From mdswindell at charter.net  Fri Nov  1 02:15:01 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Fri Nov  1 02:15:01 2002
Subject: Wildcard char for searching?
In-Reply-To: <B864E619.1426%pixelbird@interisland.net>
Message-ID: <B9E7683E.312D%mdswindell@charter.net>

Is it possible in Revolution to search for a string using a wildcard
character, such as:

Find "a*e" 

where the asterisk would represent any character between the letters "a" and
"e?"

If not, what might be the best way to accomplish this?

Thanks,

Mark 



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Fri Nov  1 02:30:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Fri Nov  1 02:30:01 2002
Subject: Wildcard char for searching?
References: <B9E7683E.312D%mdswindell@charter.net>
Message-ID: <0db101c28176$e0cbc590$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Mark,

The best way is to use regular expressions (see the "matchText" and
"matchChunk" entries). So for example to verify that a string exists
starting with "a" and ending with "e" within another string, you'd do this:

on mouseUp
  put fld 1 into textToSearch
  put matchText(textToSearch,"a[^ ]*?e") into stringIsThere
  if stringIsThere then
    answer "It's in the field."
  else
    answer "It's not in the field."
  end if
end mouseUp

Note that the character after the ^ in the above code is a space. It says
"look for an 'a', followed by zero or more characters that are not spaces,
and ending with 'e'".

If you want to retrieve the text to examine the match, you can do this:

on mouseUp
  local theWord
  put fld 1 into textToSearch
  put matchText(textToSearch,"(a[^ ]*?e)", theWord) into stringIsThere
  if stringIsThere then
    answer "It's in the field, and it's: " & theWord
  else
    answer "It's not in the field."
  end if
end mouseUp

Note the parentheses around the regulare expression, which says to "extract
it", and the defining a local variable (theWord) to hold the extracted
result.

BTW: Regular expression support is good in Rev 1.1.1, but will be great in
Rev 2 because of full Perl-compatible regular expression support.

Hope this helps,

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/


----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Swindell" <mdswindell at charter.net>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Friday, November 01, 2002 1:07 AM
Subject: Wildcard char for searching?


> Is it possible in Revolution to search for a string using a wildcard
> character, such as:
>
> Find "a*e"
>
> where the asterisk would represent any character between the letters "a"
and
> "e?"
>
> If not, what might be the best way to accomplish this?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Mark
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From heather at runrev.com  Fri Nov  1 06:25:01 2002
From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams)
Date: Fri Nov  1 06:25:01 2002
Subject: Sending large files to Runrev
Message-ID: <B9E81365.D956%heather@runrev.com>

Greetings,

Some of you may have noticed that if you sent a message to runrev or the
lists a day or so back, it returned to you as temporarily undeliverable.
This was owing to an unfortunate incident with some *very* large files
somebody unexpectedly sent us. Our server was unable to cope. We think all
the delayed mail has now arrived, and no mail was permanently lost.

We would be grateful if, before sending any unusually large files, you
checked with the recipient first. We can always make arrangements to receive
something big if we know it's coming.

Whilst waking up to a completely empty inbox makes a refreshing change, it's
not something I'd like to experience every day...

Regards,

Heather
-- 
Heather Williams <heather at runrev.com> <http://www.runrev.com/>
Runtime Revolution Ltd.
Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707
Ten Thumbs Typing Tutor Teach your Fingers to Dance



From benr_mc at cogapp.com  Fri Nov  1 06:43:01 2002
From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein)
Date: Fri Nov  1 06:43:01 2002
Subject: Stack compare utility (scripts)
Message-ID: <B9E81762.236A%benr_mc@cogapp.com>

Has anyone done a utility to compare two stacks (my current interest is in
scripts); or has anyone done a utility to output a neutral description of a
stack (eg in XML format)?

Any suggestions, tips, links or utilites gratefully received,

 
  Ben Rubinstein               |  Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com
  Cognitive Applications Ltd   |  Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600
  http://www.cogapp.com        |  Fax  : +44 (0)1273-728866




From kevin at runrev.com  Fri Nov  1 07:54:01 2002
From: kevin at runrev.com (Kevin Miller)
Date: Fri Nov  1 07:54:01 2002
Subject: Server maintenance
Message-ID: <B9E82872.C77F%kevin@runrev.com>

Hi,

We will be taking everything offline at 1:30PM this afternoon UK time
(that?s in about 45 minutes) for anything up to an hour for essential
maintenance.  We need to rearrange some aspects of the server to be certain
that we don't have a repeat of the problem that took the server down for a
few hours the other day.

Kind regards,

Kevin

Kevin Miller <kevin at runrev.com> <http://www.runrev.com/>
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
Tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165.  Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707.



From zellner at neo.tamu.edu  Fri Nov  1 09:04:01 2002
From: zellner at neo.tamu.edu (Ronald Zellner)
Date: Fri Nov  1 09:04:01 2002
Subject: SQL connections
In-Reply-To: <200211010716.CAA00908@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211010716.CAA00908@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <v04210100b9e836327830@[165.91.10.249]>

Does anyone have a simple, straightforward example of connecting to 
an SQL data base file to read or write text  data?
 
Also, related to the revdatabase.rev example (from the Revolution 
site) where you can send a  graphic file to a DB, is it also possible 
to send  a graphic object  that is on a card to a  DB?

Thanks,

Ron Zellner


From andre.rombauts at win.be  Fri Nov  1 09:37:00 2002
From: andre.rombauts at win.be (Andre Rombauts)
Date: Fri Nov  1 09:37:00 2002
Subject: SQL connections
In-Reply-To: <v04210100b9e836327830@[165.91.10.249]>
Message-ID: <B9E84E24.8273%andre.rombauts@win.be>

Le 01/11/2002 14:57, Ronald Zellner ? zellner at neo.tamu.edu a ?crit:

> Does anyone have a simple, straightforward example of connecting to
> an SQL data base file to read or write text  data?
Also looking for this, please...
Setting up OBDC databases for multiplaform access does not seem obvious to
me... :-(

Andr?



From rcozens at pon.net  Fri Nov  1 11:06:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Fri Nov  1 11:06:01 2002
Subject: usage of "this"
In-Reply-To: <1D25704A-ED0A-11D6-8EBC-000393529642@mindlube.com>
References: <1D25704A-ED0A-11D6-8EBC-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <a05100300b9e85437d5c2@[216.229.107.254]>

>>Hope this helps, check out Rob's original post and sorry for stealing your
>>brain-work Rob.
>
>That seems like the answer, but I just checked and my dynamicPaths 
>properties are set to false in both of the stacks. Or do you think I 
>should be running with dynamicPaths set to true?

Jim, Alex, et al:

If it's the answer, I've no problem with others sharing it; but the 
dynamicPaths issue seems to deal with cards, not stacks.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From dsc at swcp.com  Fri Nov  1 11:55:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Fri Nov  1 11:55:01 2002
Subject: iCalendar/vCalendar (OT: joke)
In-Reply-To: <B9E5C620.6A69%sjoerdoptland@s2theatertechniek.nl>
Message-ID: <766F0FFE-EDB9-11D6-9932-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Wednesday, October 30, 2002, at 02:27 PM, Sjoerd Op 't Land wrote:

>> I don't know what iCalendar/vCalendar is, but I think it will have 
>> units
>> of conductance, the inverse of resistance (ohms).
> ohms^-1

I have seen mho, siemen and Siemen.  The last has caused me confusion, 
because the AV industry often uses S for seconds instead of s.

> (although V isn't the symbol for voltage anymore, it now is U)

Now I feel really old.

Actually, I'm very glad you mentioned this.  I just got my new 
programmable power supply (to be controlled with Revolution, of course), 
looked at the manual, and--yep!--there is U!

Dar Scott



From Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com  Fri Nov  1 13:52:01 2002
From: Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com (Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com)
Date: Fri Nov  1 13:52:01 2002
Subject: UPC or Barcode Scanners
Message-ID: <OF92A13033.67530542-ON85256C64.006154FC@sealedair.com>

Has anyone used Revolution to capture input from barcode readers/scanners
connected via serial or USB? I have tried without success. The unit beeps,
telling me the UPC is valid, but I get no text in my field. I have tried
the examples on opening and reading from serial ports in the Rev help. I
also tried the TEST SERIAL Rev app that was provided here on the list
several months ago. Is there a preferred type or brand of UPC scanner that
works best with Rev? Is there some sample scripts available that does this
sort of thing that I could use as a guide/tutorial?

Kind Regards,
Roger Eller
roger.e.eller at sealedair.com






From smilingeyes at mac.com  Fri Nov  1 14:06:01 2002
From: smilingeyes at mac.com (Ray Bennett)
Date: Fri Nov  1 14:06:01 2002
Subject: UPC or Barcode Scanners
References: <OF92A13033.67530542-ON85256C64.006154FC@sealedair.com>
Message-ID: <3DC2CEFD.3050303@mac.com>

I use a WASP USB barcode scanner in a HyperCard application that I'm 
porting to Rev.  Haven't ported it yet, but see no reason it _shouldn't_ 
be straightforward.  The trick is that the scanner is programmable. 
 Meaning that you can program it to send a preamble (read, "handler 
name") when it reads a code.  For me, I just named the preamble "wasp".  

Then, in my Home stack (main stack in Rev), I have the handler  "on wasp 
barcode".  

When you "gun" a code, the barcode reader sends keyboard input that 
looks like this:
    wasp "Francis Bacon 125"

I put the "on wasp" handler at the top of the hierarchy so that all of 
my substacks could avail themselves of it.  

Hope this helps.
Ray

Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com wrote:

>Has anyone used Revolution to capture input from barcode readers/scanners
>connected via serial or USB? I have tried without success. The unit beeps,
>telling me the UPC is valid, but I get no text in my field. I have tried
>the examples on opening and reading from serial ports in the Rev help. I
>also tried the TEST SERIAL Rev app that was provided here on the list
>several months ago. Is there a preferred type or brand of UPC scanner that
>works best with Rev? Is there some sample scripts available that does this
>sort of thing that I could use as a guide/tutorial?
>
>Kind Regards,
>Roger Eller
>roger.e.eller at sealedair.com
>
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>use-revolution mailing list
>use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>
>  
>




From trevor at mangomultimedia.com  Fri Nov  1 14:13:01 2002
From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore)
Date: Fri Nov  1 14:13:01 2002
Subject: Picture Brightness on Windows
In-Reply-To: <B9DEEEC0.4D0E%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <CF72839A-EDCC-11D6-BAF3-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com>

Scott,

I implemented this technique and it worked great for what we needed.  I 
had a slider that would change the blend of a white image between 100% 
and 80% in order to make the image look lighter.  Thanks.

Trevor DeVore
Blue Mango Multimedia
trevor at mangomultimedia.com

On Friday, October 25, 2002, at 03:51  PM, Scott Rossi wrote:
>
> In any event, you can do some hacked display manipulation using a
> translucent image object (white, black or grey) and changing its 
> blendLevel.
> There are also ink effects that can be employed to achieve other color 
> mix
> variations.  Off hand I would guess that a brightness slider would 
> display a
> translucent white overlay for values from 0 to +100, and black for 0 to
> -100. With some experimentation, you might be able to achieve what you 
> need.
>
> Regards,
>
> Scott Rossi
> Creative Director
> Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
> -----
> E: scott at tactilemedia.com
> W: http://www.tactilemedia.com



From RGould8 at aol.com  Fri Nov  1 15:06:01 2002
From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com)
Date: Fri Nov  1 15:06:01 2002
Subject: Way to ensure Rev app stays on top?
Message-ID: <134.16eff530.2af43714@aol.com>

I've created a Revolution app that launches Internet Explorer.   This is 
fine, except that it puts IE on top of my Rev app.   My Rev app is only 200 
pixels wide.   What I'd like to do, if possible, is have my Rev app appear to 
the left of the IE window - - - My Rev app would be at the very left edge of 
the screen, from 0 - 200 pixels, and then I'd like for IE to be positioned 
from say, 210 pixels and beyond, to the right-edge of the screen.   

Does anyone know if there's a way to do this?   I know how to position the 
stage of my Revolution app to just the correct position.   I'm assuming I'd 
have to use some sort of Applescript calls to position IE.

- Rob
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From Zzyzx at Relia.Net  Fri Nov  1 15:17:01 2002
From: Zzyzx at Relia.Net (Josh Dye)
Date: Fri Nov  1 15:17:01 2002
Subject: Way to ensure Rev app stays on top?
References: <134.16eff530.2af43714@aol.com>
Message-ID: <000901c281e2$ab6f5f30$1501000a@drzzyzx>

I would also like to know how to do this. :)

 - Josh Dye


----- Original Message -----
From: RGould8 at aol.com
To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
Sent: Friday, November 01, 2002 12:59 PM
Subject: Way to ensure Rev app stays on top?


I've created a Revolution app that launches Internet Explorer.  This is
fine, except that it puts IE on top of my Rev app.  My Rev app is only 200
pixels wide.  What I'd like to do, if possible, is have my Rev app appear to
the left of the IE window - - - My Rev app would be at the very left edge of
the screen, from 0 - 200 pixels, and then I'd like for IE to be positioned
from say, 210 pixels and beyond, to the right-edge of the screen.

Does anyone know if there's a way to do this?  I know how to position the
stage of my Revolution app to just the correct position.  I'm assuming I'd
have to use some sort of Applescript calls to position IE.

- Rob



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Fri Nov  1 15:22:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Fri Nov  1 15:22:01 2002
Subject: Way to ensure Rev app stays on top?
References: <134.16eff530.2af43714@aol.com>
Message-ID: <0e4601c281e2$d90f8460$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Rob,

Is this (a) Mac-only, and (b) OS X or OS 9? Knowing this might help in
finding a solution...

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: <RGould8 at aol.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Friday, November 01, 2002 1:59 PM
Subject: Way to ensure Rev app stays on top?


> I've created a Revolution app that launches Internet Explorer.   This is
> fine, except that it puts IE on top of my Rev app.   My Rev app is only
200
> pixels wide.   What I'd like to do, if possible, is have my Rev app appear
to
> the left of the IE window - - - My Rev app would be at the very left edge
of
> the screen, from 0 - 200 pixels, and then I'd like for IE to be positioned
> from say, 210 pixels and beyond, to the right-edge of the screen.
>
> Does anyone know if there's a way to do this?   I know how to position the
> stage of my Revolution app to just the correct position.   I'm assuming
I'd
> have to use some sort of Applescript calls to position IE.
>
> - Rob
>



From RGould8 at aol.com  Fri Nov  1 17:29:04 2002
From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com)
Date: Fri Nov  1 17:29:04 2002
Subject: Way to ensure Rev app stays on top?
Message-ID: <50.144477ed.2af4589c@aol.com>

Whoops - - - you're right - - that would be good to know.

This is for Mac OS 8/9 and Mac OS X.

In a message dated 11/1/02 3:17:06 PM, kray at sonsothunder.com writes:


> Rob,
> 
> Is this (a) Mac-only, and (b) OS X or OS 9? Knowing this might help in
> finding a solution...
> 
> Ken Ray
> Sons of Thunder Software
> Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> 

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From capellan2000 at yahoo.com  Fri Nov  1 19:38:01 2002
From: capellan2000 at yahoo.com (Alejandro Tejada)
Date: Fri Nov  1 19:38:01 2002
Subject: NEW! Eps Import version 03
In-Reply-To: <200210240432.AAA13268@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <20021102003119.47547.qmail@web40509.mail.yahoo.com>

Hi everyone on the list!

Download the new version of the utility stack
EpsImportV03p from:

http://ffc.virtualave.net/revEpsImportV03p.zip
http://ffc.virtualave.net/mcEpsImportV03p.zip

This version is a whole step closer to bring
more of the Adobe Illustrator files to Revolution and
MetaCard.
Now you could import linked Png, Gif and Jpg images
from your designs. There are checkbuttons that give
you options for locking the screen, flip the graphics,
group the objects imported (images and graphics),
import the graphics as outlines (without fill colors),
 import graphics with their color fills, import all
graphics and linked images and select your own folder
for the linked images. And other options for importing
"placed" png images.

If you download version 02 of this tool, you'll like
better version 03. (Tool itself only 50k, but download
zip file is 315 k with the samples files)

Alejandro Tejada Capellan



__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now
http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/


From revolution at knowledgeworks.plus.com  Fri Nov  1 20:01:01 2002
From: revolution at knowledgeworks.plus.com (Bernard Devlin)
Date: Fri Nov  1 20:01:01 2002
Subject: SQL connections
In-Reply-To: <B9E84E24.8273%andre.rombauts@win.be>
References: <v04210100b9e836327830@[165.91.10.249]> <B9E84E24.8273%andre.rombauts@win.be>
Message-ID: <200211020100.UAA09816@www.runrev.com>

I use this script in the onMouseUp event of button that gets a connection:

  put revdb_connections() into connectionList
  if connectionList is empty then
    put the text of button btnDbType into DbType
    put the text of field fdDsn into Dsn
    put the text of field fdUsername into Username
    put the text of field fdDsn into thePassword
    get revdb_connect(DbType,Dsn,"",Username,thePassword)
    wait 3 seconds -- not sure if it needs to wait as long as this
    put revdb_connections() into connectionList
    if connectionList is empty then
      answer "problem connecting to specified datasource"
     else
             set the cpConnNumber of field fdDsn to It  
             -- here the connection number is stored as a custom property so it
can be grabbed when needed
    end if
  end if

You will need to configure the Dsn (ODBC DataSource Name).  I know how to do
this on Win2k and Linux, but not on OS X.  It means you will need to have ODBC
drivers for the database you are using (unless you are using MySql, Oracle or
Valentina - in which case I believe you can make use of the connectors supplied
with Rev.)

Here is the code you can put in a handler to take the SQL from a field, run it
against the ODBC connection, and display the result in another field:

  put the cpConnNumber of field fdDSN into theConnection
  get revdb_querylist(comma,return,theConnection,field "fdQuery")
  put it into field fdResultset

Hope this helps.

> > Does anyone have a simple, straightforward example of connecting to
> > an SQL data base file to read or write text  data?
> Also looking for this, please...
> Setting up OBDC databases for multiplaform access does not seem obvious to
> me... :-(
> 
> Andr?
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution


From alex at mindlube.com  Sat Nov  2 01:21:00 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Sat Nov  2 01:21:00 2002
Subject: SQL connections
In-Reply-To: <200211020100.UAA09816@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <5D3F6820-EE2A-11D6-BC85-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Friday, November 1, 2002, at 05:52  PM, Bernard Devlin wrote:

> You will need to configure the Dsn (ODBC DataSource Name).  I know how 
> to do
> this on Win2k and Linux, but not on OS X.  It means you will need to 
> have ODBC
> drivers for the database you are using (unless you are using MySql, 
> Oracle or
> Valentina - in which case I believe you can make use of the connectors 
> supplied
> with Rev.)
>

Starting with Mac OS X 10.2, there is an ODBC Administrator app in 
/Applications/Utilities. I haven't used it, but would be *very* 
interested to hear how it goes and if you get Rev. working with ODBC on 
OS X.

The only time I've used ODBC before was on Windows and am familiar with 
setting up DSNs there. But on Unix/Mac OS there seems to be a panoply 
of different ODBC drivers and layers. Not sure where to start!

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Sat Nov  2 01:54:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Sat Nov  2 01:54:01 2002
Subject: different windows in the same stack
Message-ID: <p05100300b9e924581fc0@[10.0.1.202]>

Hello,

I've tried to go to different cds in the same stack but don't reach my goal :

I'd like to go to some cds of the stack "as modal"
and some other cds of the same stack "as toplevel"

go to cd "one" of stack "myStack" as modal


when I'm on this cd, I have a btn with this script
go to cd "two" of stack "myStack" as toplevel


It makes problems.


Is it possible to do such a thing ?
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sat Nov  2 03:13:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sat Nov  2 03:13:01 2002
Subject: different windows in the same stack
In-Reply-To: <p05100300b9e924581fc0@[10.0.1.202]>
Message-ID: <20021102080625.44558.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com>

--- yves COPPE <yvescoppe at skynet.be> wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I've tried to go to different cds in the same stack
> but don't reach my goal :
> 
> I'd like to go to some cds of the stack "as modal"
> and some other cds of the same stack "as toplevel"
> 
> go to cd "one" of stack "myStack" as modal
> 
> 
> when I'm on this cd, I have a btn with this script
> go to cd "two" of stack "myStack" as toplevel
> 
> 
> It makes problems.
> 
> 
> Is it possible to do such a thing ?
> -- 
> Greetings.
> 
> Yves COPPE
> 

Hi Yves,

My first response would be that you should move the
'modal' cards into one or more substacks.
You could try to 'clone this stack' but maintaining
any data sets and knowing which stack you're in could
very well become a problem at that point.
Maybe we can provide an alternative approach if you
tell us why you would want to keep these 'modal' cards
in your stack at all cost?

Bestregards,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now
http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/


From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Sat Nov  2 03:26:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Sat Nov  2 03:26:01 2002
Subject: different windows in the same stack
In-Reply-To: <20021102080625.44558.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021102080625.44558.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <p05100300b9e93a9258c8@[10.0.1.202]>

>
>
>Hi Yves,
>
>My first response would be that you should move the
>'modal' cards into one or more substacks.
>You could try to 'clone this stack' but maintaining
>any data sets and knowing which stack you're in could
>very well become a problem at that point.
>Maybe we can provide an alternative approach if you
>tell us why you would want to keep these 'modal' cards
>in your stack at all cost?


To avoid access to menus in the menubar (mac OS X)
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sat Nov  2 04:43:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sat Nov  2 04:43:01 2002
Subject: different windows in the same stack
In-Reply-To: <p05100300b9e93a9258c8@[10.0.1.202]>
Message-ID: <20021102093604.61892.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>

--- yves COPPE <yvescoppe at skynet.be> wrote:
> >
> >
> >Hi Yves,
> >
> >My first response would be that you should move the
> >'modal' cards into one or more substacks.
> >You could try to 'clone this stack' but maintaining
> >any data sets and knowing which stack you're in
> could
> >very well become a problem at that point.
> >Maybe we can provide an alternative approach if you
> >tell us why you would want to keep these 'modal'
> cards
> >in your stack at all cost?
> 
> 
> To avoid access to menus in the menubar (mac OS X)
> -- 
> Greetings.
> 
> Yves COPPE
> 

Hi Yves,

You could always act "as-if" the stack is modal by
disabling the menus yourself. As menus are essentially
buttons, use the 'disable' command:
  disable btn "File"

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now
http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/


From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Sat Nov  2 04:56:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Sat Nov  2 04:56:01 2002
Subject: different windows in the same stack
In-Reply-To: <20021102093604.61892.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021102093604.61892.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <p05100300b9e94fc152b0@[10.0.1.202]>

>
>You could always act "as-if" the stack is modal by
>disabling the menus yourself. As menus are essentially
>buttons, use the 'disable' command:
>   disable btn "File"
>
>Hope this helped,
>


I thought to do it so but with some "lock messages" here and there I 
had problems;

I will trace the lock messages and make as you say "diasble btn".

Thank you.
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From curry at kagi.com  Sat Nov  2 04:59:00 2002
From: curry at kagi.com (curry)
Date: Sat Nov  2 04:59:00 2002
Subject: Correct shell command
In-Reply-To: <200211011748.MAA02642@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211011748.MAA02642@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <a05111b00b9e94af4e1e8@[68.34.213.220]>

I'm trying to figure out a reliable way to set the user's 
shellcommand properly for his or her system. Is "cmd.exe" always the 
right shell for Windows 2K and XP?

I've been thinking along these lines:

on setshell
   set the hideconsolewindows to true
   get shell("vol")
end setshell

on errordialog x
   if "setshell" is in x then
     set the shellcommand to "cmd.exe"
   end if
end errordialog

Would something like this be dependable? Is there a better way?

Thanks,

Curry Kenworthy



From wow at together.net  Sat Nov  2 06:33:01 2002
From: wow at together.net (Richard D. Miller)
Date: Sat Nov  2 06:33:01 2002
Subject: Screenmouseloc
In-Reply-To: <a05111b00b9e94af4e1e8@[68.34.213.220]>
Message-ID: <B9E92081.347AD%wow@together.net>

Can't get the screenmouseloc() command to work under OS 9.2, even enclosing
the coordinates in quotes. Does this work for others?


-- 
Best regards,
Richard Miller, CEO
Advanced Training Systems, Inc.



From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Sat Nov  2 06:41:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Sat Nov  2 06:41:01 2002
Subject: iCalendar/vCalendar (OT: joke)
In-Reply-To: <766F0FFE-EDB9-11D6-9932-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <20021101222128.20178.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com>

 
> > (although V isn't the symbol for voltage
> > anymore, it now is U)
> 
> Now I feel really old.

V is for volt
U is for ?

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now
http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/


From sjoerdoptland at s2theatertechniek.nl  Sat Nov  2 10:29:01 2002
From: sjoerdoptland at s2theatertechniek.nl (Sjoerd Op 't Land)
Date: Sat Nov  2 10:29:01 2002
Subject: iCalendar/vCalendar (OT: joke)
In-Reply-To: <20021101222128.20178.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <B9E9AC09.6B01%sjoerdoptland@s2theatertechniek.nl>

erik hansen wrote/ schreef:

> V is for volt
> U is for ?
voltage

as:

A is for ampere
I is for current

R is for resistance
? is for ohms

Regards, / Groeten,
Sjoerd



From gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net  Sat Nov  2 13:02:01 2002
From: gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net (Gary Aitcheson)
Date: Sat Nov  2 13:02:01 2002
Subject: Web Access
Message-ID: <20021102175506.21491.qmail@web80105.mail.yahoo.com>


When I use "revGoURL "http://www.pageName.com"" I get "Internet Explorer was unable to link to the Web page you requested. The page might be temporarily unavailable". 

I have RR 1.1.1 under XP with a DSL connection and Yahoo as my default browser. 

Any suggestions? 

Thanks - Gary Aitcheson 
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From miscdas at boxfrog.com  Sat Nov  2 13:52:01 2002
From: miscdas at boxfrog.com (miscdas at boxfrog.com)
Date: Sat Nov  2 13:52:01 2002
Subject: iCalendar/vCalendar (OT: joke)
In-Reply-To: <B9E9AC09.6B01%sjoerdoptland@s2theatertechniek.nl> 
References: <B9E9AC09.6B01%sjoerdoptland@s2theatertechniek.nl>
Message-ID: <20021102184616.96731.qmail@www.boxfrog.com>

So what standards body issued the U for voltage?  And, is U still expressed 
in volts? 

miscdas 

Sjoerd Op 't Land writes: 

> erik hansen wrote/ schreef: 
> 
>> V is for volt
>> U is for ?
> voltage 
> 
> as: 
> 
> A is for ampere
> I is for current 
> 
> R is for resistance
> ? is for ohms 
> 
> Regards, / Groeten,
> Sjoerd
 


From sjoerdoptland at s2theatertechniek.nl  Sat Nov  2 14:44:01 2002
From: sjoerdoptland at s2theatertechniek.nl (Sjoerd Op 't Land)
Date: Sat Nov  2 14:44:01 2002
Subject: Screenmouseloc
In-Reply-To: <B9E92081.347AD%wow@together.net>
Message-ID: <B9E9E7A9.6B03%sjoerdoptland@s2theatertechniek.nl>

Richard D. Miller wrote/ schreef:

> Can't get the screenmouseloc() command
A bit more precise, the screenmouseloc is a global property (a bit like a
function, but it is settable.

> to work under OS 9.2, even enclosing the coordinates in quotes. Does this work
> for others?
I guess you mean setting it here. On MacOS 9.0.4 (here) it doesn't work. I
heard something like that it only worked on Windows.

Regards, / Groeten,
Sjoerd



From sjoerdoptland at s2theatertechniek.nl  Sat Nov  2 15:54:01 2002
From: sjoerdoptland at s2theatertechniek.nl (Sjoerd Op 't Land)
Date: Sat Nov  2 15:54:01 2002
Subject: iCalendar/vCalendar (OT: joke)
In-Reply-To: <20021102184616.96731.qmail@www.boxfrog.com>
Message-ID: <B9E9F838.6B0F%sjoerdoptland@s2theatertechniek.nl>

miscdas at boxfrog.com wrote/ schreef:

> So what standards body issued the U for voltage?
SI (system internationale)

> And, is U still expressed in volts?
Yes.

I propose to stop this OT-thread. If you have any questions about
electronics, mail me or search the web, but let's stop posting it here.

Regards, / Groeten,
Sjoerd



From bfr at nwlink.com  Sun Nov  3 00:18:01 2002
From: bfr at nwlink.com (Bruce Robertson)
Date: Sun Nov  3 00:18:01 2002
Subject: Relational database capabilities?
In-Reply-To: <IDELJJOBILDEKAEHEILGOEHJCFAA.gary.rathbone@btclick.com>
Message-ID: <B9E9F002.5CA2%bfr@nwlink.com>

> There's loads of stuff about FileMaker and Rev in the searchable archives at
> 
> <http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com>
> 
> I prefer the web companion method, which briefly...
> 
> Quote
> " You can use FileMaker Pro web companion to  exchange  data between FMP
> and Rev either on the local network or on the internet.
> 
> Normally, all you have to do  (after  setting up web companion) is to send
> 
> put "http://folderInPath/folderWithResponseFile/FMPro" into theURL
> post
> "-db=MyDbNameHere&-lay=DBLayoutNameHere&-format=FormatFileName.html&-findAll
> "
> put urlDecode(it) "


This reply is rather discontinuous. None of the statements seem to relate to
each other. First a variable is declared, then never used. Then a post
statemenet is issued. Then you put something, referring to a variable that
hasn't been defined, and not actually putting it anywhere.

I have searched the referenced site and can't find the orginal which this
quote is supposed to have come from.

Is there a real and complete example of this technique somewhere?



From terry at discovery.nl  Sun Nov  3 01:20:01 2002
From: terry at discovery.nl (Terry Vogelaar)
Date: Sun Nov  3 01:20:01 2002
Subject: Repeats repeated
In-Reply-To: <B9E9F002.5CA2%bfr@nwlink.com>
Message-ID: <5DD56ADA-EEF3-11D6-ACF8-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>

Hi all,

Last week I asked a question about filtering the double lines in a var 
with many lines. The list helped very well by pointing out that I 
shouldn't use "repeat with", but "repeat for each", which brought the 
processing time back from 60 hours to 4 seconds (!)

So I tried the same technique with another script that has a triple 
repeat loop. The var "t" contains about 150 short lines and the script 
is intended to put every possible combination of 3 lines of t into a 
field:

   repeat with f1 = 1 to the number of lines of t - 2
     put line f1 of t into g1
     repeat with f2 = f1+1 to the number of lines of t - 1
       put line f2 of t into g2
       repeat with f3 = f2+1 to the number of lines of t
        put line f3 of t into g3
        put g1&","&g2&","&g3& return after fld "uitvoer"
       end repeat
     end repeat
   end repeat

That took 101 seconds. So I tried to speed it up with what I learned 
about "repeat for each":

   put line 1 to -3 of t into t1
   put 0 into f1
   repeat for each line g1 in t1
     add 1 to f1
     put line f1+1 to -2 of t into t2
     put 0 into f2
     repeat for each line g2 in t2
       add 1 to f2
       put line f2+1 to -1 of t into t3
       repeat for each line g3 in t3
         put g1&","&g2&","&g3& return after fld "uitvoer"
       end repeat
     end repeat
   end repeat

364 seconds! And I thought it would be faster!  It involved some extra 
vars, but since it is not much data processed, I don't think memory 
issues could explain this.

Any thoughts why this is much slower than the original script and how I 
can speed this up?

Terry




From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Sun Nov  3 01:56:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Sun Nov  3 01:56:01 2002
Subject: Repeats repeated
In-Reply-To: <5DD56ADA-EEF3-11D6-ACF8-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>
Message-ID: <B9EA06E7.1F4DF%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Terry Vogelaar wrote:

> Last week I asked a question about filtering the double lines in a var
> with many lines. The list helped very well by pointing out that I
> shouldn't use "repeat with", but "repeat for each", which brought the
> processing time back from 60 hours to 4 seconds (!)
> 
> So I tried the same technique with another script that has a triple
> repeat loop. The var "t" contains about 150 short lines and the script
> is intended to put every possible combination of 3 lines of t into a
> field:
> 
> repeat with f1 = 1 to the number of lines of t - 2
> put line f1 of t into g1
> repeat with f2 = f1+1 to the number of lines of t - 1
> put line f2 of t into g2
> repeat with f3 = f2+1 to the number of lines of t
> put line f3 of t into g3
> put g1&","&g2&","&g3& return after fld "uitvoer"
> end repeat
> end repeat
> end repeat
> 
> That took 101 seconds. So I tried to speed it up with what I learned
> about "repeat for each":
> 
> put line 1 to -3 of t into t1
> put 0 into f1
> repeat for each line g1 in t1
> add 1 to f1
> put line f1+1 to -2 of t into t2
> put 0 into f2
> repeat for each line g2 in t2
> add 1 to f2
> put line f2+1 to -1 of t into t3
> repeat for each line g3 in t3
> put g1&","&g2&","&g3& return after fld "uitvoer"
> end repeat
> end repeat
> end repeat
> 
> 364 seconds! And I thought it would be faster!  It involved some extra
> vars, but since it is not much data processed, I don't think memory
> issues could explain this.
> 
> Any thoughts why this is much slower than the original script and how I
> can speed this up?

Every time you count a line number it eats time.  Arrays are faster for this
-- check out the split and combine commands to see how to convert chunks to
arrays andback again.

Also, take anything that touches a field out of the loop for an even greater
speed increase.

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Custom Software and Web Development for All Major Platforms
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Sun Nov  3 02:35:01 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Sun Nov  3 02:35:01 2002
Subject: Repeats repeated
In-Reply-To: <5DD56ADA-EEF3-11D6-ACF8-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>
Message-ID: <C6E8E3A2-EEFD-11D6-B32B-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Sunday, Nov 3, 2002, at 17:13 Australia/Sydney, Terry Vogelaar wrote:

> Hi all,
>
snip

> So I tried the same technique with another script that has a triple 
> repeat loop. The var "t" contains about 150 short lines and the script 
> is intended to put every possible combination of 3 lines of t into a 
> field:
>
>   repeat with f1 = 1 to the number of lines of t - 2
>     put line f1 of t into g1
>     repeat with f2 = f1+1 to the number of lines of t - 1
>       put line f2 of t into g2
>       repeat with f3 = f2+1 to the number of lines of t
>        put line f3 of t into g3
>        put g1&","&g2&","&g3& return after fld "uitvoer"
>       end repeat
>     end repeat
>   end repeat
>
> That took 101 seconds. So I tried to speed it up with what I learned 
> about "repeat for each":
>
>   put line 1 to -3 of t into t1
>   put 0 into f1
>   repeat for each line g1 in t1
>     add 1 to f1
>     put line f1+1 to -2 of t into t2
>     put 0 into f2
>     repeat for each line g2 in t2
>       add 1 to f2
>       put line f2+1 to -1 of t into t3
>       repeat for each line g3 in t3
>         put g1&","&g2&","&g3& return after fld "uitvoer"
>       end repeat
>     end repeat
>   end repeat
>
> 364 seconds! And I thought it would be faster!  It involved some extra 
> vars, but since it is not much data processed, I don't think memory 
> issues could explain this.
>
> Any thoughts why this is much slower than the original script and how 
> I can speed this up?

Terry

I can see why repeat for each failed here - you need to extract subsets 
of the main list for each of the inner RFE loops for each time through 
its outer loop. Thus, you are extracting by line numbers and doing more 
work than in the first instance. RFE is fast through each sub-list but 
the work of continually creating new lists is an overwhelming burden. 
Not sure how to solve it using arrays as you seem to wind up with the 
same problem only this time fiddling with keys. Since Richard suggested 
that approach, perhaps he has something in mind.....

regards
David
>
> Terry
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sun Nov  3 03:00:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sun Nov  3 03:00:01 2002
Subject: Relational database capabilities?
In-Reply-To: <B9E9F002.5CA2%bfr@nwlink.com>
Message-ID: <20021103075338.23596.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Bruce Robertson <bfr at nwlink.com> wrote:
> [snip]
> 
> This reply is rather discontinuous. None of the
> statements seem to relate to
> each other. First a variable is declared, then never
> used. Then a post
> statemenet is issued. Then you put something,
> referring to a variable that
> hasn't been defined, and not actually putting it
> anywhere.
> 
> I have searched the referenced site and can't find
> the orginal which this
> quote is supposed to have come from.
> 
> Is there a real and complete example of this
> technique somewhere?
> 

Hi Bruce,

Actually, all that was missing was a target URL at the
end of the 'post' command. So it should have read:

put "http://folderInPath/folderWithResponseFile/FMPro"
  into theURL
post
"-db=MyDbNameHere&-lay=DBLayoutNameHere&-format=FormatFileName.html&-findAll"
to theUrl
put urlDecode(it)

At any rate, I went sniffing around my own archives,
and retrieved the following post from the
use-revolution archives:
http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2002-March/002769.html

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now
http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/


From gary.rathbone at btclick.com  Sun Nov  3 06:31:01 2002
From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone)
Date: Sun Nov  3 06:31:01 2002
Subject: Way to ensure Rev app stays on top?
In-Reply-To: <50.144477ed.2af4589c@aol.com>
Message-ID: <IDELJJOBILDEKAEHEILGCEFICGAA.gary.rathbone@btclick.com>

Its difficult to suggest a full solution as I don't know the full picture.
However, A slightly contrived solution is as follows using Web Pages and a
bit of Javascript. It doesn't keep Rev on top, as such, but places the web
browser in a position away from the Rev app, so its visible (as Rob
suggested - I think).

I assuming the following is happening (?)
1. A rev app is launched - positioned top left of screen
2. This rev app sends an HTML file to the browser
3. The browser opens the web page
4. There is some interaction between Rev and the Web Page


Click here (the equivalent of Rev launching a URL - RevGoURL(tURL)- )
http://www.GaryRathbone.net/win5.html

It may be polite to return the Browser to the users location and size after
use.
This has been tested on W2k with IE6. Look at the source of the HTML page to
see how its done.

NOTES
i) Whilst this is a 'live' web solution I don't see any reason why the web
pages can't be held and passed locally
ii) Using Rev as a 'Web Capture' application see
http://www.GaryRathbone.net/RevServ also presents other options.

Regards

Gary Rathbone BSc MBCS
Chartered Information Systems Practitioner





From terry at discovery.nl  Sun Nov  3 10:49:01 2002
From: terry at discovery.nl (Terry Vogelaar)
Date: Sun Nov  3 10:49:01 2002
Subject: Repeats repeated
In-Reply-To: <B9EA06E7.1F4DF%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <CFDF55A4-EF42-11D6-999C-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>

Richard Gaskin heeft op zondag, 3 nov 2002 om 07:49 het volgende 
geschreven:

> Every time you count a line number it eats time.  Arrays are faster 
> for this
> -- check out the split and combine commands to see how to convert 
> chunks to
> arrays andback again.

David Vaughan heeft op zondag, 3 nov 2002 om 08:27 het volgende 
geschreven:

> I can see why repeat for each failed here - you need to extract 
> subsets of the main list for each of the inner RFE loops for each time 
> through its outer loop. Thus, you are extracting by line numbers and 
> doing more work than in the first instance. RFE is fast through each 
> sub-list but the work of continually creating new lists is an 
> overwhelming burden. Not sure how to solve it using arrays as you seem 
> to wind up with the same problem only this time fiddling with keys. 
> Since Richard suggested that approach, perhaps he has something in 
> mind.....

I understand now why my 2nd script was so slow thanks to David. And 
like David I really cannot imagine why Richard's suggestion about using 
arrays would contribute anything to the speed, but I tried it and it 
obviously worked; it reduced my (fastest) 101 seconds to 36!

Thanks,
Terry




From rcozens at pon.net  Sun Nov  3 11:19:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Sun Nov  3 11:19:01 2002
Subject: usage of "this"
In-Reply-To: <B9E6A31A.B227%jmac@consensustech.com>
References: <B9E6A31A.B227%jmac@consensustech.com>
Message-ID: <a05100301b9eaf2af3e90@[216.229.107.204]>

>  > if tCalcType is not empty then
>>  go to first card of stack tCalcType as toplevel
>>  -- close the the current... the stack we were just in.
>>  -- close this stack -- nope; "this stack" has now changed!
>>  close stack "FacilityCalculator"
>>  end if
>>
>
>
>While I'm still simply a newbie lurker... I think your answer lies in a post
>on 10/24 from Rob Cozens titled "Heads Up For HyperCard Stack Converters ".

Jim, Alex, et al:

To expand my previous post, I believe "this" can always be 
interpreted as "the current".  For example, suppose I'm at card A and 
click on a button whose handler takes me to card B.  If the short 
name of "this card" is displayed, it should be "A" before 'go to card 
"B"' and "B" after.

In the scenario above, dynamicPaths determines whether card A and its 
controls or card B and its controls receive messages after 'go to 
card "B"'.  In standard RunRev (dynamicPaths = false) card A and its 
controls continue to receive messages until the handler ends.  In 
converted HC stacks (dynamicPaths = true) card "B" receives all 
messages after 'go to card "B"'.

IMFO, Apple & HC did it wrong here: If one clicks on a control that 
goes to another card with dynamicPaths = true, the mouseLeave message 
is sent to the new card, not the one you just left.  Without 
workaround scripting, the mouseLeave handler will generate a runtime 
error if there is no control on the new card with the same name, id, 
or number (depending on your form of reference) or the handler 
references other controls missing from the target card.

Way back when, before I knew about dynamicPaths, I asked Kevin to 
test the above scenario.  I was SO pleased RunRev did not display 
HC's behavior in this regard.  Virtually every OenoLog button with a 
mouseLeave handler contains or references a workaround for the 
dynamicPaths problem...it will feel SO good to delete all that 
verbiage.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Sun Nov  3 12:09:02 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Sun Nov  3 12:09:02 2002
Subject: Repeats repeated
In-Reply-To: <CFDF55A4-EF42-11D6-999C-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>
Message-ID: <B9EA96A9.1F509%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Terry Vogelaar wrote:

> I understand now why my 2nd script was so slow thanks to David. And
> like David I really cannot imagine why Richard's suggestion about using
> arrays would contribute anything to the speed, but I tried it and it
> obviously worked; it reduced my (fastest) 101 seconds to 36!

It's the line-counting.  Traversing indexed arrays is a faster operation
than counting lines, which includes not only getting a line put appending
new lines to the end of a chunk.

I hgad a 40mb Web log file that used to take prohibitively long to parse;
now it takes under two minutes. :)

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Custom Software and Web Development for All Major Platforms
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From dan at danshafer.com  Sun Nov  3 13:21:01 2002
From: dan at danshafer.com (Dan Shafer)
Date: Sun Nov  3 13:21:01 2002
Subject: Web Access
Message-ID: <a05200a04b9eb16c329d8@[63.205.23.218]>

At 12:02 PM -0500 11/3/02, Gary Aitcheson wrote:
>When I use "revGoURL "http://www.pageName.com"" I get "Internet 
>Explorer was unable to link to the Web page you requested. The page 
>might be temporarily unavailable".
>
>I have RR 1.1.1 under XP with a DSL connection and Yahoo as my 
>default browser.
>
>Any suggestions?

IWOMM. (It Works on My Machine). :-)

As long as I give the revGoURL command a valid Web page address in 
quotation marks, this works every time. I tested it under Mac OS X 
and Windows 2000.

So, perhaps you're giving an invalid URL. For example, the one in 
your email (which I'm sure was just by way of example) *will* produce 
the error you describe because there *is* no such URL as 
www.pageName.com. In fact, that appears to me to be about the *only* 
thing that could be going wrong here because the error message you're 
describing is not generated by RR but rather by Internet Explorer, 
which is your default browser (you've set  Yahoo! as your default 
home page, but Yahoo! is not a browser.)

Try

revGoURL "http://www.runrev.com" and I bet it works.

If not, then something more serious is going on.
-- 
-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
How smart do you work? What's your TQ (Time Quotient)?
Find out free in 2 minutes at http://www.thinktq.com/Results2002
Free one-year training course in your email box - $120 value
Get an insightful book written and published EXCLUSIVELY FOR YOU


From troy at rpsystems.net  Sun Nov  3 13:35:01 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Sun Nov  3 13:35:01 2002
Subject: Web Access
In-Reply-To: <a05200a04b9eb16c329d8@[63.205.23.218]>
Message-ID: <B9EAD4E5.15FEB%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/3/02 1:16 PM, "Dan Shafer" <dan at danshafer.com> wrote:

> Try
> 
> revGoURL "http://www.runrev.com" and I bet it works.
> 
> If not, then something more serious is going on.

Note that Norton Auto-protect will hose up some RevGoURL commands. Anything
from a bad browser launch, to "Blue screen of death", to spontaneous reboot.

This is a known issue, but seems to be more Norton related than Rev related
(there are tons of reports of apps that get screwed by "auto-protect.")

This may not be the case here, but it is worth mentioning, and all users of
RevGoURL should be aware of it - lest be painfully aware of it once you
start crashing client machines.


-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net



From Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com  Sun Nov  3 14:22:01 2002
From: Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com (Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com)
Date: Sun Nov  3 14:22:01 2002
Subject: NEW! Eps Import version 03
Message-ID: <OFCB56E925.76D5C19B-ON85256C65.00562D6F@sealedair.com>

Hi Alejandro,

I think your EPS import is great!  I tried v2 and liked it, and your v3 is
even better. Some of the EPS files I use come from a graphics application
made by Barco-Graphics. They are well known in the printing industry, but
not in the desktop software market. Anyway, I have attached a sample EPS
file for you to play with. I can't get any Barco created EPS files to
import into your program. I have e-mailed a sample to you (off-list).

Will you also be doing EPS Export? I could really use that functionality as
well. Thanks for sharing your creation with the Rev community!  EPS import
is really looking better and better! Keep up the good work.

Kind Regards,
Roger Eller
roger.e.eller at sealedair.com




From freakyphoenix at hotmail.com  Sun Nov  3 14:23:01 2002
From: freakyphoenix at hotmail.com (FreakyPhoenix >)
Date: Sun Nov  3 14:23:01 2002
Subject: question about sockets
Message-ID: <F9gFM8cjJ0RSIOsx24300012c3c@hotmail.com>

An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-livecode/attachments/20021103/992e117a/attachment.html>

From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Sun Nov  3 15:19:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Sun Nov  3 15:19:01 2002
Subject: app crashes frequently
In-Reply-To: <CFDF55A4-EF42-11D6-999C-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>
References: <CFDF55A4-EF42-11D6-999C-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>
Message-ID: <a05200a02b9eb1f717e51@[68.129.88.180]>

i am running Rev 1.1.1. under os X 10.2.1. on a Pismo.  so far i 
haven't done much developing, because the app CRASHES ALL THE TIME. 
anybody else with the same experience?  olli.


From Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com  Sun Nov  3 15:36:01 2002
From: Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com (Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com)
Date: Sun Nov  3 15:36:01 2002
Subject: app crashes frequently
Message-ID: <OFB310B1D2.8DCD8FA4-ON85256C66.0070030F@sealedair.com>

> i am running Rev 1.1.1. under os X 10.2.1. on a Pismo.  so far i
> haven't done much developing, because the app CRASHES ALL THE TIME.
> anybody else with the same experience?  olli.

I don't use a Mac, But I have read here that there is an OS bug in the
Appearance Manager that causes these crashes. The current workaround is to
go under the View menu and set the LookAndFeel to Preview Mac OS.  This
emulates the look of the classic interface I believe. I have also read that
once your app is finished, and you build a stand-alone, the crashes do not
happen in the stand-alone. Like I said, I can't verify any of this.
Hopefully this will help.

Roger Eller
roger.e.eller at sealedair.com




From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Sun Nov  3 16:17:01 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Sun Nov  3 16:17:01 2002
Subject: Repeats repeated
In-Reply-To: <CFDF55A4-EF42-11D6-999C-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>
Message-ID: <A09FB480-EF70-11D6-B32B-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Monday, Nov 4, 2002, at 02:42 Australia/Sydney, Terry Vogelaar wrote:

snip
>
>> . Not sure how to solve it using arrays as you seem to wind up with 
>> the same problem only this time fiddling with keys. Since Richard 
>> suggested that approach, perhaps he has something in mind.....
>
> ... like David I really cannot imagine why Richard's suggestion about 
> using arrays would contribute anything to the speed, but I tried it 
> and it obviously worked; it reduced my (fastest) 101 seconds to 36!

Terry

My problem was not in imagining it would be faster but in would be the 
code :-), given your particular problem.
Would you mind showing your new solution, on or off list?

regards
David
>
> Thanks,
> Terry
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Sun Nov  3 16:32:01 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Sun Nov  3 16:32:01 2002
Subject: app crashes frequently
In-Reply-To: <OFB310B1D2.8DCD8FA4-ON85256C66.0070030F@sealedair.com>
Message-ID: <BF238947-EF72-11D6-B32B-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Monday, Nov 4, 2002, at 07:29 Australia/Sydney, 
Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com wrote:

>
>> i am running Rev 1.1.1. under os X 10.2.1. on a Pismo.  so far i
>> haven't done much developing, because the app CRASHES ALL THE TIME.
>> anybody else with the same experience?  olli.
>
> I don't use a Mac, But I have read here that there is an OS bug in the
> Appearance Manager that causes these crashes. The current workaround 
> is to
> go under the View menu and set the LookAndFeel to Preview Mac OS.  This
> emulates the look of the classic interface I believe. I have also read 
> that
> once your app is finished, and you build a stand-alone, the crashes do 
> not
> happen in the stand-alone. Like I said, I can't verify any of this.
> Hopefully this will help.

Oliver

I do use a Mac (10.2.1). I have it from some of the best people on this 
list that this problem exists on their systems and to use the 
"emulated" workaround, and accept that it is so. However, I do not 
share the problem, finding 1.1.1 stable with Look and Feel set to Mac 
OS Appearance Manager (perhaps it relates to different things we are 
doing with the app; when it comes to multimedia, I'm somewhere else).
So, firstly, the change may work for you, and secondly, if it does not 
then the problem almost certainly does not lie in RR on the Mac but in 
something else in your system.

regards
David
>
> Roger Eller
> roger.e.eller at sealedair.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Sun Nov  3 16:55:00 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Sun Nov  3 16:55:00 2002
Subject: app crashes frequently
In-Reply-To: <BF238947-EF72-11D6-B32B-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>
References: <BF238947-EF72-11D6-B32B-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05200a00b9eb49ee73c7@[128.196.99.206]>

i changed the look and feel accordingly and no more crashes now.  it 
thus appears that there is some kind of bug in Rev 1.1.1.  let's hope 
that this will be solved in 2.0
thanks for your quick help.  best, olli.



11/4/02, David Vaughan wrote:

>On Monday, Nov 4, 2002, at 07:29 Australia/Sydney, 
>Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com wrote:
>
>>
>>>  i am running Rev 1.1.1. under os X 10.2.1. on a Pismo.  so far i
>>>  haven't done much developing, because the app CRASHES ALL THE TIME.
>>>  anybody else with the same experience?  olli.
>>
>>  I don't use a Mac, But I have read here that there is an OS bug in the
>>  Appearance Manager that causes these crashes. The current workaround is to
>>  go under the View menu and set the LookAndFeel to Preview Mac OS.  This
>>  emulates the look of the classic interface I believe. I have also read that

>So, firstly, the change may work for you, and secondly, if it does 
>not then the problem almost certainly does not lie in RR on the Mac 
>but in something else in your system.


From bvlahos at mac.com  Sun Nov  3 17:24:01 2002
From: bvlahos at mac.com (Bill Vlahos)
Date: Sun Nov  3 17:24:01 2002
Subject: app crashes frequently
In-Reply-To: <a05200a00b9eb49ee73c7@[128.196.99.206]>
Message-ID: <059FECFC-EF7A-11D6-A6FD-0003936A2C42@mac.com>

It is a known bug in the IDE for 1.1.1 and will be fixed in 2.0 (it 
already is in the alpha version).

I never see the bug in existing projects but see it right away in new 
ones. Since the Revolution folks have never characterized it (beyond 
saying that it is a bug in the Mac OS) so it is hard to know what 
triggers it.

Bill
On Sunday, November 3, 2002, at 01:48  PM, Oliver Hardt wrote:

> i changed the look and feel accordingly and no more crashes now.  it 
> thus appears that there is some kind of bug in Rev 1.1.1.  let's hope 
> that this will be solved in 2.0



From RGould8 at aol.com  Sun Nov  3 21:46:01 2002
From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com)
Date: Sun Nov  3 21:46:01 2002
Subject: Way to mimic user/pass browser popup?
Message-ID: <144.1dfe8b3.2af737dd@aol.com>

I've hit a serious roadblock, and would appreciate any advice:

I've written a Revolution app that configures a DSL modem.  This DSL modem 
contains a web-server with configuration data that gets passed from it.  I 
have successfully used Revolution to get and pass data back and forth to the 
modem to make/drop connections, request info about the unit, etc.  I've been 
able to test the success of the software I've written by going into IE and 
typing the IP address of the DSL router and going to various URLs on the 
pages hosted in the hardware.

I was 99% complete until the client surprised me with a new feature - - - 
admin login access.  Without it, I cannot access any data from the router.

The good news is, if I go into IE and go to the "getmodeminfo" URL, I get 
prompted (via an IE popup) to enter the admin userid and password and join a 
realm.  After I enter it in IE, I am able to continue browsing the 
configuration pages within the DSL modem.  IE is just for testing, we are 
using Revolution for the actual software.

The bad news is, if I go to the exact same URL in Revolution (using the put 
URL URLvar into x call), I do not get a userid/password popup.  Without this 
popup, or a means of mimicing what IE is doing when it displays the popup and 
passes it back to the server, I'm sunk.  My problem is that I don't really 
know what causes a web-browser to display a login prompt, and even if I did, 
I wouldn't know the http protocols for passing the data back.  I did notice 
that Revolution offers a great means of creating custom HTTP headers, if 
that's of any help.

Any http gurus on the list who could be of help?  I'm authoring this for Mac 
OS 8/9 and X.

- Rob



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Sun Nov  3 21:55:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Sun Nov  3 21:55:01 2002
Subject: Way to mimic user/pass browser popup?
In-Reply-To: <144.1dfe8b3.2af737dd@aol.com>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHMEPDCKAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Hi

Try http://username:password at myurl.com

Monte

> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of
> RGould8 at aol.com
> Sent: Monday, 4 November 2002 1:09 PM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Way to mimic user/pass browser popup?
>
>
> I've hit a serious roadblock, and would appreciate any advice:
>
> I've written a Revolution app that configures a DSL modem.  This
> DSL modem
> contains a web-server with configuration data that gets passed
> from it.  I
> have successfully used Revolution to get and pass data back and
> forth to the
> modem to make/drop connections, request info about the unit, etc.
>  I've been
> able to test the success of the software I've written by going
> into IE and
> typing the IP address of the DSL router and going to various URLs on the
> pages hosted in the hardware.
>
> I was 99% complete until the client surprised me with a new feature - - -
> admin login access.  Without it, I cannot access any data from the router.
>
> The good news is, if I go into IE and go to the "getmodeminfo" URL, I get
> prompted (via an IE popup) to enter the admin userid and password
> and join a
> realm.  After I enter it in IE, I am able to continue browsing the
> configuration pages within the DSL modem.  IE is just for testing, we are
> using Revolution for the actual software.
>
> The bad news is, if I go to the exact same URL in Revolution
> (using the put
> URL URLvar into x call), I do not get a userid/password popup.
> Without this
> popup, or a means of mimicing what IE is doing when it displays
> the popup and
> passes it back to the server, I'm sunk.  My problem is that I
> don't really
> know what causes a web-browser to display a login prompt, and
> even if I did,
> I wouldn't know the http protocols for passing the data back.  I
> did notice
> that Revolution offers a great means of creating custom HTTP headers, if
> that's of any help.
>
> Any http gurus on the list who could be of help?  I'm authoring
> this for Mac
> OS 8/9 and X.
>
> - Rob
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From terry at discovery.nl  Sun Nov  3 22:22:01 2002
From: terry at discovery.nl (Terry Vogelaar)
Date: Sun Nov  3 22:22:01 2002
Subject: Repeats repeated
In-Reply-To: <A09FB480-EF70-11D6-B32B-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>
Message-ID: <8B66E480-EFA3-11D6-995F-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>

David Vaughan heeft op zondag, 3 nov 2002 om 22:10 het volgende 
geschreven:

>> ... like David I really cannot imagine why Richard's suggestion about 
>> using arrays would contribute anything to the speed, but I tried it 
>> and it obviously worked; it reduced my (fastest) 101 seconds to 36!
>
> My problem was not in imagining it would be faster but in would be the 
> code :-), given your particular problem.
> Would you mind showing your new solution, on or off list?

Of course:

   put the number of lines of t into s
   split t by return
   repeat with f1 = 1 to s - 2
     put t[f1] into g1
     repeat with f2 = f1+1 to s - 1
       put t[f2] into g2
       repeat with f3 = f2+1 to s
         put t[f3] into g3
         put g1 & "," & g2 & "," & g3 & return after outvar
       end repeat
     end repeat
   end repeat

You see, no big changes with the first script. It only uses an array 
instead of the lines of a variable (25 secs faster) and outputs it to a 
var instead of to a field (40 secs faster).

Terry




From dan at danshafer.com  Sun Nov  3 23:14:01 2002
From: dan at danshafer.com (Dan Shafer)
Date: Sun Nov  3 23:14:01 2002
Subject: app crashes frequently
Message-ID: <a05200a0bb9eba3190e10@[63.205.23.218]>

At 10:23 PM -0500 11/3/02, Oliver Hardt wrote:
>i am running Rev 1.1.1. under os X 10.2.1. on a Pismo.  so far i
>haven't done much developing, because the app CRASHES ALL THE TIME.
>anybody else with the same experience?  olli.

I run Rev 1.1.1 under OS X 10.2.1 but not on a Pismo. I haven't had a 
Rev crash in weeks and weeks. FWIW
-- 
-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
Dan Shafer
Technology Visionary - Technology Assessment - Documentation
"Looking at technology from every angle"
http://www.danshafer.com
831-392-1127 Voice - 831-401-2531 Fax


From Jmicha5059 at aol.com  Mon Nov  4 00:19:01 2002
From: Jmicha5059 at aol.com (Jmicha5059 at aol.com)
Date: Mon Nov  4 00:19:01 2002
Subject: Development vs Standalones
Message-ID: <193.101ba610.2af75ba1@aol.com>

I have what I hope is a simple question and problem to solve.  I recently 
constructed a simple stack that does some graphing using the paint tools.  
The graphing works fine in the developer version but does not work in the OSX 
or Windows Standalone versions.  I cannot find a resource library or anything 
else in the Distribution settings that fixes the problem.  Others must have 
run into this problem.  Is there any document that explains all the 
differences between the devlelopment version and the standalone versions?  
Has  anyone fixed this problem before?  Thanks much in advance.

Mike Williams
http://www.brainmetric.com


From gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net  Mon Nov  4 02:26:01 2002
From: gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net (Gary Aitcheson)
Date: Mon Nov  4 02:26:01 2002
Subject: Web Access
Message-ID: <20021104071956.21743.qmail@web80104.mail.yahoo.com>


Thanks for the suggestions. No solution yet but the problem in plainer. Somewhere in the process unwanted characters are inserted into the message. 

revgoURL "http:www.runrev.com" results in http://"http:www.runrev.com"/  in the Address bar.  

revgoURL "www.runrev.com" results in http://"www.runrev.com"/ 

revgoURL www.runrev.com results in http://"www.runrev.com"/ 

revgoURL tAddress (with www.runrev.com in tAddress) results in http://"www.runrev.com"/ 

revgoURL runrev.com results in nothing

How to get rid of these unnecessary additions? The cat is being killed with kindness.

Thanks - Gary



 


 
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From chipp at chipp.com  Mon Nov  4 02:49:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Mon Nov  4 02:49:01 2002
Subject: Way to mimic user/pass browser popup?
In-Reply-To: <144.1dfe8b3.2af737dd@aol.com>
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOEECHCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Rob,

It depends on how they're doing their password authentication. It sounds
like they're doing a redirect based on some logged in cookie setting (just a
guess - you might want to ask them). If that is the case, then you'll have
to check the response for the redirect -- or just go to the login screen
first. If you give us more information, we should be able to help you.

-Chipp

>
> I've hit a serious roadblock, and would appreciate any advice:
>
> I've written a Revolution app that configures a DSL modem.  This
> DSL modem
> contains a web-server with configuration data that gets passed
> from it.  I
> have successfully used Revolution to get and pass data back and
> forth to the
> modem to make/drop connections, request info about the unit, etc.
>  I've been
> able to test the success of the software I've written by going
> into IE and
> typing the IP address of the DSL router and going to various URLs on the
> pages hosted in the hardware.
>
> I was 99% complete until the client surprised me with a new feature - - -
> admin login access.  Without it, I cannot access any data from the router.
>
> The good news is, if I go into IE and go to the "getmodeminfo" URL, I get
> prompted (via an IE popup) to enter the admin userid and password
> and join a
> realm.  After I enter it in IE, I am able to continue browsing the
> configuration pages within the DSL modem.  IE is just for testing, we are
> using Revolution for the actual software.
>
> The bad news is, if I go to the exact same URL in Revolution
> (using the put
> URL URLvar into x call), I do not get a userid/password popup.
> Without this
> popup, or a means of mimicing what IE is doing when it displays
> the popup and
> passes it back to the server, I'm sunk.  My problem is that I
> don't really
> know what causes a web-browser to display a login prompt, and
> even if I did,
> I wouldn't know the http protocols for passing the data back.  I
> did notice
> that Revolution offers a great means of creating custom HTTP headers, if
> that's of any help.
>
> Any http gurus on the list who could be of help?  I'm authoring
> this for Mac
> OS 8/9 and X.
>



From chipp at chipp.com  Mon Nov  4 02:52:00 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Mon Nov  4 02:52:00 2002
Subject: Web Access
In-Reply-To: <20021104071956.21743.qmail@web80104.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOIECHCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Gary,

try:

revgoURL "http://wwwrunrev.com"

(you forgot the slashes)

-----Original Message-----
From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
[mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Gary Aitcheson
Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 1:20 AM
To: RUG
Subject: Web Access


Thanks for the suggestions. No solution yet but the problem in plainer.
Somewhere in the process unwanted characters are inserted into the message.
revgoURL "http:www.runrev.com" results in http://"http:www.runrev.com"/  in
the Address bar.
revgoURL "www.runrev.com" results in http://"www.runrev.com"/
revgoURL www.runrev.com results in http://"www.runrev.com"/
revgoURL tAddress (with www.runrev.com in tAddress) results in
http://"www.runrev.com"/
revgoURL runrev.com results in nothing
How to get rid of these unnecessary additions? The cat is being killed with
kindness.
Thanks - Gary








From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Mon Nov  4 03:16:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Mon Nov  4 03:16:01 2002
Subject: Repeats repeated
In-Reply-To: <8B66E480-EFA3-11D6-995F-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>
Message-ID: <B9EB6B47.1F584%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Terry Vogelaar wrote:

> David Vaughan heeft op zondag, 3 nov 2002 om 22:10 het volgende
> geschreven:
> 
>>> ... like David I really cannot imagine why Richard's suggestion about
>>> using arrays would contribute anything to the speed, but I tried it
>>> and it obviously worked; it reduced my (fastest) 101 seconds to 36!
>> 
>> My problem was not in imagining it would be faster but in would be the
>> code :-), given your particular problem.
>> Would you mind showing your new solution, on or off list?
> 
> Of course:
> 
> put the number of lines of t into s
> split t by return
> repeat with f1 = 1 to s - 2
> put t[f1] into g1
> repeat with f2 = f1+1 to s - 1
> put t[f2] into g2
> repeat with f3 = f2+1 to s
> put t[f3] into g3
> put g1 & "," & g2 & "," & g3 & return after outvar
> end repeat
> end repeat
> end repeat
> 
> You see, no big changes with the first script. It only uses an array
> instead of the lines of a variable (25 secs faster) and outputs it to a
> var instead of to a field (40 secs faster).

Excellent job, Terry!  And thanks for posting that to the list -- this has
been a valuable lesson in the benefits of employing Rev's unique syntax
options.

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Mon Nov  4 04:44:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Mon Nov  4 04:44:01 2002
Subject: iCalendar/vCalendar (OT: joke)
In-Reply-To: <B9E9AC09.6B01%sjoerdoptland@s2theatertechniek.nl>
Message-ID: <20021103010617.49152.qmail@web20004.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Sjoerd Op 't Land
<sjoerdoptland at s2theatertechniek.nl> wrote:
> erik hansen wrote/ schreef:
> 
> > V is for volt
> > U is for ?
> voltage
> 
> as:
> 
> A is for ampere
> I is for current
> 
> R is for resistance
> ? is for ohms

so in Sweden they have Uoltage?

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now
http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/


From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk  Mon Nov  4 04:50:00 2002
From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg)
Date: Mon Nov  4 04:50:00 2002
Subject: Way to mimic user/pass browser popup?
In-Reply-To: <144.1dfe8b3.2af737dd@aol.com>
References: <144.1dfe8b3.2af737dd@aol.com>
Message-ID: <p05200e01b9ebe9678910@[192.168.123.3]>

At 9:39 pm -0500 3/11/02, RGould8 at aol.com wrote:

>I was 99% complete until the client surprised me with a new feature - - -
>admin login access.  Without it, I cannot access any data from the router.
>
>The good news is, if I go into IE and go to the "getmodeminfo" URL, I get
>prompted (via an IE popup) to enter the admin userid and password and join a
>realm.  After I enter it in IE, I am able to continue browsing the
>configuration pages within the DSL modem.  IE is just for testing, we are
>using Revolution for the actual software.
>
>The bad news is, if I go to the exact same URL in Revolution (using the put
>URL URLvar into x call), I do not get a userid/password popup.  Without this
>popup, or a means of mimicing what IE is doing when it displays the popup and
>passes it back to the server, I'm sunk.  My problem is that I don't really
>know what causes a web-browser to display a login prompt, and even if I did,
>I wouldn't know the http protocols for passing the data back.  I did notice
>that Revolution offers a great means of creating custom HTTP headers, if
>that's of any help.

Assuming the modem/server is using the "http basic authorization" 
scheme (which it sounds like from your IE experience), Monte's 
suggestion is the right approach -- put the user name and password in 
the url.

get url "http://username:password at host/path/page.html"

Rev will take care of filling out the headers for you.

In this case, as you know in advance that a login is required, you 
can ask the user to enter a user name and password before 
constructing the url.

In the more general case, where you may not know in advance that a 
username/password is required, you need to check the response from 
the server to your url request. If authorization failed (because you 
didn't supply a username/password), the server will return a 401 
response. You can get this from the result function after making the 
url request. It will look somethig like "error 401 Unauthorized" (The 
text following 401 will vary by server)

So the general approach would be to do something like this:

--make your "get url" call
--check the result
--if word 2 of the result is 401 then
    -- ask the user to supply a name and password
    -- insert the name and password in to the url as above
    -- make the "get url" request again


Cheers
Dave


From chipp at chipp.com  Mon Nov  4 05:11:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Mon Nov  4 05:11:01 2002
Subject: New ButtonGadget for Revolution...
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOGECKCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Hey All,

I've just released ButtonGadget as an Altuit application made in RunRev. I
also have a version developed solely for Windows RR users and would like
some feedback. The current beta version is free to all who register.

ButtonGadget automatically builds 1,2,3 or 4 state buttons (normal,
mouseOver, mouseDown, disabled) based upon predefined 'ButtonSet' templates.
Many templates are available online (more coming soon) and you can 'roll
your own.' Once buttons are rendered, they can automatically be transferred
to the stack you're working on.

Many of the ButtonSets are very sophisticated including multiple
transparency settings and the ability to adapt to any color background.
Buttons can also be exported as PNG and JPG as well.

One of the keen features, is the one-click access -- a user needs only click
once on a buttonset link on a webpage and it automatically downloads,
launches ButtonGadget.exe and loads itself. You'll need to install the
ButtonGadget.exe to see how this works.

Developers can use ButtonGadget to create complete OS independant
interfaces, so no worrying about how Linux/Mac/Windows is going to 'render'
your app. You can check it out at:

http://www.buttongadget.com/buttongadget/RunRevUsers.htm

best,

Chipp Walters
Altuit, Inc.



From benr_mc at cogapp.com  Mon Nov  4 07:22:01 2002
From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein)
Date: Mon Nov  4 07:22:01 2002
Subject: Getting the type of a control
Message-ID: <B9EC14E0.243D%benr_mc@cogapp.com>

Is there a clean way to get the type of a control?

If I write a script that goes through the controls of a stack in order, I
can get the properties of each control, and list them.  The only property I
don't seem to be able to get is what type of control it is - field, button,
etc.  You can even get the number property, which is dependant on the type -
eg if you have a group containing a field, a button, and another field, you
get
    layer number
    1       1  - first group
    2       1  - first field
    3       1  - first button
    4       2  - second field

...but I can't see anything to return the type.  The workaround I've found
is to get first word of the long name - but that seems like a hack.  Is
there a clean way?

TIA,

  Ben Rubinstein               |  Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com
  Cognitive Applications Ltd   |  Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600
  http://www.cogapp.com        |  Fax  : +44 (0)1273-728866




From JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com  Mon Nov  4 07:32:01 2002
From: JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com (JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com)
Date: Mon Nov  4 07:32:01 2002
Subject: INFO FOR NEWBIE: whats next
Message-ID: <F14C380BA911D211B58A0008C724468D077B4609@JANBEBEEXS5.janbe.jnj.com>

Dear

after completing the exercieses wich comes with revolution

what is the next best step to follow

kind regards
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From Doug_Ivers at lord.com  Mon Nov  4 09:45:01 2002
From: Doug_Ivers at lord.com (Ivers, Doug E)
Date: Mon Nov  4 09:45:01 2002
Subject: Development vs Standalones
Message-ID: <E08533A454364A4C8B395EA007D1F42309D79F@ntsrvcrd04.main.lord.com>

I've also noticed a descrepancy between dev and standalone on Windows regarding the display of bold HTML text.  MacX dev, MacX standalone, Windows dev are all ok, but bold doesn't show on Windows standalone.

-- D


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jmicha5059 at aol.com [mailto:Jmicha5059 at aol.com]
> Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 12:12 AM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Development vs Standalones
> 
> 
> I have what I hope is a simple question and problem to solve. 
>  I recently 
> constructed a simple stack that does some graphing using the 
> paint tools.  
> The graphing works fine in the developer version but does not 
> work in the OSX 
> or Windows Standalone versions.  I cannot find a resource 
> library or anything 
> else in the Distribution settings that fixes the problem.  
> Others must have 
> run into this problem.  Is there any document that explains all the 
> differences between the devlelopment version and the 
> standalone versions?  
> Has  anyone fixed this problem before?  Thanks much in advance.
> 
> Mike Williams
> http://www.brainmetric.com
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 


From troy at rpsystems.net  Mon Nov  4 10:25:01 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Mon Nov  4 10:25:01 2002
Subject: New ButtonGadget for Revolution...
In-Reply-To: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOGECKCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <B9EBF8BC.1602F%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/4/02 5:04 AM, "Chipp Walters" <chipp at chipp.com> wrote:

> I've just released ButtonGadget as an Altuit application made in RunRev. I
> also have a version developed solely for Windows RR users and would like
> some feedback. The current beta version is free to all who register.

Hey Chipp, that looks great!! Let us know when the Mac OSX version is
available for testing.  ;-)


-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net



From RGould8 at aol.com  Mon Nov  4 10:30:01 2002
From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com)
Date: Mon Nov  4 10:30:01 2002
Subject: Way to mimic user/pass browser popup?
Message-ID: <14d.16d45a5d.2af7eac6@aol.com>

Yup!   This did the trick - - - thanks everyone for your advice - - - the 

get url "http://username:password at host/path/page.html"

worked just fine.

In a message dated 11/4/02 4:44:45 AM, dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk writes:


> Assuming the modem/server is using the "http basic authorization"
> scheme (which it sounds like from your IE experience), Monte's
> suggestion is the right approach -- put the user name and password in
> the url.
> 
> get url "http://username:password at host/path/page.html"
> 

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From raney at metacard.com  Mon Nov  4 13:24:00 2002
From: raney at metacard.com (Scott Raney)
Date: Mon Nov  4 13:24:00 2002
Subject: app crashes frequently
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211041058320.28819-100000@mast.metacard.com>

On Sun, 3 Nov 2002 Bill Vlahos <bvlahos at mac.com> wrote:

> It is a known bug in the IDE for 1.1.1 and will be fixed in 2.0 (it
> already is in the alpha version).
> 
> I never see the bug in existing projects but see it right away in new
> ones. Since the Revolution folks have never characterized it (beyond
> saying that it is a bug in the Mac OS) so it is hard to know what
> triggers it.

It's Apple bug #3078545, FYI, and is a problem where Appearance
Manager makes invalid assumptions about what the current background
pattern is.  Any app that changes the pattern and then draws a
pushbutton could run into (not just RR/MC apps).  It's only a problem
in 10.2 and most likely only going to be a problem when running RR
(we've never seen it in MC) because of the way it changes the patterns
to update the toolbar and palettes when the selection changes.  It's
possible to cause the problem in standalones, though this is unlikely
unless you use "standard" style buttons together with other types of
controls with their backPattern set and force redraws to occur in a
particular order.

We've already worked around this bug for MC 2.5/RR 2.0.  It's a highly
reproducible bug, so if you must release your application before this
new version of MC/RR is released, just be sure to test it on a 10.2
system to make sure you didn't just stumble on the "magic
incantation".  If you don't see the problem, neither will your
customers.
  Regards,
    Scott

********************************************************
Scott Raney  raney at metacard.com  http://www.metacard.com
MetaCard: You know, there's an easier way to do that...



From chipp at chipp.com  Mon Nov  4 14:58:08 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Mon Nov  4 14:58:08 2002
Subject: New ButtonGadget for Revolution...
In-Reply-To: <B9EBF8BC.1602F%troy@rpsystems.net>
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOMEDDCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Thanks Troy,

I'll get to the Mac version of ButtonGadget soon. In fact there's already a
bunch of code in it to do the image processing on Macs. The problem areas
are registration without a registry and how to launch ButtonGadget when
clicking on a web link (any ideas anyone?)

best,

Chipp


> > I've just released ButtonGadget as an Altuit application made
> in RunRev. I
> > also have a version developed solely for Windows RR users and would like
> > some feedback. The current beta version is free to all who register.
>
> Hey Chipp, that looks great!! Let us know when the Mac OSX version is
> available for testing.  ;-)
>



From gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net  Mon Nov  4 15:21:00 2002
From: gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net (Gary Aitcheson)
Date: Mon Nov  4 15:21:00 2002
Subject: Web Access (corrected version!)
Message-ID: <20021104201500.43692.qmail@web80103.mail.yahoo.com>


Sorry, I had typos in my last post. I shouldn't write these late at night. I did have the appropriate slashes in the address but it still did not work. To recap - I am trying to use revGoURL to access the web. I have RR 1.1.1 on XP and Internet Explorer. I get a web page that says in part "Internet Explorer was unable to link to the Web page you requested."  This is clearly because the address in the Address Bar is different from the one that  I put with the revGoURL command. It seems that somewhere the system thinks my address is incomplete and is trying to be helpful by adding to it, but the end result is incorrect. My experiments with different forms of the command give these results int the Address Bar

revGoURL  "http://www.runRev.com/"  gives   http://"http://www.runrev.com/"
revGoURL  http://www.runrev.com/      gives   http://"http:"/
revGoURL  "www.runrev.com/"            gives   http://"www.runrev.com/"
revGoURL  www.runrev.com/              gives   http://"www.runrev.com/"
revGoURL  www.runrev.com               gives   http://"www.runrev.com"/

I suspect that the problem is not in RR but elsewere in the process. Any ideas?

Thanks for your patience with this rather boring glitch - Gary


 
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From freakyphoenix at hotmail.com  Mon Nov  4 15:55:01 2002
From: freakyphoenix at hotmail.com (FreakyPhoenix >)
Date: Mon Nov  4 15:55:01 2002
Subject: Just a little Self-Correction
Message-ID: <OE17tuKCM0xLURAjRCE0000f391@hotmail.com>

Self-Correction: UTP, not UDP.


FreakyPhoenixHaal meer uit het web. Download MSN Explorer gratis: http://explorer.msn.nl/intl.asp#du
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From scott at tactilemedia.com  Mon Nov  4 16:07:01 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Mon Nov  4 16:07:01 2002
Subject: Getting the type of a control
In-Reply-To: <B9EC14E0.243D%benr_mc@cogapp.com>
Message-ID: <B9EC0CD0.50E1%scott@tactilemedia.com>

Recently, "Ben Rubinstein"  wrote:

> Is there a clean way to get the type of a control?

One way:

  answer the long name of control n

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-----
E: scott at tactilemedia.com
W: http://www.tactilemedia.com



From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Mon Nov  4 16:15:00 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Mon Nov  4 16:15:00 2002
Subject: INFO FOR NEWBIE: whats next
In-Reply-To: <F14C380BA911D211B58A0008C724468D077B4609@JANBEBEEXS5.janbe.jnj.com>
Message-ID: <9FE6C1E8-F039-11D6-B32B-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>


On Monday, Nov 4, 2002, at 23:25 Australia/Sydney, 
JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com wrote:

> Dear
>
> after completing the exercieses wich comes with revolution
>
> what is the next best step to follow
>
> kind regards
>
Build something for yourself. Convert something you have or make a new 
application that might be interesting to you. It is the best step 
because you will find the problems and features which relate to the way 
_you_ build applications, not somebody else's approach.

regards
David
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From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Mon Nov  4 16:16:01 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Mon Nov  4 16:16:01 2002
Subject: INFO FOR NEWBIE: whats next
In-Reply-To: <F14C380BA911D211B58A0008C724468D077B4609@JANBEBEEXS5.janbe.jnj.com>
Message-ID: <BC814CFC-F039-11D6-B32B-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>


On Monday, Nov 4, 2002, at 23:25 Australia/Sydney, 
JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com wrote:

> Dear
>
> after completing the exercieses wich comes with revolution
>
> what is the next best step to follow
>
> kind regards
>
Build something for yourself. Convert something you have or make a new 
application that might be interesting to you. It is the best step 
because you will find the problems and features which relate to the way 
_you_ build applications, not somebody else's approach.

regards
David
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From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Mon Nov  4 16:26:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Mon Nov  4 16:26:01 2002
Subject: loading images
In-Reply-To: <B9EC0CD0.50E1%scott@tactilemedia.com>
References: <B9EC0CD0.50E1%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <a05200a03b9ec933535eb@[68.128.200.249]>

problem: i want to load an image but i don't want to display it 
immediately.  currently, i am using the approach lined out below.

2 questions:  (1) any better scripting out there?  (2) when i import 
an image with "import paint ...", how do i get the ID RR assigned to 
the image?

thanks, olli.



current approach:


   answer file "Select Image to Display"
   put it into lFileName
   if lFileName is not empty
   then
     lock screen
     import paint from file lFileName
     set the itemDelimiter to "/"
     put the last item of lFileName into lImageName
     hide image lImageName
     unlock screen
     wait 2 seconds
     show image lImageName
   end if


From chipp at chipp.com  Mon Nov  4 17:01:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Mon Nov  4 17:01:01 2002
Subject: loading images
In-Reply-To: <a05200a03b9ec933535eb@[68.128.200.249]>
Message-ID: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAMEPNCMAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Oliver,

Check out:

hide img "hiddenImage"
answer file "Select Image to Display"
set the filename of img "hiddenImage" to it

then you can show/hide img "hiddenImage" anytime you want,

Chipp

> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Oliver Hardt
> Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 3:19 PM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: loading images
> 
> 
> problem: i want to load an image but i don't want to display it 
> immediately.  currently, i am using the approach lined out below.
> 
> 2 questions:  (1) any better scripting out there?  (2) when i import 
> an image with "import paint ...", how do i get the ID RR assigned to 
> the image?
> 
> thanks, olli.
> 
> 
> 
> current approach:
> 
> 
>    answer file "Select Image to Display"
>    put it into lFileName
>    if lFileName is not empty
>    then
>      lock screen
>      import paint from file lFileName
>      set the itemDelimiter to "/"
>      put the last item of lFileName into lImageName
>      hide image lImageName
>      unlock screen
>      wait 2 seconds
>      show image lImageName
>    end if
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 


From chipp at chipp.com  Mon Nov  4 17:04:00 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Mon Nov  4 17:04:00 2002
Subject: Web Access (corrected version!)
In-Reply-To: <20021104201500.43692.qmail@web80103.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAEEPOCMAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Gary,

revGoURL "http://www.runrev.com" works just fine from the messagebox on my
XP machine...

hmmm

btw, please post to the list as Plain Text

best,

Chipp



From chipp at chipp.com  Tue Nov  5 00:18:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Tue Nov  5 00:18:01 2002
Subject: Cool generic scripts...
Message-ID: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAEEADCNAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Everyone has a bunch of tools they use when developing programs...And I was
wondering if anyone wanted to share some of the stuff they put in *all*
their projects?

for instance, I usually put the following in all my stacks:

on closeStack

  if exists(stack "revMenubar") or exists(stack "Home") then
    beep
  else
    answer question "Are you sure you want to Quit?" with "No" or "Yes"
    if it is "Yes" then
      killSockets
      quit
    end if
  end if

end closeStack

on killSockets
  put openSockets() into theSocks
  repeat for each line sock in theSocks
    close socket sock
  end repeat
end killSockets

this checks to see if I'm in RR (stack "revMenubar") or MC (stack "Home").
Also, I need to trap it in other stacks or else they'll quit the application
when they close a window.

Any others out there?

-Chipp

---------------------
Chipp Walters
Altuit, inc.
http://www.altuit.com
http://www.chipp.com
---------------------



From jeanne at runrev.com  Tue Nov  5 00:42:01 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Tue Nov  5 00:42:01 2002
Subject: Getting the type of a control
In-Reply-To: <B9EC14E0.243D%benr_mc@cogapp.com>
Message-ID: <v0313030bb9ecfbc409dc@[10.0.1.18]>

At 4:15 AM -0800 11/4/02, Ben Rubinstein wrote:
>Is there a clean way to get the type of a control?
[...]
>...but I can't see anything to return the type.  The workaround I've found
>is to get first word of the long name - but that seems like a hack.

That's the only way to do it that I know of.

The first word of the long name of a control will always report the object
type, unless the stack's hcAddressing is true. In that case, you need the
second word (the first word is "card" or "background" if the hcAddressing
is true).

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com  Tue Nov  5 01:32:01 2002
From: JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com (JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com)
Date: Tue Nov  5 01:32:01 2002
Subject: INFO FOR NEWBIE: whats next
Message-ID: <F14C380BA911D211B58A0008C724468D077B4610@JANBEBEEXS5.janbe.jnj.com>

Thanks David
 
I was trying to do this
but thought that this wasn't a very good idee
 
kind regards

-----Original Message-----
From: David Vaughan [mailto:dvk at dvkconsult.com.au]
Sent: Monday, 4 November 2002 22:10
To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
Subject: Re: INFO FOR NEWBIE: whats next





On Monday, Nov 4, 2002, at 23:25 Australia/Sydney, JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com
wrote: 


Dear 


after completing the exercieses wich comes with revolution 


what is the next best step to follow 


kind regards 


Build something for yourself. Convert something you have or make a new
application that might be interesting to you. It is the best step because
you will find the problems and features which relate to the way _you_ build
applications, not somebody else's approach. 


regards 

David 

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From mazzapaolo at libero.it  Tue Nov  5 01:42:01 2002
From: mazzapaolo at libero.it (paolo mazza)
Date: Tue Nov  5 01:42:01 2002
Subject: Save array
In-Reply-To: <200211041532.KAA00348@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <B9ED2930.4457%mazzapaolo@libero.it>

How can I save an array into a stack?
I thought I could save the array into a custom property.
Am I supposed to combine the array and save in text format?
Thanks, Paolo



From chipp at chipp.com  Tue Nov  5 02:55:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Tue Nov  5 02:55:01 2002
Subject: Cool generic scripts...
In-Reply-To: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAEEADCNAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAOEAECNAA.chipp@chipp.com>

I meant to say "all my *main* stacks"

> Everyone has a bunch of tools they use when developing 
> programs...And I was
> wondering if anyone wanted to share some of the stuff they put in *all*
> their projects?
> 
> for instance, I usually put the following in all my stacks:
> 
> on closeStack
> 
>   if exists(stack "revMenubar") or exists(stack "Home") then
>     beep
>   else
>     answer question "Are you sure you want to Quit?" with "No" or "Yes"
>     if it is "Yes" then
>       killSockets
>       quit
>     end if
>   end if
> 
> end closeStack
> 
> on killSockets
>   put openSockets() into theSocks
>   repeat for each line sock in theSocks
>     close socket sock
>   end repeat
> end killSockets
> 
> 


From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Tue Nov  5 03:56:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Tue Nov  5 03:56:01 2002
Subject: Save array
In-Reply-To: <B9ED2930.4457%mazzapaolo@libero.it>
Message-ID: <B9ECC610.1F662%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

paolo mazza wrote:

> How can I save an array into a stack?
> I thought I could save the array into a custom property.
> Am I supposed to combine the array and save in text format?

You can do that, or you can set an entire propertyset to an array, with each
element in the array becoming a property in the specified propertyset:

  -- Create an array:
  put "hello world" into tMyArray[1]
  --
  -- Tell MC which propertyset to work with:
  set the propertyset of stack "storage" to "ArrayData"
  --
  -- Set all of the key-value pairs of the storage object to
  -- the key-value pairs of the array:
  set the properties of stack "storage" to tArrayData


-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net  Tue Nov  5 07:00:01 2002
From: gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net (Gary Aitcheson)
Date: Tue Nov  5 07:00:01 2002
Subject: Web Access
Message-ID: <20021105115354.89886.qmail@web80107.mail.yahoo.com>


Gary,

revGoURL "http://www.runrev.com" works just fine from the messagebox on 
my XP machine...

best,

Chipp

Thanks Chipp - I pasted the above to my messagebox but no luck. So the problem is not in RR or XP.  I use SBC Yahoo DSL and Internet Explorer. I guess the answer is in there somewhere. Probably something as simple as a setting. I will poke around and let y'all know what I find - Gary


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From sims at ezpzapps.com  Tue Nov  5 07:29:01 2002
From: sims at ezpzapps.com (sims)
Date: Tue Nov  5 07:29:01 2002
Subject: Open app when a PC starts up
In-Reply-To: <B9EC0CD0.50E1%scott@tactilemedia.com>
References: <B9EC0CD0.50E1%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <v04220800b9ed67186640@[10.0.1.2]>

Goal:  Have a Rev app open automatically when a PC starts up.

Problem: VirtualPC on my Mac seems to add the shortcut but the Rev app
doesn't open at startup on VPC...so I am left wondering if the issue is VPC
or my script.

Anyone feel like testing the following script on a PC?

on mouseUp
   answer file "Which app to add?"
   put it into tApptoAdd
   set the itemDel to "/"
   put last item of tApptoAdd into newApp
   put specialFolderPath(7) into prefsLocation
   create alias prefsLocation & "/"&newApp &"Shortcut.lnk" to file tApptoAdd
end mouseUp


tia


sims


From BradAllen at mac.com  Tue Nov  5 07:30:01 2002
From: BradAllen at mac.com (Brad Allen)
Date: Tue Nov  5 07:30:01 2002
Subject: Cool generic scripts...
In-Reply-To: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAEEADCNAA.chipp@chipp.com>
References: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAEEADCNAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <a05111b05b9ed59aebcb7@[192.168.1.101]>

Thanks for closeStack/killSockets tip, Chipp. Would using such a 
script be adviseable even in stacks which don't manual open sockets, 
but which do access URLs such as FTP sites using the a command like: 
get URL "ftp://whatever.com" , which presumably both open and close a 
socket within that one command?


>
>for instance, I usually put the following in all my stacks:
>
>on closeStack
>
>   if exists(stack "revMenubar") or exists(stack "Home") then
>     beep
>   else
>     answer question "Are you sure you want to Quit?" with "No" or "Yes"
>     if it is "Yes" then
>       killSockets
>       quit
>     end if
>   end if
>
>end closeStack
>
>on killSockets
>   put openSockets() into theSocks
>   repeat for each line sock in theSocks
>     close socket sock
>   end repeat
>end killSockets
>
>this checks to see if I'm in RR (stack "revMenubar") or MC (stack "Home").
>Also, I need to trap it in other stacks or else they'll quit the application
>when they close a window.
>
>Any others out there?
>
>-Chipp


From richmond at mail.maclaunch.com  Tue Nov  5 10:09:01 2002
From: richmond at mail.maclaunch.com (Mathewson)
Date: Tue Nov  5 10:09:01 2002
Subject: Quicktime Buggery in Windows
Message-ID: <web-299136777@mail.maclaunch.com>

So, after 6 months hard slog I have got to a "final Beta" of
my Musical CD_ROm (207MB, 200 odd substacks) and set out to
build a WIN version:

1.  Building on a machine running WIN ME: the quicktime
players for all the embedded MOV files won't play.

2.  Building on a machine running jaguar MAC X for WIN much
the same problem.

3.  Building any version on a Mac under OS 9.2.2 it gets
stuck at "copying MAINFILE.rev"

As you can see I am up queer street without a paddle (nice
mixed metaphor).....


HELP, HELP, HELP

Richmond Mathewson
---------------------------------------------------------------
Great Macintosh Products 
 The MacLaunch Store! http://www.maclaunch.com/cgi-launch/store/agora.cgi
---------------------------------------------------------------


From Timothy_Hart at umit.maine.edu  Tue Nov  5 11:13:01 2002
From: Timothy_Hart at umit.maine.edu (Timothy Hart)
Date: Tue Nov  5 11:13:01 2002
Subject: Writing radio to a file
Message-ID: <fc.004c4d190f949210004c4d190f949210.f9496b8@umit.maine.edu>

Alright.  I have figured out how to group radio buttons and set their behavior to true you can only have one highlighted.  Atleast I did it like this.  I just grouped them and doubled clicked on one and scripted:
"set the radiobehavior of group to true"  That seemed to have worked.

Now my question is how can I script it to write the choice of a user to a file.  I want to give a little quiz to people and have multiple choice questions.  I want my output to be a text file that they can then send to me or even better have rev do
it.  But that might be getting ahead of myself.  Anyone have any ideas?  Thanks.

-Tim









From dsc at swcp.com  Tue Nov  5 11:22:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Tue Nov  5 11:22:01 2002
Subject: Cool generic scripts...
In-Reply-To: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAEEADCNAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <84DC8DC1-F0D9-11D6-86DC-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Monday, November 4, 2002, at 10:11 PM, Chipp Walters wrote:

> for instance, I usually put the following in all my stacks:

Main stacks, I note.

I'm just developing my style and it is not clear to me what to copy to 
my main stack script and what to leave in a library stack.  Conflict in 
local variables is one issue that comes mind.

BTW, is there any platform that does not close sockets for an 
application that quits?

Dar Scott



From chipp at chipp.com  Tue Nov  5 11:37:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Tue Nov  5 11:37:01 2002
Subject: Cool generic scripts...
In-Reply-To: <a05111b05b9ed59aebcb7@[192.168.1.101]>
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOKEEACJAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Brad,

Some of the commands in libURL are asychronous. So it is possible to issue a
command and then continue woriking in RR. In these cases, killsockets would
help if one was to quit before a command was finishing executing. Course,
I'm not sure RR/MC doesn't automatically kill sockets when quitting (??)

I have built some of my own socket protocols for file transfer and seem to
remember having some problem with a 'residual' effect after quitting a
program with sockets open...that's why I use the killsockets on close stack
script. It can't hurt.

-Chipp

>
> Thanks for closeStack/killSockets tip, Chipp. Would using such a
> script be adviseable even in stacks which don't manual open sockets,
> but which do access URLs such as FTP sites using the a command like:
> get URL "ftp://whatever.com" , which presumably both open and close a
> socket within that one command?



From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Tue Nov  5 13:16:01 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Tue Nov  5 13:16:01 2002
Subject: Writing radio to a file
In-Reply-To: <fc.004c4d190f949210004c4d190f949210.f9496b8@umit.maine.edu>
Message-ID: <DD47A0C2-F0E9-11D6-BC7C-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Hi Timothy,

> Alright.  I have figured out how to group radio buttons and set their 
> behavior to true you can only have one highlighted.  Atleast I did it 
> like this.  I just grouped them and doubled clicked on one and 
> scripted:
> "set the radiobehavior of group to true"  That seemed to have worked.

I think even this is not necessary.

Just create some radio-buttons, group them and that's all.

They should act as desired immediately.
I jsut tried it here at home and it worked...

> Now my question is how can I script it to write the choice of a user 
> to a file.
> I want to give a little quiz to people and have multiple choice 
> questions.
> I want my output to be a text file that they can then send to me or 
> even better have rev do
> it.  But that might be getting ahead of myself.  Anyone have any 
> ideas?  Thanks.

You can query "the hilitedbuttonname of grp xxx".

This will give you the name of the button that is hilited in that group.

So you can script something like:

on mouseup ## or whatever
   put the hilitedbuttonname of grp "the difficult quiz" into 
url"file:quizresults.txt"
end mouseup

Don't forget to give the radio-buttons appropriate names ;-)

> -Tim

Hope this helps.

Regards


Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de



From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk  Tue Nov  5 14:14:01 2002
From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg)
Date: Tue Nov  5 14:14:01 2002
Subject: Cool generic scripts...
In-Reply-To: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOKEEACJAA.chipp@chipp.com>
References: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOKEEACJAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <p05200e03b9edbaf151f6@[192.168.123.3]>

At 10:30 am -0600 5/11/02, Chipp Walters wrote:
>Brad,
>
>Some of the commands in libURL are asychronous. So it is possible to issue a
>command and then continue woriking in RR. In these cases, killsockets would
>help if one was to quit before a command was finishing executing. Course,
>I'm not sure RR/MC doesn't automatically kill sockets when quitting (??)
>
>I have built some of my own socket protocols for file transfer and seem to
>remember having some problem with a 'residual' effect after quitting a
>program with sockets open...that's why I use the killsockets on close stack
>script. It can't hurt.

It can. :)

closeStack isn't necessarily the same as quitting, for example when 
you have multiple windows. Closing all open sockets while libUrl is 
doing something is not a good idea. It shouldn't harm if you really 
are quitting, but if say your closeStack handler ran when a status 
window closed during a download, you could be in trouble. On shutdown 
would be a better place to do this.

Cheers
Dave


From Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com  Tue Nov  5 14:38:01 2002
From: Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com (Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com)
Date: Tue Nov  5 14:38:01 2002
Subject: Open app when a PC starts up
Message-ID: <OFEC566850.EF7AC7DA-ON85256C68.006AE180@sealedair.com>

> Goal:  Have a Rev app open automatically when a PC starts up.
>
> Problem: VirtualPC on my Mac seems to add the shortcut but the Rev app
> doesn't open at startup on VPC...so I am left wondering if the issue is
VPC
> or my script.
>
> Anyone feel like testing the following script on a PC?
>
> on mouseUp
>   answer file "Which app to add?"
>   put it into tApptoAdd
>   set the itemDel to "/"
>   put last item of tApptoAdd into newApp
>   put specialFolderPath(7) into prefsLocation
>   create alias prefsLocation & "/"&newApp &"Shortcut.lnk" to file
   tApptoAdd
> end mouseUp
>
>
> tia
>
>
> sims

It could be that the "/" you are using as a delimiter of folders is the
problem. The "/" is a unix spec which was adopted by Rev for consistency,
but when shortcuts are made that will be used in the actual Windows OS, the
delimiter needs to be replaced by a backslash "\".

