the four scenarios work OK, the fourth, which is the >>combination I need (I'm sure this must be somebody's law, murphy's, >>sods...) is the one that doesn't work. [OT] And as far as the laws go I haven't found one that exactly fits, but there are many to choose from at http://www.murphys-laws.com/murphy/murphy-technology.html So take your pick... regards Gary Rathbone From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Tue Mar 25 14:54:01 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Tue Mar 25 14:54:01 2003 Subject: wave files Message-ID: <20030325195053.22400.qmail@web20416.mail.yahoo.com> I'm trying to use the play command to play external wave files, but I'm just hearing static. What are the reasons for this. When I use a Player object (QuickTime) to play the file, it's fine. Do wave files have to have a certain sample/bit rate. Running Mac OS X and Rev 1.1.1. Any help would be appreciated. I would rather use external wave files than use a Player object, as some Windows users may not have QuickTime installed. But if that's the only answer, then so be it. :-) Chris Sheffield Read Naturally __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From jbradshaw at blueyonder.co.uk Tue Mar 25 15:22:00 2003 From: jbradshaw at blueyonder.co.uk (Jez) Date: Tue Mar 25 15:22:00 2003 Subject: Combobox messages Message-ID: <001b01c2f30b$b25945a0$c6abc050@Jez2> I want to capture the event when a combobox selection is edited with the keyboard (when the user navigates off it), and when the list selection is changed to another entry. What messages capture these events ? From devin_asay at byu.edu Tue Mar 25 15:23:01 2003 From: devin_asay at byu.edu (Devin Asay) Date: Tue Mar 25 15:23:01 2003 Subject: Accessing remote MySQL database Message-ID: Brad, Brilliant! I had been using the browser-based phpmyadmin utility to create users for this database. Apparently it does not do it properly. When I created the user using the mysqladmin command line application, it all worked as expected. Thanks. Devin Brad said: > I got stuck for awhile on the same error message. It turns out, as a > default, the root mySQL user can only access mySQL from the local > machine. For remote access, you should create another user and give > it access from the host you'll be connecting from (or if you want > that user to be able to connect from any address use '%' under the > host column when you create the user.) Devin Asay Humanities Technology and Research Support Center Brigham Young University From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Tue Mar 25 16:36:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Tue Mar 25 16:36:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030325213311.65504.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com> --- Malte Brill wrote: > @ Erik. > How do you want to deliver your media? As a > download or streamed? both! > I have > been trying to display media (.mpg video) from > the Web in a Stack. > Has anyone succeded streaming video directly > into rev, without the need of > downloading the whole File? In my teststack the > player refused playing the > video/audio until the file was completely in > cache. this seems like a new frontier for rev. for sales and publicity, i don't see how you can beat streaming video in rev. > Rev, the Revolution Newbies board: > http://www.mailping.net/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi as much as i would like to think of myself as post newbie... tanks for duh tip. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Tue Mar 25 16:39:00 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Tue Mar 25 16:39:00 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030325213629.85969.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com> --- Richard Gaskin wrote: > > so what does it take to stream your own QT > videos > > to RR users? if this means desktop > broadcasting > > from your own digital camera has arrived, > then > > this is an wondrous new world we live in. > > Showing a stream is very different from > originating one. > You can start here: > > thank you. it is surprising that this is not a HOT rev topic. even if other apps already do this well, there must be room for the kind of script control rev offers. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From monte at sweattechnologies.com Tue Mar 25 16:43:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Tue Mar 25 16:43:01 2003 Subject: Payment Processing (was: Way to set default homepage in Rev?) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > > Hi Monte, > Hi > > From: "Monte Goulding" > > > > Also to anyone else that wants to integrate with payment processing from > > their apps a simple solution is to do wrote out a html file with > > > > > > ... > > Do you mean to have this file loaded into the browser and then > have the user > continue from there? You save this document locally then you launch it in a browser. It then submits the form as it's being loaded and you go to Kagi or wherever. > > Or do you mean true integration i.e. as a way to actually perform a secure > transmission within the app itself? No we don't have SSL. > > Either way, how do you retrieve the result of the transmission? You don't. It just makes it easier to link to a web store like Kagi. At least easier than what I was doing before which was asking the user to submit the local form manually. Regards Monte From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Tue Mar 25 17:02:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Tue Mar 25 17:02:01 2003 Subject: Combobox messages In-Reply-To: Message-ID: When a new list selection is chosen, a menuPick message is sent with the new choice as it's parameter. The other half of your question is an interesting one and I had not previously considered it. On testing, I discovered that a closeField is sent to the combo-box (I think it is really a field attached to a button), so you can trap "closeField" and get the label of the combobox when it changes. Cheers, Sarah sarahr at genesearch.com.au http://www.troz.net/Rev/ On Wednesday, March 26, 2003, at 06:23 am, Jez wrote: > I want to capture the event when a combobox selection is edited with > the > keyboard (when the user navigates off it), and when the list selection > is > changed to another entry. What messages capture these events ? > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Tue Mar 25 17:09:00 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Tue Mar 25 17:09:00 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1212 - 14 msgs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030325220554.43913.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com> --- Richard Gaskin wrote: > Malte Brill wrote: > > > > > Does anybody happen to know some URLs to > different streams for testing > > purposes? I wanted to try some of the > different radio streams available in > > Itunes, but that didn?t work (even though I > think I didn?t get the correct > > URLs.) > > I got this NP stream from the QT site: > > > Here's how: > > 1. Play a stream in Apple's QT Player > 2. File->Export, using the option to export to > a QT Media Link > 3. Open the link file in any text editor -- > it's a very simple XML file: > > > type="application/x-quicktime-media-link"?> > autoplay="true" > controller="false" > > src="http://stream.qtv.apple.com/channels/npr/sprites/nprlivenew.mov" just to clarify: does anyone on the list have video footage that can be streamed from rev to a qt player? ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From jhurley at infostations.com Tue Mar 25 17:16:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Tue Mar 25 17:16:01 2003 Subject: RR and FileMaker In-Reply-To: <200303251702.MAA23330@www.runrev.com> References: <200303251702.MAA23330@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: The recent discussion on interfacing FileMaker and Rev has aroused my curiosity. I have occasion, especially at election time, to work with FileMaker. Since I have never been able to decipher the arcane scripting language in FileMaker, my alternative has been to export the FileMaker file as a text file, make my changes using Transcript in RR and then import the altered text file back into FileMaker. Can I assume that this is not a really dumb way to work with FileMaker? Jim P.S. I know there are other databases (Valentina etc.) which interface with RR but I can't bring myself to learn yet another complex application which I will use only on rare occasions. I anxiously await the database improvements in 2.0 From monte at sweattechnologies.com Tue Mar 25 17:37:02 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Tue Mar 25 17:37:02 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1212 - 14 msgs In-Reply-To: <20030325220554.43913.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: > > just to clarify: > does anyone on the list have video footage that > can be streamed from rev to a qt player? > Hi Eric It seems you are getting mixed up between our ability to use QuickTime streaming in the player object to receive streamed media and our INABILITY to stream from rev to another QuickTime player. To stream from rev you would need to implement the Real-Time Transport Protocol to create an RTP server. You would also need to set up some way for the client to find the server if you are talking about peer-to-peer streaming. Check out http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~hgs/rtp/ for more info on developing a server. Regards Monte From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Tue Mar 25 18:11:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Tue Mar 25 18:11:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1212 - 14 msgs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030325230821.54601.qmail@web20010.mail.yahoo.com> --- Monte Goulding wrote: > It seems you are getting mixed up between our > ability to use QuickTime > streaming in the player object to receive > streamed media and our INABILITY > to stream from rev to another QuickTime player. > To stream from rev you would > need to implement the Real-Time Transport > Protocol to create an RTP server. > You would also need to set up some way for the > client to find the server if > you are talking about peer-to-peer streaming. > > Check out http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~hgs/rtp/ > for more info on developing a > server. thanks, i will do as you suggest. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From capellan2000 at yahoo.com Tue Mar 25 18:42:00 2003 From: capellan2000 at yahoo.com (Alejandro Tejada) Date: Tue Mar 25 18:42:00 2003 Subject: Graphics experiments In-Reply-To: <200303252238.RAA00605@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <20030325233848.3137.qmail@web40506.mail.yahoo.com> Hi list members, Download these experiments with graphics: http://ffc.virtualave.net/CurvedDrawingPen_v01.zip http://ffc.virtualave.net/export_regular_polygons.zip These are parts of a larger work, to be released soon. Alejandro ===== Useful sites: http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/metacard/tips/ and /revolution/tips/ http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/metacard/ and /use-revolution/ http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Tue Mar 25 19:09:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Tue Mar 25 19:09:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media (a little OT) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030326000539.13108.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com> --- Ken Norris wrote: > on 3/23/03 1:41 AM, Ken Norris at > pixelbird at interisland.net wrote: > > > ********** > >> Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 16:17:50 -0800 (PST) > >> From: erik hansen > >> Subject: Re: Streaming media [was:Scripted > musical notation available ] > >> > >> so what does it take to stream your own QT > videos > >> to RR users? if this means desktop > broadcasting > >> from your own digital camera has arrived, > then > >> this is an wondrous new world we live in. > > ---------- > > Sure, but you must do it through a server > capable of streaming video, and you > > need streaming software: > > > > > > > ----------- > P.S. > > The technology seems to be getting close to > streaming full length, full > screen movies and interactive theatrical > quality performances online: > > there is no limit on how long a video we can receive via streaming is there? ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Tue Mar 25 19:21:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Tue Mar 25 19:21:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030326001801.75497.qmail@web20005.mail.yahoo.com> --- Ken Norris wrote: > ********** > > Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 16:17:50 -0800 (PST) > > From: erik hansen > > Subject: Re: Streaming media [was:Scripted > musical notation available ] > > > > so what does it take to stream your own QT > videos > > to RR users? if this means desktop > broadcasting > > from your own digital camera has arrived, > then > > this is an wondrous new world we live in. > ---------- > Sure, but you must do it through a server > capable of streaming video, and > you need streaming software: > > winner of the NerdTV award. ok, let's say you have a nerdtv server. can you somehow run an animation in RR and use your external software to stream that? ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From monte at sweattechnologies.com Tue Mar 25 20:41:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Tue Mar 25 20:41:01 2003 Subject: Bug confirmation Message-ID: Hi All I've been discussing a possible bug with Scott and as I'm the only one to report it and he hasn't been able to reproduce it he can't fix it. The problem is that under certain conditions the engine seems not to update a stacks location when you move it. I noticed it in MC 2.5 but I have since found it in Rev 1.1.1. I get it every time if I follow the following recipe with Rev 1.1.1 on Windows XP: Launch Rev Move the menubar Click on a menu It can now be seen as the menu displays in the worng position (or the right position for where the stack used to be) Moving the menubar again fixes the problem. You can also look in the properties dialog and see the incorrect location. This bug also thows the mouseLoc out If anyone else can replicate this or has ever seen it could you please email Scott raney at metacard.com. Thanks Monte Goulding B.App.Sc. (Hons.) Executive Director Sweat Technologies email: monte at sweattechnologies.com website: www.sweattechnologies.com mobile (International): +61 421 138 274 (Australia): 0421 138 274 From chipp at chipp.com Tue Mar 25 22:40:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Tue Mar 25 22:40:01 2003 Subject: Bug confirmation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Monte, I tried it here, but with no problems (WinXP RR1.5). Perhaps you can turn off your video acceleration and see if that fixes your problem? (Right-click the Desktop..Display Properties..Settings tab...Advanced Button...Troubleshoot tab...Turn down Hardware Acceleration to NONE) best, Chipp > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Monte > Goulding > Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2003 7:38 PM > To: MetaCard List; Rev List > Subject: Bug confirmation > > > > Hi All > > I've been discussing a possible bug with Scott and as I'm the only one to > report it and he hasn't been able to reproduce it he can't fix it. > > The problem is that under certain conditions the engine seems not > to update > a stacks location when you move it. I noticed it in MC 2.5 but I > have since > found it in Rev 1.1.1. I get it every time if I follow the > following recipe > with Rev 1.1.1 on Windows XP: > > Launch Rev > Move the menubar > Click on a menu > It can now be seen as the menu displays in the worng position (or > the right > position for where the stack used to be) > > Moving the menubar again fixes the problem. > > You can also look in the properties dialog and see the incorrect location. > > This bug also thows the mouseLoc out > > If anyone else can replicate this or has ever seen it could you > please email > Scott raney at metacard.com. > > Thanks > > Monte Goulding > B.App.Sc. (Hons.) > > Executive Director > Sweat Technologies > > email: monte at sweattechnologies.com > website: www.sweattechnologies.com > mobile (International): +61 421 138 274 > (Australia): 0421 138 274 > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 25 23:39:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 25 23:39:01 2003 Subject: Autofile snapshots In-Reply-To: <200303252238.RAA00596@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 18:31:53 +0100 > Subject: Re: Autofile snapshots > From: "Wolfgang M. Bereuter" > Hello Ken, > there is an very easy way to do that, if you are on OS9 called: screen > catcher. > this tool does all for your. > Predefine the exact size of the shot )(you can change or move it of > course too, but it helps a lot if much shots have the same size..) > Then capture it with a short cut or from contextual menue and save it > to any folder you define, as any format you like. > The best file format for images is the own screen catcher gif format, > because it is very small. About third part of an equal PH file and even > smaller than GC. I did not find any tool wich can do such small gif in > this quality. Unfortunatly its not OSX until now. I still change to OS > 9, if I hava a lot of shots to do. Even with Snapz Pro you cant do it > so easy. ---------- Sounds like a cool program, I'll try to check it out. Bjournke sent a script that corrected some problems I had with the [import snapshot] commands. I haven't tried it yet (I need to modify it slightly), but it should work. Thanks so much, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Tue Mar 25 23:46:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Tue Mar 25 23:46:01 2003 Subject: Autofile snapshots In-Reply-To: <200303252238.RAA00596@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: "Jim Lambert" > Subject: Re: Autofile snapshots > Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 09:34:54 -0800 > > window while I'm typing into a script editor and visa versa> > > FYI > ALT-selecting text in the dictionary copies it to the clipboard for easy > pasting into a script. ----------- Thanks Jim, I knew that, and have, in fact, used it, but I don't really have the habit because much of the time the examples don't quite apply. But, I concede, it would probably have prevented an error in this case. Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 26 00:01:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 26 00:01:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media In-Reply-To: <200303252238.RAA00596@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: "Monte Goulding" m> > Subject: RE: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1212 - 14 msgs > Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 09:04:33 +1030 > >To stream from rev you would > need to implement the Real-Time Transport Protocol to create an RTP server. > You would also need to set up some way for the client to find the server if > you are talking about peer-to-peer streaming. > > Check out http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~hgs/rtp/ for more info on developing a > server. ---------- What would be REALLY cool would be to implement multimedia server stuff into Rev. Then some bright Rev gurus could all get together and offer online classes in Rev in realtime. I might actually be willing to pay for that, especially if I could build a demo for doing the same thing to show clients who want to conduct interactive multi-media classes across the net in realtime. That way, one could build a highly elastic UI to allow them to change things at will. There'd be no end to what could be done with that!! Ken N. From monte at sweattechnologies.com Wed Mar 26 00:01:21 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Wed Mar 26 00:01:21 2003 Subject: Bug confirmation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: That's it! Is there a simmilar hardware acceleration on OS X because I've seen it there???? Thanks Monte > > Hi Monte, > > I tried it here, but with no problems (WinXP RR1.5). Perhaps you can turn > off your video acceleration and see if that fixes your problem? > (Right-click > the Desktop..Display Properties..Settings tab...Advanced > Button...Troubleshoot tab...Turn down Hardware Acceleration to NONE) > > best, > > Chipp > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Monte > > Goulding > > Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2003 7:38 PM > > To: MetaCard List; Rev List > > Subject: Bug confirmation > > > > > > > > Hi All > > > > I've been discussing a possible bug with Scott and as I'm the > only one to > > report it and he hasn't been able to reproduce it he can't fix it. > > > > The problem is that under certain conditions the engine seems not > > to update > > a stacks location when you move it. I noticed it in MC 2.5 but I > > have since > > found it in Rev 1.1.1. I get it every time if I follow the > > following recipe > > with Rev 1.1.1 on Windows XP: > > > > Launch Rev > > Move the menubar > > Click on a menu > > It can now be seen as the menu displays in the worng position (or > > the right > > position for where the stack used to be) > > > > Moving the menubar again fixes the problem. > > > > You can also look in the properties dialog and see the > incorrect location. > > > > This bug also thows the mouseLoc out > > > > If anyone else can replicate this or has ever seen it could you > > please email > > Scott raney at metacard.com. > > > > Thanks > > > > Monte Goulding > > B.App.Sc. (Hons.) > > > > Executive Director > > Sweat Technologies > > > > email: monte at sweattechnologies.com > > website: www.sweattechnologies.com > > mobile (International): +61 421 138 274 > > (Australia): 0421 138 274 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > use-revolution mailing list > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk Wed Mar 26 02:08:01 2003 From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg) Date: Wed Mar 26 02:08:01 2003 Subject: wave files In-Reply-To: <20030325195053.22400.qmail@web20416.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030325195053.22400.qmail@web20416.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: At 11:50 am -0800 25/3/03, Chris Sheffield wrote: >I'm trying to use the play command to play external >wave files, but I'm just hearing static. What are the >reasons for this. When I use a Player object >(QuickTime) to play the file, it's fine. Do wave >files have to have a certain sample/bit rate. Running >Mac OS X and Rev 1.1.1. Any help would be >appreciated. I would rather use external wave files >than use a Player object, as some Windows users may >not have QuickTime installed. But if that's the only >answer, then so be it. :-) It's not necessary to have QuickTime installed to use a Player object on Windows. You should be able to play most audio formats through a player, although it depends to some extent on what media software has previously been installed on the Windows machine. For example, with an out-of-the-box install of Win98, you won't be able to play mp3 files, but if Windows Media Player 6.4 has been installed, you will. Cheers Dave From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 26 04:23:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 26 04:23:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: <20030325213311.65504.