Roger Eller
roger.e.eller at sealedair.com





From Timothy_Hart at umit.maine.edu  Tue Nov  5 16:59:01 2002
From: Timothy_Hart at umit.maine.edu (Timothy Hart)
Date: Tue Nov  5 16:59:01 2002
Subject: Sending a file
Message-ID: <fc.004c4d190f960cb0004c4d190f960cb0.f960fa2@umit.maine.edu>

Sorry two questions in one day.  I was wondering what is the best method to send a text file to certain place (like a server).  I have a stack that write to a text file. and I want to user to be able to sumbit it and the stack will send it to a
folder on my server.  Any help is greatly appreciated.

Oh and thanks a lot Klaus for earlier.

-Tim









From chipp at chipp.com  Tue Nov  5 18:08:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Tue Nov  5 18:08:01 2002
Subject: Cool generic scripts...
In-Reply-To: <p05200e03b9edbaf151f6@[192.168.123.3]>
Message-ID: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCMEEHDGAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Yep,
Dave you are right.
I generally trap all close stack messages from other stacks before they get
to the main stack.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Dave Cragg
> Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2002 12:24 PM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: RE: Cool generic scripts...
>
>
> At 10:30 am -0600 5/11/02, Chipp Walters wrote:
> >Brad,
> >
> >Some of the commands in libURL are asychronous. So it is
> possible to issue a
> >command and then continue woriking in RR. In these cases,
> killsockets would
> >help if one was to quit before a command was finishing executing. Course,
> >I'm not sure RR/MC doesn't automatically kill sockets when quitting (??)
> >
> >I have built some of my own socket protocols for file transfer
> and seem to
> >remember having some problem with a 'residual' effect after quitting a
> >program with sockets open...that's why I use the killsockets on
> close stack
> >script. It can't hurt.
>
> It can. :)
>
> closeStack isn't necessarily the same as quitting, for example when
> you have multiple windows. Closing all open sockets while libUrl is
> doing something is not a good idea. It shouldn't harm if you really
> are quitting, but if say your closeStack handler ran when a status
> window closed during a download, you could be in trouble. On shutdown
> would be a better place to do this.
>
> Cheers
> Dave
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From dwilk at globalnet.co.uk  Tue Nov  5 18:32:01 2002
From: dwilk at globalnet.co.uk (David Wilkinson)
Date: Tue Nov  5 18:32:01 2002
Subject: Web Access -launching external browser
In-Reply-To: <200211050646.BAA15692@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211050646.BAA15692@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <E189D4H-00033l-00@iffley.bradcomp.co.uk>

FWIW RevGoURL does not seem to work at all on my Unix box

If you single step through the revLib, the function returns 255, which I take to mean success, and nothing else. My workaround is to use:
	put "http://" & the selectedtext into tUrlName 
	put shell ("netscape" && tUrlName) 

maybe the same approach will work for you 

This seems to be true of a fair bit of RR on Unix - ie either things do not work as expected OR they work and then they stop working. In this instance the library uses *get shell .............* not put; the message box will launch the browser if you enter that command - but the same line in a script will terminate silently with no launch.

and another example
 
	answer the selectedtext
  	put the selectedtext into tAppName
  	answer tAppName

the first dialog box shows the selected text and the second is blank!  ??? 

Still, it is early days.



From bvlahos at mac.com  Tue Nov  5 21:09:00 2002
From: bvlahos at mac.com (Bill Vlahos)
Date: Tue Nov  5 21:09:00 2002
Subject: Using Fortran or C code in Rev
Message-ID: <DB1E6484-F12B-11D6-B54B-0003936A2C42@mac.com>

A co-worker asked me how to use existing fortran or C code within a 
Revolution application (or called by a Revolution application)?

This would be primarily for Mac OS 9 and X and maybe some Windows.

Bill Vlahos



From g.castre at free.fr  Wed Nov  6 02:14:01 2002
From: g.castre at free.fr (Guillaume CASTRE)
Date: Wed Nov  6 02:14:01 2002
Subject: (no subject)
Message-ID: <00a701c28563$1620cca0$05000a0a@maman>



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Wed Nov  6 03:17:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Wed Nov  6 03:17:01 2002
Subject: Using Fortran or C code in Rev
In-Reply-To: <DB1E6484-F12B-11D6-B54B-0003936A2C42@mac.com>
Message-ID: <20021106081023.51624.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Bill Vlahos <bvlahos at mac.com> wrote:
> A co-worker asked me how to use existing fortran or
> C code within a 
> Revolution application (or called by a Revolution
> application)?
> 
> This would be primarily for Mac OS 9 and X and maybe
> some Windows.
> 
> Bill Vlahos
> 

Hi Bill,

There's the External SDK for exactly this sort of
purposes.
I guess he's running CodeWarrior? Then writing XCMD's
and XFCN's should be a breeze.
For Windows he could build a DLL to accomplish the
same tasks.

Too bad there's no architecture for external objects ;
though it would cause problems to build and compile
these on all the platforms supported by MC/RR.
Oh well, maybe someday :-)

Best regards,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now
http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/


From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Wed Nov  6 05:04:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Wed Nov  6 05:04:01 2002
Subject: standalone desktop info
In-Reply-To: <20021102003119.47547.qmail@web40509.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20021105230047.26557.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com>

is there a way to tell whether a file is a
standalone or not from the desktop? thanks.

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now
http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Wed Nov  6 07:50:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Wed Nov  6 07:50:01 2002
Subject: standalone desktop info
In-Reply-To: <20021105230047.26557.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20021106124358.13285.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>

--- erik hansen <erikhans08 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> is there a way to tell whether a file is a
> standalone or not from the desktop? thanks.
> 

Hi Erik,

If the icon has a 'dog ear', it's a file.
If the icon is in the shape of a diamond, it's an
application.

However, double-clicking a revolution stack will
automatically disable the Revolution UI, unlike when
you open it from within Revolution.

Hope this cleared things up,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now
http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/


From mdswindell at charter.net  Wed Nov  6 09:19:02 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Wed Nov  6 09:19:02 2002
Subject: Sliders/progress bars templates?
In-Reply-To: <200211050643.BAA15446@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <B9EE635E.3370%mdswindell@charter.net>

Is there a Revolution (or SC?) library anywhere which contains a collection
nice-looking pre-fabbed sliders and progress bars?  I saw a couple that did
interesting things on thee user projects section of the web site, but I'm
wondering if there might be a set of templates out there?

Thanks,
Mark



From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov  6 10:31:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov  6 10:31:01 2002
Subject: standalone desktop info
In-Reply-To: <20021105230047.26557.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021105230047.26557.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <a05100300b9eee0da6e8e@[216.229.107.102]>

>is there a way to tell whether a file is a
>standalone or not from the desktop? thanks.

Hi Erik,

If you want to determine whether a Rev file is a stack or a 
standalone from within a handler, check for the existence of a group 
"revLibraries".  It seems to be placed in all standalones by the 
Distribution Builder.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov  6 10:31:20 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov  6 10:31:20 2002
Subject: Sliders/progress bars templates?
In-Reply-To: <B9EE635E.3370%mdswindell@charter.net>
References: <B9EE635E.3370%mdswindell@charter.net>
Message-ID: <a05100301b9eee291d5bf@[216.229.107.102]>

>Is there a Revolution (or SC?) library anywhere which contains a collection
>nice-looking pre-fabbed sliders and progress bars?

Hello Mark,

I doubt SC progress bars would work with RunRev; but I have not tried 
it.  In RunRev a progress bar is a special instance of the horizontal 
scrollbar.  To create a progress bar select "New Control" & "Progress 
Bar" from the development UI.

As for scripting a progress bar, here's a portion of a handler I 
posted in August.  I've prefixed each statement pertinent to the 
progress bar with "}"

   if backingUp then
     put "binfile:"&(the text of button "Destination Title") into backupFileName
     set the label of stack "Backup Progress" to 
sdbMessage(sdbBackupInProgressLabel)
     put (field "File Index" of card 2 of stack 
sdbStackName)&recordDelimiter into backupData
}    put the number of cards of stack sdbStackName into lastRecord
}    put lastRecord-3 into recordCount
}    set the thumbPosition of scrollBar "Progress Scrollbar" to 0
}    set the endvalue of scrollBar "Progress Scrollbar" to recordCount
}    show scrollBar "Progress Scrollbar"
}    put 0 into recordsProcessed
}    put round(recordCount/(the width of scrollBar "Progress 
Scrollbar")) into progressInterval
}    put max(1,progressInterval) into progressInterval
     repeat with x=4 to lastRecord
       set cursor to busy
       put field "Record Type" of card x of stack sdbFileName into theType
       put field "Record Key" of card x of stack sdbFileName into theKey
       put field "Record" of card x of stack sdbFileName into theRecord
       put theType&&theKey&return&theRecord&recordDelimiter after backupData
}      add 1 to recordsProcessed
}      if (recordsProcessed mod progressInterval)=0 then set the 
thumbPosition of scrollBar "Progress Scrollbar" to recordsProcessed
     end repeat
}    set the thumbPosition of scrollBar "Progress Scrollbar" to 
recordCount -- yes, recordCount
   else

-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From alex at mindlube.com  Wed Nov  6 11:20:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Wed Nov  6 11:20:01 2002
Subject: Using Fortran or C code in Rev
In-Reply-To: <20021106081023.51624.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <A73C331B-F1A2-11D6-BA63-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Wednesday, November 6, 2002, at 01:10  AM, Jan Schenkel wrote:
>
> There's the External SDK for exactly this sort of
> purposes.
> I guess he's running CodeWarrior? Then writing XCMD's
> and XFCN's should be a breeze.
> For Windows he could build a DLL to accomplish the
> same tasks.
>
> Too bad there's no architecture for external objects ;
> though it would cause problems to build and compile
> these on all the platforms supported by MC/RR.
> Oh well, maybe someday :-)

What is RevRev's position on supporting Mach-O/dyld libraries on OS X? 
I know C but am never ever going to buy CodeWarrior.

Apple's Project Builder is a great IDE and it's based on GCC, which any 
Unix geek likely knows and loves. OK, I just read a tantalizing post in 
the archives by Ken Ray about the latest version of Metacard being 
Mach-O based?

Alex Rice <alex at mindlube.com>
Mindlube Software
http://mindlube.com/



From alex at mindlube.com  Wed Nov  6 11:32:02 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Wed Nov  6 11:32:02 2002
Subject: OS X native RR apps listed as "Classic"
In-Reply-To: <63C8E298-CBCC-11D6-83A0-00039348A1E6@snet.net>
Message-ID: <572099A4-F1A4-11D6-BA63-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Thursday, September 19, 2002, at 07:42  AM, Kurt Kaufman wrote:

> Since I've been getting a lot of inquiries as to why my OS X native RR 
> apps are designated as "Classic" in their "Get Info"  Finder windows, 
> I'd like to know whether this will be "fixed" in the next version of 
> RR, or whether someone could write an application (in RR?) that might 
> adjust the "plist" or whatever is needed to correct this inaccuracy.  
> Does the problem have to do with the file format of the carbon binary 
> (CFM/PEF vs. Dyld/Mach-O)?
> Thanks, Kurt

I noticed this as well and since I'm familiar with OS X app bundles, I 
created one and plunked my Revolution binary into the bundle. I created 
the bundle with Project Builder, but you could do it by hand instead. 
Using a bundle gives one complete control over how the app appears to 
the user including the icon and get-info data. If you want, I can mail 
you the app bundle and Project Builder .pbproj file. This may become a 
non-issue if Rev gets this completely fixed for v2.0.

It's just a Folder with this structure. The .app suffix is important.

# ls -R FacilityCalculator.app

FacilityCalculator.app/Contents:
Info.plist                PkgInfo                   pbdevelopment.plist
MacOS/                    Resources/

FacilityCalculator.app/Contents/MacOS:
FacilityCalculator  data/

FacilityCalculator.app/Contents/MacOS/data:
UserData.rev

FacilityCalculator.app/Contents/Resources:
English.lproj/  nps.icns

FacilityCalculator.app/Contents/Resources/English.lproj:
InfoPlist.strings

--
FacilityCalculator.app/Contents/MacOS/FacilityCalculator is my Rev 
binary.
FacilityCalculator.app/Contents/MacOS/data/UserData.rev is a supporting 
Rev stack.
The .plist and PkgInfo files are short XML property lists.

nps.icns is an icons file created with IconComposer.app, which comes 
with the OS X developer tools. (you just run it and drag-n-drop four 
TIFFs or PNGs of the right size onto the app's image wells, then save)

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Wed Nov  6 13:16:00 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Wed Nov  6 13:16:00 2002
Subject: Sending a file
In-Reply-To: <fc.004c4d190f960cb0004c4d190f960cb0.f960fa2@umit.maine.edu>
Message-ID: <017454F2-F1B3-11D6-8640-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Hi Timothy,

> Sorry two questions in one day.

we will survive this ;-)

> I was wondering what is the best
> method to send a text file to certain place
> (like a server).  I have a stack that write to
> a text file. and I want to user to be able to
> sumbit it and the stack will send it to a
> folder on my server.
> Any help is greatly appreciated.

This is easier than you can imagine ;-)
...and it is already build-in.

I suppose you want to upload the file to your ftp-server.

It is even not necessary to save the data to a text-file.

Here are 2 solutions for your problem:

The first one will transfer a textfile to your server.
Teh second one will tranfer the content of a field
(or a global var or a custom property or...) to the server.

1.
on mouseup
    put url("file:your_text_file_here.txt") into URL 
"ftp://username:password at ftp.yourservername.com/foldername/file.txt"
end if

2.
on mouseup
    put fld "data to transfer" into URL 
"ftp://username:password at ftp.yourservername.com/foldername/file.txt"
end if

Of course you have to replace username, password etc... with
your names ;-)

> Oh and thanks a lot Klaus for earlier.

You're welcome...

> -Tim


Hope this helps.


Regards from germany

Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de



From herz at ucsd.edu  Wed Nov  6 13:35:01 2002
From: herz at ucsd.edu (Richard K. Herz)
Date: Wed Nov  6 13:35:01 2002
Subject: Using Fortran or C code in Rev
References: <200211061633.LAA07109@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <001801c285c2$43c419f0$58bfef84@rkhpc1>

Bill Vlahos <bvlahos at mac.com> wrote:

> A co-worker asked me how to use existing fortran or C code within a
> Revolution application (or called by a Revolution application)?

There are two options I'm aware of: (1) communicate between Rev and compiled
program via disk files (acceptable if the compiled program takes at least a
second or two to run), (2) build an external (if running on locked volumes
or if compiled program executes very fast).

Option (1) I'm doing this with MC and a Fortran program on Windows.  The MC
GUI writes inputs to a disk file, tells the system shell to run the Fortran
exe, then reads in the output files and displays results.  To get the
Windows OS shell command, "get the shellCommand" in Rev.

For "command.com" on, e.g., Win 98, use start command's /m option to
minimize the shell console window, plus set hideConsoleWindows to true in
Rev. For list of start options, enter "start" in command.com console window.

For "cmd.exe" on, e.g., Win XP, use start command's /min or /b option to
hide the shell console window, plus set hideConsoleWindows to true in Rev.
for list of start options, enter "help start" in cmd.exe console window.
(command.com also available but different behavior than on Win 98)

Combine two or more shell commands in one Rev get shell() by using the "&"
character, as you have to do with a path with spaces in the name.  For
example, for the shellCommand "cmd.exe", in order to execute "C:\Path with
spaces in name\myprog.exe", since"cd" is immune to spaces in path but
"start" isn't, use

get shell("cd C:\Path with spaces in name & start /min /high /wait
myprog.exe")

Command.com on Win 98 returns executable output to the console (e.g., print
* from Fortran and STOP) to the Rev "it" variable on completion so that you
can check for a good run.  Cmd.exe on Win XP doesn't seem to return anything
to Rev, so I delete old output files before a run and then check for new
good output files after the run.

AppleScript should do the job on Macs.

Option (2):  I've only found the "glue" files needed to build XCMDs and
XFCNs written in C, C++ and Pascal.  To make a Fortran program into an XCMD,
the thing to do would be to write a C program that calls the Fortran
executable and then build that package into an XCMD using the C glue files.
I you translate the glue files into Fortran, please let us know!

Rich Herz
herz at ucsd.edu






From kray at sonsothunder.com  Wed Nov  6 14:18:00 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Wed Nov  6 14:18:00 2002
Subject: Using Fortran or C code in Rev
References: <A73C331B-F1A2-11D6-BA63-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <015c01c285c7$ac42a4b0$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> Apple's Project Builder is a great IDE and it's based on GCC, which any
> Unix geek likely knows and loves. OK, I just read a tantalizing post in
> the archives by Ken Ray about the latest version of Metacard being
> Mach-O based

That's right, Alex. And Rev 2.0 will also be (since it inherits the MC
engine specs).

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From alex at mindlube.com  Wed Nov  6 16:01:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Wed Nov  6 16:01:01 2002
Subject: Using Fortran or C code in Rev
In-Reply-To: <015c01c285c7$ac42a4b0$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <F4635814-F1C9-11D6-BA63-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Wednesday, November 6, 2002, at 12:06  PM, Ken Ray wrote:

>> Apple's Project Builder is a great IDE and it's based on GCC, which 
>> any
>> Unix geek likely knows and loves. OK, I just read a tantalizing post 
>> in
>> the archives by Ken Ray about the latest version of Metacard being
>> Mach-O based
>
> That's right, Alex. And Rev 2.0 will also be (since it inherits the MC
> engine specs).

Do you think that it will get us closer to being able to use dyld 
library bundles and OS X frameworks from Rev apps, or will it still be 
only XCMDs and such.

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Wed Nov  6 18:07:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Wed Nov  6 18:07:01 2002
Subject: Writing radio to a file
In-Reply-To: <a05111af7b9ed9dd0797b@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <81653D34-F1DB-11D6-A259-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

I have a generic handler that writes a preferences file, using all the 
cards & controls on a stack, including radio buttons. The advantage of 
this is that when you change your preference objects, you don't need to 
change this handler. Then you need a corresponding handler to read 
these settings and change the display accordingly.

  put "" into prefs
   repeat with c = 1 to the number of cards in this stack
     put cr & "Card: " & the short name of card c & cr after prefs
     repeat with f = 1 to the number of fields in card c
       -- save all editable fields
       if the lockText of fld f of cd c = false then
         put the short name of fld f of cd c & "?" & fld f of cd c & "?" 
& cr after prefs
       end if
     end repeat
       -- save settings for radio buttons & check boxes
     repeat with b = 1 to the number of buttons in card c
       if the style of btn b of cd c is in "radiobutton,checkbox" then
         put the short name of btn b of cd c & "?" & the hilite of btn b 
of cd c & "?" & cr after prefs
       end if
     end repeat
     put "???" & cr after prefs
   end repeat

While this is a generic preferences handler, if you are only using 
radio buttons, it is probably easier just to find the 
"hilitedButtonName" of the group.

Cheers,
Sarah


On Wednesday, November 6, 2002, at 02:09  am, Timothy Hart wrote:

> Alright.  I have figured out how to group radio buttons and set their 
> behavior to true you can only have one highlighted.  Atleast I did it 
> like this.  I just grouped them and doubled clicked on one and 
> scripted:
> "set the radiobehavior of group to true"  That seemed to have worked.
>
> Now my question is how can I script it to write the choice of a user 
> to a file.  I want to give a little quiz to people and have multiple 
> choice questions.  I want my output to be a text file that they can 
> then send to me or even better have rev do
> it.  But that might be getting ahead of myself.  Anyone have any 
> ideas?  Thanks.
>
> -Tim




From capellan2000 at yahoo.com  Wed Nov  6 21:04:01 2002
From: capellan2000 at yahoo.com (Alejandro Tejada)
Date: Wed Nov  6 21:04:01 2002
Subject: Compressed Digest
In-Reply-To: <200211061633.LAA07162@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <20021107015721.57617.qmail@web40514.mail.yahoo.com>

Hi everyone on the list,

I was looking for the compressed digest at:
http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/revolution/

The files are gone!

Where can I get them?

Can you post a link for download?

Thanks in advance.

Alejandro



__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2


From kkaufman at snet.net  Wed Nov  6 21:34:03 2002
From: kkaufman at snet.net (Kurt Kaufman)
Date: Wed Nov  6 21:34:03 2002
Subject: OS X native RR apps listed as "Classic"
Message-ID: <657E0F4F-F1F8-11D6-A080-0003936D1F12@snet.net>

Thanks for your reply and explanation, Alex.  Since I understand from 
your post the structure of the .app bundle, but not how all of the 
files are created, nor which flags produce what in the Get Info box, 
etc., I think I'll wait and hope that this is corrected in RR 2.

-Kurt



From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Wed Nov  6 21:43:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Wed Nov  6 21:43:01 2002
Subject: UPC or Barcode Scanners
In-Reply-To: <a05111a2fb9eb4bb93bde@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <B45147B0-F1F9-11D6-A25B-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

Yes, I have used a Rev app to get barcode data. I'm not sure if my 
reader is typical but it works as a keyboard wedge so generates data 
just like a keyboard. The trick is to find the identifier at the end of 
the scan.

Here are the 2 handlers that work for me:

local readCodes

on keyDown theKey
if readCodes = true then
     put theKey after fld "Barcode"
   else
     pass keyDown
   end if
end keyDown

on rawKeyDown theKey
   if theKey = 65293 and readCodes = true then
     send mouseUp to btn "Process Barcode"
   else
     pass rawKeyDown
   end if
end rawKeyDown

readCodes is just a flag that is set depending on whether I want to 
read from the scanner or not.
The keyDown gets the data letter by letter, but the rawKeyDown gets the 
end of line marker, in my case 65293. You'll need to test what your 
scanner is producing by getting the rawKeyDown to display whatever if 
receives, then you can use that to get your program to handle the 
complete barcode.

Cheers,
Sarah


On Monday, November 4, 2002, at 07:55  am, Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com 
wrote:

>
> Has anyone used Revolution to capture input from barcode 
> readers/scanners
> connected via serial or USB? I have tried without success. The unit 
> beeps,
> telling me the UPC is valid, but I get no text in my field. I have 
> tried
> the examples on opening and reading from serial ports in the Rev help. 
> I
> also tried the TEST SERIAL Rev app that was provided here on the list
> several months ago. Is there a preferred type or brand of UPC scanner 
> that
> works best with Rev? Is there some sample scripts available that does 
> this
> sort of thing that I could use as a guide/tutorial?
>
> Kind Regards,
> Roger Eller
> roger.e.eller at sealedair.com




From chipp at chipp.com  Thu Nov  7 01:42:00 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Thu Nov  7 01:42:00 2002
Subject: Alpha version of ButtonGadget now available for Mac
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOIEFPCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>

The PC version is released.

There's an alpha version of ButtonGadget available at:
http://www.buttongadget.com/buttongadget/RunRevUsers.htm

bottom of the page.

Before I go on, I have to mention something about this conversion process.
ButtonGadget is a very complicated PC program. It has many image effect
libraries and lots of file management tools, not to mention a lot of PC
specific registration and regedit code. Anyway, I loaded it up tonight for
the very first time on a Mac, expecting to spend a couple of days to just
get it working..and..EVERYTHING worked pretty much as it should! Oh, set the
backcolor of btn x doesn't seem to work on a Mac but the rest sure does!
Took me all of 45 minutes to compile this version. It doesn't have the
creator code stuff or even a decent menu (not needed on PC), but the core
app is the same. I do love this programming language. Back to ButtonGadget.

The .sit file contains:

Readme.txt PLEASE READ THIS!
ButtonGadget.rev for use with RunRev to build buttons and export them
ButtonGadget executable
buttonplugins folder - where you should download new buttonsets to.
You can get buttonsets at:
http://www.buttongadget.com/buttonsets/default.htm

Couple of things to note about this version:

1)All compositing and effects are done inside Revolution. Originally
programmed on a PC 800Mhz, much faster than my G3 powerbook. The only real
slow one is the blur filter. So, if you load a buttonset which uses the
blur, it may take as long as 15 seconds on a G3 to render each button. If
you don't want to wait, hold the option key down and it will interrupt the
blur for that button state. Then turn off blur for that button state and the
buttonstate will redraw correctly. You'll want to save the buttonset without
blur.

2)It's still Alpha. Let me know problems you have.

You'll want to read the online manual at:
http://www.buttongadget.com/manual/gettingstarted.htm

-Chipp



From Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com  Thu Nov  7 09:33:01 2002
From: Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com (Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com)
Date: Thu Nov  7 09:33:01 2002
Subject: UPC or Barcode Scanners
Message-ID: <OFE3F3C78A.B79EC06E-ON85256C6A.004C4832@sealedair.com>

> Yes, I have used a Rev app to get barcode data. I'm not sure if my
> reader is typical but it works as a keyboard wedge so generates data
> just like a keyboard. The trick is to find the identifier at the end of
> the scan.
>
> Here are the 2 handlers that work for me:
>
> local readCodes
>
> on keyDown theKey
> if readCodes = true then
> put theKey after fld "Barcode"
> else
> pass keyDown
> end if
> end keyDown
>
> on rawKeyDown theKey
> if theKey = 65293 and readCodes = true then
> send mouseUp to btn "Process Barcode"
> else
> pass rawKeyDown
> end if
> end rawKeyDown
>
> readCodes is just a flag that is set depending on whether I want to
> read from the scanner or not.
> The keyDown gets the data letter by letter, but the rawKeyDown gets the
> end of line marker, in my case 65293. You'll need to test what your
> scanner is producing by getting the rawKeyDown to display whatever if
> receives, then you can use that to get your program to handle the
> complete barcode.
>
> Cheers,
> Sarah
>
>
> On Monday, November 4, 2002, at 07:55  am, Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com
> wrote:
>>
>> Has anyone used Revolution to capture input from barcode
>> readers/scanners...
>> ...  ...  ...
>> Is there some sample scripts available that does this
>> sort of thing that I could use as a guide/tutorial?
>>
>> Kind Regards,
>> Roger Eller
>> roger.e.eller at sealedair.com

Sarah,

Thanks for the code!  Would you consider submitting a simple stack to the
Rev site (user contributions) containing your working script and maybe a
single text field. That would be a wonderful addition, and would be very
useful to many of us I'm sure. Thanks again.

Roger Eller
roger.e.eller at sealedair.com





From mgarrido at techno-design.com  Thu Nov  7 11:19:01 2002
From: mgarrido at techno-design.com (Manolo Garrido)
Date: Thu Nov  7 11:19:01 2002
Subject: Sockets
Message-ID: <B9F04CCC.1068%mgarrido@techno-design.com>

Does anyone knows if it's possible to develop a synchronous TCP/IP
communication with Revolution that works when client and server applications
runs on a single machine over a Mac OS 9?

Thanks 
Manuel



From steve at messimercomputing.com  Thu Nov  7 12:09:03 2002
From: steve at messimercomputing.com (Steve Messimer)
Date: Thu Nov  7 12:09:03 2002
Subject: sending email
Message-ID: <B9F0069D.D68%steve@messimercomputing.com>

Hi folks,

I am working on a button that will automatically send an email msg when
clicked. Actually it is a bit more involved. I know that this will only work
on the MacOS.  Here's the script:

If the platform is "MacOS" then
    ask "Please type the email address of your instructor in the space
provided."
    If it is empty then
      exit to top
    else
      put "mailto:"&it&"" into mailaddress -- this works OK
      -- How do I load the Subject line of the email?
      -- put "Assignment" into subject
      -- How do I load the body of the email?
      -- put field "Assignment" into body
      revGoURL mailaddress
    end if
  else
    Answer information "Sorry this feature only works with the the Macintosh
operating system."
  end if
end mouseUp

Thanks for your help! :-)

Steve

Stephen R. Messimer
Messimer Computing, Inc
208 1st Ave South
Escanaba, MI 49829
www.messimercomputing.com




From shaosean at unitz.ca  Thu Nov  7 14:16:05 2002
From: shaosean at unitz.ca (Shao Sean)
Date: Thu Nov  7 14:16:05 2002
Subject: sending email
Message-ID: <3dcaba7c.58ee.1804289383@unitz.ca>

if you need something cross-platform, take a look at my SMTP
library <http://www.shaosean.tk/>.. it allows you to send
emails directly from within runrev/metacard without the need
for an external email client.. it supports file attachments
and authenticated smtp..

feel free to contact me off-list if you have any questions
about it..

----------------------------------------------------
Unitz Online Inc. - Sign-up today! - www.unitz.ca


From jeanne at runrev.com  Thu Nov  7 15:35:01 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Thu Nov  7 15:35:01 2002
Subject: sending email
In-Reply-To: <B9F0069D.D68%steve@messimercomputing.com>
Message-ID: <v03130315b9f079c8f699@[10.0.1.18]>

At 9:01 AM -0800 11/7/02, Steve Messimer wrote:
>      put "mailto:"&it&"" into mailaddress -- this works OK
>      -- How do I load the Subject line of the email?
>      -- put "Assignment" into subject
>      -- How do I load the body of the email?
>      -- put field "Assignment" into body

Sooooon all your problems will be solved. ;-) (There's a new command in 2.0
that handles all these parameters for mail. Cross-platform, too.)

Meanwhile, you can use the mailto: URL syntax to add a subject and body.
Follow the email address with a question mark, then append "subject=" and
your subject, "&", and "body=" and your body text. For example:

mailto:jaed at jaedworks.com?subject=The%20Readme%20File&body=Some%20text

You'll need to URLencode the subject and body.

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From jeanne at runrev.com  Thu Nov  7 15:36:16 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Thu Nov  7 15:36:16 2002
Subject: Web Access -launching external browser
In-Reply-To: <E189D4H-00033l-00@iffley.bradcomp.co.uk>
References: <200211050646.BAA15692@www.runrev.com>
 <200211050646.BAA15692@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <v03130319b9f07c408b4a@[10.0.1.18]>

At 3:23 PM -0800 11/5/02, David Wilkinson wrote:
>	answer the selectedtext
>  	put the selectedtext into tAppName
>  	answer tAppName
>
>the first dialog box shows the selected text and the second is blank!  ???

This is happening because the dialog box takes the focus, so the text is
deselected. Instead, you need to save the text in a variable:

  put the selectedText into myText
  answer myText
  put myText into tAppName
  answer tAppName

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From RGould8 at aol.com  Thu Nov  7 15:49:01 2002
From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com)
Date: Thu Nov  7 15:49:01 2002
Subject: Will load URL work on CD-ROM?
Message-ID: <137.17127423.2afc2a13@aol.com>

I was having problems with my application hanging when using the put URL into 
x command, and after further reading, it appears that the "load URL" call 
will fix the problem (since it's non-blocking).   My question is this, since 
my app is to be run off of a CD-ROM, will it be able to save the cache?   
Will Revolution automatically know that my app is running off of CD and save 
the cached http: data to the user's hard-drive?   I'm developing this to run 
on Mac OS 8,9 and X.

- Rob
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From alex at mindlube.com  Thu Nov  7 16:25:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Thu Nov  7 16:25:01 2002
Subject: status of ODBC on OS X; is this a waste of time?
Message-ID: <6FDBF51F-F296-11D6-B44E-000393529642@mindlube.com>

1) Mac OS 10.2 ships with the iODBC Driver Manager pre-installed, and 
PostgreSQL has a configure option --with-iodbc to build ODBC driver for 
iODBC. Rev has ODBC connectivity. Methinks this might work! Am I 
wasting my time or should I give it a try?

2) What is the DB support looking like in Rev 2.0? Is the PostgreSQL 
driver going to be Pro-version only?

2a) The Rev docs should probably be updated in 2.0 to reflect the 
current state of affairs with ODBC on Mac.

TIA


Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From speitel at hawaii.edu  Thu Nov  7 16:55:01 2002
From: speitel at hawaii.edu (Thomas Speitel)
Date: Thu Nov  7 16:55:01 2002
Subject: Video-digitizing xcmd or xfnc for OS 10
Message-ID: <9AE9971E-F299-11D6-8068-0003935B47FC@hawaii.edu>

Aloha,
Does anyone know of a video-digitizing external for OS 10.
Thanks,
Tom


Tom Speitel
Curriculum Research & Development Group
College of Education
University of Hawaii
1776 University Avenue
Honolulu, HI 96822

www.hawaii.edu/crdg



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Thu Nov  7 21:55:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Thu Nov  7 21:55:01 2002
Subject: Panel Resizers and Geometry Manager
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHEEANCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Hi All

After a discussion on the improve rev list convinced me that many users have
not yet seen to power of the Geometry Manager I decided to provide a nobject
library with a vertical and horizontal panel resizer. Instructions for use
can be seen in the description field in the Object Library.

Download from www.sweattechnologies.com/rev

Cheers

Monte Goulding
B.App.Sc. (Hons.)

Executive Director
Sweat Technologies

email: monte at sweattechnologies.com
website: www.sweattechnologies.com
mobile (International): +61 421 138 274
       (Australia): 0421 138 274



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Thu Nov  7 22:24:00 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Thu Nov  7 22:24:00 2002
Subject: Panel Resizers and Geometry Manager
In-Reply-To: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHEEANCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHKEANCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

That's an object not a nobject ;-P

> provide a nobject



From chipp at chipp.com  Thu Nov  7 22:50:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Thu Nov  7 22:50:01 2002
Subject: Panel Resizers and Geometry Manager
In-Reply-To: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHKEANCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOIEHCCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Monte,

I dl'ed your library, installed it where you said to, and can't figure out
how to use/access it. Can't find the description field in the stack. I'm on
XP -- please enlighten me! I'm probably just missing something simple.

-Chipp



From katir at hindu.org  Thu Nov  7 23:49:04 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Thu Nov  7 23:49:04 2002
Subject: Read and Analyze Giant Files
Message-ID: <84566354-F2D4-11D6-A9C6-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

We are trying to use Rev (or MC) to analyze a web site access log that 
is 3 million lines long, a 300 meg (or more) file.

If I try a shell script (interpreted) or pascal program (compiled) each 
runs in about 2 minutes on this file but an xTalk script takes a very 
long time, maybe it hangs forever?? shell and pascal can read the file 
one line at a time and process the line but not sure how to do it in mc.

Here's the code

shell, 2 lines

#!/bin/sh
fgrep mystic_mouse | wc -l

pascal, 16 lines

Program detect;
{$H+}
Var
? buffer??? : string;
? result??? : integer;
Begin {main}
? buffer := '';
? result := 0;
? While (Not(eof)) Do
? Begin
??? Readln(buffer);
??? If (pos('mystic_mouse', buffer) > 0) Then
????? inc(result);
? End; {file}
? Writeln(result);
End. {program}

metacard, 13 lines

#!/usr/local/bin/mc
on startup
? put empty into the_message
? put 0 into the_counter
? read from stdin until empty
? put it into the_message
? repeat for each line this_line in the_message
??? if (this_line contains "mystic_mouse") then
????? put the_counter + 1 into the_counter
??? end if
? end repeat
? put the_counter
end startup



is there a more efficient way in Transcript to do this?

Well, to try it out, I chopped down the log to a half million lines, 
then I got these times:? shell script, 22 seconds.? Pascal 7 seconds.? 
metacard 13 minutes and still running ??

I would like never to have to say that "Metacard/Revolution can't do 
this"

Before I tackle it further I was thinking someone had already invented 
this wheel.



Thanks!
Himalayan Academy Publications
Sannyasin Sivakatirswami
Editor's Assistant/Production Manager
katir at hindu.org
www.HinduismToday.com, www.HimalayanAcademy.com,
www.Gurudeva.org, www.hindu.org
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From jeanne at runrev.com  Fri Nov  8 00:42:01 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Fri Nov  8 00:42:01 2002
Subject: Read and Analyze Giant Files
In-Reply-To: <84566354-F2D4-11D6-A9C6-003065FB9830@hindu.org>
Message-ID: <v03130307b9f0fb52d14c@[10.0.1.7]>

At 8:42 PM -0800 11/7/02, Sannyasin Sivakatirswami wrote:
>We are trying to use Rev (or MC) to analyze a web site access log
>that is 3 million lines long, a 300 meg (or more) file.
>
>If I try a shell script (interpreted) or pascal program (compiled)
>each runs in about 2 minutes on this file but an xTalk script takes
>a very long time, maybe it hangs forever?
[...]

>#!/usr/local/bin/mc
> on startup
>   put empty into the_message
>   put 0 into the_counter
>   read from stdin until empty
>   put it into the_message
>   repeat for each line this_line in the_message
>     if (this_line contains "mystic_mouse") then
>       put the_counter + 1 into the_counter
>     end if
>   end repeat
>   put the_counter
> end startup

Meh. Reading that large a file all at once I would guess is why you're
experiencing such slowness.

Is it possible for the target string to appear more than once in a single
line? If not, try something like this:

repeat
  read from stdin until "mystic_mouse"
  if the result is not empty then add 1 to the_counter -- found it
  else exit repeat -- encountered end of file, no more occurrences
end repeat
put the_counter

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From wmb at internettrainer.com  Fri Nov  8 04:26:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Fri Nov  8 04:26:01 2002
Subject: copyrighted Runtime Revolution in MacOSes?
Message-ID: <3D2858A4-F2FB-11D6-B9DC-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

Hallo

Apple indicated me to that:

>> ----
>> Louk Janssen <ljanssen at apple.com>
>> Date: Don Nov 7, 2002  6:22:26  Uhr Europe/Vienna
>> To: Wolfgang Bereuter <wmb at internettrainer.com>
>> Subject: ife
>>
>> Dear Mr. Bereuter,
>>
>> Your App Ife says that it is copyrighted Runtime Revolution (Get 
>> Info): I think you wan to change that to the name of your compny or 
>> your own name.
>> ---

What can I do to to change that. Tried to build it a new distribution 
(1.1.1) with everything off but it did not help. I could change that 
easily in WIN (I think Linux too) but in both MacOS buildings did not 
change...

Any ideas?
Thanks for help in advance...

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539


From simran at teleline.es  Fri Nov  8 08:56:01 2002
From: simran at teleline.es (Peter Lundh)
Date: Fri Nov  8 08:56:01 2002
Subject: Building "serious" scientific applications with RunRev...
Message-ID: <B9F17182.3918%simran@teleline.es>

Hi all-

This autumn I started my PhD on Colour Imaging Science at the Derby
University, UK. A requirement at the institute is knowledge of MatLab and
"C" - MatLab for modeling and C for compiling applications. MatLab I know,
so that's ok - but now I have to learn "C" on top of all the other things I
have to do. 

So my question is the following: Could Revolution (since I'm already
familiar with it and like it!) be a substitute for "C" when developing
scientific applications? Typical needs would be the ability to read,
manipulate, display and output different types of image data, Possibility to
compute Matrix, Fourier and Polynomial algorithms etc.

I'm also curious to know if any other list members have developed scientific
applications with RunRev, and in particular - since it's in my line of
interest - Imaging, Psychophysical, or Colour related applications.

-Peter
-- 
Peter Lundh
E: simran at teleline.es
UK



From simran at teleline.es  Fri Nov  8 09:35:02 2002
From: simran at teleline.es (Peter Lundh)
Date: Fri Nov  8 09:35:02 2002
Subject: Mac OK - Win compilation problematic
Message-ID: <B9F17A7E.391B%simran@teleline.es>

Hi all-

I made an Application with RunRev 1.1.1 on Mac OSX earlier this year. The
client's come back to me and now wants a PC version. I built the Windows
distribution with the MacOSX version of Revolution (if that's of any
importance). Unfortunately, the finished Windows application is displaying a
number of defects which I hoped that, perhaps, someone could help me with:

1) The "visual effect dissolve" is much slower in the Windows version, but
what's worse is that it's displayed in a "pixelated" fashion, almost
stuttering from frame to frame, whereas it's a smooth and beautiful
transition in both the PPC and OSX versions of the app.

2) Cards containing grouped objects and fields with (vertical) scrollbars
look and work fine in the Mac builds, but in the Windows build exactly the
same thing happens: The main stack contain three cards with white
backgrounds and groups, or text fields with vertical scrollbars. For some
reason, the card color, which is white in the Mac versions, is a 50% gray in
the Windows version. The strange thing is that even if I place a white
rectangle in the background, covering the whole card it makes no difference
- the darn Windows application still displays a 50% gray background on those
cards. The scrollable fields, themselves, which are white in the Mac
versions are also 50% gray in the Win app.

3) Throughout the application there are large images that change when you
click on them. They are large buttons where the Icon and Hilited Icon ID's
are set to different images. Each button has a simple on MouseUp script
setting "the hilite of me to (not the hilite of me)" (a la Klaus Major ;).
Once again, in Mac I click on the images and they change nicely without any
hiccups. In the Windows build, however, when I click on an image it changes
to the Hilited Icon ID and then back again (as if I did a double click). The
hilited image is also shifted a couple pixels diagonally making the
application look anything but professional.

Grateful for advice :)

-Peter
-- 
Peter Lundh
E: simran at teleline.es
UK



From kkaufman at snet.net  Fri Nov  8 10:06:01 2002
From: kkaufman at snet.net (Kurt Kaufman)
Date: Fri Nov  8 10:06:01 2002
Subject: copyrighted Runtime Revolution in MacOSes?
Message-ID: <9FC62E98-F32A-11D6-8A82-0003936D1F12@snet.net>

You used to be able to adjust that information using ResEdit , but it 
appears that such changes are ignored when querying the info. under 
"Jaguar".  Hopefully this will be addressed in an upcoming version of 
RR.
-Kurt



From SilverDollar at NYC.rr.com  Fri Nov  8 10:21:01 2002
From: SilverDollar at NYC.rr.com (SilverDollar)
Date: Fri Nov  8 10:21:01 2002
Subject: Clearing QT video when it's done
Message-ID: <B9F13F0A.3E7E%SilverDollar@NYC.rr.com>

Hello,

I?m new to RR, I?m not a programmer though I used to do a bit of SuperCard
and HC. Thank you in advance for your help.  I?m using the Runtime Starter
kit (till I decide) on a Mac G4 os 9.1.

I?m running Quicktime video clips in a player using the ?Set the filename of
player 1 to MyClipName, followed by a ?Start player 1? command. (my thanks
to the examples posted on the website).

When the clip is finished playing, I?d like the last frame to disappear. As
it stands, the last frame persists.  I?ve tried several variations using the
?Done? function hoping to either hide the player or go to another card at
the end of the video.  I can?t get the Done function to work.  It seems to
continue waiting even though the video is long over.  Only Cmd-period gets
the script to stop.

I?ve tried:
If the movie is done..
If Movie() = done...
Wait until the movie is done...
Etc.

Can you recommend a way to clear the screen at the end of the clip?

Many thanks, I have more questions but for now take things one step at a
time. (except for; When is vers 2.0 expected?)

Lance Jacobs
SilverDollar at nyc.rr.com
NYC




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From troy at rpsystems.net  Fri Nov  8 10:34:01 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Fri Nov  8 10:34:01 2002
Subject: Mac OK - Win compilation problematic
In-Reply-To: <B9F17A7E.391B%simran@teleline.es>
Message-ID: <B9F14217.16241%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/8/02 9:28 AM, "Peter Lundh" <simran at teleline.es> wrote:

> 1) The "visual effect dissolve" is much slower in the Windows version, but
> what's worse is that it's displayed in a "pixelated" fashion, almost
> stuttering from frame to frame, whereas it's a smooth and beautiful
> transition in both the PPC and OSX versions of the app.

This sounds indicative of the Windows machine not having QuickTime
installed. If there is no QuickTime available, Rev uses a "weaker" internal
set of transitions. Try installing QT and taking another look.
-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net





From rolfk at vetvir.unizh.ch  Fri Nov  8 10:56:01 2002
From: rolfk at vetvir.unizh.ch (Rolf Kocherhans)
Date: Fri Nov  8 10:56:01 2002
Subject: Building "serious" scientific applications with RunRev... 
Message-ID: <BF081B5C-F331-11D6-A4B0-003065EEE22E@vetvir.unizh.ch>

Hello Peter

I made a scientific application its use is in the field of molecular 
biology.

I find Revolution a very good tool for my purpose, if you want to, have 
a look at it go here:

http://www.vetvir.unizh.ch/programs/

Cheers
Rolf



From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Fri Nov  8 11:06:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Fri Nov  8 11:06:01 2002
Subject: Mac OK - Win compilation problematic
In-Reply-To: <B9F17A7E.391B%simran@teleline.es>
Message-ID: <B9F11F77.1F91A%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Peter Lundh wrote:

> 1) The "visual effect dissolve" is much slower in the Windows version, but
> what's worse is that it's displayed in a "pixelated" fashion, almost
> stuttering from frame to frame, whereas it's a smooth and beautiful
> transition in both the PPC and OSX versions of the app.

QT is very slow on Windows the first time it is called, and general
performance is not as good as Rev's built-in, platform-independent, albeit
slightly-less polished-looking, transitions.

Rev attempts to use QT effects by default.  You can turn this off with the
dontUseQTeffects global property.


> 2) Cards containing grouped objects and fields with (vertical) scrollbars
> look and work fine in the Mac builds, but in the Windows build exactly the
> same thing happens: The main stack contain three cards with white
> backgrounds and groups, or text fields with vertical scrollbars. For some
> reason, the card color, which is white in the Mac versions, is a 50% gray in
> the Windows version. The strange thing is that even if I place a white
> rectangle in the background, covering the whole card it makes no difference
> - the darn Windows application still displays a 50% gray background on those
> cards. The scrollable fields, themselves, which are white in the Mac
> versions are also 50% gray in the Win app.

Try adjusting the colors (topcolor, bottomcolor, etc).  In most of my apps I
set the colors for each platform at the stack level on startup.


> 3) Throughout the application there are large images that change when you
> click on them. They are large buttons where the Icon and Hilited Icon ID's
> are set to different images. Each button has a simple on MouseUp script
> setting "the hilite of me to (not the hilite of me)" (a la Klaus Major ;).
> Once again, in Mac I click on the images and they change nicely without any
> hiccups. In the Windows build, however, when I click on an image it changes
> to the Hilited Icon ID and then back again (as if I did a double click). The
> hilited image is also shifted a couple pixels diagonally making the
> application look anything but professional.

That's something I've not encountered.  Maybe Chip Walters, who just
produced a wonderful button-making widget for Windows and later for Mac, can
offer some tips here.

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From betypaul at arvotek.net  Fri Nov  8 11:19:01 2002
From: betypaul at arvotek.net (Paul Conover)
Date: Fri Nov  8 11:19:01 2002
Subject: Fonts in a Standalone
Message-ID: <638965BE-F333-11D6-8E30-0050E456D376@arvotek.net>

I have made this promo program on my Mac and then made a standalone for 
Windows.
All my effects work well except that on the PC my funky headline 64 
point font turns out as an about 12 point  font something like Helvetica.
There are a lot of titles so I am reluctant to change them all to 
images. Are there headline fonts that are somewhat universal? or is it 
possible that a font can be  embedded in the file with the standalone?  
Has anyone on the list met this problem?
After slaving on this project I would be very grateful tor any help over 
this last hurdle.



From alex at mindlube.com  Fri Nov  8 11:33:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Fri Nov  8 11:33:01 2002
Subject: copyrighted Runtime Revolution in MacOSes?
In-Reply-To: <9FC62E98-F32A-11D6-8A82-0003936D1F12@snet.net>
Message-ID: <CE555526-F336-11D6-83C5-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Friday, November 8, 2002, at 07:59  AM, Kurt Kaufman wrote:

> You used to be able to adjust that information using ResEdit , but it 
> appears that such changes are ignored when querying the info. under 
> "Jaguar".  Hopefully this will be addressed in an upcoming version of 
> RR.

Where is Jaguar getting the information from, including the (c) Runtime 
Revolution then? I always found the resources information that ResEdit 
exposes to be kind of arcane & never really learned it very well.

Wolfgang and Kurt, until Rev 2.0 you can do a workaround on OS X, which 
involves putting your Rev executable into an .app bundle. If anyone is 
interested I'll email you off list. You could use the bundle I have 
already created, you would just need to copy your executable into 
place, edit a .plist file and perhaps create some icons, or not.

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Fri Nov  8 11:34:01 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Fri Nov  8 11:34:01 2002
Subject: Clearing QT video when it's done
In-Reply-To: <B9F13F0A.3E7E%SilverDollar@NYC.rr.com>
Message-ID: <16984A12-F337-11D6-9A48-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Hi Lance,

> Hello,
>
> I?m new to RR, I?m not a programmer though I used to do a bit of 
> SuperCard and HC. Thank you in advance for your help. ?I?m using the 
> Runtime Starter kit (till I decide) on a Mac G4 os 9.1.
>
> I?m running Quicktime video clips in a player using the ?Set the 
> filename of player 1 to MyClipName, followed by a ?Start player 1? 
> command. (my thanks to the examples posted on the website).
>
> When the clip is finished playing, I?d like the last frame to 
> disappear. As it stands, the last frame persists. ?I?ve tried several 
> variations using the ?Done? function hoping to either hide the player 
> or go to another card at the end of the video. ?I can?t get the Done 
> function to work. ?It seems to continue waiting even though the video 
> is long over. ?Only Cmd-period gets the script to stop.
>
> I?ve tried:
> If the movie is done..
> If Movie() = done...
> Wait until the movie is done...
> Etc.
>
> Can you recommend a way to clear the screen at the end of the clip?

There may be 2 ways to solve your problem... (maybe more ?)

Using a player to display movies always leaves the last frame on the 
screen.

So you can:

1. NOT use a player ;-)

Just script:

on mouseup ##or whatever
   player videoclip "path_to_your/movie.mov" at x,y
   ## replace x,y with your desired location on the card
end mouseup

This will play your movie and clear the last frame if the movie is done.

Disadvantage is that you don't have much control over your movie.


2. use the "send...in" command to clear the filename of your player

Put this in the card-script:

on clearframe
   set the filename of player 1 to empty
end clearframe

Then you can script your button like:

on xxx
    set the filename of player 1 to yyy
    start player 1
    put the duration of player 1 into totaltime
    put the timescale of player 1 into per_second
    send "clearframe" to this cd in (totaltime/per_second) secs
end xxx

This will deliver the message "clearframe" to the card in exactly
the time that your movie will last.

Movies have their own timescale and the duration is measured in
this special timescale. But you can query that and act accordingly.

Disadvantage of this method: If someone stops the movie before it
is over and starts it again it might stop unexspectedly...

But if you do not show the controller or give the user the possibility
to stop/start the movie this will do.

> Many thanks, I have more questions but for now take things one step at 
> a time.
> (except for; When is vers 2.0 expected?)

It should be delivered at the end of november... ;-)

> Lance Jacobs
> SilverDollar at nyc.rr.com
> NYC

Hope this helps.


Regards


Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de


From alex at mindlube.com  Fri Nov  8 11:44:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Fri Nov  8 11:44:01 2002
Subject: Building "serious" scientific applications with RunRev...
In-Reply-To: <B9F17182.3918%simran@teleline.es>
Message-ID: <502937F8-F338-11D6-83C5-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Friday, November 8, 2002, at 06:49  AM, Peter Lundh wrote:
> This autumn I started my PhD on Colour Imaging Science at the Derby
> University, UK. A requirement at the institute is knowledge of MatLab 
> and
> "C" - MatLab for modeling and C for compiling applications. MatLab I 
> know,
> so that's ok - but now I have to learn "C" on top of all the other 
> things I
> have to do.
>
> So my question is the following: Could Revolution (since I'm already
> familiar with it and like it!) be a substitute for "C" when developing
> scientific applications? Typical needs would be the ability to read,
> manipulate, display and output different types of image data, 
> Possibility to
> compute Matrix, Fourier and Polynomial algorithms etc.

I don't have any direct experience, but here is my opinion-- Revolution 
would be no match for a highly optimized C library for a particular 
purpose, like imaging or crunching matrices and things.

If I were you, I would go ahead and learn C. C is not a very big or 
complex language; Unlike C++ <shudder> which is a monster of a 
language. Get the book _The C Programming Language_ by Kernighan and 
Ritchie (270pp) which will get you up to speed on ANSI C.

Then you could learn how to write Revolution externals. Then you can 
have the best of both worlds: Quickly build apps with nice GUIs in 
Revolution, which have access to Matlab or other imaging and math 
libraries that exist out there. If there is a fast imaging or maths 
library that exists out there, it's probably written in C and you don't 
want to spend time rewriting it in Rev. You want to start using it ASAP 
and that's where externals come in.

Not that I have ever written an external or anything, mind you. ;-)

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From mike at cyber-ny.com  Fri Nov  8 11:44:08 2002
From: mike at cyber-ny.com (Mike Brown)
Date: Fri Nov  8 11:44:08 2002
Subject: Fonts in a Standalone
In-Reply-To: <638965BE-F333-11D6-8E30-0050E456D376@arvotek.net>
Message-ID: <B9F15263.62F%mike@cyber-ny.com>

Hi Paul,

I have run into the same issue and for that reason I generally use Times and
Arial for text.  These two font selections seem to be supported on most
computers although it is a very limiting selection.  I would be very
interested to hear of any other solutions for text fields.

Best,
Mike

Mike Brown
Cyber-NY Interactive
212-475-2721
1-888-70-CYBER
mike at cyber-ny.com



> From: Paul Conover <betypaul at arvotek.net>
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 11:01:49 -0500
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Fonts in a Standalone
> 
> I have made this promo program on my Mac and then made a standalone for
> Windows.
> All my effects work well except that on the PC my funky headline 64
> point font turns out as an about 12 point  font something like Helvetica.
> There are a lot of titles so I am reluctant to change them all to
> images. Are there headline fonts that are somewhat universal? or is it
> possible that a font can be  embedded in the file with the standalone?
> Has anyone on the list met this problem?
> After slaving on this project I would be very grateful tor any help over
> this last hurdle.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From heather at runrev.com  Fri Nov  8 11:49:01 2002
From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams)
Date: Fri Nov  8 11:49:01 2002
Subject: Compressed Digest
In-Reply-To: <200211071702.MAA11177@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <B9F199FB.DDEE%heather@runrev.com>

> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 17:57:21 -0800 (PST)
> From: Alejandro Tejada <capellan2000 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Compressed Digest
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> 
> Hi everyone on the list,
> 
> I was looking for the compressed digest at:
> http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/revolution/

I believe the link you are looking for is

http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/

Regards,

Heather
> 
> The files are gone!
> 
> Where can I get them?
> 
> Can you post a link for download?
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> Alejandro

-- 
Heather Williams <heather at runrev.com> <http://www.runrev.com/>
Runtime Revolution Ltd.
Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707
Ten Thumbs Typing Tutor Teach your Fingers to Dance



From trevor at mangomultimedia.com  Fri Nov  8 12:05:00 2002
From: trevor at mangomultimedia.com (Trevor DeVore)
Date: Fri Nov  8 12:05:00 2002
Subject: Clearing QT video when it's done
In-Reply-To: <B9F13F0A.3E7E%SilverDollar@NYC.rr.com>
Message-ID: <27579907-F33B-11D6-804F-00039376023C@mangomultimedia.com>


On Friday, November 8, 2002, at 10:14  AM, SilverDollar wrote:
>
> I?m running Quicktime video clips in a player using the ?Set the 
> filename of player 1 to MyClipName, followed by a ?Start player 1? 
> command. (my thanks to the examples posted on the website).
>
> When the clip is finished playing, I?d like the last frame to 
> disappear. As it stands, the last frame persists. ?I?ve tried several 
> variations using the ?Done? function hoping to either hide the player 
> or go to another card at the end of the video. ?I can?t get the Done 
> function to work. ?It seems to continue waiting even though the video 
> is long over. ?Only Cmd-period gets the script to stop.

You could probably set a callback event for the movie that sent a 
message to your player when the end of the movie was reached.  I 
haven't tested this but it should work.

In the properties palette for your movie you can set a callback event 
under the "QuickTime" tab (it has a little QuickTime Q).  At the bottom 
of the palette you can enter callback events.  In the column on the 
left you would enter the duration of your movie.  In the column on the 
right enter the message you want sent to the player when the end of the 
movie is reached.

Now you just need to create the script to handle the message when it is 
sent to the player.  In the script tab for the player enter:
on NameOfYourMessage
	set the visible of me to false
end NameOfYourMessage

This would hide the player when it is done.  Hope this works.

Trevor DeVore
Blue Mango Multimedia
trevor at mangomultimedia.com
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From steve at messimercomputing.com  Fri Nov  8 12:17:01 2002
From: steve at messimercomputing.com (Steve Messimer)
Date: Fri Nov  8 12:17:01 2002
Subject: sending email 
Message-ID: <B9F15A2D.D6F%steve@messimercomputing.com>

Hi Jeanne,

you said ...

Sooooon all your problems will be solved. ;-) (There's a new command in 2.0
that handles all these parameters for mail. Cross-platform, too.)

Well OK! I'll just wait for a few more days then.  ;-)  Thanks for the
prompt response.

Regards,

Steve

Stephen R. Messimer
Messimer Computing, Inc
208 1st Ave South
Escanaba, MI 49829
www.messimercomputing.com





From preid at reidit.co.uk  Fri Nov  8 12:40:01 2002
From: preid at reidit.co.uk (Peter Reid)
Date: Fri Nov  8 12:40:01 2002
Subject: Building "serious" scientific applications with RunRev...
In-Reply-To: <B9F17182.3918%simran@teleline.es>
References: <B9F17182.3918%simran@teleline.es>
Message-ID: <p05111a00b9f1a4ce4085@[192.168.181.1]>

>This autumn I started my PhD on Colour Imaging Science at the Derby
>University, UK. A requirement at the institute is knowledge of MatLab and
>"C" - MatLab for modeling and C for compiling applications. MatLab I know,
>so that's ok - but now I have to learn "C" on top of all the other things I
>have to do.
>
>So my question is the following: Could Revolution (since I'm already
>familiar with it and like it!) be a substitute for "C" when developing
>scientific applications? Typical needs would be the ability to read,
>manipulate, display and output different types of image data, Possibility to
>compute Matrix, Fourier and Polynomial algorithms etc.
>
>I'm also curious to know if any other list members have developed scientific
>applications with RunRev, and in particular - since it's in my line of
>interest - Imaging, Psychophysical, or Colour related applications.

I've used RunRev to produce a data manipulation tool for my wife 
carrying out chemistry research at Loughborough University, UK.  In 
addition, I used RunRev to produce a tool to capture data from an 
analytical chemistry instrument (a diode array detector for an HPLC) 
and output it in a form suitable for importing into Excel.

Cheers

Peter
-- 
Peter Reid
Reid-IT Limited, Loughborough, Leics., UK
Tel: +44 (0)1509 268843 Fax: +44 (0)8700 527576
E-mail: preid at reidit.co.uk
Web: http://www.reidit.co.uk


From wmb at internettrainer.com  Fri Nov  8 13:25:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Fri Nov  8 13:25:01 2002
Subject: Fonts in a Standalone
In-Reply-To: <200211081701.MAA21040@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <7D5F3BA9-F346-11D6-A30C-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Freitag, November 8, 2002, at 06:01  Uhr, 
use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote:

>  Re: Fonts in a Standalone
> From: Mike Brown <mike at cyber-ny.com>
> To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>
> Hi Paul,
>
> I have run into the same issue and for that reason I generally use 
> Times and
> Arial for text.  These two font selections seem to be supported on most
> computers although it is a very limiting selection.  I would be very
> interested to hear of any other solutions for text fields.

Hi Mike,

Imho you should not use Times nor Arial because...
Times is a small serif font - difficult to read on Monitor
Arial is a sanserif font - san serif are normally good to read on 
monitors even in small sizes - but *not* the small and irregular Arial. 
And it is very, very ugly...
So this both are not good for Apps (times is better for printing on 
paper Arial is imho for nothing). If you develop only for WIN than the 
users can live with them, because they are trained on them from the OS 
and Word... But even WIN user deserve a better design for instance 
with: Verdana (installed with IE on MAc too). It is developed from M$ 
especially as ascreen font for better readability on monitors...

snip ----
>> There are a lot of titles so I am reluctant to change them all to
>> images.

Try a Postscript font especially for that big size  (Verdana is not a 
PS font!)

>> Are there headline fonts that are somewhat universal? or is it
>> possible that a font can be  embedded in the file with the standalone?
>> Has anyone on the list met this problem?

Have a look at the Profile Manger. With it you can define different 
Fonts(sizes, styles) for different platforms.

And have a look at building distribution
Tab:stacks: copy default font settings
try to uncheck or check it and see the results after building.

Just my 2 ?cent...

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Fri Nov  8 13:41:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Fri Nov  8 13:41:01 2002
Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #822 - 11 msgs
In-Reply-To: <200211081701.MAA21040@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <DBB674DF-F348-11D6-A30C-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Freitag, November 8, 2002, at 06:01  Uhr, 
use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote:

> Wolfgang and Kurt, until Rev 2.0 you can do a workaround on OS X, which
> involves putting your Rev executable into an .app bundle. If anyone is
> interested I'll email you off list. You could use the bundle I have
> already created, you would just need to copy your executable into
> place, edit a .plist file and perhaps create some icons, or not.

Yes, please mail it to me
Thanks a lot in advance...

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From tuviah at runrev.com  Fri Nov  8 14:06:00 2002
From: tuviah at runrev.com (Tuviah Snyder)
Date: Fri Nov  8 14:06:00 2002
Subject: status of ODBC on OS X; is this a waste of time?
Message-ID: <002301c2872e$a56329e0$55aa8bac@user>

>1) Mac OS 10.2 ships with the iODBC Driver Manager pre-installed, and 
>PostgreSQL has a configure option --with-iodbc to build ODBC driver for 
>iODBC. Rev has ODBC connectivity. Methinks this might work! Am I 
>wasting my time or should I give it a try?
iODBC will be supported in 2.0. It won't work with 1.1, you actually have to link to iODBC at compile time.

>2) What is the DB support looking like in Rev 2.0? Is the PostgreSQL 
>driver going to be Pro-version only?
Oracle (all platforms), MySQL (all), Valentina (osx, ppc, windows), iODBC (all), DataDirect ODBC (ppc), Postgresql client (windows, osx, unix). It will also be modified in that it will load db driver files (ie. dbmysql-one file for each type of database), to avoid bringing down Revolution in the event that a databases client libraries cannot be found. Another advantage is that it will give C++ programmer the chance to easily extend revdb's database capabilities by authoring one of these database driver files. I'll leave Kevin to comment on licensing issues.

Tuviah Snyder <tuviah at runrev.com> <http://www.runrev.com/>
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
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From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Fri Nov  8 14:08:01 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Fri Nov  8 14:08:01 2002
Subject: Fonts in a Standalone
In-Reply-To: <638965BE-F333-11D6-8E30-0050E456D376@arvotek.net>
Message-ID: <8CB0DF68-F34C-11D6-9A48-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Hi Paul,

> I have made this promo program on my Mac and then made a standalone 
> for Windows.
> All my effects work well except that on the PC my funky headline 64 
> point font turns out
> as an about 12 point  font something like Helvetica.

Ouch...

The old crossplatform problem: Fonts :(

> There are a lot of titles so I am reluctant to change them all to 
> images.
> Are there headline fonts that are somewhat universal?
> or is it possible that a font can be  embedded in the file with the 
> standalone?
> Has anyone on the list met this problem?
> After slaving on this project I would be very grateful tor any help 
> over this last hurdle.

There is this external-collection on the old runrev-site:

http://www.xworlds.com/metacard/external.htm

which is free now, if i remember right.
(Contact RunRev for a license-key...)

It provides this possibility to:

# Load font - load a font from any file for use without installation

IF (!) you have your "funky" fonts availabe as a truetype windows 
version
(licensed if possible :-), PS-fonts won't work on windows without the 
ATM,
if i remenber right) then you could store your font(s) in a 
customproperty
in your stack, install it on preopenstack and delete it on closestack 
:-)
Not tested, but should work fine.


Hope this helps.
(If you need help with the syntrax for the external,
feel free to ask me offlist :-)


Regards

Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de



From kkaufman at snet.net  Fri Nov  8 15:21:01 2002
From: kkaufman at snet.net (Kurt Kaufman)
Date: Fri Nov  8 15:21:01 2002
Subject: Building "serious" scientific applications with RunRev...
Message-ID: <B7EC63A6-F356-11D6-B83B-0003936D1F12@snet.net>

Alex Rice wrote:
"...Get the book _The C Programming Language_ by Kernighan and
Ritchie (270pp) which will get you up to speed on ANSI C...."

Also, have a look at this fragment from a long out-of-print book by Jim 
Trudeau:
http://shopperturnpike.com/usefulsoftware/Guide to C.pdf

or, if your web browser can't resolve spaces:
http://shopperturnpike.com/usefulsoftware/Guide%20to%20C.pdf

I have found this to be a a useful, concise overview of the "C" 
language (such as it was when the book was published many years ago...)

HTH,
Kurt



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Fri Nov  8 16:51:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Fri Nov  8 16:51:01 2002
Subject: Panel Resizers and Geometry Manager
In-Reply-To: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOIEHCCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHCEBECLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Just open the Object Library then choose "Panel Resizers" from the option
button.

> Monte,
>
> I dl'ed your library, installed it where you said to, and can't figure out
> how to use/access it. Can't find the description field in the
> stack. I'm on
> XP -- please enlighten me! I'm probably just missing something simple.
>
> -Chipp
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From chipp at chipp.com  Fri Nov  8 17:18:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Fri Nov  8 17:18:01 2002
Subject: Fonts in a Standalone
In-Reply-To: <638965BE-F333-11D6-8E30-0050E456D376@arvotek.net>
Message-ID: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCIEIMDGAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Paul,

You can also create a

if the platform is "Win32" then
	set the textfont of fld "myTitle" to Verdana
	set the textsize of fld "myTitle" to 32
	etc..
end if

I find I need to do this sometimes in ports.

On of the reasons I created ButtonGadget is to 'unify' interface elements
across all distribution platforms. They all look EXACTLY alike...though are
not necessarily in line with each platforms UI guidelines.

-Chipp




From katir at hindu.org  Fri Nov  8 21:04:00 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Fri Nov  8 21:04:00 2002
Subject: sending email
In-Reply-To: <3dcaba7c.58ee.1804289383@unitz.ca>
Message-ID: <BAC2E816-F386-11D6-A9C6-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

> Re: sending email

Shao, thank you for all the great work you did. I haven't done it yet, 
but could probably break out the necessary components, but you would 
know how to do so better:

One very useful subset of your "maha" ("great big") library to just do 
the following would be super:


a) field to enter server
b) field to enter user
c) field to enter password
d) field to enter recipient
e) field to enter subject
f) field to enter body of email msg

and two buttons:
one to browse for attachements
one to send the email.

And the necessary handlers for just this subset of operations.

Now, we can obviously hack your library to pull this out... but maybe 
it would be if you did that so that we don't break anything?

Thanks!
Himalayan Academy Publications
Sannyasin Sivakatirswami
katir at hindu.org
www.HinduismToday.com, www.HimalayanAcademy.com,
www.Gurudeva.org, www.hindu.org



From katir at hindu.org  Fri Nov  8 21:50:01 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Fri Nov  8 21:50:01 2002
Subject: Poke the IPTC annotation data space of images?
Message-ID: <243BCB66-F38D-11D6-A9C6-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

Platform is MAC OSX:

Does anyone know how to access/write to the IPTC  annotation data space 
of a jpg or image file? I don't even really know what the proper 
nomenclature is, but some programs like Photoshop are able to add a 
caption to a photo that can be read later.

Goal: to be able to write captions for photos and have that data "live" 
in the jpg file itself. Read and write that data from within Rev. Using 
a Rev interface I could then delegate photo captioning to other team 
players anywhere in the world where they download a photo, write a 
caption and upload the photo to our server and I can read the 
caption... or, they take photos locally ( as for instance our 
correspondent in New Delhi) then we make a Rev interface for him to 
view his hi-res digital files, generate low res thumbnails, caption 
these and upload to the managing editors space on our server. we read 
the jpg and its caption from one and the same file, send him back a 
list of files we want, he hits another button and uploads the original 
hi-res photos we have selected for the article.

One could of course load photos into images and then use a 
customProperty for the caption and that would be highly facile script 
wise, but the problem is that the caption no longer "lives" with the 
image. and then re-ordering these on an interface (for output to and 
html page) becomes another snaky game (move the image objects around or 
re-order the files on disk and reload them into the same series of 
image objects) and means a single stack holds data for multiple images 
and the collaboration options diminish--someone else has the file open 
(LAN scenario), multiple copies of the stack to reconcile (global team 
scenario if working on the same photo set) better if the caption data 
lives in the image file itself.


Om shanti,
Hinduism Today
Himalayan Academy Publications
Sannyasin Sivakatirswami
katir at hindu.org
www.HinduismToday.com, www.HimalayanAcademy.com,
www.Gurudeva.org, www.hindu.org



From michaell at unimelb.edu.au  Fri Nov  8 21:52:01 2002
From: michaell at unimelb.edu.au (Michael J. Lew)
Date: Fri Nov  8 21:52:01 2002
Subject: Building "serious" scientific applications with RunRev...
Message-ID: <p05001900b9f22322a7f5@[128.250.138.183]>

Absolutely!

I use Revolution as my ONLY programming tool for both teaching and 
scientific applications (and sometimes both combined in a single 
project). I have built several projects using matrix algorithms from 
the "Numerical Recipes" book (Press et al.) and facilitated that by 
making a fortran and pascal to transcript (partial) converters. 
Specific programs that work well are a partial differential 
equation-based numerical simulation system (both Runge-Kutta and 
Rosenbrock stiff integration routines), a statistical program that 
does simple Student's t-tests and the more widely appropriate 
permutations tests, a not-quite perfect (yet) curve-fitting program 
along with a wide variety of other smaller applications.

Relevant built-in functions in Revolution make the building these 
types of routines quite straightforward. For instance the random() 
function returns reliably random numbers that have no bias or 
correlation. I recommend that if you are already familiar with 
Revolution then you should have no qualms concerning its 
applicability to scientific computing problems.

I can't comment specifically on imaging, psychophysical or colour 
projects, but I'd certainly give it a go in Revolution before trying 
to deal with C. My programs are generally a bit slower in execution 
than commercial programs with similar functionality, but they are 
certainly fast enough for my purposes and the speed difference is 
nowhere near great enough to counterbalance the time that learning C 
might take.

Regards,
-- 
Michael J. Lew

Senior Lecturer
Department of Pharmacology
The University of Melbourne
Parkville 3010
Victoria
Australia

Phone +613 8344 8304

**
New email address: michaell at unimelb.edu.au
**


From katir at hindu.org  Fri Nov  8 22:41:01 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Fri Nov  8 22:41:01 2002
Subject: RTF Reader in Rev
Message-ID: <5100EBDD-F394-11D6-A9C6-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

We have Geoff's RTF rev docs exporter; but do we have an RTF reader?

Apple's mail.app saves emails as .rtf files... i would like to be able 
to read those into Rev sans all the mark up. Needs to work in OSX 10.2

Himalayan Academy Publications
Sannyasin Sivakatirswami
katir at hindu.org
www.HinduismToday.com, www.HimalayanAcademy.com,
www.Gurudeva.org, www.hindu.org



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Fri Nov  8 23:17:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Fri Nov  8 23:17:01 2002
Subject: RTF Reader in Rev
In-Reply-To: <5100EBDD-F394-11D6-A9C6-003065FB9830@hindu.org>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHIEBHCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Wait for 2.0 nd the rtfText property ;-)
> 
> We have Geoff's RTF rev docs exporter; but do we have an RTF reader?
> 
> Apple's mail.app saves emails as .rtf files... i would like to be able 
> to read those into Rev sans all the mark up. Needs to work in OSX 10.2
> 
> Himalayan Academy Publications
> Sannyasin Sivakatirswami
> katir at hindu.org
> www.HinduismToday.com, www.HimalayanAcademy.com,
> www.Gurudeva.org, www.hindu.org
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 


From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Fri Nov  8 23:26:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Fri Nov  8 23:26:01 2002
Subject: RTF Reader in Rev
In-Reply-To: <5100EBDD-F394-11D6-A9C6-003065FB9830@hindu.org>
Message-ID: <B9F1CCEE.1F9BE%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Sannyasin Sivakatirswami wrote:

> We have Geoff's RTF rev docs exporter; but do we have an RTF reader?

MC 2.5.

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From katir at hindu.org  Fri Nov  8 23:48:07 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Fri Nov  8 23:48:07 2002
Subject: RFE: Read and Analyze Giant Files
Message-ID: <9022C8DC-F39D-11D6-A9C6-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

Jeanne:

Slick solution!? Think I'll try it. .....
(read and analyze data in 300 meg file with over 3 million lines)

Welp, it sounds good but it doesn't work.,? Here's my code

#!/usr/local/bin/mc
on startup
put 0 into the_counter
repeat
? read from stdin until "mystic_mouse"
? if the result is not empty then
??? add 1 to the_counter
? else
??? put the_counter
??? exit repeat
? end if
end repeat
end startup

I got, counter is zero, program exits with "broken pipe".? I am cat'ing 
the input into it with a pipe.

??
Himalayan Academy Publications
Sannyasin Sivakatirswami
katir at hindu.org
www.HinduismToday.com, www.HimalayanAcademy.com,
www.Gurudeva.org, www.hindu.org


From luetzm at texasreading.org  Sat Nov  9 06:32:01 2002
From: luetzm at texasreading.org (Mark Luetzelschwab)
Date: Sat Nov  9 06:32:01 2002
Subject: Clearing QT video when it's done
In-Reply-To: <200211081701.MAA21005@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211081701.MAA21005@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <p05111a12b9f1b8eafec9@[128.83.244.37]>

>

Use the playStopped message

inside of the player script

from memory, so check syntax :)

on playStopped
	if the currentTime of me = the duration of me then
	  # hide the movie or whatever
	   set the fileName of me to empty
	   hide me
            set the topLeft of me to the bottomRight of this card
		# there are many other options that should work (any 
of these should do the trick - you shouldn't need all three)

	end if
end playStopped


>Message: 2
>Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 10:14:34 -0500
>Subject: Clearing QT video when it's done
>From: SilverDollar <SilverDollar at NYC.rr.com>
>To: Runtime Revolution Mailing List <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
>Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>
>>  This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
>this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.
>
>--B_3119595274_3286317
>Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"
>Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
>
>Hello,
>
>I=B9m new to RR, I=B9m not a programmer though I used to do a bit of SuperCard
>and HC. Thank you in advance for your help.  I=B9m using the Runtime Starter
>kit (till I decide) on a Mac G4 os 9.1.
>
>I=B9m running Quicktime video clips in a player using the =B3Set the 
>filename o=
>f
>player 1 to MyClipName, followed by a =B3Start player 1=B2 command. (my thanks
>to the examples posted on the website).
>
>When the clip is finished playing, I=B9d like the last frame to disappear. As
>it stands, the last frame persists.  I=B9ve tried several variations using th=
>e
>=B3Done=B2 function hoping to either hide the player or go to another card at
>the end of the video.  I can=B9t get the Done function to work.  It seems to
>continue waiting even though the video is long over.  Only Cmd-period gets
>the script to stop.
>
>I=B9ve tried:
>If the movie is done..
>If Movie() =3D done...
>Wait until the movie is done...
>Etc.
>
>Can you recommend a way to clear the screen at the end of the clip?
>
>Many thanks, I have more questions but for now take things one step at a
>time. (except for; When is vers 2.0 expected?)
>
>Lance Jacobs
>SilverDollar at nyc.rr.com
>NYC


From dwilk at bradfork.co.uk  Sat Nov  9 06:32:27 2002
From: dwilk at bradfork.co.uk (David Wilkinson)
Date: Sat Nov  9 06:32:27 2002
Subject: Web Access - launch Browser
In-Reply-To: <200211081437.JAA13580@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211081437.JAA13580@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <E18AJUj-0007E4-00@iffley.bradcomp.co.uk>

Jeanne
Thanks for your response. Unfortunately, I don't think it is the 
complete answer since the original scriptlet was:

	put the selectedtext into tAppName 
	Answer file "Select Text file to open " 
	If tAppName is not empty then 
		put"file:" & it into tFileName 
		Get shell (tAppName && tFileName) 
	End if

The problem was that the conditional clause never ran because 
tAppName was always empty. The answer dialog lines were inserted one 
at a time to discover if RR had picked up the selectedText, which it 
had but for some reason it would not *put* it into the variable.

However, today it is working as expected - as I said, there are some 
gremlins at work somewhere - ?with running stacks within the dev UI?
There are other issues under Linux  - cutting from the documentation 
works sporadically( though c&p is a bit of a nightmare under X 
anyway), likewise code completion in the script editor and mouse 
wheel scrolling direction is reversed to mention just three off the 
top of my head.  By the way. does RR install by default with root 
privileges - if so that might need to be addressed in due course? - 
though that will not be easy.

> From: "Jeanne A. E. DeVoto" <jeanne at runrev.com> > > This is 
happening because the dialog box takes the focus, so the > text is 
deselected. Instead, you need to save the text in a > variable: > > 
put the selectedText into myText > answer myText > put myText into 
tAppName > answer tAppName



From Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com  Sat Nov  9 10:27:01 2002
From: Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com (Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com)
Date: Sat Nov  9 10:27:01 2002
Subject: RTF Reader in Rev
Message-ID: <OFCF7ED170.BC1D6951-ON85256C6C.0053AB6C@sealedair.com>

> Wait for 2.0 nd the rtfText property ;-)

That sounds great, but let's take it a step further. Where I work, MS-Word
(.doc) is a corporate standard for memos, etc. sent via e-mail. We also
have several unix (not linux) based machines that people use. They have to
get PC/Mac users to print these memos because there are no decent MS-word
viewers available for *nix machines. Rev could change this. How about
adding a new docText property as well? This has been a *nix desired
functionality for soooo long.

Roger Eller
roger.e.eller at sealedair.com





From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Sat Nov  9 10:33:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Sat Nov  9 10:33:01 2002
Subject: Building "serious" scientific applications with RunRev...
In-Reply-To: <p05001900b9f22322a7f5@[128.250.138.183]>
References: <p05001900b9f22322a7f5@[128.250.138.183]>
Message-ID: <a05200a01b9f2d199f845@[65.56.248.103]>

i do not agree with the general statement "if you want to program a 
serious scientific app, you better learn C".  from my experience that 
is true only for some problems.  for example, if you would like to 
analyze fMRI data with an algorithm of your own, well, you'll better 
learn C.  and sometimes you need structures (struct in C, record in 
pascal) in order to model more complex data, then C or pascal is the 
better choice (for example if you want to do some complex modelling). 
but RR can be used successfully for scientific applications -- i am 
an experimental psychologist and use it nearly everyday:  i prepare 
my data for later analysis (clean up files, merge data, rearrange 
files), create my experiments, manage some databases.  it probably 
isn't the best tool to do 3d live rendering, but about that i am not 
sure.  on the other hand, perhaps the stuff i do is not considered 
"serious" science ...
best, olli.


From shaosean at unitz.ca  Sat Nov  9 12:39:00 2002
From: shaosean at unitz.ca (Shao Sean)
Date: Sat Nov  9 12:39:00 2002
Subject: sending email
Message-ID: <3dcd46af.111e.1804289383@unitz.ca>

> a) field to enter server
> b) field to enter user
> c) field to enter password
> d) field to enter recipient
> e) field to enter subject
> f) field to enter body of email msg

just create a field and then when the user (or your code)
wants to send the email, just use the built-in commands to
pass that information across (if you need help with this,
feel free to contact me off-list)


> and two buttons:
> one to browse for attachements
> one to send the email.

the example stack has these two buttons available..

----------------------------------------------------
Unitz Online Inc. - Sign-up today! - www.unitz.ca


From mdswindell at charter.net  Sat Nov  9 12:47:01 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Sat Nov  9 12:47:01 2002
Subject: selecting  tab button  from script
In-Reply-To: <200211090253.VAA00478@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <B9F28892.34B0%mdswindell@charter.net>

What is the proper way to hilite/select a tabbed button from a script?  I
have two nearly identical navigation tabbed button sets on two different
groups, and when I jump groups it goes to the correct card but doesn't
hilite the proper tab upon getting there.

The "select menuItem x of menu 'buttonName'" doesn't seem to work," and I
can't locate the info in the docs.  Trying to figure out how tabbed buttons
and menus distinguish themselves.

Thanks
Mark



From Jmicha5059 at aol.com  Sat Nov  9 12:51:00 2002
From: Jmicha5059 at aol.com (Jmicha5059 at aol.com)
Date: Sat Nov  9 12:51:00 2002
Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #824 - 8 msgs
Message-ID: <73.28d5e25c.2afea34f@aol.com>

Most fMRI analyses are now done with SPM.  This system uses scripts in Matlab 
and very few C routines.  Matlab scripts are about as far from programminmg 
as you can get.  The attitude that "serious" programming is done only with 
procedural languages is just a sentiment expressed by people who have beat 
their heads against the wall of badly designed programming systems who now 
realize that object-oriented scripting systems do the same job without the 
bloody mess on the wall.

Mike Williams
http://www.brainmetric.com

In a message dated 11/9/02 11:56:52 AM, 
use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com writes:

<< Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 08:26:33 -0700
To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
From: Oliver Hardt <hardt at u.arizona.edu>
Subject: Re: Building "serious" scientific applications with RunRev...
Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com

i do not agree with the general statement "if you want to program a 
serious scientific app, you better learn C".  from my experience that 
is true only for some problems.  for example, if you would like to 
analyze fMRI data with an algorithm of your own, well, you'll better 
learn C.  and sometimes you need structures (struct in C, record in 
pascal) in order to model more complex data, then C or pascal is the 
better choice (for example if you want to do some complex modelling). 
but RR can be used successfully for scientific applications -- i am 
an experimental psychologist and use it nearly everyday:  i prepare 
my data for later analysis (clean up files, merge data, rearrange 
files), create my experiments, manage some databases.  it probably 
isn't the best tool to do 3d live rendering, but about that i am not 
sure.  on the other hand, perhaps the stuff i do is not considered 
"serious" science ...
best, olli. >>



From gary.rathbone at btclick.com  Sat Nov  9 13:09:01 2002
From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone)
Date: Sat Nov  9 13:09:01 2002
Subject: Creating links
In-Reply-To: <p05100300b9dd06fff96a@[128.250.164.101]>
Message-ID: <IDELJJOBILDEKAEHEILGEEHJCGAA.gary.rathbone@btclick.com>

Put your script in a button making sure the "Can Receive Keybaord Focus" box
is unchecked in the 'button' tab of the properties window.

This keeps the text selected when you click the button.

Regards

Gary Rathbone BSc MBCS
Chartered Information Systems Practitioner

-----Original Message-----
From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
[mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Terry Judd
Sent: 24 October 2002 03:17
To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
Subject: Creating links


OK, surely this can't be difficult. How do I select some text in a
field and then set its linkText property without having to resort to
"set the linkText of..." in the message box? I'm having real problems
even querying the selectedChunk given that it automatically deselects
as soon as I click in the message box (or anywhere else for that
matter).

Cheers,

Terry...
--
Dr Terry Judd
Biomedical Multimedia Unit
Faculty of Dentistry Medicine & Health Sciences
The University of Melbourne
Parkville VIC
Australia
_______________________________________________
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution




From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sat Nov  9 14:00:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sat Nov  9 14:00:01 2002
Subject: selecting  tab button  from script
In-Reply-To: <B9F28892.34B0%mdswindell@charter.net>
Message-ID: <20021109185323.47238.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Mark Swindell <mdswindell at charter.net> wrote:
> What is the proper way to hilite/select a tabbed
> button from a script?  I
> have two nearly identical navigation tabbed button
> sets on two different
> groups, and when I jump groups it goes to the
> correct card but doesn't
> hilite the proper tab upon getting there.
> 
> The "select menuItem x of menu 'buttonName'" doesn't
> seem to work," and I
> can't locate the info in the docs.  Trying to figure
> out how tabbed buttons
> and menus distinguish themselves.
> 
> Thanks
> Mark
> 

Hi Mark,

Try this:
  set the menuHistory of btn 'tabbedBtn' to 2

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2


From wow at together.net  Sat Nov  9 14:12:01 2002
From: wow at together.net (Richard D. Miller)
Date: Sat Nov  9 14:12:01 2002
Subject: Recording sound
In-Reply-To: <IDELJJOBILDEKAEHEILGEEHJCGAA.gary.rathbone@btclick.com>
Message-ID: <B9F2C6A4.14E2A%wow@together.net>

Being Mac people...we're in the process of moving a project over to Windows
XP and are having problems recording sound. The sound is coming in through
the Firewire port on our Sony VAIO laptop (via an analog video camera hooked
up through an analog-to-digital converter). When we try using the Sound
Recorder app on the PC, it doesn't recognize any sound input.

On the Mac, we had to adjust the Sound control panel by switching the input
to DV Audio. I suspect we have to do the same thing under XP, but haven't
found the way to do this yet. What are we missing?

Thanks.

-- 
Richard Miller
Advanced Training Systems, Inc.
802-238-5355




From gary.rathbone at btclick.com  Sat Nov  9 14:42:02 2002
From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone)
Date: Sat Nov  9 14:42:02 2002
Subject: Poke the IPTC annotation data space of images?
In-Reply-To: <243BCB66-F38D-11D6-A9C6-003065FB9830@hindu.org>
Message-ID: <IDELJJOBILDEKAEHEILGEEHKCGAA.gary.rathbone@btclick.com>

There's a lot of information at
http://www.iptc.org/site/standards.html

including "...some sample software written in C++ to provide a guide to
programmers wishing to extract IPTC DataSets from JPEG image files..."

You might also want to take a look at
http://www.breezesys.com/BreezeBrowser/iptc.htm

Regards

Gary Rathbone BSc MBCS
Chartered Information Systems Practitioner



-----Original Message-----
From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
[mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Sannyasin
Sivakatirswami
Sent: 09 November 2002 02:44
To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
Subject: Poke the IPTC annotation data space of images?


Platform is MAC OSX:

Does anyone know how to access/write to the IPTC  annotation data space
of a jpg or image file? I don't even really know what the proper
nomenclature is, but some programs like Photoshop are able to add a
caption to a photo that can be read later.

Goal: to be able to write captions for photos and have that data "live"
in the jpg file itself. Read and write that data from within Rev. Using
a Rev interface I could then delegate photo captioning to other team
players anywhere in the world where they download a photo, write a
caption and upload the photo to our server and I can read the
caption... or, they take photos locally ( as for instance our
correspondent in New Delhi) then we make a Rev interface for him to
view his hi-res digital files, generate low res thumbnails, caption
these and upload to the managing editors space on our server. we read
the jpg and its caption from one and the same file, send him back a
list of files we want, he hits another button and uploads the original
hi-res photos we have selected for the article.

One could of course load photos into images and then use a
customProperty for the caption and that would be highly facile script
wise, but the problem is that the caption no longer "lives" with the
image. and then re-ordering these on an interface (for output to and
html page) becomes another snaky game (move the image objects around or
re-order the files on disk and reload them into the same series of
image objects) and means a single stack holds data for multiple images
and the collaboration options diminish--someone else has the file open
(LAN scenario), multiple copies of the stack to reconcile (global team
scenario if working on the same photo set) better if the caption data
lives in the image file itself.


Om shanti,
Hinduism Today
Himalayan Academy Publications
Sannyasin Sivakatirswami
katir at hindu.org
www.HinduismToday.com, www.HimalayanAcademy.com,
www.Gurudeva.org, www.hindu.org

_______________________________________________
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution




From rpresender at earthlink.net  Sat Nov  9 15:11:01 2002
From: rpresender at earthlink.net (Robert Presender)
Date: Sat Nov  9 15:11:01 2002
Subject: Menu problem
Message-ID: <62DCA5E0-F41E-11D6-8386-000393A19046@earthlink.net>

Hi,
Need help again re menus.  Using OS 10.2.1,  1.1.1 r2, 1.5A7r1

I have a menubar with several btn menus as pulldown:  one of the menus 
has several items:
New
Trans
-
Sort
-

I would like to have the Sort item to be cascading(?) like:
-
Sort  (arrow symbol)      By Date
                                           By Event
  -

Tried to follow the info in About Menus but have had no success.  Tried 
tabbing Sort to no avail when in properties.  Checked custom to make 
sure Tab was true not false.

Will appreciate help in this matter.  TIA

Regards ... Bob 
     



From mdswindell at charter.net  Sat Nov  9 15:17:01 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Sat Nov  9 15:17:01 2002
Subject: selecting  tab button  from script
In-Reply-To: <20021109185323.47238.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <B9F2AB9B.34C4%mdswindell@charter.net>

on 11/9/02 10:53 AM, Jan Schenkel at janschenkel at yahoo.com wrote:

> set the menuHistory of btn 'tabbedBtn' to 2


Thank you!  I put the following in the opencard handler in the stack script
and it appears to work great.
  

if exists (btn "MainTabbedButton") then
    set the menuHistory of btn "MainTabbedButton" to the number of this cd
end if


Mark



From kevin at runrev.com  Sat Nov  9 15:20:01 2002
From: kevin at runrev.com (Kevin Miller)
Date: Sat Nov  9 15:20:01 2002
Subject: status of ODBC on OS X; is this a waste of time?
In-Reply-To: <002301c2872e$a56329e0$55aa8bac@user>
Message-ID: <B9F31CE9.CD07%kevin@runrev.com>

On 8/11/02 1:49 pm, Tuviah Snyder <tuviah at runrev.com> wrote:

> I'll leave Kevin to comment on licensing issues.

Postgres will be the same as the other specific databases: most of the
feature set will only work with the pro version.  ODBC will continue to be
fully functional in the Small Business Edition.

Kevin

Kevin Miller <kevin at runrev.com> <http://www.runrev.com/>
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
Tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165.  Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707.



From alex at mindlube.com  Sat Nov  9 15:42:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Sat Nov  9 15:42:01 2002
Subject: status of ODBC on OS X; is this a waste of time?
In-Reply-To: <B9F31CE9.CD07%kevin@runrev.com>
Message-ID: <C9B473A4-F422-11D6-A365-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Saturday, November 9, 2002, at 01:13  PM, Kevin Miller wrote:

> On 8/11/02 1:49 pm, Tuviah Snyder <tuviah at runrev.com> wrote:
>
>> I'll leave Kevin to comment on licensing issues.
>
> Postgres will be the same as the other specific databases: most of the
> feature set will only work with the pro version.  ODBC will continue 
> to be
> fully functional in the Small Business Edition.
>

Thanks Tuviah and Kevin,

2.0 sounds like a winner!


Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From alex at mindlube.com  Sat Nov  9 15:43:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Sat Nov  9 15:43:01 2002
Subject: Building "serious" scientific applications with RunRev...
In-Reply-To: <a05200a01b9f2d199f845@[65.56.248.103]>
Message-ID: <02309CF0-F423-11D6-A365-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Saturday, November 9, 2002, at 08:26  AM, Oliver Hardt wrote:

> i do not agree with the general statement "if you want to program a 
> serious scientific app, you better learn C".  from my experience that 
> is true only for some problems.  for example, if you would like to 
> analyze fMRI data with an algorithm of your own, well, you'll better 
> learn C.  and sometimes you need structures (struct in C, record in 
> pascal) in order to model more complex data, then C or pascal is the 
> better choice (for example if you want to do some complex modelling). 
> but RR can be used successfully for scientific applications -- i am an 
> experimental psychologist and use it nearly everyday:  i prepare my 
> data for later analysis (clean up files, merge data, rearrange files), 
> create my experiments, manage some databases.  it probably isn't the 
> best tool to do 3d live rendering, but about that i am not sure.  on 
> the other hand, perhaps the stuff i do is not considered "serious" 
> science ...

I wasn't at all suggesting that if it's not written in C, it's not 
"serious" science. I was just pointing out that there are very refined, 
fast C libraries for specific purposes that one would not want to 
rewrite. Matlab, & OpenGL are a couple that come to mind for the 
original poster.

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to




From themacguy at macosx.com  Sat Nov  9 16:16:00 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Sat Nov  9 16:16:00 2002
Subject: New Card yields a different size?
Message-ID: <84E7C8D5-F427-11D6-955C-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

When I use the menu command "New Card" to add a card to my stack 
(development environment), the resulting card is taller (about 15-20 
pixels) than the first card even though the card properties declare 
both cards to be the same size. The first card of the stack is 620x460 
pixels.

I could use a little advice if someone feels so inclined.

Thanks,
Barry



From katir at hindu.org  Sat Nov  9 16:38:15 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Sat Nov  9 16:38:15 2002
Subject: Poke the IPTC annotation data space of images?
In-Reply-To: <IDELJJOBILDEKAEHEILGEEHKCGAA.gary.rathbone@btclick.com>
Message-ID: <C1FF2169-F42A-11D6-A9C6-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

Thanks Gary:

That get's me up to speed on this area, but since I don't know C++. 
Getting from where Rev is today to Revolution with a cross platform 
IPTC DataSet plug-in doesn't appear very doable.

I guess for now I will have to go with the stack model where images 
carry associated data as custom props.

If anyone ever did generate this funcationality within Rev, an entire 
(hard to assess how big, but if only photoShop and BreezeSys are doing 
it now, then it's any body's game)  market within the publishing, 
newspaper, media industry could open up for developers to provide 
needed apps...

But for now I'll have to stay with xTalk. I have posted this to the 
Improve list, as an obscure wish for the future feature list, just in 
case, unbeknownst to us, since to core engine already has JPEG export 
built in, poking the IPTC data might not be such a big deal to add on 
to the core engine. I can't imagine that it is anything more than some 
kind of header or trailer.... in a specific pre-defined format.

Thanks
Hinduism Today

Sannyasin Sivakatirswami
Editor's Assistant/Production Manager
katir at hindu.org
www.HinduismToday.com, www.HimalayanAcademy.com,
www.Gurudeva.org, www.hindu.org




On Saturday, November 9, 2002, at 09:33  AM, Gary Rathbone wrote:

> There's a lot of information at
> http://www.iptc.org/site/standards.html
>
> including "...some sample software written in C++ to provide a guide to
> programmers wishing to extract IPTC DataSets from JPEG image files..."
>
> You might also want to take a look at
> http://www.breezesys.com/BreezeBrowser/iptc.htm

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From troy at rpsystems.net  Sat Nov  9 17:03:00 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Sat Nov  9 17:03:00 2002
Subject: New Card yields a different size?
In-Reply-To: <84E7C8D5-F427-11D6-955C-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
Message-ID: <B9F2EEAE.162EF%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/9/02 4:09 PM, "Barry Levine" <themacguy at macosx.com> wrote:

> I could use a little advice if someone feels so inclined.

Any chance you have menus enabled on one but not another, or something to
that effect?
-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net




From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Sat Nov  9 17:20:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Sat Nov  9 17:20:01 2002
Subject: Menu problem
In-Reply-To: <62DCA5E0-F41E-11D6-8386-000393A19046@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <B9F2C881.1FA39%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Robert Presender wrote:

> I have a menubar with several btn menus as pulldown:  one of the menus
> has several items:
> New
> Trans
> -
> Sort
> -
> 
> I would like to have the Sort item to be cascading(?)

Put this in your menu button contents:

New
Trans
-
Sort
<tab>by Date
<tab>by Event


-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From themacguy at macosx.com  Sat Nov  9 17:29:01 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Sat Nov  9 17:29:01 2002
Subject: Card size changing - problem identified (maybe)
Message-ID: <C976565B-F431-11D6-955C-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

Looks like the problem I posted a little while ago about a new card 
being taller than the first card (as it was spec'd in the stack - 22 
pixels, it turned out) was caused by checking the "Menu Bar Group" 
checkbox. When I unchecked it, the problem went away. Probably will 
need to review when the proper time is (during the development process) 
to create the menubar, etc.

Any pointers (or pointers to existing documents) will be appreciated.

Thanks,
Barry



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sat Nov  9 18:22:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sat Nov  9 18:22:01 2002
Subject: Card size changing - problem identified (maybe)
References: <C976565B-F431-11D6-955C-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
Message-ID: <010301c28845$3dd5d4e0$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Barry,

When you have a menu bar, that 22 pixels' worth of space is used to show the
menu bar on Windows machines (since the menu bar is part of the window), and
hidden on Macs (since the menu bar is fixed at the top of the screen).
Technically the card includes the menu bar space, but Rev is just hiding
that 22 pixels so you don't get duplicated menu bars (one at the top of the
screen and one in the window).

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Barry Levine" <themacguy at macosx.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 09, 2002 4:22 PM
Subject: Card size changing - problem identified (maybe)


> Looks like the problem I posted a little while ago about a new card
> being taller than the first card (as it was spec'd in the stack - 22
> pixels, it turned out) was caused by checking the "Menu Bar Group"
> checkbox. When I unchecked it, the problem went away. Probably will
> need to review when the proper time is (during the development process)
> to create the menubar, etc.
>
> Any pointers (or pointers to existing documents) will be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
> Barry
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Sat Nov  9 19:30:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Sat Nov  9 19:30:01 2002
Subject: sending email
In-Reply-To: <3dcd46af.111e.1804289383@unitz.ca>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHKEBMCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Heres the script that I use to abstract from the libSMTP API. Watch for
wrapping:

on sendmail pText, pAttachment, pTo, pFrom, pSubject, pSMTP
  put url "http://www.google.com/" into tHome
  if tHome is "" then
    answer error "Could not contact server! Please check your internet
connection and try again." titled "Could not contact server."
    exit to top
  end if
  libSMTP_initialize
  libSMTP_serverInfo pSMTP
  libSMTP_mailFrom item 1 of pFrom , item 2 of pFrom
  repeat for each line strRecipientListLine in pTo
    if the number of items of pTo > 1 then
      libSMTP_recipient item 1 of strRecipientListLine, item 2 of
strRecipientListLine
    else
      libSMTP_recipient item 1 of strRecipientListLine
    end if
  end repeat
  repeat for each line strAttachmentListLine in pAttachment
    libSMTP_attachment strAttachmentListLine
  end repeat
  libSMTP_messageSubject pSubject
  libSMTP_messageBodyText pText
  libSMTP_mailerInfo "Revolution SMTP Socket v1.0.0 (2002.05.27.2)"
  put libSMTP_send() into tSuccess
  if tSuccess <> "" then
	answer error tSuccess
  end if
end sendmail

Cheers Monte



From Jimw1956 at cs.com  Sat Nov  9 21:43:00 2002
From: Jimw1956 at cs.com (Jimw1956 at cs.com)
Date: Sat Nov  9 21:43:00 2002
Subject: How do I make standalone database save it's data?
Message-ID: <8d.20de18b7.2aff202a@cs.com>

I am new to Revolution.  I managed to create a simple database application to 
keep a database of videotapes at a local tv station where I work.  Everything 
works just like I want except for one small detail...I can't figure out how 
to save the updated data that I've added to the database when it closes.

I'm from a novice hypercard background, and I'm used to Hypercard 
automatically saving changes as they are made, and just assumed Revolution 
would do the same thing. After researching the documentation, I found the 
part that says that a standalone cannot save changes to itself, and that the 
data should be in a seperate stack or file. Unfortunately, I can't figure out 
how to do this from the documentation.

I wrote a script into the stack that comes up when the window is closed and 
ask if you want to save the changes, I just can't figure out how to actually 
save the changes so that when the application is run again, the changes will 
be there.

Any help, or locations of tutorials that would help me understand this would 
be greatly appreciated.
By the way, the stack and standalone was built in Mac OS-X using the trial 
version.

Thanks,
Jim Williams


From switchedon at hsj.com  Sat Nov  9 22:23:01 2002
From: switchedon at hsj.com (Bill Lynn)
Date: Sat Nov  9 22:23:01 2002
Subject: Hide A File From A Script
In-Reply-To: <200211092139.QAA18987@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <B9F339E2.1412%switchedon@hsj.com>

I'm looking for a way to hide a text file on disk from a script. Can this be
done using Transcript? If not, is it possible to do with AppleScript?

Cheers... Bill Lynn



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sat Nov  9 22:39:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sat Nov  9 22:39:01 2002
Subject: Hide A File From A Script
References: <B9F339E2.1412%switchedon@hsj.com>
Message-ID: <012401c28869$22593350$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Bill,

Are we talking OS X, OS 9 or both?

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Lynn" <switchedon at hsj.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 09, 2002 9:17 PM
Subject: Hide A File From A Script


> I'm looking for a way to hide a text file on disk from a script. Can this
be
> done using Transcript? If not, is it possible to do with AppleScript?
>
> Cheers... Bill Lynn
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From dan at danshafer.com  Sun Nov 10 00:58:01 2002
From: dan at danshafer.com (Dan Shafer)
Date: Sun Nov 10 00:58:01 2002
Subject: XML-RPC Support?
Message-ID: <C1DD727E-F470-11D6-978F-00306549AFD4@danshafer.com>

Has anyone developed any libraries or tools for doing XML-RPC from RR?



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sun Nov 10 05:03:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sun Nov 10 05:03:01 2002
Subject: How do I make standalone database save it's data?
In-Reply-To: <8d.20de18b7.2aff202a@cs.com>
Message-ID: <20021110095658.15271.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Jimw1956 at cs.com wrote:
> I am new to Revolution.  I managed to create a
> simple database application to 
> keep a database of videotapes at a local tv station
> where I work.  Everything 
> works just like I want except for one small
> detail...I can't figure out how 
> to save the updated data that I've added to the
> database when it closes.
> 
> I'm from a novice hypercard background, and I'm used
> to Hypercard 
> automatically saving changes as they are made, and
> just assumed Revolution 
> would do the same thing. After researching the
> documentation, I found the 
> part that says that a standalone cannot save changes
> to itself, and that the 
> data should be in a seperate stack or file.
> Unfortunately, I can't figure out 
> how to do this from the documentation.
> 
> I wrote a script into the stack that comes up when
> the window is closed and 
> ask if you want to save the changes, I just can't
> figure out how to actually 
> save the changes so that when the application is run
> again, the changes will 
> be there.
> 
> Any help, or locations of tutorials that would help
> me understand this would 
> be greatly appreciated.
> By the way, the stack and standalone was built in
> Mac OS-X using the trial 
> version.
> 
> Thanks,
> Jim Williams
>

Hi Jim,

And welcome on board of the Revolution fleet :-)

Steer the transcript documentation to the 'save'
command and check out its definition.

You should note that at the bottom, there's a tiny
disclaimer that you cannot save data into a
stand-alone stack.

What this means is that when building your stand-alone
application, you will have to put the substacks in a
separate folder.

So basically, you can't write 'self-modifying'
executables ; your data stacks will have to remain
separate.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sun Nov 10 05:07:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sun Nov 10 05:07:01 2002
Subject: XML-RPC Support?
In-Reply-To: <C1DD727E-F470-11D6-978F-00306549AFD4@danshafer.com>
Message-ID: <20021110100100.15681.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Dan Shafer <dan at danshafer.com> wrote:
> Has anyone developed any libraries or tools for
> doing XML-RPC from RR?
> 

Hi Dan,

RunRev 2.0 sports a great SOAP-toolbox, if that's what
you're looking for. [Thanks for that gem, Dave]
If it's a different protocol, I'm sure it's not too
hard to build, and with the right specs could be setup
in a matter of weeks.
As I'm working on something in that field, I'd be
happy to exchange information off-list.

Best regards,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2


From DVGlasgow at aol.com  Sun Nov 10 07:30:01 2002
From: DVGlasgow at aol.com (DVGlasgow at aol.com)
Date: Sun Nov 10 07:30:01 2002
Subject: Constraining the pointer within a group
Message-ID: <118.1a7c8df3.2affa8e3@aol.com>

I have been working on assessment tools for people with learning 
disabilities.  Sometimes they also have motor skills problems.  

I ask them to rate something using a scale made up of adjacent buttons which 
behave like radio buttons, but offers a bigger target.  Sometimes the act of 
clicking by users nudges the pointer off the button group so the mouseup is 
not registered.  Since I am timing responses, this is a real pain, to say 
nothing of the frustration caused to the user.

I am thinking of trying to constrain the pointer so it cannot move out of the 
rating scale area until a rating has been made.  Before I start to 
experiment, has anyone any suggestions or advice?

Thanks


Best wishes,

David Glasgow
Home/ forensic assessments --> <A HREF="http://members.aol.com/dvglasgow/">
DVGlasgow </A>
Courses --> <A HREF="http://www.i-Psych.co.uk">i-Psych</A>


From gary.rathbone at btclick.com  Sun Nov 10 07:54:01 2002
From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone)
Date: Sun Nov 10 07:54:01 2002
Subject: Constraining the pointer within a group
In-Reply-To: <118.1a7c8df3.2affa8e3@aol.com>
Message-ID: <IDELJJOBILDEKAEHEILGGEHNCGAA.gary.rathbone@btclick.com>

I've had a similar problem with 'Adult returners', who, in the act of
clicking, moved the mouse outside the boundary of the button. Depending on
the layout of the screen constraining the mouse might not solve the problem
as the 'mousedown' may be in one button area and the 'mouseup' (after
moving) occur in another.

For our 'tests' we scripted the buttons to respond on a 'Mousedown'? This
means any movement after the 'click' is irrelevant.

Hope this helped.

Regards

Gary Rathbone BSc MBCS
Chartered Information Systems Practitioner

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----

I have been working on assessment tools for people with learning
disabilities.  Sometimes they also have motor skills problems.

I ask them to rate something using a scale made up of adjacent buttons which
behave like radio buttons, but offers a bigger target.  Sometimes the act of
clicking by users nudges the pointer off the button group so the mouseup is
not registered.  Since I am timing responses, this is a real pain, to say
nothing of the frustration caused to the user.

I am thinking of trying to constrain the pointer so it cannot move out of
the
rating scale area until a rating has been made.  Before I start to
experiment, has anyone any suggestions or advice?

Thanks


Best wishes,

David Glasgow
Home/ forensic assessments --> <A HREF="http://members.aol.com/dvglasgow/">
DVGlasgow </A>
Courses --> <A HREF="http://www.i-Psych.co.uk">i-Psych</A>
_______________________________________________
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution




From Jimw1956 at cs.com  Sun Nov 10 09:45:00 2002
From: Jimw1956 at cs.com (Jimw1956 at cs.com)
Date: Sun Nov 10 09:45:00 2002
Subject: How do I make standalone database save it's data?
Message-ID: <c9.2b6fc51b.2affc8b0@cs.com>

In a message dated 11/10/02 3:58:03 AM, janschenkel at yahoo.com writes:

<< What this means is that when building your stand-alone
application, you will have to put the substacks in a
separate folder.

So basically, you can't write 'self-modifying'
executables ; your data stacks will have to remain
separate. >>

Thanks..and yes I did read that section and that small (but troublesome) 
disclaimer line.
Basically my whole app is written as a main stack.  I tried writing another 
small app to just "call" the main stack, which I moved into the small app as 
a substack, compiled and saved to seperate stacks as you mentioned, but that 
did not work either. I have a few experiments to try though, which might make 
that work.

Thanks for the welcome, and the suggestion.


From themacguy at macosx.com  Sun Nov 10 10:52:00 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Sun Nov 10 10:52:00 2002
Subject: Player Object problem
Message-ID: <4EC1A39C-F4C3-11D6-8E0C-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

I have a few Player Objects in my stack that contain QT movies. I have 
no problem triggering the playing of the movies at the appropriate 
times. However, I do have a problem getting the movies to maintain the 
display of their last frames or even to set them to the last frames via 
Transcript. This occurs when I leave the current card, move to another, 
and then return. The movie's currentTime resets to 0. Okay, I can 
understand that might happen so I'll add some code to my stack script. 
Here is my code:

on doThis
	go next card
	-- (then do something there)
	go prev card
	-- (now we're back on the card where the movie is)
	set the currentTime of player "player1" to the duration of player 
"player1"
end doThis

The problem is that the currentTime remains at 0 when I test this using 
the messageBox.

However, if I add a button (named "setMaxDuration") on the card with 
the code:

on mouseUp
	set the currentTime of player "player1" to the duration of player 
"player1
end mouseUp

...that works! So I have to change my stack code to:

on doThis
	go next card
	-- (then do something there)
	go prev card
	-- (now we're back on the card where the movie is)
	send mouseUp to button "setMaxDuration"
end doThis

Have I found a bug (or found one that has already been identified 
months ago)? The bootm line is that I'd like to have the card remain 
exactly as I left it when I return to it. It seems that the player 
objects do not have persistency. Am I not setting the various options 
correctly?

BTW - The lista who recommended setting the UI to Mac (away from 
Appearance Manager) if running in Jaguar was quite correct. Rev 1.1.1 
has stopped crashing as long as I set this properly immediately upon 
launch.

Thanks,
Barry



From dwilk at bradfork.co.uk  Sun Nov 10 11:38:01 2002
From: dwilk at bradfork.co.uk (David Wilkinson)
Date: Sun Nov 10 11:38:01 2002
Subject: RTF Reader in Rev
In-Reply-To: <200211091701.MAA11003@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211091701.MAA11003@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <E18AdQ2-0008TN-00@iffley.bradcomp.co.uk>

Roger

Just a suggestion:

There is an excellent  open source Word compatible WP - Abiword 
(http:\\www.abisource.com)  - reads, writes and prints Word Docs  
runs on 
GNU/Linux, BSD, Solaris (2.6, 7,8,9), AIX, HP/UX (10.20, 11.0), 
OSF/1, Tru64, Mac OS X,QNX,BeOS oh and I nearly forgot Windows.

Perhaps Word will not be the de facto corporate standard for ever? 
Especially, since the file format does not remain the same!



On Saturday 09 November 2002 5:01 pm,  Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com 
wrote:
>
> That sounds great, but let's take it a step further. Where I work,
> MS-Word (.doc) is a corporate standard for memos, etc. sent via
> e-mail. We also have several unix (not linux) based machines that
> people use. They have to get PC/Mac users to print these memos
> because there are no decent MS-word viewers available for *nix
> machines. Rev could change this. How about adding a new docText
> property as well? This has been a *nix desired functionality for
> soooo long.


From themacguy at elp.rr.com  Sun Nov 10 11:38:10 2002
From: themacguy at elp.rr.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Sun Nov 10 11:38:10 2002
Subject: Player Object problem
Message-ID: <DA2AFA78-F46B-11D6-9D10-000393AAEF66@elp.rr.com>

I have a few Player Objects in my stack that contain QT movies. I have 
no problem triggering the playing of the movies at the appropriate 
times. However, I do have a problem getting the movies to maintain the 
display of their last frames or even to set them to the last frames via 
Transcript. This occurs when I leave the current card, move to another, 
and then return. The movie's currentTime resets to 0. Okay, I can 
understand that might happen so I'll add some code to my stack script. 
Here is my code:

on doThis
	go next card
	-- (then do something there)
	go prev card
	-- (now we're back on the card where the movie is)
	set the currentTime of player "player1" to the duration of player 
"player1"
end doThis

The problem is that the currentTime remains at 0 when I test this using 
the messageBox.

However, if I add a button (named "setMaxDuration") on the card with 
the code:

on mouseUp
	set the currentTime of player "player1" to the duration of player 
"player1
end mouseUp

...that works! So I have to change my stack code to:

on doThis
	go next card
	-- (then do something there)
	go prev card
	-- (now we're back on the card where the movie is)
	send mouseUp to button "setMaxDuration"
end doThis

Have I found a bug (or found one that has already been identified 
months ago)? The bootm line is that I'd like to have the card remain 
exactly as I left it when I return to it. It seems that the player 
objects do not have persistency. Am I not setting the various options 
correctly?

BTW - The lista who recommended setting the UI to Mac (away from 
Appearance Manager) if running in Jaguar was quite correct. Rev 1.1.1 
has stopped crashing as long as I set this properly immediately upon 
launch.

Thanks,
Barry



From mdswindell at charter.net  Sun Nov 10 12:07:00 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Sun Nov 10 12:07:00 2002
Subject: How do I make standalone database save it's data?
In-Reply-To: <c9.2b6fc51b.2affc8b0@cs.com>
Message-ID: <B9F3D08D.3527%mdswindell@charter.net>

on 11/10/02 6:35 AM, Jimw1956 at cs.com at Jimw1956 at cs.com wrote:

> Thanks..and yes I did read that section and that small (but troublesome)
> disclaimer line.
> Basically my whole app is written as a main stack.  I tried writing another
> small app to just "call" the main stack, which I moved into the small app as
> a substack, compiled and saved to seperate stacks as you mentioned, but that
> did not work either. I have a few experiments to try though, which might make
> that work.
> 
> Thanks for the welcome, and the suggestion.

In a similar situation I had (also new to Revolution) Tech support suggested
to me that I simply  make my main stack the splash screen.  Perhaps that
will work for you, as well.

Mark



From switchedon at hsj.com  Sun Nov 10 12:31:01 2002
From: switchedon at hsj.com (Bill Lynn)
Date: Sun Nov 10 12:31:01 2002
Subject: Hide A File From A Script
In-Reply-To: <200211101639.LAA07842@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <B9F40089.143E%switchedon@hsj.com>

>> I'm looking for a way to hide a text file on disk from a script. Can this be
>> done using Transcript? If not, is it possible to do with AppleScript?

> Are we talking OS X, OS 9 or both?

Good point, Ken. Both.

Cheers... Bill Lynn





From rpresender at earthlink.net  Sun Nov 10 13:17:01 2002
From: rpresender at earthlink.net (Robert Presender)
Date: Sun Nov 10 13:17:01 2002
Subject: Menu problem
In-Reply-To: <200211101639.LAA07828@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <9A7FA234-F4D7-11D6-86BE-000393A19046@earthlink.net>

On Sunday, November 10, 2002, at 08:39  AM, Richard Gaskin wrote:

> Robert Presender wrote:
>
>> I have a menubar with several btn menus as pulldown:  one of the menus
>> has several items:
>> New
>> Trans
>> -
>> Sort
>> -
>>
>> I would like to have the Sort item to be cascading(?)
>
> Put this in your menu button contents:
>
> New
> Trans
> -
> Sort
> <tab>by Date
> <tab>by Event
>

Richard .. thank you for your input.  Your suggestion worked but I 
couldn't get it to look like a cascade of Sort.

Since asking for help, I continued (again early this AM) to experiment 
(couldn't find any documentation on how to use the manager) with Menu 
Manager.  I finally was able to get the results I wanted.

The key was a click on the icon (make the selected menu item into a 
submenu item) after entering a new item name after Sort.   Sort then 
looked like a cascade.

Thanks again for your suggestion.

Regards ...  Bob



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sun Nov 10 14:31:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sun Nov 10 14:31:01 2002
Subject: Constraining the pointer within a group
References: <IDELJJOBILDEKAEHEILGGEHNCGAA.gary.rathbone@btclick.com>
Message-ID: <014601c288ee$261f88b0$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

The other possibility is that you'll get a mouseRelease when the mouse comes
up outside the hit area of the button. You could check the location of the
mouse at that time, and if it's within a few pixels of the original target,
you could run your "hit" code anyway..

Just my $0.03*,

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

* $0.02 adjusted for inflation ;-)

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Rathbone" <gary.rathbone at btclick.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2002 6:45 AM
Subject: RE: Constraining the pointer within a group


> I've had a similar problem with 'Adult returners', who, in the act of
> clicking, moved the mouse outside the boundary of the button. Depending on
> the layout of the screen constraining the mouse might not solve the
problem
> as the 'mousedown' may be in one button area and the 'mouseup' (after
> moving) occur in another.
>
> For our 'tests' we scripted the buttons to respond on a 'Mousedown'? This
> means any movement after the 'click' is irrelevant.
>
> Hope this helped.
>
> Regards
>
> Gary Rathbone BSc MBCS
> Chartered Information Systems Practitioner
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
> -----
>
> I have been working on assessment tools for people with learning
> disabilities.  Sometimes they also have motor skills problems.
>
> I ask them to rate something using a scale made up of adjacent buttons
which
> behave like radio buttons, but offers a bigger target.  Sometimes the act
of
> clicking by users nudges the pointer off the button group so the mouseup
is
> not registered.  Since I am timing responses, this is a real pain, to say
> nothing of the frustration caused to the user.
>
> I am thinking of trying to constrain the pointer so it cannot move out of
> the
> rating scale area until a rating has been made.  Before I start to
> experiment, has anyone any suggestions or advice?
>
> Thanks
>
>
> Best wishes,
>
> David Glasgow
> Home/ forensic assessments --> <A
HREF="http://members.aol.com/dvglasgow/">
> DVGlasgow </A>
> Courses --> <A HREF="http://www.i-Psych.co.uk">i-Psych</A>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sun Nov 10 14:35:00 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sun Nov 10 14:35:00 2002
Subject: Player Object problem
References: <DA2AFA78-F46B-11D6-9D10-000393AAEF66@elp.rr.com>
Message-ID: <015901c288ee$af694160$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

The Player object is a little finicky because it is Quicktime that is
managing it (for the most part), not Rev. I have found that if you use
"send" to allow the current handler to finish, you get better results.
You've done this yourself with a button and a mouseUp handler, but you could
do the same thing this way:

  send "ResetTime" to this card in 10 milliseconds
  -- gives time for the "doThis" handler to complete

  on ResetTime
    set the currentTime of player "player1" to the duration of player
"player1"
  end ResetTime

> BTW - The lista who recommended setting the UI to Mac (away from
> Appearance Manager) if running in Jaguar was quite correct. Rev 1.1.1
> has stopped crashing as long as I set this properly immediately upon
> launch.

You won't have to do this with Rev 2.0, BTW, so I suggest you upgrade as
soon as it's available. :-)

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/d



From freakyphoenix at hotmail.com  Sun Nov 10 14:36:01 2002
From: freakyphoenix at hotmail.com (FreakyPhoenix >)
Date: Sun Nov 10 14:36:01 2002
Subject: Sockets
Message-ID: <F163Y0Bqhk6KR8Cp2Yp00001492@hotmail.com>

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From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sun Nov 10 14:41:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sun Nov 10 14:41:01 2002
Subject: Hide A File From A Script
References: <B9F40089.143E%switchedon@hsj.com>
Message-ID: <016201c288ef$86012b20$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

You can hide a file on disk in OS X by putting a "." in front of the file
name:

on HideAFile pFilePath
  put pFilePath into tDestPath
  set the itemDel to "/"
  put last item of pFilePath into tFileName
  put "." & tFileName into last item of tDestPath
  rename pFilePath to tDestPath
end HideAFile

In OS 9, you need to set the "invisible bit", which I think would require an
external.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Lynn" <switchedon at hsj.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2002 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: Hide A File From A Script


> >> I'm looking for a way to hide a text file on disk from a script. Can
this be
> >> done using Transcript? If not, is it possible to do with AppleScript?
>
> > Are we talking OS X, OS 9 or both?
>
> Good point, Ken. Both.
>
> Cheers... Bill Lynn
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From gary.rathbone at btclick.com  Sun Nov 10 14:54:01 2002
From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone)
Date: Sun Nov 10 14:54:01 2002
Subject: Sockets
In-Reply-To: <F163Y0Bqhk6KR8Cp2Yp00001492@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <IDELJJOBILDEKAEHEILGOEHPCGAA.gary.rathbone@btclick.com>

Perhaps a slightly different slant but I beleive the IP address of any
computer is 127.0.0.1 as well as the given IP number (either statically or
dynamically assigned). This is what I use in development (for Rev,
Dreamweaver, IIS etc) and it works fine.

I guess it depends on what your trying to do, if you can expand a little
then more suggestions may be offered. Personally, I use multiple Rev stacks
on the same IP number but different HTTP ports. This works fine for what I
want to do.

eg Rev (server) loads a web page to Explorer (client) on 127.0.0.1:8181 and
reply is then captured by Rev listening on this port. In this case there's
no reason why the client can't be Rev.

Regards

Gary Rathbone BSc MBCS
Chartered Information Systems Practitioner


-----Original Message-----
From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
[mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of FreakyPhoenix >
Sent: 10 November 2002 19:30
To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
Subject: Re: Sockets


I don't believe that is possible. Your computer just won't find your own IP.

FreakyPhoenix


>From: Manolo Garrido
>Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>To:
>Subject: Sockets
>Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 17:01:00 +0100
>
>
>Does anyone knows if it's possible to develop a synchronous TCP/IP
>communication with Revolution that works when client and server
applications
>runs on a single machine over a Mac OS 9?
>
>Thanks
>Manuel
>
>_______________________________________________
>use-revolution mailing list
>use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



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From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sun Nov 10 14:56:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sun Nov 10 14:56:01 2002
Subject: Sockets
References: <F163Y0Bqhk6KR8Cp2Yp00001492@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <018401c288f1$921c4fa0$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Actually, Freaky, but there are a number of ways you can get it - I have
some examples that get the MAC address at my site for OS 9, X and Win32, but
you can adjust them slightly to get the IP address of the current machine.
You can see it at:

  http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_env001

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "FreakyPhoenix >" <freakyphoenix at hotmail.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2002 1:29 PM
Subject: Re: Sockets


> I don't believe that is possible. Your computer just won't find your own
IP.
>
>
>
> FreakyPhoenix
>
>
>
> >From: Manolo Garrido
> >Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> >To:
> >Subject: Sockets
> >Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 17:01:00 +0100
> >
> >
> >Does anyone knows if it's possible to develop a synchronous TCP/IP
> >communication with Revolution that works when client and server
applications
> >runs on a single machine over a Mac OS 9?
> >
> >Thanks
> >Manuel
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >use-revolution mailing list
> >use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> >http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
------
> MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.
_______________________________________________ use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From andre.rombauts at win.be  Sun Nov 10 17:10:01 2002
From: andre.rombauts at win.be (Andre Rombauts)
Date: Sun Nov 10 17:10:01 2002
Subject: Global /local variables
Message-ID: <B9F495BE.8CC4%andre.rombauts@win.be>

I do not understand the real meaning of global and local variables in
Revolution... The info about declaring variables outside a handler seems to
be equal in both cases... :-(


From andre.rombauts at win.be  Sun Nov 10 17:16:01 2002
From: andre.rombauts at win.be (Andre Rombauts)
Date: Sun Nov 10 17:16:01 2002
Subject: URL lib
Message-ID: <B9F49700.8CCB%andre.rombauts@win.be>

When using a command such as:

delete URL "ftp://me:mine at ftp.example.net/trash/"

Can a user ?read? the username and password inside the standalone file?...

Andr?
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From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Sun Nov 10 17:29:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Sun Nov 10 17:29:01 2002
Subject: URL lib
In-Reply-To: <B9F49700.8CCB%andre.rombauts@win.be>
Message-ID: <B9F41C15.1FB03%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Andre Rombauts wrote:

> When using a command such as:
> 
> delete URL "ftp://me:mine at ftp.example.net/trash/"
> 
> Can a user ?read? the username and password inside the standalone file?...

Not if you password-protect your script.

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Sun Nov 10 17:41:07 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Sun Nov 10 17:41:07 2002
Subject: Building "serious" scientific applications with RunRev...
In-Reply-To: <a05111a2eb9f1723340d4@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <7ACEC0C4-F4FC-11D6-8E26-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

I have developed applications to communicate with various scientific 
instruments and chart the results. As someone mentioned, the speed of 
execution may be slightly reduced, but the speed of development and 
ease of modification makes a very powerful argument for Revolution. I 
have been in the circumstance of needing to change control algorithms 
in the middle of an experiment and being able to edit the relevant 
stack and have the new algorithm running within minutes, without even 
shutting down the program.

Ken Ray's web site has some interesting tips on manipulating image data 
and there is a good demonstration of using Charts in the User 
Contributions area of the Rev web site. For manipulating matrices etc, 
while the code may turn out longer than it's C equivalents, I would bet 
that it would be much easier to read & debug.

Cheers,
Sarah


On Friday, November 8, 2002, at 11:52  pm, Peter Lundh wrote:

> Hi all-
>
> This autumn I started my PhD on Colour Imaging Science at the Derby
> University, UK. A requirement at the institute is knowledge of MatLab 
> and
> "C" - MatLab for modeling and C for compiling applications. MatLab I 
> know,
> so that's ok - but now I have to learn "C" on top of all the other 
> things I
> have to do.
>
> So my question is the following: Could Revolution (since I'm already
> familiar with it and like it!) be a substitute for "C" when developing
> scientific applications? Typical needs would be the ability to read,
> manipulate, display and output different types of image data, 
> Possibility to
> compute Matrix, Fourier and Polynomial algorithms etc.
>
> I'm also curious to know if any other list members have developed 
> scientific
> applications with RunRev, and in particular - since it's in my line of
> interest - Imaging, Psychophysical, or Colour related applications.
>
> -Peter
> -- 
> Peter Lundh
> E: simran at teleline.es
> UK
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Sun Nov 10 17:45:00 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Sun Nov 10 17:45:00 2002
Subject: Global /local variables
In-Reply-To: <a05111a2fb9f488fa97b3@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <21C45BA7-F4FD-11D6-8E26-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

Imagine you have a button, and in it's script you have several 
handlers: mouseUp, processData, doMoreStuff etc. If you put a local 
variable in the button's script but OUTSIDE any of the handlers - say 
on the first line - then all of these handlers can access the data 
stored in that variable. However no other scripts e.g. card script, 
stack script, another button's script - can access that variable. If 
they declare a local variable even using the same variable name, it 
will refer to a new variable.

If instead of "local", you declared that variable as "global", then any 
handler in any script could access it, either by declaring it inside 
the handler or in the script but outside the handler.

Cheers,
Sarah



On Monday, November 11, 2002, at 08:06  am, Andre Rombauts wrote:

> I do not understand the real meaning of global and local variables in
> Revolution... The info about declaring variables outside a handler 
> seems to
> be equal in both cases... :-(
>
>> From the ?local? entry in Revolution Help system:
>> You can also use the local command in a script, outside any handlers 
>> in the
> script. These local variables can be used by any handler in that 
> script, without
> needing to be declared in the handler itself, and their values are 
> maintained
> from handler to handler
>
>> From the ?global? entry in Revolution Help system:
>
>> You can also place a global command in a script, but outside any 
>> handlers in
> the script. These globals can be used by any handler in that script, 
> without
> needing to be declared in the handler itself.
>
> Andr?
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sun Nov 10 17:56:00 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sun Nov 10 17:56:00 2002
Subject: Global /local variables
References: <B9F495BE.8CC4%andre.rombauts@win.be>
Message-ID: <001801c2890a$c1e4c9b0$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Andre,

For global commands, you have two choices: Inside handlers or outside. If
you declare a global inside of a handler, each handler that wants to access
that global needs to declare that same variable to get "access" to it. For
example:

on DoStuff1
  global gVar
  put 10 into gVar
end DoStuff 1

on DoStuff2
  put gVar
end DoStuff2

-- > Puts nothing, since DoStuff2 doesn't know about gVar. If the handler
was:

on DoStuff2
  global gVar
  put gVar
end DoStuf2

-- > Puts "10" since it "knows" about gVar by declaring "global gVar"

However, if you put it *outside* handlers in the script, all handlers
already "know" about the global, so you could do this:

global gVar

on DoStuff1
  put 10 into gVar
end DoStuff1

on DoStuff2
  put gVar
end DoStuff 2

-- > Puts "10".

Since global variables are "global", you can access that same gVar variable
in another script entirely through one of the two methods above. So if in
another script you had:

on DoStuff3
  global gVar
  put gVar
end DoStuff3

-- Puts "10".

Locals are the same as globals, except that they cannot have a scope outside
of a single script. If you declare them inside of a handler, they apply only
to that handler. If you declare them inside of a script, they are available
to any handler in that script only. Other scripts don't "see" them.

Hope this helps,

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/


----- Original Message -----
From: "Andre Rombauts" <andre.rombauts at win.be>
To: "revolution" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2002 4:01 PM
Subject: Global /local variables


> I do not understand the real meaning of global and local variables in
> Revolution... The info about declaring variables outside a handler seems
to
> be equal in both cases... :-(
>
> >From the Olocal? entry in Revolution Help system:
> >You can also use the local command in a script, outside any handlers in
the
> script. These local variables can be used by any handler in that script,
without
> needing to be declared in the handler itself, and their values are
maintained
> from handler to handler
>
> >From the Oglobal? entry in Revolution Help system:
>
> >You can also place a global command in a script, but outside any handlers
in
> the script. These globals can be used by any handler in that script,
without
> needing to be declared in the handler itself.
>
> Andr?
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From switchedon at hsj.com  Sun Nov 10 19:08:06 2002
From: switchedon at hsj.com (Bill Lynn)
Date: Sun Nov 10 19:08:06 2002
Subject: Hiding A File From A Script
In-Reply-To: <200211102246.RAA18468@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <B9F45D7F.145C%switchedon@hsj.com>

> You can hide a file on disk in OS X by putting a "." in front of the file
> name:

Thanks, Ken.

Cheers... Bill Lynn





From kkaufman at snet.net  Sun Nov 10 20:39:01 2002
From: kkaufman at snet.net (Kurt Kaufman)
Date: Sun Nov 10 20:39:01 2002
Subject: Edit "on-the-fly"
Message-ID: <6B3FE666-F515-11D6-8AE8-0003936D1F12@snet.net>

Sarah wrote:
"...I have been in the circumstance of needing to change control 
algorithms
in the middle of an experiment and being able to edit the relevant
stack and have the new algorithm running within minutes, without even
shutting down the program..."

That's pretty amazing, when you think about it (well, when I think 
about it, anyway). I wonder if there are any currently maintained 
programming tools other than MC/RR and SC that are capable of this.

-KK



From Jimw1956 at cs.com  Sun Nov 10 21:20:01 2002
From: Jimw1956 at cs.com (Jimw1956 at cs.com)
Date: Sun Nov 10 21:20:01 2002
Subject: How do I make standalone database save it's data?
Message-ID: <64.28029857.2b006b99@cs.com>

In a message dated 11/10/02 11:02:13 AM, mdswindell at charter.net writes:

<< n a similar situation I had (also new to Revolution) Tech support suggested
to me that I simply  make my main stack the splash screen.  Perhaps that
will work for you, as well.
 >>

Ahhhh...that is exactly what I did and it did work, after I fixed an 
incorrect stack reference in my save code. Thanks again.


From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Mon Nov 11 02:37:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Mon Nov 11 02:37:01 2002
Subject: complex text manipulation
Message-ID: <p05100300b9f50b6e8748@[10.0.1.202]>

Hi,


I have a text fld named "src".
the locktext is false

in a script I'd like to do

1) find a line with a text
put lineOffset("myString",fld "src") into tLine
if tLine <> "0" then
set the textStyle of line tLine of fld "src" to "link"
end if



2) now I'd like to click on this line to show a picture in another 
stack as modal

so the script of the fld should be something like :

on mouseDown
if the textStyle of the clickLine is "link" then
    if the value of the clickLine is "my last holliday" then
       go to cd x of stack "anotherStack" as modal
    end if
end if
end mouseDown


Now, the fld "src" must have his locktext turned to false

Is it possible ?
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From mgarrido at techno-design.com  Mon Nov 11 03:37:01 2002
From: mgarrido at techno-design.com (Manolo Garrido)
Date: Mon Nov 11 03:37:01 2002
Subject: Sockets
In-Reply-To: <F163Y0Bqhk6KR8Cp2Yp00001492@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: <B9F52690.10F3%mgarrido@techno-design.com>

It is possible with AppleScript, so why  shouldn't it with Revolution??

on 11/10/02 20:29, FreakyPhoenix > at freakyphoenix at hotmail.com wrote:

I don't believe that is possible. Your computer just won't find your own IP.



FreakyPhoenix

>From: Manolo Garrido
>Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>To: 
>Subject: Sockets 
>Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 17:01:00 +0100
> 
> 
>Does anyone knows if it's possible to develop a synchronous TCP/IP
>communication with Revolution that works when client and server applications
>runs on a single machine over a Mac OS 9?
> 
>Thanks 
>Manuel 
> 
>_______________________________________________
>use-revolution mailing list
>use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution




MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES.  <http://g.msn.com/8HMCEN/2020>  Get 2
months FREE*. _______________________________________________ use-revolution
mailing list use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
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From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Mon Nov 11 03:55:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Mon Nov 11 03:55:01 2002
Subject: complex text manipulation
In-Reply-To: <p05100300b9f50b6e8748@[10.0.1.202]>
Message-ID: <20021111084904.21470.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>

--- yves COPPE <yvescoppe at skynet.be> wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I have a text fld named "src".
> the locktext is false
> 
> in a script I'd like to do
> 
> 1) find a line with a text
> put lineOffset("myString",fld "src") into tLine
> if tLine <> "0" then
> set the textStyle of line tLine of fld "src" to
> "link"
> end if
> 
> 2) now I'd like to click on this line to show a
> picture in another 
> stack as modal
> 
> so the script of the fld should be something like :
> 
> on mouseDown
> if the textStyle of the clickLine is "link" then
>     if the value of the clickLine is "my last
> holliday" then
>        go to cd x of stack "anotherStack" as modal
>     end if
> end if
> end mouseDown
> 
> 
> Now, the fld "src" must have his locktext turned to
> false
> 
> Is it possible ?
> -- 
> Greetings.
> 
> Yves COPPE
> 

Hi Yves,

Actually, you're almost there, though I'd do a few
things just a tad differently:

- make a button "Link" with script
on mouseUp
  -- get the text to link
  ask "Find what text to link?"
  if it is empty then exit mouseUp
  put lineOffset(it, fld "src") into tLine
  if tLine = 0 then exit mouseUp
  -- get the card to link to
  ask "To which card should this line be linked?"
  if it is empty then exit mouseUp
  put it into tLink
  -- link to the card
  set the linkText of line tLine of fld "src" to tLink
  -- now update the textStyle
  get the textStyle of line tLine of fld "src"
  switch
  case "link" is amongst the items of it
    exit mouseUp
  case it is "plain"
    set the textStyle of line tLine of fld "src" \
      to "link"
    break
  default
    set the textStyle of line tLine of fld "src" to \
    it & ",link"
    break
  end switch
end mouseUp

- have a button to lock/unlock the field
on mouseUp
  set the lockText of fld "src" to not the lockText \
    of fld "src"
end mouseUp

- set the script of the field to
on linkClicked pWhichLink
  -- pWhichLink is the linkText of the clickedChunk
  go cd pWhichLink of stack "anotherStack" as modal
end linkClicked

This should make it easier to edit/maintain the links
to the cards in the other stack.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2


From jiml at netrin.com  Mon Nov 11 04:20:01 2002
From: jiml at netrin.com (Jim Lambert)
Date: Mon Nov 11 04:20:01 2002
Subject: Sockets
In-Reply-To: <200211102246.RAA18468@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <NEBBICMMKLOIPMPOLALAAEAJEFAA.jiml@netrin.com>

The script Ken Ray posted on his site to Get MAC Address is excellent.
One note though, on my Win98 SE machine the function returned nothing
because

get matchText(temp,"Physical Address. . . . . . . . . :
([A-Z0-9-]*)",retVal)

doesn't find "Physical Address. . . . . . . . . :"

The data returned by IPCONFIG.EXE shows "Physical Address. . . . . . :"
So, removing 3 periods:

get matchText(temp,"Physical Address. . . . . . : ([A-Z0-9-]*)",retVal)

does work.

Perhaps the format of information returned by IPCONFIG.EXE varies by Windows
version (a very Microsofty possibility!) If this is so, someone more adept
at Regular Expressions than I might want to post a matchtext parameter that
finds "Physical Address" + any number of periods + colon.

Jim Lambert



From igor at pixelmedia.com.au  Mon Nov 11 04:20:10 2002
From: igor at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor Couto)
Date: Mon Nov 11 04:20:10 2002
Subject: Newbie Questions!
Message-ID: <5D895724-F516-11D6-A543-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Hail, Oh Revolution Masters!

I am afraid I am a Revolution newbie, and as such, will ask questions 
that may annoy the more experienced users in the list. Nevertheless, 
after furiously jumping from one place to another in the documentation, 
I decided that it might be a better use of my time if I asked for some 
help and guidance from the experts! After all, I believe the tasks I'm 
trying to perform are quite mundane, and therefore I assume that it is 
just due to my ignorance and unfamiliarity with Revolution that I 
cannot work out the 'easy' way to do them... So here it goes:

TASK: I am trying to build a stack that will allow the user to enter 
some statistical data (text), and then produce some graphs to 
illustrate it (made of groups of graphic objects). My idea is that the 
user should be able to save their data - and associated graphics - as a 
cross-platform document. My questions are:

1) How do I save more than one type of data (text and graphics) to a 
single file? I guess this will have to be a binary file, but then how 
do I go about reading the data back into the stack? Is there a way to 
set 'item delimiters' for binary files? Or is there another way to go 
about saving/reading the data?

2) I know how to associate a custom icon to an APPLICATION compiled by 
Revolution, but how do you associate a custom icon to different FILE 
TYPES that your application might produce? For instance, if I produce a 
custom-defined file type '.stat', how do I get my '.stat' files to show 
under Mac and Windows with a custom icon for that type of document?

3) Is there a way to take the GRAPHICS data out of Revolution and into 
other drawing programs? Is there a way to EXPORT the graphs (made out 
of tens of graphic objects) that my stack produces to a standard 
format, so that they can be imported into other applications?

Any help or pointers on these items will be greatly, greatly 
appreciated!

Even though I've only been playing with Revolution 1.1.1 (on MacOS X) 
for about a week, I'm absolutely amazed with just how feature-full and 
easy-to-use it is. Very, very exciting! I can hardly wait to see 
version 2.0!

Kind Regards,
--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
igor at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Mon Nov 11 05:19:00 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Mon Nov 11 05:19:00 2002
Subject: making a pie chart
Message-ID: <p05100300b9f5323ba516@[10.0.1.202]>

Hi,

I have a list of ages with percent :

  0-10 : 15
11-20 : 20
21-30 : 17
...


does anyone know the script how to make a pie chart with this suite of data ?

Thanks.
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From tkuypers at pandora.be  Mon Nov 11 05:42:01 2002
From: tkuypers at pandora.be (tkuypers at pandora.be)
Date: Mon Nov 11 05:42:01 2002
Subject: Html to text
Message-ID: <B9F54659.3F88%tkuypers@pandora.be>

Forgive me for a maybe very dumb question, but I?m new to Revolution...

I used to work with SuperCard but I need to go cross-platvorm so RunRev is
the only good choice.

But I?m facing a small problem and before writing a lot of code, maybe
somebody can give me a lead or suggestion...

I?ve put a html-page into a variable and need to get rid of all html-code...
The remaining information needs to be analised, reformatted and printed.

In SC I could use an external to clean up these code, but anybody got a
suggestion how to do it in Revolution?

Any help is welcome

Ton Kuypers
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From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Mon Nov 11 06:10:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Mon Nov 11 06:10:01 2002
Subject: Html to text
In-Reply-To: <B9F54659.3F88%tkuypers@pandora.be>
Message-ID: <20021111110338.35191.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>

--- "tkuypers at pandora.be" <tkuypers at pandora.be> wrote:
> Forgive me for a maybe very dumb question, but I?m
> new to Revolution...
> 
> I used to work with SuperCard but I need to go
> cross-platvorm so RunRev is
> the only good choice.
> 
> But I?m facing a small problem and before writing a
> lot of code, maybe
> somebody can give me a lead or suggestion...
> 
> I?ve put a html-page into a variable and need to get
> rid of all html-code...
> The remaining information needs to be analised,
> reformatted and printed.
> 
> In SC I could use an external to clean up these
> code, but anybody got a
> suggestion how to do it in Revolution?
> 
> Any help is welcome
> 
> Ton Kuypers
> 

Hi Ton,

There are two ways to tackle this:

1) use a field like this:
  set the htmlText of fld "tricky" to theTextWithHTML
  put the text of fld "tricky" into theTextWithoutHTML

2) or have a look at the following posts from the
mailing list archive:
 
http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2002-August/006632.html
 
http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2002-August/006647.html

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2


From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Mon Nov 11 06:26:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Mon Nov 11 06:26:01 2002
Subject: Html to text
In-Reply-To: <B9F54659.3F88%tkuypers@pandora.be>
Message-ID: <B9F4D265.1FB62%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

tkuypers at pandora.be wrote:

> I?ve put a html-page into a variable and need to get rid of all html-code...
> The remaining information needs to be analised, reformatted and printed.
> 
> In SC I could use an external to clean up these code, but anybody got a
> suggestion how to do it in Revolution?

One field and two lines:

   set the htmltext of fld 1 to tMyVar
   put the text of fld 1 into tMyVar

If you have time to clock it against an external I'd be interested to see
how it compares.

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From tkuypers at pandora.be  Mon Nov 11 06:50:01 2002
From: tkuypers at pandora.be (tkuypers at pandora.be)
Date: Mon Nov 11 06:50:01 2002
Subject: Html to text
In-Reply-To: <B9F4D265.1FB62%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <B9F55674.3F90%tkuypers@pandora.be>

YESSSSS
This indeed is easy and fast, tnx


> From: Richard Gaskin <ambassador at fourthworld.com>
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 03:20:05 -0800
> To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> Subject: Re: Html to text
> 
> tkuypers at pandora.be wrote:
> 
>> I?ve put a html-page into a variable and need to get rid of all html-code...
>> The remaining information needs to be analised, reformatted and printed.
>> 
>> In SC I could use an external to clean up these code, but anybody got a
>> suggestion how to do it in Revolution?
> 
> One field and two lines:
> 
>  set the htmltext of fld 1 to tMyVar
>  put the text of fld 1 into tMyVar
> 
> If you have time to clock it against an external I'd be interested to see
> how it compares.
> 
> -- 
> Richard Gaskin 
> Fourth World Media Corporation
> Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
> ___________________________________________________________
> Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
> Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 



From tkuypers at pandora.be  Mon Nov 11 06:54:59 2002
From: tkuypers at pandora.be (tkuypers at pandora.be)
Date: Mon Nov 11 06:54:59 2002
Subject: Html to text
In-Reply-To: <20021111110338.35191.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <B9F556A0.3F91%tkuypers@pandora.be>

The htmlText works perfect, thankssssss


> From: Jan Schenkel <janschenkel at yahoo.com>
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 03:03:38 -0800 (PST)
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Re: Html to text
> 
> --- "tkuypers at pandora.be" <tkuypers at pandora.be> wrote:
>> Forgive me for a maybe very dumb question, but I?m
>> new to Revolution...
>> 
>> I used to work with SuperCard but I need to go
>> cross-platvorm so RunRev is
>> the only good choice.
>> 
>> But I?m facing a small problem and before writing a
>> lot of code, maybe
>> somebody can give me a lead or suggestion...
>> 
>> I?ve put a html-page into a variable and need to get
>> rid of all html-code...
>> The remaining information needs to be analised,
>> reformatted and printed.
>> 
>> In SC I could use an external to clean up these
>> code, but anybody got a
>> suggestion how to do it in Revolution?
>> 
>> Any help is welcome
>> 
>> Ton Kuypers
>> 
> 
> Hi Ton,
> 
> There are two ways to tackle this:
> 
> 1) use a field like this:
> set the htmlText of fld "tricky" to theTextWithHTML
> put the text of fld "tricky" into theTextWithoutHTML
> 
> 2) or have a look at the following posts from the
> mailing list archive:
> 
> http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2002-August/006632.html
> 
> http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2002-August/006647.html
> 
> Hope this helped,
> 
> Jan Schenkel.
> 
> =====
> "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La
> Rochefoucauld)
> 
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
> http://launch.yahoo.com/u2
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 



From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Mon Nov 11 07:17:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Mon Nov 11 07:17:01 2002
Subject: making a pie chart
In-Reply-To: <p05100300b9f5323ba516@[10.0.1.202]>
Message-ID: <B9F4DE54.1FB6B%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

yves COPPE wrote:

> I have a list of ages with percent :
> 
> 0-10 : 15
> 11-20 : 20
> 21-30 : 17
> ...
> 
> 
> does anyone know the script how to make a pie chart with this suite of data ?


on mouseUp
  put fld 1 into tData
  put "20,20,120,120" into tRect
  put "blue,green,red,yellow,purple,orange,gray" into tColors
  --
  MakePieChart tData, tRect, tColors
end mouseUp

on MakePieChart pData, pRect, pColors
  lock screen
  -- Set up template object:
  set the style of the templategraphic to "oval"
  set the rect of the templategraphic to pRect
  set the filled of the templategraphic to true
  --
  -- Create legend field:
  create field "PieLegend"
  put it into tLegendField
  set the showborder of tLegendField to false
  set the locktext of tLegendField to true
  set the traversalon of tLegendField to false
  --
  -- Create pie slices:
  put 0 into tCounter
  put empty into tNuObj
  repeat for each line tLine in pData
    add 1 to tCounter
    if tNuObj is not empty then put tNuObj into tOldObj
    create grc
    put it into tNuObj
    set the arcAngle of tNuObj to (360 * (last word of tLine/100) )
    if tCounter > 1 then
      set the startAngle of tNuObj to (the arcAngle of tOldObj)+(the
startAngle of tOldObj)
    end if
    put item tCounter of pColors into tColor
    set the backgroundcolor of tNuObj to tColor
    -- Make legend entry:
    put "      "&word 1 of tLine into line tCounter of field "PieLegend"
    set the backgroundcolor of char 1 to 4 of line tCounter of field
"PieLegend" to tColor
  end repeat
  -- Position legecd field:
  set the height of field "PieLegend" to the formattedheight of tLegendField
  set the topleft of field "PieLegend" to the topright of grc 1
  choose browse tool
  unlock screen
end MakePieChart


-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From malte.brill at t-online.de  Mon Nov 11 07:23:00 2002
From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill)
Date: Mon Nov 11 07:23:00 2002
Subject: making a pie chart 
Message-ID: <B9F55E14.5E%520041426354-0001@t-online.de>

Hi Yves:
Here is my two cent (just very rough, coded "on the fly":

Put the following in the card skript
on newGraphic
  choose browse tool
end newGraphic

Button "a":

global numberOfSlices,percentage,allValues,other
on mouseup
  put 0 into other
  put 0 into allValues
  put 0 into numberOfSlices
  put 10 into percentage[1]
  put 20 into percentage[2]
  put 30 into percentage[3]
repeat for each element x in percentage
   put x+allValues into allValues
   put numberOfSlices+1 into numberOfSlices
end repeat
if allValues<100 then put 100-allValues into other
end mouseup

--Just to initialize the values

Button "b":

global numberOfSlices,percentage,allValues,other,angleOffset
on mouseUp
  put 0 into angleOffset
  repeat with i=1 to numberOfSlices
    create graphic ("slice"&i)
    set the style of graphic (slice&i) to oval
    set the rectangle of graphic(slice&i) to 0,0,100,100
    set the arcAngle of graphic(slice&i) to percentage[i]*3.6
    set the startangle of graphic (slice&i) to angleoffset
    put angleoffset+percentage[i]*3.6 into angleOffset
  end repeat
 if other >0 then
  create graphic "others"
  set the style of graphic "others" to oval
  set the rectangle of graphic others to 0,0,100,100
  set the arcangle of graphic"others" to other*3.6
  set the startangle of graphic "others" to angleOffset
 end if
end mouseUp

Regards
Malte



From bvg at mac.com  Mon Nov 11 07:44:01 2002
From: bvg at mac.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?=)
Date: Mon Nov 11 07:44:01 2002
Subject: making a pie chart
In-Reply-To: <p05100300b9f5323ba516@[10.0.1.202]>
Message-ID: <6F702221-F571-11D6-B28F-003065AD94A4@mac.com>

On Montag, Nov 11, 2002, at 11:12 Europe/Zurich, yves COPPE wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I have a list of ages with percent :
>
>  0-10 : 15
> 11-20 : 20
> 21-30 : 17
> ...
>
>
> does anyone know the script how to make a pie chart with this suite of 
> data ?
>
> Thanks.
> -- 
> Greetings.
>
> Yves COPPE

I would take a look at the arcAngle and startAngle properties.
you could make 3 oval graphics and align them properly.
for your example, you would have to calculate like this:

15 + 20 + 17 = 52 // the whole circle is equivalent to 52 "pieces"
360 : 52 = 6.923077 // this is how big 1 "piece" would be in degree
15 * 6.923077 = 103.846155 // you must make a integer out of your 
results
20 * 6.923077 = 138.46154 //try to round to integer but beware of 
overlap and spaces!
17 * 6.923077 = 117.692309 //see how they are 360.000004 together?

The problem here is that you got all together 2.000004 behind the coma, 
and you only should have 2, so its quiet hard to calculate it exactly...

maybe like this:
  //this is untested, so use it at your own risk
put  (15 * 6.923077) into varGraph1
put (20 * 6.923077) into varGraph2
put (17 * 6.923077) into varGraph3
//calculate how many rest can be distributed //its 2.000004, remeber?
put  trunc((15 * 6.923077) mod 1 + (20 * 6.923077) mod 1 + (17 * 
6.923077) mod 1) into theStinkinRest
//divide them evenly among the members
repeat for  theStinkinRest  times
   add one to counter
   if counter mod 3 = 0 then
     add one to varGraph3
   else if counter mod 2 = 0 then
     add one to varGraph2
   else
     add one to varGraph1
   end if
end repeat


Now create 3 ovals that are the same size, round and on the same 
position

set the startangle of graphic "new graphic 1" to 360 //you could leave 
that out
set the arcangle of graphic "new graphic 1" to 104
set the startangle of graphic "new graphic 2" to 104
set the arcangle of graphic "new graphic 2" to 139
set the startangle of graphic "new graphic 3" to 242 //139 + 103
set the arcangle of graphic "new graphic 3" to 117

voila, pie!
nice munching ;)
Bj?rnke von Gierke



From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Mon Nov 11 12:23:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Mon Nov 11 12:23:01 2002
Subject: textStyle
Message-ID: <p05100300b9f595c50809@[10.0.1.202]>

Hi,


I have a fld with some lines have textstyle turned to "link"

now I want

1) disable the link Style
I script :
set the textstyle of fld "xxx" to plain"

it doesn't work !

2) is it possible to have a line in "link" textstyle but without 
showing the "underlining" of the "link" text style ?


thanks
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Mon Nov 11 12:30:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Mon Nov 11 12:30:01 2002
Subject: textStyle
In-Reply-To: <p05100300b9f595c50809@[10.0.1.202]>
Message-ID: <20021111172347.73783.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>

--- yves COPPE <yvescoppe at skynet.be> wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> 
> I have a fld with some lines have textstyle turned
> to "link"
> 
> now I want
> 
> 1) disable the link Style
> I script :
> set the textstyle of fld "xxx" to plain"
> 
> it doesn't work !
> 
> 2) is it possible to have a line in "link" textstyle
> but without 
> showing the "underlining" of the "link" text style ?
> 

Hi Yves,

If you set the textStyle fo aa field that's its
default setting, overridden per chunk. So you need to
give it a chunk to play with.

Try this for approach 1:
  set the textStyle of char 1 to -1 of fld "xxx" \
    to "plain"

And for approach 2:
- the old HC property
  set the showGroups to false
- or its RR synonym:
  set the underlineLinks to false

Hop this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2


From gslj at intergate.ca  Mon Nov 11 13:07:01 2002
From: gslj at intergate.ca (Gareth Jones)
Date: Mon Nov 11 13:07:01 2002
Subject: Several questions about the Menu Mgr
Message-ID: <a05111a00b9f59be95e0c@[216.113.201.83]>

I'm trying to mock up a program's menu structure. (Actually, to 
figure out better menus for OpenOffice.org, so I can suggest the 
changes to the dev team). I need to be able to show:

shift-control keyboard equivalents to the menu items (e.g. shift-control-M)
function key keyboard equivalents to the menu items (e.g. F2)
hierarchical menus

I did read Richard Gaskins' recent e-mail about hierarchical menus. 
where he seemed to say that entering <tab)menuname would do it. If I 
type <tab>menuname into the Menu Manager, however, the resulting menu 
item shows in the main menu as "ab>menuname" ... and if I press the 
tab key, it just pops into the next text entry field, so that doesn't 
work :-)

Any help would be appreciated.

-Gareth


From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Mon Nov 11 14:42:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Mon Nov 11 14:42:01 2002
Subject: textStyle
In-Reply-To: <20021111172347.73783.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021111172347.73783.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <p05100300b9f5b6b6c54b@[10.0.1.202]>

>--- yves COPPE <yvescoppe at skynet.be> wrote:
>>  Hi,
>>
>>
>>  I have a fld with some lines have textstyle turned
>>  to "link"
>>
>>  now I want
>>
>>  1) disable the link Style
>>  I script :
>>  set the textstyle of fld "xxx" to plain"
>>
>>  it doesn't work !
>>
>>  2) is it possible to have a line in "link" textstyle
>>  but without
>>  showing the "underlining" of the "link" text style ?
>>
>
>Hi Yves,
>
>If you set the textStyle fo aa field that's its
>default setting, overridden per chunk. So you need to
>give it a chunk to play with.
>
>Try this for approach 1:
>   set the textStyle of char 1 to -1 of fld "xxx" \
>     to "plain"
>
>And for approach 2:
>- the old HC property
>   set the showGroups to false
>- or its RR synonym:
>   set the underlineLinks to false
>
>Hop this helped,
>
>Jan Schenkel.
>


thanks

-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Mon Nov 11 14:42:43 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Mon Nov 11 14:42:43 2002
Subject: making a pie chart
In-Reply-To: <B9F4DE54.1FB6B%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
References: <B9F4DE54.1FB6B%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <p05100301b9f5b6efd2c7@[10.0.1.202]>

>yves COPPE wrote:
>
>>  I have a list of ages with percent :
>>
>>  0-10 : 15
>>  11-20 : 20
>>  21-30 : 17
>>  ...
>>
>>
>>  does anyone know the script how to make a pie chart with this 
>>suite of data ?
>
>
>on mouseUp
>   put fld 1 into tData
>   put "20,20,120,120" into tRect
>   put "blue,green,red,yellow,purple,orange,gray" into tColors
>   --
>   MakePieChart tData, tRect, tColors
>end mouseUp
>
>on MakePieChart pData, pRect, pColors
>   lock screen
>   -- Set up template object:
>   set the style of the templategraphic to "oval"
>   set the rect of the templategraphic to pRect
>   set the filled of the templategraphic to true
>   --
>   -- Create legend field:
>   create field "PieLegend"
>   put it into tLegendField
>   set the showborder of tLegendField to false
>   set the locktext of tLegendField to true
>   set the traversalon of tLegendField to false
>   --
>   -- Create pie slices:
>   put 0 into tCounter
>   put empty into tNuObj
>   repeat for each line tLine in pData
>     add 1 to tCounter
>     if tNuObj is not empty then put tNuObj into tOldObj
>     create grc
>     put it into tNuObj
>     set the arcAngle of tNuObj to (360 * (last word of tLine/100) )
>     if tCounter > 1 then
>       set the startAngle of tNuObj to (the arcAngle of tOldObj)+(the
>startAngle of tOldObj)
>     end if
>     put item tCounter of pColors into tColor
>     set the backgroundcolor of tNuObj to tColor
>     -- Make legend entry:
>     put "      "&word 1 of tLine into line tCounter of field "PieLegend"
>     set the backgroundcolor of char 1 to 4 of line tCounter of field
>"PieLegend" to tColor
>   end repeat
>   -- Position legecd field:
>   set the height of field "PieLegend" to the formattedheight of tLegendField
>   set the topleft of field "PieLegend" to the topright of grc 1
>   choose browse tool
>   unlock screen
>end MakePieChart
>


thanks
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From pixelbird at interisland.net  Mon Nov 11 15:39:01 2002
From: pixelbird at interisland.net (pixelbird at interisland.net)
Date: Mon Nov 11 15:39:01 2002
Subject: Constraining the pointer within a group
Message-ID: <200211112030.gABKUUL27849@lopez.interisland.net>

 
> I am thinking of trying to constrain the pointer so it
cannot move out of the 
> rating scale area until a rating has been made.  Before I
start to 
> experiment, has anyone any suggestions or advice?
----------
I also am developing software for disabled folk. This
situation appears as if you are working it with a single
switch, otherwise the user could keep the mouse oriented in
the activity area.

If that is the case, why not use a sequential scanner system
with hilited buttons to time the responses, and no cursor at
all, i.e., set the cursor to "none" (Macs) while it's running?

I have a little "Dragster" game I use for practice
(improving) and testing of response times. The user plays
the game and gets a score, plus available "Top Ten" scores,
plus it puts actual switch response times in a storage area
accessible by the "teacher". Just one idea I use. If you
want more details, email me offlist.

<pixelbird at interisaland.net>

HTH,
Ken N.









---------------------------------------------
           The Computer Place
        Info = info at interisland.net
        http://www.compplace.com/




From rcozens at pon.net  Mon Nov 11 19:36:00 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Mon Nov 11 19:36:00 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20021018172716.027134c0@mail.spamcop.net>
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20021017182440.02620780@mail.spamcop.net>
 <5.1.0.14.2.20021017124528.026be340@mail.spamcop.net>
 <5.1.0.14.2.20021017182440.02620780@mail.spamcop.net>
 <5.1.0.14.2.20021018172716.027134c0@mail.spamcop.net>
Message-ID: <a05100301b9f5f8a886f7@[216.229.107.190]>

>Here is a summary of the new features listed in that release:
>
>[snip]
>
>
>*Windows of any size and shape

Hi Rod,

Could you possibly comment on whether controls (especially buttons) 
as well as windows can be non-rectangular?
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Mon Nov 11 19:37:26 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Mon Nov 11 19:37:26 2002
Subject: Newbie Questions!
In-Reply-To: <5D895724-F516-11D6-A543-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
References: <5D895724-F516-11D6-A543-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05100302b9f5fa7cf50d@[216.229.107.190]>

>TASK: I am trying to build a stack that will allow the user to enter 
>some statistical data (text), and then produce some graphs to 
>illustrate it (made of groups of graphic objects). My idea is that 
>the user should be able to save their data - and associated graphics 
>- as a cross-platform document. My questions are:
>
>1) How do I save more than one type of data (text and graphics) to a 
>single file?

Hi Igor,

How long does it take to plot the graphs once you have the data? 
Unless it is a lengthy process, you can simplify your design by 
simply storing the text and plotting the graphs on demand.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Mon Nov 11 19:53:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Mon Nov 11 19:53:01 2002
Subject: Newbie Questions!
In-Reply-To: <a05100302b9f5fa7cf50d@[216.229.107.190]>
Message-ID: <B9F58F5B.1FBD0%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

> How do I save more than one type of data (text and graphics) to a
> single file?

You could use a stack file as your document.

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From scott at tactilemedia.com  Mon Nov 11 19:59:00 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Mon Nov 11 19:59:00 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <a05100301b9f5f8a886f7@[216.229.107.190]>
Message-ID: <B9F590CF.5321%scott@tactilemedia.com>

Recently, "Rob Cozens"  wrote:

> Could you possibly comment on whether controls (especially buttons)
> as well as windows can be non-rectangular?

Windows can already be non-rectangular -- see the windowShape property.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-----
E: scott at tactilemedia.com
W: http://www.tactilemedia.com



From alex at mindlube.com  Mon Nov 11 20:19:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Mon Nov 11 20:19:01 2002
Subject: groups not shown
Message-ID: <DDD49F9C-F5DB-11D6-9D09-000393529642@mindlube.com>

In the Rev docs, "Why isn't a group listed?" is says: if a group has 
subgroups, it won't show up in groupNames, and I presume it won't show 
up in the Application Overview either.

1) I have a group that's listed in the groupNames of my card, but does 
not appear in the App. Overview window. I'm nearly certain the group 
does not contain any subgroups. Why else would the group not appear in 
the Application Overview?

2) Also, I've noticed sometimes a changed group name is not reflected 
in the App. Overview. Is this a bug?

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From alex at mindlube.com  Mon Nov 11 20:19:10 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Mon Nov 11 20:19:10 2002
Subject: rectangle button q's
Message-ID: <DE699DAB-F5DB-11D6-9D09-000393529642@mindlube.com>

I'm using the rectangle style button.

1) I'm using this style because I have left aligned text and right 
aligned icons on these buttons. With the standard button style on OS X, 
the icon hangs off the rounded corner of the button, which looks bad. 
The rectangle style does not have this problem. I like the rounded 
buttons, so is there any other workarounds for this other than using 
the rectangle style.

2) When the rectangle style button is selected, and the "hilite 
background" property is yes, then button highlights when clicked, 
drawing a dark blue background color. How can I change that dark blue 
hilite color? It doesn't look like it fits the system control colors on 
Mac. Maybe the dark blue looks fine on Windows.

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From alex at mindlube.com  Mon Nov 11 20:32:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Mon Nov 11 20:32:01 2002
Subject: relative scrolling in a group
Message-ID: <A98849CC-F5DD-11D6-9D09-000393529642@mindlube.com>

I have complex group with a vertical scrollbar. How can I scroll to 
make a particular object visible, instead of hardcoding the vscroll 
pixels like this

set the vscroll of grp "reportGroup" to 475

I want to do something like this

set the vscroll of grp "reportGroup" to the location of fld 
"myReportHeader"

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From brendan at poolcreative.com  Mon Nov 11 20:37:01 2002
From: brendan at poolcreative.com (Brendan Bonsack)
Date: Mon Nov 11 20:37:01 2002
Subject: Exporting images
Message-ID: <3DD05B84.718853B9@poolcreative.com>

Hello list gurus

Can anyone think of a way to produce this effect:

I need to be able to export an image to JPEG format from a mixture of
imported graphics and "drawn" graphics on a stack. My method so far has
been to layer images and graphic controls over each other in the stack,
let the user manipulate them, etc, and then to take a screen snapshot of
the "mix" and export the snapshot to a single JPEG file. This is flawed,
however, since if the image is larger than the stack only the visible
part will export, and if a palette is over the image at the time of the
snapshot, that gets captured too! I know I can hide palettes for the
sake of the snapshot, but the first problem I can't work out at all.

Does anyone know of a method to "merge" a number of images into one?


Cheers
Brendan Bonsack



From chipp at chipp.com  Mon Nov 11 21:28:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Mon Nov 11 21:28:01 2002
Subject: Exporting images
In-Reply-To: <3DD05B84.718853B9@poolcreative.com>
Message-ID: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAMEHNCNAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Brendan,

Check the image compositing stack at:

http://www.altuit.com/webs/altuit2/RunRev/Downloads.htm

though it doesn't solve your problem exactly, I can see how it could be
helpful.

-Chipp

> Hello list gurus
>
> Can anyone think of a way to produce this effect:
>
> I need to be able to export an image to JPEG format from a mixture of
> imported graphics and "drawn" graphics on a stack. My method so far has
> been to layer images and graphic controls over each other in the stack,
> let the user manipulate them, etc, and then to take a screen snapshot of
> the "mix" and export the snapshot to a single JPEG file. This is flawed,
> however, since if the image is larger than the stack only the visible
> part will export, and if a palette is over the image at the time of the
> snapshot, that gets captured too! I know I can hide palettes for the
> sake of the snapshot, but the first problem I can't work out at all.
>
> Does anyone know of a method to "merge" a number of images into one?
>



From chipp at chipp.com  Mon Nov 11 21:29:00 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Mon Nov 11 21:29:00 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <a05100301b9f5f8a886f7@[216.229.107.190]>
Message-ID: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAAEHOCNAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Rob,

Sure buttons can be any shape. Just use a transparent GIF or PNG and set the
icon of the button to it.

ButtonGadget does this automatically (www.buttongadget.com)

-Chipp

> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Rob Cozens
> Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 6:21 PM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Re: 1.5 (now 2.0)
>
>
> >Here is a summary of the new features listed in that release:
> >
> >[snip]
> >
> >
> >*Windows of any size and shape
>
> Hi Rod,
>
> Could you possibly comment on whether controls (especially buttons)
> as well as windows can be non-rectangular?
> --
>
> Rob Cozens
> CCW, Serendipity Software Company
> http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm
>
> "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
> Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."
>
> from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Mon Nov 11 21:56:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Mon Nov 11 21:56:01 2002
Subject: Sockets
References: <NEBBICMMKLOIPMPOLALAAEAJEFAA.jiml@netrin.com>
Message-ID: <011101c289f5$809868e0$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Jim,

Thanks for the update. I'll amend the scripts at my site... IPCONFIG is a
funky beast, and does indeed vary by platform! And being a RegEx hound I'll
update the matchText function accordingly.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Lambert" <jiml at netrin.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2002 7:30 PM
Subject: RE: Sockets


> The script Ken Ray posted on his site to Get MAC Address is excellent.
> One note though, on my Win98 SE machine the function returned nothing
> because
>
> get matchText(temp,"Physical Address. . . . . . . . . :
> ([A-Z0-9-]*)",retVal)
>
> doesn't find "Physical Address. . . . . . . . . :"
>
> The data returned by IPCONFIG.EXE shows "Physical Address. . . . . . :"
> So, removing 3 periods:
>
> get matchText(temp,"Physical Address. . . . . . : ([A-Z0-9-]*)",retVal)
>
> does work.
>
> Perhaps the format of information returned by IPCONFIG.EXE varies by
Windows
> version (a very Microsofty possibility!) If this is so, someone more adept
> at Regular Expressions than I might want to post a matchtext parameter
that
> finds "Physical Address" + any number of periods + colon.
>
> Jim Lambert
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Mon Nov 11 22:01:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Mon Nov 11 22:01:01 2002
Subject: Several questions about the Menu Mgr
References: <a05111a00b9f59be95e0c@[216.113.201.83]>
Message-ID: <013901c289f6$230670e0$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Gareth, try typing the tab key and the text for the submenu into a regular
field, select it, copy it, and paste it into the Menu Mgr. I don't know if
it will work, but it's worth a try.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gareth Jones" <gslj at intergate.ca>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 11:51 AM
Subject: Several questions about the Menu Mgr


> I'm trying to mock up a program's menu structure. (Actually, to
> figure out better menus for OpenOffice.org, so I can suggest the
> changes to the dev team). I need to be able to show:
>
> shift-control keyboard equivalents to the menu items (e.g.
shift-control-M)
> function key keyboard equivalents to the menu items (e.g. F2)
> hierarchical menus
>
> I did read Richard Gaskins' recent e-mail about hierarchical menus.
> where he seemed to say that entering <tab)menuname would do it. If I
> type <tab>menuname into the Menu Manager, however, the resulting menu
> item shows in the main menu as "ab>menuname" ... and if I press the
> tab key, it just pops into the next text entry field, so that doesn't
> work :-)
>
> Any help would be appreciated.
>
> -Gareth
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From terry at discovery.nl  Mon Nov 11 22:10:01 2002
From: terry at discovery.nl (Terry Vogelaar)
Date: Mon Nov 11 22:10:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAAEHOCNAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <4A6ABF42-F5EB-11D6-B6C1-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>

Chipp Walters heeft op dinsdag, 12 nov 2002 om 03:21 het volgende 
geschreven:

> Sure buttons can be any shape. Just use a transparent GIF or PNG and 
> set the
> icon of the button to it.

That changes the visual shape of a button, but the clickable area is 
still a rectangle. In the cases a non-rectangular clickable area is 
needed, a script that does some calculations with the mouse location 
could provide a solution for those cases. Still there are cases 
imaginable where this also wouldn't help. But to introduce a true 
non-rectangular button just for those rare cases seems overkill. RunRev 
is not the right app for 100% of all the development work, but it sure 
covers 90 to 99%.

Terry




From jeanne at runrev.com  Mon Nov 11 22:29:01 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Mon Nov 11 22:29:01 2002
Subject: copyrighted Runtime Revolution in MacOSes?
In-Reply-To: <3D2858A4-F2FB-11D6-B9DC-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <v0313030bb9f5dcf55b2d@[10.0.1.5]>

At 1:19 AM -0800 11/8/02, Wolfgang M. Bereuter wrote:
>>> Your App Ife says that it is copyrighted Runtime Revolution (Get
>>> Info): I think you wan to change that to the name of your compny or
>>> your own name.
>>> ---
>
>What can I do to to change that.

For Mac OS builds, you need to use ResEdit (or a similar utility) to change
the vers resource. Opening this resource in ResEdit, you'll see fields and
popup menus that are fairly self-explanatory. (The part that is visible in
Get Info is the "Long Version String" in the vers resource.)

For OS X builds, again use ResEdit, and open the plst resource. There is no
ResEdit template for this resource, so you'll see hexadecimal data on the
left and the text equivalent on the right. Select all the text, copy it,
and paste it into a text editor. You'll see that it is simply XML. Find the
NSHumanReadableCopyright key near the bottom. In the string just below it,
substitute your copyright data. When you're done, copy the text and paste
it back into the right-hand text column in ResEdit, then save the
application.

(OS X builds also have a vers resource, which appears in Mac OS, and you
will probably want to change this too.)

(The 2.0 Distribution Builder has new options to set all this when you
build your distribution, so this is only needed for 1.1.1.)

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From jeanne at runrev.com  Mon Nov 11 22:29:11 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Mon Nov 11 22:29:11 2002
Subject: Newbie Questions!
In-Reply-To: <5D895724-F516-11D6-A543-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <v0313030cb9f5e8a1190d@[10.0.1.5]>

At 5:39 PM -0800 11/10/02, Igor Couto wrote:
>Hail, Oh Revolution Masters!

Greetings, Igor. ;-)

>I am afraid I am a Revolution newbie, and as such, will ask questions
>that may annoy the more experienced users in the list. Nevertheless,
>after furiously jumping from one place to another in the documentation,
>I decided that it might be a better use of my time if I asked for some
>help and guidance from the experts!

Speaking as the docs person, I'm happy to see newbies post their questions
here. Not only does it give them a source of quick help, but it gives me a
better idea of where the docs need improvement.

>1) How do I save more than one type of data (text and graphics) to a
>single file?

The simplest way of doing this is to save the data in a stack file. Stack
files can save all the objects (of course), and this way you don't need to
come up with a file format - just put the data into a stack, save the
stack, and there you are. You can use the create stack command to make a
stack (or use the clone command to copy a substack you keep inside your
application).

You can refer to objects in the stack to get your data and put it into
objects in your main user interface. (Or you can make the saved stack
itself part of your user interface.)


>3) Is there a way to take the GRAPHICS data out of Revolution and into
>other drawing programs? Is there a way to EXPORT the graphs (made out
>of tens of graphic objects) that my stack produces to a standard
>format, so that they can be imported into other applications?

For graphics, there's no built-in way. You can export images, so one
possibility is to use the import snapshot command to make an image out of a
finished graph, then use the export command to export that image to a file.

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From jeanne at runrev.com  Mon Nov 11 22:30:00 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Mon Nov 11 22:30:00 2002
Subject: Several questions about the Menu Mgr
In-Reply-To: <a05111a00b9f59be95e0c@[216.113.201.83]>
Message-ID: <v0313030db9f5eb4eba21@[10.0.1.5]>

At 9:51 AM -0800 11/11/02, Gareth Jones wrote:
>I did read Richard Gaskins' recent e-mail about hierarchical menus.
>where he seemed to say that entering <tab)menuname would do it. If I
>type <tab>menuname into the Menu Manager, however, the resulting menu
>item shows in the main menu as "ab>menuname" ... and if I press the
>tab key, it just pops into the next text entry field, so that doesn't
>work :-)

Not literally "<tab>" - a tab character.

In the Menu Manager, you can insert the tab character by selecting the menu
item, then clicking the right-arrow icon to the right of the menu name (its
tooltip is "Make the selected menu item into a submenu item"). If you're
building the menu in a handler, you'd use something like
  put "First Item" & tab & return & "Subitem" & return \
     & "Last Item" into button "File"

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From scott at tactilemedia.com  Mon Nov 11 22:31:01 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Mon Nov 11 22:31:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <4A6ABF42-F5EB-11D6-B6C1-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>
Message-ID: <B9F5B49B.9052%scott@tactilemedia.com>

>> Sure buttons can be any shape. Just use a transparent GIF or PNG and
>> set the
>> icon of the button to it.
> 
> That changes the visual shape of a button, but the clickable area is
> still a rectangle.

This isn't the case with transparent GIFs and PNGs, at least in MetaCard.
All transparent pixels in these images ignore mouse events, so you can
indeed have irregular regions that respond appropriately to mouse clicks.
Test this for yourself and see if you get the same results.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director

Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
Email: scott at tactilemedia.com
Web: www.tactilemedia.com



From crutcher at udayton.edu  Mon Nov 11 23:27:01 2002
From: crutcher at udayton.edu (Robert Crutcher)
Date: Mon Nov 11 23:27:01 2002
Subject: building Mac OSX-stand-alones problem
Message-ID: <a05111b01b9f631d08ede@[192.168.1.2]>

I was successfully building Mac OS X stand-alone versions of a 
revolution stack that I'm working on.  Now suddenly every time I 
build a new stand-alone, despite selecting the OS X Standalone 
option, Revolution builds a 'classic' stand-alone application--this 
despite the fact that the folder in which the stand-alone is created 
is correctly labeled as 'Standalone_MacOSX'.  Can anyone suggest what 
is happening??

rob crutcher

BTW I am running the OS X version of Revolution 1.1.1 and Mac OS 10.2.1
-- 
Robert J. Crutcher
Department of Psychology
University of Dayton
300 College Park
Dayton, OH 45469-1430

Phone: 937-229-1346
Email: crutcher at udayton.edu


From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Tue Nov 12 00:00:01 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Tue Nov 12 00:00:01 2002
Subject: Newbie Questions!
In-Reply-To: <a05100302b9f5fa7cf50d@[216.229.107.190]>
Message-ID: <B3763D69-F5FA-11D6-A815-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Rob,

On Tuesday, November 12, 2002, at 11:27  AM, Rob Cozens wrote:

> How long does it take to plot the graphs once you have the data? 
> Unless it is a lengthy process, you can simplify your design by simply 
> storing the text and plotting the graphs on demand.
>

Thank you for the suggestion! That is a neat solution, indeed - I will 
be able to use it in a wide variety of situations. The only problem 
this solution poses is that I wouldn't be able to add any IMAGE objects 
to the graphs, in the future... I would like to give the user the 
option of being able to specify images to be used for certain graphic 
elements (ie, background). That is why I was considering saving all 
elements to a separate file. My problem really is being able to specify 
more than one element to a file, and then being able to read them 
back... I know that for text files we can use custom-defined item 
delimiters, but I don't know exactly what is the procedure for doing 
the same with binary files...

Once again, many thanks for your suggestion!

Kind Regards,

--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
igor at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Tue Nov 12 00:05:01 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Tue Nov 12 00:05:01 2002
Subject: Newbie Questions!
In-Reply-To: <B9F58F5B.1FBD0%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <76368FBC-F5FB-11D6-A815-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Richard,

Many thanks for your posting!

On Tuesday, November 12, 2002, at 11:46  AM, Richard Gaskin wrote:

>> How do I save more than one type of data (text and graphics) to a
>> single file?
>
> You could use a stack file as your document.
>

So, I assume that what you are saying is that it is possible for me to 
actually create another stack from inside my application, and populate 
it with the data (text, images, etc.) that I need. That sounds like a 
really interesting solution! A couple of questions:

1) Is the stack that functions as the 'document' (the one I saved all 
the relevant information TO) cross-platform? ie, would a Mac and a 
Windows user be able to exchange stacks?

2) Is it possible for me to setup a custom Mac file type for that 
stack? (and a custom icon?)

You help is immensely appreciated!

Many thanks, and

Kind Regards,

--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
igor at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Tue Nov 12 00:11:01 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Tue Nov 12 00:11:01 2002
Subject: Newbie Questions!
In-Reply-To: <v0313030cb9f5e8a1190d@[10.0.1.5]>
Message-ID: <37BCD3F2-F5FC-11D6-A815-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Jeanne,

Thank you for your suggestion!

On Tuesday, November 12, 2002, at 10:16  AM, Jeanne A. E. DeVoto wrote:

>> 1) How do I save more than one type of data (text and graphics) to a
>> single file?
>
> The simplest way of doing this is to save the data in a stack file. 
> Stack
> files can save all the objects (of course), and this way you don't 
> need to
> come up with a file format - just put the data into a stack, save the
> stack, and there you are. You can use the create stack command to make 
> a
> stack (or use the clone command to copy a substack you keep inside your
> application).
>
> You can refer to objects in the stack to get your data and put it into
> objects in your main user interface. (Or you can make the saved stack
> itself part of your user interface.)
>

I will definitely try this out!

Two questions I posted in an earlier reply:

1) Is this stack cross-compatible? ie, will my Mac and Windows users be 
able to exchange files?

2) Is it possible to assign a specific file/document type to the 
created stack - and an associated icon?

Many thanks!

Kind Regards,

--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
igor at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Tue Nov 12 00:23:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Tue Nov 12 00:23:01 2002
Subject: building Mac OSX-stand-alones problem
In-Reply-To: <a05111acfb9f632d56748@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <E003874E-F5FD-11D6-9FC1-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

If you "Get Info" on an OS X standalone created with Rev, then it says 
that it is a Classic app. It really isn't and it works fine in OS X 
without having to boot Classic. I think this is a bug that is due to be 
fixed in the next version.

Sarah

On Tuesday, November 12, 2002, at 02:23  pm, Robert Crutcher wrote:

> I was successfully building Mac OS X stand-alone versions of a 
> revolution stack that I'm working on.  Now suddenly every time I build 
> a new stand-alone, despite selecting the OS X Standalone option, 
> Revolution builds a 'classic' stand-alone application--this despite 
> the fact that the folder in which the stand-alone is created is 
> correctly labeled as 'Standalone_MacOSX'.  Can anyone suggest what is 
> happening??
>
> rob crutcher
>
> BTW I am running the OS X version of Revolution 1.1.1 and Mac OS 10.2.1
> -- 
> Robert J. Crutcher
> Department of Psychology
> University of Dayton
> 300 College Park
> Dayton, OH 45469-1430
>
> Phone: 937-229-1346
> Email: crutcher at udayton.edu
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Tue Nov 12 02:56:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Tue Nov 12 02:56:01 2002
Subject: Newbie Questions!
In-Reply-To: <76368FBC-F5FB-11D6-A815-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <B9F5F2B3.1FC22%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Igor de Oliveira Couto wrote:

> 1) Is the stack that functions as the 'document' (the one I saved all
> the relevant information TO) cross-platform? ie, would a Mac and a
> Windows user be able to exchange stacks?

Yes.  Revolution stack files will open on all supported platforms without
modification.

> 2) Is it possible for me to setup a custom Mac file type for that
> stack? (and a custom icon?)

Yes, provided you're comfortable with ResEdit.  You'll want to change the
BNDL resource and edit the icns resources, but it's pretty straightforward.

If you'll be distributing your app you may want to register your creator
code with Apple:  <http://developer.apple.com/dev/cftype/>.

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From jeanne at runrev.com  Tue Nov 12 03:17:01 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Tue Nov 12 03:17:01 2002
Subject: Newbie Questions!
In-Reply-To: <37BCD3F2-F5FC-11D6-A815-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
References: <v0313030cb9f5e8a1190d@[10.0.1.5]>
Message-ID: <v0313030eb9f645114b95@[10.0.1.5]>

At 9:04 PM -0800 11/11/02, Igor de Oliveira Couto wrote:
>On Tuesday, November 12, 2002, at 10:16  AM, Jeanne A. E. DeVoto wrote:
>>> 1) How do I save more than one type of data (text and graphics) to a
>>> single file?
>>
>> The simplest way of doing this is to save the data in a stack file.
>
>1) Is this stack cross-compatible? ie, will my Mac and Windows users be
>able to exchange files?

Yes. All Revolution stack files are cross-platform and can be opened by
Revolution (or standalones) on any other platform. (Of course, you may need
to tweak fonts and colors slightly for best appearance on each operating
system, but the basic stack format is the same regardless of platform.)

>2) Is it possible to assign a specific file/document type to the
>created stack - and an associated icon?

Yes, although it is a bit complex and involves work with ResEdit. (This
will become simpler in the next version. I think. ;-) The essential thing
is to set the fileType property before saving the stack file: this lets you
assign a custom file type, and your standalone app's creator code, to the
stack file.

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From jeanne at runrev.com  Tue Nov 12 03:17:09 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Tue Nov 12 03:17:09 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <4A6ABF42-F5EB-11D6-B6C1-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>
References: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAAEHOCNAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <v0313030fb9f6469ea8e1@[10.0.1.5]>

<non-rectangular buttons>

Remember, too, that other objects get all the messages buttons get. You
can, for example, create a graphic of any shape that acts like a button -
even do a pseudo-highlight under script control.

We tend to get into the habit of thinking "clickable object = button", but
there are additional options...

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From jeanne at runrev.com  Tue Nov 12 03:17:15 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Tue Nov 12 03:17:15 2002
Subject: rectangle button q's
In-Reply-To: <DE699DAB-F5DB-11D6-9D09-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <v03130310b9f647e3f54f@[10.0.1.5]>

At 5:12 PM -0800 11/11/02, Alex Rice wrote:
>2) When the rectangle style button is selected, and the "hilite
>background" property is yes, then button highlights when clicked,
>drawing a dark blue background color. How can I change that dark blue
>hilite color?

Set the button's hiliteColor to the color you want.

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From mazzapaolo at libero.it  Tue Nov 12 03:48:01 2002
From: mazzapaolo at libero.it (paolo mazza)
Date: Tue Nov 12 03:48:01 2002
Subject: Exporting images
In-Reply-To: <200211120258.VAA15787@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <B9F6812B.458A%mazzapaolo@libero.it>

I have beeen looking for a solution to this problem for a long time.
As far as I know in Rev we are supposed to take a shapshot of the screen.
I tryed to merge images using imagedata and maskdata. It works but the
process is slow and unstable. Perhaps you can do a better job.
I posted this script at the page:

http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs/2380

Ciao,
Paolo

> From: use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 21:58:13 -0500
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #831 - 17 msgs
> 
> Message: 14
> Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 12:38:13 +1100
> From: Brendan Bonsack <brendan at poolcreative.com>
> To: "use-revolution at lists.runrev.com" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> Subject: Exporting images
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> 
> Hello list gurus
> 
> Can anyone think of a way to produce this effect:
> 
> I need to be able to export an image to JPEG format from a mixture of
> imported graphics and "drawn" graphics on a stack. My method so far has
> been to layer images and graphic controls over each other in the stack,
> let the user manipulate them, etc, and then to take a screen snapshot of
> the "mix" and export the snapshot to a single JPEG file. This is flawed,
> however, since if the image is larger than the stack only the visible
> part will export, and if a palette is over the image at the time of the
> snapshot, that gets captured too! I know I can hide palettes for the
> sake of the snapshot, but the first problem I can't work out at all.
> 
> Does anyone know of a method to "merge" a number of images into one?
> 
> 
> Cheers
> Brendan Bonsack



From michael-kristensen at dsa-net.dk  Tue Nov 12 05:08:01 2002
From: michael-kristensen at dsa-net.dk (Michael Kristensen)
Date: Tue Nov 12 05:08:01 2002
Subject: Not all mail goes into the Digest
In-Reply-To: <200211120818.DAA24342@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <AC320EAC-F625-11D6-9D08-0050E405EA7D@dsa-net.dk>

Hi all

Over and over again I see replies to mail where the original mail was 
not in the Digest.

It seams that the Digest is cut of at some place.

A recent example is the mail with the Topic:      1.5 (now 2.0)

The replies is there but not the original.


Kind regards
Michael Kristensen



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Tue Nov 12 05:21:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Tue Nov 12 05:21:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0
In-Reply-To: <200211120818.DAA24179@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <9C998D18-F627-11D6-9A02-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Dienstag, November 12, 2002, at 09:18  Uhr, 
use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote:

>> Sure buttons can be any shape. Just use a transparent GIF or PNG and
>> set the
>> icon of the button to it.
>
> That changes the visual shape of a button, but the clickable area is
> still a rectangle. In the cases a non-rectangular clickable area is
> needed, a script that does some calculations with the mouse location
> could provide a solution for those cases. Still there are cases
> imaginable where this also wouldn't help. But to introduce a true
> non-rectangular button just for those rare cases seems overkill. RunRev
> is not the right app for 100% of all the development work, but it sure
> covers 90 to 99%.

Rare cases??
What you have on more than 50% of the sites on the net and on nearly 
every MM App?
Sorry, but thats *not* an overkill. Thats urgently needed!!

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Tue Nov 12 05:48:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Tue Nov 12 05:48:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <200211120818.DAA24179@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <65DACDA8-F62B-11D6-9A02-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Dienstag, November 12, 2002, at 09:18  Uhr, 
use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote:

> Re: 1.5 (now 2.0)
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>
> <non-rectangular buttons>
>
> Remember, too, that other objects get all the messages buttons get. You
> can, for example, create a graphic of any shape that acts like a 
> button -
> even do a pseudo-highlight under script control.
>
> We tend to get into the habit of thinking "clickable object = button", 
> but
> there are additional options...

I have such a structur . If I had to do that with singular "clickable 
object = buttons" than the number of gifs, I have to handle, which are 
about 60-70, would expand to thousands...
Its like image maps in html. A lot of invisible buttons sitting on the 
gif (1. layer = exact size of the card) and flashing on click. Looks 
fine on rectangular objects. But the world is not rectangular only, and 
thats the reason why I miss a unregular shape (round) button so much....

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From dsc at swcp.com  Tue Nov 12 10:35:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Tue Nov 12 10:35:01 2002
Subject: Not all mail goes into the Digest
In-Reply-To: <AC320EAC-F625-11D6-9D08-0050E405EA7D@dsa-net.dk>
Message-ID: <0F497B7A-F653-11D6-B286-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Tuesday, November 12, 2002, at 03:01 AM, Michael Kristensen wrote:

> It seams that the Digest is cut of at some place.
>
> A recent example is the mail with the Topic:      1.5 (now 2.0)

In this particular case, the thread was started back on October 16 as 
"1.5" and was quiet between the 21st and yesterday.

I have my mail client automatically sort my use-revolution mail into its 
own mailbox.  For me this works better than subscribing to a digest.  My 
in-box is not cluttered and I can sort and search better.

Dar Scott



From rcozens at pon.net  Tue Nov 12 10:56:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Tue Nov 12 10:56:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAAEHOCNAA.chipp@chipp.com>
References: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAAEHOCNAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <a05100300b9f6c9df5db1@[216.229.107.153]>

>Sure buttons can be any shape. Just use a transparent GIF or PNG and set the
>icon of the button to it.

Hi Chipp,

Here's the issue I am dealing with:

I have a "round" button named "Clock" and a series of transparent, 
round clock-face icons depicting clock hand positions for all 
possible times of day (in five minute increments).

I want to be able to change the clock's background color to depict 
daytime (6 AM - 5:55 PM) vs nighttime (6 PM - 5:55 AM) hours.  How 
can I change the background color inside the circular image without 
changing the color of the button's corners protruding around the 
circular image.

The only solution I can see at present (other than doubling the 
number of icons) is to paint an opaque mask over the portion of the 
button not covered by the image.  This is not a good solution because 
the mask must be repainted every time the button is placed on a 
different colored background.

Anyone have a better solution?
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Tue Nov 12 10:57:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Tue Nov 12 10:57:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <B9F5B49B.9052%scott@tactilemedia.com>
References: <B9F5B49B.9052%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <a05100302b9f6cec5845d@[216.229.107.153]>

>This isn't the case with transparent GIFs and PNGs, at least in MetaCard.
>All transparent pixels in these images ignore mouse events, so you can
>indeed have irregular regions that respond appropriately to mouse clicks.
>Test this for yourself and see if you get the same results.

Scott, et al:

It works that way for me...but, as noted previously, my issue has to 
do with changing the background color of an irregular region.

And while I'm on the subject, here's a similar issue I'll need a 
solution for soon:

Suppose I have a "round" button depicting a wine barrel.  If the 
barrel is half full of wine, I want to show the inside of the barrel 
half full; if it's 3/4 full I want to show the inside of the barrel 
3/4 full.  The basic mechanism I used in HyperCard was to place a 
highlighted button behind the barrel button and adjust the top of the 
button to the correct height.  Once again, I see no way of doing this 
with rectangular buttons without painting an opaque border around the 
hilited button, and in this case the workaround would be to create 
different icons for every possible setting (eg: 1 pixel full, 2 
pixels full, etc), which is worse than drawing a new mask for each 
background the buttons are placed on.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Tue Nov 12 10:57:07 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Tue Nov 12 10:57:07 2002
Subject: Newbie Questions!
In-Reply-To: <B3763D69-F5FA-11D6-A815-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
References: <B3763D69-F5FA-11D6-A815-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05100303b9f6d20948be@[216.229.107.153]>

>My problem really is being able to specify more than one element to 
>a file, and then being able to read them back.

Igor,

As others have suggested, a stack is probably easier to use for this 
purpose than a data file.  One can simply install the images in the 
stack and place the text in a field or stack property.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Tue Nov 12 11:25:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Tue Nov 12 11:25:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <a05100302b9f6cec5845d@[216.229.107.153]>
References: <B9F5B49B.9052%scott@tactilemedia.com>
 <a05100302b9f6cec5845d@[216.229.107.153]>
Message-ID: <a05100300b9f6d9650379@[216.229.107.219]>

>>This isn't the case with transparent GIFs and PNGs, at least in MetaCard.
>>All transparent pixels in these images ignore mouse events, so you can
>>indeed have irregular regions that respond appropriately to mouse clicks.
>>Test this for yourself and see if you get the same results.
>
>Scott, et al:
>
>It works that way for me...

Oops! I spoke too soon: All transparent pixels in these images ignore 
mouse events IF the image is directly clickable; however, if the 
image is attached to a button as an icon, the button responds to 
mouse events anywhere in the rect of the mouse.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From chipp at chipp.com  Tue Nov 12 11:28:00 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Tue Nov 12 11:28:00 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <a05100300b9f6c9df5db1@[216.229.107.153]>
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOMEMHCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>

> I have a "round" button named "Clock" and a series of transparent,
> round clock-face icons depicting clock hand positions for all
> possible times of day (in five minute increments).
>
> I want to be able to change the clock's background color to depict
> daytime (6 AM - 5:55 PM) vs nighttime (6 PM - 5:55 AM) hours.  How
> can I change the background color inside the circular image without
> changing the color of the button's corners protruding around the
> circular image.

Rob, is the button round or rectangular. You talk about the button's
corners, but a round button has no corners - so I'm not sure I understand
exactly the question.

If I were to try and create the effect I *think* you're after, I'd probably
overlay a circular graphic with a color and use one of the ink effects to
create a see-thru effect. Or, I would use a single transparent circular.gif
and set the the blendLevel of it to a transparent number. Of course you'll
need to pass the mouseUp event (or others if you use them) through it.