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: erik hansen wrote: > this seems like a new frontier for rev. > for sales and publicity, i don't see how you can > beat streaming video in rev. I'm intrigued by the idea, but I'm finding my dinosaur mind unable to blend the two traditionally distinct tasks involved: authoring and broadcasting. With the anticipated authoring features, Rev would seem a wonderfully rich and flexible ways to author content, which could be sent over the wire when it's done using any number of existing streaming solutions. Where I find myself limited is in trying to think of QT content that can be authored in real time for live broadcasting. What sort of QT content would you ideally want to both author and stream in real time? -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From wmb at internettrainer.com Wed Mar 26 05:34:01 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Wed Mar 26 05:34:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <01721589-5F76-11D7-917A-003065430226@internettrainer.com> On Wednesday, Mar 26, 2003, at 10:20 Europe/Vienna, Richard Gaskin wrote: >> this seems like a new frontier for rev. >> for sales and publicity, i don't see how you can >> beat streaming video in rev. > > I'm intrigued by the idea, but I'm finding my dinosaur mind unable to > blend > the two traditionally distinct tasks involved: authoring and > broadcasting. > > With the anticipated authoring features, Rev would seem a wonderfully > rich > and flexible ways to author content, which could be sent over the wire > when > it's done using any number of existing streaming solutions. Me too. I dont see the need for "a streaming rev" for CBT. If the user can download, lets say one (or more) lessons as a stack and work then offline. That will be so much faster and easier than this "allover there complicated and mostly slow and useless" Shockwave or what ever online learning sites, where you have to be conected to the server all the time. And much more expansiv for everybody which has "only" a modem connection. For inevitable streaming stuff you can do that with QT, Flash or the Browser opened within rev.... regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From gary.rathbone at btclick.com Wed Mar 26 07:24:01 2003 From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone) Date: Wed Mar 26 07:24:01 2003 Subject: RR and FileMaker In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001c2f392$14612200$0e00000a@server> > The recent discussion on interfacing FileMaker and Rev has aroused my > curiosity. > > I have occasion, especially at election time, to work with FileMaker. > Since I have never been able to decipher the arcane scripting > language in FileMaker... I really like FileMaker. Although its not as powerful or as cheap as other products on the market you really can produce great results very quickly. Filemaker seemed to get a foothold with my customers many years ago (early 1990's) as a cross platform solution. I still have many existing users with FileMaker databases. I do agree that the scripting is limited and very contrived. But, as it comes 'web ready' then its ideal to use Rev either as a front end or as I'm doing a query tool. Currently I'm using Filemaker for a 'Fault Call Logging System'. Rev will sit on the same (or a separate server) and query the 'call-log' database. The data is then analysed, turned into web pages and uploaded onto my co-located server for users to track the progress of their call and see the stats on response times etc... The calls made to Filemaker seen in previous posts are HTTP (web) requests using CDML (Claris Dynamic Markup Language) and are returned in a predefined text or HTML template. A great resource for CDML is : http://www.webmastermac.com/tips/filemaker/ Especially the Filemaker CDML resources at : http://www.spinnerworld.com/cdmltags.html >...my alternative has been to export the > FileMaker file as a text file, make my changes using Transcript in RR > and then import the altered text file back into FileMaker. > > Can I assume that this is not a really dumb way to work with > FileMaker? As ever, there are other ways. Often when I look at how I can 'streamline' tasks like this then I take a look at how long the task takes me over a given period, say a year. I then take a guess at how long it would take me to write an app to do it 'automatically', if its significantly longer then generally I don't bother. Unless of course I've got some spare time and can see how learning such a system would be benefical for other projects. Hope this helps. Regards Gary Rathbone From sanke at hrz.uni-kassel.de Wed Mar 26 12:27:00 2003 From: sanke at hrz.uni-kassel.de (Wilhelm Sanke) Date: Wed Mar 26 12:27:00 2003 Subject: custom buttons Message-ID: <3E81E339.CA64B737@hrz.uni-kassel.de> Although I am 5 days late in this thread a few remarks: On Fri, 21 Mar 2003 Chris Sheffield wrote: > Why is it that if I use a transparent button with a > custom image, I can't get the button label to look > right? If I enter a label such as "Exit" for my > button, and select the Show Name property, the label > displays below the custom graphic, not centered on it. > I can adjust the margins so that the label seems to > be centered on the button, but it displays behind the > image, not on top of it. Is there any way to make > this work. Seems like strange behavior. > > I need the use of custom buttons, but I'd like to be > able to have a built-in button label. Otherwise, I > have to create tons of button images (at least three > states for each button) with the labels already on > them, and then import them into my stack. Is there an > easier way to do it? > > Thanks, > > Chris Sheffield > Read Naturally > Scott Rossi on Fri, 21 Mar 2003 has already pointed out that that the button name/name beneath the icon is the default behavior. Like Chris Sheffield I believe that the possibility to have the button name/label directly "on top" of an icon would be a useful additional feature of Metacard/Revolution. There are a lot of instances - for instance with language exercises - where you might use customised icons and want to be able to change button names/labels "on the fly" during runtime. On way to achieve this would be to use the respective images as *backpatterns* of the button, but unfortunately this works only if you have rectangular images. If you use partially transparent non-rectangular images, the transparent parts of the image will appear as black - and not as transparent. So indeed the only solution to use non-rectangular images as button icons would be with the added feature to be able to place names/labels directly on top of an icon. Of course, there are workarounds (like grouping fields and buttons or images and graphics), but the most comfortable way would be this additional feature. I had an exchange with Scott Raney of Metacard about these questions about a year ago, and he had told me that this feature is on the request list. Those of you who are interested in such a feature should ask Scott Raney to move it more upwards on the to-do list, so it could be available in Metacard and Metacard-based Revolution in a less distant future. By the way, check out "RealDraw Pro" of www.mediachance.com as a very inexpensive but also otherwise powerful tool to create transparent png-images (sorry only for Windows). Regards, Wilhelm Sanke From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 26 12:56:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 26 12:56:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media (a little OT) In-Reply-To: <200303261225.HAA12871@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 16:05:39 -0800 (PST) > From: erik hansen > Subject: Re: Streaming media (a little OT) > > > there is no limit on how long a video we can > receive via streaming is there? ---------- No, not really. There may be practical reasons for not broadcasting TV all the time, but most internet radio stations remain on 24/7. However, most of the sites I've seen that do webcasting are using RealPlayer or MediaPlayer, not QT. Ken N. From runrev at colegroup.com Wed Mar 26 12:58:01 2003 From: runrev at colegroup.com (Dave Cole) Date: Wed Mar 26 12:58:01 2003 Subject: RR and FileMaker In-Reply-To: <000001c2f392$14612200$0e00000a@server> References: <000001c2f392$14612200$0e00000a@server> Message-ID: At 12:20 PM +0000 3/26/03, Gary Rathbone wrote: >As ever, there are other ways. Often when I look at how I can 'streamline' >tasks like this then I take a look at how long the task takes me over a >given period, say a year. I then take a guess at how long it would take me >to write an app to do it 'automatically', if its significantly longer then >generally I don't bother. Unless of course I've got some spare time and can >see how learning such a system would be benefical for other projects. i also use this equation but add one more factor: will i *forget* to do something? rolling logs on a specific day of the (month, week, year), executing a database dump at a specific time ... cron has been very good to me over the years. \dmc From pixelbird at interisland.net Wed Mar 26 14:04:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Wed Mar 26 14:04:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media In-Reply-To: <200303261225.HAA12871@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 11:30:46 +0100 > Subject: Re: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] > From: "Wolfgang M. Bereuter" > > > On Wednesday, Mar 26, 2003, at 10:20 Europe/Vienna, Richard Gaskin > wrote: snip >> With the anticipated authoring features, Rev would seem a wonderfully >> rich >> and flexible ways to author content, which could be sent over the wire >> when >> it's done using any number of existing streaming solutions. > > Me too. I dont see the need for "a streaming rev" for CBT. If the user > can download, lets say one (or more) lessons as a stack and work then > offline. That will be so much faster and easier than this "allover > there complicated and mostly slow and useless" Shockwave or what ever > online learning sites, where you have to be conected to the server all > the time. And much more expansiv for everybody which has "only" a modem > connection. ---------- Of course, good webcasts are all but useless without a broadband connection, but so are very many other multi-media websites. Virtually all cities, at least in the U.S., offer broadband connections, and it's spreading into rural communities. A quickly growing number of colleges and universities are offering online interactive classes, not just text (chatroom style) interaction, but live video lectures with media inserts, etc., even music concerts and drama, for those with broadband access. ---------- > For inevitable streaming stuff you can do that with QT, Flash or the > Browser opened within rev.... ---------- But we're speaking about webcasting. I don't know all sites, but as a Christian I'm familiar with this one, which broadcasts live audio and video at various times throughout the day (RealPlayer is required to view the live content, they don't use QT): If you need/want RealPlayer: (for Macs, Windows is available too) Anyway, if you look there and are able to view it OK, you'll see that the same can be (and _is_ being) done for any corporate or college seminars, and of course, news. My point is that if Rev can be integrated into displaying and working with live multimedia content, then the broadcaster could manipulate and display it while lecturing and going over the material in realtime from a classroom studio, just like television but with the ability for interaction (student questions, etc.) I see this as the _inevitable_ future of interactive television. Best regards, Ken N. From alrice at ARCplanning.com Wed Mar 26 16:27:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Wed Mar 26 16:27:01 2003 Subject: security of the runtime Message-ID: <418243D2-5FD1-11D7-AE22-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> I was just reading this article http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/55/29958.html and thinking about Runrev. Focusing specifically on 1) buffer overflows, 2) format string vulnerabilities and 3) input validation errors. #3 is squarely in the responsibility of the me the programmer. But how does the MC/Rev engine measure up regarding #1 and #2? Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Wed Mar 26 18:09:00 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Wed Mar 26 18:09:00 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030326230537.4762.qmail@web20007.mail.yahoo.com> --- Richard Gaskin wrote: > What sort of QT content would you ideally want > to both author and stream in real time? right now, simple button animation with the buttons both moving and changing images. these would be created in rev and accessed via a web page. also, i have 30 half-hour videos from my community access series Street Dancers' Alternative To Violence. if a user could browse in the home page, then click on the program they wish to see, that would be good. even a brief video preview would be helpful. p.s. the spell checker recommends gas kin or GA skin, presumably a southern Appalachian Cherokee. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Wed Mar 26 18:13:00 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Wed Mar 26 18:13:00 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: <01721589-5F76-11D7-917A-003065430226@internettrainer.com> Message-ID: <20030326231012.96043.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com> --- "Wolfgang M. Bereuter" wmb at internettrainer.com> wrote: > I dont see the need for "a streaming > rev" for CBT. If the user > can download, lets say one (or more) lessons as > a stack and work then > offline. That will be so much faster and easier > than this "allover > there complicated and mostly slow and useless" > Shockwave or what ever > online learning sites, where you have to be > conected to the server all > the time. And much more expansiv for everybody > which has "only" a modem connection. i had no idea. > For inevitable streaming stuff you can do that > with QT, Flash or the Browser opened within rev.... that narrows things down considerably, thanks. ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Wed Mar 26 18:21:00 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Wed Mar 26 18:21:00 2003 Subject: Streaming media (a little OT) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030326231737.7618.qmail@web20007.mail.yahoo.com> --- Ken Norris wrote: > most of the sites I've seen that do > webcasting are using RealPlayer > or MediaPlayer, not QT. are there compatability-with-rev concerns here? ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From ambassador at fourthworld.com Wed Mar 26 18:44:03 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Wed Mar 26 18:44:03 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: <20030326230537.4762.qmail@web20007.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: erik hansen wrote: > --- Richard Gaskin > wrote: >> What sort of QT content would you ideally want >> to both author and stream in real time? > > right now, simple button animation with the > buttons both moving and changing images. these > would be created in rev and accessed via a web > page. But need these be authored in real time? > also, i have 30 half-hour videos from my > community access series Street Dancers' > Alternative To Violence. if a user could browse > in the home page, then click on the program they > wish to see, that would be good. even a brief > video preview would be helpful. This sounds like just the sort of thing just about any standard streaming server would be able to provide for you, without needing to write custom software. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Wed Mar 26 19:11:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Wed Mar 26 19:11:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media [was:Scripted musical notation available ] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030327000744.13768.qmail@web20006.mail.yahoo.com> --- Richard Gaskin wrote: > erik hansen wrote: > > > --- Richard Gaskin > > > wrote: > >> What sort of QT content would you ideally > want > >> to both author and stream in real time? > > > > right now, simple button animation with the > > buttons both moving and changing images. > these > > would be created in rev and accessed via a > web > > page. > > But need these be authored in real time? not yet, but that brings up the topic of people on a network interactively affecting a stack in realtime. this was discussed a while ago, right? > > also, i have 30 half-hour videos from my > > community access series Street Dancers' > > Alternative To Violence. if a user could > browse > > in the home page, then click on the program > they > > wish to see, that would be good. even a brief > > video preview would be helpful. > > This sounds like just the sort of thing just > about any standard streaming > server would be able to provide for you, > without needing to write custom > software. that's a relief! i was afraid there might be compatability problems with rev. has anyone actually streamed a rev project using QT or RealPlayer? ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From alrice at ARCplanning.com Wed Mar 26 22:36:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Wed Mar 26 22:36:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wednesday, March 26, 2003, at 09:10 AM, Ken Norris wrote: > > My point is that if Rev can be integrated into displaying and working > with > live multimedia content, then the broadcaster could manipulate and > display > it while lecturing and going over the material in realtime from a > classroom > studio, just like television but with the ability for interaction > (student > questions, etc.) > > I see this as the _inevitable_ future of interactive television. What are you envisioning as the payload that the player will receive? video streams? Or a lightweight scene description that's then rendered by the player? I think a lot of Flash developers are already doing the latter, using the flash player to fetch live data in XML format, which is then parsed and rendered by a flash script. Different multimedia types are then fetched and inserted here and there. Runrev could be used in mostly the same way (as in Richard's Beyond the Browser article) If you mean broadcasting video, that's a heavyweight problem. For that, Quicktime might be a good starting point, since Rev already supports the Quicktime player. Quicktime actually has a lot of features like VR scenes, 3D, sprites and interactivity. However most developers don't know it because there is only a low level C API for doing these things! I know I wouldn't want to mess with that API. Apple gives away for FREE, open source, the Quicktime Streaming Server, even for Linux and other server platforms. http://www.apple.com/quicktime/products/qtss/ Broadcaster also looks like an interesting product - live encoding. It might not seem like Quicktime is used that much, but in fact ALL the major movie studios release their movie trailers in Quicktime. Recently I thought I saw cnn.com doing quicktime streams as well. However, there are major licensing issues with all these semi-open standanrds formats like MPEG. (see http://www.xiph.org) I don't think a small company like Runrev could handle the licensing. It would have to piggyback on Apple or Macromedia or someone. Someone described Quicktime as only a wrapper for about a hundred different codecs for multimedia content. OK now I'm just rambling. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From wmb at internettrainer.com Thu Mar 27 05:04:01 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Thu Mar 27 05:04:01 2003 Subject: custom buttons In-Reply-To: <3E81E339.CA64B737@hrz.uni-kassel.de> Message-ID: On Wednesday, Mar 26, 2003, at 18:28 Europe/Vienna, Wilhelm Sanke wrote: > By the way, check out "RealDraw Pro" of www.mediachance.com as a very > inexpensive but also otherwise powerful tool to create transparent > png-images (sorry only for Windows). check out Omnigraffle for the Mac. It can do Transparency, gradienst, charting and much more... Export as : EPS pdf gif jpeg and PNG I think its about $60 http://www.omnigroup.com/applications/omnigraffle/ regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From rpresender at earthlink.net Thu Mar 27 08:23:01 2003 From: rpresender at earthlink.net (Robert Presender) Date: Thu Mar 27 08:23:01 2003 Subject: test Message-ID: Please ignore. From rom1 at xplicitnetwork.com Thu Mar 27 10:08:00 2003 From: rom1 at xplicitnetwork.com (rom1) Date: Thu Mar 27 10:08:00 2003 Subject: File's comments on Mac Message-ID: Hello, i'm working on an on-screen portfolio. I'd like to get the text from that comments-field in the info window. Anyone here knows how to do it ? Romain From alrice at ARCplanning.com Thu Mar 27 10:50:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Thu Mar 27 10:50:01 2003 Subject: custom buttons In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <679B48FB-606B-11D7-94A3-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 03:00 AM, Wolfgang M. Bereuter wrote: > check out Omnigraffle for the Mac. It can do Transparency, gradienst, > charting and much more... Yes, Omnigraffle is definitely worth the price. I love it. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From trevor at mangomultimedia.com Thu Mar 27 11:33:01 2003 From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore) Date: Thu Mar 27 11:33:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <68550563-6071-11D7-9042-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com> On Wednesday, March 26, 2003, at 10:32 PM, Alex Rice wrote: > > If you mean broadcasting video, that's a heavyweight problem. > > For that, Quicktime might be a good starting point, since Rev already > supports the Quicktime player. Quicktime actually has a lot of > features like VR scenes, 3D, sprites and interactivity. However most > developers don't know it because there is only a low level C API for > doing these things! I know I wouldn't want to mess with that API. FYI - tools like LiveStage Professional (www.totallyhip.com) and eZediaQTI (www.ezedia.com) expose this API allowing you to create interactive QT movies. LSP is the most powerful while QTI is more user friendly. You can create interactive moveis and database connected QT movies using XML with LSP. Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Multimedia trevor at mangomultimedia.com From wmb at internettrainer.com Thu Mar 27 12:05:00 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Thu Mar 27 12:05:00 2003 Subject: Streaming media In-Reply-To: <68550563-6071-11D7-9042-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com> Message-ID: On Thursday, Mar 27, 2003, at 17:30 Europe/Vienna, Trevor DeVore wrote: > On Wednesday, March 26, 2003, at 10:32 PM, Alex Rice wrote: >> >> If you mean broadcasting video, that's a heavyweight problem. >> >> For that, Quicktime might be a good starting point, since Rev already >> supports the Quicktime player. Quicktime actually has a lot of >> features like VR scenes, 3D, sprites and interactivity. However most >> developers don't know it because there is only a low level C API for >> doing these things! I know I wouldn't want to mess with that API. > > FYI - tools like LiveStage Professional (www.totallyhip.com) and > eZediaQTI (www.ezedia.com) expose this API allowing you to create > interactive QT movies. LSP is the most powerful while QTI is more > user friendly. and a real bargain! regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From alrice at ARCplanning.com Thu Mar 27 12:44:00 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Thu Mar 27 12:44:00 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones Message-ID: <4EEACEA1-607B-11D7-94A3-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> http://news.com.com/2100-1046-994258.html I'm a little confused about what it is, because I thought there was already a standalone flash player that doesn't require a browser plugin. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From trevor at mangomultimedia.com Thu Mar 27 13:10:03 2003 From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore) Date: Thu Mar 27 13:10:03 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: <4EEACEA1-607B-11D7-94A3-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: I will take a stab at this since I am sitting in the Keynote at the FlashForward conference where Macromedia just did a presentation of it. Some interesting things from the keynote: 1) Macromedia Central will allow developers to create flash based desktop applications on Mac and Windows. This will far surpass what is currently available from the Flash player. 2) Macromedia Central allows you to have your web connected apps running like a desktop application but now a user can save data while they are offline and then synch up with a server once they connect to the internet again. 3) A developer can now make flash apps that people can purchase and Central handles the trial period as well as the purchasing of the program. This opens up a new market for Flash application developers. There are definitely other things but this is what stood out to me during the Central presentation. It looks like a really interesting product. Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Multimedia trevor at mangomultimedia.com On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 12:41 PM, Alex Rice wrote: > http://news.com.com/2100-1046-994258.html > > I'm a little confused about what it is, because I thought there was > already a standalone flash player that doesn't require a browser > plugin. > > Alex Rice, Software Developer > Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. > alrice at ARCplanning.com > alrice at swcp.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From kray at sonsothunder.com Thu Mar 27 13:26:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Thu Mar 27 13:26:01 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <007101c2f48d$dbb03700$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Trevor, Is this much different in theory than a Rev standalone the communicates over internet protocols to a backend database? I know it's Flash and not Rev, but is it basically the same? Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > Trevor DeVore > Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2003 12:07 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: [OT] Flash wants standalones > > > I will take a stab at this since I am sitting in the Keynote at the > FlashForward conference where Macromedia just did a > presentation of it. > Some interesting things from the keynote: > > 1) Macromedia Central will allow developers to create flash based > desktop applications on Mac and Windows. This will far > surpass what is > currently available from the Flash player. > 2) Macromedia Central allows you to have your web connected apps > running like a desktop application but now a user can save data while > they are offline and then synch up with a server once they connect to > the internet again. > 3) A developer can now make flash apps that people can purchase and > Central handles the trial period as well as the purchasing of the > program. This opens up a new market for Flash application developers. > > There are definitely other things but this is what stood out to me > during the Central presentation. It looks like a really interesting > product. > > Trevor DeVore > Blue Mango Multimedia > trevor at mangomultimedia.com > > On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 12:41 PM, Alex Rice wrote: > > > http://news.com.com/2100-1046-994258.html > > > > I'm a little confused about what it is, because I thought there was > > already a standalone flash player that doesn't require a browser > > plugin. > > > > Alex Rice, Software Developer > > Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com > > alrice at swcp.com > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > use-revolution mailing list > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From trevor at mangomultimedia.com Thu Mar 27 13:41:01 2003 From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore) Date: Thu Mar 27 13:41:01 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: <007101c2f48d$dbb03700$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: <324EBA6E-6083-11D7-9042-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com> It is pretty much the same concept. Also very similar to Java WebStart. It will support secure connections which is the only thing that keeps me from developing web connected applications in Revolution right now. I remember Kevin mentioning that this would come out after 2.0 was released though. One benefit for a lot of people will be that Central handles trial periods and purchasing of applications which I think will be a nice feature. Anything to save time and save you some hassle. Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Multimedia trevor at mangomultimedia.com On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 01:22 PM, Ken Ray wrote: > Trevor, > > Is this much different in theory than a Rev standalone the communicates > over internet protocols to a backend database? I know it's Flash and > not > Rev, but is it basically the same? > > Ken Ray > Sons of Thunder Software > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com >> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of >> Trevor DeVore >> Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2003 12:07 PM >> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >> Subject: Re: [OT] Flash wants standalones >> >> >> I will take a stab at this since I am sitting in the Keynote at the >> FlashForward conference where Macromedia just did a >> presentation of it. >> Some interesting things from the keynote: >> >> 1) Macromedia Central will allow developers to create flash based >> desktop applications on Mac and Windows. This will far >> surpass what is >> currently available from the Flash player. >> 2) Macromedia Central allows you to have your web connected apps >> running like a desktop application but now a user can save data while >> they are offline and then synch up with a server once they connect to >> the internet again. >> 3) A developer can now make flash apps that people can purchase and >> Central handles the trial period as well as the purchasing of the >> program. This opens up a new market for Flash application developers. >> >> There are definitely other things but this is what stood out to me >> during the Central presentation. It looks like a really interesting >> product. >> >> Trevor DeVore >> Blue Mango Multimedia >> trevor at mangomultimedia.com >> >> On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 12:41 PM, Alex Rice wrote: >> >>> http://news.com.com/2100-1046-994258.html >>> >>> I'm a little confused about what it is, because I thought there was >>> already a standalone flash player that doesn't require a browser >>> plugin. >>> >>> Alex Rice, Software Developer >>> Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com >>> alrice at swcp.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> use-revolution mailing list >>> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> use-revolution mailing list >> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution >> > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From chipp at chipp.com Thu Mar 27 14:44:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Thu Mar 27 14:44:01 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: <324EBA6E-6083-11D7-9042-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com> Message-ID: Trevor, Can you give us any idea what it will cost...and how much they will charge for doing the ecommerce bit? Just curious. I've thought for some time it would be easy to set up a server which works with PayPal to do all the evaluation and purchase bit (I've already done this for ButtonGadget). Something like that would enable all rev standalones to be purchased online. Do you know if the new Flash Player will act like a regualar app? Can you give it it's own filetypes and icons -- and double click a document type and launch it with it's own application? Frankly, I'd be a bit surprised if it can do all that. Also, do you really think it feasible to develop full applications in Flash? I've done a little with ActionScript and it seems like a lot of work for doing something other than animations..just wondering. Sorry to hear about the SSL need you have. I too hope MC or RR will address after 2.0. best, Chipp From kray at sonsothunder.com Thu Mar 27 15:21:00 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Thu Mar 27 15:21:00 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: <324EBA6E-6083-11D7-9042-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com> Message-ID: <007f01c2f49d$f4914880$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> I think that's why they're charging 20% (of the release cost?) of commercial software that takes advantage of this. From the link: ----------------------- Macromedia Central will create an environment where Flash applications can run independent of the browser. Along with providing the client software--a free addition to the free Flash player--Macromedia plans to sell a wealth of downloadable Flash applications created by third-party developers. Macromedia will take 20 percent of any software sales, with the rest going to developers. ----------------------- I'm not so sure I like that idea if it is mandatory (and I'm not even sure I like it if it isn't)... Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > Trevor DeVore > Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2003 12:38 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: [OT] Flash wants standalones > > > It is pretty much the same concept. Also very similar to Java > WebStart. It will support secure connections which is the only thing > that keeps me from developing web connected applications in > Revolution > right now. I remember Kevin mentioning that this would come > out after > 2.0 was released though. > > One benefit for a lot of people will be that Central handles trial > periods and purchasing of applications which I think will be a nice > feature. Anything to save time and save you some hassle. > > Trevor DeVore > Blue Mango Multimedia > trevor at mangomultimedia.com > > On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 01:22 PM, Ken Ray wrote: > > > Trevor, > > > > Is this much different in theory than a Rev standalone the > > communicates over internet protocols to a backend database? I know > > it's Flash and not Rev, but is it basically the same? > > > > Ken Ray > > Sons of Thunder Software > > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com > > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > >> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Trevor > >> DeVore > >> Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2003 12:07 PM > >> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > >> Subject: Re: [OT] Flash wants standalones > >> > >> > >> I will take a stab at this since I am sitting in the > Keynote at the > >> FlashForward conference where Macromedia just did a > presentation of > >> it. > >> Some interesting things from the keynote: > >> > >> 1) Macromedia Central will allow developers to create flash based > >> desktop applications on Mac and Windows. This will far > surpass what > >> is currently available from the Flash player. > >> 2) Macromedia Central allows you to have your web connected apps > >> running like a desktop application but now a user can save > data while > >> they are offline and then synch up with a server once they > connect to > >> the internet again. > >> 3) A developer can now make flash apps that people can purchase and > >> Central handles the trial period as well as the purchasing of the > >> program. This opens up a new market for Flash application > developers. > >> > >> There are definitely other things but this is what stood out to me > >> during the Central presentation. It looks like a really > interesting > >> product. > >> > >> Trevor DeVore > >> Blue Mango Multimedia > >> trevor at mangomultimedia.com > >> > >> On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 12:41 PM, Alex Rice wrote: > >> > >>> http://news.com.com/2100-1046-994258.html > >>> > >>> I'm a little confused about what it is, because I thought > there was > >>> already a standalone flash player that doesn't require a browser > >>> plugin. > >>> > >>> Alex Rice, Software Developer > >>> Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com > >>> alrice at swcp.com > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> use-revolution mailing list > >>> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > >>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > >>> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> use-revolution mailing list > >> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > use-revolution mailing list > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From jbradshaw at blueyonder.co.uk Thu Mar 27 15:28:01 2003 From: jbradshaw at blueyonder.co.uk (Jez) Date: Thu Mar 27 15:28:01 2003 Subject: Group Background Behavior Message-ID: <000501c2f49e$f7214cc0$c6abc050@Jez2> Why. when I group things together and set the group's background behaviour property to true, is the group only visible on cards that I create from that point onwards ? I want it visible on cards I have already created and coded - how can I achieve this ? From alrice at ARCplanning.com Thu Mar 27 15:36:00 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Thu Mar 27 15:36:00 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: <007f01c2f49d$f4914880$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: <5F7EAFB8-6093-11D7-8074-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 01:17 PM, Ken Ray wrote: > I think that's why they're charging 20% (of the release cost?) of > commercial software that takes advantage of this. From the link: > I think 20% is high but not unreasonable. I think Kagi charges 15%, and eSellerate charges 10%. Although eSellerate's 10% is a special rate for if you are selling under $50K year.. But it sounds like Central is supposed to have a lot of value-added stuff. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From monte at sweattechnologies.com Thu Mar 27 16:42:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Thu Mar 27 16:42:01 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: <5F7EAFB8-6093-11D7-8074-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: Kagi uses the following pricing table which makes them the most affordable: Monthly Sales $0 to $25 $25 to $100 $100 and greater < $3000 5% + $1.25 10.0% 5.0% + $5 >= $3,000 5% + $1.25 9.50% 4.9% + $5 >= $10,000 5% + $1.25 9.00% 4.8% + $5 >= $30,000 5% + $1.25 8.75% 4.7% + $5 >= $100,000 5% + $1.25 8.50% 4.6% + $5 >= $300,000 5% + $1.25 8.25% 4.5% + $5 >= $1,000,000 5% + $1.25 8.00% 4.4% + $5 All we need now is Transcript CGI code generation on the Kagi servers and Rev-Kagi plugin. Cheers Monte > > > On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 01:17 PM, Ken Ray wrote: > > > I think that's why they're charging 20% (of the release cost?) of > > commercial software that takes advantage of this. From the link: > > > I think 20% is high but not unreasonable. I think Kagi charges 15%, and > eSellerate charges 10%. Although eSellerate's 10% is a special rate for > if you are selling under $50K year.. > > But it sounds like Central is supposed to have a lot of value-added > stuff. > > Alex Rice, Software Developer > Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. > alrice at ARCplanning.com > alrice at swcp.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From trevor at mangomultimedia.com Thu Mar 27 16:53:00 2003 From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore) Date: Thu Mar 27 16:53:00 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0975A5F2-609E-11D7-9042-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com> On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 02:40 PM, Chipp Walters wrote: > Trevor, > > Can you give us any idea what it will cost...and how much they will > charge > for doing the ecommerce bit? Just curious. I've thought for some time > it > would be easy to set up a server which works with PayPal to do all the > evaluation and purchase bit (I've already done this for ButtonGadget). > Something like that would enable all rev standalones to be purchased > online. As Ken mentioned they take the 20% cut. From what I have been told the Central 'browser' will be free. > Do you know if the new Flash Player will act like a regualar app? Can > you > give it it's own filetypes and icons -- and double click a document > type and > launch it with it's own application? Frankly, I'd be a bit surprised > if it > can do all that. I don't think they are making modifications to the actual player. Central will be an entirely different product. > Also, do you really think it feasible to develop full applications in > Flash? > I've done a little with ActionScript and it seems like a lot of work > for > doing something other than animations..just wondering. > Sorry to hear about the SSL need you have. I too hope MC or RR will > address > after 2.0. You can do some sophisticated things with ActionScript. With Flash MX AS has become pretty powerful. The problem is that the Flash IDE is in no way suited for creating applications. There are still many things that Flash lacks such as file browsers, etc. The available tools which provide this to Flash are Windows only and aren't part of the actual Flash authoring environment. I am really looking forward to SSL as well because I don't enjoy designing my web apps in browsers. I would much prefer to author them in Rev. Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Multimedia trevor at mangomultimedia.com From trevor at mangomultimedia.com Thu Mar 27 16:54:01 2003 From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore) Date: Thu Mar 27 16:54:01 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: <007f01c2f49d$f4914880$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: <453C6547-609E-11D7-9042-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com> On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 03:17 PM, Ken Ray wrote: > I think that's why they're charging 20% (of the release cost?) of > commercial software that takes advantage of this. From the link: > > ----------------------- > Macromedia Central will create an environment where Flash applications > can run independent of the browser. Along with providing the client > software--a free addition to the free Flash player--Macromedia plans to > sell a wealth of downloadable Flash applications created by third-party > developers. Macromedia will take 20 percent of any software sales, with > the rest going to developers. > ----------------------- > > I'm not so sure I like that idea if it is mandatory (and I'm not even > sure I like it if it isn't)... For some Flash developers this will be great and they will love it. I agree with you however. I don't want someone else to have as much control over the player that my app is running in as it appears that Central will have. Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Multimedia trevor at mangomultimedia.com From alrice at ARCplanning.com Thu Mar 27 17:02:02 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Thu Mar 27 17:02:02 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <51FC2D65-609F-11D7-8074-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 02:38 PM, Monte Goulding wrote: > > Kagi uses the following pricing table which makes them the most > affordable: Wow I was way off. I donnow where my 15% came from. Did they change their rates recently? For products < $21, Kagi is not necessarily the cheapest. That +1.25 really gets you. Maybe that's what I was remembering. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From raney at metacard.com Thu Mar 27 17:58:01 2003 From: raney at metacard.com (Scott Raney) Date: Thu Mar 27 17:58:01 2003 Subject: security of the runtime In-Reply-To: <200303271551.KAA32256@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 26 Mar 2003 Alex Rice wrote: > > I was just reading this article > http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/55/29958.html and thinking about > Runrev. > > Focusing specifically on 1) buffer overflows, 2) format string > vulnerabilities and 3) input validation errors. > > #3 is squarely in the responsibility of the me the programmer. But how > does the MC/Rev engine measure up regarding #1 and #2? Certainly much better than the vast majority of software out there, including such open source stalwarts as sendmail and bind (the DNS server). It has to be, or you'd be crashing it regularly with simple script errors. Even #3 is a small fraction the risk with an MC/RR based app compared with one written in a third generation language like BASIC/C/C++/Java because the malicious data not only has to fall through the script checks, but also through a crack in the engine error checking, and the odds of the two lining up exactly like that are close enough to 0 that it's reasonable to ignore the possibility. The primary vulnerabilities are in the third-party libraries we use. For example, I wouldn't be surprised if you could force the engine to crash or execute arbitrary machine code by passing it a carefully crafted bogus GIF/JPEG/PNG image, QT movie, or compress() stream. But as long as you can maintain some control over the source of the data you're using with those routines I wouldn't lose any sleep over the possibility of a user being able to craft some other type of data that would allow them to break into a machine using your program. Regards, Scott > Alex Rice, Software Developer > Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. > alrice at ARCplanning.com > alrice at swcp.com ******************************************************** Scott Raney raney at metacard.com http://www.metacard.com MetaCard: You know, there's an easier way to do that... From pixelbird at interisland.net Thu Mar 27 18:04:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Thu Mar 27 18:04:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media In-Reply-To: <200303271551.KAA32217@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 20:32:37 -0700 > Subject: Re: Streaming media > From: Alex Rice > > On Wednesday, March 26, 2003, at 09:10 AM, Ken Norris wrote: >> >> My point is that if Rev can be integrated into displaying and working >> with >> live multimedia content, then the broadcaster could manipulate and >> display >> it while lecturing and going over the material in realtime from a >> classroom >> studio, just like television but with the ability for interaction >> (student >> questions, etc.) >> >> I see this as the _inevitable_ future of interactive television. > > What are you envisioning as the payload that the player will receive? > video streams? Or a lightweight scene description that's then rendered > by the player? ---------- Good response Alex... If you're asking what I think you're asking, I'd say both. I just finished watching Apple's live online webcast seminar on streaming with QT, which had over 1800 participants worldwide including yours truly (albeit it I got on a little late due to another meeting this morning). It went from about 11:00-12:15. The entire session was all about exactly what we've been discussing in this thread (see more below). And, I should mention, my only available connection was my dialup service through my 56K modem in my 350mHz G4. The video was the usual slowmo framerate sort of thing we're used to at that data rate, but it was still entirely watchable, even with the switches to the window content, and I was able to take notes. They will be hosting another _huge_ one from WWDC 2003 in San Fransisco, June 23-27 at which they are expecting more than 10,000 participants worldwide. ---------- > I think a lot of Flash developers are already doing the latter, using > the flash player to fetch live data in XML format, which is then parsed > and rendered by a flash script. Different multimedia types are then > fetched and inserted here and there. ---------- Can you direct us to a website that is currently broadcasting live content with Flash? ---------- > Runrev could be used in mostly the same way (as in Richard's Beyond the > Browser article) ---------- Agreed. My ideas for using Rev, at present, would probably go something like this: 1) If you have a special presentation as part of an educational program, you could setup the class content in a downloadable stack, complete with user-controlled clips, VR movies (for multiple angles), and realtime manipulation of the subject content. 2) Along with the above, you would have a player running, perhaps in the upper left corner of the screen, which is displaying both live streaming lecture content and screen output for the students to follow along on their home systems, during the webcast. 