Also, don't forget you can set the backPattern of a graphic to an image. Not
sure if it will help, but it is an interesting way to crop images to a
circle.

hope this helps.

-Chipp



From mswindel at santacruz.k12.ca.us  Tue Nov 12 11:42:01 2002
From: mswindel at santacruz.k12.ca.us (Mark Swindell)
Date: Tue Nov 12 11:42:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <a05100300b9f6c9df5db1@[216.229.107.153]>
Message-ID: <B9F669F8.38B3%mswindel@santacruz.k12.ca.us>

on 11/12/02 7:24 AM, Rob Cozens at rcozens at pon.net wrote:

> 
> Here's the issue I am dealing with:
> 
> I have a "round" button named "Clock" and a series of transparent,
> round clock-face icons depicting clock hand positions for all
> possible times of day (in five minute increments).
> 
> I want to be able to change the clock's background color to depict
> daytime (6 AM - 5:55 PM) vs nighttime (6 PM - 5:55 AM) hours.  How
> can I change the background color inside the circular image without
> changing the color of the button's corners protruding around the
> circular image.


I'm not sure I understand... why does it have to be a button?  Why not use a
graphic and change the bg color in the graphic script?

Mark Swindel



From chipp at chipp.com  Tue Nov 12 11:43:00 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Tue Nov 12 11:43:00 2002
Subject: Exporting images
In-Reply-To: <B9F6812B.458A%mazzapaolo@libero.it>
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOGEMICJAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Paolo,

Yo don't have to do a repeat within a repeat. If the image sizes are exactly
the same, you needn't do rows and columns, you'll just need to increment
your pixel pointer by 4 each time. Then you can add the R1,G1,B1 values to
the R2,G2,B2 values. Don't forget to check for max clipping--the values can
only be 255 or smaller.

You might want to check out my image compositing library at:
http://www.altuit.com/webs/altuit2/RunRev/Downloads.htm

There's a small bug in the fillImage handler...I need to post the fix.

-Chipp

> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of paolo mazza
> Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 2:58 AM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Re:Exporting images
>
>
> I have beeen looking for a solution to this problem for a long time.
> As far as I know in Rev we are supposed to take a shapshot of the screen.
> I tryed to merge images using imagedata and maskdata. It works but the
> process is slow and unstable. Perhaps you can do a better job.
> I posted this script at the page:
>
> http://wiki.macitworks.com/revdocs/2380
>
> Ciao,
> Paolo
>
> > From: use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com
> > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 21:58:13 -0500
> > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #831 - 17 msgs
> >
> > Message: 14
> > Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 12:38:13 +1100
> > From: Brendan Bonsack <brendan at poolcreative.com>
> > To: "use-revolution at lists.runrev.com" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> > Subject: Exporting images
> > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> >
> > Hello list gurus
> >
> > Can anyone think of a way to produce this effect:
> >
> > I need to be able to export an image to JPEG format from a mixture of
> > imported graphics and "drawn" graphics on a stack. My method so far has
> > been to layer images and graphic controls over each other in the stack,
> > let the user manipulate them, etc, and then to take a screen snapshot of
> > the "mix" and export the snapshot to a single JPEG file. This is flawed,
> > however, since if the image is larger than the stack only the visible
> > part will export, and if a palette is over the image at the time of the
> > snapshot, that gets captured too! I know I can hide palettes for the
> > sake of the snapshot, but the first problem I can't work out at all.
> >
> > Does anyone know of a method to "merge" a number of images into one?
> >
> >
> > Cheers
> > Brendan Bonsack
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Tue Nov 12 11:52:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Tue Nov 12 11:52:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
References: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOMEMHCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <01a101c28a6a$6471a0d0$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> Rob, is the button round or rectangular. You talk about the button's
> corners, but a round button has no corners - so I'm not sure I understand
> exactly the question.

Chipp, I think Rob answered that in his last post... he was talking about a
round image as the icon of a button object, vs. using an image itself as a
"button".

Rob, there's a lot you can do with images as buttons; you don't specifically
have all the button properties available, but you can set the
backgroundPattern or backgroundColor of an image so that might help your
situation. For example, if you make the clock face such that the "white"
areas inside the clock are actually transparent, and then set the
backgroundColor of the image to white, you *should* see a white clock. If
you then set it to yellow, you see a yellow clock. I'm doing this from
memory, but try it out... it might just work.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From alex at mindlube.com  Tue Nov 12 12:13:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Tue Nov 12 12:13:01 2002
Subject: rectangle button q's
In-Reply-To: <v03130310b9f647e3f54f@[10.0.1.5]>
Message-ID: <2C420582-F661-11D6-BC5C-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Monday, November 11, 2002, at 10:54  PM, Jeanne A. E. DeVoto wrote:

> At 5:12 PM -0800 11/11/02, Alex Rice wrote:
>> 2) When the rectangle style button is selected, and the "hilite
>> background" property is yes, then button highlights when clicked,
>> drawing a dark blue background color. How can I change that dark blue
>> hilite color?
>
> Set the button's hiliteColor to the color you want.
>
Thanks, that was easier than I thought. :-) I was thrown off because 
the color panel showed white for hiliteColor but I was seeing a dark 
blue.



Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Tue Nov 12 13:27:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Tue Nov 12 13:27:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 now 2.0
In-Reply-To: <200211121702.MAA02727@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <8BEEE01F-F66B-11D6-B2ED-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Dienstag, November 12, 2002, at 06:02  Uhr, 
use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote:

> I'm not sure I understand... why does it have to be a button?  Why not 
> use a
> graphic and change the bg color in the graphic script?

if you have a few buttons only, yes that could be a solution...
But I dont know how to make it flash, rollover or transparent?
Is this possible with a script?
I think it must be a "double graphic" button...
But what format would be the best, if it should be transparent and 
resizable?
How big would the size of this "double graphic" button be?
50kb, 100, 150kb or more... (my background-gifs for about 15-30 buttons 
are between 8-12kb)
And all that: *500 or thousand(s)...

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From scott at tactilemedia.com  Tue Nov 12 13:27:30 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Tue Nov 12 13:27:30 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <a05100300b9f6c9df5db1@[216.229.107.153]>
Message-ID: <B9F68699.5365%scott@tactilemedia.com>

> Here's the issue I am dealing with:
> 
> I have a "round" button named "Clock" and a series of transparent,
> round clock-face icons depicting clock hand positions for all
> possible times of day (in five minute increments).
> 
> I want to be able to change the clock's background color to depict
> daytime (6 AM - 5:55 PM) vs nighttime (6 PM - 5:55 AM) hours.  How
> can I change the background color inside the circular image without
> changing the color of the button's corners protruding around the
> circular image.

Chip Walters has already explained one way to achieve this.  Just remember
there's no need to use buttons to grab mouseclicks; any object will work.

Another way to do the above is to use a transparent circular graphic to grab
the mouseclicks and display the clock faces in a button behind the graphic.
Why do this?  Because this way you can place the clock face images anywhere
you want in the stack, even off screen or in a separate substack, and then
display them at will in the button by setting the button's icon to the id of
the desired face image.  You don't need to worry about aligning all the
clock images or repositioning them if you edit the stack.  Sometimes folks
who come from a SuperCard background lament the absence of the pictureData
property of graphics in MC, but in reality, the feature is available, just
as the icon property of buttons.

Another thing to consider is whether or not you need any soft edges in your
clock image.  If you do, use a 24 bit PNG image with translucency -- your
clock will look nicely rendered.

And here's one last trick: if a GIF is suitable for your needs (one level of
transparency) you can use an animated GIF that contains each clock face on a
separate frame.  When you need to change the clock, simply script "set the
currentFrame of img myClock to x" where x is the frame number of the
appropriate clock face.

When it comes to screen display of images and graphics, Scott Raney's
catchphrase "There's a better way to do that" has never been more true.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-----
E: scott at tactilemedia.com
W: http://www.tactilemedia.com



From terry at discovery.nl  Tue Nov 12 13:28:00 2002
From: terry at discovery.nl (Terry Vogelaar)
Date: Tue Nov 12 13:28:00 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0
In-Reply-To: <9C998D18-F627-11D6-9A02-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <8A4ECCE6-F66B-11D6-9A0D-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>

>> In the cases a non-rectangular clickable area is needed, a script 
>> that does some calculations with the mouse location could provide a 
>> solution for those cases. Still there are cases imaginable where this 
>> also wouldn't help. But to introduce a true non-rectangular button 
>> just for those rare cases seems overkill. RunRev is not the right app 
>> for 100% of all the development work, but it sure covers 90 to 99%.
>
> Rare cases??
> What you have on more than 50% of the sites on the net and on nearly 
> every MM App?
> Sorry, but thats *not* an overkill. Thats urgently needed!!

I don't underestimate the need for non-rect btns (although you probably 
overestimate it), but I think the cases where a non-rectangular 
clickable area is needed that cannot be handled by a script doing 
calculations with the mouse loc to determine the right action, is very 
rare.

Terry




From wmb at internettrainer.com  Tue Nov 12 13:32:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Tue Nov 12 13:32:01 2002
Subject: building Mac OSX-stand-alones problem
In-Reply-To: <200211120818.DAA24179@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <3D051115-F66C-11D6-B2ED-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Dienstag, November 12, 2002, at 09:18  Uhr, 
use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote:

> I was successfully building Mac OS X stand-alone versions of a
> revolution stack that I'm working on.  Now suddenly every time I
> build a new stand-alone, despite selecting the OS X Standalone
> option, Revolution builds a 'classic' stand-alone application--this
> despite the fact that the folder in which the stand-alone is created
> is correctly labeled as 'Standalone_MacOSX'.  Can anyone suggest what
> is happening??
>
> rob crutcher
>
> BTW I am running the OS X version of Revolution 1.1.1 and Mac OS 10.2.1
...
We are in the middle of november...
If you *can* wait, wait for 2.0...
Thats my 2cents...

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From chipp at chipp.com  Tue Nov 12 15:00:00 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Tue Nov 12 15:00:00 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <B9F68699.5365%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCMENFDGAA.chipp@chipp.com>

> And here's one last trick: if a GIF is suitable for your needs
> (one level of
> transparency) you can use an animated GIF that contains each
> clock face on a
> separate frame.  When you need to change the clock, simply script "set the
> currentFrame of img myClock to x" where x is the frame number of the
> appropriate clock face.

my personal favorite. You could have different images for night and day.
Let's see. 12 images per hour * 24 hours per day = 288 separate
images...lot's of images to keep track of *unless* it's one GIF file.

Some points to note:

1) don't forget to
set the repeatcount of img "myClock" to 0

2) You don't what to use frame differencing or bounding box removal settings
for the GIF. Each frame should be a complete picture in itself.

-Chipp



From alex at mindlube.com  Tue Nov 12 16:27:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Tue Nov 12 16:27:01 2002
Subject: insert script into back?
Message-ID: <8995C501-F684-11D6-970A-000393529642@mindlube.com>

insert script of stack "MyMainStack" into back

Somewhere I found this code snippet, without a real good explanation of 
why one would need it. Does this transcript do anything really? Doesn't 
the mainstack already catch all messages by virtue of being the main 
stack?

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Tue Nov 12 16:45:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Tue Nov 12 16:45:01 2002
Subject: insert script into back?
In-Reply-To: <8995C501-F684-11D6-970A-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <20021112213848.81996.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Alex Rice <alex at mindlube.com> wrote:
> insert script of stack "MyMainStack" into back
> 
> Somewhere I found this code snippet, without a real
> good explanation of 
> why one would need it. Does this transcript do
> anything really? Doesn't 
> the mainstack already catch all messages by virtue
> of being the main 
> stack?
> 

Yes it does, but sometimes you might want to s?tup
something from a library stack to catch all the
messages.
The backScripts sit just before the engine, but behind
the stacksInUse. So you could use them (for example)
to complement certain standard behaviour.

As for frontScripts, you can use those (for example)
to check input in fields by inserting the script of a
library field in the front on openField.

Pretty powerful things, frontScripts and backScripts,
though admittedly I only use frontScripts.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2


From matt.denton at limelight.com.au  Tue Nov 12 17:36:01 2002
From: matt.denton at limelight.com.au (Matt Denton)
Date: Tue Nov 12 17:36:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0) The Transparent Button Issue
In-Reply-To: <200211121702.MAA02774@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <4722DE8C-F68E-11D6-84B5-000393924880@limelight.com.au>

Hiya Rob

We delivered a CD-ROM multimedia project last week and in it we had 
similar transparent buttons (ours was a map for kids with animals, not 
wine barrels).  Here's what I found:

Use the irregular polygon filled with black.  Draw around your image.  
Set the ink to NOOP (I guess this is the old NO OPeration) as some 
other inks have problems when building as a standalone, not sure 
exactly why but Windows didn't like many of the inks, even the inks 
that were supposed to work on all platforms. Problem only appears as 
the standalone.

Of course as you have discovered, transparent pixels on a PNG don't get 
mouse events!  This is truly wonderful and makes the whole process of 
creating irregular buttons easy.  In my case, I used the above polygon 
to trace out a larger click area around the object (kids don't always 
click inside small objects), also I didn't want 'holes' and transparent 
bits in the centre to not be click-able.

I had my script in the polygon, we had no need to send click events it 
to another button.

(On another matter: for those kind Rev-elers that had a look at my 
first alpha of Jump Scripts a new version will be coming shortly!  We 
have just been extremely busy at the office with four multimedia, DVD 
and web projects delivered simultaneously last week and three this. 
Sleep, what's that?)

Hope this helps.  Still a bit of mystery why when you build the 
standalone for Windows the inks change but anyway NOOP works well, 
tested on 12 different Macs and PCs.

Cheers

M@
Matt Denton



From gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net  Tue Nov 12 17:47:01 2002
From: gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net (Gary Aitcheson)
Date: Tue Nov 12 17:47:01 2002
Subject: Web Access + Port Control
Message-ID: <20021112224032.22814.qmail@web80107.mail.yahoo.com>

An update on my problem with using revGoURL with XP and an SBCGlobal DSL connection. It seems that the DSL software also installed an SBC browser. Somewhere in the process this added extra characters to an address sent with revGoURL and did not work. I am happy to say that changing the XP system settings back to Internet Explorer has fixed the problem. Thanks for all the useful suggestions.But now another problem. My DSL connection is through the USB port on phone line A.  I can access the web and use RR to dial phone numbers through an internal modem on phone line B. However when I listen to LaunchCast I cannot access the modem port with the usual 'open file "com3:" for write' command. LaunchCast is set to download music through the DSL connection, but it appears to commandeer the modem port as well. The port becomes available as soon as I shut down LaunchCast. Is there any other way regain access to it through RR?Thanks for the reminder to post my messages in Plain Text. Currently I have the SBC Yahoo Mail system that comes with the DSL and it does not appear to offer a Plain option. It is probably possible to change to OutLook which would be better, but I have not had time to do that yet. And maybe I can build something better within RR using the improvements coming later this month.As I write I see that there is a "Plain" button lurking up the top of this page. I will use it and see if it removes the formatting. Appologies if it does not. Sorry If I do not have all the technical terminology correct - but I think you can get the idea.Happy programming y'all - Gary
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From kray at sonsothunder.com  Tue Nov 12 22:32:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Tue Nov 12 22:32:01 2002
Subject: Web Access + Port Control
References: <20021112224032.22814.qmail@web80107.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <006001c28ac3$a1bb07c0$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Uh, Gary... it *did* remove the formatting... and all the line breaks as
well. Fine for a short post, but if you post a long one with code in it, it
will be pretty hard to read.

Outlook sounds like a good option to me. ;-)

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Aitcheson" <gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net>
To: "RUG" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 4:40 PM
Subject: Web Access + Port Control


> An update on my problem with using revGoURL with XP and an SBCGlobal DSL
connection. It seems that the DSL software also installed an SBC browser.
Somewhere in the process this added extra characters to an address sent with
revGoURL and did not work. I am happy to say that changing the XP system
settings back to Internet Explorer has fixed the problem. Thanks for all the
useful suggestions.But now another problem. My DSL connection is through the
USB port on phone line A.  I can access the web and use RR to dial phone
numbers through an internal modem on phone line B. However when I listen to
LaunchCast I cannot access the modem port with the usual 'open file "com3:"
for write' command. LaunchCast is set to download music through the DSL
connection, but it appears to commandeer the modem port as well. The port
becomes available as soon as I shut down LaunchCast. Is there any other way
regain access to it through RR?Thanks for the reminder to post my messages
in Plain Text. Cur!
> rently I have the SBC Yahoo Mail system that comes with the DSL and it
does not appear to offer a Plain option. It is probably possible to change
to OutLook which would be better, but I have not had time to do that yet.
And maybe I can build something better within RR using the improvements
coming later this month.As I write I see that there is a "Plain" button
lurking up the top of this page. I will use it and see if it removes the
formatting. Appologies if it does not. Sorry If I do not have all the
technical terminology correct - but I think you can get the idea.Happy
programming y'all - Gary



From gslj at intergate.ca  Tue Nov 12 23:22:00 2002
From: gslj at intergate.ca (Gareth Jones)
Date: Tue Nov 12 23:22:00 2002
Subject: Several questions about the Menu Mgr
In-Reply-To: <v0313030db9f5eb4eba21@[10.0.1.5]>
References: <v0313030db9f5eb4eba21@[10.0.1.5]>
Message-ID: <a05111a03b9f77f099941@[216.113.201.101]>

Thanks, Jeanne. That sounds a lot simpler than the workaround I came 
up with: use the Application Overview to see the button text of the 
menu, copy it, paste it into a word processor, enter tabs, then paste 
it back into the Application Overview! Come to think of it, my 
solution is pretty close to what Ken Ray suggested that I do. Thanks, 
Ken.

Now, about the other questions: can I specify a keyboard equivalent 
of a menu item that needs Command+Shiftkey+letter or a Function key 
(e.g. F2)?

-Gareth

>At 9:51 AM -0800 11/11/02, Gareth Jones wrote:
>>I did read Richard Gaskins' recent e-mail about hierarchical menus.
>>where he seemed to say that entering <tab)menuname would do it. If I
>>type <tab>menuname into the Menu Manager, however, the resulting menu
>>item shows in the main menu as "ab>menuname" ... and if I press the
>>tab key, it just pops into the next text entry field, so that doesn't
>>work :-)
>
>Not literally "<tab>" - a tab character.
>
>In the Menu Manager, you can insert the tab character by selecting the menu
>item, then clicking the right-arrow icon to the right of the menu name (its
>tooltip is "Make the selected menu item into a submenu item"). If you're
>building the menu in a handler, you'd use something like
>   put "First Item" & tab & return & "Subitem" & return \
>      & "Last Item" into button "File"
>
>--
>Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
>Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
>http://www.runrev.com/
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>use-revolution mailing list
>use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Wed Nov 13 02:23:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Wed Nov 13 02:23:01 2002
Subject: Global /local variables
In-Reply-To: <001801c2890a$c1e4c9b0$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <20021113071629.95813.qmail@web20007.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Ken Ray <kray at sonsothunder.com> wrote:

> Locals are the same as globals, except that
> they cannot have a scope outside
> of a single script. If you declare them inside
> of a handler, they apply only
> to that handler. If you declare them inside of
> a script, they are available
> to any handler in that script only. Other
> scripts don't "see" them.

i like declaring locals mainly to control the
order in which the variables are displayed during
debugging. are there any other important reasons
for declaring locally?

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2


From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Wed Nov 13 02:33:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Wed Nov 13 02:33:01 2002
Subject: when will rev 2.0 ship?
In-Reply-To: <6F702221-F571-11D6-B28F-003065AD94A4@mac.com>
References: <6F702221-F571-11D6-B28F-003065AD94A4@mac.com>
Message-ID: <a05200a05b9f7af0c8897@[65.59.178.243]>

anybody got an answer to the subject line's question?  thanks.  olli.


From JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com  Wed Nov 13 02:47:01 2002
From: JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com (JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com)
Date: Wed Nov 13 02:47:01 2002
Subject: Get Popup submenu name
Message-ID: <F14C380BA911D211B58A0008C724468D077B465F@JANBEBEEXS5.eu.jnj.com>

Dear

yesterday evening I was trying to get the
value(or name) of a submenu of popup list.
let me explain it a litle bit

I have a Popup menu which is named Platform
	when you klik on it you get a list of platforms
	f.e.  - PC
		- Linux
		- Macintosh

now when a user slects on of the items
I want to put this as a text i a Global or Local var

but i dont seem to find any function or command in the dicionary
that does something like this

where am i going wrong?
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From mazzapaolo at libero.it  Wed Nov 13 03:15:01 2002
From: mazzapaolo at libero.it (paolo mazza)
Date: Wed Nov 13 03:15:01 2002
Subject: Exporting images
In-Reply-To: <200211121702.MAA02774@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <B9F7CB29.45C0%mazzapaolo@libero.it>

Actually I wuold like to merge images of different size....that's I had to
check rows and colums.

> Yo don't have to do a repeat within a repeat. If the image sizes are exactly
> the same, you needn't do rows and columns, you'll just need to increment
> your pixel pointer by 4 each time. Then you can add the R1,G1,B1 values to
> the R2,G2,B2 values. Don't forget to check for max clipping--the values can
> only be 255 or smaller.
> 
> You might want to check out my image compositing library at:
> http://www.altuit.com/webs/altuit2/RunRev/Downloads.htm

I had a look to your script. It is great.
Still I wonder how can I merge images of different size and how can I speed
up this process.
 
> There's a small bug in the fillImage handler...I need to post the fix.
> 
> -Chipp

Thanks for your help.
Paolo



From mazzapaolo at libero.it  Wed Nov 13 05:14:01 2002
From: mazzapaolo at libero.it (paolo mazza)
Date: Wed Nov 13 05:14:01 2002
Subject: Transparent Images
In-Reply-To: <200211121702.MAA02774@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <B9F7D790.45C4%mazzapaolo@libero.it>

All transparent pixels in  images ignore mouse events.
How can I change this?
I wuold like transparent pixels of my images  answer to mouse events and I
do not want to set the image as the icon of a button.
Any idea?
Thanks,  Paolo



From Timothy_Hart at umit.maine.edu  Wed Nov 13 06:53:01 2002
From: Timothy_Hart at umit.maine.edu (Timothy Hart)
Date: Wed Nov 13 06:53:01 2002
Subject: when will rev 2.0 ship?
In-Reply-To: <a05200a05b9f7af0c8897@[65.59.178.243]>
References: <a05200a05b9f7af0c8897@[65.59.178.243]>
Message-ID: <fc.004c4d190fb7221c3b9aca00432a8736.fb72275@umit.maine.edu>

Feels like forever.  Let's hope not the 30th.  If that is the case they should have just said December.  Not that I am complaining or anything.  I am just very eager to use it.

-Tim









From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Wed Nov 13 07:27:00 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Wed Nov 13 07:27:00 2002
Subject: Get Popup submenu name
In-Reply-To: <F14C380BA911D211B58A0008C724468D077B465F@JANBEBEEXS5.eu.jnj.com>
Message-ID: <20021113122111.56721.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>

--- JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com wrote:
> Dear
> 
> yesterday evening I was trying to get the
> value(or name) of a submenu of popup list.
> let me explain it a litle bit
> 
> I have a Popup menu which is named Platform
> 	when you klik on it you get a list of platforms
> 	f.e.  - PC
> 		- Linux
> 		- Macintosh
> 
> now when a user slects on of the items
> I want to put this as a text i a Global or Local var
> 
> but i dont seem to find any function or command in
> the dicionary
> that does something like this
> 
> where am i going wrong?
> 

RR sends a 'menuPick' event upon selection of an item
in a menu button, so I suggest you look it up in the
Transcript language dictionary.

Set the script of your popup button to this:

on menuPick pWhichItem
  global gSomeGlobal
  put pWhichItem into gSomeGlobal
end menuPick

If you want to know which item is currently selected,
have a look at the 'menuHistory' property in the
Trascript language dictionary.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2


From kevin at runrev.com  Wed Nov 13 08:00:01 2002
From: kevin at runrev.com (Kevin Miller)
Date: Wed Nov 13 08:00:01 2002
Subject: when will rev 2.0 ship?
In-Reply-To: <fc.004c4d190fb7221c3b9aca00432a8736.fb72275@umit.maine.edu>
Message-ID: <B9F7FBAD.CF03%kevin@runrev.com>

On 13/11/02 11:46 am, Timothy Hart <Timothy_Hart at umit.maine.edu> wrote:

> Feels like forever.  Let's hope not the 30th.  If that is the case they should
> have just said December.  Not that I am complaining or anything.  I am just
> very eager to use it.

We don't have an exact date yet.  All I can say is that everyone is working
around the clock to bring out what should be a really exciting release!

Kevin

Kevin Miller <kevin at runrev.com> <http://www.runrev.com/>
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
Tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165.  Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707.



From mazzapaolo at libero.it  Wed Nov 13 09:02:01 2002
From: mazzapaolo at libero.it (paolo mazza)
Date: Wed Nov 13 09:02:01 2002
Subject: backColor of image
In-Reply-To: <200211130725.CAA14505@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <B9F81C72.45CE%mazzapaolo@libero.it>

on MouseUp
  set the backgroundcolor of image "image1" to 0,0,0
end MouseUp

This button change the BackColor property of "image1" but the image does not
change at all. Why?
An image has a backcolor or not?
Ciao, Paolo





From ivan at kagi.com  Wed Nov 13 09:11:01 2002
From: ivan at kagi.com (Ivan Gobbo)
Date: Wed Nov 13 09:11:01 2002
Subject: Slide show application that runs on Windows
In-Reply-To: <B9F81C72.45CE%mazzapaolo@libero.it>
Message-ID: <B9F81A46.118B1%ivan@kagi.com>

Hi all,

is somebody of this list that wrote a slide show application that andle
images and QT muvies that runs (fine) on Windows?

I would like to propose a collaboration.

Thank you

Ivan
--
Apimac - Easy to use but powerful software.
Our web address is <http://www.apimac.com>.


> on MouseUp
> set the backgroundcolor of image "image1" to 0,0,0
> end MouseUp
> 
> This button change the BackColor property of "image1" but the image does not
> change at all. Why?
> An image has a backcolor or not?
> Ciao, Paolo
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From ludovic.thebault at laposte.net  Wed Nov 13 09:49:01 2002
From: ludovic.thebault at laposte.net (Ludovic Thebault)
Date: Wed Nov 13 09:49:01 2002
Subject: How drag text in a list field ?
Message-ID: <3DD264A6.50709@laposte.net>

I want to drag a line in a list field but the drag n'drop doesn't work 
in this field

I try to script it but i can't.



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Wed Nov 13 10:18:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Wed Nov 13 10:18:01 2002
Subject: How drag text in a list field ?
In-Reply-To: <3DD264A6.50709@laposte.net>
Message-ID: <20021113151203.76960.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Ludovic Thebault <ludovic.thebault at laposte.net>
wrote:
> I want to drag a line in a list field but the drag
> n'drop doesn't work 
> in this field
> 
> I try to script it but i can't.
> 

Hi Ludovic,

A quick trip to the archives gave the following links:

http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2002-February/002442.html
http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2002-February/002562.html

Hope this helped, even if it's not clean code.

Best regards,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Wed Nov 13 10:20:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Wed Nov 13 10:20:01 2002
Subject: backColor of image
In-Reply-To: <B9F81C72.45CE%mazzapaolo@libero.it>
Message-ID: <20021113151416.77213.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>

--- paolo mazza <mazzapaolo at libero.it> wrote:
> on MouseUp
>   set the backgroundcolor of image "image1" to 0,0,0
> end MouseUp
> 
> This button change the BackColor property of
> "image1" but the image does not
> change at all. Why?
> An image has a backcolor or not?
> Ciao, Paolo
> 

Hi Paolo,

My best guess (I don't do graphic/multimedia stuff) is
that this would be the color used to represent the
transparent pixels, possibly depending on the ink
settings?

Just a thought,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2


From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com  Wed Nov 13 10:42:01 2002
From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon)
Date: Wed Nov 13 10:42:01 2002
Subject: insert script into back?
In-Reply-To: <8995C501-F684-11D6-970A-000393529642@mindlube.com>
References: <8995C501-F684-11D6-970A-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <a05100328b9f820c196c8@[206.117.139.191]>

>insert script of stack "MyMainStack" into back
>
>Somewhere I found this code snippet, without a real good explanation of why one would need it. Does this transcript do anything really? Doesn't the mainstack already catch all messages by virtue of being the main stack?
>
>Alex Rice, Software Developer
>Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
>alrice at swcp.com
>alex_rice at arc.to

You might have more than one main stack open. This makes "MyMainStack" sort of a super main stack, getting messages sent in other main stacks after the other main stacks have had a chance.
-- 

regards,

Geoff Canyon
gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com


From JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com  Wed Nov 13 11:28:00 2002
From: JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com (JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com)
Date: Wed Nov 13 11:28:00 2002
Subject: Get Popup submenu name
Message-ID: <F14C380BA911D211B58A0008C724468D077B4661@JANBEBEEXS5.eu.jnj.com>

Thanks 
this works

-----Original Message-----
From: Jan Schenkel [mailto:janschenkel at yahoo.com]
Sent: Wednesday, 13 November 2002 13:21
To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
Subject: Re: Get Popup submenu name


--- JVTONGEL at janbe.jnj.com wrote:
> Dear
> 
> yesterday evening I was trying to get the
> value(or name) of a submenu of popup list.
> let me explain it a litle bit
> 
> I have a Popup menu which is named Platform
> 	when you klik on it you get a list of platforms
> 	f.e.  - PC
> 		- Linux
> 		- Macintosh
> 
> now when a user slects on of the items
> I want to put this as a text i a Global or Local var
> 
> but i dont seem to find any function or command in
> the dicionary
> that does something like this
> 
> where am i going wrong?
> 

RR sends a 'menuPick' event upon selection of an item
in a menu button, so I suggest you look it up in the
Transcript language dictionary.

Set the script of your popup button to this:

on menuPick pWhichItem
  global gSomeGlobal
  put pWhichItem into gSomeGlobal
end menuPick

If you want to know which item is currently selected,
have a look at the 'menuHistory' property in the
Trascript language dictionary.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."
(La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2
_______________________________________________
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
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From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 11:28:21 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 11:28:21 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOMEMHCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>
References: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOMEMHCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <a05100300b9f812195a77@[216.229.107.240]>

>  > I have a "round" button named "Clock" and a series of transparent,
>>  round clock-face icons depicting clock hand positions for all
>  > possible times of day (in five minute increments).
>>
>[snip]
>Rob, is the button round or rectangular. You talk about the button's
>corners, but a round button has no corners - so I'm not sure I understand
>exactly the question.

Chipp,

My original question had to do with whether buttons and other 
controls could have irregular shapes in v2.0.  So far as I know, true 
round buttons do not exist in RunRev; so I wrote "round" in quotes to 
denote the appearance of the button, not its actual shape.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 11:28:28 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 11:28:28 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <B9F669F8.38B3%mswindel@santacruz.k12.ca.us>
References: <B9F669F8.38B3%mswindel@santacruz.k12.ca.us>
Message-ID: <a05100301b9f8138cb1bb@[216.229.107.240]>

>I'm not sure I understand... why does it have to be a button?  Why not use a
>graphic and change the bg color in the graphic script?

Hi Mark,

The problem with that approach is the clock appears on 25-30% of the 
cards in the stack; so the 150(+-) images would have to be duplicated 
around ten times and installed on each card where time is displayed 
or entered.

BTW, I briefly considered writing a general-purpose handler that 
would draw the the clock face on-the-fly; but the icon approach is 
working in HC and I'd rather not make that design change at a time 
when I'm rushing to complete conversion.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 11:28:35 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 11:28:35 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <01a101c28a6a$6471a0d0$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom>
References: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOMEMHCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>
 <01a101c28a6a$6471a0d0$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <a05100302b9f8180bc003@[216.229.107.240]>

>you can set the
>backgroundPattern or backgroundColor of an image so that might help your
>situation. For example, if you make the clock face such that the "white"
>areas inside the clock are actually transparent, and then set the
>backgroundColor of the image to white, you *should* see a white clock.

Thanks for the suggestion, Ken; but by setting the background color & 
opaqueness of the button I get a black clock face inside a white 
square.  The background color property populates the entire rectangle 
of the button, not just the portion within the round image.

I might note that in HC, setting the hilite of a transparent button 
causes the button colors to invert within the icon image only.  So 
far as I can tell, this effect is not possible in RunRev short of 
producing a set of hilited images and setting the button's hilited 
icon.  If the button is not opaque, setting/changing the background 
color has no visible effect; if it is opaque, hiliting the button 
hilites its entire rectangle.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 11:28:44 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 11:28:44 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOMEMHCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>
References: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOMEMHCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <a05100303b9f81d6e0417@[216.229.107.240]>

Chipp, et al:


>If I were to try and create the effect I *think* you're after, I'd probably
>overlay a circular graphic with a color and use one of the ink effects to
>create a see-thru effect. Or, I would use a single transparent circular.gif
>and set the the blendLevel of it to a transparent number. Of course you'll
>need to pass the mouseUp event (or others if you use them) through it.

I don't think this will do it for me; but I'm willing to experiment 
if you think it will work.  My issue here is I don't want any colors 
in the non-transparent portion of the image to change; just the 
background color of the button and just within the confines of the 
round icon image:

1. Create a circular image with a transparent center.
2. Make the image a button icon (remember the image appears on 25-30% 
of the cards in the stack).
3. How to make the area under the inside the circle change color 
without changing images or coloring the portions of the button 
outside the image?

>Also, don't forget you can set the backPattern of a graphic to an image. Not
>sure if it will help, but it is an interesting way to crop images to a
>circle.

I don't understand the technique you're describing here...could you 
please restate this sentence or provide an example?

-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 11:28:53 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 11:28:53 2002
Subject: when will rev 2.0 ship?
In-Reply-To: <a05200a05b9f7af0c8897@[65.59.178.243]>
References: <6F702221-F571-11D6-B28F-003065AD94A4@mac.com>
 <a05200a05b9f7af0c8897@[65.59.178.243]>
Message-ID: <a05100308b9f829b3e603@[216.229.107.240]>

>anybody got an answer to the subject line's question?

Hi Oliver,

If anyone does, it's Rod...

                 but he couldn't possibly comment.   :{`)
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 11:29:04 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 11:29:04 2002
Subject: backColor of image
In-Reply-To: <B9F81C72.45CE%mazzapaolo@libero.it>
References: <B9F81C72.45CE%mazzapaolo@libero.it>
Message-ID: <a0510030ab9f82b0635c1@[216.229.107.240]>

>on MouseUp
>   set the backgroundcolor of image "image1" to 0,0,0
>end MouseUp
>
>This button change the BackColor property of "image1" but the image does not
>change at all. Why?
>An image has a backcolor or not?

Paolo,

Try changing the image from transparent to opaque.  I have not worked 
much with directly-clickable images because most of my images appear 
more than once in a stack; however I know that a transparent button 
does not display a background color but an opaque one does.

Ciao!
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From ludovic.thebault at laposte.net  Wed Nov 13 11:33:01 2002
From: ludovic.thebault at laposte.net (Ludovic Thebault)
Date: Wed Nov 13 11:33:01 2002
Subject: How drag text in a list field ?
References: <20021113151203.76960.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3DD27D0B.8040104@laposte.net>

> A quick trip to the archives gave the following links:

Thanks.
I know now why that didn't work. !



From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 11:41:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 11:41:01 2002
Subject: Transparent Images
In-Reply-To: <B9F7D790.45C4%mazzapaolo@libero.it>
References: <B9F7D790.45C4%mazzapaolo@libero.it>
Message-ID: <a05100309b9f82a370522@[216.229.107.240]>

>All transparent pixels in  images ignore mouse events.
>How can I change this?
>I wuold like transparent pixels of my images  answer to mouse events and I
>do not want to set the image as the icon of a button.

Bon journo, Paolo:

Place a button with this handler behind the image:

on mouseUp
    send mouseUp to image [your image name or "id" + image id here]
end mouseUp

Ciao!
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 11:42:28 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 11:42:28 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCMENFDGAA.chipp@chipp.com>
References: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCMENFDGAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <a05100304b9f82099c2bc@[216.229.107.240]>

>  > And here's one last trick: if a GIF is suitable for your needs
>>  (one level of
>>  transparency) you can use an animated GIF that contains each
>>  clock face on a
>>  separate frame.  When you need to change the clock, simply script "set the
>>  currentFrame of img myClock to x" where x is the frame number of the
>>  appropriate clock face.
>
>my personal favorite. You could have different images for night and day.
>Let's see. 12 images per hour * 24 hours per day = 288 separate
>images...lot's of images to keep track of *unless* it's one GIF file.

Hi Again, Chipp:

Unless RunRev v2 will support true round buttons (I'm guessing at 
this point it won't), it seems I will have to create different images 
for daytime & nighttime.  This will produce about 314 images instead 
of 157 (in addition to the 144 possible time configurations there is 
a blank clock face the user can click on to select the hour and 
twelve clock faces with only an hour hand the user can click on to 
complete time designation by clicking on the minute).  I'll look at 
combining the images; though OenoLog already uses 370+ other images, 
so what's a few hundred more.  :{`)

Oops! The animated gif sounds good; but for the issue that the 
image(s) must appear on 25-30% of the cards in the stack.  Can one 
set the icon of a buttom to a specific frame in an animated gif?

>When it comes to screen display of images and graphics, Scott Raney's
>catchphrase "There's a better way to do that" has never been more true.

I'm still groping to find that better way.  The basic hang up I'm 
finding is images displayed as icons don't look [different borders) 
or behave the same as native images, and to duplicate the native 
image look on multiple cards requires multiple copies of the same 
image.

-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From scott at tactilemedia.com  Wed Nov 13 12:03:00 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Wed Nov 13 12:03:00 2002
Subject: backColor of image
In-Reply-To: <B9F81C72.45CE%mazzapaolo@libero.it>
Message-ID: <B9F7C45C.9107%scott@tactilemedia.com>

Recently, paolo mazza wrote:

> on MouseUp
> set the backgroundcolor of image "image1" to 0,0,0
> end MouseUp
> 
> This button change the BackColor property of "image1" but the image does not
> change at all. Why?
> An image has a backcolor or not?

Try using a graphic instead of an image.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director

Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
Email: scott at tactilemedia.com
Web: www.tactilemedia.com



From rodmc at runrev.com  Wed Nov 13 12:35:01 2002
From: rodmc at runrev.com (Rod McCall)
Date: Wed Nov 13 12:35:01 2002
Subject: when will rev 2.0 ship?
In-Reply-To: <a05100308b9f829b3e603@[216.229.107.240]>
References: <a05200a05b9f7af0c8897@[65.59.178.243]>
 <6F702221-F571-11D6-B28F-003065AD94A4@mac.com>
 <a05200a05b9f7af0c8897@[65.59.178.243]>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20021113171903.02b95920@mail.spamcop.net>

At 08:10 13/11/2002 -0800, you wrote:
>>anybody got an answer to the subject line's question?
>
>Hi Oliver,
>
>If anyone does, it's Rod...
>
>                 but he couldn't possibly comment.   :{`)


Your right I couldn't possibly comment :-)  However I will say that 
development is going well and an announcement will be made in due course.

It's still November so if everyone can hold their breath a little longer I 
am sure it will all be worth it.

Kind regards,

Rod


Rod McCall  <www.runrev.com>
Runtime Revolution Ltd
Revolution - The Solution for Software Development
tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165 fax: +44 (0) 131 718 4334

All email subject to spam and virus checks. This may delay a response.



From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 13:17:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 13:17:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0) The Transparent Button Issue
In-Reply-To: <4722DE8C-F68E-11D6-84B5-000393924880@limelight.com.au>
References: <4722DE8C-F68E-11D6-84B5-000393924880@limelight.com.au>
Message-ID: <a0510030bb9f830d793bb@[216.229.107.120]>

>Use the irregular polygon filled with black.  Draw around your 
>image.  Set the ink to NOOP

Thanks for your suggestion, Matt.

The further this discussion goes, the more it seems to me the crux of 
the issue is that an image that appears on multiple cards must be 
duplicated on each card to retain image behavior.  There should 
either be a way to:

1. reference or alias an image so it can appear on multiple cards 
without (a) duplication or (b) loss of image functionality

2. set an imageBehavior property in a button so the icon displays 
image behavior instead of button behavior.

As I write this, it occurs to me that placing a referenced image on 
each card might achieve the functionality I desire without the 
overhead of actually duplicating the image.  I have often wished the 
properties palette for a referenced image would display (and allow me 
to change) the file reference.

I assume the storage requirements for a referenced image depend on 
the length of the file name, not the size of the image.  Can anyone 
tell me for sure?  If so, it's looking like the best solution I've 
considered so far.  I suppose I could create two identical stacks, 
add multiple references to the same image to one and one reference + 
buttons with icons of the image to the other, and compare the byte 
size of the two stacks.

Another oops!  In my time icon example, placing image references on 
each card would result in a net gain of 313 (314 new images replace 
one button) controls on each card where the clock is displayed.

OK, so the crux of the issue is how to achieve image behavior from a 
button icon.  The best long-term solutions I see are:

1.  A button property that causes icons to behave as images, and/or

2.  Support for irregular buttons whose shapes match the shape of their icon.

Kevin, Scott Raney, or anyone in a position to comment: Is either of 
these alternatives (or some better alternative) even a remote 
possibility?  If so, I will submit a request to the improve-rev list.

In any case, it looks like I will have to use different images for 
daytime & nighttime hours for the foreseeable future.

Yet another oops: if I consolidate the 314 images in an animated gif, 
I can replace each clock button with one image reference.  Thanks, 
all, for helping me think my way through the issue.

Any other thoughts or suggestions are welcomed.  (I may also need a 
reference to instructions on creating an animated gif from my 314 
individual images.)

TIA,
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 13:17:15 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 13:17:15 2002
Subject: Transparent Images
Message-ID: <a0510030cb9f83c8c53b8@[216.229.107.120]>

>All transparent pixels in  images ignore mouse events.
>How can I change this?
>I wuold like transparent pixels of my images  answer to mouse events and I
>do not want to set the image as the icon of a button.

>Place a button with this handler behind the image:
>
>on mouseUp
>    send mouseUp to image [your image name or "id" + image id here]
>end mouseUp

I should have noted that the handler assumes a rectangular image the 
same size as the button.  If your image is irregular, you would need 
to test the mouseLoc and determine whether it is within the image 
before sending mouseUp to the image.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From alex at mindlube.com  Wed Nov 13 13:56:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Wed Nov 13 13:56:01 2002
Subject: ungroup selected =  then crash
Message-ID: <ACAB7198-F738-11D6-91A6-000393529642@mindlube.com>

With Rev. 1.1.1 on OS X, Rev will usually crash with the following:

select a group
pick Object menu | Ungroup Selected
then Command-S for Save

Is this a known bug? I just tried creating a new mainstack and 
duplicating this behavior but could not repeat it... OK, now I can't 
even duplicate the behavior in the stack I was originally seeing it 
in... strange.

The only thing unusual about the group is is has this handler which 
references the target. Does this look safe?

on closeField

   doSaveCard the short name of this stack, the short name of this card
   -- update the UI after delay
   -- because the closeField message will validate the user's input
   send "updateUI "& the short name of this stack, the short name of 
this card \
       to the target in 1 tick
   pass closeField

end closeField


Alex Rice <alex at mindlube.com>
Mindlube Software
http://mindlube.com/



From sims at ezpzapps.com  Wed Nov 13 14:17:01 2002
From: sims at ezpzapps.com (sims)
Date: Wed Nov 13 14:17:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0) The Transparent Button Issue
In-Reply-To: <a0510030bb9f830d793bb@[216.229.107.120]>
References: <4722DE8C-F68E-11D6-84B5-000393924880@limelight.com.au>
 <a0510030bb9f830d793bb@[216.229.107.120]>
Message-ID: <a05200f01b9f854752985@[10.0.1.2]>

>
>Any other thoughts or suggestions are welcomed.  (I may also need a 
>reference to instructions on creating an animated gif from my 314 
>individual images.)


Might not be what you want/need but on perhaps this'll help...

Here's a clock:

http://www.flexiblelearning.com/xtalk/AnalogueClock.mc

atb

sims
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------
    http://EZPZapps.com         info at EZPZapps.com
       Software - Internet Development - Consulting


From Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com  Wed Nov 13 14:18:00 2002
From: Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com (Roger.E.Eller at sealedair.com)
Date: Wed Nov 13 14:18:00 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0) The Transparent Button Issue
Message-ID: <OF523D2627.B9A86C73-ON85256C70.0068D6C1@sealedair.com>

If the goal is to have all of the images accessible on every card without
duplication of the actual image data, why not do this?...
Put all of the images into a group, set the group's background behavior to
true, then place the group onto any existing cards. New cards that are
created will automatically contain the group of images (referenced because
of background behavior). Then control which clock image is visible using
hide or show image in a script.

Roger Eller
roger.e.eller at sealedair.com





From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 14:55:00 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 14:55:00 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0) The Transparent Button Issue
In-Reply-To: <OF523D2627.B9A86C73-ON85256C70.0068D6C1@sealedair.com>
References: <OF523D2627.B9A86C73-ON85256C70.0068D6C1@sealedair.com>
Message-ID: <a05100302b9f858abef22@[216.229.107.93]>

>If the goal is to have all of the images accessible on every card without
>duplication of the actual image data, why not do this?...
>Put all of the images into a group, set the group's background behavior to
>true, then place the group onto any existing cards.

You suggestion sounds promising, Roger...why didn't I think of it?   :{`)

Although, in this case (since they are designed to all be displayed 
in the same location and never more than one at a time) it makes 
sense to consolidate the images in one animated gif and make it a 
one-control group.

Thank you.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 14:55:23 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 14:55:23 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0) The Transparent Button Issue
In-Reply-To: <a05200f01b9f854752985@[10.0.1.2]>
References: <4722DE8C-F68E-11D6-84B5-000393924880@limelight.com.au>
 <a0510030bb9f830d793bb@[216.229.107.120]>
 <a05200f01b9f854752985@[10.0.1.2]>
Message-ID: <a05100303b9f85a2e49fa@[216.229.107.93]>

>Might not be what you want/need but on perhaps this'll help...
>
>Here's a clock:
>
>http://www.flexiblelearning.com/xtalk/AnalogueClock.mc

Thanks, I'll check it out...but probably just to see if there are 
some design ideas I can learn from.

My clock needs to closely integrate into OenoLog's total look & feel; 
so I pretty much need to start from scratch or have total control 
over the clock's appearance & behavior..
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 15:09:00 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 15:09:00 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0) The Transparent Button Issue
Message-ID: <a05100301b9f85f287546@[216.229.107.93]>

>If the goal is to have all of the images accessible on every card without
>duplication of the actual image data, why not do this?...
>Put all of the images into a group, set the group's background behavior to
>true, then place the group onto any existing cards.

>You suggestion sounds promising, Roger...why didn't I think of it?   :{`)

Here's my excuse from May 23rd:

>All I did was import an image as control, create a group containing 
>only the image, and set the background property of the group.  Now 
>select New Card from the Objects menu and then open the image 
>library for the stack--wallah: two copies of the image appear.


Subsequent to that post, Jeanne confirmed there was only one copy of 
the image (bug in the Image Library stack); but I guess I forgot to 
reinstate single-image groups as a viable option.

-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From kray at sonsothunder.com  Wed Nov 13 15:13:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Wed Nov 13 15:13:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
References: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOMEMHCJAA.chipp@chipp.com> <01a101c28a6a$6471a0d0$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom> <a05100302b9f8180bc003@[216.229.107.240]>
Message-ID: <011e01c28b4f$a1ec7260$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom>

OK Rob, let me see if I have this the way you want it:

Suppose you have a rectangluar image that is 300x300 that has a 200x200
clock in it. The interior part of the clock needs to change color, but the
color surrounding the clock face itself does not. So for example, if the
300x300 image had a white background, it should stay white even if the clock
interior changes colors, right?

If this is what you want, then here's what you do ('cause I just did it
myself with a simple example):

1) Take your clock into Photoshop (or the equivalent), set the exterior of
the clock face to the color you want (I used white) and the interior of the
clock to transparent. (I dumped red into the interior of the clock,
flattened the image, reduced it to 256 colors and then exported as Gif89a,
selecting the red as my transparent color in the dialog box before
exporting.)

2) Import the image into Rev. What should happen is that the clock face
takes on the background color of the card it's sitting on. (To check, change
the background color of the card and see if it does.)

3) Now create a rectangle with the fill color that you want, and place it
*behind* the clock face, so that its color shows through the face of the
clock. Now all you need to do is change the backgroundColor of the rectangle
behind the clock to make it appear as though you're changing the color of
the clock.

If this is NOT what you want, let me know and I'll see if I can come up with
something else.

Hope this helps,

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Cozens" <rcozens at pon.net>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 9:12 AM
Subject: Re: 1.5 (now 2.0)


> >you can set the
> >backgroundPattern or backgroundColor of an image so that might help your
> >situation. For example, if you make the clock face such that the "white"
> >areas inside the clock are actually transparent, and then set the
> >backgroundColor of the image to white, you *should* see a white clock.
>
> Thanks for the suggestion, Ken; but by setting the background color &
> opaqueness of the button I get a black clock face inside a white
> square.  The background color property populates the entire rectangle
> of the button, not just the portion within the round image.
>
> I might note that in HC, setting the hilite of a transparent button
> causes the button colors to invert within the icon image only.  So
> far as I can tell, this effect is not possible in RunRev short of
> producing a set of hilited images and setting the button's hilited
> icon.  If the button is not opaque, setting/changing the background
> color has no visible effect; if it is opaque, hiliting the button
> hilites its entire rectangle.
> --
>
> Rob Cozens
> CCW, Serendipity Software Company
> http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm
>
> "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
> Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."
>
> from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Wed Nov 13 15:14:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Wed Nov 13 15:14:01 2002
Subject: Transparent Images
References: <a0510030cb9f83c8c53b8@[216.229.107.120]>
Message-ID: <012501c28b4f$caf7a620$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> I should have noted that the handler assumes a rectangular image the 
> same size as the button.  If your image is irregular, you would need 
> to test the mouseLoc and determine whether it is within the image 
> before sending mouseUp to the image.

Or use a polygon and have *it* trap and send the mouseUp message...

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From themacguy at macosx.com  Wed Nov 13 15:32:01 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Wed Nov 13 15:32:01 2002
Subject: Animation Manager
Message-ID: <F74CD8DF-F745-11D6-8DE7-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

This may be something that is rectified in Rev 2.0 but I'll ask it 
anyway.

I was working through the tutorials and followed the instructions for 
the Animation Manager tutorial "to the letter". The resulting animation 
(which moved the field from off-card to the center of the card) was 
extremely "jerky". I relaunched Rev just in case it was a memory issue 
but the problem remained. I know it's not a "horsepower" issue because 
I'm running Rev v1.1.1 on a dual-867G4 with 512MB RAM in OSX 10.2.2.

BTW, the original script which simply moved the field was smooth as 
silk. Anyone (who knows) care to comment?

Thanks,
Barry

PS - For the newbies: Work through the tutorials even if you're an 
experienced HC developer. You just can't "learn Rev as you go" if you 
jump in unprepared.



From chipp at chipp.com  Wed Nov 13 15:48:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Wed Nov 13 15:48:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <a05100304b9f82099c2bc@[216.229.107.240]>
Message-ID: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCGECFDHAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Rob,

I checked on my WinXP system and it looks like you can do the following:

set the repeatcount of img "clock" to 0
set the currentframe of img "clock" to 17
set the icon of btn "myClockButton" to the id of img "clock"

This works. So you could use a single image with multiple buttons.

You could also 'share' the img with mulitple cards by using it in a
background group.

-Chipp


>
> Oops! The animated gif sounds good; but for the issue that the
> image(s) must appear on 25-30% of the cards in the stack.  Can one
> set the icon of a buttom to a specific frame in an animated gif?
>
> >When it comes to screen display of images and graphics, Scott Raney's
> >catchphrase "There's a better way to do that" has never been more true.
>
> I'm still groping to find that better way.  The basic hang up I'm
> finding is images displayed as icons don't look [different borders)
> or behave the same as native images, and to duplicate the native
> image look on multiple cards requires multiple copies of the same
> image.
>



From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 13 16:26:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 13 16:26:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)--Eureka!
Message-ID: <a05100303b9f87088a7b2@[216.229.107.134]>

>>
1. Create a circular image with a transparent center.
2. Make the image a button icon (remember the image appears on 25-30% 
of the cards in the stack).
3. How to make the area under the inside the circle change color 
without changing images or coloring the portions of the button 
outside the image?
<<

A.  Create a circular image with a transparent center
B.  Create two opaque round images that fit the transparent center in 
different colors
C.  Group images with circular image (eg: clock frame, hands, 
numerals) over round images (eg: clock faces)
D.  Switch visibility of the round images (or make them both icons 
and create a button to display one or the other).

Looks cool to me...

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From Yennie at aol.com  Wed Nov 13 16:34:01 2002
From: Yennie at aol.com (Yennie at aol.com)
Date: Wed Nov 13 16:34:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
Message-ID: <b0.2f7e9dbd.2b041d89@aol.com>

Rob,

Have you tried placing your images in a group, with the "backgroundBehavior" 
property set to true?
This should simulate Hypercard/Supercard backgrounds, where the group is 
shared across multiple cards. That way you can have native image objects, but 
only one copy of each inside of the shared group.

HTH,
Brian

> I'm still groping to find that better way.? The basic hang up I'm 
> finding is images displayed as icons don't look [different borders) 
> or behave the same as native images, and to duplicate the native 
> image look on multiple cards requires multiple copies of the same 
> image.
> 

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From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Wed Nov 13 17:13:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Wed Nov 13 17:13:01 2002
Subject: ungroup selected =  then crash
In-Reply-To: <a05111a5ab9f8511277a5@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <2EF6AA6E-F754-11D6-9FC1-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

This sounds more like the OS X Appearance Manager problem, which tends 
to cause a quit when selecting/deselecting/re-selecting objects. If you 
can work out how to duplicate the crash, try turning the Look & Feel to 
Mac OS Emulated. I'd bet that you can't duplicate it then.

Your script shouldn't cause a crash. At the most all it might do is 
give an error saying that the object doesn't exist but I have found 
that errors in pending messages are usually just ignored. If you really 
wanted to be careful, you could check that "the target" exists before 
doing the send.

Sarah

On Thursday, November 14, 2002, at 04:57  am, Alex Rice wrote:

> With Rev. 1.1.1 on OS X, Rev will usually crash with the following:
>
> select a group
> pick Object menu | Ungroup Selected
> then Command-S for Save
>
> Is this a known bug? I just tried creating a new mainstack and 
> duplicating this behavior but could not repeat it... OK, now I can't 
> even duplicate the behavior in the stack I was originally seeing it 
> in... strange.
>
> The only thing unusual about the group is is has this handler which 
> references the target. Does this look safe?
>
> on closeField
>
>   doSaveCard the short name of this stack, the short name of this card
>   -- update the UI after delay
>   -- because the closeField message will validate the user's input
>   send "updateUI "& the short name of this stack, the short name of 
> this card \
>       to the target in 1 tick
>   pass closeField
>
> end closeField
>
>
> Alex Rice <alex at mindlube.com>
> Mindlube Software
> http://mindlube.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From themacguy at macosx.com  Wed Nov 13 17:35:01 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Wed Nov 13 17:35:01 2002
Subject: Transparent button issue
In-Reply-To: <200211132127.QAA05611@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <3C31E634-F757-11D6-8DE7-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

I haven't been following this issue too closely but the last post 
pointed me to something I've been doing in a current project.

I am using picture objects and simply setting the fileName of the 
object to an existing jpeg (in a "resource" folder). I'm able to set 
the picture to whatever I need programmatically depending on what the 
user chooses in other available picture objects (which I am treating as 
buttons).

For example:

on whateverEvent
	set the fileName of image "myImage" to "myJPEG.jpg"
end whateverEvent

I'm not sure how this impacts upon #2 (below) as I am not yet 
completely conversant in the nuances.

Hope this helps.

Barry

On Wednesday, November 13, 2002, at 02:27 PM, 
use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote:

> 1. reference or alias an image so it can appear on multiple cards
> without (a) duplication or (b) loss of image functionality
>
> 2. set an imageBehavior property in a button so the icon displays
> image behavior instead of button behavior.
>
> As I write this, it occurs to me that placing a referenced image on
> each card might achieve the functionality I desire without the
> overhead of actually duplicating the image.  I have often wished the
> properties palette for a referenced image would display (and allow me
> to change) the file reference.
--------------------------------------------------------



From alex at mindlube.com  Wed Nov 13 17:48:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Wed Nov 13 17:48:01 2002
Subject: ungroup selected =  then crash
In-Reply-To: <2EF6AA6E-F754-11D6-9FC1-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>
Message-ID: <1DA31752-F759-11D6-91A6-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Wednesday, November 13, 2002, at 03:06  PM, Sarah wrote:

> This sounds more like the OS X Appearance Manager problem, which tends 
> to cause a quit when selecting/deselecting/re-selecting objects. If 
> you can work out how to duplicate the crash, try turning the Look & 
> Feel to Mac OS Emulated. I'd bet that you can't duplicate it then.

I was definitely in MacOS Emulated Look & Feel when the crashes 
happened.

> Your script shouldn't cause a crash. At the most all it might do is 
> give an error saying that the object doesn't exist but I have found 
> that errors in pending messages are usually just ignored. If you 
> really wanted to be careful, you could check that "the target" exists 
> before doing the send.

OK, thanks for confirming. However I can't duplicate the crash anymore. 
Posting to the list seems to have autosolved it. Is RunRev sentient or 
something ;-)

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Wed Nov 13 20:51:01 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Wed Nov 13 20:51:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
Message-ID: <B6873EF0-F772-11D6-ADED-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Revolution Masters,

I'm trying to implement a simple button that should use 3 different 
images: 'idle', 'over' (when the cursor in on top of the button), and 
'down' (when  the mouse is down on the button).

Because the shape of the button is irregular, and I want the 
transparent bits to be ignored for mouse events, rather than specifying 
the images as icons in a button control, I used IMAGES. My idea was to 
setup the 3 images on a card, on top of each other, and simply 
show/hide each one in response to the appropriate mouse events.

So I started by putting the 'idle' image on the card, and then the 
'over' image on top of that, making sure the 'loc' properties of both 
was exactly the same (ie, they were exactly on top of each other). Each 
picture is exactly the same as the other, just using different 
colours... Now, I went into the scrip of the 'idle' picture, and typed:

on mouseEnter
	show image "over"
	hide me
end mouseEnter

Then, I went into the script of the 'over' image, and did the opposite:

on mouseLeave
	show image "idle"
	hide me
end mouseLeave

Now, what is happening when I use the browse tool is a bit of a puzzle: 
it goes like this:
The card is displaying the 'idle' image. I move the cursor into the 
image, and presto, I see the 'over' image. I also know that the 'idle' 
image HAS been hidden - I can check with the message box...
Now, I slowly move the cursor OUTSIDE the image, and... nothing. The 
'over' image behaves as if it has NOT received the 'mouseLeave' 
message...
I move the cursor back onto the 'over' image, and move it back out - 
now for the second time - and, presto, it works: it hides the 'over' 
image and shows the 'idle' image.
The crunch of the matter is: I have to 'leave' the image TWICE for it 
to work... EVERYTIME!

All I can deduct is that for some reason, the first time the mouse 
leaves the 'over' image, no 'mouseLeave' message is being sent to it! 
Only after the cursor has re-entered the image, and then proceeds to 
leave again, does it work...

Am I missing something embarrassingly simple? Did I not read the 
documentation properly? Is this a behaviour that others have noticed? 
Is it a bug?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Kind Regards,
--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
igor at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From kkaufman at snet.net  Wed Nov 13 22:05:01 2002
From: kkaufman at snet.net (Kurt Kaufman)
Date: Wed Nov 13 22:05:01 2002
Subject: paste graphic on mousedown
Message-ID: <F4B5A39B-F77C-11D6-95C9-0003936D1F12@snet.net>

I need to be able to paste small graphic objects with one click.  In 
other words, keep a graphic on the clipboard and paste numerous times 
at locations determined by the point of the arrow cursor. -Sort of like 
an ink "stamp". There would be a few different graphics to choose from, 
and they could be selected by keyboard shortcut, or by clicking on a 
palette. The "stamped" graphics must be moveable.
Does anyone have a suggestion as to the most efficient way of doing 
this?

Thank you,
Kurt



From tsj at unimelb.edu.au  Wed Nov 13 23:36:01 2002
From: tsj at unimelb.edu.au (Terry Judd)
Date: Wed Nov 13 23:36:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <B6873EF0-F772-11D6-ADED-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
References: <B6873EF0-F772-11D6-ADED-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <p05100301b9f8c35c999e@[128.250.164.101]>

How about using a referenced image control and change the fileName of 
the image to reflect the different states? I tried several approaches 
using separate object and like you couldn't get any of them to work 
satisfactorily (although I was using  buttons rather than images for 
testing). Placing the mouseLeave handler in the 'idle' object and 
sending a message to it from the 'over' object worked inconsistently. 
The other approach I tried was to group the objects and place all the 
handlers in the group's script - seemed to work as intended for a few 
mouseEnters and mouseLeaves but then descended into some sort of 
hyperactive state switching that eventually locked out (temporarily) 
any mouse activity (command "." seemed to do the trick).


>I'm trying to implement a simple button that should use 3 different 
>images: 'idle', 'over' (when the cursor in on top of the button), 
>and 'down' (when  the mouse is down on the button).
>
>Because the shape of the button is irregular, and I want the 
>transparent bits to be ignored for mouse events, rather than 
>specifying the images as icons in a button control, I used IMAGES. 
>My idea was to setup the 3 images on a card, on top of each other, 
>and simply show/hide each one in response to the appropriate mouse 
>events.
>
>So I started by putting the 'idle' image on the card, and then the 
>'over' image on top of that, making sure the 'loc' properties of 
>both was exactly the same (ie, they were exactly on top of each 
>other). Each picture is exactly the same as the other, just using 
>different colours... Now, I went into the scrip of the 'idle' 
>picture, and typed:
>
>on mouseEnter
>	show image "over"
>	hide me
>end mouseEnter
>
>Then, I went into the script of the 'over' image, and did the opposite:
>
>on mouseLeave
>	show image "idle"
>	hide me
>end mouseLeave
>
>Now, what is happening when I use the browse tool is a bit of a 
>puzzle: it goes like this:
>The card is displaying the 'idle' image. I move the cursor into the 
>image, and presto, I see the 'over' image. I also know that the 
>'idle' image HAS been hidden - I can check with the message box...
>Now, I slowly move the cursor OUTSIDE the image, and... nothing. The 
>'over' image behaves as if it has NOT received the 'mouseLeave' 
>message...
>I move the cursor back onto the 'over' image, and move it back out - 
>now for the second time - and, presto, it works: it hides the 'over' 
>image and shows the 'idle' image.
>The crunch of the matter is: I have to 'leave' the image TWICE for 
>it to work... EVERYTIME!
>
>All I can deduct is that for some reason, the first time the mouse 
>leaves the 'over' image, no 'mouseLeave' message is being sent to 
>it! Only after the cursor has re-entered the image, and then 
>proceeds to leave again, does it work...


-- 
Dr Terry Judd
Biomedical Multimedia Unit
Faculty of Dentistry Medicine & Health Sciences
The University of Melbourne
Parkville VIC
Australia


From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Wed Nov 13 23:55:00 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Wed Nov 13 23:55:00 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <p05100301b9f8c35c999e@[128.250.164.101]>
Message-ID: <58F5799A-F78C-11D6-ADED-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Terry,

Thank you for your reply! - and suggestions:

> How about using a referenced image control and change the fileName of 
> the image to reflect the different states? I tried several approaches 
> using separate object and like you couldn't get any of them to work 
> satisfactorily (although I was using  buttons rather than images for 
> testing). Placing the mouseLeave handler in the 'idle' object and 
> sending a message to it from the 'over' object worked inconsistently. 
> The other approach I tried was to group the objects and place all the 
> handlers in the group's script - seemed to work as intended for a few 
> mouseEnters and mouseLeaves but then descended into some sort of 
> hyperactive state switching that eventually locked out (temporarily) 
> any mouse activity (command "." seemed to do the trick).
>

Hmmm, that doesn't sound very good... This really is starting to sound 
like a bug, isn't it?

About your suggestion: the images must be saved inside the stack, so 
that the stack can later be saved as a 'self-contained' document - that 
does not need to access any external data. Therefore, using 'fileName' 
is a no-no...

I have now also tried several different things:

a) first I thought it might be because my images were '.png', so I 
re-exported them as '.gif', but obtained the same result (just with 
less levels of transparency! :-P)

b) then I thought it might be the order in which I was showing one 
image and hiding the other, so I tried several permutations, but that 
had no effect either

c) I then thought that maybe the 'over' image HAD to receive a 
'mouseEnter' in order to be able to get a 'mouseLeave', so I tried 
sending a 'mouseEnter' from inside the 'idle' image, as soon as the 
'over' image was shown, but still... no difference...

Perhaps this really is a bug?... What are other people's experiences? 
Are we overlooking something basic? Are we going about it the wrong way?

Any suggestions are immensely appreciated!

Kind Regards,
--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
info at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From tsj at unimelb.edu.au  Thu Nov 14 00:48:01 2002
From: tsj at unimelb.edu.au (Terry Judd)
Date: Thu Nov 14 00:48:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <58F5799A-F78C-11D6-ADED-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
References: <58F5799A-F78C-11D6-ADED-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05100300b9f8e773e13e@[203.134.22.129]>

>
>c) I then thought that maybe the 'over' image HAD to receive a 
>'mouseEnter' in order to be able to get a 'mouseLeave', so I tried 
>sending a 'mouseEnter' from inside the 'idle' image, as soon as the 
>'over' image was shown, but still... no difference...
>
>Perhaps this really is a bug?... What are other people's 
>experiences? Are we overlooking something basic? Are we going about 
>it the wrong way?
>

Igor - How 'odd-shaped' are the non transparent parts of your images? 
Could you get away with placing a 'transparent' polygon grc over the 
top of the lot and putting your handlers in that? Not very elegant 
but...

Cheers,

Terry...
-- 
------------------------------------------------
Dr Terry Judd
Biomedical Multimedia Unit
Faculty of Medicine, Dentistry & Health Sciences
The University of Melbourne
AUSTRALIA
------------------------------------------------


From gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net  Thu Nov 14 00:48:23 2002
From: gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net (Gary Aitcheson)
Date: Thu Nov 14 00:48:23 2002
Subject: Open Program with RR
Message-ID: <20021114054138.34495.qmail@web80106.mail.yahoo.com>

A question that I know has been asked before, but I
can't find the answer. I want to open a program
automatically each time I open RR. How do I do this?

TIA - Gary


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 14 01:59:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 14 01:59:01 2002
Subject: paste graphic on mousedown
In-Reply-To: <F4B5A39B-F77C-11D6-95C9-0003936D1F12@snet.net>
Message-ID: <20021114065312.70059.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Kurt Kaufman <kkaufman at snet.net> wrote:
> I need to be able to paste small graphic objects
> with one click.  In 
> other words, keep a graphic on the clipboard and
> paste numerous times 
> at locations determined by the point of the arrow
> cursor. -Sort of like 
> an ink "stamp". There would be a few different
> graphics to choose from, 
> and they could be selected by keyboard shortcut, or
> by clicking on a 
> palette. The "stamped" graphics must be moveable.
> Does anyone have a suggestion as to the most
> efficient way of doing 
> this?
> 
> Thank you,
> Kurt
> 

Hi Kurt,

The simples apprach would be to have the different
'stamps' as a few buttons with a script like:

on mouseUp
  global gPuttingStamps, gCurrentStamp
  set the hilite of me to not the hilite of me
  put the hilite of me into gPuttingStamps
  put "stamps\"&(the name of me) into gCurrentStamp
end mouseUp

Try this in your card script:

on mouseUp
  global gPuttingStamps
  if gPuttingStamps then
    -- might want to check for boundaries here
    -- ...
    -- create the image, save ID, reset cursor
    create image
    put it into tID
    choose browser tool
    -- set height, width and location
    set the height of image tID to \
      gHeights[gCurrentStamp]
    set the width of image tID to \
      gWidths[gCurrentStamp]
    set the location of image tID to the clickLoc
    -- set the correct stamp image
    set the fileName of image tID to gCurrentStamp
    -- make sure we get the message again later
    -- in case the user clicks on one of our images
    set the script of image tID to \
      "on mouseUp" & return & "pass mouseUp" & \
      return & "end mouseUp"
    -- and we're all set :-)
  end if
end mouseUp

You'll have to prepare the necessary data of course,
but this general approach should work like a charm.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 14 02:05:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 14 02:05:01 2002
Subject: Open Program with RR
In-Reply-To: <20021114054138.34495.qmail@web80106.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20021114065824.14264.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Gary Aitcheson <gary_aitcheson at sbcglobal.net>
wrote:
> A question that I know has been asked before, but I
> can't find the answer. I want to open a program
> automatically each time I open RR. How do I do this?
> 
> TIA - Gary
>

Hi Gary,

Check out the 'launch' command. Set the script of your
mainStack to something like:

on openStack
  -- automatically open companion application
  launch "MyFavouriteApp"
  -- do other stuff here
  -- ...
end openStack

If you're looking for a solution that will run _every
time_ you open RunRev, you could write a small plug-in
that is basically a field of which every line is
executed with the 'do' command in the plug-in's
'openStack' handler.

And if nobody's going to write a plug-in like that
this time around, I'll post it over the weekend.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
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From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 14 02:15:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 14 02:15:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <B6873EF0-F772-11D6-ADED-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <20021114070854.31402.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Igor de Oliveira Couto <info at pixelmedia.com.au>
wrote:
>
> [snip]
> 
> All I can deduct is that for some reason, the first
> time the mouse 
> leaves the 'over' image, no 'mouseLeave' message is
> being sent to it! 
> Only after the cursor has re-entered the image, and
> then proceeds to 
> leave again, does it work...
> 
> Am I missing something embarrassingly simple? Did I
> not read the 
> documentation properly? Is this a behaviour that
> others have noticed? 
> Is it a bug?
> 
> Any help would be greatly appreciated!
> 
> Kind Regards,
> --
> Igor de Oliveira Couto
>

Hi Igor,

The reason seems quite simple: the "over" image never
got a 'mouseEnter' message at the time it was hidden,
and doesn't get one when it appears as the mouse was
already within its rect.
Applying Newton's action-reaction theorem to MC/RR,
the "over" message doesn't get a 'mouseLeave' either
as it didn't 'mouseEnter' it in the first place.

Easiest solution would be to stick with a 'one image,
many pictures' approach, and handle all the messages
from within a single object, setting the fileName to
the different states.

Or you could have it all handled with a single button,
no scripting required:
- import the graphics
- set its 'icon' to the "idle" graphic
- set its 'armedIcon' to the "over" graphic
- set its 'autoArm' property to true.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 14 02:49:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Thu Nov 14 02:49:01 2002
Subject: Open Program with RR
In-Reply-To: <20021114065824.14264.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20021114074246.97031.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Jan Schenkel <janschenkel at yahoo.com> wrote:
> Check out the 'launch' command. Set the script
of your mainStack to something like:
> 
> on openStack
>   -- open companion application
>   launch "MyFavouriteApp"
> end openStack

this is embarrassing.
after completing the tutorials and perusing the
Transcript files, i can't figure out how to
implement:

on startup
  start using stack "A"
  start using stack "B"
  start using stack "C"
end startup

as an HC MC refugee, i only know to put these in
a "Home" stack script. evidently RR has a
different approach. how DO you get the prelims
taken care of? thank you.

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
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From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 14 03:36:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 14 03:36:01 2002
Subject: Open Program with RR
In-Reply-To: <20021114074246.97031.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20021114082951.14646.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>

--- erik hansen <erikhans08 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> --- Jan Schenkel <janschenkel at yahoo.com> wrote:
> > Check out the 'launch' command. Set the script
> of your mainStack to something like:
> > 
> > on openStack
> >   -- open companion application
> >   launch "MyFavouriteApp"
> > end openStack
> 
> this is embarrassing.
> after completing the tutorials and perusing the
> Transcript files, i can't figure out how to
> implement:
> 
> on startup
>   start using stack "A"
>   start using stack "B"
>   start using stack "C"
> end startup
> 
> as an HC MC refugee, i only know to put these in
> a "Home" stack script. evidently RR has a
> different approach. how DO you get the prelims
> taken care of? thank you.
> 

Hi Erik,

It's okay to feel a bit confused/bedazzled ; as a
fellow ex-HC-user I know how some things take quite a
bit of getting used to.
But it's well worth the effort. RR is great and
version 2.0 will be even better. *cheers*

Back to your question : move the 'start using' bits
into the 'openStack' handler of your mainStack.
It might be a good idea to keep track of whether or
not they were in the stacksInUse and in the
'closeStack' handler only 'stop using' them if they
weren't open to begin with.

Again, if you want them automatically used at every
starup of RR, you'll need to build some sort of
plug-in ; if no volunteers show up by saturday, I'll
script+post a plug-in for this over the weekend.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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From simon-lists at ldml.com  Thu Nov 14 05:27:01 2002
From: simon-lists at ldml.com (Simon Forster)
Date: Thu Nov 14 05:27:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
Message-ID: <A13AD9F0-F7BA-11D6-BCDE-0050E4CE1D03@ldml.com>

Hi

I've vaguely flirted with Revolution and gone through a couple of 
tutorials but I've never played with HyperCard or other stack based 
systems - and I don't understand the programming model which they 
follow. What is a stack? How do they fit in with more traditional 
programming languages?

<Yorkshire accent>
When I were a lad, we sat down in front of green terminals bashing out 
endless lines of C. None of your fancy object orientated rubbish, just 
nice, clean hand crafted code. We had to trudge through the snow in 
bare feet...
</Yorkshire accent>

Seriously, can someone put the whole stack thing into some sort of 
perspective wrt more traditional programming languages - or point me to 
a resource which does this? I think it'd help me quite a lot.

TIA

Simon Forster
___________________________________________________
   LDML Ltd, Office One, 16 Canham Road, London, W3 7SR, UK
   <tel int="+44 70 9230 5244" uk="070 9230 5244">
   <fax int="+44 70 9230 5247" uk="070 9230 5247">
   <mailto:simon at ldml.com>
___________________________________________________



From kkaufman at snet.net  Thu Nov 14 07:41:01 2002
From: kkaufman at snet.net (Kurt Kaufman)
Date: Thu Nov 14 07:41:01 2002
Subject: paste graphic on mousedown
Message-ID: <52C329EB-F7CD-11D6-AC51-0003936D1F12@snet.net>

Thank you for the suggestion, Jan; I'll try the scripts this afternoon.
I had previously created a project with similar requirements in 
SuperCard, but decided that Revolution was likely just different enough 
in terms of syntax to warrant starting over!

-Kurt



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 14 08:13:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 14 08:13:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model [pretty lengthy]
In-Reply-To: <A13AD9F0-F7BA-11D6-BCDE-0050E4CE1D03@ldml.com>
Message-ID: <20021114130657.7209.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Simon Forster <simon-lists at ldml.com> wrote:
> 
> [snip]
> 
> Seriously, can someone put the whole stack thing
> into some sort of 
> perspective wrt more traditional programming
> languages - or point me to 
> a resource which does this? I think it'd help me
> quite a lot.
> 
> TIA
> 
> Simon Forster
> 

Hi Simon,

I'm sure there are lots of resources out there, a
number of which will probably give you a better
explanation, but I'll give it a shot nonetheless.

In the old days of procedural programming, the
application pretty much decided where the user was
going to go next.
As in: the user has a limited set of choices, and he
types 1,2,3 or Q and my program reacts to this input.
I control what the user can type.

Then came the Graphical User Interface and all of a
sudden the paradigm shifted: the user was in control
now, and could jump from place to place and do things
in a sequence trhat we didn't quite have in mind.
As in: the user may decide to fill in field 5, then
field 6, click on a button here, or even attempt to
select a menu or dismiss my screen to the background.

So programs changed and sat in a (foundation) loop,
responding to the events the user's actions generated,
enabling and disabling options, and when the user
pressed some button, run a procedure.
As in: an event loop capturing the messages, trying to
figure out what window is active and call the correct
procedure in response to the action.

Along with the GUI another idea became a hot topic:
object-oriented programming and its reuse of standard
components.
The GUI was an excellent candidate for this sort of
technology, as you could write special-purpose
controls that would respond ion a consistent way.
A lot of 'traditional' programming languages
incorporated class libraries and some even adopted the
Integrated Development Environment, where you could
design screens and such niceties.
As in: Think Class Library, MacApp, Turbo Pascal /
Borland Delphi, and more recently Java.

Before OOP seriously took off, several graphical
programming environments came up, taking care of the
event loop and calling the procedures for you.
All the programmer had to do was design the screen and
code the procedures behind every control to particular
actions.
The programming languages themselves are 'fourth
generation' and are usually much closer to human
languages (often English).
Their constructs for loops and branches are also much
easier to read by non-programmers.
Prime examples: HyperCard in 1987, Visual Basic a
number of years later.

These graphical programming environments often adopted
techniques from OOP, though sometimes only partially
or with clear restrictions.
The 'xCard' approach adopted the 'message hierarchy'
that's present in most class libraries: an event is
handled at the front, or sent 'up the command chain'.

In the Think Class Library for example, 'panes' handle
things at the front, or send the message up to the
'document' to which they belong which in turn may send
it up to the 'application' itself.
If you wanted, you could adapt the chain, inserting
layers or even have multiple chains.

In HyperCard, the following layers were introduced:

       button / field
       --------------
            card
       --------------
         background
       --------------
            stack
       --------------
        'home' stack
       --------------
          HyperCard

Though the above representation cheerfully avoids the
difference between card and background buttons and
fields, it describes the 'message chain' adequately.
Example:
- when a user clicks on a button, a 'mouseUp' message
is sent to the button
- if the button doesn't handle it, the 'mouseUp'
message is sent up the chain to the card
- if the card doesn't handle it, the 'mouseUp' message
is sent up the chain to the background
- if the background doesn't handle it, the 'mouseUp'
message is sent up the chain to the stack
- if the stack doesn't handle it, the 'mouseUp'
message is sent up the chain to the home stack
- if HyperCard doesn't have a default associated
behaviour, the message is simply discarded and nothing
happens.

But the xCard implementation of the message chain
doesn't stop there: besides a number of standard
'events' it also employs user-defined 'handlers' and
'functions'.
These procedures (as that's what they basically are)
are also part of the chain, allowing a procedure to
call another procedure that is defined at the same
level or higher up in the chain.

In this way, xCard brought in some aspects of OOP, but
limiting them at the same time: there is no 'true'
inheritance, and the message hierarchy is 'fixed'.
The original hierarchy has been adapted along the
road, but there's an excellent chapter in the
documentation that gives you all the details you may
ever want to know about the message path.

So there you have it: scripts in objects handle
messages, which travel along a message path.

Hope this helped clear a few things up,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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From rodmc at runrev.com  Thu Nov 14 08:38:01 2002
From: rodmc at runrev.com (Rod McCall)
Date: Thu Nov 14 08:38:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
In-Reply-To: <A13AD9F0-F7BA-11D6-BCDE-0050E4CE1D03@ldml.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20021114123017.02e4e1c8@mail.spamcop.net>

Hi Simon,

At 10:19 14/11/2002 +0000, you wrote:
>Hi
>
>I've vaguely flirted with Revolution and gone through a couple of 
>tutorials but I've never played with HyperCard or other stack based 
>systems - and I don't understand the programming model which they follow. 
>What is a stack? How do they fit in with more traditional programming 
>languages?

Sorry if you've already figured this out and it seems like I am talking 
down to you.... Also this is a brief overview and may miss out certain 
things, however it should get you started. If not please email me off list 
at rodmc at runrev.com

At the most basic level possible a program consists of a main stack. A main 
stack is simply a collection of cards (or windows) and as with nearly every 
other developer tool you can place objects (such as buttons) onto the 
cards. You can also write lines of code (known as scripts) which can be 
attached to stacks, cards or objects. Each card (or window) in the stack is 
in a specific order and you can navigate between them using either the card 
name or commands such as next or previous.  The metaphor is similar to 
having a deck of playing cards, i.e. you can pick specific cards or simply 
move through the deck of cards one at a time going back or forward.

You can also have substacks which are linked off the main stack, these are 
essentially just groups of related cards (or windows) which fulfill a 
specific purpose. For example say your program was an accounting package. 
You may have a mainstack which lets you access all the options (e.g. 
payments, receipts, invoices etc, etc).  This mainstack could contain 
substacks which handled specific items. For example one substack may 
contain only the options for invoicing (e.g. windows/cards, objects and 
scripts).

Now the next phase is messages. Essentially messages (e.g. an event when 
a  button is pressed) are passed up via a hierarchy. For example say I have 
a mainstack which contains one card and a button. If I press the button 
Revolution first checks if I have written the appropriate handler (e.g. 
mouseup) inside the script for the button, if not then it checks to see 
whether that handler is in the script for the card, if it is not in the 
card then it checks to see whether the handler is in the script for the 
mainstack.


><Yorkshire accent>
>When I were a lad, we sat down in front of green terminals bashing out 
>endless lines of C. None of your fancy object orientated rubbish, just 
>nice, clean hand crafted code. We had to trudge through the snow in bare 
>feet...
></Yorkshire accent>

You had it far too easy my boy! In my day we used binary and oscilloscopes 
for programming on monochrome NCR terminals powered by bicycles. If we were 
lucky we got to use assembler. However we were quite state of the art and 
some were still using punched card.

Programmers today have never had it so good :-)


>Seriously, can someone put the whole stack thing into some sort of 
>perspective wrt more traditional programming languages - or point me to a 
>resource which does this? I think it'd help me quite a lot.


Revolution has quite a different metaphor in comparison to most other 
languages I've come across but I hope you've managed to get something out 
of the description earlier. Here is a very brief summary:

MainStack = your program (contains substacks, cards, and objects).
         Card = A window and is part of a stack.
Substack = a group of related cards.

Cheers,

Rod



Rod McCall  <www.runrev.com>
Runtime Revolution Ltd
Revolution - The Solution for Software Development


tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165 fax: +44 (0) 131 718 4334

All email subject to spam and virus checks. This may delay a response.



From tedl at voyager.net  Thu Nov 14 10:10:01 2002
From: tedl at voyager.net (Ted)
Date: Thu Nov 14 10:10:01 2002
Subject: Hilite With Transparent Button
Message-ID: <001c01c28bee$f561cd60$a3ce59cf@egl>

Rob Cozens wrote in part:

>I might note that in HC, setting the hilite of a transparent button
>causes the button colors to invert within the icon image only. So
>far as I can tell, this effect is not possible in RunRev short of
>producing a set of hilited images and setting the button's hilited
>icon.

Pixel inversion under transparent buttons was a very useful feature of
HyperCard; it allowed you to quickly and easily hilite any object. This was
especially handy for painted text: you could create graphical fields, menus,
maps, charts, and labels--and then hilite text portions at will with overlaid
transparent buttons. (In the above instances, paint text is used for
stability. Cross-platform display can turn text into taffy, so text fields are
unacceptable, for example, in the tight confines of a map.)

I requested this feature when Revolution was in beta testing. Kevin added it
to the list, but I don't know where it stands at this point.

Ted








From mdswindell at charter.net  Thu Nov 14 10:15:01 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Thu Nov 14 10:15:01 2002
Subject: floating overviews/debugger?
In-Reply-To: <A13AD9F0-F7BA-11D6-BCDE-0050E4CE1D03@ldml.com>
Message-ID: <B9F8FC7D.36FC%mdswindell@charter.net>

Can one set the window styles of the debugger and stack overview windows to
be floating palettes?  And one further, a tiny floating palette like the
MacOs switcher to hide show them, bring them to front?
Thanks,
Mark



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 14 10:44:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 14 10:44:01 2002
Subject: floating overviews/debugger?
In-Reply-To: <B9F8FC7D.36FC%mdswindell@charter.net>
Message-ID: <20021114153801.22970.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Mark Swindell <mdswindell at charter.net> wrote:
> Can one set the window styles of the debugger and
> stack overview windows to
> be floating palettes?  And one further, a tiny
> floating palette like the
> MacOs switcher to hide show them, bring them to
> front?
> Thanks,
> Mark
> 

Hi Mark,

There's a work-around for that:
- in the Preferences, check the box next to :
  "Contextual menus work in Revolution windows"
- now command-control-shift-click on the 'Application
  Overview' (same procedure for the other windows)
- go to the sub-menu 'Card & Stack'
- proceed to its sub-menu 'Stack mode'
- and in there select the option 'Palette'

This change won't "stick" so you'll have to do this
again every time you start RunRev.

Hope this helped,

Ja

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 14 10:44:12 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 14 10:44:12 2002
Subject: floating overviews/debugger?
In-Reply-To: <B9F8FC7D.36FC%mdswindell@charter.net>
Message-ID: <20021114153817.48547.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Mark Swindell <mdswindell at charter.net> wrote:
> Can one set the window styles of the debugger and
> stack overview windows to
> be floating palettes?  And one further, a tiny
> floating palette like the
> MacOs switcher to hide show them, bring them to
> front?
> Thanks,
> Mark
> 

Hi Mark,

There's a work-around for that:
- in the Preferences, check the box next to :
  "Contextual menus work in Revolution windows"
- now command-control-shift-click on the 'Application
  Overview' (same procedure for the other windows)
- go to the sub-menu 'Card & Stack'
- proceed to its sub-menu 'Stack mode'
- and in there select the option 'Palette'

This change won't "stick" so you'll have to do this
again every time you start RunRev.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From simran at teleline.es  Thu Nov 14 10:55:01 2002
From: simran at teleline.es (Peter Lundh)
Date: Thu Nov 14 10:55:01 2002
Subject: Runrev and MatLab
Message-ID: <B9F968B8.39E2%simran@teleline.es>

Hi all-

Has anybody any experience of how to incorporate external MatLab libraries
in Runrev project. Any info, or help would be much appreciated.

Yours sincerely.

-Peter
-- 
Peter Lundh
E: simran at teleline.es
Derby, UK



From sschofield at computing.dundee.ac.uk  Thu Nov 14 10:59:01 2002
From: sschofield at computing.dundee.ac.uk (sschofield)
Date: Thu Nov 14 10:59:01 2002
Subject: Display web page in scrollable field
Message-ID: <31C6D68FA597D411B04D00E02965883BB14DBD@mailhost>

This is undoubtedly very easy if you know how but I don't. I just get the
html. Please enlighten.

susie


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 14 11:35:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 14 11:35:01 2002
Subject: Display web page in scrollable field
In-Reply-To: <31C6D68FA597D411B04D00E02965883BB14DBD@mailhost>
Message-ID: <20021114162826.73627.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>

--- sschofield <sschofield at computing.dundee.ac.uk>
wrote:
> This is undoubtedly very easy if you know how but I
> don't. I just get the
> html. Please enlighten.
> 
> susie
> 

Hi Susie,

Try this:
  set the htmlText of field "theWebPage" to \
    URL "http://www.example.net/"

You should note, however, that RunRev only supports a
_subset_ of HTML ; tables, frames, lists and a bunch
of other things are simply not supported.

If you're trying to display a simple web-page within a
field, it should be no problem.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From CBross4055 at aol.com  Thu Nov 14 12:19:01 2002
From: CBross4055 at aol.com (CBross4055 at aol.com)
Date: Thu Nov 14 12:19:01 2002
Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #839 - 13 msgs
Message-ID: <88.2108f3a2.2b053380@aol.com>

 


From Fred_D_Yocum at mail.mcc.org  Thu Nov 14 12:31:01 2002
From: Fred_D_Yocum at mail.mcc.org (Fred_D_Yocum at mail.mcc.org)
Date: Thu Nov 14 12:31:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
Message-ID: <85256C71.005FBA55.00@mail.mcc.org>

Stacks and Messages paths --and yet that doesn't seem clear enough to me.
Looking at the discussion on the list, it is frequently stressed if  you want
speed, you keep the data out of the stack-card-field paradym and put the
information in a variable or an array.

Another words if I was designing an address database: with my stack hat on I
think I should create a stack with multiple cards each dedicated to the
information of one individual. But this does not seem to be what I should doing.
I should really be keeping things out of stacks-cards-fields except for display
purposes and then I'm back a not dis-similar method of programing than any
other?.

Fred




From dsc at swcp.com  Thu Nov 14 12:50:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Thu Nov 14 12:50:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
In-Reply-To: <A13AD9F0-F7BA-11D6-BCDE-0050E4CE1D03@ldml.com>
Message-ID: <2BDADC4C-F7F8-11D6-A10A-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Thursday, November 14, 2002, at 03:19 AM, Simon Forster wrote:

> I've vaguely flirted with Revolution and gone through a couple of 
> tutorials but I've never played with HyperCard or other stack based 
> systems - and I don't understand the programming model which they 
> follow. What is a stack? How do they fit in with more traditional 
> programming languages?

You have already answers from experts.  Here is an alternate view that 
might help.

In short, this view involves index cards.

Suppose you are fond of novels by Martian authors.  Over the years you 
have written a little report or reminder to yourself about each novel 
you read on a 6X4 index card.  You have accumulated a stack of cards.

Later you added a stack of 5X3 cards to your collection that contains 
author information.

At the back of your novel stack you have put a special card (light blue) 
that provides some general reminders on how to use the stack.  Most of 
what you do is natural.  You thumb through cards.  You look up novels.  
You look up the author of a particular novel.  You find novels by an 
author.

Over the years you have stuck on stickers and flags that mean something 
to you.  You have made notes such as "See _Twelve Sand Eyes_ by Au 
GBeeen Rarrououo" or "Do not confuse with _19,123 Toes_".  On the back 
you have written notes such as "When looking up this author use first 
name since this author is Ag and not Au as most literate Martians are" 
and "To calculate the respected age from the true chronological age for 
this author, do not count the years zhe was off planet."

You decide to add some notes on writing authors names in Martian 
script.  You consider adding a special card to the end of the author 
stack, but decide to simply write out the notes on 8X7 paper.  You fold 
these up and put these and the two stacks (each bound, say, by rubber 
bands) into the Martian navel shoe box.  Your daughter made a flip-card 
animation of a dancing Martian and you put that into the shoe box, too, 
and make a reference to it on the cards for _233 Leaning Dancers_, _Two 
Left Feet_ and _951 Right-Drifting Dancers_.

Now, with that in mind, make a powerful, general programming 
environment.  You now have Revolution.

Dar Scott




From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 14 13:08:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 14 13:08:01 2002
Subject: backColor of image
Message-ID: <a05100300b9f971844c60@[216.229.107.134]>

>on MouseUp
>   set the backgroundcolor of image "image1" to 0,0,0
>end MouseUp
>
>This button change the BackColor property of "image1" but the image does not
>change at all. Why?
>An image has a backcolor or not?

>Try changing the image from transparent to opaque.

Paolo, et al:

I tried this last night, and it did not work for me.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 14 13:08:11 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 14 13:08:11 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <B6873EF0-F772-11D6-ADED-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
References: <B6873EF0-F772-11D6-ADED-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05100301b9f97896f5b6@[216.229.107.134]>

>All I can deduct is that for some reason, the first time the mouse 
>leaves the 'over' image, no 'mouseLeave' message is being sent to 
>it! Only after the cursor has re-entered the image, and then 
>proceeds to leave again, does it work...

Hi Igor,

FWIW, I'm seeing the same behavior here (RR v1.5), but with 
additional complications:  If the top image has transparent pixels, 
moving the cursor from an opaque portion of the image to a 
transparent portion WITHIN THE SAME IMAGE will generate a mouseLeave, 
and moving from transparent to opaque portions generates a mouseEnter.

Which brings up a question for imaging wizards:  When I create a gif 
image, I can make part of it transparent.  When I import that image 
into a stack, I can set a property to make the image transparent or 
opaque.  How is the gif's internal transparency affected by the 
opaque property and vice versa?

Back to your main issue--I can tell you what I think is happening; 
but none of the workarounds I have tried fix it:  Image "idle" is not 
getting a mouseLeave message until the mouse leaves and reenters 
image "over". There is no mouseLeave message sent to image "over" (I 
guess RunRev thinks the mouse is still within image "idle") until you 
exit "over" and reenter it, at which point mouseLeave is sent to 
"idle" and mouseEnter is sent to "over".  I've tried specifically 
sending mouseLeave & mouseEnter to the images and clicking outside 
image "idle" before hiding it; but I still get no message the first 
time the mouse leaves "over".

Perhaps the MC engine needs to update its current control status when 
an image is hidden?
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 14 13:09:00 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 14 13:09:00 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <011e01c28b4f$a1ec7260$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom>
References: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOMEMHCJAA.chipp@chipp.com>
 <01a101c28a6a$6471a0d0$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom>
 <a05100302b9f8180bc003@[216.229.107.240]>
 <011e01c28b4f$a1ec7260$6401a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <a05100302b9f992e62448@[216.229.107.134]>

>3) Now create a rectangle with the fill color that you want, and place it
>*behind* the clock face, so that its color shows through the face of the
>clock. Now all you need to do is change the backgroundColor of the rectangle
>behind the clock to make it appear as though you're changing the color of
>the clock.

Thanks for the suggestion, Ken.

I buy it if you change "rectangle" to "circle": perhaps I didn't make 
it clear that this is an analog (ie: round) clock.

And there is one further complication I'm now evaluating:  Since I'm 
changing the clock face from a pale yellow for daytime to navy blue 
for nighttime, I may not get satisfactory visual results using the 
same color for the clock hands over both faces.

So I may still end up with 314 instead of 157 images, and I'm looking 
among the tools on my Mac to see if I have anything that creates 
animated gifs.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 14 13:40:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 14 13:40:01 2002
Subject: Hilite With Transparent Button
In-Reply-To: <001c01c28bee$f561cd60$a3ce59cf@egl>
References: <001c01c28bee$f561cd60$a3ce59cf@egl>
Message-ID: <a05100304b9f99662f5a5@[216.229.107.166]>

>I requested this feature when Revolution was in beta testing. Kevin added it
>to the list, but I don't know where it stands at this point.

Hi Ted,

I agree that a button property, or a default armed/hilited icon id#, 
designating that the entire button or just its icon should be 
inverted on arming/hiliting would save a lot of time and reduce the 
number of images needed to support an application.

-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 14 13:40:17 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 14 13:40:17 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
In-Reply-To: <2BDADC4C-F7F8-11D6-A10A-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
References: <2BDADC4C-F7F8-11D6-A10A-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <a05100305b9f998787331@[216.229.107.166]>

>>I've vaguely flirted with Revolution and gone through a couple of 
>>tutorials but I've never played with HyperCard or other stack based 
>>systems - and I don't understand the programming model which they 
>>follow. What is a stack? How do they fit in with more traditional 
>>programming languages?

Hi Simon,

Stacks are very difficult to categorize, except to say a stack can be 
almost anything you want it to be, including:

* An application
* A document
* A document that can create other documents
* A library of runtime routines, images, sounds, and/or other resources
* A database
* A dialog box
* A palette

I would say in its traditional form (eg: your address stack with one 
card per address) a stack is a database that includes the interface & 
code to access and display the data it contains.

I find the metaphor that works best for me is to think of a stack as 
a database and each card as a record.  So think of "go to card 1" 
[card id 99; card "Card Name"] as something like "get record number 
1" {record key "99") (alternate record key ""Card Name"), only the 
command not only loads the record into a buffer but also opens the 
user interface to display/manipulate the data.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 14 13:50:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 14 13:50:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
In-Reply-To: <85256C71.005FBA55.00@mail.mcc.org>
Message-ID: <20021114184350.22021.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Fred_D_Yocum at mail.mcc.org wrote:
> Stacks and Messages paths --and yet that doesn't
> seem clear enough to me.
> Looking at the discussion on the list, it is
> frequently stressed if  you want
> speed, you keep the data out of the stack-card-field
> paradym and put the
> information in a variable or an array.
> 
> Another words if I was designing an address
> database: with my stack hat on I
> think I should create a stack with multiple cards
> each dedicated to the
> information of one individual. But this does not
> seem to be what I should doing.
> I should really be keeping things out of
> stacks-cards-fields except for display
> purposes and then I'm back a not dis-similar method
> of programing than any
> other?.
> 
> Fred
> 

Hi Fred,

Speed is a very 'relative' thing. As long as you don't
have a huge amount of cards and/or don't have to do
complicated sorting all of the time, the stack+card
paradigm works just fine.
Besides, sometimes we're talking about seconds instead
of a minute. If you have a minute to spare, you don't
need to invest extra time to make it as speedy as
possible.
Because it takes time to switch data from one format
to another, and quite a bit of time in both thinking
and programming to make all these switches happen.

One of the differences between HyperCard and
MetaCard/RunRev is that HC used a disk-based scheme,
whereas MC/RR uses a ram-based scheme.
This means that MC/RR have to load the _entire_ stack
into memory, whereas HC would just read what it needed
and swap to disk whenever it needed the memory.
Consequence of this difference: MC/RR is faster, but
large stacks slow it down considerably.

At any rate, for a home-grown application, the
stack+cards approach works just fine. For a commercial
application, you'll probably want to look at a
database back-end anyway. And then, RunRev is an
excellent candidate for the front-end.

Just my 2 euro-cents,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From scott at tactilemedia.com  Thu Nov 14 13:56:01 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Thu Nov 14 13:56:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <a05100301b9f97896f5b6@[216.229.107.134]>
Message-ID: <B9F9304E.5430%scott@tactilemedia.com>

Recently, "Rob Cozens"  wrote:

> If the top image has transparent pixels,
> moving the cursor from an opaque portion of the image to a
> transparent portion WITHIN THE SAME IMAGE will generate a mouseLeave,
> and moving from transparent to opaque portions generates a mouseEnter.

This is desirable behavior since it allows you to employ non-rectangular
regions.


> When I create a gif
> image, I can make part of it transparent.  When I import that image
> into a stack, I can set a property to make the image transparent or
> opaque.  How is the gif's internal transparency affected by the
> opaque property and vice versa?

Are you talking about the blendLevel property?  In any event, the GIF itself
is not affected, the image object that displays the GIF is what you are
setting the property for.  But the net result is what you see on screen: a
GIF with a different appearance.


> Perhaps the MC engine needs to update its current control status when
> an image is hidden?

Better would be to get in the habit of using a transparent object to manage
display of other objects/images, or display images via a button.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-----
E: scott at tactilemedia.com
W: http://www.tactilemedia.com



From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 14 14:11:00 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 14 14:11:00 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <B9F9304E.5430%scott@tactilemedia.com>
References: <B9F9304E.5430%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <a05100307b9f9a24bc23d@[216.229.107.166]>

>Are you talking about the blendLevel property?

Hi Scott,

You're talking to a novice when it comes to image manipulation: I use 
HyperCard's PICT editor to create/modify images and Clip-To-Gif to 
create my gif files.  C2G gives me the options of setting no 
transparency, designating white, the first pixel, or a specific color 
as transparent.

And why, as Paolo asked, doesn't the image's background color appear 
behind the transparent portion of the image regardless of the image's 
opaque property?
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 14 14:28:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 14 14:28:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <B9F9304E.5430%scott@tactilemedia.com>
References: <B9F9304E.5430%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <a05100300b9f9a5958807@[216.229.107.166]>

>  > If the top image has transparent pixels,
>>  moving the cursor from an opaque portion of the image to a
>>  transparent portion WITHIN THE SAME IMAGE will generate a mouseLeave,
>>  and moving from transparent to opaque portions generates a mouseEnter.
>
>This is desirable behavior since it allows you to employ non-rectangular
>regions.

Scott, et al:

As a general feature, yes; but in the specific instance and way Igor 
is using the images, it could mean problems if that is not the effect 
he was intending.  Show the user a circle with a transparent center; 
from the point of view of the user, the cursor is over (inside) the 
image even when it is over the transparent center.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From doupsy at wanadoo.fr  Thu Nov 14 14:39:01 2002
From: doupsy at wanadoo.fr (doupsy at wanadoo.fr)
Date: Thu Nov 14 14:39:01 2002
Subject: How to have a hierarchical menu popup ?
Message-ID: <4D42B4A0-F7FE-11D6-AA69-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>

Hello,

I used Rinaldi's XFCN FullHPop wich have a 2 hierarchical level (menu, 
submenu, sub-submenu).
I know now, with Revoluion, how to make a menu + submenu with a popup 
button and a locked field and the popup command. But I don't know how to 
make the same thing with a sub-submenu (if it is possible). Could you 
help me ?

Thanks

Edouard



From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Thu Nov 14 14:51:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Thu Nov 14 14:51:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
In-Reply-To: <a05100305b9f998787331@[216.229.107.166]>
Message-ID: <B9F93D32.1FEE0%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

> I've vaguely flirted with Revolution and gone through a couple of
> tutorials but I've never played with HyperCard or other stack based
> systems - and I don't understand the programming model which they
> follow. What is a stack? How do they fit in with more traditional
> programming languages?

You can think of a "stack" as the contents of a window, with a "card" being
one of a nearly unlimited number of screens in that window.  Each stack has
one card when it's created, and you can create more cards with the "create
card" command or make a duplicate of an existing card with the "clone card"
command.  

You could think of a card as being similar in some respects to a VB form.  A
card is where you put controls (buttons, field, images, etc).  Like VB,
Visual C++, and others, controls are placed on the card by drawing them
interactively using the appropriate tool.

Unlike VB, C++, and the rest, these tool modes are also available to you in
scripting -- you can have a browse (normal) mode for interacting with
controls, or a pointer tool mode for selecting, moving, and resizing
objects.  And there are other tools for creating each object type, so you
could have a user create their own fields, for example, using the field
tool.

If you've programmed GUIs without a framework, you know how much code is
devoted to handling the event loop: querying the OS for things like mouse
and keyboard activity, determining which control is affected, and then
calling a function to handle that event.  With the xTalk family of languages
(of which Revolution is one of several flavors, including ToolBook) the
event loop is handled for you:  controls are sent messages that you can
intercept by name --

  on mouseUp
    put "hello world!" into field 1
  end mouseUp

Similar to truly object-oriented systems, messages are sent along a
hierarchy, such that if the first object in the chain doesn't handle it the
message will pass to the second, third, etc.

For example, the "mouseUp" message is sent to the control the user clicked
on, but rather than write code into every button you could put your mouseUp
handler in the card to handle all clicks on the card, or in the stack to
handle all clicks on all cards in the stack.

This message hierarchy is also extensible and malleable to some degree,
using frontscripts, backscripts, libraries, and the send and call commands.

Another big bonus for Revolution: nearly all memory issues (allocation and
deallocation) are handled for you.  Keeping track of object size and
managing associated memory accounts for a huge portion of code in C and
other lower-level languages, but Rev handles all that for you so you can
concentrate on your program logc and user interface.

Once you get the hang of it I suspect you'll find yourself cranking out
applications in a fraction of the time it would take in C, or even Java.

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Thu Nov 14 14:57:00 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Thu Nov 14 14:57:00 2002
Subject: How to have a hierarchical menu popup ?
In-Reply-To: <4D42B4A0-F7FE-11D6-AA69-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>
Message-ID: <B9F93EA4.1FEE1%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

doupsy at wanadoo.fr wrote:

> I used Rinaldi's XFCN FullHPop wich have a 2 hierarchical level (menu,
> submenu, sub-submenu).
> I know now, with Revoluion, how to make a menu + submenu with a popup
> button and a locked field and the popup command. But I don't know how to
> make the same thing with a sub-submenu (if it is possible). Could you
> help me ?

Put this into a button's contents and set the style of the button to Option:

Item 1
Item 2
<tab>SubItem 2.1
<tab>SubItem 2.2
<tab><tab>Sub-Subitem 2.2.1
<tab><tab>Sub-Subitem 2.2.2
<tab>SubItem 2.3
Item 3


Note: "<tab>" denotes a tab character.

Also, keep in mind this caveat from Apple's Aqua HIG (the sentiment is also
expressd in the Win HIG):

  Be very cautious about creating a pop-up menu with
  submenus.  Doing so hides choices too deeply and
  is physically difficult to use.


-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From scott at tactilemedia.com  Thu Nov 14 15:08:01 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Thu Nov 14 15:08:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <a05100300b9f9a5958807@[216.229.107.166]>
Message-ID: <B9F9411F.543F%scott@tactilemedia.com>

Recently, "Rob Cozens"  wrote:

> As a general feature, yes; but in the specific instance and way Igor
> is using the images, it could mean problems if that is not the effect
> he was intending.  Show the user a circle with a transparent center;
> from the point of view of the user, the cursor is over (inside) the
> image even when it is over the transparent center.

Then a transparent graphic object could be used to trap mouse events (with
the image positioned behind it).

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-----
E: scott at tactilemedia.com
W: http://www.tactilemedia.com



From scott at tactilemedia.com  Thu Nov 14 15:08:09 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Thu Nov 14 15:08:09 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <a05100307b9f9a24bc23d@[216.229.107.166]>
Message-ID: <B9F94125.543F%scott@tactilemedia.com>

Recently, "Rob Cozens"  wrote:

> And why, as Paolo asked, doesn't the image's background color appear
> behind the transparent portion of the image regardless of the image's
> opaque property?

I've never seen an example of the opaque property affecting image objects
(though MC's docs claim this property does affect image objects).

As far as image backColor goes, the only way I've been able create an image
whose backColor can be changed is by drawing a paint graphic (rect, oval,
etc).

Basically, if you want to be able to change the background color of an
imported image, you can use two objects: your image object with a graphic
object behind it, and change the backColor of the graphic object as needed.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-----
E: scott at tactilemedia.com
W: http://www.tactilemedia.com



From troy at rpsystems.net  Thu Nov 14 15:16:01 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Thu Nov 14 15:16:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
In-Reply-To: <B9F93D32.1FEE0%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <B9F96D24.16542%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/14/02 2:44 PM, "Richard Gaskin" <ambassador at fourthworld.com> wrote:

> You can think of a "stack" as the contents of a window, with a "card" being
> one of a nearly unlimited number of screens in that window.  Each stack has
> one card when it's created, and you can create more cards with the "create
> card" command or make a duplicate of an existing card with the "clone card"
> command.  
> 
> You could think of a card as being similar in some respects to a VB form.  A
> card is where you put controls (buttons, field, images, etc).  Like VB,
> Visual C++, and others, controls are placed on the card by drawing them
> interactively using the appropriate tool.

I agree with the card assessment, and would further the one on stacks to say
- you can think of the stack as the window itself, and not just the
contents. Generally, the stack is like a smart window, and the cards are the
contents.

Then again - I also rather liked Dar's version (paraphrased) "Fill up a
shoebox with stuff, get visited by aliens, and there ya go... Revolution!!"
Or something like that.  ;-)


-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net



From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Thu Nov 14 15:24:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (Yves =?iso-8859-1?Q?Copp=E9?=)
Date: Thu Nov 14 15:24:01 2002
Subject: How to have a hierarchical menu popup ?
In-Reply-To: <4D42B4A0-F7FE-11D6-AA69-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>
References: <4D42B4A0-F7FE-11D6-AA69-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>
Message-ID: <p05111701b9f9b56ddc77@[10.0.1.204]>

>Hello,
>
>I used Rinaldi's XFCN FullHPop wich have a 2 hierarchical level 
>(menu, submenu, sub-submenu).
>I know now, with Revoluion, how to make a menu + submenu with a 
>popup button and a locked field and the popup command. But I don't 
>know how to make the same thing with a sub-submenu (if it is 
>possible). Could you help me ?
>
>Thanks
>


I think it is not possible...
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From katir at hindu.org  Thu Nov 14 15:33:01 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Thu Nov 14 15:33:01 2002
Subject: Printing Card to Letter Sheet--Offset 1 inch
Message-ID: <865D6195-F80F-11D6-99E6-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

I made a stack 792 pixels tall 612 pixels wide effectively making a US 
Letter sized card, layed out a letterhead and printed.

The entire image of the card is offset almost exactly 72 pixels
(1 inch) from the top and the left.

How can I "nail" the topleft 0,0, of the card image to the  topleft, 
0,0 of the physical sheet that is being printed (a plain 8.5 X 11 sheet 
of paper)? I tested this on our b/w Apple Laser 8500 and also our 4C 
Xante Color Laser. Two completely different drivers and printing 
technologies, exact same result in both cases.

OSX, Jaguar, appleTalk, Rev 1.1.1, using "print card' from the file 
menu.

Thanks!

Himalayan Academy Publications
Sannyasin Sivakatirswami
katir at hindu.org
www.HinduismToday.com, www.HimalayanAcademy.com,
www.Gurudeva.org, www.hindu.org



From mazzapaolo at libero.it  Thu Nov 14 15:45:01 2002
From: mazzapaolo at libero.it (paolo mazza)
Date: Thu Nov 14 15:45:01 2002
Subject: Transparent Images
In-Reply-To: <200211131701.MAA29290@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <B9F9CC63.4619%mazzapaolo@libero.it>

Thank you for your messages.
So,  there is not way to have transparent pixels of an image to answer mouse
events unless you trap the mouse event in a button or in a ghaphic.
Now I can relax... I thought I was missing the point.
Thanks,  Paolo
 

> 
>> All transparent pixels in  images ignore mouse events.
>> How can I change this?
>> I wuold like transparent pixels of my images  answer to mouse events and I
>> do not want to set the image as the icon of a button.
> 
> Bon journo, Paolo:
> 
> Place a button with this handler behind the image:
> 
> on mouseUp
> send mouseUp to image [your image name or "id" + image id here]
> end mouseUp
> 
> Ciao!
> -- 
> 
> Rob Cozens
> CCW, Serendipity Software Company

>Or use a polygon and have *it* trap and send the mouseUp message...

>Ken Ray
>Sons of Thunder Software
>Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
>Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Thu Nov 14 16:22:01 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Thu Nov 14 16:22:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
Message-ID: <2EE33CDA-F816-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Revolution Folks,

Thank you all very much for your suggestions, re: problem with 
mouseLeave/mouseEnter messages not being sent to an object if the 
object is hidden while mouse is over it. Comments so far:

 From Terry Judd:
> Igor - How 'odd-shaped' are the non transparent parts of your images? 
> Could you get away with placing a 'transparent' polygon grc over the 
> top of the lot and putting your handlers in that? Not very elegant 
> but...
>

 From Scott Rossi:
> Better would be to get in the habit of using a transparent object to 
> manage
> display of other objects/images, or display images via a button.

and further:
> Then a transparent graphic object could be used to trap mouse events 
> (with
> the image positioned behind it).

The idea behind my application is that users will be able to design 
their own interfaces - i.e., create 'skins' for the application! The 
shape of any buttons therefore, will be up to the user to determine- I 
cannot predict what they will be. Having the image that represents the 
button as an irregular shape (let's say, an 'ink splatter' shape) and 
having the clickable area over is as a rectangle or oval does not seem 
to me to be a very elegant programming solution that we should be 
striving to adopt. It also seems to me that the 'image' control in 
Revolution was designed specifically for that purpose - when irregular 
clickable areas are required.

The crunch of the problem here, however, as pointed out by Rob Cozens, 
is not related to what areas of the image button end up being 
'clickable' or not. The issue here has to do with showing/hiding 
objects, and what messages are passed to objects when they are 
shown/hidden underneath the cursor...

 From Jan Schenkel:
> Or you could have it all handled with a single button,
> no scripting required:
> - import the graphics
> - set its 'icon' to the "idle" graphic
> - set its 'armedIcon' to the "over" graphic
> - set its 'autoArm' property to true.
>

The reason why I chose the 'image' rather than the 'button' object, was 
precisely because after following discussions in this list, I learned 
that the while the 'button' object can display transparent icons, it 
retains a 'rectangular' clickable area - which is not wanted here, as 
some of the buttons designed by users will undoubtedly overlap each 
other!

> Easiest solution would be to stick with a 'one image,
> many pictures' approach, and handle all the messages
> from within a single object, setting the fileName to
> the different states.

Yes, indeed! If I could only refer to images INSIDE the stack, instead 
of having to use EXTERNAL references, this could perhaps work... See, 
the 'skin' file has to be a self-contained entity - ie, it has to have 
all the images that the user needs INSIDE it. Having your skin file 
refer to 30-odd external image files makes for a very unpractical way 
for users to share their skins!

 From Rob Cozens:
> Back to your main issue--I can tell you what I think is happening; but 
> none of the workarounds I have tried fix it:  Image "idle" is not 
> getting a mouseLeave message until the mouse leaves and reenters image 
> "over". There is no mouseLeave message sent to image "over" (I guess 
> RunRev thinks the mouse is still within image "idle") until you exit 
> "over" and reenter it, at which point mouseLeave is sent to "idle" and 
> mouseEnter is sent to "over".  I've tried specifically sending 
> mouseLeave & mouseEnter to the images and clicking outside image 
> "idle" before hiding it; but I still get no message the first time the 
> mouse leaves "over".
>
> Perhaps the MC engine needs to update its current control status when 
> an image is hidden?

I must admit, I had reached the same conclusion, and tried the same 
technique (sending mouseEnter/mouseLeave messages to the appropriate 
objects from inside my script), and observed the same results (ie, 
zilch difference). I have to confess, this is quite disappointing...

I agree wholeheartedly with you: perhaps this is an oversight with the 
Revolution engine design, and if that is the case, I sure hope that it 
will be fixed in version 2.0... It should not be terribly hard to 
implement: if the cursor in within an object's clickable area when it 
receives a 'hide' message, the object should be sent a 'mouseLeave' 
message. Conversely, if when an object receives a 'show' message it 
appears with its clickable area right underneath the cursor, it should 
receive a 'mouseEnter'  message.

Is anyone able to tell us whether this bug has been previously 
reported, and whether it is being addressed in version 2.0?

Many thanks to all, for your interest and your kind suggestions.

Kind Regards,
--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
igor at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 14 16:34:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 14 16:34:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <2EE33CDA-F816-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <20021114212752.72189.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Igor de Oliveira Couto <info at pixelmedia.com.au>
wrote:
> Dear Revolution Folks,
> 
> Thank you all very much for your suggestions, re:
> problem with 
> mouseLeave/mouseEnter messages not being sent to an
> object if the 
> object is hidden while mouse is over it. 
> 
> [snip]
> 
> > Easiest solution would be to stick with a 'one
> image,
> > many pictures' approach, and handle all the
> messages
> > from within a single object, setting the fileName
> to
> > the different states.
> 
> Yes, indeed! If I could only refer to images INSIDE
> the stack, instead 
> of having to use EXTERNAL references, this could
> perhaps work... See, 
> the 'skin' file has to be a self-contained entity -
> ie, it has to have 
> all the images that the user needs INSIDE it. Having
> your skin file 
> refer to 30-odd external image files makes for a
> very unpractical way 
> for users to share their skins!
> 

Hi Igor,

A 'devious' workaround for this limitation would be
the following:
- store the entire collection of pictures in custom
properties (one per file with 'set the
uPictures[tFileName] of this stack to URL
"binfile:"&tFilePath')
- on openStack you 'unpack' the images, placing them
in a temporary directory
- then you point the fileName property of the image to
the 'unpacked' file in that temporary directory

This way you still have only a single file.

Just a thought ;-)

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 14 16:35:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 14 16:35:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <B9F9411F.543F%scott@tactilemedia.com>
References: <B9F9411F.543F%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <a05100300b9f9c36ceff2@[216.229.107.72]>

>Then a transparent graphic object could be used to trap mouse events (with
>the image positioned behind it).

Thanks, Scott, for reminding me of a question that came to mind the other day:

What is the difference between a graphic object and an image?

If I create a red square in HC PICT editor, convert it to gif, & 
import it to a stack, is it somehow different from a red square 
created with RunRev's tools?

Can one convert graphics to images and/or vice versa?
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 14 16:39:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 14 16:39:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <2EE33CDA-F816-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
References: <2EE33CDA-F816-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05100301b9f9c68dac34@[216.229.107.158]>

>Is anyone able to tell us whether this bug has been previously 
>reported, and whether it is being addressed in version 2.0?

Igor, et al:

I sent the following to the improve-rev list earlier today:

>>
Hi All,

 From the use-rev list:

1. Create a stack with two identically-sized images, "top" & 
"bottom", placed at the same loc.

2.Top image script:

on mouseleave
   answer "left top"
   hide me
   show image "bottom"
end mouseleave

on mouseenter
   answer "entered top"
end mouseenter

3. Bottom image script:

on mouseenter
   answer "entered bottom"
   hide me
   show image "top.gif"
end mouseenter

on mouseleave
   answer "left bottom"
end mouseleave

Image "bottom" is not getting a mouseLeave message until the mouse 
leaves and reenters image "top". There is no mouseLeave message sent 
to image "top" until you exit "top" and reenter it, at which point 
mouseLeave is sent to "bottom" and mouseEnter is sent to "top".  I've 
tried specifically sending mouseLeave & mouseEnter to the images and 
clicking outside image "bottom" before hiding it; but I still get no 
message the first time the mouse leaves "over".  Locking message and 
changing the order of the hide & show messages didn't seem to help 
either.

Perhaps the MC engine needs to update its current control status when 
an image is hidden?

<<
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From doupsy at wanadoo.fr  Thu Nov 14 16:43:00 2002
From: doupsy at wanadoo.fr (doupsy at wanadoo.fr)
Date: Thu Nov 14 16:43:00 2002
Subject: How to have a hierarchical menu popup ?  
Message-ID: <126C3CFE-F819-11D6-92BC-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>

doupsy at wanadoo.fr wrote:

 > I used Rinaldi's XFCN FullHPop wich have a 2 hierarchical level (menu,
 > submenu, sub-submenu).
 > I know now, with Revoluion, how to make a menu + submenu with a popup
 > button and a locked field and the popup command. But I don't know how 
to
 > make the same thing with a sub-submenu (if it is possible). Could you
 > help me ?

Put this into a button's contents and set the style of the button to 
Option:

Item 1
Item 2
<tab>SubItem 2.1
<tab>SubItem 2.2
<tab><tab>Sub-Subitem 2.2.1
<tab><tab>Sub-Subitem 2.2.2
<tab>SubItem 2.3
Item 3


Note: "<tab>" denotes a tab character.

Also, keep in mind this caveat from Apple's Aqua HIG (the sentiment is 
also
expressd in the Win HIG):

   Be very cautious about creating a pop-up menu with
   submenus.  Doing so hides choices too deeply and
   is physically difficult to use.


--
  Richard Gaskin
  Fourth World Media Corporation
  Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
  ___________________________________________________________
  Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
  Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



Hello,

Thanks very much,

I try this and it is very O.K.
I must copy a tab character before and paste it.

Edouard
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From scott at tactilemedia.com  Thu Nov 14 16:48:01 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Thu Nov 14 16:48:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <a05100300b9f9c36ceff2@[216.229.107.72]>
Message-ID: <B9F958B3.546C%scott@tactilemedia.com>

Recently, "Rob Cozens"  wrote:

> What is the difference between a graphic object and an image?

A graphic is a rectangle, oval, etc object that is based on vector point
information.  An image is a bitmap that is created by painting or importing
(GIF, JPEG, etc).


> If I create a red square in HC PICT editor, convert it to gif, &
> import it to a stack, is it somehow different from a red square
> created with RunRev's tools?

If you paint the red square, then no, there's no difference.  But if you use
the drawing tools to create the red square, then yes, this is different from
an imported GIF (GIFs are bitmap/paint information).


> Can one convert graphics to images and/or vice versa?

Graphics to images is pretty easy: usually cut and paste depending on the
tools used.

Images to graphics requires tracing or redrawing.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-----
E: scott at tactilemedia.com
W: http://www.tactilemedia.com



From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Thu Nov 14 16:49:00 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Thu Nov 14 16:49:00 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <a05100301b9f9c68dac34@[216.229.107.158]>
Message-ID: <FCA7D6B7-F819-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Rob,

On Friday, November 15, 2002, at 08:32  AM, Rob Cozens wrote:

> I sent the following to the improve-rev list earlier today:
>

(snip)

Many thanks! I hope they are responsive!

Kind Regards,

--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
igor at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Thu Nov 14 16:52:01 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Thu Nov 14 16:52:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <20021114212752.72189.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <5CA89542-F81A-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Jan,

On Friday, November 15, 2002, at 08:27  AM, Jan Schenkel wrote:

> A 'devious' workaround for this limitation would be
> the following:
> - store the entire collection of pictures in custom
> properties (one per file with 'set the
> uPictures[tFileName] of this stack to URL
> "binfile:"&tFilePath')
> - on openStack you 'unpack' the images, placing them
> in a temporary directory
> - then you point the fileName property of the image to
> the 'unpacked' file in that temporary directory
>
> This way you still have only a single file.
>

OOOOOOOH! I like the sound of that! You genius!
Sounds like a lot of work, but I will try that for sure!

Many, many thanks, and

Kind Regards,

--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
igor at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From carette.pierre-marie at wanadoo.fr  Thu Nov 14 17:27:00 2002
From: carette.pierre-marie at wanadoo.fr (Pierre-Marie CARETTE)
Date: Thu Nov 14 17:27:00 2002
Subject: Subject: Re: How to have a hierarchical menu popup ?
In-Reply-To: <200211142144.QAA10139@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <32FBBBED-F81F-11D6-8BC9-003065A335E6@wanadoo.fr>

Not THE solution, but my solution

global menuchoisi

on mouseenter
   get the propMenu of the target           -- the menu can change
   set text of btn "Menu" of group "Menubar" to it  ----btn invisible , 
group backgroundbehavior true
end mouseenter

on mousedown
   put word 2 of the clickline into nl
   popup btn "menu" of group "menubar"
   get menuChoisi
   put empty into menuChoisi
   if it is not empty then send it &","&nl to the target   -- nl is 
added as last parameter
   exit to top  -- to block another popmenu down from card....
end mousedown

script in btn "menu" :

on menupick x           -- x = choixA|choixAA|choixAAA|???
   if x is empty then exit to top
   replace "|" with comma in x
   get offset(comma,x)
   if it is not empty then put space into char it of x   --to delete the 
first comma
   put x into menuChoisi  -- menuchoisi = choixA 
choixAA,choixAAA.........
end menupick

I use a global variable "menuchoisi" but you can use a property : the 
menuchoisi of this stack
Question : what solution is the best ? i don't know...
it works..
my philosophy : i prefer a pop-menu WHERE i must make a choice (on a 
field, on a button) , i dislike the menubar : my mouse doesn't climb up 
and down all day long





From themacguy at macosx.com  Thu Nov 14 17:39:01 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Thu Nov 14 17:39:01 2002
Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #487 - 6 msgs
In-Reply-To: <200206191601.MAA01967@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <E4705204-F820-11D6-9B58-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

I'm creating a program that plays some ".aif" audio (22KHz, 16bit, 
mono). I'm having a problem getting a particular file to play back in a 
consistent manner. Using Transcript, I set the filename of a player 
object to the audio file and then tell the player to play. I then set 
it to another file and play the player again. It seems only to happen 
to one particular file and then only in this manner:

The first time I set the filename to file 1 and play the player, I get 
no audio. The second time I do.

Then I set the filename to file 2 and play the player. It always plays.

Then I set the filename back to file1 and play the player. No audio. I 
do it again and it works.

I've set the filename and played the player using the message box and 
have found identical behavior: The first time I play the player, no 
audio results. I play it again and it's fine even without setting the 
filename.

So the filename is getting placed in the proper manner. I've even tried 
adding a "wait until messages" and even a "wait 1 second" line of code 
just in case there are things happening I'm not seeing, but the result 
is the same.

Have I run into a "wait until Rev 2.0" issue?

I'm running OSX 10.2.2 on a dual-867 G4 with 512MB RAM and Rev 1.1.1.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Barry
On Wednesday, June 19, 2002, at 10:01 AM, 
use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote:

> (Unfortunately OSX appears to have [yet another] bug that causes audio 
> to
> cut out periodically.  sigh.)



From tsj at unimelb.edu.au  Thu Nov 14 17:44:01 2002
From: tsj at unimelb.edu.au (Terry Judd)
Date: Thu Nov 14 17:44:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <5CA89542-F81A-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
References: <5CA89542-F81A-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05100300b9f9d55272b9@[128.250.196.25]>

>Dear Jan,
>
>On Friday, November 15, 2002, at 08:27  AM, Jan Schenkel wrote:
>
>>A 'devious' workaround for this limitation would be
>>the following:
>>- store the entire collection of pictures in custom
>>properties (one per file with 'set the
>>uPictures[tFileName] of this stack to URL
>>"binfile:"&tFilePath')
>>- on openStack you 'unpack' the images, placing them
>>in a temporary directory
>>- then you point the fileName property of the image to
>>the 'unpacked' file in that temporary directory
>>
>>This way you still have only a single file.
>>
>
>OOOOOOOH! I like the sound of that! You genius!
>Sounds like a lot of work, but I will try that for sure!
>
>Many, many thanks, and
>
>Kind Regards,
>

If you're considering this path then... use the imageData property to 
set the image from a property and you don't even need to write out to 
an external file. You must make sure that your image object is the 
right dimensions however, if not you'll experience some unexpected 
results.

Cheers,

Terry..
-- 
___________________________________________________________________________
Dr Terry Judd

Biomedical Multimedia Unit
Faculty of Medicine, Dentistry & Health Sciences
The University of Melbourne
Email: t.judd at bmu.unimelb.edu.au
Phone: 03 9344 0187
Fax: 03 9344 4998
___________________________________________________________________________


From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 14 17:56:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Thu Nov 14 17:56:01 2002
Subject: Open Program with RR
In-Reply-To: <20021114082951.14646.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20021114224929.25107.qmail@web20010.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Jan Schenkel <janschenkel at yahoo.com> 
> > on startup
> >   start using stack "A"
> >   start using stack "B"
> >   start using stack "C"
> > end startup

> move the 'start using' bits
> into the 'openStack' handler of your
> mainStack. 

thanks for responding.

MainStack. i have a number of stacks that are
interrelated. with the 30K script limit gone, all
common utility handlers can be consolidated in
one place, but there will still be stacks
interacting in various ways. they don't seem like
"substacks" because they should open and function
independently if possible. maybe the splash
screen stack with a menu of stacks would work.

the structure still eludes me but using the TD
and the "See Also" button are very helpful.
hoping to put previous conceptual models to rest,
starting with "Home",

"put mainstacks()" yields a long list with "Home"
at the top Transcript Dictionary (TD) has no
listing for "Home" and <go stack stack "Home"
causes nothing to happen.

what exactly IS "Home" in RR?

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From scott at tactilemedia.com  Thu Nov 14 17:57:01 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Thu Nov 14 17:57:01 2002
Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #487 - 6 msgs
In-Reply-To: <E4705204-F820-11D6-9B58-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
Message-ID: <B9F968F9.5487%scott@tactilemedia.com>

Recently, "Barry Levine"  wrote:

> I'm creating a program that plays some ".aif" audio (22KHz, 16bit,
> mono). I'm having a problem getting a particular file to play back in a
> consistent manner. Using Transcript, I set the filename of a player
> object to the audio file and then tell the player to play. I then set
> it to another file and play the player again. It seems only to happen
> to one particular file and then only in this manner:
> 
> The first time I set the filename to file 1 and play the player, I get
> no audio. The second time I do.
> 
> Then I set the filename to file 2 and play the player. It always plays.
> 
> Then I set the filename back to file1 and play the player. No audio. I
> do it again and it works.

Try setting the fileName of the player to empty in between fileName changes.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-----
E: scott at tactilemedia.com
W: http://www.tactilemedia.com



From raney at metacard.com  Thu Nov 14 18:05:01 2002
From: raney at metacard.com (Scott Raney)
Date: Thu Nov 14 18:05:01 2002
Subject: Hilite With Transparent Button
In-Reply-To: <200211141600.LAA25311@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211141550140.22603-100000@mast.metacard.com>

On Thu, 14 Nov 2002 "Ted" <tedl at voyager.net> wrote:

> Pixel inversion under transparent buttons was a very useful feature of
> HyperCard; it allowed you to quickly and easily hilite any object.

Hmm, seems like all apps should work this way.  OK, let's try try this
one then:

Monochrome was a very useful feature of HyperCard, because it reduced
memory requirements and made pixel inversion hiliting very easy to
implement.

;-)

> I requested this feature when Revolution was in beta testing. Kevin added it
> to the list, but I don't know where it stands at this point.

Hey, you want pixel inversion, just draw a white object (black on the
Mac, I think) with its ink set to srcXor on top of your object.  Once
you see what that looks like, though, you'll see why I think you don't
really want what you're asking for...
  Regards,
    Scott

> Ted

PS: and about that plan of using a GIF as an image library.  It's bad
idea because the frames are all decompressed ahead of time, chewing up
large amounts of RAM for no good reason unless you're actually going
to use it for animation where performance is more important than
memory requirements.

********************************************************
Scott Raney  raney at metacard.com  http://www.metacard.com
MetaCard: You know, there's an easier way to do that...




From bvlahos at mac.com  Thu Nov 14 18:12:01 2002
From: bvlahos at mac.com (Bill Vlahos)
Date: Thu Nov 14 18:12:01 2002
Subject: Project Management Software
Message-ID: <8A958CB4-F825-11D6-B85F-003065EC5590@mac.com>

I would like to find out if anyone is working on Project Management 
software. It is not something I'm interested in writing but would be 
interested in buying.

There is no cross platform software which does both GANT and PERT 
charts that is current.

FastTrack Schedule is a very nice cross platform program but it only 
does GANT charts. Microsoft has abandoned Project for the Mac and, of 
course, there isn't anything I'm aware of for Linux.

I'm putting this out as a good application to be written in Revolution. 
I don't know enough about project management to write this myself.

Bill Vlahos



From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Thu Nov 14 18:42:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Thu Nov 14 18:42:01 2002
Subject: Project Management Software
In-Reply-To: <8A958CB4-F825-11D6-B85F-003065EC5590@mac.com>
Message-ID: <B9F97355.1FF36%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Bill Vlahos wrote:

> I would like to find out if anyone is working on Project Management
> software. It is not something I'm interested in writing but would be
> interested in buying.
> 
> There is no cross platform software which does both GANT and PERT
> charts that is current.

I don't know much about this one (I still keep MS Project 4.0 around) but it
looks promising:

<http://www.microplanning.com/>


-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From chripa at aon.at  Thu Nov 14 19:00:00 2002
From: chripa at aon.at (Chris Pastl)
Date: Thu Nov 14 19:00:00 2002
Subject: Can=?ISO-8859-1?B?tA==?=t open driver
Message-ID: <B9F9F611.E2%chripa@aon.at>

I?m interested in developing applications on Mac OS 9
which can connect to a USB driver.
So tried to open a driver called "USB Serial Driver"
using the following code:

open driver "USB Serial Driver" for binary update

But the program says that it "can?t open that file".

What?s wrong?

The Driver is successfully installed in the extensions folder.


Regards,
Chris 


From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Thu Nov 14 19:40:01 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Thu Nov 14 19:40:01 2002
Subject: Project Management Software
In-Reply-To: <B9F97355.1FF36%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <ED730094-F831-11D6-BE61-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Friday, Nov 15, 2002, at 10:35 Australia/Sydney, Richard Gaskin 
wrote:

> Bill Vlahos wrote:
>
>> I would like to find out if anyone is working on Project Management
>> software. It is not something I'm interested in writing but would be
>> interested in buying.
>>
>> There is no cross platform software which does both GANT and PERT
>> charts that is current.
>
> I don't know much about this one (I still keep MS Project 4.0 around) 
> but it
> looks promising:
>
> <http://www.microplanning.com/>

Also, try www.headshack.com

Currently ChartConstructor is OS X only but is clean, simple and 
provides GANTT and PERT views. You could try the author to see in what 
they have written it and if they are interested in cross-platform.

regards
David
>
>
> -- 
>  Richard Gaskin
>  Fourth World Media Corporation
>  Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
>  ___________________________________________________________
>  Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
>  Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From djh at mac.com  Thu Nov 14 19:54:01 2002
From: djh at mac.com (Derek Hadlington)
Date: Thu Nov 14 19:54:01 2002
Subject: Project Management Software
In-Reply-To: <8A958CB4-F825-11D6-B85F-003065EC5590@mac.com>
Message-ID: <000001c28c40$8e407620$717e27d9@djhdell340>

One for my list of possibilities :-) 
Seems to be a few good products that may suffice but none with the 
platform cover that a Revolution Application could provide if required.

Regards
Derek Hadlington

-----Original Message-----
From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
[mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Bill Vlahos
Sent: 14 November 2002 23:05
To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
Subject: Project Management Software

I would like to find out if anyone is working on Project Management 
software. It is not something I'm interested in writing but would be 
interested in buying.

There is no cross platform software which does both GANT and PERT 
charts that is current.

FastTrack Schedule is a very nice cross platform program but it only 
does GANT charts. Microsoft has abandoned Project for the Mac and, of 
course, there isn't anything I'm aware of for Linux.

I'm putting this out as a good application to be written in Revolution. 
I don't know enough about project management to write this myself.

Bill Vlahos

_______________________________________________
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution




From djh at mac.com  Thu Nov 14 19:55:03 2002
From: djh at mac.com (Derek Hadlington)
Date: Thu Nov 14 19:55:03 2002
Subject: Project Management Software
In-Reply-To: <8A958CB4-F825-11D6-B85F-003065EC5590@mac.com>
Message-ID: <000101c28c40$b53cc710$717e27d9@djhdell340>

One for my list of possibilities :-) 
Seems to be a few good products that may suffice but none with the 
platform cover that a Revolution Application could provide if required.

Regards
Derek Hadlington

-----Original Message-----
From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
[mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Bill Vlahos
Sent: 14 November 2002 23:05
To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
Subject: Project Management Software

I would like to find out if anyone is working on Project Management 
software. It is not something I'm interested in writing but would be 
interested in buying.

There is no cross platform software which does both GANT and PERT 
charts that is current.

FastTrack Schedule is a very nice cross platform program but it only 
does GANT charts. Microsoft has abandoned Project for the Mac and, of 
course, there isn't anything I'm aware of for Linux.

I'm putting this out as a good application to be written in Revolution. 
I don't know enough about project management to write this myself.

Bill Vlahos

_______________________________________________
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution




From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 14 21:34:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 14 21:34:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <B9F958B3.546C%scott@tactilemedia.com>
References: <B9F958B3.546C%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <a05100302b9fa082b4c06@[216.229.107.23]>

>A graphic is a rectangle, oval, etc object that is based on vector point
>information.  An image is a bitmap that is created by painting or importing
>(GIF, JPEG, etc).

Thanks Scott, for furthering my education:  I do know the difference 
between vector and bitmap representation; but had not made the 
association between vector/bitmap <-->graphic/image.

Are there any essential differences in the properties and/or behavior 
of graphics and images?

TIA,
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From scott at tactilemedia.com  Thu Nov 14 21:42:01 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Thu Nov 14 21:42:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <a05100302b9fa082b4c06@[216.229.107.23]>
Message-ID: <B9F99D98.91A2%scott@tactilemedia.com>

Recently, Rob Cozens wrote:

> Are there any essential differences in the properties and/or behavior
> of graphics and images?

Besides those already mentioned, you should go through the docs and check
out the respective properties.  If you have any specific questions, feel
free to ask.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director

Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
Email: scott at tactilemedia.com
Web: www.tactilemedia.com



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Thu Nov 14 22:01:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Thu Nov 14 22:01:01 2002
Subject: Project Management Software
In-Reply-To: <8A958CB4-F825-11D6-B85F-003065EC5590@mac.com>
Message-ID: <9B3B4022-F845-11D6-B157-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Freitag, November 15, 2002, at 12:05  Uhr, Bill Vlahos wrote:

> I would like to find out if anyone is working on Project Management 
> software. It is not something I'm interested in writing but would be 
> interested in buying.
>
> There is no cross platform software which does both GANT and PERT 
> charts that is current.
>
> FastTrack Schedule is a very nice cross platform program but it only 
> does GANT charts. Microsoft has abandoned Project for the Mac and, of 
> course, there isn't anything I'm aware of for Linux.

Not a real Project Management software, but a powerful "PERT chart" 
tool: Inspiration.com. With its unique change between Diagram and 
Outliner view and its "show checklist"-feature you can do great PERT 
charts. With brainstorming function, symbol-links, text-notes and voice 
recognition and a lot more features you can do more than in any other 
tool I know. And you have a lot of export/import features. But it has 
no "classical GANTT chart" with a "calendar integration".
Depends what you need. And its cross platform...


regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu  Thu Nov 14 22:40:01 2002
From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry)
Date: Thu Nov 14 22:40:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20021114123017.02e4e1c8@mail.spamcop.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0211141928520.15366-100000@titan.ecs.fullerton.edu>

Rod,

I don't know if I told you this previously, but I have entered a second
master's degree program in instructional design and technology..  Anyway,
they've approved as a final project for me to design a series of
tools/tutorials to help acclimate new users to Rev -- particularly
non-technical types such as new public school teachers.

My first project is a stack which aims to teach the concept of mouse
events; it is due early December.

Would you be interested in offering any feedback?  These things could
perhaps be of use in attracting the K-12 market...

Cheers,

Judy




From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Thu Nov 14 22:42:00 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Thu Nov 14 22:42:00 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <a05111a92b9f996a2c556@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <434C2869-F84B-11D6-82E4-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

> So I may still end up with 314 instead of 157 images, and I'm looking 
> among the tools on my Mac to see if I have anything that creates 
> animated gifs.
>
Try GifBuilder http://www.mac.org/graphics/gifbuilder/
Don't be put off by it's version number being 0.5. It's been around for 
ages and is stable and easy to use.

Cheers,
Sarah




From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu  Thu Nov 14 22:44:01 2002
From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry)
Date: Thu Nov 14 22:44:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0211141928520.15366-100000@titan.ecs.fullerton.edu>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0211141937090.15366-100000@titan.ecs.fullerton.edu>

Okay, I am apparently just too stupid to live.

The previous message was intended for Rod.  Please ignore me in my vast
stupidity.

:(

Judy




From wmb at internettrainer.com  Thu Nov 14 22:58:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Thu Nov 14 22:58:01 2002
Subject: swf files?
In-Reply-To: <B9F97355.1FF36%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <9F4329A6-F84D-11D6-B157-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

Hello list,
maybe I have missed something but 1.1.1. cannot handle flash files...
Will 2.0 do that?
If yes, is it possible to control them with the Animation Manager or 
what else?
Sorry if that is a ignorant question...

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Thu Nov 14 22:59:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Thu Nov 14 22:59:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
References: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0211141937090.15366-100000@titan.ecs.fullerton.edu>
Message-ID: <00cc01c28c59$dac6b9f0$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

No worries, Judy. I just did the same thing a few days ago on the MetaCard
list...

Doh!   :-)

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Judy Perry" <jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2002 9:37 PM
Subject: Re: The RR programming model


> Okay, I am apparently just too stupid to live.
>
> The previous message was intended for Rod.  Please ignore me in my vast
> stupidity.
>
> :(
>
> Judy
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Thu Nov 14 23:01:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Thu Nov 14 23:01:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
In-Reply-To: <a05111a7eb9f98d7ba041@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <EE45B385-F84D-11D6-82E4-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

> Stacks and Messages paths --and yet that doesn't seem clear enough to 
> me.
> Looking at the discussion on the list, it is frequently stressed if  
> you want
> speed, you keep the data out of the stack-card-field paradym and put 
> the
> information in a variable or an array.

This is a good point but I think it needs to come second. Firstly, 
consider that all these xCard development tools started off using the 
rolodex metaphor i.e. a stack of cards but with easier navigation, 
searching etc. Then they became more general programming tools so the 
rolodex metaphor is no longer so relevant but it is still there.

As someone else said, unless your database is massive (probably under 
1000 cards would be fine) then using the card system will work well. So 
you might have your address book stack with one card per person. Added 
to that you might have other stacks which act more like dialog boxes 
than stacks. They would be one card stacks offering print options, 
search options, preferences, splash screen, whatever...

Moving on from this concept, you might decide that you have too many 
addresses for a stack of cards, so you decide to store your addresses 
in some other way and have the addresses stack as a one card stack to 
allow easy viewing & editing. This might be faster but it isn't as easy 
to implement first off, so I would recommend trying the rolodex method 
and altering it later if you aren't sure.

Going back to the original question about the programming model, I tend 
to think of Rev as an object oriented language with preset objects. To 
talk in C++ speak for a moment, you can instantiate a button, give it 
data (name, size, color, custom properties etc), and give it methods 
(mouseUp, mouseDown, doMyStuff). Purists would probably say that it 
isn't properly object oriented since any other object can read & write 
it's data directly, instead of sending it a message. Your button also 
becomes part of a hierarchy that allows messages to be sent up the 
chain higher & higher until they are handled or finally ignored. If you 
want to make yourself a custom object, start with an existing object, 
edit one copy the way you want it, then use this is a template to clone 
other copies.

Because each object is visible on your screen, it is very easy to edit 
it's properties and it's scripts. This makes a language like Rev not 
only quick & easy to use, but amazingly easy to debug, even after a 
long time. If your program crashes when you click a button, then the 
problem is nearly always right there in the button itself.

Cheers,
Sarah


On Friday, November 15, 2002, at 03:27  am, Fred_D_Yocum at mail.mcc.org 
wrote:

>
> Another words if I was designing an address database: with my stack 
> hat on I
> think I should create a stack with multiple cards each dedicated to the
> information of one individual. But this does not seem to be what I 
> should doing.
> I should really be keeping things out of stacks-cards-fields except 
> for display
> purposes and then I'm back a not dis-similar method of programing than 
> any
> other?.
>
> Fred
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Thu Nov 14 23:03:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Thu Nov 14 23:03:01 2002
Subject: Printing Card to Letter Sheet--Offset 1 inch
In-Reply-To: <a05111ad3b9f9b7e7915f@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <39DA7F1A-F84E-11D6-82E4-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

Check the printMargins property. I think it is set to give a 72 pixel 
border, so you'll need to reduce that to whatever your printer can 
handle.

Sarah

On Friday, November 15, 2002, at 06:28  am, Sannyasin Sivakatirswami 
wrote:

> I made a stack 792 pixels tall 612 pixels wide effectively making a US 
> Letter sized card, layed out a letterhead and printed.
>
> The entire image of the card is offset almost exactly 72 pixels
> (1 inch) from the top and the left.
>
> How can I "nail" the topleft 0,0, of the card image to the  topleft, 
> 0,0 of the physical sheet that is being printed (a plain 8.5 X 11 
> sheet of paper)? I tested this on our b/w Apple Laser 8500 and also 
> our 4C Xante Color Laser. Two completely different drivers and 
> printing technologies, exact same result in both cases.
>
> OSX, Jaguar, appleTalk, Rev 1.1.1, using "print card' from the file 
> menu.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Himalayan Academy Publications
> Sannyasin Sivakatirswami
> katir at hindu.org
> www.HinduismToday.com, www.HimalayanAcademy.com,
> www.Gurudeva.org, www.hindu.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Thu Nov 14 23:15:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Thu Nov 14 23:15:01 2002
Subject: swf files?
In-Reply-To: <9F4329A6-F84D-11D6-B157-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <B9F9B333.1FF73%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Wolfgang M. Bereuter wrote:

> maybe I have missed something but 1.1.1. cannot handle flash files...
> Will 2.0 do that?
> If yes, is it possible to control them with the Animation Manager or
> what else?
> Sorry if that is a ignorant question...

QuickTime plays SWF -- you can play them with Rev in a player object.

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From troy at rpsystems.net  Thu Nov 14 23:16:00 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Thu Nov 14 23:16:00 2002
Subject: swf files?
In-Reply-To: <9F4329A6-F84D-11D6-B157-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <B9F9DDC1.16580%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/14/02 10:52 PM, "Wolfgang M. Bereuter" <wmb at internettrainer.com>
wrote:

> Hello list,
> maybe I have missed something but 1.1.1. cannot handle flash files...
> Will 2.0 do that?
> If yes, is it possible to control them with the Animation Manager or
> what else?
> Sorry if that is a ignorant question...

Unless they are weaving up some serious magic that they haven't even hinted
at, I would think that SWF would continue to be handled as a QuickTime
object. This would translate to using player objects, and needing the
QuickTime plugin on the user's machine.

Animation manager is kind of neat, but is not up to handling SWF files.
Personally, I'm not expecting dramatic changes in that area, besides perhaps
usability and interface enhancements.

The good news is that through QuickTime, you can already do a lot with SWF
files, providing they are coded for Flash 5 and below, QT even supports
their interactivity. Via debugStr, you could even do certain types of
data-sharing and inter-application communications can be handled in several
ways.

All my way of saying - I doubt you'll see it get any more "native", but you
can already do quite a lot.


-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net



From terry at discovery.nl  Thu Nov 14 23:30:01 2002
From: terry at discovery.nl (Terry Vogelaar)
Date: Thu Nov 14 23:30:01 2002
Subject: swf files?
In-Reply-To: <9F4329A6-F84D-11D6-B157-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <F05D9802-F851-11D6-8D1F-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>

Wolfgang M. Bereuter heeft op vrijdag, 15 nov 2002 om 04:52  het 
volgende geschreven:

> Hello list,
> maybe I have missed something but 1.1.1. cannot handle flash files...
> Will 2.0 do that?
> If yes, is it possible to control them with the Animation Manager or 
> what else?
> Sorry if that is a ignorant question...

QuickTime can display a SWF file, so RR can do it too, using QT.
It would be nice if RR could import, modify and export SWF files so you 
can add functionality to them and / or enhance your stacks with complex 
fluently displaying animations with a minimal number of bytes like 
Flash does, but that would be nearly impossible to implement. So don't 
expect that before version 8 of RunRev. OK, I realise the RR team has 
done some miracles before, so maybe I should say version 5.

Terry




From kray at sonsothunder.com  Thu Nov 14 23:47:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Thu Nov 14 23:47:01 2002
Subject: swf files?
References: <9F4329A6-F84D-11D6-B157-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <00d101c28c60$742a8d50$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Actually, you can use flash files inside QuickTime 6 (it supports Flash 5
files), and then QuickTime inside a player object in Rev.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wolfgang M. Bereuter" <wmb at internettrainer.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2002 9:52 PM
Subject: swf files?


> Hello list,
> maybe I have missed something but 1.1.1. cannot handle flash files...
> Will 2.0 do that?
> If yes, is it possible to control them with the Animation Manager or
> what else?
> Sorry if that is a ignorant question...
>
> regards
> Wolfgang M. Bereuter
>
> Learn easy with trainingsmaps?
>
> INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
> Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
> ...............................
> http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
> ...............................
> Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Fri Nov 15 01:40:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Fri Nov 15 01:40:01 2002
Subject: Open Program with RR
In-Reply-To: <20021114224929.25107.qmail@web20010.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20021115063355.38842.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>

--- erik hansen <erikhans08 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> MainStack. i have a number of stacks that are
> interrelated. with the 30K script limit gone, all
> common utility handlers can be consolidated in
> one place, but there will still be stacks
> interacting in various ways. they don't seem like
> "substacks" because they should open and function
> independently if possible. maybe the splash
> screen stack with a menu of stacks would work.
> 

That's definitely the easiest and most flexible route.

> the structure still eludes me but using the TD
> and the "See Also" button are very helpful.
> hoping to put previous conceptual models to rest,
> starting with "Home",
> 
> "put mainstacks()" yields a long list with "Home"
> at the top Transcript Dictionary (TD) has no
> listing for "Home" and <go stack stack "Home"
> causes nothing to happen.
> 
> what exactly IS "Home" in RR?
> 

"Home" still exists, but it's not the home stack we
now from HyperCard. Afaik, it's a face-less stack
somewhere in RunRev memory.
No special handlers (well maybe a few, but nothing we
can touch anyway), no interface to setup certain
variables, no one-click jump to the template fields...

In fact, if you call up the 'mainStacks' in a
stand-alone application, it doesn't show up.
So it looks like an engine backward-compatibility
residu, but only the MC/RR boys can solve that
mistery.

Best regards,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From simon-lists at ldml.com  Fri Nov 15 02:30:01 2002
From: simon-lists at ldml.com (Simon Forster)
Date: Fri Nov 15 02:30:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
In-Reply-To: <20021114130657.7209.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <143A84D9-F86B-11D6-BEBD-0050E4CE1D03@ldml.com>

Just to say thanks to everyone who responded - I have far better mental 
image of the RR paradigm. Not perfect you understand but far better,

ATB

Simon Forster
___________________________________________________
   LDML Ltd, Office One, 16 Canham Road, London, W3 7SR, UK
   <tel int="+44 70 9230 5244" uk="070 9230 5244">
   <fax int="+44 70 9230 5247" uk="070 9230 5247">
   <mailto:simon at ldml.com>
___________________________________________________



From degbert at mac.com  Fri Nov 15 02:44:01 2002
From: degbert at mac.com (David Egbert)
Date: Fri Nov 15 02:44:01 2002
Subject: Save stack working?
Message-ID: <B9F9F213.AA57%degbert@mac.com>

I've tried the following script to try to setup a preferences-like file for
windows.  I can't seem to get it to save the stack to the defaultFolder area
of my standalone.

Is save stack screwed up or am I?  :-)  It seems pretty simple.

on mouseUP
  put "prefs.dat" into prefsFile

  create invisible stack prefsFile
  -- set custom properties here

  save stack prefsFile
    -- should save in the defaultFolder right?

  close stack prefsFile
end mouseUP


Thanks!

--
Dave Egbert



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Fri Nov 15 03:34:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Fri Nov 15 03:34:01 2002
Subject: Save stack working?
References: <B9F9F213.AA57%degbert@mac.com>
Message-ID: <046601c28c80$23e92660$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

David,

Where is the stack being saved? If is being saved in the same directory as
Rev, it is because "the directory" needs to be set to the location of your
stack. When you make your stack a standalone, its location will be the
"default", but until it's a standalone, the Rev app's folder is the default.

To change it for Windows and Mac OS (not OS X) only, use something like
this:

function AppPath
   local tPath
   get matchText(the effective fileName of this stack,"(.*\/)",tPath)
   return tPath
end AppPath

If you want a more generic all-purpose, multi-platform version, you can use
the one on this tip at my site:

http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_file008

Enjoy,

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/


----- Original Message -----
From: "David Egbert" <degbert at mac.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Friday, November 15, 2002 1:36 AM
Subject: Save stack working?


> I've tried the following script to try to setup a preferences-like file
for
> windows.  I can't seem to get it to save the stack to the defaultFolder
area
> of my standalone.
>
> Is save stack screwed up or am I?  :-)  It seems pretty simple.
>
> on mouseUP
>   put "prefs.dat" into prefsFile
>
>   create invisible stack prefsFile
>   -- set custom properties here
>
>   save stack prefsFile
>     -- should save in the defaultFolder right?
>
>   close stack prefsFile
> end mouseUP
>
>
> Thanks!
>
> --
> Dave Egbert
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From chripa at aon.at  Fri Nov 15 03:59:01 2002
From: chripa at aon.at (Chris Pastl)
Date: Fri Nov 15 03:59:01 2002
Subject: Can=?ISO-8859-1?B?tA==?=t open driver
Message-ID: <B9F9F596.DF%chripa@aon.at>

I?m interested in developing applications on Mac OS 9
which can connect to a USB driver.
So tried to open a driver called "USB Serial Driver"
using the following code:

open driver "USB Serial Driver" for binary update

But the program says that it "can?t open that file".

What?s wrong?

The Driver is successfully installed in the extensions folder.


Regards,
Chris 


From wmb at internettrainer.com  Fri Nov 15 06:39:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Fri Nov 15 06:39:01 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0211141928520.15366-100000@titan.ecs.fullerton.edu>
Message-ID: <F4316CB6-F88D-11D6-B3FE-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Freitag, November 15, 2002, at 04:33  Uhr, Judy Perry wrote:

> I don't know if I told you this previously, but I have entered a second
> master's degree program in instructional design and technology..  
> Anyway,
> they've approved as a final project for me to design a series of
> tools/tutorials to help acclimate new users to Rev -- particularly
> non-technical types such as new public school teachers.
>
> My first project is a stack which aims to teach the concept of mouse
> events; it is due early December.
>
> Would you be interested in offering any feedback?  These things could
> perhaps be of use in attracting the K-12 market...

W*ho*o*o*w!!!
Where can I See that???

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Fri Nov 15 06:48:00 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Fri Nov 15 06:48:00 2002
Subject: swf files?
In-Reply-To: <B9F9DDC1.16580%troy@rpsystems.net>
Message-ID: <3BBE7999-F88F-11D6-B3FE-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Freitag, November 15, 2002, at 05:09  Uhr, Troy Rollins wrote:

Thanks to all...
All infos have been very helpful...
But my question was not exact enough, should be: *without* QuickTime
sorry

> The good news is that through QuickTime, you can already do a lot with 
> SWF
> files, providing they are coded for Flash 5 and below, QT even supports
> their interactivity. Via debugStr, you could even do certain types of
> data-sharing and inter-application communications can be handled in 
> several
> ways.
>
> All my way of saying - I doubt you'll see it get any more "native", 
> but you
> can already do quite a lot.
>
>
> -- 
> Troy
> RPSystems, Ltd.
> www.rpsystems.net
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution


regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Fri Nov 15 06:55:01 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Fri Nov 15 06:55:01 2002
Subject: Save stack working?
In-Reply-To: <B9F9F213.AA57%degbert@mac.com>
Message-ID: <4D1AAD8C-F890-11D6-9FFA-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Hi Dave,

> I've tried the following script to try to setup a preferences-like 
> file for
> windows.  I can't seem to get it to save the stack to the 
> defaultFolder area
> of my standalone.
>
> Is save stack screwed up or am I?  :-)  It seems pretty simple.
>
> on mouseUP
>   put "prefs.dat" into prefsFile
>
>   create invisible stack prefsFile
>   -- set custom properties here
>
>   save stack prefsFile
>     -- should save in the defaultFolder right?
>
>   close stack prefsFile
> end mouseUP
>
>
> Thanks!
>
> --
> Dave Egbert

looks like the engine does not yet know into which file
the stack should be saved for the first time.

So just add these 2 words:

....
   save stack prefsFile as prefsfile ## !
   ## the missing piece :-)
....

Hope this helps.

Regards

Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de



From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Fri Nov 15 06:59:00 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Fri Nov 15 06:59:00 2002
Subject: swf files?
In-Reply-To: <3BBE7999-F88F-11D6-B3FE-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <CEE7C06C-F890-11D6-9FFA-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Hi Wolfgang,

>
> On Freitag, November 15, 2002, at 05:09  Uhr, Troy Rollins wrote:
>
> Thanks to all...
> All infos have been very helpful...
> But my question was not exact enough, should be: *without* QuickTime

the answer is simple: You can't :-(

...unless someone is willing to write an external...
(I would buy it ! :-)
...or an external that will handle "shockwave", too...
Wow, what a hought...
(I would buy 2 :-)

> sorry
> regards
> Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Have a nice weekend.

Regards


Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de



From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Fri Nov 15 08:39:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Fri Nov 15 08:39:01 2002
Subject: why the hell does this not work??????
In-Reply-To: <a0510030cb9f83c8c53b8@[216.229.107.120]>
References: <a0510030cb9f83c8c53b8@[216.229.107.120]>
Message-ID: <a05200a00b9faa3dbd22a@[128.196.99.222]>

gals and guys:  i am pretty much pissed off right now.  below is a 
snippet of code that is driving me nuts.  this code simply displays 
something on the screen and then *should* ask the user whether that 
should happen again or whether the program should go on and do 
something else.  this response is get using "answer question".
	so far, so straightforward.  in the code, the "put 
flushEvents ..." and "set the cursor ..." lines or just in because i 
thought they might solve the problem,  but they didn't.

	and this is the problem: the "answer question" dialogue ONLY 
pops up, when i run the stack from within RunRev UI (i.e., i start 
RR, and then use the File menu to open the stack).  it *doesn't* pop 
up, when i simply double click the stack icon on my desktop (RR is 
not loaded when i click).  all this happens under OS X 10.2.2.  WHAT 
THE F!&@*! IS GOING ON HERE????

	please help me!!!  thanks, olli.


repeat
     lH_clearDisplay
     lH_Instructions

     put flushEvents(all) into lDummy
     set the cursor to hand
     answer question "Again?" with "NO" or "YES"
     put it into lAnswer
     if it is "NO" then exit repeat
   end repeat


From rcozens at pon.net  Fri Nov 15 10:11:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Fri Nov 15 10:11:01 2002
Subject: Hilite With Transparent Button
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211141550140.22603-100000@mast.metacard.com>
References: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211141550140.22603-100000@mast.metacard.com>
Message-ID: <a05100300b9fa269469ef@[216.229.107.23]>

Hi Scott,

>  > I requested this feature when Revolution was in beta testing. 
>Kevin added it
>>  to the list, but I don't know where it stands at this point.
>
>Hey, you want pixel inversion, just draw a white object (black on the
>Mac, I think) with its ink set to srcXor on top of your object.  Once
>you see what that looks like, though, you'll see why I think you don't
>really want what you're asking for...

If this does not produce an effect as good as what I see when I type 
"flash" in the message box while viewing a kludgy AddColor HyperCard 
image, it's not what I (& Ted?) want.  If that effect cannot be 
produced by the MetaCard engine, that's too bad.

Inverting an image (remember we're talking simple icons here, not 
fine art) on arming or hiliting is a simple, easy way to make the 
interface more responsive to the user without having to create & 
manage addition icon images.

>PS: and about that plan of using a GIF as an image library.  It's bad
>idea because the frames are all decompressed ahead of time, chewing up
>large amounts of RAM for no good reason unless you're actually going
>to use it for animation where performance is more important than
>memory requirements.

I understand the reasoning behind your general admonition, but I 
think the technique makes eminent sense in the circumstances under 
discussion:

* 314 images (I would only need 157 IF the MC engine could invert them)
* Average image size: 4K
* Images are scripted, grouped, & distributed as a set: if one is 
missing, the group can't function properly
* Images are always displayed singly
* All images are displayed at the same location
* It only uses one of the 100 icon ids you assigned me   :{`)
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From troy at rpsystems.net  Fri Nov 15 10:21:01 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Fri Nov 15 10:21:01 2002
Subject: swf files?
In-Reply-To: <3BBE7999-F88F-11D6-B3FE-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <B9FA79A3.165A3%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/15/02 6:41 AM, "Wolfgang M. Bereuter" <wmb at internettrainer.com> wrote:

> All infos have been very helpful...
> But my question was not exact enough, should be: *without* QuickTime

Actually, I understood that, so it must have been my answer that was not
complete enough.

More directly to the point - I would NOT count on using SWFs in Rev without
QuickTime anytime soon.
-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net




From troy at rpsystems.net  Fri Nov 15 10:30:01 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Fri Nov 15 10:30:01 2002
Subject: why the heck does this not work??????
In-Reply-To: <a05200a00b9faa3dbd22a@[128.196.99.222]>
Message-ID: <B9FA7BBC.165A5%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/15/02 8:32 AM, "Oliver Hardt" <hardt at u.arizona.edu> wrote:

> and this is the problem: the "answer question" dialogue ONLY
> pops up, when i run the stack from within RunRev UI (i.e., i start
> RR, and then use the File menu to open the stack).  it *doesn't* pop
> up, when i simply double click the stack icon on my desktop (RR is
> not loaded when i click).

The problem is not the code. It's how you are running it. The answer dialog
is available in the Rev environment, and in your stand-alones if you choose
to include it - but not in your native stack file. Do a build, and include
the dialogs, and it will work.


-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net



From rcozens at pon.net  Fri Nov 15 10:32:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Fri Nov 15 10:32:01 2002
Subject: 1.5 (now 2.0)
In-Reply-To: <434C2869-F84B-11D6-82E4-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>
References: <434C2869-F84B-11D6-82E4-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05100301b9fabecee21a@[216.229.107.167]>

>>So I may still end up with 314 instead of 157 images, and I'm 
>>looking among the tools on my Mac to see if I have anything that 
>>creates animated gifs.
>>
>Try GifBuilder http://www.mac.org/graphics/gifbuilder/

Thanks, Sarah.

I just sent out an inquiry to someone who has done image manipulation 
for me in the past; but if I can find a way to do it myself that 
would be great.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Fri Nov 15 10:32:10 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Fri Nov 15 10:32:10 2002
Subject: why the hell does this not work??????
In-Reply-To: <a05200a00b9faa3dbd22a@[128.196.99.222]>
References: <a0510030cb9f83c8c53b8@[216.229.107.120]>
 <a05200a00b9faa3dbd22a@[128.196.99.222]>
Message-ID: <a05100302b9fac1096880@[216.229.107.167]>

>	and this is the problem: the "answer question" dialogue ONLY 
>pops up, when i run the stack from within RunRev UI (i.e., i start 
>RR, and then use the File menu to open the stack).  it *doesn't* pop 
>up, when i simply double click the stack icon on my desktop (RR is 
>not loaded when i click).  all this happens under OS X 10.2.2.  WHAT 
>THE F!&@*! IS GOING ON HERE????

Hi Oliver,

Basically, most (if not all) stacks will not perform or display 
correctly if double clicked on from the OS.  They need to run from 
the Dev UI or a standalone player or application, or to be built as 
standalones to work properly.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Fri Nov 15 10:43:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Fri Nov 15 10:43:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <B9F99D98.91A2%scott@tactilemedia.com>
References: <B9F99D98.91A2%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <a05100303b9fac354f267@[216.229.107.167]>

>  > Are there any essential differences in the properties and/or behavior
>>  of graphics and images?
>
>Besides those already mentioned, you should go through the docs and check
>out the respective properties.  If you have any specific questions, feel
>free to ask.

No specific questions, Scott; just wanted to know if there were any 
major categorical differences.  Comparing two lists of property names 
does not always get one focused on essential differences in behavior.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From bvlahos at mac.com  Fri Nov 15 11:26:04 2002
From: bvlahos at mac.com (Bill Vlahos)
Date: Fri Nov 15 11:26:04 2002
Subject: Project Management Software
In-Reply-To: <ED730094-F831-11D6-BE61-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>
Message-ID: <162921E4-F8B6-11D6-B48D-003065EC5590@mac.com>

It actually was chartConstructor which prompted me to look into this. 
All I know is that it is a Cocoa app and I don't believe the author is 
interested in taking it cross platform. I have purchased it and like it 
a lot although it seems to be fairly basic in its current form.

I contacted the Micro Planner folks and they are not OS X native yet 
but are working on it. They say they will "have a release prior to 
support being dropped by Apple." They did not give a date but I'm 
assuming that could mean this January as they say that if purchased 
now, the OS X native version would be included as a free upgrade. 
They're product is very expensive so it isn't really a competitor to MS 
Project in the way chartConstructor might be if it was cross platform.

I still think a program written in Rev that did both GANTT and PERT 
charts could be killer.

Thanks for all the feedback. I didn't know about Micro Planner.

Bill Vlahos

On Thursday, November 14, 2002, at 04:33  PM, David Vaughan wrote:

>>> I would like to find out if anyone is working on Project Management
>>> software. It is not something I'm interested in writing but would be
>>> interested in buying.
>>>
>>> There is no cross platform software which does both GANT and PERT
>>> charts that is current.
>>
>> I don't know much about this one (I still keep MS Project 4.0 around) 
>> but it
>> looks promising:
>>
>> <http://www.microplanning.com/>
>
> Also, try www.headshack.com
>
> Currently ChartConstructor is OS X only but is clean, simple and 
> provides GANTT and PERT views. You could try the author to see in what 
> they have written it and if they are interested in cross-platform.
>
> regards
> David



From gary.rathbone at btclick.com  Fri Nov 15 11:43:01 2002
From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone)
Date: Fri Nov 15 11:43:01 2002
Subject: Project Management Software (OffTopic?)
In-Reply-To: <162921E4-F8B6-11D6-B48D-003065EC5590@mac.com>
Message-ID: <IDELJJOBILDEKAEHEILGMEKLCGAA.gary.rathbone@btclick.com>

>I still think a program written in Rev that did both GANTT and PERT
>charts could be killer.

Only if it could handle the four types of float calculations, milestone
slippage (preferably graphical) and resource levelling (with applicable
re-analysis of the critical path). Also a client server based model would be
ideal so task/resource allocation can be updated by the delegated
stakeholder etc...

As you'll know Project Manangement is much more than MSProject or GANTT and
PERT charts. However these are vital planning and monitoring tools. Where
there is a HUGE gap in the market is modelling an effective computer based
communications structure around the PRINCE2
(http://www.prince2.com/whatisp2.html#intro) framework...

("Prince (PRojects IN Controlled Environments) is a structured method for
effective project management. It is a de facto standard used extensively by
the UK Government and is widely recognised and used in the private sector,
both in the UK and internationally...)

... whilst integrating those components which PRINCE2 deems to be outside
its scope such as GANTT, PERT, WBS, NPV etc...

A mamoth task, but what a product !

Gary Rathbone BSc MBCS
Chartered Information Systems Practitioner





From themacguy at macosx.com  Fri Nov 15 12:12:01 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Fri Nov 15 12:12:01 2002
Subject: Sound not playing sometimes. Why?
Message-ID: <5A64EC5A-F8BC-11D6-9AAD-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

I have a stack with a player object. No matter how I assign the 
fileName property or play the sound (via transcript or the message 
box), I have at least one audio file that will not play some of the 
time. My audio files are all AIF 22KHz, 16bit, mono.

It was suggested that I first set the fileName to empty and then re-set 
the property to the correct name. I've tried this. Also tried playing 
the "empty" player before re-setting the fileName property. No luck.

I've tried "pre-playing" the sound (playing it with the playLoudness 
set to 0) and then playing it at the proper volume. No luck.

I've found some consistency:

Play the sound the first time and it will fail (even if played twice in 
one handler).
Play the same sound the second time (without changing the fileName to 
something else and back again) and it plays fine.
Change the fileName property to some other audio file and it plays 
(with the other sound).
Change it back to the original fileName and it will fail to play. Play 
it again (another event triggering the same handler) and it plays fine.

I've even tried playing the sound TWICE in one handler (with no "wait" 
delay between) and the same consistency applies.

What can I do to work around this? Another audio format? Will Rev 2.0 
resolve it?

Thanks,
Barry



From roger.kingston at omnibus.co.uk  Fri Nov 15 12:22:01 2002
From: roger.kingston at omnibus.co.uk (Roger Kingston (OmniBus - Stanford))
Date: Fri Nov 15 12:22:01 2002
Subject: DDE - Dynamic Data Exchange
Message-ID: <DB4D3F61CB18A840A4C3927AFC94461121DB27@stanmail.omnibus.co.uk>

In a past life, I used to integrate Toolbook (Asymetrix) applications with Winword and EXCEL using DDE.  This allowed me to pass data to and from MS documents and then remotely run macros in MS to format, chart or mail-merge, etc.  This was extremely powerful and pretty reliable.  

Now I am an unrepentful RR convert (no going back!) can anyone suggest whether or not this, or something like it, can be achieved with RR? 

Regards

Roger Kingston
Omnibus Systems
 



From iago at iago.net  Fri Nov 15 12:39:01 2002
From: iago at iago.net (Iago)
Date: Fri Nov 15 12:39:01 2002
Subject: SSL/HTTPS/etc
Message-ID: <20021115173452.GR7527@iago.net>

  Is there any currently existing way (free or commercial)
  to enable Revolution to download SSL-encrypted (https://)
  URLs?

  If there is, Revolution is pretty much what I'll recommend
  to my manager as the way to build some standalones for our
  purposes at work... Without it, it's pretty much a
  dealbreaker.

-- 
Fred Hicks <iago AT iago DOT net>


From mpetrides at earthlink.net  Fri Nov 15 13:37:00 2002
From: mpetrides at earthlink.net (Marian Petrides)
Date: Fri Nov 15 13:37:00 2002
Subject: Sound not playing sometimes. Why?
Message-ID: <Springmail.0994.1037385050.0.17632600@webmail.pas.earthlink.net>

Full length of the sound's file name appears to be an issue.  If one exceeds
certain limit for full pathname/filename then the sound (or video) file
appears not to play.  I suspect that the files that play properly have file
names that are (a trifle) shorter than those which do not play properly

You can test this by putting everything (your stack, the audio files, etc.) 
in a folder at root level and then running the app.  If I'm right, then this
should solve your problem.

If I'm right about the cause, then one workaround would be to hard code the
pathnames of the audio files in your scripts rather than using relative
pathnames.  This has its disadvantages, especially if you plan on distributing
your app, but it does work--and isn't a problem for me, since my intention (at
the request of my publisher) is to have the app run off the distribution CD.

HTH.

Marian

On Fri, 15 Nov 2002 10:04:50 -0700 Barry Levine <themacguy at macosx.com> wrote:

> I have a stack with a player object. No matter
> how I assign the 
> fileName property or play the sound (via
> transcript or the message 
> box), I have at least one audio file that will
> not play some of the 
> time. My audio files are all AIF 22KHz, 16bit,
> mono.
> 
> It was suggested that I first set the fileName
> to empty and then re-set 
> the property to the correct name. I've tried
> this. Also tried playing 
> the "empty" player before re-setting the
> fileName property. No luck.
> 
> I've tried "pre-playing" the sound (playing it
> with the playLoudness 
> set to 0) and then playing it at the proper
> volume. No luck.
> 
> I've found some consistency:
> 
> Play the sound the first time and it will fail
> (even if played twice in 
> one handler).
> Play the same sound the second time (without
> changing the fileName to 
> something else and back again) and it plays
> fine.
> Change the fileName property to some other
> audio file and it plays 
> (with the other sound).
> Change it back to the original fileName and it
> will fail to play. Play 
> it again (another event triggering the same
> handler) and it plays fine.
> 
> I've even tried playing the sound TWICE in one
> handler (with no "wait" 
> delay between) and the same consistency
> applies.
> 
> What can I do to work around this? Another
> audio format? Will Rev 2.0 
> resolve it?
> 
> Thanks,
> Barry
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 



From mkorica at ica.net  Fri Nov 15 13:37:22 2002
From: mkorica at ica.net (Mat Korica)
Date: Fri Nov 15 13:37:22 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
Message-ID: <B0041744310@modusmail.ica.net>

>Going back to the original question about the programming model, I tend 
>to think of Rev as an object oriented language with preset objects. To 
>talk in C++ speak for a moment, you can instantiate a button, give it 
>data (name, size, color, custom properties etc), and give it methods 
>(mouseUp, mouseDown, doMyStuff). Purists would probably say that it 

While it's easy to create an interface using Revolution's built-in objects,
the big weakness is that you can't make your own custom objects. I actually
was impressed enough with Revolution to implement this myself using
Transcript.

I decided that stacks/cards can represent classes/objects. Class methods are
functions stored in the script of a stack while stack and card custom
properties store the object and class attributes. I implemented inheritance
by giving classes a custom property that indicates their parent "stack". I
also provided object aggregation in a similar way.

The end result was that I could use the following syntax:

show age of Student of School "James Culnan"

...where "Student" and "School" are individual stacks, "James Culnan" is a
card in the "School" stack, "age" is a custom property on cards in the
"Student" stack, and "show" is a function in the stack "Class" that
"Student" inherits from. Also, the "School" stack acts as a container for
"Student". ("Student" really means "Students" in this context).

This actually works reasonably well, but the code I wrote is kind of
cumbersome. I also recently tried RealBASIC and realized that this type of
workaround is unnecessary there.

Cheers,
Mat


From scott at tactilemedia.com  Fri Nov 15 13:56:01 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Fri Nov 15 13:56:01 2002
Subject: DDE - Dynamic Data Exchange
In-Reply-To: <DB4D3F61CB18A840A4C3927AFC94461121DB27@stanmail.omnibus.co.uk>
Message-ID: <B9FA81CA.54C8%scott@tactilemedia.com>

Recently, "Roger Kingston (OmniBus - Stanford)"  wrote:

> In a past life, I used to integrate Toolbook (Asymetrix) applications with
> Winword and EXCEL using DDE.  This allowed me to pass data to and from MS
> documents and then remotely run macros in MS to format, chart or mail-merge,
> etc.  This was extremely powerful and pretty reliable.
> 
> Now I am an unrepentful RR convert (no going back!) can anyone suggest whether
> or not this, or something like it, can be achieved with RR?

RR can do DDE using the old Externals Collection available on the RunRev
site, but my understanding is that DDE is to be phased out as of WindowsXP.
Maybe someone more knowledgeable about MS/Windows can elaborate.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-----
E: scott at tactilemedia.com
W: http://www.tactilemedia.com



From alex at mindlube.com  Fri Nov 15 14:47:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Fri Nov 15 14:47:01 2002
Subject: OT humor: RunRev logo
Message-ID: <1B4D9B86-F8D2-11D6-A75E-000393529642@mindlube.com>

The RunRev logo is kinda cool. But it has a "swoosh". Study the logo 
for a little bit, then try to decide which of the following categories 
it falls into. I'm not knocking RunRev or the logo designer. But it is 
humorous.

    - ball 'n' swoosh
    - star 'n' swoosh
    - name 'n' swoosh
    - the arrowhead
    - aren't we clever
    - half swoosh
    - ooh, planets
    - stepping man
    - alice gets lazy

(see http://www.50cups.com/swoosh/ for sample logos and explanation of 
categories)

At least Revolution has the spherical, orbital double-meaning thing 
going for it. Which most other swoosh-ees don't have. Usually swoosh 
usage is completely gratuitous!

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Fri Nov 15 15:10:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Fri Nov 15 15:10:01 2002
Subject: Project Management Software (OffTopic?)
In-Reply-To: <IDELJJOBILDEKAEHEILGMEKLCGAA.gary.rathbone@btclick.com>
Message-ID: <74BB6CC8-F8D5-11D6-9DC8-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Freitag, November 15, 2002, at 05:34  Uhr, Gary Rathbone wrote:

>> I still think a program written in Rev that did both GANTT and PERT
>> charts could be killer.
>
> Only if it could handle the four types of float calculations, milestone
> slippage (preferably graphical) and resource levelling (with applicable
> re-analysis of the critical path). Also a client server based model 
> would be
> ideal so task/resource allocation can be updated by the delegated
> stakeholder etc...

Agree...


> used in the private sector,
> both in the UK and internationally...)
>
> ... whilst integrating those components which PRINCE2 deems to be 
> outside
> its scope such as GANTT, PERT, WBS, NPV etc...
>
> A mamoth task, but what a product !

do you have 10 years for playing with idea in minds only than you could 
maybe start. seems not to much to start...
Thats Imho not a project for rev, thats one for 4D or such databased 
RAD giants tools with a big company and developer structure behind it...
my 2cents

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From dsc at swcp.com  Fri Nov 15 16:22:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Fri Nov 15 16:22:01 2002
Subject: OT humor: RunRev logo
In-Reply-To: <1B4D9B86-F8D2-11D6-A75E-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <11EC784F-F8DF-11D6-A69A-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Friday, November 15, 2002, at 12:40 PM, Alex Rice wrote:

> At least Revolution has the spherical, orbital double-meaning thing 
> going for it. Which most other swoosh-ees don't have. Usually swoosh 
> usage is completely gratuitous!

Yes.  The swoosh here is probably semantic.  Because of that, I'm even 
hesitant to call it a swoosh.

Dar Scott



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Fri Nov 15 16:31:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Fri Nov 15 16:31:01 2002
Subject: swf files?
In-Reply-To: <CEE7C06C-F890-11D6-9FFA-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>
Message-ID: <C99A1613-F8E0-11D6-9DC8-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Freitag, November 15, 2002, at 12:53  Uhr, Klaus Major wrote:

>> But my question was not exact enough, should be: *without* QuickTime
>
> the answer is simple: You can't :-(
>
> ...unless someone is willing to write an external...
> (I would buy it ! :-)
needless to say me too...

How much time does a good sripter need for that about: What do you 
think??

> ...or an external that will handle "shockwave", too...
> Wow, what a hought...
> (I would buy 2 :-)

Do you really see such an importance for shockwave like for flash?
Imho the filesize is to big. Flash is a killer because of its small 
size...
Sometimes I think MM will let it die slowly together with Director and 
blow Flash then up with a Pro version up to a new Director...

> Have a nice weekend.

Danke, das werd ich jetzt brauchen, weniger nice daf?r mehr busy...;))

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From zelston at aol.com  Fri Nov 15 17:01:00 2002
From: zelston at aol.com (Zac Elston)
Date: Fri Nov 15 17:01:00 2002
Subject: problem with socketID
Message-ID: <HNEFLBGCPKCOFDJDMMKMAEGJCBAA.zelston@aol.com>

I can open and read/write to a socket with

on mouseup
  open socket to "host:25"
  read from socket "host:25"until linefeed
  answer it
  close socket "host:25"
end mouseup

but when I try to use a socketID, it does not work.

on mouseup
  open socket to "host:25|mysocketname"
  read from socket mysocketname until linefeed
  answer it
  close socket mysocketname
end mouseup

in fact, using a socketID at all seems to be the problem..
this doesn't work either
on mouseup
  open socket to "host:25|mysocketname"
  read from socket "host:25" until linefeed
  answer it
  close socket "host:25"
end mouseup


tried both windows 2000 and OSX

what am I missing?


thanks

-zac




From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk  Fri Nov 15 18:39:01 2002
From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg)
Date: Fri Nov 15 18:39:01 2002
Subject: problem with socketID
In-Reply-To: <HNEFLBGCPKCOFDJDMMKMAEGJCBAA.zelston@aol.com>
References: <HNEFLBGCPKCOFDJDMMKMAEGJCBAA.zelston@aol.com>
Message-ID: <p05200f03b9fb30ce9583@[192.168.123.3]>

At 4:54 pm -0500 15/11/02, Zac Elston wrote:
>I can open and read/write to a socket with
>
>on mouseup
>   open socket to "host:25"
>   read from socket "host:25"until linefeed
>   answer it
>   close socket "host:25"
>end mouseup
>
>but when I try to use a socketID, it does not work.
>
>on mouseup
>   open socket to "host:25|mysocketname"
>   read from socket mysocketname until linefeed
>   answer it
>   close socket mysocketname
>end mouseup

When referring to a socket, you need to include the host, port and, 
if used, the connection ID (socket ID).

so...

put "somehost:8000|1000" into tSocket
open socket tSocket
write "hello" to socket tSocket
close socket tSocket

The purpose of the connection ID is to allow multiple connections to 
the same host:port combination.

Cheers
Dave


From dsc at swcp.com  Fri Nov 15 18:59:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Fri Nov 15 18:59:01 2002
Subject: problem with socketID
In-Reply-To: <HNEFLBGCPKCOFDJDMMKMAEGJCBAA.zelston@aol.com>
Message-ID: <09D5E09F-F8F5-11D6-803E-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Friday, November 15, 2002, at 02:54 PM, Zac Elston wrote:

> on mouseup
>   open socket to "host:25|mysocketname"
>   read from socket mysocketname until linefeed
>   answer it
>   close socket mysocketname
> end mouseup

This looks like the trouble area.

on mouseup
   local mySocket
   put "127.0.0.1:25|mysocketID" into mySocket
   open socket to mySocket
   read from socket mySocket until linefeed
   answer it
   close socket mySocket
end mouseup

Use the socketId if you might be creating two (or more) connections to 
port 25 on the same computer at the same time.  For example, you might 
have code in one place sending mail on an alarm and code in another 
place sending mail for regular reports; they might use a common queue 
for other code or independently connect--the latter needs the use of the 
socketID.

Dar Scott




From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Fri Nov 15 20:15:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Fri Nov 15 20:15:01 2002
Subject: Script Analysis
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHMEFECLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Hi All

I'm looking for a script analysis tool. I'm mainly interested in being able
to choose an object and a message and view all script that is executed in
response to that message.

I guess this would involve firstly parsing the code to find custom functions
and handlers then parsing the scripts down the object heirarchy to find the
script they refer to. Then repeating the process with those scripts until
there are no more scripts to parse. It would need to handle frontscripts,
backscripts, libraries, setprops, getprops and sent messages also.

Anyone interested in working on it with me or have anything to help me get
started?

Monte Goulding
B.App.Sc. (Hons.)

Executive Director
Sweat Technologies

email: monte at sweattechnologies.com
website: www.sweattechnologies.com
mobile (International): +61 421 138 274
       (Australia): 0421 138 274



From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Fri Nov 15 20:24:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Fri Nov 15 20:24:01 2002
Subject: Open Program with RR
In-Reply-To: <20021115063355.38842.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20021116011807.21867.qmail@web20004.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Jan Schenkel <janschenkel at yahoo.com> wrote:

> > splash screen stack with a menu of stacks...

> definitely the easiest and most flexible route.

> > what exactly IS "Home" in RR?

> "Home" still exists, but it's not the home
> stack we know from HyperCard. it looks like an
> engine backward-compatibility residu, but only
> the MC/RR boys can solve that mystery.

thanks for the information.

ok, so you can't go "Home" again.
put stacks() puts this into the msg:
revmessagebox.rev
revmenubar.rev
revapplicationoverview.rev

"splash" does not come up in the TD.
is there an invisible "splash screen" stack
hidden somewhere 
does this just mean you can create a stack that
does nothing except get things rolling, and
defines all other stacks as sub-stacks. declaring
all common handlers & functions(), setting
preferences & locations of objects/controls,
perhaps using buttons to go to different stacks?
you could even name it "Joe's Home"! 


=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
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From alex at mindlube.com  Fri Nov 15 20:59:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Fri Nov 15 20:59:01 2002
Subject: repeat string: how?
Message-ID: <297630FE-F906-11D6-9360-000393529642@mindlube.com>

In Perl one can do this in a string context to get a 20 strings 
concatenated into a string.

"fu" x 20 => fufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufu

Does Transcript have any syntax similar to this, or do I have to write 
a loop to build up a string this way?

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From chipp at chipp.com  Fri Nov 15 22:29:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Fri Nov 15 22:29:01 2002
Subject: why the heck does this not work??????
In-Reply-To: <a05200a00b9faa3dbd22a@[128.196.99.222]>
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOMEDBCKAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Hey Oliver.
I see you are (often) frustrated. Profanity isn't necessary in order to get
a quick answer in this forum. Here's a suggestion which might help (it
helped me early on learning about RR). I spent some time reading the
archives for RR and MC. It's amazing what you can find there. Takes a few
hours, but there are some very informative posts!

-Chipp

> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Oliver Hardt
> Sent: Friday, November 15, 2002 7:32 AM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: why the hell does this not work??????
>
>
> gals and guys:  i am pretty much pissed off right now.  below is a
> snippet of code that is driving me nuts.  this code simply displays
> something on the screen and then *should* ask the user whether that
> should happen again or whether the program should go on and do
> something else.  this response is get using "answer question".
> 	so far, so straightforward.  in the code, the "put
> flushEvents ..." and "set the cursor ..." lines or just in because i
> thought they might solve the problem,  but they didn't.
>
> 	and this is the problem: the "answer question" dialogue ONLY
> pops up, when i run the stack from within RunRev UI (i.e., i start
> RR, and then use the File menu to open the stack).  it *doesn't* pop
> up, when i simply double click the stack icon on my desktop (RR is
> not loaded when i click).  all this happens under OS X 10.2.2.  WHAT
> THE F!&@*! IS GOING ON HERE????
>
> 	please help me!!!  thanks, olli.
>
>
> repeat
>      lH_clearDisplay
>      lH_Instructions
>
>      put flushEvents(all) into lDummy
>      set the cursor to hand
>      answer question "Again?" with "NO" or "YES"
>      put it into lAnswer
>      if it is "NO" then exit repeat
>    end repeat
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From chipp at chipp.com  Fri Nov 15 22:53:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Fri Nov 15 22:53:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <5CA89542-F81A-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOCEDCCKAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Hey Igor,

check out

put img 1 into img 2

this way you don't have to 'unpack' them

If you're using tranparent images, you may have to:

set the width of img 1 to the width of img 2
set the imagedata of img 1 to the imagedata of image 2
set the alphadata of img 1 to the alphadata of image 2

I spent a lot of time working with images recently (butongadget)

I also recently wrote a 'skinnable' application and had to work around many
of the same issues.

-Chipp

> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Igor de
> Oliveira Couto
> Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2002 3:45 PM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Re: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
>
>
> Dear Jan,
>
> On Friday, November 15, 2002, at 08:27  AM, Jan Schenkel wrote:
>
> > A 'devious' workaround for this limitation would be
> > the following:
> > - store the entire collection of pictures in custom
> > properties (one per file with 'set the
> > uPictures[tFileName] of this stack to URL
> > "binfile:"&tFilePath')
> > - on openStack you 'unpack' the images, placing them
> > in a temporary directory
> > - then you point the fileName property of the image to
> > the 'unpacked' file in that temporary directory
> >
> > This way you still have only a single file.
> >
>
> OOOOOOOH! I like the sound of that! You genius!
> Sounds like a lot of work, but I will try that for sure!
>
> Many, many thanks, and
>
> Kind Regards,
>
> --
> Igor de Oliveira Couto
> ----------------------------------
> igor at pixelmedia.com.au
> ----------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From themacguy at macosx.com  Fri Nov 15 22:55:01 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Fri Nov 15 22:55:01 2002
Subject: Sound not playing sometimes. Why? FOUND IT!
In-Reply-To: <200211160200.VAA18007@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <4BFAA3C6-F916-11D6-9649-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

Eureka! I found the problem -and- the solution. Firstly, thanks to the 
listas who provided suggestions. Though none of them provided the 
ultimate answer, they caused me to examine other paths which led me to 
the happy ending.

Speaking of paths (as was one lista): I had a "resources" folder at the 
same level of my stack so the pathnames I used (both hardcoded and 
programmatically set) were of the form "resources/mySound.aif". When I 
compile the app, I copy the resources folder into the same folder as 
the app and everything works just fine.

The problem? It's a mathematical or timing error in Rev (or QT?) - 
maybe something to do with rounding but here is what I found: I needed 
to have a sound play completely before proceeding with another sound 
and, during the handler, some images are being displayed and hidden. So 
I use the following line of code to cause the handler to wait until the 
sound in complete.

   wait (the duration of player "player1") / (the timeScale of player 
"player1") seconds

What sometimes happens (I eventually discovered by looking at the 
player object's properties) is that something causes the audio file to 
stop playing prematurely, maybe as little a 5% or less from the end of 
the file. The next time the handler tells the player to start playing, 
only the last few % of the file plays. It sounds like the audio 
vanishes and then starts back up at the end but it's really just the 
end of the file that plays. The "wait..." code makes it seem as if 
everything is timed properly (because currentTime is ignored). The next 
time you run through the handler, everything plays fine because the 
sound file is back at the beginning (well, really the end but playing 
it from the beginning is really the only course open at this point).

I've also found that the "wait..." line of code, above, does not always 
result in the correct amount of time passing before the handler 
proceeds. The result is sometimes less so the sound stops prematurely 
when some other line of code executes in the handler.

The "fix" I put into place is as follows:

  wait (the duration of player "player1") / (the timeScale of player 
"player1") + .2 seconds
--note the "+.2" I added. Sometimes I can use .1, it appears. This 
guarantees that any small error in timing won't cause the handler to 
continue prematurely.

then I add:
set the currentTime of player "player1" to 0 -- that's a zero
-- this forces a "rewind" of the player in case something causes a 
premature halt to the sound.
-- now the next time I play the sound, it's ready to play from start to 
end.

I went through multiple levels of Cat Skinning to nail this SOB but it 
works and, hopefully, Rev2 (or maybe OSX 10.2.3 or QT6.1) will resolve 
it.

Barry

On Friday, November 15, 2002, at 07:00 PM, 
use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote:

> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 10:04:50 -0700
> Subject: Sound not playing sometimes. Why?
> From: Barry Levine <themacguy at macosx.com>
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>
> I have a stack with a player object. No matter how I assign the
> fileName property or play the sound (via transcript or the message
> box), I have at least one audio file that will not play some of the
> time. My audio files are all AIF 22KHz, 16bit, mono.
>
> It was suggested that I first set the fileName to empty and then re-set
> the property to the correct name. I've tried this. Also tried playing
> the "empty" player before re-setting the fileName property. No luck.
>
> I've tried "pre-playing" the sound (playing it with the playLoudness
> set to 0) and then playing it at the proper volume. No luck.
>
> I've found some consistency:
>
> Play the sound the first time and it will fail (even if played twice in
> one handler).
> Play the same sound the second time (without changing the fileName to
> something else and back again) and it plays fine.
> Change the fileName property to some other audio file and it plays
> (with the other sound).
> Change it back to the original fileName and it will fail to play. Play
> it again (another event triggering the same handler) and it plays fine.
>
> I've even tried playing the sound TWICE in one handler (with no "wait"
> delay between) and the same consistency applies.
>
> What can I do to work around this? Another audio format? Will Rev 2.0
> resolve it?
>
> Thanks,
> Barry
>
--------------------------------------------------------
Barry Jay Levine
"The Mac Guy"

Macintosh Troubleshooting, System Engineering, Training,
AppleShare/OSX Server Setup, System Upgrades and Enhancements,

On-Site service for K20, Business, Consumer

Phone/VoiceMail: 915-581-1105
             Fax: 915-581-8167
           eMail: themacguy at macosx.com

MacOS X: It does. You can. It will.
WindowsXP: Insert wallet into Drive A: Press any key to empty
--------------------------------------------------------



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Fri Nov 15 23:19:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Fri Nov 15 23:19:01 2002
Subject: DDE - Dynamic Data Exchange
References: <B9FA81CA.54C8%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <050f01c28d25$b307e2a0$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> RR can do DDE using the old Externals Collection available on the RunRev
> site, but my understanding is that DDE is to be phased out as of
WindowsXP.
> Maybe someone more knowledgeable about MS/Windows can elaborate.

Well, Scott, I'm currently running XP on a laptop, and the DDE external
works just fine. I don't think DDE is phased out of XP, just deprecated.
Eventually they'll phase it out, but for right now, it seems to still work.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From terry at discovery.nl  Fri Nov 15 23:25:01 2002
From: terry at discovery.nl (Terry Vogelaar)
Date: Fri Nov 15 23:25:01 2002
Subject: swf files? (OT)
In-Reply-To: <C99A1613-F8E0-11D6-9DC8-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <7C45F948-F91A-11D6-8A9F-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>

> Do you really see such an importance for shockwave like for flash?
> Imho the filesize is to big. Flash is a killer because of its small 
> size...
> Sometimes I think MM will let it die slowly together with Director and 
> blow Flash then up with a Pro version up to a new Director...

Not really. Directory is mainly useful for multimedia CDs using pixel 
pictures. Because of the popularity of the internet, the glory days of 
the multimedia CD are over. But there is still use for Directory, 
especially when you think about DVD menus. (I don't know if Directory 
can do that, but it could be(come) a handy tool for it).  Shockwave is 
a way to bring these multimedia projects to the internet. However, 
because file sizes are much more important on the internet than on CD, 
Shockwave is never really efficient.