3) For additional data, say from an online reference library in a different webpath, you could open another player that d/l's streamed data head-buffered to disk so that it does an 'instant-on' display of the reference material as it continues to play it. ---------- > If you mean broadcasting video, that's a heavyweight problem. ---------- Not nearly as much as it was. You can do 3/4 terrabyte (6 internal drive array) live streaming with Apple's XServe package right out of the box. I believe, in addition to the hardware and other necessary software, it includes QT 6 cleaner, QT Streaming Server, and Broadcaster. That may sound like an Apple ad, but that's a good deal more than anyone else is offering at all, let alone at an affordable (for most companies) $2800 price. I'd think that would put it well into Rev's corporate budget for a web tutorial tool for its product. ---------- > For that, Quicktime might be a good starting point, since Rev already > supports the Quicktime player. Quicktime actually has a lot of > features like VR scenes, 3D, sprites and interactivity. However most > developers don't know it because there is only a low level C API for > doing these things! I know I wouldn't want to mess with that API. ---------- But, as I mentioned above, QT 6 Pro, at a lousy $29.95, offers more free authoring ability than most people realize. When you add to that the stuff you mention below, we already have a pretty fair toolset available. All we really need is an expanded set of controls for QT, something like HyperCard's QT Tools externals, i.e., I couldn't find any commands for the display and manipulation of sprites in a movie. ---------- > Apple gives away for FREE, open source, the Quicktime Streaming Server, > even for Linux and other server platforms. > http://www.apple.com/quicktime/products/qtss/ Broadcaster also looks > like an interesting product - live encoding. It might not seem like > Quicktime is used that much, but in fact ALL the major movie studios > release their movie trailers in Quicktime. Recently I thought I saw > cnn.com doing quicktime streams as well. ---------- Yes, but those are just the _first_ of the two ways you can handle streaming content. It's called 'Progressive Downloading', and what it does is cause QT to D/L just enough buffered pre-recorded content (it knows the length of the movie in advance) such that it can start the movie and play it to the end without stopping, i. e, the buffering process stays ahead of the play process, meets it at the end. If your QT Player settings are correct, this makes for very smooth playback because it's actually coming completely from a temporary disk file. The second way to stream is with QuickTime Streaming, which allows realtime streaming, i.e., everything you see is happening in realtime, like the QT seminar I attended earlier today. If you included the player skin in an interactive web page, you could ask typed questions in realtime, or even send voicemail-type audio, if you had a microphone hooked up, or just call it in to a temporary 800 phone number... any number of possibilities. ---------- > However, there are major licensing issues with all these semi-open > standanrds formats like MPEG. (see http://www.xiph.org) I don't think a > small company like Runrev could handle the licensing. It would have to > piggyback on Apple or Macromedia or someone. Someone described > Quicktime as only a wrapper for about a hundred different codecs for > multimedia content. ---------- Simplistically speaking, that's what it is. But QT Pro now offers a great deal of authoring ability that few know about or are taking advantage of. I don't see that there would be any heavy licensing issues involved with manipulating those through Rev. ---------- > OK now I'm just rambling. ---------- Ramble on.... Ken N. From chipp at chipp.com Thu Mar 27 18:11:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Thu Mar 27 18:11:01 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: <007f01c2f49d$f4914880$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: 20%!!!! Wow!! Count me not interested!! Esp if it's mandatory. I sell ButtonGadget for $19.95 on PayPal. I'm setup to auto-generate unlock passwords and email buyers. All for only 88 cents per transaction...which means I get to keep $19.07. I don't know why these other systems charge so much!? -Chipp fr PayPal: Gross Amount: 19.95 Fee Amount: -0.88 Net Amount: 19.07 From jiml at netrin.com Thu Mar 27 18:41:01 2003 From: jiml at netrin.com (Jim Lambert) Date: Thu Mar 27 18:41:01 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: <200303272155.QAA10643@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: This is indeed OT but... Here's John Dowdell's take on Macromedia Central. http://www.macromedia.com/devnet/jd_forum/jd027.html He positions Central on a middle ground between the browser and a net-connected application, such as we can whip up with Rev. He makes a lot of "Trust." Basically, the Macromedia Central client is a kind of application installer/browser (if you will). It lets users see what kind of Flash 'applications' are available, downloads and installs 'em, handles local storage, handles communications between the Flash apps and to the backend(s), as well as ecommerce and other stuff (for which Macromedia snags 20%). Kinda sounds like a Rev app that brings over stacks. Wonder if they wrote it in Director!? Nah, that would be eating their own dog food. Echoes of the ill-fated Shockmachine and shockwave.com. Still, the idea of escaping browser tyranny through net-enabled applications is great. As noted earlier, Richard Gaskin wrote a wonderful paper on this years ago. Jim Lambert From valetia at mac.com Thu Mar 27 18:47:00 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Thu Mar 27 18:47:00 2003 Subject: Make an entire card scroll? In-Reply-To: <000501c2f49e$f7214cc0$c6abc050@Jez2> Message-ID: Hi all, What is the best way to make an entire card scroll (thereby achieving an effect similar to that of a web browser)? Valetia From alrice at ARCplanning.com Thu Mar 27 18:56:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Thu Mar 27 18:56:01 2003 Subject: security of the runtime In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4180D3F0-60AF-11D7-8074-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 03:55 PM, Scott Raney wrote: > The primary vulnerabilities are in the third-party libraries we use. > For example, I wouldn't be surprised if you could force the engine to > crash or execute arbitrary machine code by passing it a carefully > crafted bogus GIF/JPEG/PNG image, QT movie, or compress() stream. But > as long as you can maintain some control over the source of the data > you're using with those routines I wouldn't lose any sleep over the > possibility of a user being able to craft some other type of data that > would allow them to break into a machine using your program. Thanks for the feedback. It's interesting. I'm glad Rev apps are in better shape than your average C/C++ app that's out there. I suppose the third-party libs problem also includes the revdb and revxml libraries? For some apps, that could be the the entire bulk of data that's handled. For XML web services it could be even more critical. All you know is you are hitting some URI and getting XML back. I am looking at revxml "strings" output and can't tell what parser is being used. I see some C++ ganga in there, some Codewarrior stuff, some links to CoreFoundation. What 3rd party lib does revxml use? Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From scott at tactilemedia.com Thu Mar 27 19:06:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Thu Mar 27 19:06:01 2003 Subject: Make an entire card scroll? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Recently, "valetia at mac.com" wrote: > What is the best way to make an entire card scroll (thereby achieving an > effect similar to that of a web browser)? Place all the content of the card in a group and scroll the group. Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design ----- E: scott at tactilemedia.com W: http://www.tactilemedia.com From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Thu Mar 27 20:49:00 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Thu Mar 27 20:49:00 2003 Subject: Group Background Behavior In-Reply-To: Message-ID: You need to "place" the group on your existing cards. Assuming you are using Rev 1.1.1 and not the pre-beta, open the Application Overview, select Groups and then hilite your group in the list on the right. If it shows controls in a particular group, use the slider button to switch to a list of groups first. Then use the "Place" popup button above the list to say "Place on all cards". Or go to a card without the group and from the Object menu, choose "Place Group" and select the one you want to place. Cheers, Sarah sarahr at genesearch.com.au http://www.troz.net/Rev/ On Friday, March 28, 2003, at 06:39 am, Jez wrote: > Why. when I group things together and set the group's background > behaviour > property to true, is the group only visible on cards that I create > from that > point onwards ? I want it visible on cards I have already created and > coded - how can I achieve this ? > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > From chipp at chipp.com Thu Mar 27 20:52:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Thu Mar 27 20:52:01 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Jim, Thanks for the link. Now I get where they're going. It's like the 'ubiquitous stack player' we sometimes chat about around here. One that can download and run stacks just by clicking on a link. They're providing the distribution service along with a UDDI type directory service -- while charging a toll along the way (when commerce is involved). They've correctly identified the limits of such a device - specifically focussed in the security sandbox area. While interesting, I'll be very surprised if it really takes off. I have seen this model before, and it's a very difficult one to make work. Lot's of companies have spent a lot of $$$ trying to launch similar products (dodots, thePort, IBM to name a few). But, then again, the Flash community is very large, and there are some creative types out there. Course, I still can't find any public Web Services which I would want to embed in a Flash (or RR) app. Not sure that Emperor (WS) is wearing all that much right now. Here are a couple of very intersting things to watch for. 1) How big is the main download going to be? 2) How 'intrusive' will it be? Will it auto-install in the sysTray? Will it 'check for updates' without permission? Will it have *any* spyware? 3) How long before hackers can figure a way to spread viruses using the tool. It *will* happen. 4) How will Macromedia respond when it does get hacked? 5) How will Macromedia deal with content? Will *they* censor specific content, such as porn, mp3s or hacker tools, etc? This is potentially a tough one, with some serious legal consequences both ways. Recently, I looked at purchasing an IO pen from Logitech. But was immediately turned off by the ~20Mb .NET installation required. I suppose it was developed using C# -- so now I have to install 20Mb just so the programmers don't have to keep track of their pointers;-). Basically, all the software does is download JPG's from the pen to my computer via USB --- 20Mbs! You got to be kidding! I'm currently knee deep in the client side of a content management system rewrite and using RR. When finished, it will be an excellent example of the success of client interfaces vs. browser interfaces. Basically the exact stuff Richard Gaskin wrote about (and Scott Raney as well). Interesting to note, it's amazing how user expectations of clients vs. browser (form based) interfaces are so far apart. While typical web form application interface is pretty much a no-brainer these days, crafting the same functionality (and of course making it significantly easier to use), is not only a challenge, but one which users will voice the limitations of quickly! Chipp From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Thu Mar 27 20:54:00 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Thu Mar 27 20:54:00 2003 Subject: File's comments on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <9419521A-60BF-11D7-9DC2-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Here is an AppleScript that asks you to choose a file and tells you the comment attached. You can use this from with a Revolution script and have it return the comment which you can then read as "the result". tell application "Finder" set tFile to choose file set tComments to the comment of tFile display dialog tComments end tell Cheers, Sarah sarahr at genesearch.com.au http://www.troz.net/Rev/ On Friday, March 28, 2003, at 01:14 am, rom1 wrote: > Hello, i'm working on an on-screen portfolio. I'd like to get the text > from > that comments-field in the info window. > Anyone here knows how to do it ? > > Romain > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > From pixelbird at interisland.net Thu Mar 27 21:53:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Thu Mar 27 21:53:01 2003 Subject: How to rotate a graphic In-Reply-To: <200303271551.KAA32217@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: I tried: rotate me by 45 rotate graphic "CALL" by 45 ...don't work. How do I rotate a graphic? TIA, Ken N. From ambassador at fourthworld.com Thu Mar 27 22:31:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Thu Mar 27 22:31:01 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: <453C6547-609E-11D7-9042-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com> Message-ID: Trevor DeVore wrote: > For some Flash developers this will be great and they will love it. I > agree with you however. I don't want someone else to have as much > control over the player that my app is running in as it appears that > Central will have. This is a very timely discussion: I've been working on a variant of RevNet as a standalone so I can distribute small freeware "applets" that I otherwise wouldn't want to support as full-fledge applications. Along the way I considered making a standalone version of RevNet itself, but I don't hear a lot of requests here for that sort of thing so I haven't pursued it heavily yet. However, this discussion of Macromedia's effort and the recent long thread about Konfabulator raise the question anew, tempered by the considerations you raised. The upside of the RevNet model is that since it's just an index and is openly accessible for anyone to add stuff to it in real time, it doesn't impose restrictions on how a stack is distributed or behaves. In essence, what we're really talking about is a form of player app, but one that provides a basic framework (a sort of "home stack") for the user experience. Thus far most Rev, MC, and even SuperCard developers tend to focus on standalones, and my previous attempts in each of these camps over the years to see if there was much interest in such a "player" app met with enthusiasm from only a very few developers. Is this an idea whose time has come? -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From bvg at mac.com Thu Mar 27 22:38:01 2003 From: bvg at mac.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?=) Date: Thu Mar 27 22:38:01 2003 Subject: How to rotate a graphic In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2B40A55B-60CE-11D7-9B96-003065AD94A4@mac.com> "rotate" is for pictures, use "revRotatePoly" instead. On Freitag, M?r 28, 2003, at 00:58 Europe/Zurich, Ken Norris wrote: > I tried: > > rotate me by 45 > rotate graphic "CALL" by 45 > > ...don't work. > > How do I rotate a graphic? > > TIA, > Ken N. > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From kray at sonsothunder.com Thu Mar 27 22:44:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Thu Mar 27 22:44:01 2003 Subject: How to rotate a graphic In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <00b301c2f4db$cd29a970$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Ken, Check out "angle" (as in "set the angle...") Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Ken Norris > Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2003 5:59 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: How to rotate a graphic > > > I tried: > > rotate me by 45 > rotate graphic "CALL" by 45 > > ...don't work. > > How do I rotate a graphic? > > TIA, > Ken N. > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From kray at sonsothunder.com Thu Mar 27 22:46:00 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Thu Mar 27 22:46:00 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <00b401c2f4dc$0881c520$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> > Recently, I looked at purchasing an IO pen from Logitech. But > was immediately turned off by the ~20Mb .NET installation > required. I suppose it was developed using C# -- so now I > have to install 20Mb just so the programmers don't have to > keep track of their pointers;-). Basically, all the software > does is download JPG's from the pen to my computer via USB > --- 20Mbs! You got to be kidding! I know what you mean. I looked at a SHAREWARE program that was written in VB.NET and it required the same 20MB .NET framework to be downloaded. Sheesh! And I thought 1MB was too much to ask the user to download... ;-) Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Thu Mar 27 23:51:01 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Thu Mar 27 23:51:01 2003 Subject: Group Background Behavior In-Reply-To: <000501c2f49e$f7214cc0$c6abc050@Jez2> Message-ID: <7DBFD03B-60D8-11D7-BED8-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> If you are using 2.0, the Navigator palette makes this easy: drag the background into the bookmark area to make a bookmark. Switch to card view. Hilite the cards you want the background to be on, and the bookmark of the background. Click and drag the bookmark of the background onto any of the cards you hilited. The background will be placed on all the cards. Under any version of Rev, you can still use Navigator. It comes with a plugin to do this: Place BG onto Cards. On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 12:25 PM, Jez wrote: > Why. when I group things together and set the group's background > behaviour > property to true, is the group only visible on cards that I create > from that > point onwards ? I want it visible on cards I have already created and > coded - how can I achieve this ? > regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From zellner at neo.tamu.edu Fri Mar 28 00:48:01 2003 From: zellner at neo.tamu.edu (Ronald Zellner) Date: Fri Mar 28 00:48:01 2003 Subject: QT movie address in player In-Reply-To: <200303272155.QAA10476@www.runrev.com> References: <200303272155.QAA10476@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: When I play a QT movie in Revolution 1.1.1 by embedding it in a player, the pathway is absolute and will be incorrect if I move the files to another computer. This is especially problematic if it is converted to a standalone file which is delivered on a CD since the file can't be edited. Is there a way to have a stack start up and immediately display the movie that was originally embedded there. Ron From kray at sonsothunder.com Fri Mar 28 02:24:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Fri Mar 28 02:24:01 2003 Subject: QT movie address in player In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <00d401c2f4fa$7dc810a0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Ron, The movie isn't ever "embedded", it's always referenced to a movie file on disk. The main thing you want to do is make sure that the fileName property of the player object is a path that is relative to your standalone, and not an absolute path. For example, if you had the standalone in a folder, and there was a subfolder called "movies" that had the movie "test.mov", you would set the player object to have a fileName of "movies/test.mov". Hope this helps, Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > Ronald Zellner > Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2003 11:40 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: QT movie address in player > > > When I play a QT movie in Revolution 1.1.1 by embedding it in a > player, the pathway is absolute and will be incorrect if I move the > files to another computer. This is especially problematic if it is > converted to a standalone file which is delivered on a CD since the > file can't be edited. > Is there a way to have a stack start up and immediately display the > movie that was originally embedded there. > Ron > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From kray at sonsothunder.com Fri Mar 28 02:27:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Fri Mar 28 02:27:01 2003 Subject: File's comments on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <00d501c2f4fa$e8e70210$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> You might want to check Fred Rinaldi's web site (http://perso.wanadoo.fr/frederic.rinaldi/); he may have an XCMD that you can use. Note that this will work only in OS 9, and only with the PPC engine in 2.0. Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of rom1 > Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2003 9:03 AM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: File's comments on Mac > > > Hello, i'm working on an on-screen portfolio. I'd like to get > the text from that comments-field in the info window. Anyone > here knows how to do it ? > > Romain > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From kray at sonsothunder.com Fri Mar 28 02:27:16 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Fri Mar 28 02:27:16 2003 Subject: File's comments on Mac In-Reply-To: <9419521A-60BF-11D7-9DC2-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au> Message-ID: <00d601c2f4fb$002f6570$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Brilliant, Sarah... I should have thought of AppleScript... :-) Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Sarah > Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2003 7:50 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Re: File's comments on Mac > > > Here is an AppleScript that asks you to choose a file and > tells you the > comment attached. > You can use this from with a Revolution script and have it return the > comment which you can then read as "the result". > > tell application "Finder" > set tFile to choose file > set tComments to the comment of tFile > > display dialog tComments > end tell > > Cheers, > Sarah > sarahr at genesearch.com.au > http://www.troz.net/Rev/ > > On Friday, March 28, 2003, at 01:14 am, rom1 wrote: > > > Hello, i'm working on an on-screen portfolio. I'd like to > get the text > > from > > that comments-field in the info window. > > Anyone here knows how to do it ? > > > > Romain > > _______________________________________________ > > use-revolution mailing list > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From alrice at ARCplanning.com Fri Mar 28 02:29:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Fri Mar 28 02:29:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <8AE7C9ED-60EE-11D7-9ABC-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 01:09 PM, Ken Norris wrote: > Can you direct us to a website that is currently broadcasting live > content > with Flash? Nothing in particular comes to mind, but if you do a google search +flash +"massively multiplayer" there are a lot of interesting hits. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Fri Mar 28 02:52:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Fri Mar 28 02:52:00 2003 Subject: Tips links broken In-Reply-To: <200303271551.KAA32217@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: In the docs (Rev 1.1.1), I'm looking at 'Development Guide' under 'Images and Multimedia'. Under 'Tips' I click on Batch-import images and I get some off-the-wall Tip. I keep clicking, and I get more irrelevent Tips. So far, it hasn't shown me a single thing to do with images. What the heck is happening? TIA, Ken N. From ambassador at fourthworld.com Fri Mar 28 02:54:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Fri Mar 28 02:54:01 2003 Subject: Streaming media In-Reply-To: <8AE7C9ED-60EE-11D7-9ABC-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: Alex Rice wrote: > On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 01:09 PM, Ken Norris wrote: >> Can you direct us to a website that is currently broadcasting live >> content with Flash? > > Nothing in particular comes to mind, but if you do a google search > +flash +"massively multiplayer" there are a lot of interesting hits. These seem like two different things: "broadcasting" usually describes the distribution of electronic media from a source to multiple destinations which generally don't alter the content, just view it. "Multiplayer" systems can be done in a client-server manner, or even P2P, but are differentiated from broadcasting by having collaborative content. If collaboration is what you're after, MC has sockets and you can design your own protocols to handle anything you like. See Tuviah's excellent example of a simple chat system at the Rev contributions page. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From smcbride at comcast.net Fri Mar 28 03:36:00 2003 From: smcbride at comcast.net (Suzanne McBride) Date: Fri Mar 28 03:36:00 2003 Subject: Color my Word Message-ID: <001101c2f4ab$289a9700$b400a8c0@limstn01.de.comcast.net> This should seem easy, but it's not happening for me: My end users want to select a word and have it display in a particular color of their choosing. I visualize them clicking a button to open the color palette, settling on the intended shade, then clicking a word in their field to set it to that color. I may be getting the syntax wrong when I try to use menuPick, since setting the word to the Pen Color involves the Color submenu under Text. Has anyone done this kind of thing? Maybe without menuPick? Thanks, Suzanne -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tiffirgrReverse at ctc.net Fri Mar 28 03:36:23 2003 From: tiffirgrReverse at ctc.net (Raymond E. Griffith) Date: Fri Mar 28 03:36:23 2003 Subject: Make an entire card scroll? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 3/27/03 6:43 PM, valetia at mac.com at valetia at mac.com wrote: > Hi all, > > What is the best way to make an entire card scroll (thereby achieving an > effect similar to that of a web browser)? > > Valetia > Group everything on the card. Set the verticalscrollbar to true. From chipp at chipp.com Fri Mar 28 03:37:01 2003 From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters) Date: Fri Mar 28 03:37:01 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Richard, I've been involved in this "time has come" discussion on this list before...and it always seems to boil down to a security issue. As I'm sure you know, there are huge security holes in the current RevNet (not that any of us would take advantage of) which need be addressed before launching a standalone player. Of course, if you (like I do with ButtonGadget) control all the source stacks, you shouldn't have any problems, but if you want to create a ubiquitous player -- there are some major considerations. My thinking is it's best to 'certify' stacks. Even then, the Rev/MC model has much more power along with tampering opportunities than either Flash or JAVA. Both Flash and JAVA try to create a 'sandbox' to run in -- so they can't write to local files, open local files, etc.. Rev/MC can of course do this, though one may wish to restrict some of it in a player. Kevin also has thought a bit about how this could happen. If you're interested, you might try contacting him (or I) offlist. best, Chipp From wmb at internettrainer.com Fri Mar 28 03:52:01 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Fri Mar 28 03:52:01 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0D1C7224-60FA-11D7-B85D-003065430226@internettrainer.com> On Friday, Mar 28, 2003, at 02:48 Europe/Vienna, Chipp Walters wrote: > 1) How big is the main download going to be? > 2) How 'intrusive' will it be? Will it auto-install in the sysTray? > Will it > 'check for updates' without permission? Will it have *any* spyware? > 3) How long before hackers can figure a way to spread viruses using the > tool. It *will* happen. MM is preparing to be taken over from M$...=:o( > 4) How will Macromedia respond when it does get hacked? > 5) How will Macromedia deal with content? Will *they* censor specific > content, such as porn, mp3s or hacker tools, etc? This is potentially a > tough one, with some serious legal consequences both ways. Great anylysis over all..! Exactly thats the problem i tried to describe with the Shockwave/Flash online learning concepts... Thats the big point for rev/MC, because there are a lot of USers in the world, which dont have cable or DSL connections where traffic does not matter... regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From wmb at internettrainer.com Fri Mar 28 04:12:02 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Fri Mar 28 04:12:02 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: <00b401c2f4dc$0881c520$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: On Friday, Mar 28, 2003, at 04:42 Europe/Vienna, Ken Ray wrote: > I know what you mean. I looked at a SHAREWARE program that was written > in VB.NET and it required the same 20MB .NET framework to be > downloaded. > Sheesh! > > And I thought 1MB was too much to ask the user to download... ;-) Similar to Java. If the client has XP and you cant assume that he has Sun JVM installed 16 MB... No so much but also big 11MB QT. Again thats the biggest advantage of MC/rev. So please go o and dont loose it... regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From wmb at internettrainer.com Fri Mar 28 04:20:00 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Fri Mar 28 04:20:00 2003 Subject: Group Background Behavior In-Reply-To: <7DBFD03B-60D8-11D7-BED8-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> Message-ID: <070BD063-60FE-11D7-B85D-003065430226@internettrainer.com> Geoff On Friday, Mar 28, 2003, at 05:48 Europe/Vienna, Geoff Canyon wrote: Hello Geoff, > If you are using 2.0, the Navigator palette makes this easy: drag the > background into the bookmark area to make a bookmark. Switch to card > view. Hilite the cards you want the background to be on, and the > bookmark of the background. Click and drag the bookmark of the > background onto any of the cards you hilited. The background will be > placed on all the cards. sounds great, but where is the Navigator in 2.0 beta4.?? I have an Application Browser - not more...?? regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From rom1 at xplicitnetwork.com Fri Mar 28 04:49:01 2003 From: rom1 at xplicitnetwork.com (rom1) Date: Fri Mar 28 04:49:01 2003 Subject: File's comments on Mac the sequel Message-ID: Thanks for the help. I'm going to try it tonight (Paris). Romain From jhurley at infostations.com Fri Mar 28 09:55:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Fri Mar 28 09:55:01 2003 Subject: Button vs. Message box scripts; P.S. Invert matrices? In-Reply-To: <200303280913.EAA27211@www.runrev.com> References: <200303280913.EAA27211@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Now here's a funny thing: I ran the following single line in the msg box: revrotatepoly graphic "MyPoly", 90 and sure enough, the graphic "MyPoly" rotated 90 degrees. But the button handler: On mouseUp revrotatepoly graphic "MyPoly", 90 end mouseUp return an error: "Chunk source is not a container." Why is it that the msg box can find the graphic but the button cannot? Jim P.S. I don't suppose anyone has a routine to invert matrices? From trevor at mangomultimedia.com Fri Mar 28 11:36:02 2003 From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore) Date: Fri Mar 28 11:36:02 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 08:48 PM, Chipp Walters wrote: > Here are a couple of very intersting things to watch for. > > 1) How big is the main download going to be? When Central was shown at FlashForward it was installed in a matter of seconds. There is ActionScript avaiable that allows you to launch Central from a Flash movie embedded in a browser window. When Macromedia did the demo the program prompted the person to install and installed pretty quickly. Granted it was on a high speed connection on a fast computer but it was still really fast. Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Multimedia trevor at mangomultimedia.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Fri Mar 28 13:00:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Fri Mar 28 13:00:01 2003 Subject: QT movie address in player In-Reply-To: <200303280913.EAA27192@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 23:39:47 -0600 > From: Ronald Zellner > Subject: QT movie address in player > > When I play a QT movie in Revolution 1.1.1 by embedding it in a > player, the pathway is absolute and will be incorrect if I move the > files to another computer. This is especially problematic if it is > converted to a standalone file which is delivered on a CD since the > file can't be edited. > Is there a way to have a stack start up and immediately display the > movie that was originally embedded there. > Ron ---------- Hi Ron, Actually we just covered this a few days ago. NOTE: If your stack is already a standalone, you'll have to rebuild it to implement these. There are two basic ways: 1) If you want to keep the movie in an offstack file (saves stack memory) like you already have it: a) Put the stack file and the movie file in the same folder, which normally becomes the defaultFolder at startup of the stack. b) Have your stack simply call the movie file for the player by its fileName. The assumption here is that the movie file is in the defaultFolder. c) Burn the FOLDER containing the stack and the movie onto the CD. 2) If you aren't concerned about stack size (memory) you can embed the movie into the stack as a videoClip object: a) Pull down the File menu > Import As Control > Video File... Choose your movie file and Rev will import it into your stack as a control object. b) Now use this simple command (using your own movie name of course): play videoClip "MyHotMovie" HTH :+) Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Fri Mar 28 13:14:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Fri Mar 28 13:14:01 2003 Subject: How to rotate a graphic In-Reply-To: <200303280913.EAA27192@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 04:34:23 +0100 > Subject: Re: How to rotate a graphic > From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?= > > "rotate" is for pictures, use "revRotatePoly" instead. ---------- Thanks, but I already tried that; it won't rotate a circular/oval graphic, which is what I want to do. The graphic is a simple drawing of a wheel with some text in it. I've tried everything I can find to rotate a circular graphic but nothing works. I suppose I can redraw it or capture it as an image, and then rotate that, but it would be nice to know whether or not we can rotate a circular or oval graphic. Best regards, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Fri Mar 28 13:23:00 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Fri Mar 28 13:23:00 2003 Subject: How to rotate a graphic In-Reply-To: <200303280913.EAA27192@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: "Ken Ray" > Subject: RE: How to rotate a graphic > Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 21:40:35 -0600 > Organization: Sons of Thunder Software > > Ken, > > Check out "angle" (as in "set the angle...") ---------- Thanks Ken, but no joy. Nothing appears to work on a circular/oval graphic. At least it's name, which appears as text in it, doesn't turn. Ken N. From scott at tactilemedia.com Fri Mar 28 13:31:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Fri Mar 28 13:31:01 2003 Subject: How to rotate a graphic In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Recently, "Ken Norris" wrote: > Nothing appears to work on a circular/oval graphic. At least it's name, > which appears as text in it, doesn't turn. You should note that currently text cannot be rotated in Rev/MC, regardless of what object displays it. You can simulate this effect by rotating a graphic but you cannot rotate actual text data. Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design ----- E: scott at tactilemedia.com W: http://www.tactilemedia.com From ambassador at fourthworld.com Fri Mar 28 15:01:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Fri Mar 28 15:01:01 2003 Subject: [OT] Flash wants standalones In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Chipp Walters wrote: > I've been involved in this "time has come" discussion on this list > before...and it always seems to boil down to a security issue. As I'm sure > you know, there are huge security holes in the current RevNet (not that any > of us would take advantage of) which need be addressed before launching a > standalone player. Of course, if you (like I do with ButtonGadget) control > all the source stacks, you shouldn't have any problems, but if you want to > create a ubiquitous player -- there are some major considerations. The "security holes" in RevNet -- or any Rev-based app -- are no more or less serious than with any other executable file, as addressed in the NetApps article. Whether an application is downloaded from a browser or Revolution, neither the browser nor Rev control its behavior. If these same security exposures are not present in the new Macromedia initiative or in Konfabulator, the usefulness of such systems is potentially quite hampered. How often would you use Word if you had to store your data remotely? And would you feel safer doing so? Download.com delivers thousands of executable files daily for years. To the best of my knowledge there have been no widespread abuses from Trojan horses, etc., and zero lawsuits. If a file is identified as a problem it is removed and complaints go to the developer of the offending wares. With GNUtella, Hotline, and other P2P file-sharing systems the risks are potentially greater and with almost zero accountability, yet traffic in executables on those systems only grows larger month after month. Meanwhile, the biggest headlines in security news have been with so-called "secure" systems like mail and Web servers. So while I don't want to give the impression I have a "What, me worry?" opinion of security issues, I think we'd all agree there seem to be two very different sets of expectations for security of things inside and outside of the Web browser. Java, Flash, and JavaScript have raised expectations for security of browser-based apps at least as effectively as they have lowered expectations for efficiency and usability. ;) But for reasons I can't explain, I see that no such concerns have slowed interest in using the same HTTP to deliver desktop apps. I'd wager that in the time it took you to read this a few thousand executable files have been downloaded across the Web with narry a concern that it will eat their registry or overwrite critical files. These apps could do so, of course, just as we could with Rev. But they don't, at least frequently enough to earn a broad sense of trust in the practice, however mislaid it may be. Thus far only one issue specific to RevNet has been cited as a potential threat, "spoofing" (editing a file entry so it appears to be something else or from someone other than the name used in the submission form). This issue was addressed shortly after the initial release with the addition of a password to the submission form. Aside from spoofing, all other potential risks cited to date are shared by all downloaded desktop apps. If any specific to RevNet are reported I'll address them as quickly as I added the submission password, but the biggest risks are things any app can do regardless of whether its URL is clicked in RevNet or a browser. With enhancements to the secureMode property we could restrict file I/O to a specific folder, but I can think of no way to restrict the nearly infinite range of application behaviors without compromising valuable functionality. Even with limited file I/O, if you allow access to launch, shell(), the registry, or AppleScript you're still exposing the system to potentially devastating actions. Yet if we remove all sources of potential risk, what's left that's worth working with? It would seem simpler to just deliver a stack as a standalone than cut it down it for distribution with a restricted RevNet (and you'd probably have at least as many downloads). So while I'm interested in exploring ways to enhance the engine, I see no reason to slow development of interesting systems in the meantime. I may add a disclaimer that requires a one-time confirmation for my own protection (I live in California ), but I have reservations about limiting the range of possibilities beyond that. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From alrice at ARCplanning.com Fri Mar 28 16:53:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Fri Mar 28 16:53:01 2003 Subject: Group Background Behavior In-Reply-To: <7DBFD03B-60D8-11D7-BED8-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> Message-ID: <3279CF34-6167-11D7-B57A-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Thursday, March 27, 2003, at 09:48 PM, Geoff Canyon wrote: > If you are using 2.0, the Navigator palette makes this easy: drag the > background into the bookmark area to make a bookmark. Switch to card > view. Hilite the cards you want the background to be on, and the > bookmark of the background. Click and drag the bookmark of the > background onto any of the cards you hilited. The background will be > placed on all the cards. > > Under any version of Rev, you can still use Navigator. It comes with a > plugin to do this: Place BG onto Cards. > > Here is something similar. Can rev navigator do this? I'm copying cards from one stack to another. If the destination stack has background "fu" and the copied card has a group "fu" then I end up with 2 fu backgrounds in the destination stack. Repeat several times and now I have a whole mess of backgrounds, and have to pick through the duplicate groups, delete them and place the 1 group I want on the cards. I need a copy-card-and-merge-backgrounds tool. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Fri Mar 28 18:15:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Fri Mar 28 18:15:01 2003 Subject: Color my Word In-Reply-To: <001101c2f4ab$289a9700$b400a8c0@limstn01.de.comcast.net> Message-ID: <20030328231212.91406.qmail@web20005.mail.yahoo.com> --- Suzanne McBride wrote: > My end users want to select a word and have it > display in a particular color of their > choosing. > I visualize them clicking a button to open the > color palette, settling on the intended shade, > then clicking a word in their field to set it > to that color. don't you usually select the text, then choose a link, a color, or whatever acts on the text? > I may be getting the syntax > wrong when I try to use menuPick, since setting > the word to the Pen Color involves the Color > submenu under Text. Has anyone done this kind > of thing? Maybe without menuPick? ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From erikhans08 at yahoo.com Fri Mar 28 18:51:01 2003 From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen) Date: Fri Mar 28 18:51:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1212 - 14 msgs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030328234741.65743.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com> --- Monte Goulding wrote: > It seems you are getting mixed up between our > ability to use QuickTime > streaming in the player object to receive > streamed media and our INABILITY > to stream from rev to another QuickTime player. completely. > To stream from rev you would > need to implement the Real-Time Transport > Protocol to create an RTP server. > You would also need to set up some way for the > client to find the server if > you are talking about peer-to-peer streaming. > > Check out http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~hgs/rtp/ > for more info on developing a > server. thanks, i will start studying up. it never ends does it? ===== erik at erikhansen.org http://www.erikhansen.org __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From david at kwinter.ca Fri Mar 28 18:52:01 2003 From: david at kwinter.ca (David Kwinter) Date: Fri Mar 28 18:52:01 2003 Subject: Recursive subfolder file scanning Message-ID: In the interest of making a backup utility I've found a problem which perhaps someone has delt with before I would like to specify a folder say: /Macintosh HD/Users/davidkwi/ And have it identify all files with full paths, then in each folder, sub-folder, sub-sub-folder, etc. collect all paths for all files regardless of the depth of folders. Resulting with something like: /Macintosh HD/Users/davidkwi/Shared/song.mp3 /Macinotsh HD/Users/davidkwi/Shared/desktoppic.jpg /Macintosh HD/Users/davidkwi/Pictures/Vacations/Whistler/mountain.tiff I'm familiar with "the files" and "the folders" - the solution must be some kind of function which gets the files and folders for a starting directory then calls itself with each subfolder? From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Fri Mar 28 20:10:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Fri Mar 28 20:10:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1212 - 14 msgs In-Reply-To: <20030328234741.65743.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030328234741.65743.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: >thanks, i will start studying up. >it never ends does it? Ain't that the troof brother, ain't that the troof. -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From scott at tactilemedia.com Fri Mar 28 20:20:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Fri Mar 28 20:20:01 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1212 - 14 msgs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > thanks, i will start studying up. > it never ends does it? Rev/MC is often deeper than most folks expect. Many developers here (myself included) have been using MC for years and are still learning things all the time... Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design ----- E: scott at tactilemedia.com W: http://www.tactilemedia.com From ambassador at fourthworld.com Fri Mar 28 22:32:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Fri Mar 28 22:32:01 2003 Subject: Recursive subfolder file scanning In-Reply-To: Message-ID: David Kwinter wrote: > I would like to specify a folder say: > > /Macintosh HD/Users/davidkwi/ > > And have it identify all files with full paths, then in each folder, > sub-folder, sub-sub-folder, etc. collect all paths for all files regardless > of the depth of folders. > > Resulting with something like: > > /Macintosh HD/Users/davidkwi/Shared/song.mp3 > /Macinotsh HD/Users/davidkwi/Shared/desktoppic.jpg > /Macintosh HD/Users/davidkwi/Pictures/Vacations/Whistler/mountain.tiff > > I'm familiar with "the files" and "the folders" - the solution must be some > kind of function which gets the files and folders for a starting directory > then calls itself with each subfolder? -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From kray at sonsothunder.com Fri Mar 28 22:40:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Fri Mar 28 22:40:01 2003 Subject: Recursive subfolder file scanning In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <005301c2f5a4$5b885c20$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> David, I have a Tip on my web site specifically about that: http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_file007 Hope this helps, Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of > David Kwinter > Sent: Friday, March 28, 2003 5:49 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Recursive subfolder file scanning > > > In the interest of making a backup utility I've found a > problem which perhaps someone has delt with before > > I would like to specify a folder say: > > /Macintosh HD/Users/davidkwi/ > > And have it identify all files with full paths, then in each > folder, sub-folder, sub-sub-folder, etc. collect all paths > for all files regardless of the depth of folders. > > Resulting with something like: > > /Macintosh HD/Users/davidkwi/Shared/song.mp3 > /Macinotsh HD/Users/davidkwi/Shared/desktoppic.jpg > /Macintosh HD/Users/davidkwi/Pictures/Vacations/Whistler/mountain.tiff > > I'm familiar with "the files" and "the folders" - the > solution must be some kind of function which gets the files > and folders for a starting directory then calls itself with > each subfolder? > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-> revolution > From kray at sonsothunder.com Fri Mar 28 22:40:25 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Fri Mar 28 22:40:25 2003 Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #1212 - 14 msgs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <005401c2f5a4$6fe697e0$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> > Rev/MC is often deeper than most folks expect. Many > developers here (myself > included) have been using MC for years and are still learning > things all the time... Amen, brother! Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ From jbradshaw at blueyonder.co.uk Sat Mar 29 04:16:01 2003 From: jbradshaw at blueyonder.co.uk (Jez) Date: Sat Mar 29 04:16:01 2003 Subject: List Behaviour Message-ID: <000501c2f5d3$55b84740$c6abc050@Jez2> I want to get the line number in a scrolling list field that the user clicks on. If I set the "Hilite Lines and Selected Text" property on I can use LineOffset(the selection,me) to get the line number. But what if I don't want that property set ? Is there a way I can get the line number without having a selection ? From jbradshaw at blueyonder.co.uk Sat Mar 29 04:20:01 2003 From: jbradshaw at blueyonder.co.uk (Jez) Date: Sat Mar 29 04:20:01 2003 Subject: Group problems Message-ID: <000b01c2f5d3$ebae79e0$c6abc050@Jez2> I have several scrolling list fields which have the "Hilite Clicked Lines and Selected Text" property on, all working fine. I put these into a Group and strange things start happening - the entry I click on often seems not to be selected at all, but I click around a bit and return and suddenly its working again. Is this a bug ? From valetia at mac.com Sat Mar 29 08:58:01 2003 From: valetia at mac.com (valetia at mac.com) Date: Sat Mar 29 08:58:01 2003 Subject: Make an entire card scroll? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Scott, >> What is the best way to make an entire card scroll (thereby achieving an >> effect similar to that of a web browser)? > > Place all the content of the card in a group and scroll the group. Is there a section within the RR docs or anywhere else that explains how this is done? Although I've heard of scrolling groups before, I haven't been able to find any mention of it in the docs (where I've looked). I'm hoping I've missed something comprehensive, so I can check it out. A couple of questions that come to mind are: * What is the recommended or easiest way to make a group scroll? * How do you position the portion of the content that cannot be seen before the group is scrolled? TIA, Valetia From steve at messimercomputing.com Sat Mar 29 10:16:00 2003 From: steve at messimercomputing.com (Stephen Messimer) Date: Sat Mar 29 10:16:00 2003 Subject: send to msg substack Message-ID: Hi, I am attempting to send a message to a substack of a plugin. The script doesn't work because the msg can't find the stack. Here's the script. on preOpenStack send ckState to stack "xData" -- ckState is a handler in a substack (xData) of a plugin located in the Rev plugins folder end preOpenStack My assumption was that because stack xData is a substack of a plugin and that Rev is up and running, the substack would be among the "stacks in use". Do I need to supply some sort of path info to the plugin? Thanks in advance for your help. Steve Stephen R. Messimer, PA 208 1st Ave. South Escanaba, MI 49829 www.messimercomputing.com From scott at tactilemedia.com Sat Mar 29 12:23:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Sat Mar 29 12:23:01 2003 Subject: List Behaviour In-Reply-To: <000501c2f5d3$55b84740$c6abc050@Jez2> Message-ID: Recently, Jez wrote: > I want to get the line number in a scrolling list field that the user clicks > on. If I set the "Hilite Lines and Selected Text" property on I can use > LineOffset(the selection,me) > to get the line number. But what if I don't want that property set ? Is > there a way I can get the line number without having a selection ? Try "the clickLine". Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design Email: scott at tactilemedia.com Web: www.tactilemedia.com From livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk Sat Mar 29 12:58:00 2003 From: livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk (Graham Samuel) Date: Sat Mar 29 12:58:00 2003 Subject: Icon queries Message-ID: I'm reaching the stage with my first Revo development of trying to build a saleable version of the app - in fact three versions, Mac OS9, Mac OSX and Windows. I am gradually solving various problems. The next big thing is the Icon Question. When I used to develop using SuperCard on pre-X Macs, I learned just enough about icons and ResEdit to create a family (is this the right word?) of icons for each of my apps, and I used the SC StandaloneMaker tool to plug them into my app. Each icon has to be a family and not just a single image because you need coloured ones, black and white ones, dimmed ones, small ones etc to provide the OS with all the variations it needs. I never completely understood how to create a complete family in ResEdit because I never found any kind of account of the way Mac icons work, but somehow I got it to work. Now with RR, I am faced with having to create three different icon sets, all obeying rules I know absolutely nothing about and all requiring construction tools I've never even heard of (except perhaps ResEdit, but this may no longer be relevant). I have searched the usual RR sources, and there is a huge wealth of icon-related discussion in the archive, but so far I haven't come across any kind of cross-platform icon cookbook that essentially tells me the shortest route to custom icons for apps and their documents on each platform. Have I missed it? I hope not, since I would be a woefully bad author of such a thing myself... if anyone can help, please tell the list! TIA Graham -- ------------------------------------------------------------------- Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK & France From pixelbird at interisland.net Sat Mar 29 13:14:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sat Mar 29 13:14:01 2003 Subject: List Behaviour In-Reply-To: <200303290917.EAA13828@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > From: "Jez" > Subject: List Behaviour > Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 09:12:34 -0000 > > I want to get the line number in a scrolling list field that the user clicks > on. If I set the "Hilite Lines and Selected Text" property on I can use > LineOffset(the selection,me) > to get the line number. But what if I don't want that property set ? Is > there a way I can get the line number without having a selection ? ---------- Check out the clickLine (it's in the Dictionary). HTH, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Sat Mar 29 13:23:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sat Mar 29 13:23:01 2003 Subject: How to rotate a graphic In-Reply-To: <200303290917.EAA13828@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 10:28:15 -0800 > Subject: Re: How to rotate a graphic > From: Scott Rossi > > Recently, "Ken Norris" wrote: > >> Nothing appears to work on a circular/oval graphic. At least it's name, >> which appears as text in it, doesn't turn. > > You should note that currently text cannot be rotated in Rev/MC, regardless > of what object displays it. You can simulate this effect by rotating a > graphic but you cannot rotate actual text data. ---------- OK, now I know. Thank you. But if you say you can't rotate the text, then what do you mean by simulating the effect? I'm guessing you mean using an _image_ with text in it as part of the picture, in which case the whole thing should rotate, but not text as a property value, in this case, the name or label. Is that what you mean? Ken N. From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Sat Mar 29 13:58:00 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Sat Mar 29 13:58:00 2003 Subject: Group Background Behavior In-Reply-To: <070BD063-60FE-11D7-B85D-003065430226@internettrainer.com> Message-ID: I'm not sure if it's included in the beta. You can always get a copy at the url I included: http://www.inspiredlogic.com/navigator On Friday, March 28, 2003, at 01:16 AM, Wolfgang M. Bereuter wrote: > sounds great, but where is the Navigator in 2.0 beta4.?? > I have an Application Browser - not more...?? > regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From scott at tactilemedia.com Sat Mar 29 14:33:01 2003 From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi) Date: Sat Mar 29 14:33:01 2003 Subject: How to rotate a graphic In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Recently, Ken Norris wrote: > I'm guessing you mean using an _image_ with text in it as part of the > picture, in which case the whole thing should rotate, but not text as a > property value, in this case, the name or label. > > Is that what you mean? Yes -- you can try it out and see for yourself. Regards, Scott Rossi Creative Director Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design Email: scott at tactilemedia.com Web: www.tactilemedia.com From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Sat Mar 29 14:43:01 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Sat Mar 29 14:43:01 2003 Subject: Group Background Behavior In-Reply-To: <3279CF34-6167-11D7-B57A-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> Message-ID: <33329877-621E-11D7-BED8-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> I can think of a couple ways to do this with Navigator. The easiest is probably this (not tested, you might have to play with it): 1. On the Stack menu, choose the source stack. 2. On the Card menu, choose Card List. 3. Hilite the cards you want to copy. 4. Go to the command panel and enter this code and click "Do": copy tID to stack "targetStack" -- whatever stack you want put it into tNewID if there is a group "fu" of tNewID then delete group "fu" of tNewID place background "fu" onto tNewID end if Note that use of the command panel in Navigator requires a licensed version of Revolution. It uses the "do" command with a script that is longer than ten lines even if you don't enter any code at all. This might change in a future version of Revolution. On Friday, March 28, 2003, at 01:49 PM, Alex Rice wrote: > Here is something similar. Can rev navigator do this? > > I'm copying cards from one stack to another. If the destination stack > has background "fu" and the copied card has a group "fu" then I end up > with 2 fu backgrounds in the destination stack. Repeat several times > and now I have a whole mess of backgrounds, and have to pick through > the duplicate groups, delete them and place the 1 group I want on the > cards. I need a copy-card-and-merge-backgrounds tool. > regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Sat Mar 29 14:46:01 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Sat Mar 29 14:46:01 2003 Subject: Recursive subfolder file scanning In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The Rev compared to REALbasic white paper on the runrev web site has an example stack included that does exactly this. regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Sat Mar 29 14:49:00 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Sat Mar 29 14:49:00 2003 Subject: List Behaviour In-Reply-To: <000501c2f5d3$55b84740$c6abc050@Jez2> Message-ID: <0A250AE0-621F-11D7-BED8-003065683ECC@inspiredlogic.com> Check the hilitedLines of the field. On Saturday, March 29, 2003, at 01:12 AM, Jez wrote: > I want to get the line number in a scrolling list field that the user > clicks > on. If I set the "Hilite Lines and Selected Text" property on I can use > LineOffset(the selection,me) > to get the line number. But what if I don't want that property set ? Is > there a way I can get the line number without having a selection ? regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From edgore at shinra.com Sat Mar 29 16:48:01 2003 From: edgore at shinra.com (Edwin Gore) Date: Sat Mar 29 16:48:01 2003 Subject: Introduction and a question Message-ID: <001801c2f63c$5fe41910$6901a8c0@ed> Just wanted to do a quick introduction. New to using Revolution, but I was a old Hypercard/SuperCard/Toolbook hand several years ago. Found out about Revolution through Richard Gaskin's FourthWorld site, and was intrigued enough to download the free version, and then buy the Student fo my daughter who is learning to program with it. Quick question... Am I correct in thinking that having a list field on a card messes up open and close field messages for other fields on the card? We are trying to do something where the navigation is a scrolling list in a group on the left of the card and clicking takes you to a specific card. Once there, you can edit one of several fields on that card, and there is some validation doen through onpen and close field scripts. The problem is that once you have clicked on the listField the other fields on the card no longer seem to get open and close field messages when you click on them and the insertion point never appears in them. YOu can still click in the field and type, but an openfield never gets sent and the insertion point never appears. Weird. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alrice at ARCplanning.com Sat Mar 29 17:59:00 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Sat Mar 29 17:59:00 2003 Subject: externals APIs? In-Reply-To: <20030320003203.39587.qmail@web20009.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <9AD14B40-6239-11D7-B2B1-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 05:32 PM, erik hansen wrote: >> The Rev External SDK mentions "You may also >> find one of the HyperCard >> books that cover externals useful." >> >> Is the De Voto, Kamins, Winkler book the one >> being referred to? > > correct I bought a copy of _Hypertalk 2.2 The Book_, 2nd ed. It looks like a fine book and I'm glad I bought it, despite that the chapters on externals are removed from this edition. on p5 it says """To make space for new information about hypertalk itself and because they covered only versions through 1.2.5, the chapters "Overview of Externals" and "Glue Routine Refernce" have been removed from this edition. ... can be found in Apple's HyperCard Script Language Guide, 3rd ed. Appendix A """ IS this information available electronically anywhere? Although it's easy to find these out of print books on Amazon, it's still tedious and time consuming. Thanks, Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From kkaufman at snet.net Sat Mar 29 20:59:01 2003 From: kkaufman at snet.net (Kurt Kaufman) Date: Sat Mar 29 20:59:01 2003 Subject: Make an entire card scroll? Message-ID: Valetia asked: * What is the recommended or easiest way to make a group scroll? * How do you position the portion of the content that cannot be seen before the group is scrolled? 1) Determine the size of stack window needed. 2) Position all objects in visible portion of stack window. 3) Group all objects in single group. (with pointer tool chosen, Menus: Edit-->Select All, then Object--> Group Selected). 4) Now when you doubleclick on the card you get the group's Properties window. Under the Group Tab of this window, make sure both the horizontal and vertical scrollbars (of the group) are enabled. Close the group's Properties window. 5) (The exact nature of the next step depends on the content of your stack). With the Pointer tool still chosen, click on the largest object in the stack window (a background graphic, perhaps) and drag it towards the upper left corner of the stack window until the object's lower right corner (with scrollbars) is visible. Resize the object (in effect resizing the visible portion of the group) until it fits the size of the stack window. Doubleclick to get the group's Properties window again. On the Basic tab, enable "Lock Location and Size". That's the location and size of the group's borders, not that of individual items within that group. 6) At this point, choose the browse tool, and you can use the group's scrollbars to scroll to another portion of the group for editing. 7) Select the group by clicking on it with the pointer tool, then go to menu Object-->Edit Group. This will allow you to edit (reposition, whatever) individual objects within the group. When you are done, be sure to go to menu Object-->Stop Editing Group. Repeat steps 6 and 7 until done. There may be other ways of doing this, maybe with fewer steps, but I hope this helps you to understand how the group works with scrollbars. -Kurt ---------------------------------------------------------------- We're in a bigger better war For your patriotic pastime, We don't know what we're fighting for- But we didn't know the last time. -Ira Gershwin, "Strike Up the Band", 1927 From capellan2000 at yahoo.com Sat Mar 29 23:35:01 2003 From: capellan2000 at yahoo.com (Alejandro Tejada) Date: Sat Mar 29 23:35:01 2003 Subject: Button vs. Message box scripts; P.S. Invert matrices? In-Reply-To: <200303291708.MAA18302@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: <20030330043154.85056.qmail@web40506.mail.yahoo.com> on Fri Mar 28 09:55:01 2003 Jim Hurley wrote: >I ran the following single line in the msg box: >revrotatepoly graphic "MyPoly", 90 >and sure enough, the graphic "MyPoly" rotated 90 >degrees. >But the button handler: >On mouseUp >revrotatepoly graphic "MyPoly", 90 >end mouseUp >return an error: "Chunk source is not a container." >Why is it that the msg box can find the graphic >but the button cannot? My guess is that this function is using the selectedobject as argument, so probably if you script first "select graphic number X" it would work. I don't have RunRev installed in this machine to test now. >P.S. I don't suppose anyone has a routine to >invert matrices? Actually, I do. If you can wait until tomorrow, I can clean it a bit and upload to some place. Using matrices for scaling, rotating and skewing polygonal graphics is extraordinarly exact. You can transform the graphics as many times as you wish and always can retrace your steps to get the original graphic. The key for the exactitude of all these operations is to hold the exact values returned by these operations in a custom property of the graphic. I've called this property the "exactPoints" and is get BEFORE every operation and set AFTER the operations are done. Of course, if the exactPoints of a graphics is empty then is necesary to use the points, but only one time, because all operations create and set this custom property in the graphic. Serious graphic users will love to use matrices for rotating, skewing and scaling polygon graphics. Alejandro ===== Useful sites: http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/metacard/tips/ and /revolution/tips/ http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/metacard/ and /use-revolution/ http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From kray at sonsothunder.com Sun Mar 30 01:14:01 2003 From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray) Date: Sun Mar 30 01:14:01 2003 Subject: Introduction and a question In-Reply-To: <001801c2f63c$5fe41910$6901a8c0@ed> Message-ID: <00ca01c2f683$1e197a10$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Edwin, That's very strange. Can you let us know what version of Rev you're using and whether the listField's group is acting as a background (I'm pretty sure it does) or the other fields have any of their sharedText properties set to true? That would help track this down, Ken Ray Sons of Thunder Software Email: kray at sonsothunder.com Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ -----Original Message----- From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Edwin Gore Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2003 3:44 PM To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com Subject: Introduction and a question Just wanted to do a quick introduction. New to using Revolution, but I was a old Hypercard/SuperCard/Toolbook hand several years ago. Found out about Revolution through Richard Gaskin's FourthWorld site, and was intrigued enough to download the free version, and then buy the Student fo my daughter who is learning to program with it. Quick question... Am I correct in thinking that having a list field on a card messes up open and close field messages for other fields on the card? We are trying to do something where the navigation is a scrolling list in a group on the left of the card and clicking takes you to a specific card. Once there, you can edit one of several fields on that card, and there is some validation doen through onpen and close field scripts. The problem is that once you have clicked on the listField the other fields on the card no longer seem to get open and close field messages when you click on them and the insertion point never appears in them. YOu can still click in the field and type, but an openfield never gets sent and the insertion point never appears. Weird. From jhurley at infostations.com Sun Mar 30 02:29:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Sun Mar 30 02:29:01 2003 Subject: Button vs. Message box scripts; P.S. Invert matrices? In-Reply-To: <200303300615.BAA28948@www.runrev.com> References: <200303300615.BAA28948@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: >on Fri Mar 28 09:55:01 2003 >Jim Hurley wrote: > >>I ran the following single line in the msg box: > >revrotatepoly graphic "MyPoly", 90 >>and sure enough, the graphic "MyPoly" rotated 90 >>degrees. >>But the button handler: >>On mouseUp >>revrotatepoly graphic "MyPoly", 90 >>end mouseUp >>return an error: "Chunk source is not a container." >>Why is it that the msg box can find the graphic >>but the button cannot? > >My guess is that this function is using the >selectedobject as argument, so probably if >you script first "select graphic number X" >it would work. I don't have RunRev installed >in this machine to test now. > >>P.S. I don't suppose anyone has a routine to >>invert matrices? > >Actually, I do. If you can wait until tomorrow, >I can clean it a bit and upload to some place. > >Using matrices for scaling, rotating and skewing >polygonal graphics is extraordinarly exact. > >You can transform the graphics as many times as >you wish and always can retrace your steps to >get the original graphic. > >The key for the exactitude of all these operations >is to hold the exact values returned by these >operations in a custom property of the graphic. >I've called this property the "exactPoints" >and is get BEFORE every operation and set AFTER the >operations are done. Of course, if the exactPoints >of a graphics is empty then is necesary to use >the points, but only one time, because all operations >create and set this custom property in the graphic. > >Serious graphic users will love to use matrices >for rotating, skewing and scaling polygon graphics. > >Alejandro > ===== Alejandro, Selecting the graphic first doesn't help, but thanks for the suggestion. I can't believe someone hasn't discovered this problem with revRotatePoly. It is so bazaar. It works in the msg box but not in a button, card or stack. Usually it is the other way around. But I did find the following routine in the archives for rotating lines and polygons. It is very nice. It rotates the object about an *arbitrary* point, not just the object's loc. The author is Derek Huby. It doesn't use the explicit matrix formalism to rotate vectors but the mathematics is equivalent. I get the feeling, since you mention it with reference to rotation in a plane, that your matrix inversion routine might be for two dimensions only, but I'll be delighted to be wrong. Unfortunately I need to invert a 4x4. But I understand. Matrix inversion in general is a major computational challenge. But here is Derek's very nice rotations program. It presumes you have constructed a graphic named: "CoR" which serves as the axis of rotation. Let me know if you find the problem with revRotatePoly. Regards, Jim on rotateshape shapename, angle -- this will rotate gc shapename through 'angle' degrees anticlockwise -- check the graphic exists if there is not a graphic shapename then exit rotateshape end if --"CoR" (centre of rotation) is a small cicular 'grabbable' gc marking the centre put item 1 of the loc of graphic "CoR" into XCentre put item 2 of the loc of graphic "CoR" into YCentre --"origPts" is a custom property containing the original point list. --You can't just rotate from the 'current' point list; rounding errors will 'degrade' the shape. if the origPts of graphic shapename = empty then set the origPts of graphic shapename to the points of graphic shapename end if --"rotAngle" is a custom property that tells you how far the shape is --currently rotated if the rotAngle of graphic shapename = empty then set the rotAngle of graphic shapename to 0 end if put empty into newPointList put the origPts of graphic shapename into pointList -- Build new list of coords relative to CoR as origin repeat for each line k in pointlist put (item 1 of k)- Xcentre & "," & (item 2 of k)- Ycentre & return after newPointList end repeat set the rotangle of graphic shapename to (the rotangle of graphic shapename + angle) mod 360 put sin(the rotangle of graphic shapename * pi/180) into S put cos(the rotangle of graphic shapename * pi/180) into C put empty into rotptlist --Now do the actual rotation repeat for each line k in newPointlist put round(c*(item 1 of k)+ s*(item 2 of k) + xCentre) after rotptlist put "," after rotptlist put round(c*(item 2 of k) - s*(item 1 of k)+ Ycentre)after rotptlist put return after rotPtList end repeat set the points of graphic shapename to rotPtlist end rotateshape ** From jbradshaw at blueyonder.co.uk Sun Mar 30 04:45:01 2003 From: jbradshaw at blueyonder.co.uk (Jez) Date: Sun Mar 30 04:45:01 2003 Subject: openStack Message-ID: <000501c2f6a0$aa900280$c6abc050@Jez2> my daily question: I do some initialization stuff