There Flash comes in. This beauty is solely intended for internet 
animation and interactivity. It is very, very efficient when it comes 
to file sizes and learning to use it mainly means learning to keep the 
file sizes down (while making animations).

Saying MM should let Director die and let Flash become a new Director 
sound a bit like saying Adobe should let PhotoShop die and turn 
Illustrator into it's successor. They both produce pictures ant they 
both can handle pixels and vectors, and PS files are usually larger, 
but still there is room for both programs.

Terry




From kray at sonsothunder.com  Fri Nov 15 23:45:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Fri Nov 15 23:45:01 2002
Subject: repeat string: how?
References: <297630FE-F906-11D6-9360-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <051e01c28d29$70ee82d0$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> In Perl one can do this in a string context to get a 20 strings 
> concatenated into a string.
> 
> "fu" x 20 => fufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufu
> 
> Does Transcript have any syntax similar to this, or do I have to write 
> a loop to build up a string this way?

You have to write a loop.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From alex at mindlube.com  Sat Nov 16 00:07:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Sat Nov 16 00:07:01 2002
Subject: DDE - Dynamic Data Exchange
In-Reply-To: <B9FA81CA.54C8%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <607ABD04-F920-11D6-9360-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Friday, November 15, 2002, at 11:49  AM, Scott Rossi wrote:
> RR can do DDE using the old Externals Collection available on the 
> RunRev
> site, but my understanding is that DDE is to be phased out as of 
> WindowsXP.
> Maybe someone more knowledgeable about MS/Windows can elaborate.

In my project I need to write reports out in MS Word and MS Excel 
formats. Realbasic has a "MS Office Automation" plugin, but it was slow 
and buggy as $%^&. It was of the reasons I switched to Rev.

So I am currently putting VBA code to  write the reports in an Excel 
template file, and the VBA code runs when I copy the Excel file into 
place and launch it. It's a tedious way to do it and VBA code is really 
hard to get right when you have to deal with lots of different MS 
Office versions.

So, what is DDE and why is it being deprecated, and what is replacing 
it?

Does anyone have examples of how I can execute VBA code via DDE from 
Revolution?

Where is this "old" Externals Collection for Windows? I don't see it on 
runrev.com. OK is this it? http://www.xworlds.com/metacard/external.htm 
? I found it in the list archives. Maybe it should be added to the 
runrev.com site?

Many thanks in advance,

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sat Nov 16 01:51:00 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sat Nov 16 01:51:00 2002
Subject: Script Analysis
In-Reply-To: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHMEFECLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <20021116064451.2951.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Monte Goulding <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
wrote:
> 
> Hi All
> 
> I'm looking for a script analysis tool. I'm mainly
> interested in being able
> to choose an object and a message and view all
> script that is executed in
> response to that message.
> 
> I guess this would involve firstly parsing the code
> to find custom functions
> and handlers then parsing the scripts down the
> object heirarchy to find the
> script they refer to. Then repeating the process
> with those scripts until
> there are no more scripts to parse. It would need to
> handle frontscripts,
> backscripts, libraries, setprops, getprops and sent
> messages also.
> 
> Anyone interested in working on it with me or have
> anything to help me get
> started?
> 
> Monte Goulding
> 

Hi Monte,

Though I've seen such stacks in the past (for
HyperCard, mind you), which would list globals and
where they were changed, and for handlers where they
were called from ; they could never receive 100%
accuracy due to the nature of the language.

The real problems in this area are the 'do','send' and
'call' commands, which allow you to compose calls to
handlers from variables.
The same thing goes for 'frontScripts', 'backScripts'
and 'libraries': these are fluctuating and depending
entirely on their state at a point in time.

I suppose one _could_ build a combination of a
frontScript and a backScript to keep track of what the
'do','send' and 'call' handlers do at runtime, and in
analogous form track the status and/or evolution of
the 'frontScripts', 'backScripts' and 'libraries'.
But that would at best be a black box, giving you a
limited view, based on one instance.

Sorry to disappoint you there.

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Sat Nov 16 02:08:00 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Sat Nov 16 02:08:00 2002
Subject: Script Analysis
In-Reply-To: <20021116064451.2951.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <B9FB2D34.20073%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Jan Schenkel wrote:

> I'm looking for a script analysis tool. I'm mainly
> interested in being able
> to choose an object and a message and view all
> script that is executed in
> response to that message.
> 
> I guess this would involve firstly parsing the code
> to find custom functions
> and handlers then parsing the scripts down the
> object heirarchy to find the
> script they refer to. Then repeating the process
> with those scripts until
> there are no more scripts to parse. It would need to
> handle frontscripts,
> backscripts, libraries, setprops, getprops and sent
> messages also.
> 
> Anyone interested in working on it with me or have
> anything to help me get
> started?

Here's a small part of it:

<http://www.RunRev.com/revolution/downloads/developerdownloads/4W_UmbrellaMa
n.rev.zip>


-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sat Nov 16 02:30:00 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sat Nov 16 02:30:00 2002
Subject: Script Analysis
In-Reply-To: <B9FB2D34.20073%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <20021116072331.94511.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Richard Gaskin <ambassador at fourthworld.com> wrote:
> Jan Schenkel wrote:
> 
> > I'm looking for a script analysis tool. I'm mainly
> > interested in being able
> > to choose an object and a message and view all
> > script that is executed in
> > response to that message.
> > 
> > I guess this would involve firstly parsing the
> code
> > to find custom functions
> > and handlers then parsing the scripts down the
> > object heirarchy to find the
> > script they refer to. Then repeating the process
> > with those scripts until
> > there are no more scripts to parse. It would need
> to
> > handle frontscripts,
> > backscripts, libraries, setprops, getprops and
> sent
> > messages also.
> > 
> > Anyone interested in working on it with me or have
> > anything to help me get
> > started?
> 
> Here's a small part of it:
> 
>
<http://www.RunRev.com/revolution/downloads/developerdownloads/4W_UmbrellaMa
> n.rev.zip>
> 
> 
> -- 
>  Richard Gaskin 

Hi RIchard,

It's nice to see my name used in these listson a
regular basis, but it was Monte Goulding who came up
with the original question :-)
4W_UmbrellaMan can indeed prove very useful in
tracking down the flow of a script, but as I said, it
shows the flow in _one_ instance.

How would you do a 'cold' check of the following
script-snippet and tell what is going to happen?

on myObfuscatedHandler pParam1, pParam2, pParam3
  global gSomeGLobal,gOtherGlobal
  switch pParam1
  case "some"
    put field gSomeGlobal into tTarget
    put "someMessage" into tMessage
    put "call" into tMethod
    break
  case "other"
    put field (gOtherGlobal&pParam3) into \
      tTarget
    put "otherMessage" && pParam3 into tMessage
    put "send" into tMethod
    break
  default
    return "error: pFirstParam must be some or other"
    break
  end switch
  do tMethod && tMessage && "to" && tTarget && \
    "in" && pParam3 && "seconds"
end myObfuscatedHandler

Have fun writing an analyser for that ; only debugging
this step by step can assure you of its correctness,
and even then only in your test-cases.
What would be kind of nice in that department is a
system that keeps track of which pieces of code have
not run yet.

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Sat Nov 16 02:37:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Sat Nov 16 02:37:01 2002
Subject: Script Analysis
In-Reply-To: <20021116072331.94511.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <B9FB343A.20078%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Jan Schenkel wrote:

> It's nice to see my name used in these listson a
> regular basis, but it was Monte Goulding who came up
> with the original question :-)
> 4W_UmbrellaMan can indeed prove very useful in
> tracking down the flow of a script, but as I said, it
> shows the flow in _one_ instance.
> 
> How would you do a 'cold' check of the following
> script-snippet and tell what is going to happen?
> 
> on myObfuscatedHandler pParam1, pParam2, pParam3
> global gSomeGLobal,gOtherGlobal
> switch pParam1
> case "some"
> put field gSomeGlobal into tTarget
> put "someMessage" into tMessage
> put "call" into tMethod
> break
> case "other"
> put field (gOtherGlobal&pParam3) into \
> tTarget
> put "otherMessage" && pParam3 into tMessage
> put "send" into tMethod
> break
> default
> return "error: pFirstParam must be some or other"
> break
> end switch
> do tMethod && tMessage && "to" && tTarget && \
> "in" && pParam3 && "seconds"
> end myObfuscatedHandler
> 
> Have fun writing an analyser for that ; only debugging
> this step by step can assure you of its correctness,
> and even then only in your test-cases.
> What would be kind of nice in that department is a
> system that keeps track of which pieces of code have
> not run yet.

That would need to be handled deeper in the engine, but it should be doable
and would be very desirable.

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sat Nov 16 03:03:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sat Nov 16 03:03:01 2002
Subject: Script Analysis
In-Reply-To: <B9FB343A.20078%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <20021116075638.9227.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Richard Gaskin <ambassador at fourthworld.com> wrote:
> Jan Schenkel wrote:
> 
> > [snip]
> >
> > What would be kind of nice in that department is a
> > system that keeps track of which pieces of code
> have
> > not run yet.
> 
> That would need to be handled deeper in the engine,
> but it should be doable
> and would be very desirable.
> 

And while we're at it: a 'threshold' value we can set
in the variable watcher to kick in the debugger when
that variable reaches a certain value.
Again, a 'deep in the engine' change, but I'd be
gloating as I can just run a program and see where
that bladted thing changes to 0 unexpectedly, without
having to trace like mad or inserting debugging code.

Ah, the joys of debugging...

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From gwills at ozemail.com.au  Sat Nov 16 03:19:01 2002
From: gwills at ozemail.com.au (Greg Wills)
Date: Sat Nov 16 03:19:01 2002
Subject: screen resolution
In-Reply-To: <200211160738.CAA24568@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211160738.CAA24568@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <a05001903b9fb9d0ff84c@[210.84.176.243]>

Hi all

I have developed some programs for a school but have come across a 
problem while testing it on a number of different Mac machines. On 
the older machines the programs do not display the entire contents of 
the card/window. If the resolution is set to 800 x 600 then the full 
card/window is shown. Some of the machines monitors however cannot be 
set to this resolution.

Is there a script that someone has developed that will check the 
monitor setting and either change the monitor setting to 800 x 600 or 
quit before the program runs.

Do windows monitors have the same problem?

regards

Greg Wills


From chipp at chipp.com  Sat Nov 16 04:09:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Sat Nov 16 04:09:01 2002
Subject: screen resolution
In-Reply-To: <a05001903b9fb9d0ff84c@[210.84.176.243]>
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOIEDJCKAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Greg,

Frederic Renaldi has an XCMD: SetMode at:
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/frederic.rinaldi/

for Macs which should set the screen rez on older Macs. I'm not completely
sure it runs with RR so you might want to ask him.

You can of course test the screen width and height, and if not correct
present a dialog telling the user to quit and reset the resolution.

-Chipp

> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Greg Wills
> Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2002 1:07 AM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: screen resolution
>
>
> Hi all
>
> I have developed some programs for a school but have come across a
> problem while testing it on a number of different Mac machines. On
> the older machines the programs do not display the entire contents of
> the card/window. If the resolution is set to 800 x 600 then the full
> card/window is shown. Some of the machines monitors however cannot be
> set to this resolution.
>
> Is there a script that someone has developed that will check the
> monitor setting and either change the monitor setting to 800 x 600 or
> quit before the program runs.
>
> Do windows monitors have the same problem?
>
> regards
>
> Greg Wills
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From doupsy at wanadoo.fr  Sat Nov 16 05:47:01 2002
From: doupsy at wanadoo.fr (doupsy at wanadoo.fr)
Date: Sat Nov 16 05:47:01 2002
Subject: on mouseDoubleDown
Message-ID: <B8A6B0E0-F94F-11D6-9107-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>

Hello,

I am trying to convert an HC Stack to an Revolution Stack.


--> Here the script of a locked bg field :
on mouseDown
	wait 20 ticks
	if (the mouseClick) and (the clickLoc is within the rect of me)
	then DOTHIS
	else DOTHAT
end mouseDown


--> Here the script of the background (group in Revolution)
on DOTHIS
	.........
end DOTHIS

on DOTHAT
	.......
end DOTHAT

I have no problem with these scripts in HC but they make mistakes in 
Revolution.
What is the problem and the solution ?
How is it possible to use mouseDown and mouseDoubleDown to make ONLYTHIS 
with the first one and ONLYTHAT with the second one.

Thanks

Edouard

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From scott at tactilemedia.com  Sat Nov 16 05:59:01 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Sat Nov 16 05:59:01 2002
Subject: Sound not playing sometimes. Why? FOUND IT!
In-Reply-To: <4BFAA3C6-F916-11D6-9649-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
Message-ID: <B9FB6399.9271%scott@tactilemedia.com>

> The problem? It's a mathematical or timing error in Rev (or QT?) -
> maybe something to do with rounding but here is what I found: I needed
> to have a sound play completely before proceeding with another sound
> and, during the handler, some images are being displayed and hidden. So
> I use the following line of code to cause the handler to wait until the
> sound in complete.
> 
> wait (the duration of player "player1") / (the timeScale of player
> "player1") seconds
> 
> What sometimes happens (I eventually discovered by looking at the
> player object's properties) is that something causes the audio file to
> stop playing prematurely, maybe as little a 5% or less from the end of
> the file. The next time the handler tells the player to start playing,
> only the last few % of the file plays. It sounds like the audio
> vanishes and then starts back up at the end but it's really just the
> end of the file that plays. The "wait..." code makes it seem as if
> everything is timed properly (because currentTime is ignored). The next
> time you run through the handler, everything plays fine because the
> sound file is back at the beginning (well, really the end but playing
> it from the beginning is really the only course open at this point).
> 
> I've also found that the "wait..." line of code, above, does not always
> result in the correct amount of time passing before the handler
> proceeds. The result is sometimes less so the sound stops prematurely
> when some other line of code executes in the handler.
> 
> The "fix" I put into place is as follows:
> 
> wait (the duration of player "player1") / (the timeScale of player
> "player1") + .2 seconds
> --note the "+.2" I added. Sometimes I can use .1, it appears. This
> guarantees that any small error in timing won't cause the handler to
> continue prematurely.


Did you take a look at the playStopped message?  Without knowing what you're
trying to do, it sounds like this is something you should investigate.

In any event, you might consider eliminating the "wait" command from your
script -- it prevents Rev/MC from executing until the time/condition is met.
Instead, consider using the "send" command, something like:

on doStuff
  do some stuff
  put (the duration of player "player1") / (the timeScale of player
    "player1") + .2 seconds into tDelay
  send "doMoreStuff" to me in tDelay seconds
end doStuff

on doMoreStuff
  doSomeOtherStuff
end doMoreStuff

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director

Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
Email: scott at tactilemedia.com
Web: www.tactilemedia.com



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Sat Nov 16 07:10:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Sat Nov 16 07:10:01 2002
Subject: not a problem for me only ;))
In-Reply-To: <CEE7C06C-F890-11D6-9FFA-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>
Message-ID: <8A09528B-F95B-11D6-AFB8-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

It seems, that the installation of icons in builded distributions is 
not a problem for me only
;))

http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/16216

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sat Nov 16 07:47:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sat Nov 16 07:47:01 2002
Subject: on mouseDoubleDown
In-Reply-To: <B8A6B0E0-F94F-11D6-9107-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>
Message-ID: <20021116124030.60634.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>

--- doupsy at wanadoo.fr wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I am trying to convert an HC Stack to an Revolution
> Stack.
> 
> 
> --> Here the script of a locked bg field :
> on mouseDown
> 	wait 20 ticks
> 	if (the mouseClick) and (the clickLoc is within the
> rect of me)
> 	then DOTHIS
> 	else DOTHAT
> end mouseDown
> 
> 
> --> Here the script of the background (group in
> Revolution)
> on DOTHIS
> 	.........
> end DOTHIS
> 
> on DOTHAT
> 	.......
> end DOTHAT
> 
> I have no problem with these scripts in HC but they
> make mistakes in 
> Revolution.
> What is the problem and the solution ?
> How is it possible to use mouseDown and
> mouseDoubleDown to make ONLYTHIS 
> with the first one and ONLYTHAT with the second one.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Edouard
> 

Hi Edouard,

Try this script:

local sDoThatMsgID
on mouseDown
  if "doThat" is not in the pendingMessages then 
    send "doTHAT" to me in 20 seconds
    put it into sDoThatMsgID
  end if
end mouseDown

on mouseDoubleDown
  if "doTHAT" is in the pendingMessages then
    cancel sDoThatMsgID
  end if
  doTHIS
end mouseDoubleDown

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Sat Nov 16 08:21:01 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Sat Nov 16 08:21:01 2002
Subject: swf files?
In-Reply-To: <C99A1613-F8E0-11D6-9DC8-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <884C328C-F965-11D6-9150-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Hi Wolfgang,

> On Freitag, November 15, 2002, at 12:53  Uhr, Klaus Major wrote:
>
>>> But my question was not exact enough, should be: *without* QuickTime
>> the answer is simple: You can't :-(
>> ...unless someone is willing to write an external...
>> (I would buy it ! :-)
> needless to say me too...
> How much time does a good sripter need for that about: What do you 
> think??

Sorry, i have no idea...

>> ...or an external that will handle "shockwave", too...
>> Wow, what a hought...
>> (I would buy 2 :-)
>
> Do you really see such an importance for shockwave like for flash?
> Imho the filesize is to big. Flash is a killer because of its small 
> size...
> Sometimes I think MM will let it die slowly together with Director and 
> blow Flash then up with a Pro version up to a new Director...

Interesting point...
I would not be surprised.

The next (OS X) version of Director is announced for
mid 2003 ! We'll see...

But i would rather like some more animation features in MC/RR.
The "Animation Manager", well, ehmmm, nice try... ;-)
And we can rotate images now (again ;-)

Anyway, thank to QT, we can have Flash, if we like...
And interactive QT. I have a version of Livestage Pro,
a really wonderful piece of software !!!

And with the addition of "the qtdebugstring" we can even have
some kind of interactivity between QT/Flash and MC/RR.

>> Have a nice weekend.
>
> Danke, das werd ich jetzt brauchen, weniger nice daf?r mehr busy...;))

OK, aber ?bertreib's nicht (don't overdrive it :-D
(Bloody joke about germans and their language-skills :-)

> regards
> Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Regards

Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de


From mparis at nc.rr.com  Sat Nov 16 10:29:01 2002
From: mparis at nc.rr.com (Mark Paris)
Date: Sat Nov 16 10:29:01 2002
Subject: dll ignorance
References: <HNEFLBGCPKCOFDJDMMKMAEGJCBAA.zelston@aol.com> <p05200f03b9fb30ce9583@[192.168.123.3]>
Message-ID: <001f01c28d82$63a94de0$b7443942@nc.rr.com>

Ok, I'll admit it, I am utterly ignorant of how to use a .dll with Rev.  Can
someone enlighten me on this?

Let's say I have a dll that contains a function, let's say it adds x+y and
returns the result.  So how do I call that function from the Rev program?
Is this a fairly simple thing to do?  Can I pass x and y from Rev to the dll
and get an answer back into Rev?  How do I tell Rev to use the dll?

Thanks very much for any insight!

Mark




From doupsy at wanadoo.fr  Sat Nov 16 12:00:02 2002
From: doupsy at wanadoo.fr (doupsy at wanadoo.fr)
Date: Sat Nov 16 12:00:02 2002
Subject: on mouseDoubleDown
In-Reply-To: <20021116124030.60634.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021116124030.60634.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <a05111700b9fc267b13a9@[80.11.64.124]>

>--- doupsy at wanadoo.fr wrote:
>>  Hello,
>>
>>  I am trying to convert an HC Stack to an Revolution
>>  Stack.
>>
>>
>>  --> Here the script of a locked bg field :
>  > on mouseDown
>>	wait 20 ticks
>>	if (the mouseClick) and (the clickLoc is within the
>>  rect of me)
>>	then DOTHIS
>>	else DOTHAT
>  > end mouseDown
>>
>>
>>  --> Here the script of the background (group in
>>  Revolution)
>>  on DOTHIS
>>	.........
>>  end DOTHIS
>>
>>  on DOTHAT
>>	.......
>>  end DOTHAT
>>
>>  I have no problem with these scripts in HC but they
>>  make mistakes in
>>  Revolution.
>>  What is the problem and the solution ?
>>  How is it possible to use mouseDown and
>>  mouseDoubleDown to make ONLYTHIS
>>  with the first one and ONLYTHAT with the second one.
>>
>>  Thanks
>>
>>  Edouard
>>
>
>Hi Edouard,
>
>Try this script:
>
>local sDoThatMsgID
>on mouseDown
>   if "doThat" is not in the pendingMessages then
>     send "doTHAT" to me in 20 seconds
>     put it into sDoThatMsgID
>   end if
>end mouseDown
>
>on mouseDoubleDown
>   if "doTHAT" is in the pendingMessages then
>     cancel sDoThatMsgID
>   end if
>   doTHIS
>end mouseDoubleDown
>
>Hope this helped,
>
>Jan Schenkel.
>
>=====
>"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same 
>time."  (La Rochefoucauld)
>



Thanks Jan,

But I don't understand very well your script, could you explain more please.

I must say you what I want exactly :

-> I have a locked bg field.

-> When I mouseDown on a line of this bg field, I have a popmenuA (I 
use popup command and an invisible button) with for example 
menuItemA1 and menuItemA2.

-> When I mouseDoubleDown on a line of this bg field, I have a 
popupmenuB with for example menuItemB1, menuItemB2, menuItemB3.


Thanks

Edouard




From rcozens at pon.net  Sat Nov 16 12:10:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Sat Nov 16 12:10:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <2EE33CDA-F816-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
References: <2EE33CDA-F816-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05100301b9fc2aa7e3d5@[216.229.107.135]>

>All I can deduct is that for some reason, the first time the mouse 
>leaves the 'over' image, no 'mouseLeave' message is being sent to 
>it! Only after the cursor has re-entered the image, and then 
>proceeds to leave again, does it work...


Hi All,

FWIW, I have found the same behavior applies to showing/hiding buttons.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From dsc at swcp.com  Sat Nov 16 13:39:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Sat Nov 16 13:39:01 2002
Subject: dll ignorance
In-Reply-To: <001f01c28d82$63a94de0$b7443942@nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <7105941E-F991-11D6-9A91-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Saturday, November 16, 2002, at 08:11 AM, Mark Paris wrote:

> Let's say I have a dll that contains a function, let's say it adds x+y 
> and
> returns the result.  So how do I call that function from the Rev 
> program?
> Is this a fairly simple thing to do?  Can I pass x and y from Rev to 
> the dll
> and get an answer back into Rev?  How do I tell Rev to use the dll?

You may need to make an external.  On Windows this is a dll that will 
work as the glue between your stack and the dll you have in mind.

You will be able to pass parameters and get results.  The simplest data 
are strings with no nulls, but there are ways to handle general byte 
strings and other types.

An external is normally written in C and your first definitely should be.

I have jotted down a list of bunny-trails to avoid when making your 
first external.  I wonder where I put that.

Also, you can hope, as I do, that someone will pop up and say, "Oh! I 
have a generic dll-glue stack!"

There may be other alternatives.  If the dll does not maintain state for 
you, you might be able to write a short command-line app in your 
second-favorite language that can call the dll.  Use the Rev shell 
capability with that.  If state is needed, use "open process" and send 
commands.  Or you might make a tiny server in that second-favorite 
language that calls the dll and listens on UDP or something.

Dar Scott





From raney at metacard.com  Sat Nov 16 15:15:01 2002
From: raney at metacard.com (Scott Raney)
Date: Sat Nov 16 15:15:01 2002
Subject: Script Analysis
In-Reply-To: <200211161702.MAA00978@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211161306290.25680-100000@mast.metacard.com>

On Sat, 16 Nov 2002 Jan Schenkel <janschenkel at yahoo.com> wrote:

> And while we're at it: a 'threshold' value we can set
> in the variable watcher to kick in the debugger when
> that variable reaches a certain value.
> Again, a 'deep in the engine' change, but I'd be
> gloating as I can just run a program and see where
> that bladted thing changes to 0 unexpectedly, without
> having to trace like mad or inserting debugging code.

Note that this feature is already implemented in the (public) alpha
test release of MetaCard 2.5.  Which means you'll probably get it in
RR 2.0.
  Regards,
    Scott

> Jan Schenkel.
> 
> =====
> "As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

********************************************************
Scott Raney  raney at metacard.com  http://www.metacard.com
MetaCard: You know, there's an easier way to do that...



From raney at metacard.com  Sat Nov 16 15:19:01 2002
From: raney at metacard.com (Scott Raney)
Date: Sat Nov 16 15:19:01 2002
Subject: Script Analysis
In-Reply-To: <200211160738.CAA24540@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211161309120.25680-100000@mast.metacard.com>

On Sat, 16 Nov 2002 Jan Schenkel <janschenkel at yahoo.com> wrote:

> How would you do a 'cold' check of the following
> script-snippet and tell what is going to happen?
> on myObfuscatedHandler pParam1, pParam2, pParam3

This is known as "The Halting Problem" in Computer Science jargon.
You'll be disappointed to learn that there *is* no general solution to
it ;-)
  Regards,
    Scott

********************************************************
Scott Raney  raney at metacard.com  http://www.metacard.com
MetaCard: You know, there's an easier way to do that...




From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Sat Nov 16 17:40:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Sat Nov 16 17:40:01 2002
Subject: debugging:  how?
In-Reply-To: <a0510030cb9f83c8c53b8@[216.229.107.120]>
References: <a0510030cb9f83c8c53b8@[216.229.107.120]>
Message-ID: <a05200a01b9fc77cb3c44@[128.196.99.222]>

hello:  i cannot get the debugger to work -- i chose "Script Debug 
Mode" and get the debugger window.  i select the message i would like 
to trace in the appropriate object and hit "send message" and nothing 
happens.  is there a trick to it?  thanks for your help.  olli.


From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Sat Nov 16 18:24:01 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Sat Nov 16 18:24:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOCEDCCKAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <9AE59092-F9B9-11D6-AD8C-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Chipp,

Many thanks for your posting!

> check out
>
> put img 1 into img 2
>
> this way you don't have to 'unpack' them
>
> If you're using tranparent images, you may have to:
>
> set the width of img 1 to the width of img 2
> set the imagedata of img 1 to the imagedata of image 2
> set the alphadata of img 1 to the alphadata of image 2
>

Your suggestion is along the same line as the suggestions given by Jan 
and Terry, which were all extremely helpful. Indeed, I went the way of 
setting imageData and alphaData, and that works quite well. One little 
word of advice to others who need to implement this: set the alphaData 
BEFORE setting the imageData, otherwise for some reason the screen does 
not redraw properly using the new alphaData information...

> I spent a lot of time working with images recently (butongadget)
>
> I also recently wrote a 'skinnable' application and had to work around 
> many
> of the same issues.
>

Wow! Wonderful! Perhaps you could give me a few pointers? For instance: 
are your 'skin' files actually stacks? - it seems that this is the best 
way to go about saving all the image and metadata information in a 
single file... Also, how do you then change the file TYPE of the skin 
stack, and how do you associate a custom file icon with that icon type 
on the Mac?

Once again, many thanks for all your suggestions!

Kind Regards,

--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
info at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sat Nov 16 18:38:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sat Nov 16 18:38:01 2002
Subject: DDE - Dynamic Data Exchange
References: <607ABD04-F920-11D6-9360-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <058501c28dc7$b2e007b0$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> Where is this "old" Externals Collection for Windows? I don't see it on 
> runrev.com. OK is this it? http://www.xworlds.com/metacard/external.htm 
> ? I found it in the list archives. Maybe it should be added to the 
> runrev.com site?

It's at: http://www.xworlds.com/metacard/contributorfiles/ext10final.sit

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sat Nov 16 18:47:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sat Nov 16 18:47:01 2002
Subject: DDE - Dynamic Data Exchange
References: <607ABD04-F920-11D6-9360-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <058c01c28dc8$f3948e10$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> Does anyone have examples of how I can execute VBA code via DDE from
> Revolution?

Well, here's how you communicate via VBA from something like Excel to
Revolution once it has been registered as "EXT" by the Externals Collection:

Private Sub CommandButton1_Click()
  Dim tVal as Long
  tVal = Application.DDEInitiate("EXT","myTopic")
  Application.DDEExecute tVal, "myCommand")
End Sub

In the Externals collection, there are two parameters that are passed to the
"extDDEexecuteMsg" handler - a "topic" and a "command". Here's how it looks
trapping it in Rev:

on extDDEexecuteMsg pTopic, pCommand
  switch pTopic
    case "myTopic"
      answer "Command is: " & pCommand
      break
    case "otherTopic"
      -- do something else
      break
  end switch
end exteDDEexecuteMsg

Hope this helps,

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sat Nov 16 18:51:00 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sat Nov 16 18:51:00 2002
Subject: on mouseDoubleDown
References: <B8A6B0E0-F94F-11D6-9107-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>
Message-ID: <05a401c28dc9$716543c0$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Edouard:

It's easy:

on mouseDown
  DOTHIS
end mouseDown

on mouseDoubleDown
  DOTHAT
end mouseDoubleDown

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <doupsy at wanadoo.fr>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2002 4:39 AM
Subject: on mouseDoubleDown


> Hello,
> 
> I am trying to convert an HC Stack to an Revolution Stack.
> 
> 
> --> Here the script of a locked bg field :
> on mouseDown
> wait 20 ticks
> if (the mouseClick) and (the clickLoc is within the rect of me)
> then DOTHIS
> else DOTHAT
> end mouseDown
> 
> 
> --> Here the script of the background (group in Revolution)
> on DOTHIS
> .........
> end DOTHIS
> 
> on DOTHAT
> .......
> end DOTHAT
> 
> I have no problem with these scripts in HC but they make mistakes in 
> Revolution.
> What is the problem and the solution ?
> How is it possible to use mouseDown and mouseDoubleDown to make ONLYTHIS 
> with the first one and ONLYTHAT with the second one.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Edouard
> 
> 


From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sat Nov 16 19:00:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sat Nov 16 19:00:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
References: <2EE33CDA-F816-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au> <a05100301b9fc2aa7e3d5@[216.229.107.135]>
Message-ID: <05b601c28dca$b7513d20$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Rob,

I hate to mention it (and I'm NOT implying it is the right thing to do, mind
you), but other apps suffer this same situation. SuperCard for a long time
did that, and one of the answers I got when I asked about it was that the
enter/leave messages need to come in pairs; that is, 'enter' sets a flag
that is cleared by 'leave', so if there was no 'enter', there can't be any
'leave'.

However, that said, since Rev and MC both get mouseMove messages that are
sent to the underlying targets, and since they *do* recognize that the
target of the mouseMove message changes when an object appears underneath
the mouse, I personally think the best approach would be to immediately send
the object a 'mouseEnter' when it appears, and then a 'mouseLeave' when it
exits. This keeps the enter/leave pairing, but also allows for the
flexibility with displayed objects.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Cozens" <rcozens at pon.net>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2002 11:05 AM
Subject: Re:Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...


> >All I can deduct is that for some reason, the first time the mouse
> >leaves the 'over' image, no 'mouseLeave' message is being sent to
> >it! Only after the cursor has re-entered the image, and then
> >proceeds to leave again, does it work...
>
>
> Hi All,
>
> FWIW, I have found the same behavior applies to showing/hiding buttons.
> --
>
> Rob Cozens
> CCW, Serendipity Software Company
> http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm
>
> "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
> Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."
>
> from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sat Nov 16 19:01:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sat Nov 16 19:01:01 2002
Subject: debugging:  how?
References: <a0510030cb9f83c8c53b8@[216.229.107.120]> <a05200a01b9fc77cb3c44@[128.196.99.222]>
Message-ID: <05bb01c28dca$ef8116c0$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Oliver,

The way I do it is to enter the word "breakpoint" in the script that I'm
trying to debug, then bring up the Script Debugger. Move it to the side and
click the button (or execute the script) you're trying to debug. When script
execution encounters the "breakpoing" statement, it will pause, and the
Debugger will shift to show where you are in the script. You can then step,
etc. through it.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Oliver Hardt" <hardt at u.arizona.edu>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2002 4:33 PM
Subject: debugging: how?


> hello:  i cannot get the debugger to work -- i chose "Script Debug
> Mode" and get the debugger window.  i select the message i would like
> to trace in the appropriate object and hit "send message" and nothing
> happens.  is there a trick to it?  thanks for your help.  olli.
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Sat Nov 16 19:43:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Sat Nov 16 19:43:01 2002
Subject: Script Analysis
In-Reply-To: <20021116064451.2951.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHCEFNCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Hi Richard

Any chance of some instructions for Umbrellaman? Actually I wasn't thinking
of a runtime system but perhaps it's the way to go.

Cheers

Monte



From rcozens at pon.net  Sat Nov 16 19:50:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Sat Nov 16 19:50:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <05b601c28dca$b7513d20$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>
References: <2EE33CDA-F816-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
 <a05100301b9fc2aa7e3d5@[216.229.107.135]>
 <05b601c28dca$b7513d20$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <a05100301b9fc95f8ba52@[216.229.107.238]>

>I personally think the best approach would be to immediately send
>the object a 'mouseEnter' when it appears, and then a 'mouseLeave' when it
>exits.

Hi Ken,

I tried explicitly sending 'mouseEnter' & 'mouseLeave' messages...nothing
I tried clicking (by script) outside the rect of the image to get the 
engine to send 'mouseLeave'...nada.
I tried locking and unlocking messages...no go
I tried changing the order of showing & hiding the images...zip

I believe Igor tried all of these workarounds also, and got the same 
[non] results.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Sat Nov 16 19:58:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Sat Nov 16 19:58:01 2002
Subject: Script Analysis
In-Reply-To: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHCEFNCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <B9FC2821.200F6%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Monte Goulding wrote:

> Any chance of some instructions for Umbrellaman? Actually I wasn't thinking
> of a runtime system but perhaps it's the way to go.

The only instructions I have are accessedd from the "?" button in thr
upper-right of the Umbrellaman window:


> 
> Umbrellaman
> 
> Umbrellaman is a "message umbrella" that traps system messages, logs 'em in
> its console, then passes them so they execute normally.
> 
> Using it is a snap:
> 
> Just select the messages you want to watch from the list at the left of the
> window (double click the list to select 'em all).  All MetaCard messages are
> in there, except idle and mouseMove (they are triggered so frequently that it
> just fills the console with uninteresting information if used).
> 
> The Start button builds a front script trapping all the selected messages and
> inserts it into the fronstscripts.
> 
> The Stop button removes the "umbrella" frontscript from the message path,
> which stops the logging.
> 
> The Clear button clears the console log.



-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Sat Nov 16 20:41:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Sat Nov 16 20:41:01 2002
Subject: Script Analysis
In-Reply-To: <B9FC2821.200F6%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHMEFNCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Thanks Richard 

I didn't see the button ;-)
> 
> Monte Goulding wrote:
> 
> > Any chance of some instructions for Umbrellaman? Actually I 
> wasn't thinking
> > of a runtime system but perhaps it's the way to go.
> 
> The only instructions I have are accessedd from the "?" button in thr
> upper-right of the Umbrellaman window:
> 
> 
> > 
> > Umbrellaman
> > 
> > Umbrellaman is a "message umbrella" that traps system messages, 
> logs 'em in
> > its console, then passes them so they execute normally.
> > 
> > Using it is a snap:
> > 
> > Just select the messages you want to watch from the list at the 
> left of the
> > window (double click the list to select 'em all).  All MetaCard 
> messages are
> > in there, except idle and mouseMove (they are triggered so 
> frequently that it
> > just fills the console with uninteresting information if used).
> > 
> > The Start button builds a front script trapping all the 
> selected messages and
> > inserts it into the fronstscripts.
> > 
> > The Stop button removes the "umbrella" frontscript from the 
> message path,
> > which stops the logging.
> > 
> > The Clear button clears the console log.
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
>  Richard Gaskin 
>  Fourth World Media Corporation
>  Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
>  ___________________________________________________________
>  Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
>  Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 


From chipp at chipp.com  Sat Nov 16 21:47:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Sat Nov 16 21:47:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <9AE59092-F9B9-11D6-AD8C-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOAEEGCKAA.chipp@chipp.com>

> Your suggestion is along the same line as the suggestions given by Jan
> and Terry, which were all extremely helpful. Indeed, I went the way of
> setting imageData and alphaData, and that works quite well. One little
> word of advice to others who need to implement this: set the alphaData
> BEFORE setting the imageData, otherwise for some reason the screen does
> not redraw properly using the new alphaData information...

Yes, my mistake. You do need to set the alphaData before the imageData.

>
> Wow! Wonderful! Perhaps you could give me a few pointers? For instance:
> are your 'skin' files actually stacks? - it seems that this is the best
> way to go about saving all the image and metadata information in a
> single file... Also, how do you then change the file TYPE of the skin
> stack, and how do you associate a custom file icon with that icon type
> on the Mac?

I used a "skins" folder with .png files which were loaded on startup,
similar to the way WinAmp and other skinnable amps work. I didn't concern
myself with 'transparency' areas for clicking. Generally the rect of even a
'round' image would work. There was also a skin.txt file used for
configuration. In this way even non-RR users could skin the app.

You can check out
http://www.sonsothunder.com/
and the article:
Setting Document Associations in Windows

for more info on how to associate files with apps in Windows.
I'm sure someone else can help you with Apple
(I just use resedit to do this, but I'm not sure it's still the best way to
go considering OSX)


-Chipp




From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sat Nov 16 21:55:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sat Nov 16 21:55:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
References: <2EE33CDA-F816-11D6-AD59-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au> <a05100301b9fc2aa7e3d5@[216.229.107.135]> <05b601c28dca$b7513d20$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom> <a05100301b9fc95f8ba52@[216.229.107.238]>
Message-ID: <067601c28de3$3d10f7d0$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Rob,

What I meant was that the *engine* should send the object the mouseEnter
when it appears, and then a mouseLeave when the mouse exits. It's for
Scott/Kevin to implement now...

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Cozens" <rcozens at pon.net>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2002 6:45 PM
Subject: Re: Re:Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...


> >I personally think the best approach would be to immediately send
> >the object a 'mouseEnter' when it appears, and then a 'mouseLeave' when
it
> >exits.
>
> Hi Ken,
>
> I tried explicitly sending 'mouseEnter' & 'mouseLeave' messages...nothing
> I tried clicking (by script) outside the rect of the image to get the
> engine to send 'mouseLeave'...nada.
> I tried locking and unlocking messages...no go
> I tried changing the order of showing & hiding the images...zip
>
> I believe Igor tried all of these workarounds also, and got the same
> [non] results.
> --
>
> Rob Cozens
> CCW, Serendipity Software Company
> http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm
>
> "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
> Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."
>
> from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sat Nov 16 21:57:00 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sat Nov 16 21:57:00 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
References: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOAEEGCKAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <067901c28de3$7cb3dc90$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> You can check out
> http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> and the article:
> Setting Document Associations in Windows

For a straight URL, you can go to:

http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_file004

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From chipp at chipp.com  Sat Nov 16 22:01:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Sat Nov 16 22:01:01 2002
Subject: Showing/Hiding Images on mouseLeave...
In-Reply-To: <9AE59092-F9B9-11D6-AD8C-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOGEEGCKAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Igor wrote:

> Your suggestion is along the same line as the suggestions given by Jan
> and Terry, which were all extremely helpful. Indeed, I went the way of
> setting imageData and alphaData, and that works quite well. One little
> word of advice to others who need to implement this: set the alphaData
> BEFORE setting the imageData, otherwise for some reason the screen does
> not redraw properly using the new alphaData information...

Rob,

I *think* the original effect was to be able to take an image with a
transparent channel and use it as a button with only the trans channel as
'clickable.' Then swap it with 2 other images on mouseOver and mouseDown
(typical button behavior).

I believe this is an acceptable 'workaround' which Kevin referred to. BTW,
in order to do something like this in VB, you'd have to use or write and
ActiveX control! I wonder if RealBasic can do this? Or SuperCard?

-Chipp





From andre.rombauts at win.be  Sun Nov 17 04:10:02 2002
From: andre.rombauts at win.be (Andre Rombauts)
Date: Sun Nov 17 04:10:02 2002
Subject: HTMLtext property
Message-ID: <B9FD19B0.949D%andre.rombauts@win.be>

When setting the HTMLtext property a field is ?blocked?: I?m not able to
move scrollbars or to type text even if thoses properties are set. Why? Is
there a way to avoid this?

Andr?
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From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sun Nov 17 04:19:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sun Nov 17 04:19:01 2002
Subject: Script Analysis
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211161306290.25680-100000@mast.metacard.com>
Message-ID: <20021117091249.38156.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Scott Raney <raney at metacard.com> wrote:
> On Sat, 16 Nov 2002 Jan Schenkel
> <janschenkel at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> > And while we're at it: a 'threshold' value we can
> set
> > in the variable watcher to kick in the debugger
> when
> > that variable reaches a certain value.
> > Again, a 'deep in the engine' change, but I'd be
> > gloating as I can just run a program and see where
> > that bladted thing changes to 0 unexpectedly,
> without
> > having to trace like mad or inserting debugging
> code.
> 
> Note that this feature is already implemented in the
> (public) alpha
> test release of MetaCard 2.5.  Which means you'll
> probably get it in
> RR 2.0.
>   Regards,
>     Scott
> 

[insert Homer Simpson image here]

Woohoo !

Thanks, that is a very welcome addition.
I'll download the alpha and have a peek at it before I
ramble on about things that re already in there :-)

Thanks again,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sun Nov 17 04:22:00 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sun Nov 17 04:22:00 2002
Subject: HTMLtext property
In-Reply-To: <B9FD19B0.949D%andre.rombauts@win.be>
Message-ID: <20021117091601.8413.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Andre Rombauts <andre.rombauts at win.be> wrote:
> When setting the HTMLtext property a field is
> ?blocked?: I?m not able to
> move scrollbars or to type text even if thoses
> properties are set. Why? Is
> there a way to avoid this?
> 
> Andr?
> 

Hi Andre,

The problem is in the redraw ; but you can solve this
problem by locking/unlocking the field. Here's the
work-around:

repeat 2 times
  set the lockText of fld "yourField" to \
    not the lockText of fld "yourField"
end repeat

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Sun Nov 17 05:04:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Sun Nov 17 05:04:01 2002
Subject: HTMLtext property
In-Reply-To: <B9FD19B0.949D%andre.rombauts@win.be>
References: <B9FD19B0.949D%andre.rombauts@win.be>
Message-ID: <p05100302b9fd0a6f7f6d@[10.0.1.203]>

>When setting the HTMLtext property a field is 'blocked': I'm not 
>able to move scrollbars or to type text even if thoses properties 
>are set. Why? Is there a way to avoid this?
>
>Andr?


Try Lock the screen and then unlock

simply add at the end of your script :

lock sceen
unlock screen

Cheers
-- 
Yves COPPE

yvescoppe at skynet.be
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From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sun Nov 17 05:11:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sun Nov 17 05:11:01 2002
Subject: Script Analysis
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211161309120.25680-100000@mast.metacard.com>
Message-ID: <20021117100513.62476.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Scott Raney <raney at metacard.com> wrote:
> On Sat, 16 Nov 2002 Jan Schenkel
> <janschenkel at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> > How would you do a 'cold' check of the following
> > script-snippet and tell what is going to happen?
> > on myObfuscatedHandler pParam1, pParam2, pParam3
> 
> This is known as "The Halting Problem" in Computer
> Science jargon.
> You'll be disappointed to learn that there *is* no
> general solution to
> it ;-)
>   Regards,
>     Scott
> 

Hi Scott

Heh, I'm way past that disappointment -- ever since
someone explained that Halting Problem to me ;-)
So it came as no shock to me ; I was merely trying to
provide an example that would be understandably
impossible to 'auto-document' in the context of the
xTalk programming language.

But I must say that this particular brain-teaser to
determine what's going to happen, is part of the charm
of xCard environments, and the flexibility offered by
the "do" construct is enormous.
As with any powerful piece of technology, one has to
keep an eye on what one's doing. Mistakes happen, and
they're not always easy to find out. And the computer
simply can't tell us -- and that's what that manual
documentation is for when we need to take another look
a year and a half down the road ;-).

And then good debuggers come in extra handy.
Which reminds me: I _love_ the new variable watcher,
with its ability to set stop points on the basis of
expressions ; I was hoping for that one :-)
And it looks like that other wish, tracking which
piece of code hasn't executed yet, is well on its way
to realisation with the script profiler.

MetaCard and RunRev just keep getting better and
better ; thanks Scott, Kevin and all the others !

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From jeanne at runrev.com  Sun Nov 17 05:16:01 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Sun Nov 17 05:16:01 2002
Subject: backColor of image
In-Reply-To: <B9F81C72.45CE%mazzapaolo@libero.it>
References: <200211130725.CAA14505@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <v03130304b9fcfed2715a@[10.0.1.3]>

At 6:12 AM -0800 11/13/02, paolo mazza wrote:
>on MouseUp
>  set the backgroundcolor of image "image1" to 0,0,0
>end MouseUp
>
>This button change the BackColor property of "image1" but the image does not
>change at all. Why?
>An image has a backcolor or not?


From jeanne at runrev.com  Sun Nov 17 05:16:11 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Sun Nov 17 05:16:11 2002
Subject: relative scrolling in a group
In-Reply-To: <A98849CC-F5DD-11D6-9D09-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <v03130305b9fd0aea48b9@[10.0.1.3]>

At 5:25 PM -0800 11/11/02, Alex Rice wrote:
>I have complex group with a vertical scrollbar. How can I scroll to
>make a particular object visible, instead of hardcoding the vscroll
>pixels like this
>
>set the vscroll of grp "reportGroup" to 475
>
>I want to do something like this
>
>set the vscroll of grp "reportGroup" to the location of fld
>"myReportHeader"

Try this:

  set the vScroll of group "reportGroup" to \
     (the top of field "myReportHeader" - the top of group "reportGroup")

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From jeanne at runrev.com  Sun Nov 17 05:16:22 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Sun Nov 17 05:16:22 2002
Subject: Several questions about the Menu Mgr
In-Reply-To: <a05111a03b9f77f099941@[216.113.201.101]>
References: <v0313030db9f5eb4eba21@[10.0.1.5]>
 <v0313030db9f5eb4eba21@[10.0.1.5]>
Message-ID: <v03130306b9fd0bb07740@[10.0.1.3]>

At 8:06 PM -0800 11/12/02, Gareth Jones wrote:
>Now, about the other questions: can I specify a keyboard equivalent
>of a menu item that needs Command+Shiftkey+letter or a Function key
>(e.g. F2)?


You can write handlers to trap these keypresses (see the functionKey and
commandKey messages), but there's no way I know of as yet to have them
appear at the right edge of the menu as shortcuts. Your handler would look
like this:

  on commandKeyDown theKey
    if the shiftKey is down then
      switch theKey
      case "A"
        -- do whatever you want for command-shift-A
        break
      case "D"
        -- ...
      default
        pass commandKeyDown
      end switch
    else pass commandKeyDown
  end commandKey

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From jeanne at runrev.com  Sun Nov 17 05:16:35 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Sun Nov 17 05:16:35 2002
Subject: why the hell does this not work??????
In-Reply-To: <a05200a00b9faa3dbd22a@[128.196.99.222]>
References: <a0510030cb9f83c8c53b8@[216.229.107.120]>
 <a0510030cb9f83c8c53b8@[216.229.107.120]>
Message-ID: <v03130307b9fd15a7ce9f@[10.0.1.3]>

At 5:32 AM -0800 11/15/02, Oliver Hardt wrote:
>	and this is the problem: the "answer question" dialogue ONLY
>pops up, when i run the stack from within RunRev UI (i.e., i start
>RR, and then use the File menu to open the stack).  it *doesn't* pop
>up, when i simply double click the stack icon on my desktop (RR is
>not loaded when i click)

You answered this yourself: the development environment isn't loaded when
you launch Revolution by double-clicking a stack file. The answer dialog
stack is part of the development environment, so it's not available in this
situation. To use it, you need to either be running in the development
environment, or use the Distribution Builder to include it with your stack
(you can either build a stack distribution or a standalone, either one).

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From jeanne at runrev.com  Sun Nov 17 05:16:47 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Sun Nov 17 05:16:47 2002
Subject: Open Program with RR
In-Reply-To: <20021114224929.25107.qmail@web20010.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021114082951.14646.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <v03130308b9fd18d28d25@[10.0.1.3]>

At 2:49 PM -0800 11/14/02, erik hansen wrote:
>"put mainstacks()" yields a long list with "Home"
>at the top Transcript Dictionary (TD) has no
>listing for "Home" and <go stack stack "Home"
>causes nothing to happen.
>
>what exactly IS "Home" in RR?

The home stack is the licensing stack (the main stack of the file
"license.rev"). You can see where it is by querying the long name of stack
"Home".

This stack is password-protected, so you can't add things to its script.
Unlike in HyperCard, the Home stack isn't a place for custom additions. The
best way, as I think Jan said, is to create a plugin. You can have plugins
open automatically at startup (and if you want a frontScript or backScript,
they can insert the necessary objects during their openStack handlers).

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From andre.rombauts at win.be  Sun Nov 17 11:35:01 2002
From: andre.rombauts at win.be (Andre Rombauts)
Date: Sun Nov 17 11:35:01 2002
Subject: How can I empty the clipboard?
Message-ID: <B9FD81DE.94DA%andre.rombauts@win.be>

If I use:

on mouseUp
      put empty into field "Dummy"
      select the text of field "Dummy"
      copy
end mouseUp

The clipboard is not emptied because no text was selected since the field
?Dummy is empty... So how do I proceed?...

Andr? Rombauts
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From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sun Nov 17 11:48:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sun Nov 17 11:48:01 2002
Subject: How can I empty the clipboard?
In-Reply-To: <B9FD81DE.94DA%andre.rombauts@win.be>
Message-ID: <20021117164218.90651.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Andre Rombauts <andre.rombauts at win.be> wrote:
> If I use:
> 
> on mouseUp
>       put empty into field "Dummy"
>       select the text of field "Dummy"
>       copy
> end mouseUp
> 
> The clipboard is not emptied because no text was
> selected since the field
> ?Dummy is empty... So how do I proceed?...
> 
> Andr? Rombauts
> 

Hi Andre,

There's no real way of doing that as far as I know.
Besides, it's not really user-friendly is it?
The question is: what are you trying to accomplish?
If you want to prevent the user pasting data into a
field, check out the 'pasteKey' command.
If you want to prevent the user copying data from a
field, check out the 'copyKey' command.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From andre.rombauts at win.be  Sun Nov 17 12:09:01 2002
From: andre.rombauts at win.be (Andre Rombauts)
Date: Sun Nov 17 12:09:01 2002
Subject: How can I empty the clipboard?
In-Reply-To: <20021117164218.90651.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <B9FD89B6.94EC%andre.rombauts@win.be>

Le 17/11/2002 17:42, Jan Schenkel ? janschenkel at yahoo.com a ?crit:

> There's no real way of doing that as far as I know.
> Besides, it's not really user-friendly is it?
> The question is: what are you trying to accomplish?

Just set the clipboard to "nodata" when starting an new session in a text
editor for students. I would like to prevent pasting text format no
applicable in my editor. No problem to prevent pasting an image but if I
have RTF text in the clipboard instead of pure ASCII I have no way to
prevent pasting it...

Andr?



From mdswindell at charter.net  Sun Nov 17 12:16:01 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Sun Nov 17 12:16:01 2002
Subject: Inconsistent variable behavior... help?
In-Reply-To: <001f01c28d82$63a94de0$b7443942@nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <B9FD0D49.386D%mdswindell@charter.net>

Here's an example of some odd behavior I'm experiencing in a stack I'm
working on.  On one card the below script works fine and does the desired
behavior.  I switch cards and get the message "can't find card."  Yet the
variables apparently contain correct values on both cards.  I'm stumped.
(The function of the script is to save some user info on a card in a
substack called "defaults.")

A handler at the stack level called from a button:

put field "wordsAvailable" into fld gMyName of grp "WordsAvailableGroup" of
cd gMySound of stack "defaults"

returns "Can't find card."

gMyName = great
gMySound = bay
__


From gslj at intergate.ca  Sun Nov 17 13:01:01 2002
From: gslj at intergate.ca (Gareth Jones)
Date: Sun Nov 17 13:01:01 2002
Subject: Several questions about the Menu Mgr
In-Reply-To: <v03130306b9fd0bb07740@[10.0.1.3]>
References: <v0313030db9f5eb4eba21@[10.0.1.5]>
 <v0313030db9f5eb4eba21@[10.0.1.5]> <v03130306b9fd0bb07740@[10.0.1.3]>
Message-ID: <a05111a00b9fd87ed5d40@[216.113.201.101]>

Thanks again for this, Jeanne. Of course, since I'm mocking up a 
program's menus, the important thing for me is having the shortcut 
appear to the right of the menu item :-(. However, I'm clipping out 
your handler for future use.

-Gareth

>At 8:06 PM -0800 11/12/02, Gareth Jones wrote:
>>Now, about the other questions: can I specify a keyboard equivalent
>>of a menu item that needs Command+Shiftkey+letter or a Function key
>>(e.g. F2)?
>
>
>You can write handlers to trap these keypresses (see the functionKey and
>commandKey messages), but there's no way I know of as yet to have them
>appear at the right edge of the menu as shortcuts. Your handler would look
>like this:
>
>   on commandKeyDown theKey
>     if the shiftKey is down then
>       switch theKey
>       case "A"
>         -- do whatever you want for command-shift-A
>         break
>       case "D"
>         -- ...
>       default
>         pass commandKeyDown
>       end switch
>     else pass commandKeyDown
>   end commandKey
>
>--
>Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
>Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
>http://www.runrev.com/
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>use-revolution mailing list
>use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From igor at pixelmedia.com.au  Sun Nov 17 13:03:00 2002
From: igor at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor Couto)
Date: Sun Nov 17 13:03:00 2002
Subject: Inappropriate Interface Behaviour during mouseDown
Message-ID: <8C194DFA-F9BD-11D6-AD8C-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Hail Revolution Masters!

I have encountered a problem with the way Revolution implements 
mouseLeave/mouseEnter messages during mouseDown - well, actually, with 
the fact that it does NOT send these messages during mouseDown, 
therefore making the interface behave in an inappropriate manner. I'll 
try to explain better:

According to the Apple interface guidelines, items on the screen should 
give CONSISTENT and APPROPRIATE feedback to the user, guiding the user 
navigation and use of the interface, and indicating as clearly as 
possible what is happening at every instant.

Therefore, the normal behaviour of buttons or clickable items is 
described as follows:
1) The user should have a clear indication that the area they are in is 
a clickable area. This is either done by the use of a graphic element 
that clearly indicates that the area is clickable, or by changing the 
user's cursor when the user enters the clickable area, or by changing 
the appearance of the clickable area when the user is over it, 
therefore alerting the user that the area is 'hot clickable'

2) When the user presses a mouse button down, for which some action is 
programmed to occur, the user should be WARNED/ADVISED that an action 
is about to occur. That is why it is recommended that a change in 
appearance be implemented in a 'mouseDown' event (therefore alerting 
the user), while the actual ACTION itself be implemented in a 'mouseUp' 
event. This is to give the user the chance of 'moving away' while the 
mouse button is still pressed down, in case it was activated by 
accident. This requires that, if the user indeed no longer wants to 
carry out the action, once they move AWAY from the clickable area, the 
appearance should change BACK to its NORMAL or IDLE mode, indicating 
that the user is no longer in 'danger' of triggering the action. 
Similarly, if a user presses a mouse button OUTSIDE a clickable area, 
and then moves the cursor OVER a clickable area, then the clickable 
area should change its appearance, indicating that if the user lets go 
of the mouse at that location, an action will trigger.

The problem in implementing this behaviour in Revolution is that while 
the mouse is down, Revolution does NOT send mouseEnter/mouseLeave 
messages to objects. The 'mouseRelease' message exists, as far as I can 
see, precisely because while the mouse is down, if a user moves AWAY 
from the clickable area, this movement is not detected until AFTER the 
user has RELEASED the mouse. This makes for some 
incongruent/inconsistent behaviour. If a user presses down a button, 
and then moves away, the button should not remain highlighted once the 
cursor moves beyond the button's boundaries. By remaining highlighted, 
the button is telling the user that it is STILL armed and about to 
trigger an action, which is not correct. The reverse (pressing down 
outside the button and then moving onto it) is also true. It SHOULD 
trigger an action, because the user is releasing a button INSIDE the 
clickable area, but that does not happen in Revolution.

I reported this inconsistency to 'support at runrev.com', but I was 
wondering whether:

* Has anyone else noticed this behaviour before, and found a way to 
work around it, in order to obtain the desired interface functionality?
* Does anyone know whether this issue will be addressed in version 2.0?

Your comments and suggestions are much appreciated!

Kind Regards,
--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
info at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From gerardcote at sympatico.ca  Sun Nov 17 13:03:08 2002
From: gerardcote at sympatico.ca (Gerard Cote)
Date: Sun Nov 17 13:03:08 2002
Subject: The RR programming model
References: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0211141928520.15366-100000@titan.ecs.fullerton.edu>
Message-ID: <011901c28e51$333b1380$6501a8c0@p166>

Hi Judy,

My name is Gerard Cote. I'm from Quebec City in Canada.
Since I'm also a newcomer to RunRev and plans to learn and test it soon as a tool for my own teaching (college level), I'll be glad
to help you test your instructional modules, if you want me to do so. So you'll get one more feedback voice before letting your work
go in the hands of other RunRev newbies, especially a K-12 audience.

Don't hesitate to contact me too if you're interested by my offer.

Regards,
Gerard

----- Original Message -----
From: "Judy Perry" <jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2002 10:33 PM
Subject: Re: The RR programming model


> Rod,
>
> I don't know if I told you this previously, but I have entered a second
> master's degree program in instructional design and technology..  Anyway,
> they've approved as a final project for me to design a series of
> tools/tutorials to help acclimate new users to Rev -- particularly
> non-technical types such as new public school teachers.
>
> My first project is a stack which aims to teach the concept of mouse
> events; it is due early December.
>
> Would you be interested in offering any feedback?  These things could
> perhaps be of use in attracting the K-12 market...
>
> Cheers,
>
> Judy
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From Grudet at aol.com  Sun Nov 17 13:03:19 2002
From: Grudet at aol.com (Grudet at aol.com)
Date: Sun Nov 17 13:03:19 2002
Subject: graph and fonction
Message-ID: <123.19f40f42.2b091f30@aol.com>

Please what are the instructions for dysplaying graph functions in a stack
How can i do to plot points and line on a stack by programming 

Thanks for help
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From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Sun Nov 17 13:24:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (Yves =?iso-8859-1?Q?Copp=E9?=)
Date: Sun Nov 17 13:24:01 2002
Subject: graph and fonction
In-Reply-To: <123.19f40f42.2b091f30@aol.com>
References: <123.19f40f42.2b091f30@aol.com>
Message-ID: <p05111700b9fd8d2999f4@[10.0.1.204]>

>Please what are the instructions for dysplaying graph functions in a stack
>How can i do to plot points and line on a stack by programming
>
>Thanks for help

Kenneth L. Simons has written a stack named : "Graph object"

I don't know his website adress anymore.

But it answers all your needs.

Can anybody gives the adress ?

if not, contact me off-list and I'll send you the stack.
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be
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From wmb at internettrainer.com  Sun Nov 17 13:30:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Sun Nov 17 13:30:01 2002
Subject: swf files?
In-Reply-To: <884C328C-F965-11D6-9150-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>
Message-ID: <B4AD6BA2-FA59-11D6-A719-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Samstag, November 16, 2002, at 02:15  Uhr, Klaus Major wrote:

>> Sometimes I think MM will let it die slowly together with Director 
>> and blow Flash then up with a Pro version up to a new Director...
> Interesting point...
> I would not be surprised.

"Director is on the Xpress trip..."
>
> The next (OS X) version of Director is announced for
> mid 2003 ! We'll see...
Later than Xpress thats why I believe that...

>
> But i would rather like some more animation features in MC/RR.
> The "Animation Manager", well, ehmmm, nice try... ;-)
> And we can rotate images now (again ;-)
;)
I m not an Animation expert, but I have seen nice tools: ToonBoom 
Studio, Axel

> Anyway, thank to QT, we can have Flash, if we like...
Yes but in this case I loose the biggest argument for rev: really 
crossplatform. An d hav eteh installation problem. IS there a rev 
sniffer for the installed QT version and an automatic installer stack 
for  QT..?

On the Desktop Linux is crowing now more rapidly. There are a really 
nice examples for that. The spanish government of province junta de 
Extremadura has thrown out all M$ product and replace them with Linux...
Con respecto! Mis hijos de la pata negra..!
And there is the government of Norway and others...
And as I know there is no QT for Linux or I m wrong...? And interactive 
QT. I have a version of Livestage Pro,
> a really wonderful piece of software !!!
Agree! I had a first look at it and it looks really great. Seems that 
it can do everything with and on QT. Here it did import the swf based 
viewlets like no other tool...

> And with the addition of "the qtdebugstring" we can even have
> some kind of interactivity between QT/Flash and MC/RR.
But if I go QT. What can rev+QT do what LSP cant do apart from the 
*nixens...
Is there more..? Database connectivity?

>>> Have a nice weekend.
>> Danke, das werd ich jetzt brauchen, weniger nice daf?r mehr busy...;))
> OK, aber ?bertreib's nicht (don't overdrive it :-D

Schon passiert. Der Hasenlauf is beinahe angebrannt und die Pasta so 
weich geworden, da? man sie nur mehr durch trinken aus dem Topf 
bekommen w?rde, brrrr... =:o(

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From bornstein at designeq.com  Sun Nov 17 13:44:01 2002
From: bornstein at designeq.com (Howard Bornstein)
Date: Sun Nov 17 13:44:01 2002
Subject: Inconsistent variable behavior... help?
Message-ID: <200211171838.gAHIcJk00963@mailout6-0.nyroc.rr.com>

>put the number of cd gMySound of stack defaults
>returns: "Can't find card"

I set up a little stack called Defaults with a card called "bay" and set 
a global gMySound = "bay"

When I executed this statement: <put the number of cd gMySound of stack 
"defaults">, RR returned 1.

Could your card name have a space before or after it (ditto for the 
global)?

Howard Bornstein
____________________
D E S I G N  E Q
www.designeq.com


From troy at rpsystems.net  Sun Nov 17 14:21:00 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Sun Nov 17 14:21:00 2002
Subject: swf files?
In-Reply-To: <B4AD6BA2-FA59-11D6-A719-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <B9FD54DF.16673%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/17/02 1:23 PM, "Wolfgang M. Bereuter" <wmb at internettrainer.com> wrote:

>> And with the addition of "the qtdebugstring" we can even have
>> some kind of interactivity between QT/Flash and MC/RR.
> But if I go QT. What can rev+QT do what LSP cant do apart from the
> *nixens...
> Is there more..? Database connectivity?

Hmm. What can Rev and QT do that QT alone can't? I think that is the
question, since LSP is just a means of programming the QT. So this is not
really about LSP or Rev, it is about QT (LSP) + Rev, compared to QT (LSP)
alone.

The first issue - QuickTime cannot save local files. It can send and receive
data through QT lists, and you can save that data on a server, but you can't
save it locally.

QT does support database connectivity, but not directly, it must be
processed by a server-side script.

Text handling is extremely limited in QT alone, unless you combine in Flash
tracks, but now you need to know Flash, and LSP, and your project planning
must be more complex.

QT is not very fast at programmatic operations.

While LSP has a good scripting language, Rev's is far more capable and
easier to learn.

There are other weaknesses, but wrapping a nice QT that has been
"pre-programmed" in LSP inside a Rev app (or iShell) certainly allows you to
hide any weaknesses of QT and allow the strengths to show.

Cheers.
-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sun Nov 17 14:45:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sun Nov 17 14:45:01 2002
Subject: How can I empty the clipboard?
In-Reply-To: <B9FD89B6.94EC%andre.rombauts@win.be>
Message-ID: <20021117193842.15293.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Andre Rombauts <andre.rombauts at win.be> wrote:
> Le 17/11/2002 17:42, Jan Schenkel ?
> janschenkel at yahoo.com a ?crit:
> 
> > There's no real way of doing that as far as I
> know.
> > Besides, it's not really user-friendly is it?
> > The question is: what are you trying to
> accomplish?
> 
> Just set the clipboard to "nodata" when starting an
> new session in a text
> editor for students. I would like to prevent pasting
> text format no
> applicable in my editor. No problem to prevent
> pasting an image but if I
> have RTF text in the clipboard instead of pure ASCII
> I have no way to
> prevent pasting it...
> 
> Andr?
> 

Hi Andre,

How about this in your field script:

on pasteKey
  send "plainText" to me in 1 tick
  -- strip of the style elements after pasting
  pass pasteKey
end pasteKey

on plainText
  lock screen
  -- strip of any style elements from the content,
  -- thus leaving only the ones set in the field 
  -- itself or in the runtime environment
  set the textHeight of char 1 to -1 of me to empty
  set the textFont of char 1 to -1 of me to empty
  set the textColor of char 1 to -1 of me to empty
  set the textShift of char 1 to -1 of me to empty
  set the textStyle of char 1 to -1 of me to empty
  set the textStyle of char 1 to -1 of me to empty
  -- possibly a few more, you'll have to check
  unlock screen
end plainText

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sun Nov 17 14:55:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sun Nov 17 14:55:01 2002
Subject: How can I empty the clipboard?
References: <B9FD81DE.94DA%andre.rombauts@win.be>
Message-ID: <06ec01c28e71$b827a610$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Try this:

on mouseUp
  select empty
  cut
end mouseUp

That should clear the clipboard...

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Andre Rombauts" <andre.rombauts at win.be>
To: "revolution" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 17, 2002 10:26 AM
Subject: How can I empty the clipboard?


If I use:

on mouseUp
      put empty into field "Dummy"
      select the text of field "Dummy"
      copy
end mouseUp

The clipboard is not emptied because no text was selected since the field
?Dummy is empty... So how do I proceed?...

Andr? Rombauts



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sun Nov 17 14:58:02 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sun Nov 17 14:58:02 2002
Subject: graph and fonction
References: <123.19f40f42.2b091f30@aol.com>
Message-ID: <06f801c28e72$14c55d90$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Check out the download called "Graph and Table Objects" by Kenneth Simons
and Tuviah Snyder. It includes a bunch of graphing capabilities:

http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm and click on
"Downloads" or scroll to the bottom of the page.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: <Grudet at aol.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 17, 2002 10:34 AM
Subject: graph and fonction


> Please what are the instructions for dysplaying graph functions in a stack
> How can i do to plot points and line on a stack by programming
>
> Thanks for help
>



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sun Nov 17 15:02:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sun Nov 17 15:02:01 2002
Subject: Inappropriate Interface Behaviour during mouseDown
References: <8C194DFA-F9BD-11D6-AD8C-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <06fd01c28e72$9652a610$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Igor,

> If a user presses down a button,
> and then moves away, the button should not remain highlighted once the
> cursor moves beyond the button's boundaries.

In my checking, it doesn't. If you make a standard button (so that it
includes the autohilite property), if you mouseDown on the button it is
depressed. If you then move the mouse outside the boundaries of the button,
it "pops out" again. Are you not getting this behavior?

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sun Nov 17 15:06:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sun Nov 17 15:06:01 2002
Subject: swf files?
References: <B4AD6BA2-FA59-11D6-A719-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <070401c28e73$3af47e00$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> > Anyway, thank to QT, we can have Flash, if we like...
> Yes but in this case I loose the biggest argument for rev: really
> crossplatform. An d hav eteh installation problem. IS there a rev
> sniffer for the installed QT version and an automatic installer stack
> for  QT..?

Yes, check out the QTVersion() function. As far as an installer stack for
QT, you'd need to download the installer from Apple and then cause your Rev
app to launch the installer if QTVersion() returns an "old" result.

> And as I know there is no QT for Linux or I m wrong...?

No, there's no version of QT for Linux; there are several "converters" that
will convert QT to a form that can be played in Linux under another player,
but you can't use those inside Rev as a "player" object.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From raney at metacard.com  Sun Nov 17 16:29:01 2002
From: raney at metacard.com (Scott Raney)
Date: Sun Nov 17 16:29:01 2002
Subject: Inappropriate Interface Behaviour during mouseDown
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211171412110.2971-100000@mast.metacard.com>

> The problem in implementing this behaviour in Revolution is that
> while the mouse is down, Revolution does NOT send
> mouseEnter/mouseLeave messages to objects. The 'mouseRelease'
> message exists, as far as I can see, precisely because while the
> mouse is down, if a user moves AWAY from the clickable area, this
> movement is not detected until AFTER the user has RELEASED the
> mouse. This makes for some incongruent/inconsistent behaviour. If a
> user presses down a button, and then moves away, the button should
> not remain highlighted once the cursor moves beyond the button's
> boundaries. By remaining highlighted, the button is telling the user
> that it is STILL armed and about to trigger an action, which is not
> correct. The reverse (pressing down outside the button and then
> moving onto it) is also true. It SHOULD trigger an action, because
> the user is releasing a button INSIDE the clickable area, but that
> does not happen in Revolution.

What you're talking about is called "tracking" in GUI jargon.  Buttons
with automatic behavior do tracking automatically, and you can even
have them change icons automatically (see armedIcon, hilitedIcon,
etc.).  If the automatic behavior doesn't do what you need, then
you'll have to handle the tracking yourself using the mouseMove
message (e.g, "if x, y is within the rect of me then ...")

Secondly, when a mouse button is pressed down in a control, that
control gets a "grab" on the mouse such that all mouse messages go to
that object until the mouse button is released.  This is a core
behavior of all GUI systems, and is why all mouseMove messages go to
that control and why mouseEnter/mouseLeave messages are not sent: From
the perspective of that control it still "owns" the mouse and so the
mouse can never "leave".  This is a feature, not a bug.
  Regards,
    Scott

********************************************************
Scott Raney  raney at metacard.com  http://www.metacard.com
MetaCard: You know, there's an easier way to do that...



From tsj at unimelb.edu.au  Sun Nov 17 17:07:01 2002
From: tsj at unimelb.edu.au (Terry Judd)
Date: Sun Nov 17 17:07:01 2002
Subject: swf files? (OT)
In-Reply-To: <7C45F948-F91A-11D6-8A9F-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>
References: <7C45F948-F91A-11D6-8A9F-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>
Message-ID: <a05100302b9fdc1a20aec@[203.134.22.107]>

>>Do you really see such an importance for shockwave like for flash?
>>Imho the filesize is to big. Flash is a killer because of its small size...
>>Sometimes I think MM will let it die slowly together with Director 
>>and blow Flash then up with a Pro version up to a new Director...
>
>Not really. Directory is mainly useful for multimedia CDs using 
>pixel pictures. Because of the popularity of the internet, the glory 
>days of the multimedia CD are over. But there is still use for 
>Directory, especially when you think about DVD menus. (I don't know 
>if Directory can do that, but it could be(come) a handy tool for 
>it).  Shockwave is a way to bring these multimedia projects to the 
>internet. However, because file sizes are much more important on the 
>internet than on CD, Shockwave is never really efficient.

You can already author for DVDs using Director. Shockwave/Director 
also supports a truckload of features (= interactivity) that Flash 
doesn't, which don't necessarily involve manipulating bitmap images. 
As always, it's horses for courses.

Cheers,

Terry...
-- 
------------------------------------------------
Dr Terry Judd
Biomedical Multimedia Unit
Faculty of Medicine, Dentistry & Health Sciences
The University of Melbourne
AUSTRALIA
------------------------------------------------


From sanke at hrz.uni-kassel.de  Sun Nov 17 17:14:01 2002
From: sanke at hrz.uni-kassel.de (Wilhelm Sanke)
Date: Sun Nov 17 17:14:01 2002
Subject: graph and fonction
Message-ID: <3DD81333.6E37D43E@hrz.uni-kassel.de>

On Sun, 17 Nov 2002,  Grudet at aol.com wrote

> Please what are the instructions for dysplaying graph functions in a stack
> How can i do to plot points and line on a stack by programming
>
> Thanks for help
>
Hello,

here is an example to draw functions from a stack used to introduce
students:


- The first sript sets the values for the coordinates (and is then
called from the first mouseup-handler):

on Koordinaten
   choose line tool
  drag from (10 , 125) to (370, 125)
  drag from (10 , 0) to (10 , 250)
  set the width of the templateField to 25
  set the height of the templateField to 25
  set the textAlign of the templateField to "center"
  set the opaque of the templateField to false
  set the showBorder of the templateField to false
end Koordinaten

- the x- and y-axis is drawn:

on mouseUp
 call Koordinaten of this stack
  create field "y-1"
  set the loc of field "y-1" to (10 , 25)
  put "1" into field "y-1"
  create field "x-180"
  set the loc of field "x-180" to (190 , 125)
  put "180" into field "x-180"
  choose browser tool
  set the layer of image 1 to 1
end mouseUp

- a sinus curve is drawn:

on mouseUp
   choose line tool
  drag from (10 , 125) to (370, 125)
  choose curve tool
  repeat with i = 0 to  360
    put ( -sin(i * pi / 180)) into yeins
    put ( -sin((i + 1) * pi / 180)) into yzwei
    drag from (i + 10 , 125 + 100 * yeins) to ((i + 10 + 1), 125 + 100 *
yzwei)
  end repeat
  choose browser tool
  set the layer of image 1 to 1
end mouseUp

Parts of these scripts could be simplified.

Hope this information is helpful.

Regards,

Wilhelm Sanke



From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Sun Nov 17 18:28:01 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Sun Nov 17 18:28:01 2002
Subject: Inappropriate Interface Behaviour during mouseDown
In-Reply-To: <06fd01c28e72$9652a610$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <7CF8265A-1E59-11B2-9EED-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Revolution Folks,

Thank you for your feedback to:

>> If a user presses down a button,
>> and then moves away, the button should not remain highlighted once the
>> cursor moves beyond the button's boundaries.


 From Ken Ray:

> In my checking, it doesn't. If you make a standard button (so that it
> includes the autohilite property), if you mouseDown on the button it is
> depressed. If you then move the mouse outside the boundaries of the 
> button,
> it "pops out" again. Are you not getting this behavior?
>

 From Scott Raney:

> What you're talking about is called "tracking" in GUI jargon.  Buttons
> with automatic behavior do tracking automatically, and you can even
> have them change icons automatically (see armedIcon, hilitedIcon,
> etc.).  If the automatic behavior doesn't do what you need, then
> you'll have to handle the tracking yourself using the mouseMove
> message (e.g, "if x, y is within the rect of me then ...")

Indeed, I do get this behaviour as well. It DOES work for buttons.
However, if you try to setup a 'custom button' using image objects 
(which is what I am working on, as these buttons have to have irregular 
clickable areas), and try to implement this behaviour by scripting 
mouse events (I am changing the image's alpha and imageData on the 
appropriate mouseUp/Down/Enter/Leave/Release messages), then it does 
NOT behave as expected.

 From Scott Raney:

> Secondly, when a mouse button is pressed down in a control, that
> control gets a "grab" on the mouse such that all mouse messages go to
> that object until the mouse button is released.  This is a core
> behavior of all GUI systems, and is why all mouseMove messages go to
> that control and why mouseEnter/mouseLeave messages are not sent: From
> the perspective of that control it still "owns" the mouse and so the
> mouse can never "leave".  This is a feature, not a bug.

I must admit, in my limited view, I fail to see how this implementation 
can be seen as a 'feature'. I fail to see why a control needs to 'own' 
the mouse until it is released. I (perhaps foolishly) thought that the 
appropriate message should be passed to whatever control happens to be 
underneath the mouse at a certain point in time, NOT to the last 
control where the mouse button was held down... If I put 3 buttons next 
to each other, press the mouse down on the first, and while still 
holding it down, move over the other 2 buttons, should they highlight? 
If so, then they MUST be able to receive messages as well. Otherwise, 
the 'owner' of the button (which is the first button) would be the only 
one receiving the messages, and my other 2 buttons would not highlight, 
even though now my mouse is pressed firmly down over one of them...

It seems to me that this implementation is also quite inefficient (it 
requires that a 'mouseRelease' message be implemented as well, while in 
other systems that message is unnecessary), and it is probably the 
reason why we've observed the unexpected behaviour of controls on 
hiding/showing objects from under the mouse (I can see now that the 
hidden object still 'owns' the mouse).

Hmmm, if this was implemented this way, I know that there must be 
situations where this kind of behaviour might be seen as useful, 
however I must confess I can't think of any. I would rather have the 
engine behave as expected, and be able to work with one less message. 
In theory, I should have been able to implement my wanted behaviour 
simply by hiding/showing the appropriate images from under the cursor 
(on mouseEnter/Leave/Down). If you have been following the discussion 
on this list (the topic was "Showing/Hiding images on mouseLeave...") 
you will see that this is currently not possible.

In regards to using 'mouseMove' to track mouse position relative to the 
'owner' control: considering that Revolution's built-in 'button' 
control DOES do the tracking as expected, and that the same tracking 
seemed to be currently impossible to implement via script on other 
controls (ie, image controls), I assumed that the error was in how the 
script language (and its handling of messages) was implemented. As a 
novice to Revolution, I surely would not have thought of using 
'mouseMove', as this seems to be a fairly low-level way of implementing 
simple button functionality: ie, why should I have to continuously work 
out if the mouse is still in the rect of the image, if there is a 
'mouseLeave' message that should be telling me just that? Also, using 
mouseMove makes it much harder to track irregularly shaped images (more 
complex scripts that check the alphaData on a certain pixel are 
needed), and it does not cover situations where the image is set to be 
'hidden' via script from under the mouse (which SHOULD trigger a 
'mouseLeave' message).

Yes, it might well be that I am not being able to see some incredibly 
useful functionality that has been given to us by the current 
implementation of the mouse messaging scheme in Revolution - but from 
this newbie's perspective, it does indeed feel like a 'bug'... not a 
'feature'...

Kind Regards,
--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
info at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Sun Nov 17 20:24:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Sun Nov 17 20:24:01 2002
Subject: graph and fonction
In-Reply-To: <a05111af4b9fdc48a87c2@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <5C66DC10-FA93-11D6-82E4-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

Will these scripts will work, they will be quite slow as they drag from 
point to point. A faster way is to create a single polygon object and 
set it's points to your coordinates.

on mouseUp
   -- this creates a graphic to show the chart.
   if there is not a grc "Chart" then
     create grc "Chart"
     choose browse tool
   end if
   set the style of grc "Chart" to "polygon"

   -- this creates a blue cross-shaped marker for the points.
   set the markerPoints of grc "Chart" to "0,2" & cr & "4,2" & cr & "" & 
cr & "2,0" & cr & "2,4"
   set the hiliteColor of grc "Chart" to "blue"

   -- the points of the graphic are stored in this list
   put empty into thePoints

   -- the main loop just sets the points rather than drawing as it goes
   repeat with i = 0 to  360
     -- calculate the x & y coordinates of each point here
     put xPoint & comma & yPoint & cr after thePoints
   end repeat

   -- implement the drawing in a single step
   set the points of grc "Chart" to thePoints
end mouseUp

Cheers,
Sarah


On Monday, November 18, 2002, at 08:11  am, Wilhelm Sanke wrote:

> On Sun, 17 Nov 2002,  Grudet at aol.com wrote
>
>> Please what are the instructions for dysplaying graph functions in a 
>> stack
>> How can i do to plot points and line on a stack by programming
>>
>> Thanks for help
>>
> Hello,
>
> here is an example to draw functions from a stack used to introduce
> students:
>
>
> - The first sript sets the values for the coordinates (and is then
> called from the first mouseup-handler):
>
> on Koordinaten
>    choose line tool
>   drag from (10 , 125) to (370, 125)
>   drag from (10 , 0) to (10 , 250)
>   set the width of the templateField to 25
>   set the height of the templateField to 25
>   set the textAlign of the templateField to "center"
>   set the opaque of the templateField to false
>   set the showBorder of the templateField to false
> end Koordinaten
>
> - the x- and y-axis is drawn:
>
> on mouseUp
>  call Koordinaten of this stack
>   create field "y-1"
>   set the loc of field "y-1" to (10 , 25)
>   put "1" into field "y-1"
>   create field "x-180"
>   set the loc of field "x-180" to (190 , 125)
>   put "180" into field "x-180"
>   choose browser tool
>   set the layer of image 1 to 1
> end mouseUp
>
> - a sinus curve is drawn:
>
> on mouseUp
>    choose line tool
>   drag from (10 , 125) to (370, 125)
>   choose curve tool
>   repeat with i = 0 to  360
>     put ( -sin(i * pi / 180)) into yeins
>     put ( -sin((i + 1) * pi / 180)) into yzwei
>     drag from (i + 10 , 125 + 100 * yeins) to ((i + 10 + 1), 125 + 100 
> *
> yzwei)
>   end repeat
>   choose browser tool
>   set the layer of image 1 to 1
> end mouseUp
>
> Parts of these scripts could be simplified.
>
> Hope this information is helpful.
>
> Regards,
>
> Wilhelm Sanke
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Sun Nov 17 20:25:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Sun Nov 17 20:25:01 2002
Subject: Inconsistent variable behavior... help?
In-Reply-To: <a05111a9fb9fd7e390cb3@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <95A436E8-FA93-11D6-82E4-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

What happens if you surround the card name with quotes?
put field "wordsAvailable" into fld gMyName of grp 
"WordsAvailableGroup" of \
cd quote & gMySound & quote of stack "defaults"

Maybe you are using bay as a variable name as well as a card name so it 
is looking for the wrong card.

Sarah

On Monday, November 18, 2002, at 03:11  am, Mark Swindell wrote:

> Here's an example of some odd behavior I'm experiencing in a stack I'm
> working on.  On one card the below script works fine and does the 
> desired
> behavior.  I switch cards and get the message "can't find card."  Yet 
> the
> variables apparently contain correct values on both cards.  I'm 
> stumped.
> (The function of the script is to save some user info on a card in a
> substack called "defaults.")
>
> A handler at the stack level called from a button:
>
> put field "wordsAvailable" into fld gMyName of grp 
> "WordsAvailableGroup" of
> cd gMySound of stack "defaults"
>
> returns "Can't find card."
>
> gMyName = great
> gMySound = bay
> __
>
>> From the message box I get the following results:
>
> put the number of cd gMySound of stack defaults
> returns: "Can't find card"
> __
> put gMySound
> returns "bay"
> __
> put the number of cd bay of stack defaults
> returns "2"
> __
>
>
> What am I doing wrong?  Any insight?
>
> Thanks,
> Mark
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From mdswindell at charter.net  Sun Nov 17 23:52:01 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Sun Nov 17 23:52:01 2002
Subject: Inconsistent variable behavior... help?
In-Reply-To: <200211171838.gAHIcJk00963@mailout6-0.nyroc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <B9FDB045.38B9%mdswindell@charter.net>

on 11/17/02 10:38 AM, Howard Bornstein at bornstein at designeq.com wrote:

>> put the number of cd gMySound of stack defaults
>> returns: "Can't find card"
> 
> I set up a little stack called Defaults with a card called "bay" and set
> a global gMySound = "bay"
> 
> When I executed this statement: <put the number of cd gMySound of stack
> "defaults">, RR returned 1.
> 
> Could your card name have a space before or after it (ditto for the
> global)?
> 
> Howard Bornstein


Howard and Sarah, 

Thanks for your responses.  Howard, you nailed it, it seems.  The variable
was picked up from a field which had somehow got returns entered after the
word "bay."  It was apparently those invisible returns that confused the
issue.

Much obliged to both for your time and troubleshooting.

Mark



From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Mon Nov 18 01:13:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Mon Nov 18 01:13:01 2002
Subject: talk/voice service?
In-Reply-To: <a05200a01b9fc77cb3c44@[128.196.99.222]>
References: <a0510030cb9f83c8c53b8@[216.229.107.120]>
 <a05200a01b9fc77cb3c44@[128.196.99.222]>
Message-ID: <a05200a00b9fced69cd39@[128.196.99.222]>

hello:  does anybody know about a way to have RR 'say' numbers, i.e. 
have a stack pronounce numbers.  the numbers vary, so prerecording 
'chunks' and later assembling them might be too big of a hassle. 
thanks for your help.  best, olli.


From irog at mac.com  Mon Nov 18 04:05:01 2002
From: irog at mac.com (irog at mac.com)
Date: Mon Nov 18 04:05:01 2002
Subject: Sound file formats
Message-ID: <7660902C-FA92-11D6-BD57-000393A1CAAA@mac.com>

Hi folks.

I'm new to this list.  can you tell me what sound file formats beside 
aiff are supported?  I'm developing on Mac OS X.  Do I need to convert 
sound files to WAV files for publishing to Windows?

Thanks, Roger



From jan.decroos at groepvanroey.be  Mon Nov 18 05:03:01 2002
From: jan.decroos at groepvanroey.be (Jan Decroos)
Date: Mon Nov 18 05:03:01 2002
Subject: repeat string: how ?
In-Reply-To: <200211160200.VAA18124@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211160200.VAA18124@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <fc.0073fc460009ee683b9aca00b281566d.9ee7b@groepvanroey.be>

use-revolution at lists.runrev.com writes:
>repeat string: how? (Alex Rice)

We use a function which can be used to initialize of list of strings or numbers.

Use it like :
	initcontainer("n",50)			--> returns a list of 50 lines from 1 to 50
	initcontainer("n",50,101)			--> returns a list of 50 lines from 101 to 150
	initcontainer("n",50,101,2)		--> returns a list of 50 lines from 101 to 199
(step 2)
	initcontainer("n",50,101,2,comma)	--> returns a list of 50 items from 101 to
199

	initcontainer("s",50,"Revolution")	--> returns a list of 50 lines each with
"Revolution"
	initcontainer("s",50,"Revolution",tab)	--> returns a list of 50 tab separated
'items' "Revolution"

This prevents re-scripting repeat loops again and again....


function InitContainer pKind, pNum
  if pNum <= 0 then return("")
  if pKind = "s" then put "t" into pKind
  put CR into lSeparator
  if (pKind = "t" and (the paramCount < 3 or the paramCount > 4)) or (pKind =
"n" and (the paramCount < 2 or the paramCount > 5)) then StopWithMessage
"Invalid number of arguments !"
  if pKind = "t" then
    put the param of 3 into lValue
    if the ParamCount = 4 then
      put the param of 4 into lSeparator
    end if
  else
    put 1 into lValue
    put 1 into lStep
    if the ParamCount >= 3 then
      if the param of 3 is a number then
        put the param of 3 into lValue
        if the ParamCount >= 4 then
          if the param of 4 is a number then
            put the param of 4 into lStep
            if the ParamCount = 5 then
              put the param of 5 into lSeparator
            end if
          else put the param of 4 into lSeparator
        end if
      else put the param of 3 into lSeparator
    end if
  end if
  if pKind = "n" then put "add lStep to lValue" into lAddStep
  else put "" into lAddStep
  put "" into lResult
  do "repeat pNum-1"&CR&\
      "  put lValue&lSeparator after lResult"&CR&\
      "  "&lAddStep&CR&\
      "end repeat"
  put lValue after lResult
  return(lResult)
end InitContainer

Jan



From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Mon Nov 18 08:24:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Mon Nov 18 08:24:01 2002
Subject: dates count
Message-ID: <p05100300b9fe98158f2e@[10.0.1.202]>

Hello,

I have a fld "dates" with a list of years sorted descending:
(the list has more than 1000 lines)
...
2002
2002
2001
1997
1997
1995
1994
...

I'd like to know how much dates per 10 years

00-10 : 75
11-20 : 58
...
...


here is my script :

on mouseUp
   put fld "dates" into tDates
   put the short date into toDay
   convert toDay to dateItems
   put item 1 of toDay into thisYear
   put "0" into a
   put thisYear-10 into thisYear
   put empty into tResult
    repeat for each line L in tDates
     if L ? thisYear then
       add "1" to a
     else
       put a&cr after tResult
       put "1" into a
       put thisYear-10 into thisYear
     end if
   end repeat
   answer tResult
end mouseUp

but my result "tResult" is not correct

can anyone help me ???
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From kkaufman at snet.net  Mon Nov 18 08:29:00 2002
From: kkaufman at snet.net (Kurt Kaufman)
Date: Mon Nov 18 08:29:00 2002
Subject: talk/voice service?
Message-ID: <BE31131A-FAF8-11D6-980E-0003936D1F12@snet.net>

On Mac OS and OSX you can use Applescript to interface with the Mac's 
text-to-speech voices. On Windows 2000 (and XP?) there is something 
called "Narrator" which will read text. However, I'm not sure how it is 
accessed from within an application.

Applescript demo:
?Prepare a field named "speaktext"
?Type some text into it.
?Create a button and paste the following into its script window:


on mouseUp
   answer "Please choose a voice..." with "Princess" or "Fred" or 
"Zarvox" or "Junior" or "Ralph" or "Trinoids" or "Kathy"
   put it into selVoice
put fld "speaktext" into myVar
Do "say " &quote& myVar &quote& " using " &quote& selVoice &quote as 
Applescript
end mouseUp

(beware possible wraparound:  the line beginning with "answer" ends 
with "Kathy"; the line beginning with "Do" ends with "Applescript")

HTH, Kurt



From jhurley at infostations.com  Mon Nov 18 10:08:00 2002
From: jhurley at infostations.com (Jim Hurley)
Date: Mon Nov 18 10:08:00 2002
Subject: graph and function
In-Reply-To: <200211181007.FAA14089@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211181007.FAA14089@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <a0510030ab9feabf94142@[66.81.56.118]>

Wilhelm Sanke wrote:
>
>Hello,
>
>here is an example to draw functions from a stack used to introduce
>students:
>
>
>- The first sript sets the values for the coordinates (and is then
>called from the first mouseup-handler):
>
>on Koordinaten
>    choose line tool
>   drag from (10 , 125) to (370, 125)
>   drag from (10 , 0) to (10 , 250)
>   set the width of the templateField to 25
>   set the height of the templateField to 25
>   set the textAlign of the templateField to "center"
>   set the opaque of the templateField to false
>   set the showBorder of the templateField to false
>end Koordinaten


etc.

There is a tool which is very useful in introducing students to 
graphics and that is Turtle Graphics first introduced in Logo. It is 
not difficult to implement in Rev as well.

For example, to draw a sine curve with an amplitude of 100 pixels, 
the button script would be:

On mouseUp
   StartTurtle -- initiate Turtle Graphics
   repeat with a = 0 to 360
     setxy a, 100*sine(a)
   end repeat
end mosueUP

Where "StartTurtle" and  "sine()" have been defined for the students 
in the stack script. ("Sine" differs from "Sin")

function sine a
   return sin(pi/180* a)
end sine

The axes may be drawn with such simple statements as "Forward 100" 
and "Setheading 90"
-- 
Jim Hurley


From harrison at all-auctions.com  Mon Nov 18 10:48:01 2002
From: harrison at all-auctions.com (Rick Harrison)
Date: Mon Nov 18 10:48:01 2002
Subject: Sound file formats
In-Reply-To: <7660902C-FA92-11D6-BD57-000393A1CAAA@mac.com>
Message-ID: <B9FE7483.1EDD%harrison@all-auctions.com>

on 11/17/2002 8:10 PM, irog at mac.com at irog at mac.com wrote:

> Hi folks.
> 
> I'm new to this list.  can you tell me what sound file formats beside
> aiff are supported?  I'm developing on Mac OS X.  Do I need to convert
> sound files to WAV files for publishing to Windows?
> 
> Thanks, Roger
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Roger,

No you do not have to convert for windows.

AIFF works fine on both platforms.  Make sure
your path names for telling the computer where
to find your files is correct.

Good Luck!

Rick Harrison



From rcozens at pon.net  Mon Nov 18 10:58:08 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Mon Nov 18 10:58:08 2002
Subject: Inappropriate Interface Behaviour during mouseDown
In-Reply-To: <8C194DFA-F9BD-11D6-AD8C-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
References: <8C194DFA-F9BD-11D6-AD8C-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05100302b9feb8b1c903@[216.229.107.238]>

>* Has anyone else noticed this behaviour before, and found a way to 
>work around it, in order to obtain the desired interface 
>functionality?

Hi Igor,

You can achieve most of the functionality without scripting by 
assigning multiple icons to a button and setting "arm on mouseEnter" 
property.

You can also script mouse events to change the background color 
and/or hilite of the button.

The one exception I noted is:

>>
Similarly, if a user presses a mouse button OUTSIDE a clickable area, 
and then moves the cursor OVER a clickable area, then the clickable 
area should change its appearance, indicating that if the user lets 
go of the mouse at that location, an action will trigger.
<<

Frankly, I don't believe I've ever seen this implemented, and I 
really question whether it is desirable behavior.  The reasoning for 
using mouseUp instead of mouseDown to trigger an event is so a user 
can reverse the mouseDown action without triggering the event by 
moving the mouse outside the control before releasing it.  The idea 
of triggering an event by holding the mouse down before entering a 
control and releasing it once it is over the control seems totally 
foreign and non-intuitive to me (except for pull-down menus).
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Mon Nov 18 11:12:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Mon Nov 18 11:12:01 2002
Subject: Repeatloop in mouseDown handler wont end
In-Reply-To: <20021015112602.65211.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021015112602.65211.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <a05100303b9febf4e56d3@[216.229.107.47]>

>on mouseRelease
>   if "updateMe" is in the pendingMessages then
>     cancel "updateMe"
>   end if
>end mouseRelease

Just curious, Jan,

The Rev Dictionary states the argument to cancel is the id of the 
message (though it then gives an example referencing a line from 
pendingMessages).  It does not show or mention cancelling an event by 
name.  I trust it works, or you would not have posted this.

BTW, someone posted something along the lines of:

    send "someMessage" to me in x seconds
    put it into messageId

a few days ago.  This will NOT work: the second line should be "put 
the result into messageId".
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From wmb at internettrainer.com  Mon Nov 18 11:34:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Mon Nov 18 11:34:01 2002
Subject: swf files?
In-Reply-To: <B9FD54DF.16673%troy@rpsystems.net>
Message-ID: <AC080001-FB12-11D6-BA4E-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Sonntag, November 17, 2002, at 08:14  Uhr, Troy Rollins wrote:
Thanks
Troy, Ken, Klaus, Richard, Terry for you great explications about 
handling swf files.
It helps a lot...

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Mon Nov 18 11:38:00 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Mon Nov 18 11:38:00 2002
Subject: Repeatloop in mouseDown handler wont end
In-Reply-To: <a05100303b9febf4e56d3@[216.229.107.47]>
Message-ID: <20021118163130.1620.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Rob Cozens <rcozens at pon.net> wrote:
> >on mouseRelease
> >   if "updateMe" is in the pendingMessages then
> >     cancel "updateMe"
> >   end if
> >end mouseRelease
> 
> Just curious, Jan,
> 
> The Rev Dictionary states the argument to cancel is
> the id of the 
> message (though it then gives an example referencing
> a line from 
> pendingMessages).  It does not show or mention
> cancelling an event by 
> name.  I trust it works, or you would not have
> posted this.
> 
> BTW, someone posted something along the lines of:
> 
>     send "someMessage" to me in x seconds
>     put it into messageId
> 
> a few days ago.  This will NOT work: the second line
> should be "put 
> the result into messageId".
>

Hi Rob,

You are of course absolutely right. Both these things
must have slipped by me (probably because I never have
to cancel my messages anyway ;-)

Thanks for the heads-up.

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From themacguy at macosx.com  Mon Nov 18 12:32:01 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Mon Nov 18 12:32:01 2002
Subject: Inappropriate mouse behavior...
In-Reply-To: <200211181702.MAA21198@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <B4DD3B67-FB1A-11D6-8694-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

The behavior as described below is contrary to Apple's human interface 
design guidelines. It also provides a "trigger" that is exactly the 
opposite of all other Mac and Windows programs. If one is looking to 
have lots of negative feedback from one's customers, do this.

Barry

On Monday, November 18, 2002, at 10:02 AM, 
use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote:

> Similarly, if a user presses a mouse button OUTSIDE a clickable area,
> and then moves the cursor OVER a clickable area, then the clickable
> area should change its appearance, indicating that if the user lets
> go of the mouse at that location, an action will trigger.
> <<
>
---------------------------------------------



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Mon Nov 18 13:00:00 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Mon Nov 18 13:00:00 2002
Subject: Sound file formats
References: <B9FE7483.1EDD%harrison@all-auctions.com>
Message-ID: <002b01c28f24$ed401630$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

You can also use any sound format supported by QuickTime and run it through
a player object (MIDI, AIF, WAV, etc.)

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick Harrison" <harrison at all-auctions.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Monday, November 18, 2002 9:42 AM
Subject: Re: Sound file formats


> on 11/17/2002 8:10 PM, irog at mac.com at irog at mac.com wrote:
>
> > Hi folks.
> >
> > I'm new to this list.  can you tell me what sound file formats beside
> > aiff are supported?  I'm developing on Mac OS X.  Do I need to convert
> > sound files to WAV files for publishing to Windows?
> >
> > Thanks, Roger
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > use-revolution mailing list
> > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>
> Roger,
>
> No you do not have to convert for windows.
>
> AIFF works fine on both platforms.  Make sure
> your path names for telling the computer where
> to find your files is correct.
>
> Good Luck!
>
> Rick Harrison
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Mon Nov 18 13:09:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Mon Nov 18 13:09:01 2002
Subject: Repeatloop in mouseDown handler wont end
In-Reply-To: <a05100303b9febf4e56d3@[216.229.107.47]>
Message-ID: <B9FE6B43.2021D%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Rob Cozens wrote:

>> on mouseRelease
>> if "updateMe" is in the pendingMessages then
>> cancel "updateMe"
>> end if
>> end mouseRelease
> 
> Just curious, Jan,
> 
> The Rev Dictionary states the argument to cancel is the id of the
> message (though it then gives an example referencing a line from
> pendingMessages).  It does not show or mention cancelling an event by
> name.  I trust it works, or you would not have posted this.
> 
> BTW, someone posted something along the lines of:
> 
> send "someMessage" to me in x seconds
> put it into messageId
> 
> a few days ago.  This will NOT work: the second line should be "put
> the result into messageId".

That should be flagged as a bug, since "it" is more commonly used for return
values from command and "the result" is more commonly used for error info.

Is there a lexical distinction that justfies this exception?

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Mon Nov 18 13:26:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Mon Nov 18 13:26:01 2002
Subject: repeat string: how ?
References: <200211160200.VAA18124@www.runrev.com> <fc.0073fc460009ee683b9aca00b281566d.9ee7b@groepvanroey.be>
Message-ID: <003701c28f27$92b0ec00$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Jan,

How about:

function InitContainer pKind,pCount,p1,p2,p3
    if pCount<=0 then return("")
    if pCount= "" then return "Invalid number of arguments!"
    put 1 into tNumSteps
    put 1 into pStartNum
    switch pKind
        case "n"
            put p1 into pStartNum
            put p2 into tNumSteps
            put p3 into tSeparator
            break
        case "s"
            put p1 into tString
            put p2 into tSeparator
            break
    end switch
    put "" into tResult
    set the lineDel to tSeparator
    repeat with x = pStartNum to (pStartNum+pCount) step tNumSteps
        if pKind = "n" then put x into line x of tResult
        if pKind = "s" then put tString into line x of tResult
    end repeat
    return tResult
end InitContainer

This is off the top of my head and hasn't been tested, but it eliminates a
bunch of "do" statements (which will improve performance) and is a bit
shorter as well...

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/


----- Original Message -----
From: "Jan Decroos" <jan.decroos at groepvanroey.be>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Monday, November 18, 2002 3:57 AM
Subject: RE: repeat string: how ?


> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com writes:
> >repeat string: how? (Alex Rice)
>
> We use a function which can be used to initialize of list of strings or
numbers.
>
> Use it like :
> initcontainer("n",50) --> returns a list of 50 lines from 1 to 50
> initcontainer("n",50,101) --> returns a list of 50 lines from 101 to 150
> initcontainer("n",50,101,2) --> returns a list of 50 lines from 101 to 199
> (step 2)
> initcontainer("n",50,101,2,comma) --> returns a list of 50 items from 101
to
> 199
>
> initcontainer("s",50,"Revolution") --> returns a list of 50 lines each
with
> "Revolution"
> initcontainer("s",50,"Revolution",tab) --> returns a list of 50 tab
separated
> 'items' "Revolution"
>
> This prevents re-scripting repeat loops again and again....
>
>
> function InitContainer pKind, pNum
>   if pNum <= 0 then return("")
>   if pKind = "s" then put "t" into pKind
>   put CR into lSeparator
>   if (pKind = "t" and (the paramCount < 3 or the paramCount > 4)) or
(pKind =
> "n" and (the paramCount < 2 or the paramCount > 5)) then StopWithMessage
> "Invalid number of arguments !"
>   if pKind = "t" then
>     put the param of 3 into lValue
>     if the ParamCount = 4 then
>       put the param of 4 into lSeparator
>     end if
>   else
>     put 1 into lValue
>     put 1 into lStep
>     if the ParamCount >= 3 then
>       if the param of 3 is a number then
>         put the param of 3 into lValue
>         if the ParamCount >= 4 then
>           if the param of 4 is a number then
>             put the param of 4 into lStep
>             if the ParamCount = 5 then
>               put the param of 5 into lSeparator
>             end if
>           else put the param of 4 into lSeparator
>         end if
>       else put the param of 3 into lSeparator
>     end if
>   end if
>   if pKind = "n" then put "add lStep to lValue" into lAddStep
>   else put "" into lAddStep
>   put "" into lResult
>   do "repeat pNum-1"&CR&\
>       "  put lValue&lSeparator after lResult"&CR&\
>       "  "&lAddStep&CR&\
>       "end repeat"
>   put lValue after lResult
>   return(lResult)
> end InitContainer
>
> Jan
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Mon Nov 18 13:42:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Mon Nov 18 13:42:01 2002
Subject: dates count
References: <p05100300b9fe98158f2e@[10.0.1.202]>
Message-ID: <003a01c28f29$8083d630$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Yves,

How about something like this (you'll need a field "ResultFld" to see the
result):

on mouseUp
  breakpoint
  put fld "dates" into tDates
  put last word of the long date into thisYear
  put 1 into lineCounter
  put "" into retVal
  put thisYear into currYear
  repeat with x = (thisYear-9) to 1 step -10
    put "From " & x & " to " & currYear & ":" into tTemp
    put 0 into tCount
    repeat for each line y in tDates
      if y >= x then
        add 1 to tCount
      else
        exit repeat
      end if
    end repeat
    delete line 1 to tCount of tDates
    put tCount after tTemp
    put tTemp into line (the number of lines of retVal)+1 of retVal
    put x-1 into currYear
  end repeat
  put retVal into fld "ResultFld"
end mouseUp

-- Modify to suit your needs...

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/


----- Original Message -----
From: "yves COPPE" <yvescoppe at skynet.be>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Monday, November 18, 2002 7:17 AM
Subject: dates count


> Hello,
>
> I have a fld "dates" with a list of years sorted descending:
> (the list has more than 1000 lines)
> ...
> 2002
> 2002
> 2001
> 1997
> 1997
> 1995
> 1994
> ...
>
> I'd like to know how much dates per 10 years
>
> 00-10 : 75
> 11-20 : 58
> ...
> ...
>
>
> here is my script :
>
> on mouseUp
>    put fld "dates" into tDates
>    put the short date into toDay
>    convert toDay to dateItems
>    put item 1 of toDay into thisYear
>    put "0" into a
>    put thisYear-10 into thisYear
>    put empty into tResult
>     repeat for each line L in tDates
>      if L " thisYear then
>        add "1" to a
>      else
>        put a&cr after tResult
>        put "1" into a
>        put thisYear-10 into thisYear
>      end if
>    end repeat
>    answer tResult
> end mouseUp
>
> but my result "tResult" is not correct
>
> can anyone help me ???
> --
> Greetings.
>
> Yves COPPE
>
> Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From rcozens at pon.net  Mon Nov 18 14:00:00 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Mon Nov 18 14:00:00 2002
Subject: Serendipity Library Update 20021116
Message-ID: <a05100300b9fedd6f6afc@[216.229.107.47]>

Hi All,

Serendipity Library Update 20021116 is now available at 
http://www.oenolog.com/ftp/serendipity_downloader.htm

The principal focus of this update is a new stack, ClickClock.rev, 
which contains a scripted animated gif image that can be used to 
capture & display analog time.  ClickClock is scripted without calls 
to Serendipity Library handlers; so it can be used and distributed 
without the Library or any of its accompanying files.  Because of 
this, ClickClock documentation and sample handlers are included in 
the one-card stack rather than in Serendipity Reference.

The only other change in this update is the addition of a readOnly 
argument to the openSDBFile command.  Since SDB does not allow 
multiple write access but can support multiple read-only access, this 
allows developers to enforce read-only restrictions in the same db 
front end stack used by the user with write access.

If you have previously downloaded the Library and are not interested 
in the SDB update, you can download ClickClock.rev.sgz individually 
and decompress it using SDB Utilities.

A final note: I was disappointed and relieved to find RunRev would 
not let me change the size of the animated gif.  Disappointed because 
I found the individual gifs retained "reasonable" quality over a 
"reasonable" range of expansion (shrinking would put the hot spots 
too close together); relieved because it gives me an excuse not to 
rewrite the mouseUp handler to define hot spots on the fly: not only 
am I lagging behind schedule in OenoLog conversion, I'm going to have 
to put all Rev stuff on back burner while I update Fed/state W/H 
tables and electronic W2 reporting code for the owners of the 
accounting system I support.

Thanks as always to translators  Jose L. Rodriguez Illera,  Terry 
Vogelaar, Yves Copp?, and Klaus Major.

-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Mon Nov 18 14:36:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Mon Nov 18 14:36:01 2002
Subject: dates count
In-Reply-To: <003a01c28f29$8083d630$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>
References: <p05100300b9fe98158f2e@[10.0.1.202]>
 <003a01c28f29$8083d630$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <p05100300b9feef0c9632@[10.0.1.202]>

>Yves,
>
>How about something like this (you'll need a field "ResultFld" to see the
>result):
>
>on mouseUp
>   breakpoint
>   put fld "dates" into tDates
>   put last word of the long date into thisYear
>   put 1 into lineCounter
>   put "" into retVal
>   put thisYear into currYear
>   repeat with x = (thisYear-9) to 1 step -10
>     put "From " & x & " to " & currYear & ":" into tTemp
>     put 0 into tCount
>     repeat for each line y in tDates
>       if y >= x then
>         add 1 to tCount
>       else
>         exit repeat
>       end if
>     end repeat
>     delete line 1 to tCount of tDates
>     put tCount after tTemp
>     put tTemp into line (the number of lines of retVal)+1 of retVal
>     put x-1 into currYear
>   end repeat
>   put retVal into fld "ResultFld"
>end mouseUp
>
>-- Modify to suit your needs...
>


Hi Ken

it answers just my needs BUT

i'd like it stops when the fld "dates" is read.

With your script I get for example
......
from 1783 to 1792 : 0
......
......
from -3 to 7 : 0

For it goes about the year dates of people's birthdate.
It may surely stop with 100 years back !!!!!!
Jesus Christus is too old to come in my list !!!!!
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Mon Nov 18 15:06:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Mon Nov 18 15:06:01 2002
Subject: dates count
In-Reply-To: <p05100300b9feef0c9632@[10.0.1.202]>
Message-ID: <20021118195928.58064.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>

--- yves COPPE <yvescoppe at skynet.be> wrote:
> >Yves,
> >
> >How about something like this (you'll need a field
> "ResultFld" to see the
> >result):
> >
> >on mouseUp
> >   breakpoint
> >   put fld "dates" into tDates
> >   put last word of the long date into thisYear
> >   put 1 into lineCounter
> >   put "" into retVal
> >   put thisYear into currYear
> >   repeat with x = (thisYear-9) to 1 step -10
> >     put "From " & x & " to " & currYear & ":" into
> tTemp
> >     put 0 into tCount
> >     repeat for each line y in tDates
> >       if y >= x then
> >         add 1 to tCount
> >       else
> >         exit repeat
> >       end if
> >     end repeat
> >     delete line 1 to tCount of tDates
> >     put tCount after tTemp
> >     put tTemp into line (the number of lines of
> retVal)+1 of retVal
> >     put x-1 into currYear
> >   end repeat
> >   put retVal into fld "ResultFld"
> >end mouseUp
> >
> >-- Modify to suit your needs...
> >
> 
> 
> Hi Ken
> 
> it answers just my needs BUT
> 
> i'd like it stops when the fld "dates" is read.
> 
> With your script I get for example
> ......
> from 1783 to 1792 : 0
> ......
> ......
> from -3 to 7 : 0
> 
> For it goes about the year dates of people's
> birthdate.
> It may surely stop with 100 years back !!!!!!
> Jesus Christus is too old to come in my list !!!!!
> -- 
> Greetings.
> 
> Yves COPPE
> 

Hi Yves,

Not to stick my nose in anything, but the small change
you have to make is:

-- ...
repeat with x = (thisYear-9) to 1900 step -10
-- ...
  if tDates is empty then exit repeat
end repeat
-- ...

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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From dsc at swcp.com  Mon Nov 18 15:24:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Mon Nov 18 15:24:01 2002
Subject: It vs. the result (was Repeatloop in mouseDown...)
In-Reply-To: <B9FE6B43.2021D%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <50EE120D-FB32-11D6-A3B8-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Monday, November 18, 2002, at 11:02 AM, Richard Gaskin wrote:

> That should be flagged as a bug, since "it" is more commonly used for 
> return
> values from command and "the result" is more commonly used for error 
> info.
>
> Is there a lexical distinction that justfies this exception?

Yeah.  Good question.

Functions return values directly.  Message handlers may return values 
obtained through result().  Some commands return values in callbacks 
(and often also in the result).  All others return values in result() 
except for CARGA (convert, answer, read, get and ask).  I think.

I'm not sure what is so special about CARGA.  I think that the main 
purpose of those commands is to generate a string.  For example, you 
read to obtain a string, but the id from a send is incidental.  Maybe 
that is the distinction.

I'm just babbling.

Dar Scott



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Mon Nov 18 15:44:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Mon Nov 18 15:44:01 2002
Subject: dates count
References: <p05100300b9fe98158f2e@[10.0.1.202]> <003a01c28f29$8083d630$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom> <p05100300b9feef0c9632@[10.0.1.202]>
Message-ID: <006101c28f3a$94917130$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> it answers just my needs BUT
>
> i'd like it stops when the fld "dates" is read.
>
> With your script I get for example
> ......
> from 1783 to 1792 : 0
> ......
> ......
> from -3 to 7 : 0
>
> For it goes about the year dates of people's birthdate.
> It may surely stop with 100 years back !!!!!!
> Jesus Christus is too old to come in my list !!!!!

Sorry, Yves... wasn't sure how far back you were going... ;-)

Here's what you can do to amend this... insert the following line after
"delete line 1 to tCount of tDates"

  if tDates is empty then exit repeat

Hope this helps,

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From zellner at neo.tamu.edu  Mon Nov 18 16:24:01 2002
From: zellner at neo.tamu.edu (Ronald D. Zellner)
Date: Mon Nov 18 16:24:01 2002
Subject: sharedText property
In-Reply-To: <200211181006.FAA14022@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211181006.FAA14022@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <v04210103b9ff081c2c0e@[165.91.234.131]>

I am having problems with the sharedText property.  The new text from 
one card doesn't appear on the other cards.  The fields were grouped 
and the property set to "true" for each field, the group was copied 
and then pasted on the other card.  Is there something I am missing?

Thanks,

Ron Zellner


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Mon Nov 18 16:28:00 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Mon Nov 18 16:28:00 2002
Subject: sharedText property
In-Reply-To: <v04210103b9ff081c2c0e@[165.91.234.131]>
Message-ID: <20021118212130.17651.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>

--- "Ronald D. Zellner" <zellner at neo.tamu.edu> wrote:
> I am having problems with the sharedText property. 
> The new text from 
> one card doesn't appear on the other cards.  The
> fields were grouped 
> and the property set to "true" for each field, the
> group was copied 
> and then pasted on the other card.  Is there
> something I am missing?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Ron Zellner
> 

Hi Ron,

You should set the groups 'backgroundBehaviour'
property to true and 'place' the group on the other
card, instead of copying+pasting it.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Mon Nov 18 16:37:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Mon Nov 18 16:37:01 2002
Subject: It vs. the result (was Repeatloop in mouseDown...)
In-Reply-To: <50EE120D-FB32-11D6-A3B8-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <B9FE9C03.20247%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Jan Schenkel and I have been enjoying a discussion of this in private email,
and this background on the issue from an email to him may be of interest to
the readers here:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Using "the result" over "it" in the context given appears to be an exception
to the conventions of the language, at least to this scripter only halfway
into his morning coffee (this appearance may change as I get closer to the
bottom of the cup).

While "the result" is not always reserved for error info, in most cases it
is.  But even more relevant here is the convention elsewhere in the language
of using "it" to return values from commands, esp. commands that create
things.

The integer returned by "send <message>" is effectively an ID.  While the
thing being created is not an object per se, commands that create objects
return the ID of the newly created object in "it".

Accordingly, many of us are in the habit of checking "the result" for error
info, and have come to expect "it" to contain non-error information for
commands that create things, esp. IDs.

IMHO, the original poster's expectations appear reasonable given these
conventions, unless there is some other linguistic rule at play that I'm not
taking into consideration.  Understanding the logic of this distinction
would seem useful for both experienced scripters and newcomers alike.

Being one of those "usability nuts", in cases of cognitive dissonance I tend
to favor user expectations over the designer's intentions, unless there's a
good argument for the design.  To Raney's and Miller's credit, most previous
cases in which a language issue appeared inconsistent at first glance have
turned out to have very solid reasoning behind them (about 99.9% of the
time).  

But nothing is perfect, and nearly everything can be refined just a bit
closer to perfection: once upon a time the MC engine used a non-standard
order for the items that described the printMargins (they were not L,T,R,B
as other rects are defined).  This was reported as a bug, and even though it
required changes to scripts that had relied on the old order it was promptly
changed in the next release, and today the language has one less exception
to remember.

In this case, we'll either see a change for greater consistency, or gain a
deeper understanding of the rules to help us understand why this instance is
truly consistent. 
 
-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Mon Nov 18 16:41:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (Yves =?iso-8859-1?Q?Copp=E9?=)
Date: Mon Nov 18 16:41:01 2002
Subject: dates count
In-Reply-To: <20021118195928.58064.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021118195928.58064.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <p05111700b9ff0dba03ab@[10.0.1.204]>

>--- yves COPPE <yvescoppe at skynet.be> wrote:
>>  >Yves,
>>  >
>>  >How about something like this (you'll need a field
>>  "ResultFld" to see the
>>  >result):
>>  >
>>  >on mouseUp
>>  >   breakpoint
>>  >   put fld "dates" into tDates
>>  >   put last word of the long date into thisYear
>>  >   put 1 into lineCounter
>>  >   put "" into retVal
>>  >   put thisYear into currYear
>>  >   repeat with x = (thisYear-9) to 1 step -10
>>  >     put "From " & x & " to " & currYear & ":" into
>>  tTemp
>>  >     put 0 into tCount
>>  >     repeat for each line y in tDates
>>  >       if y >= x then
>>  >         add 1 to tCount
>>  >       else
>>  >         exit repeat
>>  >       end if
>>  >     end repeat
>>  >     delete line 1 to tCount of tDates
>>  >     put tCount after tTemp
>>  >     put tTemp into line (the number of lines of
>>  retVal)+1 of retVal
>>  >     put x-1 into currYear
>>  >   end repeat
>>  >   put retVal into fld "ResultFld"
>>  >end mouseUp
>>  >
>>  >-- Modify to suit your needs...
>>  >
>>
>>
>>  Hi Ken
>>
>>  it answers just my needs BUT
>>
>>  i'd like it stops when the fld "dates" is read.
>>
>>  With your script I get for example
>>  ......
>>  from 1783 to 1792 : 0
>>  ......
>>  ......
>>  from -3 to 7 : 0
>>
>>  For it goes about the year dates of people's
>>  birthdate.
>>  It may surely stop with 100 years back !!!!!!
>>  Jesus Christus is too old to come in my list !!!!!
>>  --
>>  Greetings.
>>
>>  Yves COPPE
>>
>
>Hi Yves,
>
>Not to stick my nose in anything, but the small change
>you have to make is:
>
>-- ...
>repeat with x = (thisYear-9) to 1900 step -10
>-- ...
>   if tDates is empty then exit repeat
>end repeat
>-- ...
>
>Hope this helped,
>
>Jan Schenkel.
>


Thank you Ken and Jan !
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From dsc at swcp.com  Mon Nov 18 16:49:00 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Mon Nov 18 16:49:00 2002
Subject: command-line args
Message-ID: <3405822E-FB3E-11D6-A3B8-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

I'm trying to make a standalone that gets args from the command line 
that ran it.  All my args show up in $1 instead of being spread out in 
$1 through $n.  XP.

Que pasa?

Dar Scott



From raney at metacard.com  Mon Nov 18 17:05:01 2002
From: raney at metacard.com (Scott Raney)
Date: Mon Nov 18 17:05:01 2002
Subject: Inappropriate Interface Behaviour during mouseDown
In-Reply-To: <200211181007.FAA14089@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211181444000.3635-100000@mast.metacard.com>

 On Fri, 2 Jan 1970 Igor de Oliveira Couto <info at pixelmedia.com.au wrote:

Looks like Igor has gone back in time to witness the birth of UNIX!

> I must admit, in my limited view, I fail to see how this
> implementation can be seen as a 'feature'. I fail to see why a
> control needs to 'own' the mouse until it is released. I (perhaps
> foolishly) thought that the appropriate message should be passed to
> whatever control happens to be underneath the mouse at a certain
> point in time, NOT to the last control where the mouse button was
> held down... If I put 3 buttons next to each other, press the mouse
> down on the first, and while still holding it down, move over the
> other 2 buttons, should they highlight?

It's an empirical question, which means you should try it yourself and
see.  In my experience on GUI systems (dating back to the Xerox Star)
I've never seen one work this way for regular pushbuttons.  Since
you're apparently back in 1970, however, I can't rule out that you
might find an early MIT or Xerox PARC prototype that works this way
;-)

> It seems to me that this implementation is also quite inefficient
> (it requires that a 'mouseRelease' message be implemented as well,
> while in other systems that message is unnecessary)

What other systems?

>, and it is
> probably the reason why we've observed the unexpected behaviour of
> controls on hiding/showing objects from under the mouse (I can see
> now that the hidden object still 'owns' the mouse).

Right, at least while the button is down.  Whether it should change
when the button is up, however, is a different question and one we're
currently researching.  But even if we change this it wouldn't solve
your problem.

(big snip)

> Yes, it might well be that I am not being able to see some
> incredibly useful functionality that has been given to us by the
> current implementation of the mouse messaging scheme in Revolution -

Yes, it's that incredibly useful functionality of working like every
other GUI application out there ;-)

> but from this newbie's perspective, it does indeed feel like a
> 'bug'... not a 'feature'...

There is a way to do what you want, using the within() function:
if within(me, the mouseLoc)
then show image 1
else hide image 1

The ugly syntax is because this is a SuperCard-compatibility feature
that I've never had much use for.  But then, I'm not trying to build
the kind of bizzarre UIs that seem to be so popular with Flash
developers, who seem to think that their worth is measured by how
different their creations are from everyone else's rather than by how
well they work.
  Regards,
    Scott

> Kind Regards,
> --
> Igor de Oliveira Couto
> ----------------------------------
> info at pixelmedia.com.au
> ----------------------------------

********************************************************
Scott Raney  raney at metacard.com  http://www.metacard.com
MetaCard: You know, there's an easier way to do that...




From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Mon Nov 18 17:10:00 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Mon Nov 18 17:10:00 2002
Subject: Inappropriate mouse behavior...
In-Reply-To: <B4DD3B67-FB1A-11D6-8694-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
Message-ID: <967627F4-FB41-11D6-975E-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Barry,

Thank you for your feedback:

On Tuesday, November 19, 2002, at 04:25  AM, Barry Levine wrote:

> The behavior as described below is contrary to Apple's human interface 
> design guidelines. It also provides a "trigger" that is exactly the 
> opposite of all other Mac and Windows programs. If one is looking to 
> have lots of negative feedback from one's customers, do this.
>
> Barry
>
> On Monday, November 18, 2002, at 10:02 AM, 
> use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote:
>
>> Similarly, if a user presses a mouse button OUTSIDE a clickable area,
>> and then moves the cursor OVER a clickable area, then the clickable
>> area should change its appearance, indicating that if the user lets
>> go of the mouse at that location, an action will trigger.
>> <<
>>
>>

A user might press down on button1, realise that they intended to 
actually press button 2, and without letting go off the mouse, move 
over to the appropriate button and let go there. This is, INDEED, 
coherent with Apple's interface guidelines and their principle of 
'forgiveness'. Menus behave that way, and several multimedia-style 
applications that I've come across DO have buttons that behave this 
way, indeed. Think about it, and you will see that it makes sense.

What does not make sense is for me to be able to have a mouse button 
DOWN over a clickable area WITHOUT any response from the system.

You are quite entitled to disagree, and the world will be a richer 
place for it. After all, being able to give users OPTIONS is what it is 
all about, isn't it? If you want to program your interface to have a 
certain kind of functionality, you should be able to do so - and so 
should I. Right now, however, Revolution is 'forcing' us to have a 
specific type of functionality, which I do not want.

Once again, thank you for your feedback.

Kind Regards,

--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
info at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Mon Nov 18 17:23:01 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Mon Nov 18 17:23:01 2002
Subject: Inappropriate Interface Behaviour during mouseDown
In-Reply-To: <a05100302b9feb8b1c903@[216.229.107.238]>
Message-ID: <6E411888-FB43-11D6-975E-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Rob,

Thank you for your feedback!

On Tuesday, November 19, 2002, at 02:46  AM, Rob Cozens wrote:

>> Similarly, if a user presses a mouse button OUTSIDE a clickable area, 
>> and then moves the cursor OVER a clickable area, then the clickable 
>> area should change its appearance, indicating that if the user lets 
>> go of the mouse at that location, an action will trigger.
>>
> Frankly, I don't believe I've ever seen this implemented, and I really 
> question whether it is desirable behavior.  The reasoning for using 
> mouseUp instead of mouseDown to trigger an event is so a user can 
> reverse the mouseDown action without triggering the event by moving 
> the mouse outside the control before releasing it.  The idea of 
> triggering an event by holding the mouse down before entering a 
> control and releasing it once it is over the control seems totally 
> foreign and non-intuitive to me (except for pull-down menus).
>

Imagine the following situation: user presses mouse button down on 
button1, but then changes their mind and moves over (without letting 
go) to button2, where they DO let go... Or: imagine that I want to 
setup a 'piano keyboard'-style array of buttons, where the user may 
press down on one button, triggering an event, but then 'drag' the 
cursor over the other buttons, triggering more events as they go. This 
would have to be achieved currently by perhaps placing another object 
on top of the array, and evaluating mouse positions while the mouse is 
down and moving, and then sending the appropriate messages to the right 
buttons...

All I wanted to point out, was that the way the current 'mouseLeave' 
and 'mouseEnter' messages work is extremely misleading - and in my 
'newbie' way of thinking, they certainly do not appear to be 
functioning as they should. If I leave a button - regardless of whether 
the mouse is down or up - I should get a 'mouseLeave'. Similarly, if I 
enter a button - with my mouse button down or not - then I should get a 
'mouseEnter'. If the button disappears from or appears under the mouse, 
I should get the appropriate 'mouseEnter/Leave' message as well. None 
of this happens. If the messages were implemented in this way, there 
would be no need for a 'mouseReleased' message, either. And most 
importantly: if the messages were implemented as I described, everybody 
would be able to implement the interface functionality they wanted, 
without too much programming. Right now, I'm being forced to have my 
interface work a certain specific way...

Many thanks for your feedback, though.

Kind Regards,

--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
info at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Mon Nov 18 17:42:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Mon Nov 18 17:42:01 2002
Subject: Inappropriate mouse behavior...
In-Reply-To: <967627F4-FB41-11D6-975E-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <20021118223549.85298.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Igor de Oliveira Couto <info at pixelmedia.com.au>
wrote:
> [snip]
> 
> A user might press down on button1, realise that
> they intended to 
> actually press button 2, and without letting go off
> the mouse, move 
> over to the appropriate button and let go there.
> This is, INDEED, 
> coherent with Apple's interface guidelines and their
> principle of 
> 'forgiveness'. Menus behave that way, and several
> multimedia-style 
> applications that I've come across DO have buttons
> that behave this 
> way, indeed. Think about it, and you will see that
> it makes sense.
> 

Hi Igor,

At the risk of adding fuel to the UI wars, just a few
thoughts.
The principle of 'forgiveness' applies IMO more to the
ability of a user to 'back out' of a situation by
moving his mouse out of the control and resting
assured nothing bad is going to happen.
If I were in an application where i'd have to be
carefull where I leave my mouse in case i want to
avoid an action, I wouldn't dare to click anymore.

> What does not make sense is for me to be able to
> have a mouse button 
> DOWN over a clickable area WITHOUT any response from
> the system.
> 

Let go of the mouse and start a new action. Much more
intuitive for the average user.

> You are quite entitled to disagree, and the world
> will be a richer 
> place for it. After all, being able to give users
> OPTIONS is what it is 
> all about, isn't it? If you want to program your
> interface to have a 
> certain kind of functionality, you should be able to
> do so - and so 
> should I. Right now, however, Revolution is
> 'forcing' us to have a 
> specific type of functionality, which I do not want.
> 

While it is desirable that developers have as much
freedom as possible, we should make sure not to stray
too far from the environment the user has come to
know.
As a developer of business applications, I find that
users already have a different mindset than
programmers to begin with, so what is logical to us
might prove very confusing to them.
Likewise, they want to get on with the job instead of
having to think 'oh, wait, what did I have to do again
in this program?' -- then we're back to DOS and the
days before consistent GUI-design.
And to people who already have to combine different
programs like Excel, Word, PowerPoint and a set of
administrative applications with legacy interfaces, a
common ground is a life-saver.

Does this mean we shouldn't step in and try to come up
with new ways that might make it easier for the user
to accomplish his or her goals?
Of course not, quite the opposite in fact. Here's an
example where I deviate from the standard behaviour:
I have combo-boxes where the first character is a
number, followed by a space, a dash, a space and the
full-length explanation of that option.
When the user starts typing, I mimic Excel's auto-fill
behaviour and show the rest of the text of that item,
selecting all the text behind what was just typed.
The result? The user can 'type' a code he/she has
known for years, whereas the novice can 'pick' an item
from the list, and start to remember the codes without
being forced to remember them all at once.
Standard behaviour? No, merely trying to bridge the
gap without alienating either type of user. And they
appreciate it a lot.

> Once again, thank you for your feedback.
> 

Hope you didn't mind me tossing in my two euro-cents,

> Kind Regards,
> 
> --
> Igor de Oliveira Couto
>

Best regards,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de  Mon Nov 18 18:12:00 2002
From: rjb at rz.uni-potsdam.de (Robert Brenstein)
Date: Mon Nov 18 18:12:00 2002
Subject: Inappropriate mouse behavior...
In-Reply-To: <967627F4-FB41-11D6-975E-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
References: <967627F4-FB41-11D6-975E-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05200f17b9ff1e4425ba@[141.89.100.235]>

>
>A user might press down on button1, realise that they intended to 
>actually press button 2, and without letting go off the mouse, move 
>over to the appropriate button and let go there. This is, INDEED, 
>coherent with Apple's interface guidelines and their principle of 
>'forgiveness'. Menus behave that way, and several multimedia-style 
>applications that I've come across DO have buttons that behave this 
>way, indeed. Think about it, and you will see that it makes sense.

I don't know where you found this in Apple's HIGs. Open a print, 
configuration, or any other standard dialog in Finder or normal Mac 
application. If you click on a button (standard button or radio for 
example) and move the button away, the button's hilite will go away 
but I haven't seen that moving mouse (while continuing to hold the 
button down) will activate another button. That would be a dangerous 
behavior. Mouse down means selection. Mouse up means finalize that 
selection and possibly invoke the associated action. If mouse up 
occurs outside the area of the selected object, it means that user 
changed his/her mind and wants to avoid the consequences. Behavior of 
menus is not parallel to this -- holding the mouse enters menu browse 
mode, hence one can move from menu to menu and see the options. The 
difference is that without the pull action one does not see the 
content of the menu.

Robert


From rfarnold at bu.edu  Mon Nov 18 18:23:00 2002
From: rfarnold at bu.edu (Bob Arnold)
Date: Mon Nov 18 18:23:00 2002
Subject: The joy of animated GIF
Message-ID: <B9FEDF00.7DC92%rfarnold@bu.edu>

I have just caught up and discovered how useful animated GIFs can be -- I
have been making card-based animations since my HC days, and although they
work in RR, I have encountered some problems controlling the sequence with
sticky mousedown loops and leaky locking messages. Now the entire animation
is on one card and I can control the speed, and the sequence, by sending
messages to the image. Before I get too happy, are there any cross-platform
issues or other problems associated with animated GIFs? So far, I have only
tested on Mac OS 9.2. Thanks.
-- 
Robert Arnold
Associate Professor of Film
Boston University
Tel (617) 353-7735  Fax (617) 353-1084
News: http://people.bu.edu/rfarnold/Announce.htm



From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Mon Nov 18 18:49:01 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Mon Nov 18 18:49:01 2002
Subject: Inappropriate Interface Behaviour during mouseDown
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211181444000.3635-100000@mast.metacard.com>
Message-ID: <5EA6E15E-FB4F-11D6-975E-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Scott,

Thank you for your comments.

On Tuesday, November 19, 2002, at 08:58  AM, Scott Raney wrote:

>> I must admit, in my limited view, I fail to see how this
>> implementation can be seen as a 'feature'. I fail to see why a
>> control needs to 'own' the mouse until it is released. I (perhaps
>> foolishly) thought that the appropriate message should be passed to
>> whatever control happens to be underneath the mouse at a certain
>> point in time, NOT to the last control where the mouse button was
>> held down... If I put 3 buttons next to each other, press the mouse
>> down on the first, and while still holding it down, move over the
>> other 2 buttons, should they highlight?
>
> It's an empirical question, which means you should try it yourself and
> see.  In my experience on GUI systems (dating back to the Xerox Star)
> I've never seen one work this way for regular pushbuttons.  Since
> you're apparently back in 1970, however, I can't rule out that you
> might find an early MIT or Xerox PARC prototype that works this way
> ;-)
>

*hehehehehehe* I'm affraid my experience does not go as far back as 
1970! I must also admit that I am totally unfamiliar with 'Flash'... 
You give me far too much credit!

My question was not empirical, though. I was NOT suggesting you open 
Mac windows and start clicking buttons to see whether they behave they 
way I described or not. My question was whether people in general think 
they SHOULD behave this way.

Apple spends a LOT of effort and money researching interface 
principles, but more than anyone, they know that their interface 
guidelines are not faultless. They might be award-winning, but not even 
Apple claims that they are perfect, and therefore, they continue on 
their research, and continue on improving and changing their guidelines.

My point is precisely that I want my interface to function a specific 
way, which is different to the way Revolution currently forces us to 
work. I might, indeed, want to create an application that behaves like 
a 1970's piece of software - or I might have other specific needs, for 
specific markets (such as young children, the disabled, or for specific 
testing purposes), which might require mouse responses to be handled in 
a different way.

The 'difference' between the way I would like my application to respond 
and the way it currently HAS to respond, is not enormous. However, a 
development tool, in my humble opinion, should be easy to use, but also 
give as much choice to the developer as possible. The reason why we 
like Revolution so much is because it gives us choice (compiling for 
many platforms) - and ease of use as well. I'm just calling your 
attention to an area where not enough CHOICE is being given. Also, 
unlike others who have followed the development of Revolution from the 
start, and know all the ins-and-outs of the software - and the 
rationale as to why things behave the way they do - I am a total 
stranger, and present a 'blank slate' to you. I will try to use things 
as they seem to me that they should be used. So, users like me, are 
also good test subjects for you to see whether Revolution is truly EASY 
and intuitive to use.

As a new Revolution user, and new to its scripting language, it 
appeared to me 'odd' that a 'mouseLeave' or 'mouseEnter' message should 
depend on the state of the mouse... It also appeared quite obvious that 
if mouseLeave/Enters were sent regardless of the mouse button status, 
then there wouldn't be a need for a 'mouseRelease' message, either. In 
my 'newbie' view, the mouseRelease message was just an extra 
complication that I'd rather not have to deal with.

>> , and it is
>> probably the reason why we've observed the unexpected behaviour of
>> controls on hiding/showing objects from under the mouse (I can see
>> now that the hidden object still 'owns' the mouse).
>
> Right, at least while the button is down.  Whether it should change
> when the button is up, however, is a different question and one we're
> currently researching.  But even if we change this it wouldn't solve
> your problem.

Actually, that would already be a great improvement! That would be 
wonderful, and make things incredibly more intuitive!

Once again, I personally believe that the mouseEnter/Leave messages 
should be sent to the image being shown/hidden, regardless of the state 
of the mouse. I'll tell you why: one of my very first scripting 
experiences with Revolution was trying to setup an irregularly-shaped 
button, by using 3 image objects. Here is what I tried to do (and which 
did not work): I had 3 images ('idle', 'over' and 'down'), and I 
scripted them thus:

* For the 'idle' image:

on mouseEnter
	hide me
	show image "imgOver"
end mouseEnter

* For the 'over' image:

on mouseLeave
	hide me
	show image "imgIdle"
end mouseLeave

on mouseDown
	hide me
	show image "imgDown"
end mouseDown

* For the 'down' image:

on mouseUp
	hide me
	show image "imgOver"
end mouseUp

Because of the current restrictions with messages not being sent when 
images are hidden/shown, these did not work - or worked erratically. If 
you implemented mouseEnter/Leave as discussed, they would work.

Please note that this would indeed be a GREAT improvement: currently, 
to implement the same functionality as given by the scripts above, I 
had to follow suggestions given to me by the more experienced users in 
the list, and setup scripts that change the alphaData, imageData and 
size of a 'display' image, getting the image information from the 3 
other hidden 'source' images ('idle', 'over' and 'down'). Not very 
intuitive AT ALL for a newbie.

Nevertheless, as noticed by you, this would still leave me with one 
problem: if the user moves away from the 'over' image while the mouse 
is down...

Right now, this event is not handled at all. I have to try and cater 
for it by scripting:

on mouseRelease
	hide me
	show image "imgIdle"
end mouseRelease

Which is how Revolution wants us to work. I would rather, however, use 
a 'mouseLeave' here, and forget about the 'mouseRelease' message 
altogether. I do not need to trap an event that tells me that 'the user 
pressed the mouse button on the image, moved away, and let go of the 
button outside the image'. While that is a GREAT shortcut for some 
tasks, all I need is 'the user has moved away'.

The absence of mouseEnter/Leave messages on hiding/showing objects 
hinted to the fact that this might be an area that could benefit from 
some improvement. That is why I pointed out what, for me, seemed like a 
cumbersome and LIMITING way of dealing with mouse messages. Users - and 
developers more than anyone else - appreciate choice.

Many thanks for your feedback, and

Kind Regards,
--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
info at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From scott at tactilemedia.com  Mon Nov 18 18:53:00 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Mon Nov 18 18:53:00 2002
Subject: The joy of animated GIF
In-Reply-To: <B9FEDF00.7DC92%rfarnold@bu.edu>
Message-ID: <B9FEBC21.558B%scott@tactilemedia.com>

> I have just caught up and discovered how useful animated GIFs can be -- I
> have been making card-based animations since my HC days, and although they
> work in RR, I have encountered some problems controlling the sequence with
> sticky mousedown loops and leaky locking messages. Now the entire animation
> is on one card and I can control the speed, and the sequence, by sending
> messages to the image. Before I get too happy, are there any cross-platform
> issues or other problems associated with animated GIFs? So far, I have only
> tested on Mac OS 9.2.

As you have discovered, animated GIFs are quite powerful in Rev/MC.  You can
do some very complicated/elaborate things in the environment with a good
deal of control.  The following is not a cross-platform issue, but rather a
GIF rendering issue to note: Rev/MC may not display optimized GIFs
consistently or accurately.

In a Web browser environment, the browser has the ability store the contents
of the first frame it encounters in the GIF, and then render each subsequent
frame on top of the first.  The browser can also account for redundant
pixels, meaning that your GIFs can weigh in lighter since you can eliminate
duplicate pixels that occur in subsequent frames.  These rendering features
are not present in Rev/MC's handling of GIFs, and may cause your GIF to
render unexpectedly in Rev/MC.  You can work around this by rendering your
GIFs with complete frames (including any transparency).

Using Adobe's ImageReady for example, I create an animation as needed and
then, using a color not present in the animation, I introduce a solid color
frame between every frame of my original animation.  This forces ImageReady
to generate an animated GIF without any optimization (redundant pixel
removal, etc).  I then open the GIF in a simple GIF editor (GIFMation),
delete all the solid color frames and resave.  The final file contains a
complete image on every frame of the animation and is suitable for display
in Rev/MC.  True, the filesize will weight in heavier than an optimized GIF,
but the resulting display behavior will be predictable.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-----
E: scott at tactilemedia.com
W: http://www.tactilemedia.com



From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Mon Nov 18 19:06:01 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Mon Nov 18 19:06:01 2002
Subject: Inappropriate mouse behavior...
In-Reply-To: <20021118223549.85298.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BFCD38BA-FB51-11D6-975E-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Jan,

I greatly enjoyed reading your response!

On Tuesday, November 19, 2002, at 09:35  AM, Jan Schenkel wrote:

> At the risk of adding fuel to the UI wars, just a few
> thoughts.
> The principle of 'forgiveness' applies IMO more to the
> ability of a user to 'back out' of a situation by
> moving his mouse out of the control and resting
> assured nothing bad is going to happen.
> If I were in an application where i'd have to be
> carefull where I leave my mouse in case i want to
> avoid an action, I wouldn't dare to click anymore.
>

Point taken. Totally agree!

>> What does not make sense is for me to be able to
>> have a mouse button
>> DOWN over a clickable area WITHOUT any response from
>> the system.
>>
>
> Let go of the mouse and start a new action. Much more
> intuitive for the average user.

Yes, and indeed, that is the way the vast majority of applications work.

> While it is desirable that developers have as much
> freedom as possible, we should make sure not to stray
> too far from the environment the user has come to
> know.
> As a developer of business applications, I find that
> users already have a different mindset than
> programmers to begin with, so what is logical to us
> might prove very confusing to them.
> Likewise, they want to get on with the job instead of
> having to think 'oh, wait, what did I have to do again
> in this program?' -- then we're back to DOS and the
> days before consistent GUI-design.
> And to people who already have to combine different
> programs like Excel, Word, PowerPoint and a set of
> administrative applications with legacy interfaces, a
> common ground is a life-saver.

Absolutely! And the 'relief' and 'comfort' provided by that interface 
familiarity is something that we all, as users, have experienced as 
well. My only comment here is that I do believe in giving developers 
the choice!

> Does this mean we shouldn't step in and try to come up
> with new ways that might make it easier for the user
> to accomplish his or her goals?
> Of course not, quite the opposite in fact.

Precisely.

As you noticed yourself, sometimes you will NEED to diverge from the 
'norm', due to the requirements of the project. This does not 
necessarily make your software clumsy and inoperable  - or confusing to 
the user. It is just a matter of controlling how the user deals with 
the 'differences' that your software presents.

Many thanks for your constructive remarks!

Kind Regards,
--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
info at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From chipp at chipp.com  Mon Nov 18 21:00:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Mon Nov 18 21:00:01 2002
Subject: The joy of animated GIF
In-Reply-To: <B9FEBC21.558B%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAKECCCOAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Scott,

I'm pretty sure the reason for the non-optimized redundant pixel removal
MC/RR animated gif is that it's very difficult to do a:

set the currentframe of img "optimized.gif" to 12

unless you have *all* the data in frame 12. Else, you would have to 'step
through' each frame and build frame 12 from the previous frames. Unlike
QuickTime, animated GIF's have no 'keyframes', so you would have to playback
the entire GIF each time you wanted to set the currentframe.

-Chipp

> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Scott Rossi
> Sent: Monday, November 18, 2002 5:48 PM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Re: The joy of animated GIF
>
>
> > I have just caught up and discovered how useful animated GIFs
> can be -- I
> > have been making card-based animations since my HC days, and
> although they
> > work in RR, I have encountered some problems controlling the
> sequence with
> > sticky mousedown loops and leaky locking messages. Now the
> entire animation
> > is on one card and I can control the speed, and the sequence, by sending
> > messages to the image. Before I get too happy, are there any
> cross-platform
> > issues or other problems associated with animated GIFs? So far,
> I have only
> > tested on Mac OS 9.2.
>
> As you have discovered, animated GIFs are quite powerful in
> Rev/MC.  You can
> do some very complicated/elaborate things in the environment with a good
> deal of control.  The following is not a cross-platform issue,
> but rather a
> GIF rendering issue to note: Rev/MC may not display optimized GIFs
> consistently or accurately.
>
> In a Web browser environment, the browser has the ability store
> the contents
> of the first frame it encounters in the GIF, and then render each
> subsequent
> frame on top of the first.  The browser can also account for redundant
> pixels, meaning that your GIFs can weigh in lighter since you can
> eliminate
> duplicate pixels that occur in subsequent frames.  These
> rendering features
> are not present in Rev/MC's handling of GIFs, and may cause your GIF to
> render unexpectedly in Rev/MC.  You can work around this by rendering your
> GIFs with complete frames (including any transparency).
>
> Using Adobe's ImageReady for example, I create an animation as needed and
> then, using a color not present in the animation, I introduce a
> solid color
> frame between every frame of my original animation.  This forces
> ImageReady
> to generate an animated GIF without any optimization (redundant pixel
> removal, etc).  I then open the GIF in a simple GIF editor (GIFMation),
> delete all the solid color frames and resave.  The final file contains a
> complete image on every frame of the animation and is suitable for display
> in Rev/MC.  True, the filesize will weight in heavier than an
> optimized GIF,
> but the resulting display behavior will be predictable.
>
> Regards,
>
> Scott Rossi
> Creative Director
> Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
> -----
> E: scott at tactilemedia.com
> W: http://www.tactilemedia.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution




From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Mon Nov 18 21:15:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Mon Nov 18 21:15:01 2002
Subject: screen resolution
In-Reply-To: <a05111a10b9fbaf558f58@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <C3823122-FB63-11D6-ABD8-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

What system are these computers running? If it is 8 or 9 (& possibly 
even 7), you can use Jon's Commands, a set of AppleScript scripting 
additions. These include commands for checking & setting the monitor 
resolution although as someone else pointed out, you can check the 
current setting more easily from within Rev.

Cheers,
Sarah


On Saturday, November 16, 2002, at 06:16  pm, Greg Wills wrote:

> Hi all
>
> I have developed some programs for a school but have come across a 
> problem while testing it on a number of different Mac machines. On the 
> older machines the programs do not display the entire contents of the 
> card/window. If the resolution is set to 800 x 600 then the full 
> card/window is shown. Some of the machines monitors however cannot be 
> set to this resolution.
>
> Is there a script that someone has developed that will check the 
> monitor setting and either change the monitor setting to 800 x 600 or 
> quit before the program runs.
>
> Do windows monitors have the same problem?
>
> regards
>
> Greg Wills
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From alanIra9 at mac.com  Mon Nov 18 21:20:01 2002
From: alanIra9 at mac.com (Alan Gayne)
Date: Mon Nov 18 21:20:01 2002
Subject: on mouseDoubleDown
In-Reply-To: <05a401c28dc9$716543c0$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <63AB00C4-FB63-11D6-9564-000393158950@mac.com>

Hi Ken:

this may only require a 1 word answer - but does a "mouseDoubleDown" 
message preempt a "mouseDown" message in the same script?

Thanks in advance,

Alan

On Saturday, November 16, 2002, at 06:39  PM, Ken Ray wrote:

> Edouard:
>
> It's easy:
>
> on mouseDown
>   DOTHIS
> end mouseDown
>
> on mouseDoubleDown
>   DOTHAT
> end mouseDoubleDown
>
> Ken Ray
> Sons of Thunder Software
> Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Mon Nov 18 22:27:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Mon Nov 18 22:27:01 2002
Subject: on mouseDoubleDown
References: <63AB00C4-FB63-11D6-9564-000393158950@mac.com>
Message-ID: <00a901c28f7a$07629b00$6f00a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Not the first time. If you double-click you get a mouseDown, and then a
mouseDoubleDown without a second mouseDown.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Gayne" <alanIra9 at mac.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Monday, November 18, 2002 8:05 PM
Subject: Re: on mouseDoubleDown


> Hi Ken:
>
> this may only require a 1 word answer - but does a "mouseDoubleDown"
> message preempt a "mouseDown" message in the same script?
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Alan
>
> On Saturday, November 16, 2002, at 06:39  PM, Ken Ray wrote:
>
> > Edouard:
> >
> > It's easy:
> >
> > on mouseDown
> >   DOTHIS
> > end mouseDown
> >
> > on mouseDoubleDown
> >   DOTHAT
> > end mouseDoubleDown
> >
> > Ken Ray
> > Sons of Thunder Software
> > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Mon Nov 18 23:01:01 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Mon Nov 18 23:01:01 2002
Subject: Determining the user's keyboard
Message-ID: <8EAF7D98-FB72-11D6-B522-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Hail Revolution Masters!

I understand that the upcoming release (2.0) of Revolution will support 
Unicode text. I suppose that this means that the users on MacOS X will 
be able to select 'unicode' keyboards layouts (such as 'US Extended') 
for typing into text fields. My question is: is there (or will there 
be) a way for us to determine what the user's current keyboard is?

The reason for this is: using different keyboard layouts, the key 
sequences that a user has to type to 'get' certain characters is 
different. I would like to be able to change my instructions to the 
user based on their current keyboard selection.

All suggestions appreciated!

Many thanks,
--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
info at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From andre.rombauts at win.be  Tue Nov 19 01:27:01 2002
From: andre.rombauts at win.be (Andre Rombauts)
Date: Tue Nov 19 01:27:01 2002
Subject: internanl Icons with Standalone 
Message-ID: <B9FF9667.96DC%andre.rombauts@win.be>

Even if I check the relevant option in the Build dialog to include the icons
lib, internal icons are not available in dialog boxes such as ?ask? or
?answer?... :-(
Any idea.

BTW: Thanks to all public or private replies to my previous postings... No
time to replt to everyone...

Andr?
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From doupsy at wanadoo.fr  Tue Nov 19 03:59:01 2002
From: doupsy at wanadoo.fr (doupsy at wanadoo.fr)
Date: Tue Nov 19 03:59:01 2002
Subject: Different menubars for different backgrounds ?
Message-ID: <97C4043A-FB45-11D6-8D68-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>

Hello,

Is it possible, with Revolution, to create different menubars for 
different backgrounds ?
A menubar is a group of buttons, but I don't know how to attach a 
menubar to a background (a background is also a group).

Thanks

Edouard



From doupsy at wanadoo.fr  Tue Nov 19 03:59:20 2002
From: doupsy at wanadoo.fr (doupsy at wanadoo.fr)
Date: Tue Nov 19 03:59:20 2002
Subject: PopUp Menus
Message-ID: <a05111700b9ff9cb14078@[81.49.193.163]>

Hello,

Is it possible to track a menuitem which have (sub)menuitems with mouseedown.
For example, I have in my popup button this :

A
<tab>A1
<tab>A2
<tab><tab>A21
<tab><tab>A22
<tab><tab>A23
<tab>A3
B
C
D
<tab>D1


After mousedown, I should like to track for example the A2 menuitem. 
How is it possible ? (menuPick ? menuHistory ? others ?).
I should like to know also how to track nothing (if after mousedown i 
don't want to choose a menuitem and I put the cursor out of the menu 
and I mouseup).

Thanks

Edouard


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Tue Nov 19 04:33:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Tue Nov 19 04:33:01 2002
Subject: PopUp Menus
In-Reply-To: <a05111700b9ff9cb14078@[81.49.193.163]>
Message-ID: <20021119092653.98514.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>

--- doupsy at wanadoo.fr wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> Is it possible to track a menuitem which have
> (sub)menuitems with mouseedown.
> For example, I have in my popup button this :
> 
> A
> <tab>A1
> <tab>A2
> <tab><tab>A21
> <tab><tab>A22
> <tab><tab>A23
> <tab>A3
> B
> C
> D
> <tab>D1
> 
> 
> After mousedown, I should like to track for example
> the A2 menuitem. 
> How is it possible ? (menuPick ? menuHistory ?
> others ?).
> I should like to know also how to track nothing (if
> after mousedown i 
> don't want to choose a menuitem and I put the cursor
> out of the menu 
> and I mouseup).
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Edouard
>

Bonjour Edouard,

After the user has made his selection from your popup
menu, the button will be sent a 'menuPick' message.
The easiest way to handle these is a switch structure,
like this one:

on menuPick pWhichItem
  switch pWichItem
  case "Foo"
    put "Foo"
    break
  case "Bar"
    put "Bar"
    break
  end switch
end menuPick

The trick with hierarchical menus is that pWhichItem
is a composition of the item, sub-item and
sub-sub-item you picked, sepoarated by a "|".
So in the above menu structure, if the user selects
item "A23", the engine sends a menuPick to your button
with as parameter "A|A2|A23"

In conclusion, your menuPick handler should look
something like:

on menuPick pWhichItem
  switch pWichItem
  case "A|A1"
    -- do whatever is appropriate
    break
  case "A|A2|A21"
    -- do whatever is appropriate
    break
  case "A|A2|A22"
    -- do whatever is appropriate
    break
  case "A|A2|A23"
    -- do whatever is appropriate
    break
  case "A|A3"
    -- do whatever is appropriate
    break
  case "B"
    -- do whatever is appropriate
    break
  case "C"
    -- do whatever is appropriate
    break
  case "D"
    -- do whatever is appropriate
    break
  end switch
end menuPick

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Tue Nov 19 04:37:00 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Tue Nov 19 04:37:00 2002
Subject: Different menubars for different backgrounds ?
In-Reply-To: <97C4043A-FB45-11D6-8D68-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>
Message-ID: <20021119093032.33229.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>

--- doupsy at wanadoo.fr wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> Is it possible, with Revolution, to create different
> menubars for 
> different backgrounds ?
> A menubar is a group of buttons, but I don't know
> how to attach a 
> menubar to a background (a background is also a
> group).
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Edouard
> 

Bonjour Edouard,

You came very close to answering your own question.
You see: as a menubar is a group, and a group can be a
background, you can choose to set the menubar groups
'backgroundBehaviour' to true, and then 'place' it on
those cards where you want it, and 'place' a different
menubar on the other cards.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From jan.decroos at groepvanroey.be  Tue Nov 19 04:52:01 2002
From: jan.decroos at groepvanroey.be (Jan Decroos)
Date: Tue Nov 19 04:52:01 2002
Subject: repeat string: how ?
In-Reply-To: <200211182139.QAA28728@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211182139.QAA28728@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <fc.0073fc460009f2f73b9aca00365ac0c7.9f394@groepvanroey.be>

use-revolution at lists.runrev.com writes:
>Jan,
>
>How about:
>
>function InitContainer pKind,pCount,p1,p2,p3
>    if pCount<=0 then return("")
>    if pCount= "" then return "Invalid number of arguments!"
>    put 1 into tNumSteps
>    put 1 into pStartNum
>    switch pKind
>        case "n"
>            put p1 into pStartNum
>            put p2 into tNumSteps
>            put p3 into tSeparator
>            break
>        case "s"
>            put p1 into tString
>            put p2 into tSeparator
>            break
>    end switch
>    put "" into tResult
>    set the lineDel to tSeparator
>    repeat with x = pStartNum to (pStartNum+pCount) step tNumSteps
>        if pKind = "n" then put x into line x of tResult
>        if pKind = "s" then put tString into line x of tResult
>    end repeat
>    return tResult
>end InitContainer
>
>This is off the top of my head and hasn't been tested

Ken,

Some remarks, if I may ...

*) Your script asumes all arguments p1, p2 and p3 are filled when InitContainer
is called.
My function uses default values when the 3rd, the 4th or the 5th argument are
not used.
See examples in my prev. mail :
	initcontainer("n",50)			--> returns a list of 50 lines from 1 to 50
	initcontainer("n",50,101)			--> returns a list of 50 lines from 101 to 150
	initcontainer("n",50,101,2)		--> returns a list of 50 lines from 101 to 199
(step 2)
	initcontainer("n",50,101,2,comma)	--> returns a list of 50 items from 101 to
199

	initcontainer("s",50,"Revolution")	--> returns a list of 50 lines each with
"Revolution"
	initcontainer("s",50,"Revolution",tab)	--> returns a list of 50 tab separated
'items' "Revolution"

To use your script, you should always pass p1,p2 and p3 (p3 only for numbers),
so initcontainer("n",50) should be called by
initcontainer("n",50,1,1,CR).  We assume defaultvalues for them.
The greatest part of my version of this function is only for argument checking,
and is only done once in the function.  Because this function is in a
stackinuse, it's not so awfully, I think.  (we've a library with functions like
this, so we avoid to re-wrrite a repeat loop every time again)

*) initcontainer("n",50,1,1,CR) returns a container from 1 to 51  in stead of
50.
*) put ... into line x of tResult : this is not correct : you should use a line
counter which is different from the loop variable x (try
initcontainer("n",50,101,2,comma)	), BUT appending each line to tResult is
*much* faster (and easier) than putting it into line x of tResult.  So "put
...&CR after lResult", and at the end remove the last CR would be faster.


>, but it eliminates a
>bunch of "do" statements (which will improve performance)

Sorry : in my script there was only ONE (=1) do statement  executed for each
call to initcontainer !!
I had
do "repeat ... end repeat" 

and not :
"repeat ... do... end repeat"

because doing it this way I avoid an extra test for each line in the repeat
loop :
    if pKind = "n" then add lStep to lValue

>and is a bit
>shorter as well...

shorter, yes   ;-)


Jan



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Tue Nov 19 05:35:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Tue Nov 19 05:35:01 2002
Subject: The joy of animated GIF
In-Reply-To: <B9FEDF00.7DC92%rfarnold@bu.edu>
Message-ID: <CEE5E54C-FBA9-11D6-810D-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Dienstag, November 19, 2002, at 12:16  Uhr, Bob Arnold wrote:

> I have just caught up and discovered how useful animated GIFs can be 
> -- I
> have been making card-based animations since my HC days, and although 
> they
> work in RR, I have encountered some problems controlling the sequence 
> with
> sticky mousedown loops and leaky locking messages. Now the entire 
> animation
> is on one card and I can control the speed, and the sequence, by 
> sending
> messages to the image. Before I get too happy,
ROTFL

> are there any cross-platform
> issues or other problems associated with animated GIFs? So far, I have 
> only
> tested on Mac OS 9.2. Thanks.
Until now I did not see any problem in the other OSes but I did not try 
to control them. They work fine as they are...

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From malte.brill at t-online.de  Tue Nov 19 05:47:01 2002
From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill)
Date: Tue Nov 19 05:47:01 2002
Subject: The joy of animated GIF =?ISO-8859-1?B?oA==?=
Message-ID: <B9FFD395.AA%520041426354-0001@t-online.de>

Hi there,

my questions might be off topic, but if I try to resize an animated gif it
won?t work. If I try to rotate it the gif breaks and displays all the frames
in one frame. I?m a bit puzzled by this. Is there a way to resize/rotate
animated Gifs in Rev?

thanks 
Malte



From themacguy at macosx.com  Tue Nov 19 10:37:01 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Tue Nov 19 10:37:01 2002
Subject: the joy of animated GIFs
In-Reply-To: <200211190953.EAA11019@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BB1B7387-FBD3-11D6-943D-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

I am currently developing a project which will use some GIFs as 
buttons. I've found a simple, cheap program that makes the creation of 
the GIFs quite simple; it's called "iDraw". The "frames" can be 
exported as a GIF animation and seem to play perfectly in Rev using the 
default iDraw export settings. The original iDraw file can also be 
saved for future editing within the program (frame-by-frame). iDraw 
costs $40. While you can do this with Adobe's products, I'd rather save 
my money for a Rev renewal, eh? You can find iDraw by searching at 
versiontracker.com. (Yes, it's an OSX app that runs fine under 10.2.2.)

Barry



From RGould8 at aol.com  Tue Nov 19 10:47:01 2002
From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com)
Date: Tue Nov 19 10:47:01 2002
Subject: Can I do "Digest Authentification"
Message-ID: <b0.2fd25849.2b0bb544@aol.com>

Not sure if I'm describing this properly, but I've been asked to write an app 
that sends XML data to a device via TCP/IP, but the device is expecting 
"Digest Authentification" as part of the http POST method.   Can anyone tell 
me if Revolution supports this type of authentification, or if there's 
another means of doing Digest Authentification?   I'm writing this for Mac OS 
8,9 and X.

My friends on the PC-side tell me that they wrote their version with Visual 
Basic, and used some sort of Microsoft XML library, with an XML.HTTP.SEND 
call.   They said something about using an "MD5 Hash".   I'm not familiar 
with VB at all - - - I'm just hoping that Revolution has comparible support 
for such a call.   If Revolution can do this, it will make my day!

- Rob
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From dsc at swcp.com  Tue Nov 19 11:27:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Tue Nov 19 11:27:01 2002
Subject: Can I do "Digest Authentification"
In-Reply-To: <b0.2fd25849.2b0bb544@aol.com>
Message-ID: <5CE9041A-FBDA-11D6-AC6D-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Tuesday, November 19, 2002, at 08:39 AM, RGould8 at aol.com wrote:
>
> My friends on the PC-side tell me that they wrote their version with 
> Visual Basic, and used some sort of Microsoft XML library, with an 
> XML.HTTP.SEND call.? They said something about using an "MD5 Hash".? 
> I'm not familiar with VB at all - - - I'm just hoping that Revolution 
> has comparible support for such a call.? If Revolution can do this, it 
> will make my day!
>
Revolution has the MD5digest function.  There is a library that can help 
in http POST and I believe there is a way to insert headers--I have not 
used it.

For your app, you might want to simply use TCP directly.

XML libraries are about, but you may be fine by pasting together some 
strings.

Creating the digest involves some string creation and using the digest 
function a few times.

Get a good http reference.  You will need to look at a couple chapters.  
I have _HTTP Essentials_ by Stephen Thomas, but I am no judge of how 
good this is.  This will be handy even should you find Rev will do most 
of the work.  You will need an XML reference, too.  Most of those 
include much more than you need; you probably need only basic XML 
syntax, a single chapter.

The digest authentication comes in (at least) the original and 
extra-crispy, I mean, improved versions.  Check on which is used.

I hope this gets you started.

Dar Scott



From alex at mindlube.com  Tue Nov 19 11:42:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Tue Nov 19 11:42:01 2002
Subject: Can I do "Digest Authentification"
In-Reply-To: <b0.2fd25849.2b0bb544@aol.com>
Message-ID: <D4201025-FBDC-11D6-8FB9-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Tuesday, November 19, 2002, at 08:39  AM, RGould8 at aol.com wrote:

> Not sure if I'm describing this properly, but I've been asked to write 
> an app that sends XML data to a device via TCP/IP, but the device is 
> expecting "Digest Authentification" as part of the http POST method.? 
> Can anyone tell me if Revolution supports this type of 
> authentification, or if there's another means of doing Digest 
> Authentification?? I'm writing this for Mac OS 8,9 and X.
>
> My friends on the PC-side tell me that they wrote their version with 
> Visual Basic, and used some sort of Microsoft XML library, with an 
> XML.HTTP.SEND call.? They said something about using an "MD5 Hash".? 
> I'm not familiar with VB at all - - - I'm just hoping that Revolution 
> has comparible support for such a call.? If Revolution can do this, it 
> will make my day!

Rev does have a md5Digest() function. Using that you could encypt the 
username and password, and use libURLSetCustomHTTPHeaders() to 
configure the HTTP request to include the Username and Password with 
the http request. I haven't tried this, but it seems like it should 
work.

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From RGould8 at aol.com  Tue Nov 19 11:59:01 2002
From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com)
Date: Tue Nov 19 11:59:01 2002
Subject: Can I do "Digest Authentification"
Message-ID: <93.2666a01a.2b0bc652@aol.com>


In a message dated 11/19/02 11:38:15 AM, alex at mindlube.com writes:


> Rev does have a md5Digest() function. Using that you could encypt the
> username and password, and use libURLSetCustomHTTPHeaders() to
> configure the HTTP request to include the Username and Password with
> the http request. I haven't tried this, but it seems like it should
> work.
> 

> This is perfect!   Exactly what I need to do.   I'm a bit leery of the 
> learning curve in using libURLSetCustomHTTPHeaders() to configure an HTTP 
> request.   I'll dig right in starting now - - - - curious though - - - can 
> someone who has done this sort of thing share some of their samples, so I 
> don't have to re-invent the wheel?   Any assistance is greatly appreciated.
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From alex at mindlube.com  Tue Nov 19 12:11:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Tue Nov 19 12:11:01 2002
Subject: Can I do "Digest Authentification"
In-Reply-To: <93.2666a01a.2b0bc652@aol.com>
Message-ID: <F77E2D66-FBE0-11D6-8FB9-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Tuesday, November 19, 2002, at 09:52  AM, RGould8 at aol.com wrote:

>
> This is perfect!? Exactly what I need to do.? I'm a bit leery of the 
> learning curve in using libURLSetCustomHTTPHeaders() to configure an 
> HTTP request.? I'll dig right in starting now - - - - curious though - 
> - - can someone who has done this sort of thing share some of their 
> samples, so I don't have to re-invent the wheel?? Any assistance is 
> greatly appreciated.

It's not too hard. Like Dar said, get a good HTTP book, or do some 
searching on Google. Basic HTTP requests are not complex. The request 
methods commonly used are GET, HEAD, and POST. A request is a single 
line followed by a double newline. Additional headers can be added one 
per line, before the double newline. Use a terminal and a telnet 
program to experiment. Here I am using the HEAD command to get info 
about an image on runrev.com's webserver. Use GET to download stuff.

alex at darkstar->telnet runrev.com 80
Trying 64.23.0.192...
Connected to www.runrev.com.
Escape character is '^]'.
HEAD /images/home/runrev.gif HTTP/1.0 <---- I typed this line followed 
by two returns

HTTP/1.1 200 OK
Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 17:08:25 GMT
Server: Apache/1.3.22 (Unix) mod_ssl/2.8.5 OpenSSL/0.9.6
Last-Modified: Sat, 10 Nov 2001 01:47:30 GMT
ETag: "ef367-a26-3bec8732"
Accept-Ranges: bytes
Content-Length: 2598
Connection: close
Content-Type: image/gif

Connection closed by foreign host.

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From scott at tactilemedia.com  Tue Nov 19 12:44:01 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Tue Nov 19 12:44:01 2002
Subject: The joy of animated GIF =?ISO-8859-1?B?oA==?=
In-Reply-To: <B9FFD395.AA%520041426354-0001@t-online.de>
Message-ID: <B9FFB713.9471%scott@tactilemedia.com>

Recently, Malte Brill wrote:

> if I try to resize an animated gif it
> won?t work. If I try to rotate it the gif breaks and displays all the frames
> in one frame. I?m a bit puzzled by this. Is there a way to resize/rotate
> animated Gifs in Rev?

It may be the case that Rev/MC is unable to properly display a rotated
animated GIF, but I would first ask, why would you need to do this?  Any
image displayed in the GIF can be rendered as rotated.  Perhaps if you
explain what you're trying to do a solution can be found.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director

Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
Email: scott at tactilemedia.com
Web: www.tactilemedia.com



From rcozens at pon.net  Tue Nov 19 12:51:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Tue Nov 19 12:51:01 2002
Subject: The joy of animated GIF
In-Reply-To: <B9FEDF00.7DC92%rfarnold@bu.edu>
References: <B9FEDF00.7DC92%rfarnold@bu.edu>
Message-ID: <a05100300ba001075c218@[216.229.107.198]>

>are there any cross-platform
>issues or other problems associated with animated GIFs?

Hi Robert,

There's one important caveat Scott Raney posted a few days ago:

>>
about that plan of using a GIF as an image library.  It's bad
idea because the frames are all decompressed ahead of time, chewing up
large amounts of RAM for no good reason unless you're actually going
to use it for animation where performance is more important than
memory requirements.
<<

As I replied to Scott, I don't think this rules out animated gifs 
totally (see ClickClock); but as a library of large images it may not 
be the best approach.

OTOH, if your design alternative is to load all the images in a stack 
(as opposed to referencing external image files), putting them in an 
animated gif incurs no RAM hit, just the time to decompress the 
frames when the image is opened.

BTW, it is the frame decompression on opening that allows the MC 
engine to display frame x without first reading frame 1 through x-1.

Also, so far as I can tell, animated gifs cannot be resized, and 
someone else reported they don't rotate correctly.

An obvious point easily overlooked: you can't display multiple frames 
of an animated gif on the same screen at the same time.

That being said animated gifs make eminent sense in controls like 
ClickClock.gif:

   300+ small images that are designed and scripted to be used as a 
set with never a need to be display multiple images or change the 
loaction of the image.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Tue Nov 19 12:51:22 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Tue Nov 19 12:51:22 2002
Subject: ClickClock: The Penultimate Touch
Message-ID: <a05100301ba00220a8c02@[216.229.107.198]>

Hi All,

Isn't it funny how sometimes one needs to stop thinking about a 
design issue in order to receive the inspiration to solve it?

For years as I've used my HyperCard ClickClock and recently as I 
converted it to Run Rev, I've been nagged by its lack of 
interactivity.  It's hard to place twelve discreet hot spots on a 
clock face the size of a Mac icon and have the user hit the right 
spot every time.

Yesterday, after posting the Library update notice, I thought "well, 
that puppy has been put to rest for the foreseeable future."  And I 
left to see how the world beyond my office had changed in the several 
days since I went out in it.

I don't think it was more than two hours of looking at Mendocino & 
Lake (California) counties turning green after the first rain since 
April before I was aware of the nag...there must be a way to enhance 
ClickClock interactivity:

Replace hot spots with buttons?
Make hot spots transparent and change their color when the mouse enters/leaves?
Create a custom cursor set and change cursors when the mouse 
enters/leaves a hot spot?

And then, EUREKA!: Change the current frame to the one that would be 
selected if the user clicked the mouse at that moment.  A few changes 
to existing handlers, plus a mouseWithin handler, and the user can 
see the clock hand track the mouse as it moves within the image.

So the file bundles at http://www.oenolog.com/ftp/serendipity_downloader.htm
and ClickClock.rev.sgz have been updated with a new version that does 
just that.

I labeled this the penultimate touch because ideally the image should 
be resizeable and scripted so the hotspots are recalculated when the 
image is resized as well as when it is moved.

I also changed handlers so the clickClockTime message is sent to the 
image itself, which passes it up the message chain.  The original 
version sent the message to the card, which meant a clickClockTime 
handler could not reside in a group that included the image.

And while I was at it I eliminated a couple of nags in SDB Utilities:

* Compress, expand, and convert file menuPicks now offer the user the 
option to process another file rather than forcing the user to select 
the menuItem once for each file processed.

* Compress, expand, and convert file remember the the paths to the 
folders the last file was read from and written to.  If the user 
processes multiple files, ask/answer file dialogs default to the 
previous source or destination folder.

SDB Utilities.rev.sgz and the bundled Library files include this uodate.

Enjoy!
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From dsc at swcp.com  Tue Nov 19 12:51:39 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Tue Nov 19 12:51:39 2002
Subject: Can I do "Digest Authentification"
In-Reply-To: <F77E2D66-FBE0-11D6-8FB9-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <28FA3B88-FBE6-11D6-AC6D-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Tuesday, November 19, 2002, at 10:04 AM, Alex Rice wrote:

> Use a terminal and a telnet program to experiment.

You can also use a packet sniffer such as Ethereal to look at the actual 
dialog of a program that does connect to the device already.  With 
Ethereal, you can focus in on that TCP connection and see the dialog.

Some network admins will think that mortals should not be using this 
method and others might become concerned, so you might want to check 
with the right folks before doing this.

Some packet sniffers are crippled and can only see traffic to and from 
the computer it is running on.  That may be all you need and that should 
be acceptable to net cops.  Also, it shouldn't take long to get a 
snapshot of the dialog, so it might be fastest to have a network admin 
type work with you or snag it for you.

If you can isolate the device and your test computer, that will work 
well, too.

Dar Scott
Some programmer guy near the upper Rio Grande



From rcozens at pon.net  Tue Nov 19 13:03:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Tue Nov 19 13:03:01 2002
Subject: the joy of animated GIFs
In-Reply-To: <BB1B7387-FBD3-11D6-943D-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
References: <BB1B7387-FBD3-11D6-943D-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
Message-ID: <a05100302ba002a457afc@[216.229.107.169]>

>iDraw costs $40.

Hi Barry,

If you have another means of creating images in GIF, TIFF, PICT, or 
Photoshop format, Sarah recently pointed me to GifBuilder which gives 
you all you need to create animated gifs and is FREE: 
http://www.mac.org/graphics/gifbuilder/

I used it to create ClockClock.gif.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From raney at metacard.com  Tue Nov 19 13:22:01 2002
From: raney at metacard.com (Scott Raney)
Date: Tue Nov 19 13:22:01 2002
Subject: The joy of animated GIF
In-Reply-To: <200211190953.EAA11019@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211191104030.5147-100000@mast.metacard.com>

On Mon, 18 Nov 2002 Scott Rossi <scott at tactilemedia.com> wrote:

Just a minor correction here:

> In a Web browser environment, the browser has the ability store the contents
> of the first frame it encounters in the GIF, and then render each subsequent
> frame on top of the first.  The browser can also account for redundant
> pixels, meaning that your GIFs can weigh in lighter since you can eliminate
> duplicate pixels that occur in subsequent frames.  These rendering features
> are not present in Rev/MC's handling of GIFs, and may cause your GIF to
> render unexpectedly in Rev/MC.  You can work around this by rendering your
> GIFs with complete frames (including any transparency).

Actually it's not the deltas between frames that are the problem, it's
the fact that some encoders "cheat" by not even encoding the deltas
for the mask at all.  This looks right if you always go forward
through the movie and draw each frame in the same location, it won't
if you don't, nor is it possible to use the image mask to "hit test"
the image to see if the user is clicking on it.  There is a hack
workaround for this cheat that you might try if you're stuck with a
GIF that's been encoded this way and that is to set the image's
"constantMask" property to true.  Unfortunately this can't be the
default because it breaks hit-testing on images that do have the mask
properly encoded.

> Using Adobe's ImageReady for example, I create an animation as needed and
> then, using a color not present in the animation, I introduce a solid color
> frame between every frame of my original animation.  This forces ImageReady
> to generate an animated GIF without any optimization (redundant pixel
> removal, etc).  I then open the GIF in a simple GIF editor (GIFMation),
> delete all the solid color frames and resave.  The final file contains a
> complete image on every frame of the animation and is suitable for display
> in Rev/MC.  True, the filesize will weight in heavier than an optimized GIF,
> but the resulting display behavior will be predictable.

Not sure if the various GIF encoders have a specific option for
disabling only this cheat, but your workaround is a little more
brute-force than should be necessary and disables even the *legal*
delta encoding, resulting in much larger file sizes than necessary.
  Regards,
    Scott

> Regards,
> 
> Scott Rossi
> Creative Director
> Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
> -----
> E: scott at tactilemedia.com
> W: http://www.tactilemedia.com

********************************************************
Scott Raney  raney at metacard.com  http://www.metacard.com
MetaCard: You know, there's an easier way to do that...



From rcozens at pon.net  Tue Nov 19 14:07:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Tue Nov 19 14:07:01 2002
Subject: Inappropriate Interface Behaviour during mouseDown
In-Reply-To: <6E411888-FB43-11D6-975E-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
References: <6E411888-FB43-11D6-975E-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05100300ba003812b915@[216.229.107.169]>

>>Frankly, I don't believe I've ever seen this implemented, and I 
>>really question whether it is desirable behavior.  [snip]
>>
>
>Imagine the following situation:

Believe me, Igor, if you're on this list for long you will learn I am 
the first one to support anyone who says "damn convention, human 
interface guidelines, & others' opinions (after considering them): 
this is the interaction I think works best in my design."
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk  Tue Nov 19 14:38:00 2002
From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg)
Date: Tue Nov 19 14:38:00 2002
Subject: Can I do "Digest Authentification"
In-Reply-To: <93.2666a01a.2b0bc652@aol.com>
References: <93.2666a01a.2b0bc652@aol.com>
Message-ID: <p05200f00ba00369fad6f@[192.168.123.3]>

At 11:52 am -0500 19/11/02, RGould8 at aol.com wrote:
>In a message dated 11/19/02 11:38:15 AM, alex at mindlube.com writes:
>
>
>Rev does have a md5Digest() function. Using that you could encypt the
>username and password, and use libURLSetCustomHTTPHeaders() to
>configure the HTTP request to include the Username and Password with
>the http request. I haven't tried this, but it seems like it should
>work.
>
>
>
>This is perfect!  Exactly what I need to do.  I'm a bit leery of the
>learning curve in using libURLSetCustomHTTPHeaders() to configure an
>HTTP request.  I'll dig right in starting now - - - - curious though
>- - - can someone who has done this sort of thing share some of
>their samples, so I don't have to re-invent the wheel?  Any
>assistance is greatly appreciated.

I also haven't done this, but I think setting the httpHeaders will be 
easier than libURLSetCustomHTTPHeaders. libURLSetCustomHTTPHeaders 
replaces the default headers including the http request line (GET, 
POST, etc) so you have to build the complete request. Setting the 
httpHeaders just adds headers to the default set (replacing any that 
are duplicated).

The details of digest authorization can be found here:

http://ftp.ics.uci.edu/pub/ietf/http/rfc2617.txt

The header you need to set will look something like this:

Authorization: Digest (followed by various data including an 
md5Digest of the password)

It looks like you will need to convert the md5Digest output to a hex string.

The example Authorization header in the above doc splits the header 
over a number of lines. I think you will have to keep it on a single 
line when setting the httpHeaders otherwise libUrl may mess up. :(

Good luck!

Dave


From rcozens at pon.net  Tue Nov 19 15:39:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Tue Nov 19 15:39:01 2002
Subject: ClickClock: An Esoteric Detail
Message-ID: <a05100300ba004d5bb934@[216.229.107.78]>

I just uploaded what should truly be the last version of this puppy 
as ClockClock.rev.sgx.  The issue it addresses is too esoteric to 
warrant rebuilding the file bundles; so it will only be available as 
.sgz download until the next Library update (sometime in 2003?).

I'm mentioning this here (a) in case anyone has tried pasting the 
image on another stack and testing it without changing its location 
first, and (b) to make others aware of the issue in case they should 
encounter it in their distributions:

The rects of the twelve hot spots on the image are saved in the 
image's "hotHands" property.  The hot spots are relative to the loc 
of the image; so they are updated on moveControl.

The change applied to ClickClock Update 20021119 is the replacement 
of a resizeControl handler (which was non sequitur since the image 
can't be resized) with a newImage handler that resets the image's 
hotHands when it is copied & pasted onto a new stack.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From dsc at swcp.com  Tue Nov 19 15:42:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Tue Nov 19 15:42:01 2002
Subject: Can I do "Digest Authentification"
In-Reply-To: <p05200f00ba00369fad6f@[192.168.123.3]>
Message-ID: <07E5B786-FBFE-11D6-AC6D-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Tuesday, November 19, 2002, at 12:15 PM, Dave Cragg wrote:

> I also haven't done this, but

LOL!  Poor Rob Gould has to risk his career on a rumor!

Well, you have three who say it "should" work.  You have to judge 
yourself, Rob.

Dar Scott

A fool and his money are soon partying.




From RGould8 at aol.com  Tue Nov 19 16:01:01 2002
From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com)
Date: Tue Nov 19 16:01:01 2002
Subject: Can I do "Digest Authentification"
Message-ID: <a2.2f54ec87.2b0bfefe@aol.com>


In a message dated 11/19/02 3:38:05 PM, dsc at swcp.com writes:


> Well, you have three who say it "should" work.? You have to judge
> yourself, Rob.
> 
> Dar Scott
> 

ok - - - well I'm about to find out if it "should" work.   Still plunging 
through the http Digest Auth docs.
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From doupsy at wanadoo.fr  Tue Nov 19 16:07:01 2002
From: doupsy at wanadoo.fr (doupsy at wanadoo.fr)
Date: Tue Nov 19 16:07:01 2002
Subject: PopUp Menus
Message-ID: <D4F8FE3A-FBFD-11D6-8628-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>

Hello,



You wrote :
The trick with hierarchical menus is that pWhichItem
is a composition of the item, sub-item and
sub-sub-item you picked, sepoarated by a "|".
So in the above menu structure, if the user selects
item "A23", the engine sends a menuPick to your button
with as parameter "A|A2|A23"

But how is it possible to select the item "A2" ? (this was possible with 
the XFCN "FullHPop" (Rinaldi) on Hypercard).
That is, I want to know if it is possible to track a menuitem which is a 
menutiem of a menu and which is also a menu with menuitems.

Thanks

Edouard
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From themacguy at macosx.com  Tue Nov 19 16:24:00 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Tue Nov 19 16:24:00 2002
Subject: Security of program's content files
Message-ID: <46CF0918-FC04-11D6-BBEA-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

I am developing a program that will utilize many pictures, audio, and 
video files. In order to minimize memory requirements, I'm using Image 
objects and Player objects, then populating those objects with a "set 
fileName..." command. There are a number of reasons why it would not be 
wise to import all of those resources into the program.

What will be a worry, however, is the "vulnerability", so to speak, of 
the Resources folder which is where all of the files will be stored. 
I'm not particularly concerned about the folder being tossed as there 
will be an original on the distribution CD which can be copied over to 
the HD. The worry, rather, is that the "content" can be copied and used 
for other purposes by people who are not authorized to do so.

So my question is: How can I encrypt (if that's the right word) the 
files so that they are useless to anyone -except- when running my 
program?

Thanks,

Barry



From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk  Tue Nov 19 16:37:01 2002
From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg)
Date: Tue Nov 19 16:37:01 2002
Subject: Can I do "Digest Authentification"
In-Reply-To: <07E5B786-FBFE-11D6-AC6D-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
References: <07E5B786-FBFE-11D6-AC6D-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <p05200f01ba0058108402@[192.168.123.3]>

At 1:32 pm -0700 19/11/02, Dar Scott wrote:
>On Tuesday, November 19, 2002, at 12:15 PM, Dave Cragg wrote:
>
>>  I also haven't done this, but
>
>LOL!  Poor Rob Gould has to risk his career on a rumor!
>
>Well, you have three who say it "should" work.  You have to judge 
>yourself, Rob.

I'm sure it'll be a piece of cake, Rob. :)  But please let us know 
what you come up with. The truth is I just want someone else to 
interpret section 3.2.2 of the rfc on digest authorization. I'm 
trying to preserve what few brain cells I have remaining.

If only J.K. Rowling wrote rfc documents.

Cheers
Dave


From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Tue Nov 19 16:51:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (Yves =?iso-8859-1?Q?Copp=E9?=)
Date: Tue Nov 19 16:51:01 2002
Subject: PopUp Menus
In-Reply-To: <D4F8FE3A-FBFD-11D6-8628-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>
References: <D4F8FE3A-FBFD-11D6-8628-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>
Message-ID: <p05111700ba006082caf8@[10.0.1.204]>

>Hello,
>
>
>
>You wrote :
>The trick with hierarchical menus is that pWhichItem
>is a composition of the item, sub-item and
>sub-sub-item you picked, sepoarated by a "|".
>So in the above menu structure, if the user selects
>item "A23", the engine sends a menuPick to your button
>with as parameter "A|A2|A23"
>
>But how is it possible to select the item "A2" ? (this was possible 
>with the XFCN "FullHPop" (Rinaldi) on Hypercard).
>That is, I want to know if it is possible to track a menuitem which 
>is a menutiem of a menu and which is also a menu with menuitems.
>
>Thanks
>
>Edouard


I repeat that what you ask is not possible !!!!
I come from Hypercard and used the same XFCN
In Rev, it is not possible...!!!
you cannot know which submenuItem has been selected
Try :
on mouseUp
    answer the selectedtext of me
end mouseUp


you will see that the answer is wrong in the submenu's

The reason is that Apple Guidelines say it's not good to make 
subMenu's in a popUp menu...
you have to create differents popUp menu's btns

sorry
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be
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From themacguy at macosx.com  Tue Nov 19 16:57:01 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Tue Nov 19 16:57:01 2002
Subject: GifBuilder & iDraw, and "real" animation
In-Reply-To: <200211192108.QAA25392@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <DC968F94-FC08-11D6-BBEA-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

Hello, Rob!

Yes, GifBuilder would make sense if you already had the program to 
create the image "layers" elsewhere. One of the things I liked about 
iDraw is that the whole shebang (that's a technical term, eh?) is 
self-contained. iDraw still needs some enhancements in its text 
handling but for the relatively simple stuff, it's all there.

BTW, for the next level, what would you recommend for character 
animation? I'm referring to the ability to move arms and legs but have 
them linked so you would only have to grab the knee (for example) to 
have the foot raise and the femur pivot at the hip? Again, I'm looking 
for simple and inexpensive solutions that can also export as a gif.

Thanks,
Barry

On Tuesday, November 19, 2002, at 02:08 PM, 
use-revolution-request at lists.runrev.com wrote:

> If you have another means of creating images in GIF, TIFF, PICT, or
> Photoshop format, Sarah recently pointed me to GifBuilder which gives
> you all you need to create animated gifs and is FREE:
> http://www.mac.org/graphics/gifbuilder/
--------------------------------------------------------



From RGould8 at aol.com  Tue Nov 19 17:04:00 2002
From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com)
Date: Tue Nov 19 17:04:00 2002
Subject: Can I do "Digest Authentification"
Message-ID: <119.1af357fd.2b0c0dd1@aol.com>

How about this for a document on Digest Authentification - - - this seems a 
bit more readible:

http://www.rassoc.com/gregr/weblog/stories/2002/07/09/webServicesSecurityHttpD

igestAuthenticationWithoutActiveDirectory.html


In a message dated 11/19/02 4:33:16 PM, dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk writes:


> At 1:32 pm -0700 19/11/02, Dar Scott wrote:
> >On Tuesday, November 19, 2002, at 12:15 PM, Dave Cragg wrote:
> >
> >>? I also haven't done this, but
> >
> >LOL!? Poor Rob Gould has to risk his career on a rumor!
> >
> >Well, you have three who say it "should" work.? You have to judge
> >yourself, Rob.
> 
> I'm sure it'll be a piece of cake, Rob. :)? But please let us know
> what you come up with. The truth is I just want someone else to
> interpret section 3.2.2 of the rfc on digest authorization. I'm
> trying to preserve what few brain cells I have remaining.
> 
> If only J.K. Rowling wrote rfc documents.
> 
> Cheers
> Dave
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 
> 

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From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Tue Nov 19 17:16:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Tue Nov 19 17:16:01 2002
Subject: PopUp Menus
In-Reply-To: <p05111700ba006082caf8@[10.0.1.204]>
Message-ID: <B9FFF6A6.2034D%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Yves Copp? wrote:

> I repeat that what you ask is not possible !!!!
> I come from Hypercard and used the same XFCN
> In Rev, it is not possible...!!!
> you cannot know which submenuItem has been selected
> Try :
>
> on mouseUp
>   answer the selectedtext of me
> end mouseUp
>
> you will see that the answer is wrong in the submenu's
> 
> The reason is that Apple Guidelines say it's not good to make subMenu's in a
> popUp menu...
> you have to create differents popUp menu's btns

A hierarchical menu may be inappropriate for an option control per se, since
an option control is for selecting a choice from a range of options.  If you
could select a submenu in an option control what would you expect it to do?

Perhaps a cascade menumode might work for you, such as those found at the
upper right of tool palettes in Adobe and Macromedia products.  These are
commony used for ititiating commands rather than displaying a selection.

What dos your menu do?

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Tue Nov 19 17:32:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Tue Nov 19 17:32:01 2002
Subject: the joy of animated GIFs
In-Reply-To: <a05100302ba002a457afc@[216.229.107.169]>
Message-ID: <F0664CAE-FC0D-11D6-9E16-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Dienstag, November 19, 2002, at 06:55  Uhr, Rob Cozens wrote:

>> iDraw costs $40.
>
> Hi Barry,
>
> If you have another means of creating images in GIF, TIFF, PICT, or 
> Photoshop format, Sarah recently pointed me to GifBuilder which gives 
> you all you need to create animated gifs and is FREE
A good old fellow...;) But its OS9 only. iDraw is for OSX and its a 
Vector Drawing tool too. I had a short look at it.. Its not Illu;) of 
course, but very easy to use. I was surprised that it can handle 
animated gifs too..


regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From RGould8 at aol.com  Tue Nov 19 17:42:01 2002
From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com)
Date: Tue Nov 19 17:42:01 2002
Subject: Can I do "Digest Authentification"
Message-ID: <126.1ad758d2.2b0c16a0@aol.com>

Just so I'm not re-inventing the wheel here, I'm not on Revolution 2.0 yet - 
- - if I were to upgrade to Rev 2.0, would it make my life any easier trying 
to pass XML data to a device that needs Digest Authentification over TCP/IP?

In a message dated 11/19/02 4:33:16 PM, dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk writes:


> I'm sure it'll be a piece of cake, Rob. :)? But please let us know
> what you come up with. The truth is I just want someone else to
> interpret section 3.2.2 of the rfc on digest authorization. I'm
> trying to preserve what few brain cells I have remaining.
> 
> If only J.K. Rowling wrote rfc documents.
> 
> Cheers
> Dave
> 

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From scott at tactilemedia.com  Tue Nov 19 17:45:00 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Tue Nov 19 17:45:00 2002
Subject: Security of program's content files
In-Reply-To: <46CF0918-FC04-11D6-BBEA-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
Message-ID: <B9FFFD9B.55D4%scott@tactilemedia.com>

Recently, "Barry Levine"  wrote:

> I am developing a program that will utilize many pictures, audio, and
> video files. In order to minimize memory requirements, I'm using Image
> objects and Player objects, then populating those objects with a "set
> fileName..." command. There are a number of reasons why it would not be
> wise to import all of those resources into the program.
> 
> What will be a worry, however, is the "vulnerability", so to speak, of
> the Resources folder which is where all of the files will be stored.
> I'm not particularly concerned about the folder being tossed as there
> will be an original on the distribution CD which can be copied over to
> the HD. The worry, rather, is that the "content" can be copied and used
> for other purposes by people who are not authorized to do so.
> 
> So my question is: How can I encrypt (if that's the right word) the
> files so that they are useless to anyone -except- when running my
> program?

One way to protect sounds and images is to place them in stacks and then
reference them from your display stack.  If necessary you can password
protect your resource stacks.  Not sure if this method would work with
movies though since I've never tried to set the fileName of a player to
movie media in another stack.  If this doesn't work, you could import the
movie data into a user property of a stack and then write it out before you
play it, but this might be more trouble than it's worth.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-----
E: scott at tactilemedia.com
W: http://www.tactilemedia.com



From jmac at consensustech.com  Tue Nov 19 17:46:01 2002
From: jmac at consensustech.com (Jim MacConnell)
Date: Tue Nov 19 17:46:01 2002
Subject: PopUp Menus
In-Reply-To: <D4F8FE3A-FBFD-11D6-8628-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>
Message-ID: <B9FFFDCC.BA06%jmac@consensustech.com>

Hi all,

> But how is it possible to select the item "A2" ?
I'm not sure what you really want to do.

If you have a menu like
Item 1
Item 2
    Item 2.1
    Item 2.2
        Item 2.2.1
        Item 2.2.2
Item 3

such that the button looks basically like this when you select Item 2.2

Item 1
Item 2 >    Item 2.2 >  Item 2.2.1
Item 3                  Item 2.2.2

If you release the mouse while over Item 2.2 nothing happens because you
haven't actually selected a menu item.

If you move over Item 2.2.1 and release the mouse button then the result of
the menuPick is:
Item 2|Item 2.2|Item 2.2.1

If you want to track these separately, parse the result into different
variables and use them. An example of doing this would be:

put "Item 2|Item 2.2|Item 2.2.1" into menuSelection
replace "|" with "," in menuSelection
put item 2 of menuSelection
----->  "Item 2.2"

Hope this helps...

A learning newbie,
Jim



From jmac at consensustech.com  Tue Nov 19 17:54:01 2002
From: jmac at consensustech.com (Jim MacConnell)
Date: Tue Nov 19 17:54:01 2002
Subject: PopUp Menus
In-Reply-To: <p05111700ba006082caf8@[10.0.1.204]>
Message-ID: <B9FFFFA4.BA07%jmac@consensustech.com>

All,

Oooops. . . .   I forgot to mention a post Jeanne wrote last month about
this... The whole submenu thing falls apart with "Option" menu buttons. Use
popup, or pulldown, or cascade or something else. And yes I worked for about
an hour until I was smart enough to  try a different button type.

Jim


>> At 12:42 PM -0700 10/16/2002, Yves Copp? wrote:
>> I've created an option menu btn in mac OS X 10.1.5
>> The menu is a list of item and some hierarchical subMenu Item
>>
>> Hierarchical menus in option menus aren't supported. (They sort of work on
>> some platforms but not on others, and UI guidelines generally say they
>> should not be used.)
>>
>>--
>> Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com 
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From info at pixelmedia.com.au  Tue Nov 19 17:55:01 2002
From: info at pixelmedia.com.au (Igor de Oliveira Couto)
Date: Tue Nov 19 17:55:01 2002
Subject: Security of program's content files
In-Reply-To: <46CF0918-FC04-11D6-BBEA-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
Message-ID: <02B6995F-FC11-11D6-85F7-00039368B1D4@pixelmedia.com.au>

Dear Barry,

On Wednesday, November 20, 2002, at 08:17  AM, Barry Levine wrote:

> So my question is: How can I encrypt (if that's the right word) the 
> files so that they are useless to anyone -except- when running my 
> program?
>

I seem to remember seeing an XCMD somewhere that did file 
encryption/decryption. If I am correct, perhaps one of the more 
experienced users can give us a pointer towards the developer's 
website?!

Is your software going to run on Windows as well as Macs? - I think you 
can probably use AppleScript on the Mac to encode files with a 
password, even though that is not a very elegant solution...