in OpenStack in my main stack. But when I open the stack in the designer and run it in Browse mode this does not implicitly fire. I have to send the message to the stack manually from the Msg window, which is ok but getting to be a bit of a pain and I often forget. Is there a neat way I could fire OpenStack automatically when I open it in the designer? From rcozens at pon.net Sun Mar 30 11:15:01 2003 From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens) Date: Sun Mar 30 11:15:01 2003 Subject: openStack In-Reply-To: <000501c2f6a0$aa900280$c6abc050@Jez2> References: <000501c2f6a0$aa900280$c6abc050@Jez2> Message-ID: >I do some initialization stuff in OpenStack in my main stack. But when I >open the stack in the designer and run it in Browse mode this does not >implicitly fire. Hi Jez, I don't know if my problem is the same as yours, but when I run my SDB Utilities stack from the Rev Dev environment, openStack does NOT happen unless I suspend the Rev Dev environment from the menuBar before opening the stack. When I forget to do so, typing "openStack" from the Message Box seems to work. Everything runs fine in the standalone; so I have not spent a lot of time trying to figure out what causes the problem. -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three; Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee." from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631) From smcbride at comcast.net Sun Mar 30 12:06:01 2003 From: smcbride at comcast.net (Suzanne McBride) Date: Sun Mar 30 12:06:01 2003 Subject: Color My Word--Open Message-ID: <3E872744.9010009@comcast.net> Need an easy way to open the Color palette for a non-scripter to use. I'm stumped! I got as far as making rev's Object menu work in my stack, so the user can manually set the selected text to the pen color; but I can't make a button to open the Color palette. Its name changes from RevPropertiesPalette2 to other numbers and the rev code is pretty complex, gives error messages when I try to use it. I don't have to incorporate the whole revMenuBar in the standalone, do I? Any advice, please?! Thanks, Suzanne From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Sun Mar 30 12:31:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Sun Mar 30 12:31:01 2003 Subject: I don't understand error messages Message-ID: * There was an Execution Error at 12:15:11 PM Error description: Function: error in function handler Object: field id 1357 of card id 1002 of stack "/TiBook hard drive/Users/victorle/Documents/Revolution programming/ATC.rev" -------------------- --answer "create" && nam,i,j,alt,idir,jdir -------------------- Value: is_exit This seems to claim that there is an error in a commented line?! -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From edgore at shinra.com Sun Mar 30 14:32:00 2003 From: edgore at shinra.com (Edwin Gore) Date: Sun Mar 30 14:32:00 2003 Subject: Introduction and a question References: <00ca01c2f683$1e197a10$6601a8c0@LightningFlash> Message-ID: <002601c2f6f2$a36c0880$6901a8c0@ed> Figured it out from looking through the archives for something else - It was actually an issue with a group that was slightly overlapping the fields that weren't getting messages/focus. Moved that group to the back, and everything is fine now! Thanks ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ken Ray" To: Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2003 11:10 PM Subject: RE: Introduction and a question > Edwin, > > That's very strange. Can you let us know what version of Rev you're > using and whether the listField's group is acting as a background (I'm > pretty sure it does) or the other fields have any of their sharedText > properties set to true? > > That would help track this down, > > Ken Ray > Sons of Thunder Software > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Edwin Gore > Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2003 3:44 PM > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > Subject: Introduction and a question > > > Just wanted to do a quick introduction. > > New to using Revolution, but I was a old Hypercard/SuperCard/Toolbook > hand several years ago. > > Found out about Revolution through Richard Gaskin's FourthWorld site, > and was intrigued enough to download the free version, and then buy the > Student fo my daughter who is learning to program with it. > > Quick question... > > Am I correct in thinking that having a list field on a card messes up > open and close field messages for other fields on the card? We are > trying to do something where the navigation is a scrolling list in a > group on the left of the card and clicking takes you to a specific card. > Once there, you can edit one of several fields on that card, and there > is some validation doen through onpen and close field scripts. > > The problem is that once you have clicked on the listField the other > fields on the card no longer seem to get open and close field messages > when you click on them and the insertion point never appears in them. > YOu can still click in the field and type, but an openfield never gets > sent and the insertion point never appears. > > Weird. > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution From mikkimi at mindspring.com Sun Mar 30 16:58:01 2003 From: mikkimi at mindspring.com (Michael Robinson) Date: Sun Mar 30 16:58:01 2003 Subject: Printing a scrolling background Message-ID: <3A8AA0B4-62FA-11D7-A7C1-0003938404E8@mindspring.com> Hi! I need some help with a printing problem. I have a scrolling background (8.5 x 11 inches) with about 15 different fields, and I can only print the the part that is showing in the stack window. I would like to print the whole scrolling background, any help would be appreciated . Thanks, Mike From alrice at ARCplanning.com Sun Mar 30 17:03:01 2003 From: alrice at ARCplanning.com (Alex Rice) Date: Sun Mar 30 17:03:01 2003 Subject: Printing a scrolling background In-Reply-To: <3A8AA0B4-62FA-11D7-A7C1-0003938404E8@mindspring.com> Message-ID: <06D079C4-62FB-11D7-A1C1-000393529642@ARCplanning.com> On Sunday, March 30, 2003, at 02:54 PM, Michael Robinson wrote: > Hi! > I need some help with a printing problem. I have a scrolling > background (8.5 x 11 inches) with about 15 different fields, and I can > only print the the part that is showing in the stack window. I would > like to print the whole scrolling background, any help would be > appreciated . > One way you can do it is create a new invisible stack, copy the group to that stack, then print that stack. Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research Consultants, Inc. alrice at ARCplanning.com alrice at swcp.com From bornstein at designeq.com Sun Mar 30 17:29:01 2003 From: bornstein at designeq.com (Howard Bornstein) Date: Sun Mar 30 17:29:01 2003 Subject: Color My Word--Open Message-ID: <200303302225.h2UMPit9020871@ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com> >Need an easy way to open the Color palette for a non-scripter to use. > I'm stumped! >I got as far as making rev's Object menu work in my stack, so the user >can manually set the selected text to the pen color; but I can't make a >button to open the Color palette. Its name changes from >RevPropertiesPalette2 to other numbers and the rev code is pretty >complex, gives error messages when I try to use it. I don't have to >incorporate the whole revMenuBar in the standalone, do I? Any advice, >please?! Suzanne, I think what you are looking for is the "answer color" command. Try this: Create a text field, add some text to it and lock the field. Put this code in the text field script: on mouseup put the clickchunk into usertext answer color put it into chosencolor set the textcolor of usertext to chosencolor end mouseup Does this do what you're trying to do? Regards, Howard Bornstein ____________________ D E S I G N E Q www.designeq.com From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 30 17:33:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 30 17:33:01 2003 Subject: Icon queries In-Reply-To: <200303300615.BAA28913@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 17:55:02 +0000 > From: Graham Samuel > Subject: Icon queries > Have I missed it? I hope not, since I > would be a woefully bad author of such a thing myself... if anyone > can help, please tell the list! ---------- Well, you probably saw it but didn't quite believe it (because it's so simple and easy to deal with). Icons are images, the same as all other images. You just assign the image you want to a transparent button, for whatever hilite type you wish. I'm sorry to disappoint you if you were expecting something more complicated, but that's really about all there is it. Have fun ;+) Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 30 18:09:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 30 18:09:01 2003 Subject: Can't rotate graphic In-Reply-To: <200303300615.BAA28913@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hi list, No matter what I do, I can't make a graphic rotate. Here's my simple script, basically right out of the Dictionary: on mouseUp revRotatePoly graphic "myGraphic", 90 end mouseUp I can't get this to work in either the script of the graphic itself or another button. The ONLY place it works is the Message box. Haven't run across this with any other command structure, so I'm guessing it's a bug. Any help for it? Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 30 18:11:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 30 18:11:01 2003 Subject: Tips links broken-repost In-Reply-To: <200303300615.BAA28913@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: In the docs (Rev 1.1.1), I'm looking at 'Development Guide' under 'Images and Multimedia'. Under 'Tips' I click on Batch-import images and I get some off-the-wall Tip. I keep clicking, and I get more irrelevent Tips. So far, it hasn't shown me a single thing to do with images. What the heck is happening? TIA, Ken N. From smcbride at comcast.net Sun Mar 30 19:03:01 2003 From: smcbride at comcast.net (Suzanne McBride) Date: Sun Mar 30 19:03:01 2003 Subject: Color My Word--Open Color Palette Message-ID: <3E8788F6.10904@comcast.net> Howard, You are a life saver! I'd seen a mention of "answer color" somewhere but just didn't get it until you put it in code. I had discounted anything that required a locked field, since the user will be editing the field at the time. Then it hit me that all I needed was your field code and a little button to lock the field for them when they're ready to do the formatting. Thank you so, so much. Suzanne From pixelbird at interisland.net Sun Mar 30 19:45:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Sun Mar 30 19:45:01 2003 Subject: Parallel Rev stacks In-Reply-To: <200303300615.BAA28913@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: Hi Rev list, As some of you know I'm using Rev (and also HC) to develop onscreen keyboards for the severely disabled. The question is: Can I get Rev to type characters (from mouseclicks, not the physical keyboard) and information into other programs, such as web browsers? I've been poring over the large amount of CGI/Browser posts all afternoon. One thing seems basically apparent: We cannot run a Rev stack in parallel with another app (is this really true?), nor does it seem very practical to build a browser with Rev (although theoretically it should be possible). Now, believe me, I'm aware of the fact that there are a number of onscreen keyboards already out there, but the really comprehensive ones, though they can compensate for various deficits, lack some intuitive simplicity, and are so expensive as to be out of range for many. Further, mine involve extensive feedback processes, and some very different methods of operation (more gamelike) which are very exciting. My first intuitve idea is have to Rev send characters directly to a port or socket, though I don't yet understand how (I'm studying, but I still don't 'get' a lot of it yet), and the course instructers at my local Community College extension don't really know either (I'm getting more hi-end knowledge right here in this list...for which I will always be grateful :+)). If I can get this to happen, I have some ideas for getting grants to hopefully launch these services so I can spend full time work on it (as it is I only have about maybe 10 max hours or so a week). Maybe then I can actually get a couple of them finished. Any help and continued guidance is appreciated, Ken N. From sarahr at genesearch.com.au Sun Mar 30 20:29:01 2003 From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah) Date: Sun Mar 30 20:29:01 2003 Subject: Parallel Rev stacks In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Ken, As you are using HyperCard I am assuming that this is all on Macs. In that case, AppleScript can do a lot of what you want whenever Rev can't do it itself. For web browsers, you can use the revGoURL command which switches to the default browser and goes to that page. If the web page has a form of any sort, then again, you can probably do it by assembling the web address for the form and using revGoURL to send the data. e.g. to search Google for "aardvarks", I can use the following Rev command: revGoURL "http://www.google.com/search?q=aardvarks" Similarly, email can be done from Rev, currently using revGoURL but in Rev 2.0 there is the much more powerful revMail command which allows you to generate an email including address, subject and message body. For other apps, a combination of Transcript and AppleScript can do the job. Supposing you were writing a letter: use the on-screen keyboard to type all the characters, then copy the text from Rev, use AppleScript to open AppleWorks, create a new word processing document, paste the text into AppleWorks, save and print. The applications you can use in this way will be restricted to those that can be scripted, but this shouldn't limit you too much. Cheers, Sarah sarahr at genesearch.com.au http://www.troz.net/Rev/ On Monday, March 31, 2003, at 10:46 am, Ken Norris wrote: > Hi Rev list, > > As some of you know I'm using Rev (and also HC) to develop onscreen > keyboards for the severely disabled. > > The question is: > > Can I get Rev to type characters (from mouseclicks, not the physical > keyboard) and information into other programs, such as web browsers? > > I've been poring over the large amount of CGI/Browser posts all > afternoon. > One thing seems basically apparent: We cannot run a Rev stack in > parallel > with another app (is this really true?), nor does it seem very > practical to > build a browser with Rev (although theoretically it should be > possible). > > Now, believe me, I'm aware of the fact that there are a number of > onscreen > keyboards already out there, but the really comprehensive ones, though > they > can compensate for various deficits, lack some intuitive simplicity, > and are > so expensive as to be out of range for many. Further, mine involve > extensive > feedback processes, and some very different methods of operation (more > gamelike) which are very exciting. > > My first intuitve idea is have to Rev send characters directly to a > port or > socket, though I don't yet understand how (I'm studying, but I still > don't > 'get' a lot of it yet), and the course instructers at my local > Community > College extension don't really know either (I'm getting more hi-end > knowledge right here in this list...for which I will always be grateful > :+)). > > If I can get this to happen, I have some ideas for getting grants to > hopefully launch these services so I can spend full time work on it > (as it > is I only have about maybe 10 max hours or so a week). Maybe then I can > actually get a couple of them finished. > > Any help and continued guidance is appreciated, > Ken N. > > > > > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > > From jeanne at runrev.com Sun Mar 30 22:10:32 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Sun Mar 30 22:10:32 2003 Subject: Button vs. Message box scripts; P.S. Invert matrices? In-Reply-To: References: <200303280913.EAA27211@www.runrev.com> <200303280913.EAA27211@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: At 6:54 AM -0800 3/28/03, Jim Hurley wrote: >On mouseUp >revrotatepoly graphic "MyPoly", 90 >end mouseUp > >return an error: "Chunk source is not a container." The problem here is that revRotatePoly needs an expression that evaluates to a graphic reference, not a graphic reference itself. (This is for complicated reasons having to do with the fact that revRotatePoly is a Transcript library routine.) This will work: revRotatePoly the long ID of graphic "MyPoly",90 -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - Software at the Speed of Thought http://www.runrev.com/ From jeanne at runrev.com Sun Mar 30 22:11:08 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Sun Mar 30 22:11:08 2003 Subject: Copy Variable to Clipboard? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: At 12:28 AM -0800 3/19/03, David Egbert wrote: >I'm having trouble copying text from a variable to the clipboard. > >I suppose I could put the contents of the variable into a field that's on a >stack off screen and then copy it. > >Is there a better way to do this? That's the best way in 1.1.1. In 2.0, you can use the new clipboardData property: set the clipboardData["text"] to myVariable -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - Software at the Speed of Thought http://www.runrev.com/ From jeanne at runrev.com Sun Mar 30 22:11:34 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Sun Mar 30 22:11:34 2003 Subject: Make an entire card scroll? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: At 5:55 AM -0800 3/29/03, valetia at mac.com wrote: >>> What is the best way to make an entire card scroll (thereby achieving an >>> effect similar to that of a web browser)? >> >> Place all the content of the card in a group and scroll the group. > >Is there a section within the RR docs or anywhere else that explains how >this is done? "How to create a scrolling window". Although Kurt's reply is much more detailed. -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - Software at the Speed of Thought http://www.runrev.com/ From jeanne at runrev.com Sun Mar 30 22:11:57 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Sun Mar 30 22:11:57 2003 Subject: send to msg substack In-Reply-To: Message-ID: At 7:13 AM -0800 3/29/03, Stephen Messimer wrote: >My assumption was that because stack xData is a substack of a plugin >and that Rev is up and running, the substack would be among the >"stacks in use". Do I need to supply some sort of path info to the >plugin? It won't be in the stacksInUse just because it's in the same file as a plugin. However, it should be loaded (and available to your script) if its main stack is loaded. (Stack files load "all or nothing" - if one stack in a stack file is loaded, they all are.) Is your plugin set up in Plugins Editor to load on startup (or have you already opened it)? -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - Software at the Speed of Thought http://www.runrev.com/ From jeanne at runrev.com Sun Mar 30 22:12:23 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Sun Mar 30 22:12:23 2003 Subject: Tips links broken In-Reply-To: References: <200303271551.KAA32217@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: At 8:58 PM -0800 3/27/03, Ken Norris wrote: >In the docs (Rev 1.1.1), I'm looking at 'Development Guide' under 'Images >and Multimedia'. Under 'Tips' I click on Batch-import images and I get some >off-the-wall Tip. I keep clicking, and I get more irrelevent Tips. So far, >it hasn't shown me a single thing to do with images. If I remember correctly, this was a bug in 1.1.1, that I think was fixed in 1.1.1r2. I can't make it happen any more in the 2.0 beta. -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - Software at the Speed of Thought http://www.runrev.com/ From michaell at unimelb.edu.au Sun Mar 30 23:45:01 2003 From: michaell at unimelb.edu.au (Michael J. Lew) Date: Sun Mar 30 23:45:01 2003 Subject: Matrix inversion Message-ID: Here are a couple of matrix handlers that I translated from Fortran routines published in the excellent Numerical Recipes book by Press et al. Not enough entirely to invert matrices (that wasn't what I needed them for), but the small additional routine is fully documented in a downloadable pdf from . For anyone who does numerical work I highly recommend the Numerical Recipes books. #--****** LUBKSB ****** # Function Revolutionised from Numerical Recipes by MJL # --Input is aMatrix, an n by n square matrix and rhsMatrix, an n by 1 vector # also uses the global indx which is built by LUDCMP # Returns an n by 1 vector solution # For use with LUDCMP to solve linear equations or invert a matrix # Note that the input and output parameters are not fully equivalent to the originals function LUBKSB aMatrix,n,rhsMatrix global indx put aMatrix into a put rhsMatrix into b set the numberformat to "0.#########################" put 0 into ii repeat with i =1 to n put indx[i] into ip put b[ip] into mySum put b[i] into b[ip] if ii<>0 then repeat with j = ii to i-1 put mySum-a[i,j]*b[j] into mySum end repeat --j else if mySum <> 0 then put i into ii end if put mySum into b[i] end repeat --i repeat with i = n down to 1 put b[i] into mySum if ibig then put a[i,j] into big end repeat --j if big =0 then answer "Singular matrix in LUDCMP. Procedure failed" exit to top end if put 1/big into vv[i] end repeat --i repeat with j=1 to n repeat with i=1 to j-1 put a[i,j] into mySum repeat with k = 1 to i-1 put mySum-a[i,k]*a[k,j] into mySum end repeat --k put mySum into a[i,j] end repeat --i put 0 into big repeat with i=j to n put a[i,j] into mySum repeat with k=1 to j-1 put mySum-a[i,k]*a[k,j] into mySum end repeat --k put mySum into a[i,j] put abs(mySum)*vv[i] into dum if dum>big then put dum into big put i into imax end if end repeat --i if j<>imax then repeat with k=1 to n put a[imax,k] into dum put a[j,k] into a[imax,k] put dum into a[j,k] end repeat --k put -d into d put vv[j] into vv[imax] end if put imax into indx[j] if a[j,j] =0 then put tiny into a[j,j] if j<>n then put 1/(a[j,j]) into dum repeat with i=j+1 to n put dum*a[i,j] into a[i,j] end repeat --i end if end repeat --j return a end LUDCMP -- Michael J. Lew Senior Lecturer Department of Pharmacology The University of Melbourne Parkville 3010 Victoria Australia Phone +613 8344 8304 ** New email address: michaell at unimelb.edu.au ** From themacguy at macosx.com Sun Mar 30 23:58:00 2003 From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine) Date: Sun Mar 30 23:58:00 2003 Subject: Converting RealBasic to Rev? Message-ID: I have a customer who is wondering whether it is possible to convert the source code of a RealBasic project over to Rev. Is there some kind of "translation utility" that can parse through the RB code and construct a Rev project from it? Please feel free to eMail me directly if you wish. Thanks, Barry From ambassador at fourthworld.com Mon Mar 31 01:52:01 2003 From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin) Date: Mon Mar 31 01:52:01 2003 Subject: Converting RealBasic to Rev? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Barry Levine wrote: > I have a customer who is wondering whether it is possible to convert > the source code of a RealBasic project over to Rev. Is there some kind > of "translation utility" that can parse through the RB code and > construct a Rev project from it? It should be relatively easu to move object layouts over, but the languages are so different that the effort needed to translate it would likely be more work than it would save. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Media Corporation Developer of WebMerge 2.2: Publish any database on any site ___________________________________________________________ Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com Tel: 323-225-3717 AIM: FourthWorldInc From eijkhout at cs.utk.edu Mon Mar 31 01:55:01 2003 From: eijkhout at cs.utk.edu (Victor Eijkhout) Date: Mon Mar 31 01:55:01 2003 Subject: Matrix inversion In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >For anyone who does numerical work I highly recommend the Numerical >Recipes books. I think you'll find almost anyone doing numerical work professionally disagreeing with that :-) Anyway, it looks like a factorisation with partial pivoting, so that's not too bad from a pov of stability. However, coding systems solution (the standard answer to "how do I invert a matrix" is "you don't; you probably only need to solve a system") in an interpreted language wil be very slow compared to even a straight Fortran or C code, let alone an optimised code. If you are going to do this with matrices of any macroscopic size, you'd better figure out how to interface RR to a fortran or c object file. -- Victor Eijkhout tel: 865 974 9308 (W), 865 673 6998 (H), 865 974 8296 (F) http://www.cs.utk.edu/~eijkhout/ From livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk Mon Mar 31 02:24:00 2003 From: livfoss at blueyonder.co.uk (Graham Samuel) Date: Mon Mar 31 02:24:00 2003 Subject: Icon queries Message-ID: OnSun, 30 Mar 2003 14:38:51 -0500, Ken Norris > wrote: > >> Have I missed it? I hope not, since I >> would be a woefully bad author of such a thing myself... if anyone >> can help, please tell the list! >---------- >Well, you probably saw it but didn't quite believe it (because it's so >simple and easy to deal with). > >Icons are images, the same as all other images. You just assign the image >you want to a transparent button, for whatever hilite type you wish. I'm >sorry to disappoint you if you were expecting something more complicated, >but that's really about all there is it. > >Have fun ;+) Ken, thanks, but I know icons are images. However I'm trying to attach appropriate families of icons to my standalone and its documents on the various platforms, so that (for example) the user sees a unique icon to double-click to start the app, either directly or by double-clicking an associated document. For me, buttons aren't involved at all. My problem is discovering what the OS expects in the way of icon families to represent the different types of display of an app or a file (in a list, on the desktop, in use, on a 16-color display etc.), and then how to create such families either in Rev or some other way. Since writing my mail, I have downloaded the Mac shareware Iconographer from www.mscape.com. This looks like tremendous value, because it explains a lot about icon families, and it can even generate Windows-compatible application icons, including the newer standard used by Windows XP, as well as conventional Mac icons for pre-X and X. It's the nearest to a cookbook that I've come so far. Graham -- ------------------------------------------------------------------- Graham Samuel / The Living Fossil Co. / UK & France From wmb at internettrainer.com Mon Mar 31 07:13:01 2003 From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter) Date: Mon Mar 31 07:13:01 2003 Subject: Group Background Behavior In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hello Geoff, On Samstag, M?rz 29, 2003, at 07:54 Uhr, Geoff Canyon wrote: > I'm not sure if it's included in the beta. You can always get a copy > at the url I included: > > http://www.inspiredlogic.com/navigator Will it be included in 2.0? Is it the replacement for the Applov or an completion? Does it work like a plugin, or do I have open it as a file (stack) Thanks an advance... regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps? INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ............................... http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com ............................... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 From jhurley at infostations.com Mon Mar 31 07:14:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Mon Mar 31 07:14:01 2003 Subject: Button vs. Message box scripts In-Reply-To: <200303310313.WAA19754@www.runrev.com> References: <200303310313.WAA19754@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > "Jeanne A. E. DeVoto" wrote: > > >On mouseUp >>revrotatepoly graphic "MyPoly", 90 >>end mouseUp >> >>return an error: "Chunk source is not a container." > >The problem here is that revRotatePoly needs an expression that evaluates >to a graphic reference, not a graphic reference itself. (This is for >complicated reasons having to do with the fact that revRotatePoly is a >Transcript library routine.) This will work: > > revRotatePoly the long ID of graphic "MyPoly",90 Jeanne, Thank you for that solution. But I am still puzzled that the message box is able to handle the graphic reference but a button, card or stack is not. I don't know how you handle your responsibility of "script mother" but I have a request which amounts to a child asking for matches. Is it possible to probe the Transcript library routines to see how they work and, dare I say it, modify them? Suppose I wanted to alter revRotatePoly (or use it as a base for a new routine) so that the center of rotation was a point of my choosing rather then the graphic's loc. From jhurley at infostations.com Mon Mar 31 09:18:01 2003 From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley) Date: Mon Mar 31 09:18:01 2003 Subject: Matrix inversion In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Michael, Thank you for these routines. I think if I can get them to work I can find the matrix inverse. My source for numerical work is : Numerical analysis, by Richard Burden. It gives only algorithms and not program routines. Unfortunately I am having trouble with your handlers. I tried a simple set of linear equations: x + 2y = 1 x + y = 0 With the solution: x = -1 and y = 1. But the routine below, LUBKSB, yields x = -2 and y = 1. I used aMatrix = 1,2 1,1 with n = 2 and rhsMatrix =1 0 Any ideas? Jim At 2:40 PM +1000 3/31/03, Michael J. Lew wrote: >Here are a couple of matrix handlers that I translated from Fortran >routines published in the excellent Numerical Recipes book by Press >et al. Not enough entirely to invert matrices (that wasn't what I >needed them for), but the small additional routine is fully >documented in a downloadable pdf from >. > >For anyone who does numerical work I highly recommend the Numerical >Recipes books. > >#--****** LUBKSB ****** ># Function Revolutionised from Numerical Recipes by MJL ># --Input is aMatrix, an n by n square matrix and rhsMatrix, an n by 1 vector ># also uses the global indx which is built by LUDCMP ># Returns an n by 1 vector solution ># For use with LUDCMP to solve linear equations or invert a matrix ># Note that the input and output parameters are not fully equivalent >to the originals > >function LUBKSB aMatrix,n,rhsMatrix > global indx > put aMatrix into a > put rhsMatrix into b > set the numberformat to "0.#########################" > put 0 into ii > repeat with i =1 to n > put indx[i] into ip > put b[ip] into mySum > put b[i] into b[ip] > if ii<>0 then > repeat with j = ii to i-1 > put mySum-a[i,j]*b[j] into mySum > end repeat --j > else > if mySum <> 0 then put i into ii > end if > put mySum into b[i] > end repeat --i > repeat with i = n down to 1 > put b[i] into mySum > if i repeat with j = i+1 to n > put mySum-a[i,j]*b[j] into mySum > end repeat --j > end if > put mySum/a[i,i] into b[i] > end repeat --i > return b >end LUBKSB > > > >#--***** LUDCMP ***** ># Function Revolutionised by MJL from Numerical Recipes subroutine ludcmp ># input is an n by n square matrix, aMatrix ># returns aMatrix modified to be an LU decomposed version of itself ># also returns (a global) indx which is a vector of the row perms >affected by partial pivoting (!) ># For use in conjunction with LUBKSB to solve linear equations or >invert a matrix ># Note that the input and output parameters are not fully equivalent >to the originals > >function LUDCMP amatrix,n > global indx > set the numberformat to "0.#########################" > put 10^-22 into tiny > put aMatrix into a > put 1 into d > repeat with i = 1 to n > put 0 into big > repeat with j=1 to n > if abs(a[i,j]) >big then put a[i,j] into big > end repeat --j > if big =0 then > answer "Singular matrix in LUDCMP. Procedure failed" > exit to top > end if > put 1/big into vv[i] > end repeat --i > repeat with j=1 to n > repeat with i=1 to j-1 > put a[i,j] into mySum > repeat with k = 1 to i-1 > put mySum-a[i,k]*a[k,j] into mySum > end repeat --k > put mySum into a[i,j] > end repeat --i > put 0 into big > repeat with i=j to n > put a[i,j] into mySum > repeat with k=1 to j-1 > put mySum-a[i,k]*a[k,j] into mySum > end repeat --k > put mySum into a[i,j] > put abs(mySum)*vv[i] into dum > if dum>big then > put dum into big > put i into imax > end if > end repeat --i > if j<>imax then > repeat with k=1 to n > put a[imax,k] into dum > put a[j,k] into a[imax,k] > put dum into a[j,k] > end repeat --k > put -d into d > put vv[j] into vv[imax] > end if > put imax into indx[j] > if a[j,j] =0 then put tiny into a[j,j] > if j<>n then > put 1/(a[j,j]) into dum > repeat with i=j+1 to n > put dum*a[i,j] into a[i,j] > end repeat --i > end if > end repeat --j > return a >end LUDCMP > > > >-- >Michael J. Lew > >Senior Lecturer >Department of Pharmacology >The University of Melbourne >Parkville 3010 >Victoria >Australia > >Phone +613 8344 8304 > >** >New email address: michaell at unimelb.edu.au >** From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Mon Mar 31 09:58:00 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Mon Mar 31 09:58:00 2003 Subject: Group Background Behavior In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Navigator is not an official part of Revolution, so it's not "the replacement" for anything. Likewise, it's up to the runrev crew whether it's bundled with 2.0. Navigator a plugin. Just toss it in the plugins folder to use it. On Monday, March 31, 2003, at 04:10 AM, Wolfgang M. Bereuter wrote: > Hello Geoff, > > On Samstag, M?rz 29, 2003, at 07:54 Uhr, Geoff Canyon wrote: > >> I'm not sure if it's included in the beta. You can always get a copy >> at the url I included: >> >> http://www.inspiredlogic.com/navigator > Will it be included in 2.0? > Is it the replacement for the Applov or an completion? > Does it work like a plugin, or do I have open it as a file (stack) regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com From jeanne at runrev.com Mon Mar 31 12:35:01 2003 From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto) Date: Mon Mar 31 12:35:01 2003 Subject: Button vs. Message box scripts In-Reply-To: References: <200303310313.WAA19754@www.runrev.com> <200303310313.WAA19754@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: At 4:13 AM -0800 3/31/03, Jim Hurley wrote: >Is it possible to probe the Transcript library routines to see how >they work and, dare I say it, modify them? Suppose I wanted to alter >revRotatePoly (or use it as a base for a new routine) so that the >center of rotation was a point of my choosing rather then the >graphic's loc. Sure, although I should mention that of course RunRev doesn't support modified versions - if you should break it. ;-) The custom script libraries are in Revolution backscripts. The revRotatePoly command is in the Common library, so click the "Backscripts" button in the message box, make sure the "Show Revolution UI back scripts" box is checked, and open the revCommon script. -- Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com Runtime Revolution Limited - Software at the Speed of Thought http://www.runrev.com/ From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 31 13:02:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 31 13:02:01 2003 Subject: Tips links broken In-Reply-To: <200303311702.MAA29495@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 16:46:47 -0800 > From: "Jeanne A. E. DeVoto" > Subject: Re: Tips links broken > If I remember correctly, this was a bug in 1.1.1, that I think was fixed in > 1.1.1r2. I can't make it happen any more in the 2.0 beta. ---------- OK. I didn't know there was an r2 version. How do I know if I have it or the original 1.1.1 version? TIA, Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 31 13:14:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 31 13:14:01 2003 Subject: Icon queries In-Reply-To: <200303311702.MAA29495@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 08:20:51 +0100 > From: Graham Samuel > Subject: Re: Icon queries snip > My problem is discovering what the OS expects in the > way of icon families to represent the different types of display of > an app or a file (in a list, on the desktop, in use, on a 16-color > display etc.), and then how to create such families either in Rev or > some other way. > > Since writing my mail, I have downloaded the Mac shareware > Iconographer from www.mscape.com. This looks like tremendous value, > because it explains a lot about icon families, and it can even > generate Windows-compatible application icons, including the newer > standard used by Windows XP, as well as conventional Mac icons for > pre-X and X. It's the nearest to a cookbook that I've come so far. ---------- I see. You're talking about DT/folder icon families. Other than creating images with Rev's limited capabilities, I don't see any relevence to Rev at all for what you're talking about. As I see it, it's a Rapid Application Development tool, not a DT icon tool. I think you're on the right track with "Iconographer". Ken N. From pixelbird at interisland.net Mon Mar 31 13:35:01 2003 From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris) Date: Mon Mar 31 13:35:01 2003 Subject: Button vs. Message box scripts In-Reply-To: <200303310313.WAA19670@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: ********** > Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 14:24:39 -0800 > From: "Jeanne A. E. DeVoto" > Subject: Re: Button vs. Message box scripts; P.S. Invert matrices? > The problem here is that revRotatePoly needs an expression that evaluates > to a graphic reference, not a graphic reference itself. (This is for > complicated reasons having to do with the fact that revRotatePoly is a > Transcript library routine.) This will work: > > revRotatePoly the long ID of graphic "MyPoly",90 ---------- I too want to thank you for this insight. I was very puzzled . A few additional points: 1) It should be noted that this is _not_ the form stated in the Dictionary, and I would ever have come up with it on my own, so I'm hoping this will be corrected in 2.0. 2) The form must be exact, e.g., it didn't work with lowercase "id" only with uppercase "ID". 3) Why does the original form stated in the Dictionary work from the Message Box, but not from a handler? That's extremely puzzling. Ken N. From zellner at neo.tamu.edu Mon Mar 31 13:42:01 2003 From: zellner at neo.tamu.edu (Ronald D. Zellner) Date: Mon Mar 31 13:42:01 2003 Subject: QT movie address in player In-Reply-To: <200303290917.EAA13814@www.runrev.com> References: <200303290917.EAA13814@www.runrev.com> Message-ID: > >Message: 1 >Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 10:06:31 -0500 >Subject: Re: QT movie address in player >From: Ken Norris >To: >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > >********** > > Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 23:39:47 -0600 > > From: Ronald Zellner > > Subject: QT movie address in player > > > > When I play a QT movie in Revolution 1.1.1 by embedding it in a > > player, the pathway is absolute and will be incorrect if I move the > > files to another computer. This is especially problematic if it is > > converted to a standalone file which is delivered on a CD since the > > file can't be edited. > > Is there a way to have a stack start up and immediately display the > > movie that was originally embedded there. > > Ron >---------- >Hi Ron, > >Actually we just covered this a few days ago. I looked again and still can't find it. > >NOTE: If your stack is already a standalone, you'll have to rebuild it to >implement these. There are two basic ways: > >1) If you want to keep the movie in an offstack file (saves stack memory) >like you already have it: > > a) Put the stack file and the movie file in the same folder, which > normally becomes the defaultFolder at startup of the stack. This seems to be the heart of the problem, I'm running 1.1.1 and the defaultFolder does not change when I startup a stack, the defaultFolder remains the folder where Revolution 1.1.1 is located. > b) Have your stack simply call the movie file for the player by its > fileName. The assumption here is that the movie file is in the > defaultFolder. I can change the defaultFolder and then set a relative path to the movie, but this is lost when I restart the stack later. I can script the stack to change the defaultFolder when opening, but this will not work when I change the location of the files to another computer. Will the 2.0 upgrade affect any of this? > > c) Burn the FOLDER containing the stack and the movie onto the CD. I assume you mean to create a standalone file first? > >2) If you aren't concerned about stack size (memory) you can embed the movie >into the stack as a videoClip object Yes, that is a solution that doesn't require the path at all, but I'm not sure I want to go that way. >HTH :+) >Ken N. From cm_sheffield at yahoo.com Mon Mar 31 15:38:01 2003 From: cm_sheffield at yahoo.com (Chris Sheffield) Date: Mon Mar 31 15:38:01 2003 Subject: system requirements Message-ID: <20030331203455.11419.qmail@web20420.mail.yahoo.com> Can someone tell me what the system requirements are for a Rev stand-alone? I can't find them anywhere. I'm particularly interested in finding out if one will run on Mac OS 8.5 or 8.6 or thereabouts. Not that it will be the end of the world if it doesn't. It's just that my company is in the education market, and a lot of schools are still using older systems. It'd be nice if we could include them. The app would pretty much consist of multimedia type stuff (pictures, sound, and animations). Thanks, Chris Sheffield Read Naturally __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From zellner at neo.tamu.edu Mon Mar 31 16:29:01 2003 From: zellner at neo.tamu.edu (Ronald D. Zellner) Date: Mon Mar 31 16:29:01 2003 Subject: QT movie address in player(2) Message-ID: > >Message: 1 >Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 10:06:31 -0500 >Subject: Re: QT movie address in player >From: Ken Norris >To: >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > >********** > > Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 23:39:47 -0600 > > From: Ronald Zellner > > Subject: QT movie address in player > > > > When I play a QT movie in Revolution 1.1.1 by embedding it in a > > player, the pathway is absolute and will be incorrect if I move the > > files to another computer. This is especially problematic if it is > > converted to a standalone file which is delivered on a CD since the > > file can't be edited. > > Is there a way to have a stack start up and immediately display the > > movie that was originally embedded there. > > Ron >---------- >Hi Ron, > >NOTE: If your stack is already a standalone, you'll have to rebuild it to >implement these. There are two basic ways: > >1) If you want to keep the movie in an offstack file (saves stack memory) >like you already have it: > > a) Put the stack file and the movie file in the same folder, which > normally becomes the defaultFolder at startup of the stack. Another approach was to add this script to the card. It seems to take care of the problem. Does this make sense? on opencard put the filename of this stack into P --isolate & remove the file name from the path repeat with X = the number of characters in P down to 1 if character X of P = "/" then put " " into character X of P exit repeat end if end repeat Delete the last word of P --substitute the movie name and set the player filename set the filename of Player "Player1" to P & "/MainMovie.mov" end opencard Ron From sanke at hrz.uni-kassel.de Mon Mar 31 16:48:01 2003 From: sanke at hrz.uni-kassel.de (Wilhelm Sanke) Date: Mon Mar 31 16:48:01 2003 Subject: Button vs. Message box scripts Message-ID: <3E88B80D.C1A62907@hrz.uni-kassel.de> On Sun, 30 Mar 2003 "Jeanne A. E. DeVoto" wrote: > At 6:54 AM -0800 3/28/03, Jim Hurley wrote: > > >On mouseUp > >revrotatepoly graphic "MyPoly", 90 > >end mouseUp > > > >return an error: "Chunk source is not a container." > > > The problem here is that revRotatePoly needs an expression that evaluates > to a graphic reference, not a graphic reference itself. (This is for > complicated reasons having to do with the fact that revRotatePoly is a > Transcript library routine.) This will work: > > revRotatePoly the long ID of graphic "MyPoly",90 > > -- > Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com > Runtime Revolution Limited - Software at the Speed of Thought > The reasons may be even more complicated and are possibly *not* related to the fact that the script is located in the "revlibrary" stack. If you put the two parts of the script of "revRotatePoly" ("on revRotatePoly pGraphic, pAngle" and "function revPoints pGraphic") into a button or card script of your own stack, you have the same problems. You can test this in a situation where the revLibrary stack is not present, as for instance when you put the two scripts into a Metacard stack. It seems to be a problem of how the Metacard engine - as a basis for Revolution - handles the script. Adding "the long ID of" to the respective parts of the script doesn't help. Neither is this problem restricted to graphics. If you create a handler "on Buttoncolor pButton put the backcolor of the long ID of pButton end ButtonColor" you still have to use "the long ID of" in your calling script or in the message box. What is really puzzling is why the "revRotatePoly" script works from the message box which the "buttoncolor pButton" does not when you omit "the long ID of" in the above basic handler. Regards, Wilhelm Sanke From monte at sweattechnologies.com Mon Mar 31 18:42:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Mon Mar 31 18:42:01 2003 Subject: system requirements In-Reply-To: <20030331203455.11419.qmail@web20420.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: HI Chris Yes the PPC engine runs on 8.5. There is a 68K engine for even older systems if required. Monte > Can someone tell me what the system requirements are > for a Rev stand-alone? I can't find them anywhere. > I'm particularly interested in finding out if one will > run on Mac OS 8.5 or 8.6 or thereabouts. Not that it > will be the end of the world if it doesn't. It's just > that my company is in the education market, and a lot > of schools are still using older systems. It'd be > nice if we could include them. The app would pretty > much consist of multimedia type stuff (pictures, > sound, and animations). > > Thanks, > Chris Sheffield > Read Naturally > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! > http://platinum.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > use-revolution mailing list > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution > From monte at sweattechnologies.com Mon Mar 31 18:52:01 2003 From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding) Date: Mon Mar 31 18:52:01 2003 Subject: Icon queries In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Since writing my mail, I have downloaded the Mac shareware > Iconographer from www.mscape.com. This looks like tremendous value, > because it explains a lot about icon families, and it can even > generate Windows-compatible application icons, including the newer > standard used by Windows XP, as well as conventional Mac icons for > pre-X and X. It's the nearest to a cookbook that I've come so far. Hi Graham I use Iconographer for Mac icon development and Microangelo for Windows icon development. The Win32 engine has very strict limitations on the icon format you use. It must be 16 color, 32x32 & 766 byte file. I find Microangelo creates these icons quite well. Unfortunalty it's a crap format so think simple. Regards Monte From edutec at sympatico.ca Mon Mar 31 19:12:01 2003 From: edutec at sympatico.ca (edutec) Date: Mon Mar 31 19:12:01 2003 Subject: Test or Quiz Examples Message-ID: Somebody kindly point me in the direction of educational/training test or quiz examples made with Rev. -- All the better if the quiz has summative data (e.g., questions answered correctly, right answer, score). Thank you. -- R. Kenyon From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com Mon Mar 31 22:37:01 2003 From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon) Date: Mon Mar 31 22:37:01 2003 Subject: system requirements In-Reply-To: <20030331203455.11419.qmail@web20420.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: 8.5 and 8.6, yes. 7.X as well. 8.0 and 8.1 may be a bit dicey in 1.1.1 -- turns out there is an appearance manager limitation in those OSes (they were the first with AM). It should be addressed in 2.0. On Monday, March 31, 2003, at 12:34 PM, Chris Sheffield wrote: > I'm particularly interested in finding out if [a standalone] will > run on Mac OS 8.5 or 8.6 or thereabouts. Not that it > regards, Geoff Canyon gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com