Kind Regards,

--
Igor de Oliveira Couto
----------------------------------
info at pixelmedia.com.au
----------------------------------



From dsc at swcp.com  Tue Nov 19 18:28:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Tue Nov 19 18:28:01 2002
Subject: Can I do "Digest Authentification"
In-Reply-To: <126.1ad758d2.2b0c16a0@aol.com>
Message-ID: <2FFEB203-FC15-11D6-AC6D-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Tuesday, November 19, 2002, at 03:35 PM, RGould8 at aol.com wrote:

> Just so I'm not re-inventing the wheel here, I'm not on Revolution 2.0 
> yet - - - if I were to upgrade to Rev 2.0, would it make my life any 
> easier trying to pass XML data to a device that needs Digest 
> Authentification over TCP/IP?
>
Do you need to include a few lines like this one in your payload?

<setup ip="10.200.200.5" voltage="4.95" utility="chocolate" />

Then I wouldn't bother getting XML tools.

But, if you need to create complex nested structures that change quite a 
bit or need to worry about DTDs and other things, then one might help.  
I think Ken Ray has something that might help at 
http://www.sonsothunder.com (no f in sonsothunder) at a great price.  
(Another one of those "I've never used it, but it should work." lines.)

Dar Scott



From rfarnold at bu.edu  Tue Nov 19 20:27:01 2002
From: rfarnold at bu.edu (Bob Arnold)
Date: Tue Nov 19 20:27:01 2002
Subject: Joy of Animated GIFS: Scott Rossi
Message-ID: <BA004D84.7DCB6%rfarnold@bu.edu>

> From: Scott Rossi <scott at tactilemedia.com>
 
The following is not a cross-platform issue, but rather a
> GIF rendering issue to note: Rev/MC may not display optimized GIFs
> consistently or accurately.

Scott, thanks for the info. About the optimization issue, may I assume if it
plays fine in RR development, I won't have any problems in the stand alone?
I did optimize my animations, but don't see any rendering issues so far in
dev. Mode.

Thanks again

Bob
-- 
Robert Arnold
Associate Professor of Film
Boston University
Tel (617) 353-7735  Fax (617) 353-1084
News: http://people.bu.edu/rfarnold/Announce.htm



From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Tue Nov 19 20:30:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Tue Nov 19 20:30:01 2002
Subject: standalone:  how to safe modifications?
Message-ID: <a05200a01ba0093e4b26e@[128.196.99.210]>

hello:  i come from hypercard, and in that environment changes to the 
stack were automatically saved to it.  in RR i currently have the 
problem that i would like to safe user modifications to the 
standalone stack, in which the safe stack command doesn't work.  the 
user should be able to change some parameters of the software and 
this should be permanently stored to the stack.
	besides creating a paramter file, is there another solution? 
thank you very much.  olli.


From rcozens at pon.net  Tue Nov 19 20:40:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Tue Nov 19 20:40:01 2002
Subject: Security of program's content files
In-Reply-To: <B9FFFD9B.55D4%scott@tactilemedia.com>
References: <B9FFFD9B.55D4%scott@tactilemedia.com>
Message-ID: <a05100300ba0095b883cd@[216.229.107.140]>

>  > So my question is: How can I encrypt (if that's the right word) the
>>  files so that they are useless to anyone -except- when running my
>>  program?

Check out Rev's built-in gzip compress/decompress commands, Barry.

You might also look at base64Encode/Decode; however it appears unable 
to support binary data.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Tue Nov 19 20:40:16 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Tue Nov 19 20:40:16 2002
Subject: GifBuilder & iDraw, and "real" animation
In-Reply-To: <DC968F94-FC08-11D6-BBEA-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
References: <DC968F94-FC08-11D6-BBEA-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
Message-ID: <a05100301ba009690b696@[216.229.107.140]>

>BTW, for the next level, what would you recommend for character animation?

I'm afraid I have no experience in that area, Barry.  Perhaps Scott 
Rossi or other's with more media experience can help.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From troy at rpsystems.net  Tue Nov 19 20:58:01 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Tue Nov 19 20:58:01 2002
Subject: standalone:  how to safe modifications?
In-Reply-To: <a05200a01ba0093e4b26e@[128.196.99.210]>
Message-ID: <BA0054E8.167B4%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/19/02 8:23 PM, "Oliver Hardt" <hardt at u.arizona.edu> wrote:

> hello:  i come from hypercard, and in that environment changes to the
> stack were automatically saved to it.  in RR i currently have the
> problem that i would like to safe user modifications to the
> standalone stack, in which the safe stack command doesn't work.  the
> user should be able to change some parameters of the software and
> this should be permanently stored to the stack.
> besides creating a paramter file, is there another solution?
> thank you very much.  olli.

Olli,

Read the archives from this list. The issue is a common one, and the
available solutions have been described many, many times.

In a nutshell - save your user data in an external sub-stack.

Cheers.
-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net



From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Tue Nov 19 21:09:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Tue Nov 19 21:09:01 2002
Subject: archives:  can they be searched?
In-Reply-To: <BA0054E8.167B4%troy@rpsystems.net>
References: <BA0054E8.167B4%troy@rpsystems.net>
Message-ID: <a05200a05ba009db7ffd2@[68.129.118.98]>

hello:  i only found a browsable version of the archives to this 
list.  is there a search engine somewhere for them?  thanks.  olli.


From wmb at internettrainer.com  Tue Nov 19 21:20:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Tue Nov 19 21:20:01 2002
Subject: GifBuilder & iDraw, and "real" animation
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba009690b696@[216.229.107.140]>
Message-ID: <D2ED8613-FC2D-11D6-AF59-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Mittwoch, November 20, 2002, at 02:33  Uhr, Rob Cozens wrote:

>
>> BTW, for the next level, what would you recommend for character 
>> animation?

Apart from the classical Apps from Adobe und MM

Have a look at Toon Boom Studio:
http://www.toonboomstudio.com/
And
3D to Flash animations?
http://www.swift3d.com. Your Toon Boom

More 3D: Axel from MindAvenue
www.mindavenue.com


regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From bornstein at designeq.com  Tue Nov 19 22:50:01 2002
From: bornstein at designeq.com (Howard Bornstein)
Date: Tue Nov 19 22:50:01 2002
Subject: archives:  can they be searched?
Message-ID: <200211200344.gAK3iHF28396@mailout5-0.nyroc.rr.com>

>hello:  i only found a browsable version of the archives to this 
>list.  is there a search engine somewhere for them?  thanks.  olli.


Try this:

http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com

Regards,

Howard Bornstein
____________________
D E S I G N  E Q
www.designeq.com


From kray at sonsothunder.com  Tue Nov 19 23:56:00 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Tue Nov 19 23:56:00 2002
Subject: repeat string: how ?
References: <200211182139.QAA28728@www.runrev.com> <fc.0073fc460009f2f73b9aca00365ac0c7.9f394@groepvanroey.be>
Message-ID: <005401c2904f$88467450$b30e48a6@mckinley.dom>

> Ken,
>
> Some remarks, if I may ...
>
> *) Your script asumes all arguments p1, p2 and p3 are filled when
InitContainer
> is called.

Actually, when I originally wrote it, I was not counting on having p1, p2
and p3 filled, but I failed to change the lines that said "put p1 into
pStartNum" to "if p1 is not empty then put p1 into pStartNum. The function
should have been:

function InitContainer pKind,pCount,p1,p2,p3
    if pCount<=0 then return("")
    if pCount= "" then return "Invalid number of arguments!"
    put 1 into tNumSteps
    put 1 into pStartNum
    put cr into tSeparator
    switch pKind
        case "n"
            if p1 is not empty then put p1 into pStartNum
            if p2 is not empty then put p2 into tNumSteps
            if p3 is not empty then put p3 into tSeparator
            break
        case "s"
            put p1 into tString
            if p2 is not empty then put p2 into tSeparator
            break
    end switch
    put "" into tResult
    set the lineDel to tSeparator
    repeat with x = pStartNum to (pStartNum+pCount) step tNumSteps
        if pKind = "n" then put x into line x of tResult
        if pKind = "s" then put tString into line x of tResult
    end repeat
    return tResult
end InitContainer

In this case, the only things necessary are pKind and pCount (for numbers)
and pKind, pCount and p1 (for strings).

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Wed Nov 20 00:09:00 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Wed Nov 20 00:09:00 2002
Subject: archives:  can they be searched?
In-Reply-To: <200211200344.gAK3iHF28396@mailout5-0.nyroc.rr.com>
References: <200211200344.gAK3iHF28396@mailout5-0.nyroc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <a05200a07ba00b793ca32@[68.129.118.98]>

howard:  thanks a lot -- i never heard about this possibility!  best, olli.


11/19/02, Howard Bornstein wrote:

>>hello:  i only found a browsable version of the archives to this
>>list.  is there a search engine somewhere for them?  thanks.  olli.
>>
>Try this:
>
>http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com


From Yennie at aol.com  Wed Nov 20 00:56:01 2002
From: Yennie at aol.com (Yennie at aol.com)
Date: Wed Nov 20 00:56:01 2002
Subject: Digest Authentication
Message-ID: <7a.3139fd3e.2b0c7c73@aol.com>

I can assure you it's possible... cause I've done it!

I'd have to do some serious editing to post a complete implementation, but 
here are a few of the important handlers I came up with. The checkPassword() 
handler has been edited heavily from my original code, so it may need some 
fixing. Also note that the nonce / opaque values are not implemented ideally 
in authenticateHeader(). You'll need a basic understanding of the RFC to make 
good use of these.

Hope this helps!

function checkPassword theSocket,requestHeader, at replyHeader, at userName
   global server_opaque,server_nonce,nonce_time, loggedInIDs, loggedInNames, 
xfactor

   put "WebCF Registered Users" into realm -- default
   
   put lineOffset("Authorization:", requestHeader) into theLine
   
   if (theLine > 0) then
     -- check the authorization
     put word 1 of requestHeader into method
     put line theLine of requestHeader into authLine
     
     replace "Authorization: Digest" with empty in authLine
     set the itemDelimiter to comma
     repeat for each item theItem in authLine
       set the itemDelimiter to "="
       put item 1 of theItem into theName
       repeat until (char 1 of theName <> " ")
         delete char 1 of theName
       end repeat
       replace (theName&"=") with (theName&"?") in theItem
       set the itemDelimiter to "?"
       put item 2 of theItem into theValue
       replace quote with empty in theValue
       set the itemDelimiter to comma
       switch(theName)
       case "userName"
         put theValue into userName
         exit switch
       case "realm"
         put theValue into realm
         exit switch
       case "nonce"
         put theValue into nonce
         exit switch
       case "uri"
         put theValue into theURL
         exit switch
       case "qop"
         put theValue into qop
         exit switch
       case "nc"
         put theValue into nc
         exit switch
       case "cnonce"
         put theValue into cnonce
         exit switch
       case "response"
         put theValue into digestValue
         exit switch
       case "opaque"
         put theValue into opaque
         exit switch
       end switch
     end repeat
   else
     put authenticateHeader(realm,"auth",empty,"default") into replyHeader
     return FALSE
   end if

   ## edit this to lookup the correct password
   put empty into userID
   put lookupPassword(userName, userID) into password
   if (password is empty) then
     put authenticateHeader(realm,"auth",empty,"default") into replyHeader
     return FALSE
   end if
   
   put makeDigest(userName,password,realm,method,theURL,nonce,nc,cnonce,qop) 
into actualValue
   
   put char 1 to length(actualValue) of digestValue into digestValue
   if ((digestValue = actualValue) AND (opaque = server_opaque)) then
       put 
authenticateInfoHeader(userName,password,realm,method,theURL,server_nonce[user

Name]) into replyHeader
       put userID into loggedInIDs[theSocket]
       put userName into loggedInNames[theSocket]
       
       put base64Encode(userName&tab&thePassword) into loginValue
       SetCookie theSocket,"webcf_entry",loginValue
       return TRUE
   else
     -- failed
     put authenticateHeader(realm,"auth",empty) into replyHeader
     return FALSE
   end if
end checkPassword


function authenticateInfoHeader userName,_password,realm,method,theURL,nonce
   put makeDigest(userName,_password,realm,empty,theURL,nonce) into response
   return "Authentication-Info: next-nonce="&quote&nonce&quote&comma&"qop="&
quote&auth&quote&comma&"rspauth="&quote&response&quote
end authenticateInfoHeader

function authenticateHeader theRealm,authMethods,isStale,userName,forceNonce
   global server_opaque,server_nonce,cfLF
   if (userName is empty) then put "default" into userName
   if (server_opaque is empty) then put base64Encode(random(4*(the ticks))&
md5Digest(the ticks)) into server_opaque
   if (server_nonce is empty) OR (forceNonce) then
     put base64Encode("Dummy") into server_nonce
   end if
   if (isStale is empty) then return "HTTP/1.1 401 Unauthorized"&crLF&
"WWW-Authenticate: Digest"&&"realm="&quote&theRealm&quote&comma&"qop="&quote&
authMethods&quote&comma&"nonce="&quote&server_nonce&quote&comma&"opaque="&
quote&server_opaque&quote&comma&"algorithm="&quote&"MD5"&quote&crLF
   else
     return "HTTP/1.1 401 Unauthorized"&crLF&"Connection: close"&crLF&
"WWW-Authenticate: Digest"&&"realm="&quote&theRealm&quote&comma&"qop="&quote&
authMethods&quote&comma&"nonce="&quote&server_nonce&quote&comma&"opaque="&
quote&server_opaque&quote&comma&"stale="&isStale&",algorithm="&quote&"MD5"&
quote&crLF
   end if
end authenticateHeader

function makeDigest 
userName,_password,realm,method,theURL,nonce,nc,cnonce,qop
   put md5Digest(userName&colon&realm&colon&_password) into A1
   get binaryDecode("H*",A1,A1)
   put md5Digest(method&colon&theURL) into A2
   get binaryDecode("H*",A2,A2)
   if (qop is empty) then
     put md5Digest(A1&colon&nonce&colon&A2) into actualValue
   else
     put md5Digest(A1&colon&nonce&colon&nc&colon&cnonce&colon&qop&colon&A2) 
into actualValue
   end if
   get binaryDecode("H*",actualValue,actualValue)
   return actualvalue
end makeDigest


> 
> I'm sure it'll be a piece of cake, Rob. :)? But please let us know 
> what you come up with. The truth is I just want someone else to 
> interpret section 3.2.2 of the rfc on digest authorization. I'm 
> trying to preserve what few brain cells I have remaining.
> 

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From malte.brill at t-online.de  Wed Nov 20 02:07:01 2002
From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill)
Date: Wed Nov 20 02:07:01 2002
Subject: The joy of animated Gif -> Scott Rossi
Message-ID: <BA00F19D.B7%520041426354-0001@t-online.de>

>It may be the case that Rev/MC is unable to properly display a rotated
>animated GIF, but I would first ask, why would you need to do this?  Any
>image displayed in the GIF can be rendered as rotated.  Perhaps if you
>explain what you're trying to do a solution can be found.

Hi Scott,

the main problem is resizing. I?m trying to do a "pseudo-3D" Demo with some
little space ships. When my ship moves into z-space I need to scale it
smaller, but resizing fails. I was trying to rotate the GIF when moving the
ship on a circular path, but I guess that really could be done with some
more frames in my animation and setting the currentframe properly.

BTW: I use Photoshop Elements for creating animated GIFs. It is really my
favourite because it is cheap (about 80 Euro) and a very powerful tool.

regards,

Malte



From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Wed Nov 20 02:12:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Wed Nov 20 02:12:01 2002
Subject: error message: Line/Character
In-Reply-To: <D4F8FE3A-FBFD-11D6-8628-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>
Message-ID: <20021120070545.69084.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com>

"Line: 1011 Character: 7"

a way to make the script editor show line #s?

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From doupsy at wanadoo.fr  Wed Nov 20 04:40:01 2002
From: doupsy at wanadoo.fr (doupsy at wanadoo.fr)
Date: Wed Nov 20 04:40:01 2002
Subject: PopUp Menus
Message-ID: <B27F4C3E-FC50-11D6-ADCE-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>

Hello,

Thanks for everybody for my questions about PopUp Menus et the choice of 
a menuitem which is also a menu :
- it is possible in Hypercard with XFCN FullHPop
- it is not possible with Revolution according with the Human Interface 
Guidelines of Apple.

The solution of my questions can be this :

If you have a menu like
Item 1
Item 2
     Item 2.1
     Item 2.2
         Item 2.2.1
         Item 2.2.2
Item 3

such that the button looks basically like this when you select Item 2.2

Item 1
Item 2 >    Item 2.2 >  Item 2.2.1
Item 3                  Item 2.2.2

The solution is to put (in this example) Item 2.2 into Item 2.2. like 
this :

Item 1
Item 2 >    Item 2.2 >  Item 2.2
Item 3                  Item 2.2.1
                         Item 2.2.2

Thanks

Edouard
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From gsaylor at net-virtual.com  Wed Nov 20 04:48:01 2002
From: gsaylor at net-virtual.com (Greg Saylor)
Date: Wed Nov 20 04:48:01 2002
Subject: Valentina and OS-X (Darwin) revisited...
In-Reply-To: <200207120541.BAA29999@www.runrev.com>
References: <200207120541.BAA29999@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <20021120094231.28904@mail.earthlink.net>

Hello,

A long time ago (8 months or so) I had posted about using Valentina under
OS-X Darwin...   Unfortunately the lack of this ability has held up my
project for over a year now - and this was only discovered after having
purchased Revolution...  So Revolution has basically been a complete bust
for me due to this issue... ;-(   I even convinced one of my clients to
purchase a license as well, but thankfully the mistake of purchasing it
for use as a database application was one that I made on my own dime and
not my client's...  

I just tried the revdb under Darwin and it doesn't work either:

#!Darwin

on startUp
        get revdb_connect("Valentina","","faa.vdb")                
        put "Hello WOrld!" into tresponse
        put tresponse
end startUp


NOTE: If I comment out the "get revdb_connect" line this script does what
is expected (it prints "Hello World!" to the console)...  If I don't I
get the following result:

[host100:Revolution 1.1.1/components/engines] root# ./test
Darwin exiting on signal 10
[host100:Revolution 1.1.1/components/engines] root#


What this all comes down to is that I have to get this project start --
which should have been finished by now.. And my Revolution license which
has been doing nothing but collecting dust is coming up for renewal...

Is it possible to either use Valentina with the Darwin engine or at least
to get the OS-X engine to function correctly from the command line?  

It remains baffling to me that the developers of these respective
products have not yet integrated their products to work together at the
command-line...  Practically every database product worth any amount of
salt has the ability to manipulate the data using command-line tools...

It is enough of a burden to have to learn this new transcript language
and development environment which is extremely inefficient (at least to
me)...  I like to have vi open in one window and execute my scripts from
another window.. The fact that I have to keep draggin' a mouse all over
the screen just to get something to work is simply a distraction -
especially when trying to conceptualize some process which should operate
entirely automated without any human interaction....

Sorry if I sound bitter, but I am... I have never bought a product before
that I was so excited about and after almost a year still been unable to
realize any value from it....

Thanks for listening to me gripe!

- Greg

P.S. THe "windowless OS-X" as well as writing Applescript junk to speak
to the OS-X engine are not acceptable options here either... I have found
both to be unreliable and clumsy to script automated processes with - if
they would even work for this anyways....

P.S.S. I have also tried:

#!/usr/bin/open ~/Revolution/components/engines/MacOSPPC

on startUp
        put "Hello WOrld!" into tresponse
        put tresponse
end startUp


However, the MacOSPPC engine does not seem to accept "scripts" because it
just starts up the development environment instead of executing the
code.....  (THis would probably be the best solution - to make the
MacOSPPC engine work like a UNIX engine when called from a command-line
script, if possible)...


P.S.S.S. I have tried lots of other stuff too - this just doesn't seem to
work but I can't remember everything I tried....



From jan.decroos at groepvanroey.be  Wed Nov 20 04:59:01 2002
From: jan.decroos at groepvanroey.be (Jan Decroos)
Date: Wed Nov 20 04:59:01 2002
Subject: repeat string: how ?
In-Reply-To: <200211200557.AAA07295@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211200557.AAA07295@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <fc.0073fc460009f81e3b9aca00161ac208.9f87c@groepvanroey.be>

use-revolution at lists.runrev.com writes:
>
>Actually, when I originally wrote it, I was not counting on having p1, p2
>and p3 filled, but I failed to change the lines that said "put p1 into
>pStartNum" to "if p1 is not empty then put p1 into pStartNum. The function
>should have been:
>
>function InitContainer pKind,pCount,p1,p2,p3
>    if pCount<=0 then return("")
>    if pCount= "" then return "Invalid number of arguments!"
>    put 1 into tNumSteps
>    put 1 into pStartNum
>    put cr into tSeparator
>    switch pKind
>        case "n"
>            if p1 is not empty then put p1 into pStartNum
>            if p2 is not empty then put p2 into tNumSteps
>            if p3 is not empty then put p3 into tSeparator
>            break
>        case "s"
>            put p1 into tString
>            if p2 is not empty then put p2 into tSeparator
>            break
>    end switch
>    put "" into tResult
>    set the lineDel to tSeparator
>    repeat with x = pStartNum to (pStartNum+pCount) step tNumSteps
>        if pKind = "n" then put x into line x of tResult
>        if pKind = "s" then put tString into line x of tResult
>    end repeat
>    return tResult
>end InitContainer
>
>In this case, the only things necessary are pKind and pCount (for numbers)
>and pKind, pCount and p1 (for strings).

Agree, BUT
now you can't have an empty separator !
(was the original question by alrice at swcp.com  : 

"fu" x 20 => fufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufufu
)

my InitContainer("s",3,"a","")  -->  "aaa"
your InitContainer("s",3,"a","") --> "a"&CR&"a"&CR&"a"&CR&"a" :
	- CR as separator in stead of empty
	- 4 lines because (see earlier: x is not the destination line number (use a
2nd variable, or better use "put ...&CR after tResult"))
	- In the repeat, there should be an 'else if' in stead of the 2nd 'if', to
avoid unnecessary tests.

I did some speed tests, and asuming your InitConatiner returns the exact
result, here are the results :
(called your function "initContainer2")

on mouseUp
  
  put the milliseconds into ms
  put initContainer("s",10000,"aaaa") into p
  put the milliseconds - ms into lRes
  
  put the milliseconds into ms
  put initContainer2("s",10000,"aaaa") into p
  put space&(the milliseconds - ms) after lRes
  
  put the milliseconds into ms
  put initContainer("n",10000) into p
  put space&(the milliseconds - ms) after lRes
  
  put the milliseconds into ms
  put initContainer2("n",10000) into p
  put space&(the milliseconds - ms) after lRes
  
  put lRes
end mouseUp


lRes : (In the msg box :)  20 6054 473 6380  (20 (my result) <-> 6054 (your
result)  and 473 (my result) <> 6380 (your result) !!!)

The first part of my initContainer (argument checking) takes .... zero to one
milliseconds !!


Jan



From klausimausi at mac.com  Wed Nov 20 05:00:01 2002
From: klausimausi at mac.com (Klaus Major)
Date: Wed Nov 20 05:00:01 2002
Subject: GifBuilder & iDraw, and "real" animation
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba009690b696@[216.229.107.140]>
Message-ID: <2F6A2CD0-FC6E-11D6-94A6-003065D52E8E@mac.com>

Hi barry

>> BTW, for the next level, what would you recommend for character 
>> animation?

take a look at:

www.lostmarble.com

They sell a wonder- and powerful tool named Moho.

Great for animations, even character animation.

Don't know if it can output gifs, but it produces QT-movies and Flash.

And it is affordable, i think... 99 US $.

Download a demo and play with it.

It might please you :-)


Regards

Klaus Major
klausimausi at mac.com



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Wed Nov 20 06:06:02 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Wed Nov 20 06:06:02 2002
Subject: Valentina and OS-X (Darwin) revisited...
In-Reply-To: <20021120094231.28904@mail.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20021120110021.13734.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Greg Saylor <gsaylor at net-virtual.com> wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> A long time ago (8 months or so) I had posted about
> using Valentina under
> OS-X Darwin...   Unfortunately the lack of this
> ability has held up my
> project for over a year now - and this was only
> discovered after having
> purchased Revolution...  So Revolution has basically
> been a complete bust
> for me due to this issue... ;-(   I even convinced
> one of my clients to
> purchase a license as well, but thankfully the
> mistake of purchasing it
> for use as a database application was one that I
> made on my own dime and
> not my client's...  
> 
> I just tried the revdb under Darwin and it doesn't
> work either:
> 
> #!Darwin
> 
> on startUp
>         get revdb_connect("Valentina","","faa.vdb") 
>               
>         put "Hello WOrld!" into tresponse
>         put tresponse
> end startUp
> 
> 
> NOTE: If I comment out the "get revdb_connect" line
> this script does what
> is expected (it prints "Hello World!" to the
> console)...  If I don't I
> get the following result:
> 
> [host100:Revolution 1.1.1/components/engines] root#
> ./test
> Darwin exiting on signal 10
> [host100:Revolution 1.1.1/components/engines] root#
> 
> 
> What this all comes down to is that I have to get
> this project start --
> which should have been finished by now.. And my
> Revolution license which
> has been doing nothing but collecting dust is coming
> up for renewal...
> 
> Is it possible to either use Valentina with the
> Darwin engine or at least
> to get the OS-X engine to function correctly from
> the command line?  
> 
> It remains baffling to me that the developers of
> these respective
> products have not yet integrated their products to
> work together at the
> command-line...  Practically every database product
> worth any amount of
> salt has the ability to manipulate the data using
> command-line tools...
> 
> It is enough of a burden to have to learn this new
> transcript language
> and development environment which is extremely
> inefficient (at least to
> me)...  I like to have vi open in one window and
> execute my scripts from
> another window.. The fact that I have to keep
> draggin' a mouse all over
> the screen just to get something to work is simply a
> distraction -
> especially when trying to conceptualize some process
> which should operate
> entirely automated without any human interaction....
> 
> Sorry if I sound bitter, but I am... I have never
> bought a product before
> that I was so excited about and after almost a year
> still been unable to
> realize any value from it....
> 
> Thanks for listening to me gripe!
> 
> - Greg
> 
> P.S. THe "windowless OS-X" as well as writing
> Applescript junk to speak
> to the OS-X engine are not acceptable options here
> either... I have found
> both to be unreliable and clumsy to script automated
> processes with - if
> they would even work for this anyways....
> 
> P.S.S. I have also tried:
> 
> #!/usr/bin/open
> ~/Revolution/components/engines/MacOSPPC
> 
> on startUp
>         put "Hello WOrld!" into tresponse
>         put tresponse
> end startUp
> 
> 
> However, the MacOSPPC engine does not seem to accept
> "scripts" because it
> just starts up the development environment instead
> of executing the
> code.....  (THis would probably be the best solution
> - to make the
> MacOSPPC engine work like a UNIX engine when called
> from a command-line
> script, if possible)...
> 
> 
> P.S.S.S. I have tried lots of other stuff too - this
> just doesn't seem to
> work but I can't remember everything I tried....
> 


Hi Greg,

Just to clear a few things up, as they are in my head:
1) There is no 'Darwin' version of Valentina.
2) If you're running the 'cgi' version of RunRev, you
have no access to the libraries such as the database
and printing libraries.
3) Those libraries should be present in the version
2.0 of the 'cgi' app ; but you'd still be limited in
what you can do under Darwin as it has no ODBC or
Valentina.

Thus I'd recommand the following path:
1) Run full MacOSX on the machine
2) Build your own cgi-server with RunRev ; Gary
Rathbone from this list has posted an example stack on
the RunRev Newbie Board.

This way you can make sure all the libraries are
loaded and the connection to the Valentina database is
opened at the start.
Moreover, you could more easily maintain your cgi's as
they're in a single stack instead of a collection of
text files.

Hope this helped, even if it wasn't the answer you
were looking for.

Best regards,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From wmb at internettrainer.com  Wed Nov 20 06:14:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Wed Nov 20 06:14:01 2002
Subject: GifBuilder & iDraw, and "real" animation
In-Reply-To: <2F6A2CD0-FC6E-11D6-94A6-003065D52E8E@mac.com>
Message-ID: <52139BB3-FC78-11D6-95A3-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Mittwoch, November 20, 2002, at 10:55  Uhr, Klaus Major wrote:

> www.lostmarble.com
>
> They sell a wonder- and powerful tool named Moho.
>
> Great for animations, even character animation.
>
> Don't know if it can output gifs, but it produces QT-movies and Flash.
>
> And it is affordable, i think... 99 US $.
>
> Download a demo and play with it.
>
> It might please you :-)

Woooow. Looks great!

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From klausimausi at mac.com  Wed Nov 20 06:57:01 2002
From: klausimausi at mac.com (Klaus Major)
Date: Wed Nov 20 06:57:01 2002
Subject: GifBuilder & iDraw, and "real" animation
In-Reply-To: <52139BB3-FC78-11D6-95A3-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <8002AB26-FC7E-11D6-94A6-003065D52E8E@mac.com>

Hi Wolfgang and all,

here is a great URL that will give you fantastic hints on how to
use MOHO effectively.

For example a "bones"-tutorial and more...

And it's free :-)

>> www.lostmarble.com
>>
>> They sell a wonder- and powerful tool named Moho.
>> Great for animations, even character animation.
>> Don't know if it can output gifs, but it produces QT-movies and Flash.
>> And it is affordable, i think... 99 US $.
>> Download a demo and play with it.
>> It might please you :-)
>
> Woooow. Looks great!
>
> regards
> Wolfgang M. Bereuter


Regards

Klaus Major
klausimausi at mac.com



From Doug_Ivers at lord.com  Wed Nov 20 08:03:01 2002
From: Doug_Ivers at lord.com (Ivers, Doug E)
Date: Wed Nov 20 08:03:01 2002
Subject: 31142 lines/cards/records
Message-ID: <E08533A454364A4C8B395EA007D1F423097681@ntsrvcrd04.main.lord.com>

How do I define a constant array and insert values outside of all handlers at the top of a script?  Is it possible?

I tried this:

constant myArray_c[1] = "left"
constant myArray_c[2] = "mid"
constant myArray_c[3] = "right"



-- D


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Geoff Canyon [mailto:gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, October 22, 2002 12:53 PM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Re: 31142 lines/cards/records
> 
> 
> At 10:05 AM -0600 10/22/02, Dar Scott wrote:
> >On Tuesday, October 22, 2002, at 09:18 AM, Terry Vogelaar wrote:
> >
> >> I could make a comma delimited
> >> field with 31142 lines, a stack with 31142 cards or a 
> database with 31142
> >> records.
> >
> >Is there a particular reason why arrays are not on your 
> list?  Does this mean you have no field (combination) that is 
> unique?  Are there operations you need that arrays can't do well?
> >
> >I'm not really advocating arrays.  I'm too green to do that. 
>  It's just I wouldn't have thrown out arrays as candidates.
> 
> It's borderline, but I'd go with text/arrays. A stack with 
> 30,000 cards will be painfully slow to open. A database is 
> also an option, but as long as a restriction to new-ish 
> hardware isn't an issue, I'd probably stick with text/arrays.
> -- 
> 
> regards,
> 
> Geoff Canyon
> gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Wed Nov 20 09:44:00 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Wed Nov 20 09:44:00 2002
Subject: 31142 lines/cards/records
In-Reply-To: <E08533A454364A4C8B395EA007D1F423097681@ntsrvcrd04.main.lord.com>
Message-ID: <20021120143738.688.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>

--- "Ivers, Doug E" <Doug_Ivers at lord.com> wrote:
> How do I define a constant array and insert values
> outside of all handlers at the top of a script?  Is
> it possible?
> 
> I tried this:
> 
> constant myArray_c[1] = "left"
> constant myArray_c[2] = "mid"
> constant myArray_c[3] = "right"
> 
> 
> 
> -- D
> 

Hi Doug,

In the Transcript dictionary it is explained that the
'constant' command only works for numbers, characters,
logical values and strings.
So I'd say it isn't possible.

Best regards,

Jan Schenkel.

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 20 12:20:00 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 20 12:20:00 2002
Subject: 31142 lines/cards/records
In-Reply-To: <20021120143738.688.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021120143738.688.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <a05100303ba016a8a1ee1@[216.229.107.140]>

>--- "Ivers, Doug E" <Doug_Ivers at lord.com> wrote:
>>  How do I define a constant array and insert values
>>  outside of all handlers at the top of a script?  Is
>>  it possible?
>>
>>  I tried this:
>>
>>  constant myArray_c[1] = "left"
>>  constant myArray_c[2] = "mid"
>>  constant myArray_c[3] = "right"
>>
>>
>>
>>  -- D
>>
>
>Hi Doug,
>
>In the Transcript dictionary it is explained that the
>'constant' command only works for numbers, characters,
>logical values and strings.
>So I'd say it isn't possible.

I think Jan is correct, Doug; but here is a workaround

constant left = 1
constant mid = 2
constant right = 3

put leftValue into myArray_c left]
put midValue into myArray_c[mid]
put rightValue into myArray_c[right]

get myArray[alignBy] -- assumes alignBy is "left", "mid", or "right"

Since I don't know the the details of what you are trying to 
accomplish, you may need to tweek it a bit.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 20 12:20:19 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 20 12:20:19 2002
Subject: error message: Line/Character
In-Reply-To: <20021120070545.69084.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021120070545.69084.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <a05100304ba016ddfe75c@[216.229.107.140]>

>"Line: 1011 Character: 7"
>
>a way to make the script editor show line #s?

Hi Erik,

I can't find a way to display the line #s; but you can navigate to a 
specific line by selecting "Go To Line" from the "View" menu.  When I 
select "Go To Line" from CodeWarrior, the line number box shows the 
current line number; but RunRev's line # box comes up empty.

You should note that v2.0 will contain a major modification to the 
Script Editor (or was it the Debugger?); so I'd wait to see what's in 
2.0 before submitting an enhancement request.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 20 12:20:34 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 20 12:20:34 2002
Subject: Security of program's content files
In-Reply-To: <a05100300ba0095b883cd@[216.229.107.140]>
References: <B9FFFD9B.55D4%scott@tactilemedia.com>
 <a05100300ba0095b883cd@[216.229.107.140]>
Message-ID: <a05100305ba016fab538a@[216.229.107.140]>

>
>>  > So my question is: How can I encrypt (if that's the right word) the
>>>  files so that they are useless to anyone -except- when running my
>>>  program?
>
>Check out Rev's built-in gzip compress/decompress commands, Barry.

Hi Again, Barry.

To be more explicit, you can:

set the "image"&anImageName of this stack to compress (URL 
("binFile:"&anImageName))

get the "image"&anImageName of this stack
put decompress(it) into URL ("binFile:"&anImageName)
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From raney at metacard.com  Wed Nov 20 12:43:01 2002
From: raney at metacard.com (Scott Raney)
Date: Wed Nov 20 12:43:01 2002
Subject: Valentina and OS-X (Darwin) revisited...
In-Reply-To: <200211201701.MAA19449@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211201014350.7451-100000@mast.metacard.com>

On Wed, 20 Nov 2002 Greg Saylor <gsaylor at net-virtual.com> wrote:

> A long time ago (8 months or so) I had posted about using Valentina under
> OS-X Darwin...   Unfortunately the lack of this ability has held up my
> project for over a year now - and this was only discovered after having
> purchased Revolution...  So Revolution has basically been a complete bust
> for me due to this issue... ;-(   I even convinced one of my clients to
> purchase a license as well, but thankfully the mistake of purchasing it
> for use as a database application was one that I made on my own dime and
> not my client's...  
> 
> I just tried the revdb under Darwin and it doesn't work either:

Unfortunately you're way off in the weeds here: not only have you not
specified where that DLL is to be loaded (hint, you need to "start
using" a stack to use an external in a console app), but the Darwin
engine doesn't even support resource or bundle-format externals, and
neither revdb nor Valentina have been built in the older format.

> #!Darwin
> 
> on startUp
>         get revdb_connect("Valentina","","faa.vdb")                
>         put "Hello WOrld!" into tresponse
>         put tresponse
> end startUp
> 
> 
> NOTE: If I comment out the "get revdb_connect" line this script does what
> is expected (it prints "Hello World!" to the console)...  If I don't I
> get the following result:
> 
> [host100:Revolution 1.1.1/components/engines] root# ./test
> Darwin exiting on signal 10
> [host100:Revolution 1.1.1/components/engines] root#

This is a bug: it should give you an execution error report here (not
that this helps you much because it still wouldn't work).

Your problems are complicated by the fact that RR was never upgraded
to the MetaCard 2.4.3 Carbon engine, which is the only one you have
any hope of getting externals to work in CGI mode with.  Even then, I
don't know if revdb will work with it and am sure that it's not
supported even if it did.

Note that I *do* think you could get this to work using the VXCMD
external directly with the MetaCard 2.4.3 Carbon engine, however.  Not
that we're volunteering to provide support for this, seeing as how you
didn't buy MetaCard ;-)  Maybe the developers of VXCMD can help you...

> What this all comes down to is that I have to get this project start --
> which should have been finished by now.. And my Revolution license which
> has been doing nothing but collecting dust is coming up for renewal...
> 
> Is it possible to either use Valentina with the Darwin engine or at least
> to get the OS-X engine to function correctly from the command line?  

The latter I believe to be possible.  Note that this whole area is
still in flux, though, and you'll have to do things a little
differently for the upcoming MC 2.5/RR 2.0 release because the Carbon
engine is now Mach-O format and so will require a different external
format (a bundle).

> It remains baffling to me that the developers of these respective
> products have not yet integrated their products to work together at the
> command-line...  Practically every database product worth any amount of
> salt has the ability to manipulate the data using command-line tools...

Keep in mind that you're not using a database product, you're using an
application development environment.  Since 99% of the work done with
MC/RR is graphical, you've kind of got to expect a certain roughness
if you're going to use if for something else.  About all I can
guarantee is that you'll find doing CGI in MC/RR a lot easier than
doing GUI development in Perl ;-)

> It is enough of a burden to have to learn this new transcript language
> and development environment which is extremely inefficient (at least to
> me)...  I like to have vi open in one window and execute my scripts from
> another window.. The fact that I have to keep draggin' a mouse all over
> the screen just to get something to work is simply a distraction -
> especially when trying to conceptualize some process which should operate
> entirely automated without any human interaction....

This all works fine: no need to use the graphical IDE to develop your
scripts.  But you do have to use the Darwin engine (no external
support) or the newest MC Carbon engines.

As an aside, and not that you need yet another thing to learn, but
using vi for application development is strictly for lightweights
IMHO.  Real programmers use Emacs ;-)

> However, the MacOSPPC engine does not seem to accept "scripts" because it
> just starts up the development environment instead of executing the
> code.....  (THis would probably be the best solution - to make the
> MacOSPPC engine work like a UNIX engine when called from a command-line
> script, if possible)...

This is not even theoretically possible: there is no stdio support in
the Classic OS.
  Regards,
    Scott

********************************************************
Scott Raney  raney at metacard.com  http://www.metacard.com
MetaCard: You know, there's an easier way to do that...



From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 20 13:14:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 20 13:14:01 2002
Subject: Valentina and OS-X (Darwin) revisited...
In-Reply-To: <20021120094231.28904@mail.earthlink.net>
References: <200207120541.BAA29999@www.runrev.com>
 <20021120094231.28904@mail.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <a05100307ba017bbe29bc@[216.229.107.176]>

>A long time ago (8 months or so) I had posted about using Valentina under
>OS-X Darwin...   Unfortunately the lack of this ability has held up my
>project for over a year now

My sympathies, Greg.

Exactly what db capabilities are you looking for?  I believe 
Valentina is single-user (someone please correct me if I'm wrong); so 
unless you already have a Revolution app using Valentina on another 
platform or require SQL compatibility, you might download & evaluate 
the SDB handlers in Serendipity Library 
<http://www.oenolog.com/ftp/serendipity_downloader.htm>.

SDB is a single-user write, multi-user read-only, hierarchical 
database written in Transcript (no extensions or cross-platform 
changes required).  It includes a SDB Utility standalone to create, 
edit, backup, & restore SDB databases, gzip compress/decompress any 
individual file, and convert text file line endings to the 
appropriate character(s) for any platform.  The dbs include password 
protection and the ability to import/export records from/to delimited 
text files.

If you would like to contact me privately with more details of your 
specific db requirements, I can give you a better idea of whether SDB 
might be appropriate.

BTW, Serendipity Library is available free of charge and SDB database 
applications may be distributed royalty-free.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From diskot123 at juno.com  Wed Nov 20 13:33:01 2002
From: diskot123 at juno.com (Tuviah M Snyder)
Date: Wed Nov 20 13:33:01 2002
Subject: Valentina and OS-X (Darwin) revisited...
Message-ID: <20021120.132437.692.1.diskot123@juno.com>

>A long time ago (8 months or so) I had posted about using Valentina
under
>OS-X Darwin...   Unfortunately the lack of this ability has held up my
>project for over a year now - and this was only discovered after having
>purchased Revolution...  So Revolution has basically been a complete
bust
>for me due to this issue... ;-(   I even convinced one of my clients to
>purchase a license as well, but thankfully the mistake of purchasing it
>for use as a database application was one that I made on my own dime and
>not my client's...  
Will work in 2.0. The problem was that externals were tied to resources
in the resource fork , which could not be loaded reliably in windowless
mode, now they are compiled as bundles (separate files like DLLs). Yes
we're listening.

>1) There is no 'Darwin' version of Valentina.
It's called VXCMD-Macho. Version 2.0 of Rev will also be a Mach-O (or Mac
OSX native executable). I've been working with the folks at Paradigmasoft
on this.

> but you'd still be limited in
>what you can do under Darwin as it has no ODBC or
>Valentina.
Version 2.0 will support ODBC (iODBC) and Valentina under Darwin.

Tuviah


From gsaylor at net-virtual.com  Wed Nov 20 14:10:01 2002
From: gsaylor at net-virtual.com (Greg Saylor)
Date: Wed Nov 20 14:10:01 2002
Subject: Valentina and OS-X (Darwin) revisited...
In-Reply-To: <200211201701.MAA19449@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211201701.MAA19449@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <20021120190433.10714@mail.earthlink.net>

>> Hello,
>> 
>> A long time ago (8 months or so) I had posted about
>> using Valentina under
>> OS-X Darwin...   Unfortunately the lack of this
>> ability has held up my
>> project for over a year now - and this was only
>> discovered after having
>> purchased Revolution...  So Revolution has basically
>> been a complete bust
>> for me due to this issue... ;-(   I even convinced
>> one of my clients to
>> purchase a license as well, but thankfully the
>> mistake of purchasing it
>> for use as a database application was one that I
>> made on my own dime and
>> not my client's...  
>> 
>> I just tried the revdb under Darwin and it doesn't
>> work either:
>> 
>> #!Darwin
>> 
>> on startUp
>>         get revdb_connect("Valentina","","faa.vdb") 
>>               
>>         put "Hello WOrld!" into tresponse
>>         put tresponse
>> end startUp
>> 
>> 
>> NOTE: If I comment out the "get revdb_connect" line
>> this script does what
>> is expected (it prints "Hello World!" to the
>> console)...  If I don't I
>> get the following result:
>> 
>> [host100:Revolution 1.1.1/components/engines] root#
>> ./test
>> Darwin exiting on signal 10
>> [host100:Revolution 1.1.1/components/engines] root#
>> 
>> 
>> What this all comes down to is that I have to get
>> this project start --
>> which should have been finished by now.. And my
>> Revolution license which
>> has been doing nothing but collecting dust is coming
>> up for renewal...
>> 
>> Is it possible to either use Valentina with the
>> Darwin engine or at least
>> to get the OS-X engine to function correctly from
>> the command line?  
>> 
>> It remains baffling to me that the developers of
>> these respective
>> products have not yet integrated their products to
>> work together at the
>> command-line...  Practically every database product
>> worth any amount of
>> salt has the ability to manipulate the data using
>> command-line tools...
>> 
>> It is enough of a burden to have to learn this new
>> transcript language
>> and development environment which is extremely
>> inefficient (at least to
>> me)...  I like to have vi open in one window and
>> execute my scripts from
>> another window.. The fact that I have to keep
>> draggin' a mouse all over
>> the screen just to get something to work is simply a
>> distraction -
>> especially when trying to conceptualize some process
>> which should operate
>> entirely automated without any human interaction....
>> 
>> Sorry if I sound bitter, but I am... I have never
>> bought a product before
>> that I was so excited about and after almost a year
>> still been unable to
>> realize any value from it....
>> 
>> Thanks for listening to me gripe!
>> 
>> - Greg
>> 
>> P.S. THe "windowless OS-X" as well as writing
>> Applescript junk to speak
>> to the OS-X engine are not acceptable options here
>> either... I have found
>> both to be unreliable and clumsy to script automated
>> processes with - if
>> they would even work for this anyways....
>> 
>> P.S.S. I have also tried:
>> 
>> #!/usr/bin/open
>> ~/Revolution/components/engines/MacOSPPC
>> 
>> on startUp
>>         put "Hello WOrld!" into tresponse
>>         put tresponse
>> end startUp
>> 
>> 
>> However, the MacOSPPC engine does not seem to accept
>> "scripts" because it
>> just starts up the development environment instead
>> of executing the
>> code.....  (THis would probably be the best solution
>> - to make the
>> MacOSPPC engine work like a UNIX engine when called
>> from a command-line
>> script, if possible)...
>> 
>> 
>> P.S.S.S. I have tried lots of other stuff too - this
>> just doesn't seem to
>> work but I can't remember everything I tried....
>> 
>
>
>Hi Greg,
>
>Just to clear a few things up, as they are in my head:
>1) There is no 'Darwin' version of Valentina.
>2) If you're running the 'cgi' version of RunRev, you
>have no access to the libraries such as the database
>and printing libraries.
>3) Those libraries should be present in the version
>2.0 of the 'cgi' app ; but you'd still be limited in
>what you can do under Darwin as it has no ODBC or
>Valentina.
>
>Thus I'd recommand the following path:
>1) Run full MacOSX on the machine
>2) Build your own cgi-server with RunRev ; Gary
>Rathbone from this list has posted an example stack on
>the RunRev Newbie Board.
>
>This way you can make sure all the libraries are
>loaded and the connection to the Valentina database is
>opened at the start.
>Moreover, you could more easily maintain your cgi's as
>they're in a single stack instead of a collection of
>text files.
>
>Hope this helped, even if it wasn't the answer you
>were looking for.
>
>Best regards,
>
>Jan Schenkel.
>
>=====
>"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."
> (La Rochefoucauld)

John,

Thanks for the reply!...

Regarding your clarification:

1)I don't quite get what you are saying....  There is a "Macho" version
of Valentina - isn't that one which will work on Darwin or am I confused?...
2) By the 'cgi' version do you mean this "Darwin.tgz" I downloaded from
http://www.runreve.com/engines11/Darwin.tgz ?...
3) [ blank look ]

Regarding your recommendation:
1) Already got that.
2) Where is the RunRev Newbie board?... I must be so new that I can't find it.


Is he talking about running some sort of client/server application with a
Revolution stack running as the server piece?.....  If so will it be able
to handle multiple simultaneous requests?...

The idea of maintaining text files inside of stack is precisely what I
want to get away from.. I want to be able to edit my files with vi or
bang out scripts for doing database manipulations from some other tool
(like PERL)...  The big thing for me is that what we are workign on is
moving a portion of a client/server application which currently resides
in Oracle down to PC's and Mac systems..  The current process of
collecting data and keeping the database updated is almost 100%
automated....  I want to ensure that this process continues
transparently....  So what I ened is a way to build, index, basically I
need to be able execute all of the Revolution transcript functions from
the command line - plain-and-simple...  If you are suggesting that I can
setup a server which will allow me to do this, it is interesting to me...
If you are saying I still have to bury my code inside of a GUI
development environment where developers can't get at it to fix it
without popping up some GUI application, that's a lot less interesting to
me (and in fact, I would probably get laughed out of the office if I
tried to suggest it)...  It's goign to be tricky enough to get them to
learn this new transcript language (I am sure there will be a lot of
resistance to it - as there has been with me)....  So in other words, I
cna play a little bit of Voodoo magic here and hide an OS-X server in the
back room where nobody has to deal with it, but when they write their
scripts they are going to want to be able to develop those scripts using
the development tools they already have for writing command-line apps and
to be able to do it in basically the same way....  They have over a
million lines of code devoted to this application and to have some other
piece hanging off a ledge somewhere else is just going to be very
distracting when trying to track down bugs or add new build procedures....

As a side note, I have noticed on several OS-X development sites that
does appear to be possible to call Carbon and/or [whatever] functions
from a command-line environment...  I'm not sure what all the terminology
is, for some reason Mach-O, CDF, and Carbon seem significant....  But,
that there are ways to cross those boundaries and link in libraries from
one of the other environments...  Though this part of my research ont he
subject goes back a long ways, that seems to be the result of what I came
up with....

Thanks, again, for your reply!..

- Greg



From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 20 14:23:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 20 14:23:01 2002
Subject: Security of program's content files
Message-ID: <a05100300ba018d9f269c@[216.229.107.175]>

>
>>  > So my question is: How can I encrypt (if that's the right word) the
>>>  files so that they are useless to anyone -except- when running my
>>>  program?

Hi Yet Again, Barry.

I've never tried to break into a Revolution standalone; but the 
answer could be: "You don't need to do any encryption: just import 
the files (they were image files, correct?) into the stack and save 
the stack in the main application file created by the Distribution 
Builder."

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 20 14:23:15 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 20 14:23:15 2002
Subject: Six vs Half a Dozen
Message-ID: <a05100301ba018e7f5b3c@[216.229.107.175]>

Quick question:

Is there any functional difference between (in a script):

on processThis toThis
  doThis toThis
end processThis

[No doThis handler in the script]

and

on processThis toThis
  send "doThis"&&value(toThis) to me
end processThis

on doThis toThis
   pass doThis
end  doThis
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Wed Nov 20 14:45:00 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Wed Nov 20 14:45:00 2002
Subject: Six vs Half a Dozen
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba018e7f5b3c@[216.229.107.175]>
Message-ID: <BA0124DF.2040E%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Rob Cozens wrote:

> Is there any functional difference between (in a script):
> 
> on processThis toThis
> doThis toThis
> end processThis
> 
> [No doThis handler in the script]
> 
> and
> 
> on processThis toThis
> send "doThis"&&value(toThis) to me
> end processThis
> 
> on doThis toThis
> pass doThis
> end  doThis

According to RevBench, the difference is only about 0.0007 ticks in favor of
directly calling the handler over using "send".

Why send the message to "me" only to pass it elsewhere?

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 20 14:51:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 20 14:51:01 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
Message-ID: <a05100300ba0192e21933@[216.229.107.230]>

Earlier today I commented to the improve-rev list:

>If there is any group who should understand "it isn't ready until 
>it's ready", it's software developers.

Anyone in the mood to suggest other candidates?

I've come up with two:

* house painters
* chefs

Anyone else want to play?
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From dsc at swcp.com  Wed Nov 20 14:53:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Wed Nov 20 14:53:01 2002
Subject: Six vs Half a Dozen
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba018e7f5b3c@[216.229.107.175]>
Message-ID: <5531FDBA-FCC0-11D6-AD3B-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Wednesday, November 20, 2002, at 12:18 PM, Rob Cozens wrote:

>  send "doThis"&&value(toThis) to me

The doc says, "The parameters are evaluated before they are passed to 
the send command."

I used to try to do this the hard way, too.  I was trying to handle 
quotes and all sorts of problems.

I think what you want is this:

send "doThis toThis" to me

These might be the same if toThis contains a number or a one-word string 
that is not a variable, but in general these are not the same.

Uh, it's been a while since I've addressed this, so I may be confused.

I pass on the pass part.

Dar Scott



From dsc at swcp.com  Wed Nov 20 15:18:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Wed Nov 20 15:18:01 2002
Subject: Six vs Half a Dozen
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba018e7f5b3c@[216.229.107.175]>
Message-ID: <CD1BFE02-FCC3-11D6-AD3B-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

I was worried I might be confused, and ran the test:

on mouseUp
   put field "Source" into x
   send "doThis x" to me
   --send "doThis field " & quote & "Source" & quote to me  -- also works
end mouseUp

on doThis toThis
   put toThis into field "Destination"
end doThis

The args to the command in the send string are evaluated in the context 
of the send.  The command may be built-in.  A send to me without time is 
probably the same as calling a handler directly.

Dar Scott



From alex at mindlube.com  Wed Nov 20 15:37:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Wed Nov 20 15:37:01 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <a05100300ba0192e21933@[216.229.107.230]>
Message-ID: <FF8DB4BF-FCC6-11D6-BE9D-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Wednesday, November 20, 2002, at 12:33  PM, Rob Cozens wrote:

> * house painters
> * chefs

pregnant women
vintners
bier meisters
butterflies in metamorphosis
flowering century plants
calving icebergs
terran magnetic field reversals

:-)

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Wed Nov 20 15:44:01 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Wed Nov 20 15:44:01 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <a05100300ba0192e21933@[216.229.107.230]>
Message-ID: <E2863670-FCC7-11D6-91B5-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Thursday, Nov 21, 2002, at 06:33 Australia/Sydney, Rob Cozens wrote:

> Earlier today I commented to the improve-rev list:
>
>> If there is any group who should understand "it isn't ready until 
>> it's ready", it's software developers.
>
> Anyone in the mood to suggest other candidates?
>
> I've come up with two:
>
> * house painters
> * chefs
>
> Anyone else want to play?

manufacturers of submarines

> -- 
>
> Rob Cozens
> CCW, Serendipity Software Company
> http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm
>
> "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
> Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."
>
> from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Wed Nov 20 15:45:00 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Wed Nov 20 15:45:00 2002
Subject: Six vs Half a Dozen
In-Reply-To: <CD1BFE02-FCC3-11D6-AD3B-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <0F03578B-FCC8-11D6-91B5-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Thursday, Nov 21, 2002, at 07:08 Australia/Sydney, Dar Scott wrote:

> A send to me without time is probably the same as calling a handler 
> directly.

I think I recall previous discussion of this, and it is.
>
> Dar Scott
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Wed Nov 20 15:48:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Wed Nov 20 15:48:01 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <FF8DB4BF-FCC6-11D6-BE9D-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <BA013394.2041F%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Alex Rice wrote:

> 
> On Wednesday, November 20, 2002, at 12:33  PM, Rob Cozens wrote:
> 
>> * house painters
>> * chefs
> 
> pregnant women
> vintners
> bier meisters
> butterflies in metamorphosis
> flowering century plants
> calving icebergs
> terran magnetic field reversals

Morton Thiokol's aerospace engineers

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.0: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From gsaylor at net-virtual.com  Wed Nov 20 15:55:01 2002
From: gsaylor at net-virtual.com (gsaylor at net-virtual.com)
Date: Wed Nov 20 15:55:01 2002
Subject: Valentina and OS-X (Darwin) revisited... 
Message-ID: <200211202047.gAKKll202349@murphy.adgrafix.com>

>Unfortunately you're way off in the weeds here: not only have you not
>specified where that DLL is to be loaded (hint, you need to "start
>using" a stack to use an external in a console app), but the Darwin
>engine doesn't even support resource or bundle-fopmat externals, and
>neither revdb nor Valentina have been built in the older format.

Oh.. ;-)   I have scoured everywhere and I am just not seeing this, of course externals have always been confusing in their implementation to me anyways.... 

>This is a bug: it should give you an execution error report here (not
>that this helps you much because it still wouldn't work).
>
>Your problems are complicated by the fact that RR was never upgraded
>to the MetaCard 2.4.3 Carbon engine, which is the only one you have
>any hope of getting externals to work in CGI mode with.  Even then, I
>don't know if revdb will work with it and am sure that it's not
>supported even if it did.
>
>Note that I *do* think you could get this to work using the VXCMD
>external directly with the MetaCard 2.4.3 Carbon engine, however.  >Not that we're volunteering to provide support for this, seeing as
>how you didn't buy MetaCard ;-)  Maybe the developers of VXCMD can help you.

I have read this a few times and I am just not getting it......    As a side note, my license is coming up for renewal (as I mentioned).. I have been told that RunRev will be able to do Valentina from Darwin in 2.0 - which is great news to me...  If it doesn't do what I need I amy consider going with MetaCard - are you saying if I did you would make this work?....

>The latter I believe to be possible.  Note that this whole area is
>still in flux, though, and you'll have to do things a little
>differently for the upcoming MC 2.5/RR 2.0 release because the Carbon
>engine is now Mach-O format and so will require a different external
>format (a bundle).
>

As long as it's something I can understand I don't care how it's done... As long as it is at least not jumping through hoops, like VXCMD's seem to be...

>Keep in mind that you're not using a database product, you're using an
>application development environment.  Since 99% of the work done with
>MC/RR is graphical, you've kind of got to expect a certain roughness
>if you're going to use if for something else.  About all I can
>guarantee is that you'll find doing CGI in MC/RR a lot easier than
>doing GUI development in Perl ;-)

Well, there are still no command line utilities for Valentina... Someone (maybe I will) should write a PERL module to interface to the C libraries of the Mach-O version.. That would be really the ideal solution....

As for doing GUI's in PERL.. I actually do them in UNIX all the time - it's not too bad really...   The problem is getting this to work on multiple platforms....  That's the reason I wanted to go with Revolution....  

The problem is since the database tool does not support any command-line scripting, the obvious way to interface to is using a development environment which does.... Writing  a "psql/mysql/sqlplus/isql/etc" command line utility in C does not appeal to me, especially since it sounds like I would have to license Valentina twice (one for the C library and another for the XCMD/Mach-O/whatever it is, which is *very* unappealing...   So it seemed like using Revolution to create this connection was a logical way to proceed.....


>This all works fine: no need to use the graphical IDE to develop your
>scripts.  But you do have to use the Darwin engine (no external
>support) or the newest MC Carbon engines.
>
>As an aside, and not that you need yet another thing to learn, but
>using vi for application development is strictly for lightweights
>IMHO.  Real programmers use Emacs ;-)
>

Yeah, Emacs is da' bomb!...  But, I do find I use vi more often for some reason...  (I've not really analyzed why that is, maybe some quirk with my personality??.. ;-) )  Oh, and I'm also not a programmer...  More of a systems integrator (in fact I hate writing code and do as little of it as possible - though sometimes that's a lot) - maybe that has something to do with it...

>This is not even theoretically possible: there is no stdio support in
>the Classic OS.


Hehehe.. *smacks self on forhead*...

- Greg





From dsc at swcp.com  Wed Nov 20 16:06:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Wed Nov 20 16:06:01 2002
Subject: Six vs Half a Dozen
In-Reply-To: <BA0124DF.2040E%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <7E68D118-FCCA-11D6-AD3B-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Wednesday, November 20, 2002, at 12:39 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:

> According to RevBench, the difference is only about 0.0007 ticks in 
> favor of
> directly calling the handler over using "send".

I got 110 microseconds.

I threw "do" into the mix:
********************************************
local storeHere

on mouseUp
   local timeA, timeB, timeOffset

   put "abc" into toThis
   put the long seconds into timeA  -- in case something special about 
first long seconds

   -- create offset
   put the long seconds into timeB
   put the long seconds into timeA
   put timeA-timeB into timeOffset

   -- time simple call
   put the long seconds into timeB
   doThis toThis
   put the long seconds into timeA
   put timeA - timeB - timeOffset & lineFeed into Field "Destination"

   -- time do
   put the long seconds into timeB
   do "doThis toThis"
   put the long seconds into timeA
   put (timeA - timeB - timeOffset) & lineFeed after Field "Destination"

   -- time send to me
   put the long seconds into timeB
   send "doThis toThis" to me
   put the long seconds into timeA
   put (timeA - timeB - timeOffset) & lineFeed after Field "Destination"

end mouseUp

on doThis toSomething
   put toSomething into storeHere
end doThis
**************************************************

Typical results were like this (300MHz? Blue & White, OS X 1.1.5):

0.000032
0.000148
0.00012

(seconds for direct call, do and send)

It is interesting that a send is faster than a do.

Dar Scott



From alex at mindlube.com  Wed Nov 20 17:18:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Wed Nov 20 17:18:01 2002
Subject: [OT] emacs on os x
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211201014350.7451-100000@mast.metacard.com>
Message-ID: <C80CEA48-FCD3-11D6-BE9D-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Wednesday, November 20, 2002, at 10:36  AM, Scott Raney wrote:
>
> As an aside, and not that you need yet another thing to learn, but
> using vi for application development is strictly for lightweights
> IMHO.  Real programmers use Emacs ;-)

Any OS X Emacs users out there should be sure to grab the prerelease 
Carbon build of GNU Emacs 21.3.5. It's very well done, and no X Windows 
is required for all the GUI niceties.

http://mindlube.com/developer/
http://www.porkrind.org/emacs/

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu  Wed Nov 20 17:20:01 2002
From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry)
Date: Wed Nov 20 17:20:01 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <a05100300ba0192e21933@[216.229.107.230]>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0211201413090.27843-100000@titan.ecs.fullerton.edu>

Gestating females?  (I remember being ready WAAAAYY earlier than the twins
were)  @;-)

Judy

On Wed, 20 Nov 2002, Rob Cozens wrote:

> Earlier today I commented to the improve-rev list:
>
> >If there is any group who should understand "it isn't ready until
> >it's ready", it's software developers.
>
> Anyone in the mood to suggest other candidates?
>
> I've come up with two:
>
> * house painters
> * chefs
>
> Anyone else want to play?
> --



From chipp at chipp.com  Wed Nov 20 18:16:00 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Wed Nov 20 18:16:00 2002
Subject: Off Topic Icon Tool
Message-ID: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCCELIDHAA.chipp@chipp.com>

http://f2.org/software/win32/free/icon.html

I found a great free program called IconRipper which will grab icons from
any file (dll or programs) and turn them into gif or bmp files. Great for
adding icons to buttons.

You can find tons of icon files in your System32 folder

-Chipp



From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Wed Nov 20 19:09:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Wed Nov 20 19:09:01 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0211201413090.27843-100000@titan.ecs.fullerton.edu>
Message-ID: <20021121000233.7379.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com>

do not try this on the MC list.

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Wed Nov 20 19:34:00 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Wed Nov 20 19:34:00 2002
Subject: Script Debug Mode <on preOpenstack>
In-Reply-To: <a05100303ba016a8a1ee1@[216.229.107.140]>
Message-ID: <20021121002803.91871.qmail@web20005.mail.yahoo.com>

Script Debug Mode is ON, the window is OPEN

here's the script of stack "a",
which i now open:

on preOpenstack
   breakpoint
   start using stack "AA1"
   start using stack "AA2"
   -- no problems with the above stacks
   start using stack "MexCho"
   -- when the above line is left in
   -- there's an error message that immediately
   -- vanishes
end preOpenstack

should the script execution stop at line 1
<breakpoint> so one can step through and pinpoint
the summoning of the error dialog?

right now it just rolls right on through.


=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site
http://webhosting.yahoo.com


From rgould8 at aol.com  Wed Nov 20 21:27:01 2002
From: rgould8 at aol.com (rgould8 at aol.com)
Date: Wed Nov 20 21:27:01 2002
Subject: Digest Authentification
Message-ID: <16030154.0126E5E5.0018446D@aol.com>

Ok, I think I have just enough brain cells left to figure out 80% of the Digest Authentification in Revolution - - - I just need a little nudge over a few small potholes.

A huge thanks to Yennie, who probably saved me 3 weeks of work trying to decypher the rfc for Digest Authentification.

The first question I have is this:  what is the Revolution command to retrieve the header information of the html page that comes back?  For instance, when I make my initial call to the device, putting URL:  http://192.168.1.1/isp/cpe_info.xml, I get a web-page that says:

Page not available.  Protected Object.

This is exactly what I'd expect to see, but what I really need is the header info that comes along with that page.  The header info should look something like this:

HTTP/1.1
401
Unauthorized
Digest realm="DSLUnit BEFDSR41W", nonce="8ce0cfdc62f8bdae849610f521a3538f", qop=auth

I see Revolution commands to SET headers, but I'm just not seeing the command to GET the header.

And then, if I'm reading the spec correctly, I'm supposed to reply with a new header which looks like this:

GET /isp/cpe_info.xml HTTP/1.1
DSL RouterUnit
192.168.1.1
Keep-Alive
Digest username="admin", realm="DSLUnit BEFDSR41W", qop="auth", algorithm="MD5", uri="/isp/cpe_info.xml", nonce="8ce0cfdc62f8bdae849610f521a3538f", nc=00000001, cnonce-"f0f06d6390b9a311f9446d8a30fb2253", response="03b79aca10595873a3bf08f6de0b34e2"



From jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu  Wed Nov 20 22:19:01 2002
From: jperryl at ecs.fullerton.edu (Judy Perry)
Date: Wed Nov 20 22:19:01 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <20021121000233.7379.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0211201912130.26158-100000@titan.ecs.fullerton.edu>

Why?

Judy

On Wed, 20 Nov 2002, erik hansen wrote:

>
> do not try this on the MC list.



From andre.rombauts at win.be  Thu Nov 21 01:08:01 2002
From: andre.rombauts at win.be (Andre Rombauts)
Date: Thu Nov 21 01:08:01 2002
Subject: internanl Icons with Standalone 
In-Reply-To: <B9FF9667.96DC%andre.rombauts@win.be>
Message-ID: <BA0234E4.9988%andre.rombauts@win.be>

Le 19/11/2002 07:19, Andre Rombauts ? andre.rombauts at win.be a ?crit:

> Even if I check the relevant option in the Build dialog to include the icons
> lib, internal icons are not available in dialog boxes such as ?ask? or
> ?answer?... :-(
> Any idea.
> 
No reply to my question. Is it so stupid?... :-(
Andr?
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From alex at mindlube.com  Thu Nov 21 01:14:00 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Thu Nov 21 01:14:00 2002
Subject: internanl Icons with Standalone 
In-Reply-To: <BA0234E4.9988%andre.rombauts@win.be>
Message-ID: <8DE928FF-FD17-11D6-86E0-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Wednesday, November 20, 2002, at 10:59  PM, Andre Rombauts wrote:

> Le 19/11/2002 07:19, Andre Rombauts ? andre.rombauts at win.be a ?crit:
>
> Even if I check the relevant option in the Build dialog to include the 
> icons lib, internal icons are not available in dialog boxes such as 
> ?ask? or ?answer?... :-(
> Any idea.
>
> No reply to my question. Is it so stupid?... :-(
> Andr?

Maybe try selecting BOTH of the include icons libs, "Standard Icons" 
and "MetaCard compatible"? It's not a stupid question.

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From sims at ezpzapps.com  Thu Nov 21 01:27:00 2002
From: sims at ezpzapps.com (sims)
Date: Thu Nov 21 01:27:00 2002
Subject: [OT]  Netherlands
In-Reply-To: <16030154.0126E5E5.0018446D@aol.com>
References: <16030154.0126E5E5.0018446D@aol.com>
Message-ID: <a05200f02ba022ba31ea1@[10.0.1.2]>

I'm hoping that someone from the Netherlands can translate
a comment sent to me by a purchaser of one of my Rev
shareware products....

Please email me at sims at ezpzapps.com

Thanks

sims
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------
    http://EZPZapps.com         info at EZPZapps.com
       Software - Internet Development - Consulting


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 21 02:15:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 21 02:15:01 2002
Subject: internanl Icons with Standalone 
In-Reply-To: <BA0234E4.9988%andre.rombauts@win.be>
Message-ID: <20021121070924.20319.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Andre Rombauts <andre.rombauts at win.be> wrote:
> Le 19/11/2002 07:19, Andre Rombauts ?
> andre.rombauts at win.be a ?crit:
> 
> > Even if I check the relevant option in the Build
> dialog to include the icons
> > lib, internal icons are not available in dialog
> boxes such as ?ask? or
> > ?answer?... :-(
> > Any idea.
> > 
> No reply to my question. Is it so stupid?... :-(
> Andr?
> 

Hi Andre,

It's not a silly question. If my guess is correct,
you'd like to include some of the nice icons in the
toolbar or scattered around the rest of RunRev.
I haven't found them yet, but as they're an integral
part of the IDE, they might fall under copyright and
that could explain why they aren't in a library.
However, technically nothing is to stop you from using
the Application Overview and wading through all the
RunRev UI stacks in search of these images.

Best regards,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 21 04:13:00 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 21 04:13:00 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <a05100300ba0192e21933@[216.229.107.230]>
Message-ID: <20021121090715.26292.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Rob Cozens <rcozens at pon.net> wrote:
> Earlier today I commented to the improve-rev list:
> 
> >If there is any group who should understand "it
> isn't ready until 
> >it's ready", it's software developers.
> 
> Anyone in the mood to suggest other candidates?
> 
> I've come up with two:
> 
> * house painters
> * chefs
> 

How about:

* indigenous people working on their regalia
* artistically talented people that scrape the
painting off the canvas over and over again because
the colour combination didn't work out

I'm sure I could find a few more things to describe my
girlfriend, but that wasn't what you were after :)
Just kidding, ladies ; of course I have the same
character trait on other topics.

Anyway, that's what came to my mind...

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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From klausimausi at mac.com  Thu Nov 21 04:26:01 2002
From: klausimausi at mac.com (Klaus Major)
Date: Thu Nov 21 04:26:01 2002
Subject: GifBuilder & iDraw, and "real" animation
In-Reply-To: <8002AB26-FC7E-11D6-94A6-003065D52E8E@mac.com>
Message-ID: <8776C13D-FD32-11D6-9EE1-003065D52E8E@mac.com>

Hi all,

again i hit the send button before thinking ;-)

> Hi Wolfgang and all,
>
> here is a great URL that will give you fantastic hints on how to
> use MOHO effectively.

Here is the missing URL:

http://www.gippsland.monash.edu.au/~myles/catnap/mohotips/index.html


Regards

Klaus Major
klausimausi at mac.com



From jamesjrichards at lineone.net  Thu Nov 21 04:26:13 2002
From: jamesjrichards at lineone.net (James Richards)
Date: Thu Nov 21 04:26:13 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <200211210609.BAA05025@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA025476.281C%jamesjrichards@lineone.net>

on 20 Nov 2002 11:33:23, Rob Cozens <rcozens at pon.net> wrote:

>> If there is any group who should understand "it isn't ready until
>> it's ready", it's software developers.
> 
> Anyone in the mood to suggest other candidates?
> 
> I've come up with two:
> 
> * house painters
> * chefs
printers

-- 
James J Richards

jamesjrichards at lineone.net

Tel. +44 (0)15394 43063 



From dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk  Thu Nov 21 05:04:01 2002
From: dcragg at lacscentre.co.uk (Dave Cragg)
Date: Thu Nov 21 05:04:01 2002
Subject: Digest Authentification
In-Reply-To: <16030154.0126E5E5.0018446D@aol.com>
References: <16030154.0126E5E5.0018446D@aol.com>
Message-ID: <p05200f00ba025cf69696@[192.168.123.3]>

At 9:20 pm -0500 20/11/02, rgould8 at aol.com wrote:
>Ok, I think I have just enough brain cells left to figure out 80% of
>the Digest Authentification in Revolution - - - I just need a little
>nudge over a few small potholes.
>
>A huge thanks to Yennie, who probably saved me 3 weeks of work
>trying to decypher the rfc for Digest Authentification.
>
>The first question I have is this:  what is the Revolution command
>to retrieve the header information of the html page that comes back?
>For instance, when I make my initial call to the device, putting
>URL:  http://192.168.1.1/isp/cpe_info.xml, I get a web-page that
>says:
>
>Page not available.  Protected Object.
>
>This is exactly what I'd expect to see, but what I really need is
>the header info that comes along with that page.  The header info
>should look something like this:
>
>HTTP/1.1
>401
>Unauthorized
>Digest realm="DSLUnit BEFDSR41W",
>nonce="8ce0cfdc62f8bdae849610f521a3538f", qop=auth
>
>I see Revolution commands to SET headers, but I'm just not seeing
>the command to GET the header.
>
>And then, if I'm reading the spec correctly, I'm supposed to reply
>with a new header which looks like this:
>
>GET /isp/cpe_info.xml HTTP/1.1
>DSL RouterUnit
>192.168.1.1
>Keep-Alive
>Digest username="admin", realm="DSLUnit BEFDSR41W", qop="auth",
>algorithm="MD5", uri="/isp/cpe_info.xml",
>nonce="8ce0cfdc62f8bdae849610f521a3538f", nc=00000001,
>cnonce-"f0f06d6390b9a311f9446d8a30fb2253",
>response="03b79aca10595873a3bf08f6de0b34e2"
>

Use libUrlLastRHHeaders() to retrieve the most recent set of headers 
sent from the remote host.

Something like:

get url myUrl
if 401 is in the result then
   put libUrlLastRHHeaders() into tRHHeaders
   ## then parse the headers

Cheers
Dave


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 21 05:19:00 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 21 05:19:00 2002
Subject: Six vs Half a Dozen
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba018e7f5b3c@[216.229.107.175]>
Message-ID: <20021121101231.36326.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Rob Cozens <rcozens at pon.net> wrote:
> Quick question:
> 
> Is there any functional difference between (in a
> script):
> 
> on processThis toThis
>   doThis toThis
> end processThis
> 
> [No doThis handler in the script]
> 
> and
> 
> on processThis toThis
>   send "doThis"&&value(toThis) to me
> end processThis
> 
> on doThis toThis
>    pass doThis
> end  doThis
> -- 
> 
> Rob Cozens
>

Hi Rob,

Just thinking out loud, here ; I wouldn't say there's
a difference, except perhaps in calling time (but that
should be minimum.
But how about 'frontScript' functionality? Could it
not make a difference there if you send something
straight on to the target bypassing the handler
defined in the same or other frontScripts?

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus ? Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com


From wmb at internettrainer.com  Thu Nov 21 06:02:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Thu Nov 21 06:02:01 2002
Subject: GifBuilder & iDraw, and "real" animation
In-Reply-To: <8776C13D-FD32-11D6-9EE1-003065D52E8E@mac.com>
Message-ID: <D268D19E-FD3F-11D6-8BD8-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Donnerstag, November 21, 2002, at 10:20  Uhr, Klaus Major wrote:

>> Hi Wolfgang and all,
>>
>> here is a great URL that will give you fantastic hints on how to
>> use MOHO effectively.
>
> Here is the missing URL:
>
> http://www.gippsland.monash.edu.au/~myles/catnap/mohotips/index.html

Thanks.
These are that kind of explications I like, need, love...;)

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Thu Nov 21 06:04:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Thu Nov 21 06:04:01 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <BA025476.281C%jamesjrichards@lineone.net>
Message-ID: <04459580-FD40-11D6-8BD8-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

>>> If there is any group who should understand "it isn't ready until
>>> it's ready", it's software developers.
>>
>> Anyone in the mood to suggest other candidates?
>>
>> I've come up with two:
>>
>> * house painters
>> * chefs

digesting..?

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Thu Nov 21 06:16:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Thu Nov 21 06:16:01 2002
Subject: Valentina and OS-X (Darwin) revisited...
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211201014350.7451-100000@mast.metacard.com>
Message-ID: <DF8CB8B5-FD41-11D6-8BD8-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Mittwoch, November 20, 2002, at 06:36  Uhr, Scott Raney wrote:

> As an aside, and not that you need yet another thing to learn, but
> using vi for application development is strictly for lightweights
> IMHO.  Real programmers use Emacs ;-)

What is vi?

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From roger.kingston at omnibus.co.uk  Thu Nov 21 07:39:01 2002
From: roger.kingston at omnibus.co.uk (Roger Kingston (OmniBus - Stanford))
Date: Thu Nov 21 07:39:01 2002
Subject: DDE - Dynamic Data Exchange
Message-ID: <DB4D3F61CB18A840A4C3927AFC944611213D2C@stanmail.omnibus.co.uk>

Ken Ray wrote: 

> Where is this "old" Externals Collection for Windows? I don't see it on
> runrev.com. OK is this it? http://www.xworlds.com/metacard/external.htm
> ? I found it in the list archives. Maybe it should be added to the
> runrev.com site?
 
Roger Kingston wrote:
Thanks Ken - I found it and it works!

>It's at: http://www.xworlds.com/metacard/contributorfiles/ext10final.sit

>Ken Ray
>Sons of Thunder Software


From BradAllen at mac.com  Thu Nov 21 08:38:01 2002
From: BradAllen at mac.com (Brad Allen)
Date: Thu Nov 21 08:38:01 2002
Subject: docs for writing external commands
Message-ID: <a05200f02ba029025ed50@[192.168.1.101]>

I couldn't find any info on this at runrev.com or within the built-in 
documentation. Where can I find out more about what it takes to write 
XCMDs that will work with a Rev standalone?

Thanks!


From terry at discovery.nl  Thu Nov 21 10:02:01 2002
From: terry at discovery.nl (Terry Vogelaar)
Date: Thu Nov 21 10:02:01 2002
Subject: MS Access db via ODBC on Mac?
Message-ID: <BA02A045.1899%terry@discovery.nl>

Hello all,

I am developing an application that makes a real estate magazine from text
data in an MS Access database. The layout part is already working - I'm
using AppleScript to communicate with Adobe InDesign.

But the ODBC connection gives me a headache. I can connect RR to the
database on a Windows PC, but than I cannot use the AppleScript part there.

Is it possible to connect with ODBC to a local MS Access database on a Mac?
How?

If it can't be done, could I connect to that Windows PC in any way? There is
a LAN connection with that PC using PC-MAC LAN 8.

Terry



From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Thu Nov 21 10:25:00 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Thu Nov 21 10:25:00 2002
Subject: ftp:  how to prevent access to file currently being accessed?
Message-ID: <a05200a00ba02a8d81135@[128.196.99.210]>

hello:  i really have not much knowledge about how ftp works, so 
forgive the question in case it was just too obvious.
	problem:  a file is kept on a ftp-server.  this file is being 
accessed by n clients, and all clients will modify the file and 
upload it to the server.
	question: how can i monitor from the client side whether the 
file is currently being used by another client, so that the it is not 
accessed until the  currently accessing client finished uploading?

	thank you!  best, oliver hardt.


From RGould8 at aol.com  Thu Nov 21 10:34:01 2002
From: RGould8 at aol.com (RGould8 at aol.com)
Date: Thu Nov 21 10:34:01 2002
Subject: Digest Authentification
Message-ID: <177.123fa5eb.2b0e5563@aol.com>

Ok, things are going well with the Digest Authorization - - - still haven't 
"cracked the response code", but I'm close.

This is starting to get a bit off topic, but I am doing this in Revolution, 
so it's semi-topical.

Can someone who's familiar with the Digest Authorization rfc tell me what the 
"http method" value should be, when doing the "Method:URI" binaryDecode-MD5 
encrytion for H2.   It's not clear to me in the spec what they mean by 
"method" - - is that a text string like "HTTP/1.1"?
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From tkuypers at pandora.be  Thu Nov 21 10:37:01 2002
From: tkuypers at pandora.be (tkuypers at pandora.be)
Date: Thu Nov 21 10:37:01 2002
Subject: ftp:  how to prevent access to file currently being accessed?
In-Reply-To: <a05200a00ba02a8d81135@[128.196.99.210]>
Message-ID: <BA02BAAC.43C6%tkuypers@pandora.be>

Get the filesize of the file
Get the filesize of the same file 1 second later

If both of them are the same then it is complete, otherwise chack the
filesize again...

This should work

T.

> From: Oliver Hardt <hardt at u.arizona.edu>
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 08:18:49 -0700
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: ftp:  how to prevent access to file currently being accessed?
> 
> hello:  i really have not much knowledge about how ftp works, so
> forgive the question in case it was just too obvious.
> problem:  a file is kept on a ftp-server.  this file is being
> accessed by n clients, and all clients will modify the file and
> upload it to the server.
> question: how can i monitor from the client side whether the
> file is currently being used by another client, so that the it is not
> accessed until the  currently accessing client finished uploading?
> 
> thank you!  best, oliver hardt.
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 



From themacguy at macosx.com  Thu Nov 21 10:46:01 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Thu Nov 21 10:46:01 2002
Subject: Off-topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <200211210609.BAA05086@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <75C36240-FD67-11D6-A78C-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

ANY parent, behind the wheel, when the kids whine, "Are we there yet?"

>> If there is any group who should understand "it isn't ready until
>> it's ready", it's software developers.
>
> Anyone in the mood to suggest other candidates?



From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 21 11:00:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 21 11:00:01 2002
Subject: 31142 lines/cards/records
Message-ID: <a05100300ba02a7c25924@[216.229.107.226]>

<<
constant left = 1
constant mid = 2
constant right = 3

put leftValue into myArray_c left]
put midValue into myArray_c[mid]
put rightValue into myArray_c[right]

get myArray_c[alignBy] -- assumes alignBy is "left", "mid", or "right"
<<

Sorry Doug: I let you astray here.

In the above example alibnBy would have to be "1", "2", or "3".

Since I'm not sure of your objective, I'm not sure show to steer you 
straight; so here are some general thoughts:

The value of a constant never changes.  Where ever the MC engine 
finds a reference to a constant in a handler, it replaces the 
reference with the value of the constant.

In general, I have two uses for constants:

One is to reference an object indirectly so the object can be changed 
without have to rewrite every handler that uses it.  For example, 
suppose I have three icon images representing a barrel holding red, 
rose, or white wine.  I can script every button on every card or 
group with something like:

    switch wineColor
       case "red"
          set the icon of me to 123456676
          break
       case "rose"
          set the icon of me to 123456677
          break
       case "white"
          set the icon of me to 123456678
          break
    end switch

If I do so, and later need to change icons for any reason, I must go 
back to every handler where this logic is used and change the 
appropriate icon id(s) everywhere they appear.

If instead I script:

    constant redBarrel = 123456676
    constant roseBarrel = 123456677
    constant whiteBVarrel = 123456678

    switch wineColor
       case "red"
          set the icon of me to redBarrel
          break
       case "rose"
          set the icon of me to roseBarrel
          break
       case "white"
          set the icon of me to whiteBarrel
          break
    end switch

I can now change the constant declarations and leave the rest of the 
scripts unchanged.  One limitation: constants are not globals; so 
they must be declared in every script (not handler) that uses them.

Reason 2: If you look at the above examples, I think you will agree 
that "set the icon of me to redBarrel" gives a scriptor revisiting 
the handler a clearer picture than "set the icon of me to 123456676". 
So the other general use I have for constants is to make my handlers 
more descriptive.

Another example: there are currently 190 individual messages (lines) 
in a Serendipity Library message file.  Every time I need a message I 
could simply "answer sdbMessage(123)" or "put sdbMessage(55) into 
field "Message Field"; but reading the handler later gives one (who 
has not memorized the message order) no clue as to content:

   answer file with sdbMessage(123)
   if it is empty then exit thisHandlerName
   open file it
   if the result is not empty then
       beep
       answer sdbMessage(137) with sdbMessage(148)
   end if

So I use something like:

   constant sdbFilePrompt = 123
   constant sdbFileOpenError = 137
   constant sdbQuitTranslated = 148

   answer file with sdbMessage(sdbFilePrompt)
   if it is empty then exit thisHandlerName
   open file it
   if the result is not empty then
       beep
       answer sdbMessage(sdbFileOpenError) with sdbMessage(sdbQuitTranslated)
   end if

Two closing note:

1.  If you look closely at the second example, note the logic also 
facilitates maintaining multiple translations of the same stack (as 
Serendipity Library does).

2.  The second example is very close to use with an array.  If one 
were to "split sdbMessages by return", then the sdbMessage function 
could "return sdbMessages[lineNumber]" instead of "return line 
linerNumber of sdbMessages".

Hope this helps.  If I'm still off target, post more details.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rfarnold at bu.edu  Thu Nov 21 11:01:00 2002
From: rfarnold at bu.edu (Bob Arnold)
Date: Thu Nov 21 11:01:00 2002
Subject: Applescript or?
Message-ID: <BA026BD6.C262%rfarnold@bu.edu>

Help!

Toast permits me to create a CD with an application that will automatically
launch when booted (MacOS) but how can I get it to distinguish between the
Classic and OSX app? Can an Applescript do this? If so, I could have the
Applescript script run automatically, and launch either the classic or X
depending on the environment. Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

Bob
-- 
Robert Arnold
Associate Professor of Film
College of Communication
Boston University
640 Commonwealth Avenue
Boston, MA 02215
Tel: 617 353-7735
Fax: 617-353-1084
Email: rfarnold at bu.edu
Http: people.bu.edu/rfarnold

"Seeing is an art that has to be learned." M. Duras, Hiroshima mon Amour



From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 21 12:00:02 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 21 12:00:02 2002
Subject: Six vs Half a Dozen
In-Reply-To: <BA0124DF.2040E%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
References: <BA0124DF.2040E%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <a05100303ba02b78e0f48@[216.229.107.23]>

>Why send the message to "me" only to pass it elsewhere?

Thanks for testing this, Richard.

Example: ClickClock, a scripted animated gif that can be placed in 
any stack.  The image sends a clickClockTime message.  I don't know 
whether a developer is going to place the image as an individual 
control or make it part of a group.  I also don't know where the 
developer wants to place the clickClockTime handler.

I've had problems using "send someMessage in x seconds" (no target)? 
Am I doing something wrong or does send...in require a target?

Anyhow, because of my problems with send...in without a target, I 
erred on the side of caution by scripting "send clickClockTime to 
this card".  Subsequently I realized this locked out the script of 
any group ClickClock was included in as a repository for a 
clickClockTime handler.  That's when I substituted "send 
clickClockTime to me" and added the handler to pass the message.

Which lead to the question that I posted and you answered so precisely.

Thank you.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 21 12:00:35 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 21 12:00:35 2002
Subject: Six vs Half a Dozen
In-Reply-To: <CD1BFE02-FCC3-11D6-AD3B-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
References: <CD1BFE02-FCC3-11D6-AD3B-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <a05100305ba02bdba828f@[216.229.107.23]>

>The args to the command in the send string are evaluated in the 
>context of the send.  The command may be built-in.  A send to me 
>without time is probably the same as calling a handler directly.

Cool Dar,

Another case where I'm scripting to avoid a problem that doesn't exist.   :{`)

I don't believe HyperTalk would handle that syntax in the same way, however.

Thanks,
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 21 12:00:47 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 21 12:00:47 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <20021121000233.7379.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021121000233.7379.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <a05100306ba02bebebf8a@[216.229.107.23]>

>do not try this on the MC list.

Guess no one there has a sense of humor, eh Erik?
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 21 12:01:02 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 21 12:01:02 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <20021121090715.26292.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021121090715.26292.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <a05100307ba02bf8befbd@[216.229.107.23]>

>  > Anyone in the mood to suggest other candidates?

I can up with three more groups overnight:

* surgeons
* parachute packers
* bungee jump operators


Thanks to everyone who responded, you gave me a light moment + a smile...
and maybe imparted a little patience upon certain members of the 
improv-rev list.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From Yennie at aol.com  Thu Nov 21 12:05:13 2002
From: Yennie at aol.com (Yennie at aol.com)
Date: Thu Nov 21 12:05:13 2002
Subject: Digest Authentication
Message-ID: <13.14af8bd8.2b0e696c@aol.com>

It's from the first line of the request... i.e. "GET" or "POST" (there are 
others, but these are the most common two). For example, your first line from 
your request headers may be something like:

HTTP/1.1 GET /mypage.html

HTH,
Brian


> Can someone who's familiar with the Digest Authorization rfc tell me what 
> the 
> "http method" value should be, when doing the "Method:URI" binaryDecode-MD5 
> 
> encrytion for H2.?? It's not clear to me in the spec what they mean by 
> "method" - - is that a text string like "HTTP/1.1"?
> 

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From alex at mindlube.com  Thu Nov 21 12:20:00 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Thu Nov 21 12:20:00 2002
Subject: MS Access db via ODBC on Mac?
In-Reply-To: <BA02A045.1899%terry@discovery.nl>
Message-ID: <9153BF43-FD74-11D6-AC2C-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Thursday, November 21, 2002, at 07:53  AM, Terry Vogelaar wrote:

> Hello all,
>
> I am developing an application that makes a real estate magazine from 
> text
> data in an MS Access database. The layout part is already working - I'm
> using AppleScript to communicate with Adobe InDesign.
>
> But the ODBC connection gives me a headache. I can connect RR to the
> database on a Windows PC, but than I cannot use the AppleScript part 
> there.
>
> Is it possible to connect with ODBC to a local MS Access database on a 
> Mac?
> How?

Mac OS X or Mac < 9?

OS X jaguar comes with the iODBC driver manager. Tuviah said that Rev 
2.0 is going to support iODBC. Woohoo! Then you will be able to connect 
from Rev to MS Access running on Windows. Unless there are driver 
issues. Don't know.

Off topic: I would love to figure out how to get MS Excel X on a Mac 
connect to ODBC server, Access or otherwise. It doesn't seem possible 
though. Anyone think otherwise?

> If it can't be done, could I connect to that Windows PC in any way? 
> There is
> a LAN connection with that PC using PC-MAC LAN 8.

That should give you access to the filesystem and printers on the 
Windows machine, and not much else.

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From dsc at swcp.com  Thu Nov 21 12:23:00 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Thu Nov 21 12:23:00 2002
Subject: Six vs Half a Dozen
In-Reply-To: <a05100303ba02b78e0f48@[216.229.107.23]>
Message-ID: <8333821E-FD74-11D6-83C8-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Thursday, November 21, 2002, at 09:30 AM, Rob Cozens wrote:

> I've had problems using "send someMessage in x seconds" (no target)? Am 
> I doing something wrong or does send...in require a target?

Specify the target when using time.

I use this in untargeted callbacks:

send someMessage to me in 0 seconds

This is caught even in groups.  It is queued; if you leave out the time, 
it is executed immediately.

You may want to allow clock customer objects to sign up for callbacks.

(Uh.  There may have been a problem with messages getting to groups in a 
recent MC alpha and I haven't taken time to track this down and find 
something reportable.)

Dar Scott




From miscdas at boxfrog.com  Thu Nov 21 12:27:01 2002
From: miscdas at boxfrog.com (miscdas at boxfrog.com)
Date: Thu Nov 21 12:27:01 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <a05100300ba0192e21933@[216.229.107.230]> 
References: <a05100300ba0192e21933@[216.229.107.230]>
Message-ID: <20021121172045.44808.qmail@www.boxfrog.com>

Rob Cozens writes:
[snip]
> Anyone else want to play?
> --  
> 
> Rob Cozens
> CCW, Serendipity Software Company
> http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm
 

Isn't this whole thread a big waste of valuable bandwidth? 

miscdas 


From dsc at swcp.com  Thu Nov 21 12:31:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Thu Nov 21 12:31:01 2002
Subject: Six vs Half a Dozen
In-Reply-To: <a05100305ba02bdba828f@[216.229.107.23]>
Message-ID: <9FC762A6-FD75-11D6-83C8-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Thursday, November 21, 2002, at 09:45 AM, Rob Cozens wrote:

> Another case where I'm scripting to avoid a problem that doesn't 
> exist.   :{`)

I went embarrassingly far down that bunny trail.  I now put literal 
strings in constants and write simple sends.

I now wonder...  For single commands maybe I should use send instead of 
do; it seems to be slightly faster.

Dar Scott



From dsc at swcp.com  Thu Nov 21 13:06:07 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Thu Nov 21 13:06:07 2002
Subject: Six vs Half a Dozen
In-Reply-To: <8333821E-FD74-11D6-83C8-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <89A07EC9-FD7A-11D6-83C8-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Thursday, November 21, 2002, at 10:13 AM, Dar Scott wrote:

> send someMessage to me in 0 seconds

I forgot an important part that might apply.  With this approach, there 
doesn't have to be a handler.  Specifically there doesn't have to be a 
handler for clickClockTime if the developer wants to ignore it. I think 
this is cool for objects like ClickClock that might be used in lots of 
places.

Dar Scott
(who has never seen ClickClock, but knows it by reputation)



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 21 13:43:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Thu Nov 21 13:43:01 2002
Subject: ftp:  how to prevent access to file currently being accessed?
In-Reply-To: <a05200a00ba02a8d81135@[128.196.99.210]>
Message-ID: <20021121183725.98806.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Oliver Hardt <hardt at u.arizona.edu> wrote:
> hello:  i really have not much knowledge about how
> ftp works, so 
> forgive the question in case it was just too
> obvious.
> 	problem:  a file is kept on a ftp-server.  this
> file is being 
> accessed by n clients, and all clients will modify
> the file and 
> upload it to the server.
> 	question: how can i monitor from the client side
> whether the 
> file is currently being used by another client, so
> that the it is not 
> accessed until the  currently accessing client
> finished uploading?
> 
> 	thank you!  best, oliver hardt.

Hi Oliver,

If you control _all_ client access, you could create a
file in the same directory on the server ; give it the
same name as the file, but append a simple token like
'.lock' ; then you can check for the presence of that
file before allowing the user to edit it from your
application.
Of course this won't do anything if users access it
from another application. Hope this helped
nonetheless.

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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Yahoo! Mail Plus ? Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com


From wmb at internettrainer.com  Thu Nov 21 13:45:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Thu Nov 21 13:45:01 2002
Subject: MS Access db via ODBC on Mac?
In-Reply-To: <9153BF43-FD74-11D6-AC2C-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <9B81134A-FD80-11D6-B2AF-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Donnerstag, November 21, 2002, at 06:13  Uhr, Alex Rice wrote:
>> If it can't be done, could I connect to that Windows PC in any way? 
>> There is
>> a LAN connection with that PC using PC-MAC LAN 8.
>
> That should give you access to the filesystem and printers on the 
> Windows machine, and not much else.

Dont know if its exactly what you are looking for. But it is really 
"great" done...
 From the Revolution Newbies Board
http://www.mailping.net/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi
  Forum tutorials
----

Not sure if you all saw Gary Rathbone's post about Inter Application 
Communication, but check out his site:

http://www.garyrathbone.net/repgen/

He was nice enough to email me an example stack (and give me permission 
to post it) which is now available here:

http://mailping.net/WebProcess.zip

Definitely worth checking out!
---

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Thu Nov 21 14:40:01 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Thu Nov 21 14:40:01 2002
Subject: Valentina and OS-X (Darwin) revisited...
In-Reply-To: <DF8CB8B5-FD41-11D6-8BD8-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <158BC46E-FD88-11D6-91B5-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Thursday, Nov 21, 2002, at 22:10 Australia/Sydney, Wolfgang M. 
Bereuter wrote:

>
> On Mittwoch, November 20, 2002, at 06:36  Uhr, Scott Raney wrote:
>
>> Real programmers use Emacs ;-)
>
> What is vi?

UNIX 1970s editor for full screen terminals, superseding ed, the line 
editor for teletypes and line-interactive terminals.

regards
David
>
> regards
> Wolfgang M. Bereuter
>
> Learn easy with trainingsmaps?
>
> INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
> Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
> ...............................
> http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
> ...............................
> Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Thu Nov 21 14:47:01 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Thu Nov 21 14:47:01 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <20021121172045.44808.qmail@www.boxfrog.com>
Message-ID: <15FD2FA2-FD89-11D6-91B5-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Friday, Nov 22, 2002, at 04:20 Australia/Sydney, miscdas at boxfrog.com 
wrote:

> Rob Cozens writes:
> [snip]
>> Anyone else want to play?
>> --  Rob Cozens
>> CCW, Serendipity Software Company
>> http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm
>
> Isn't this whole thread a big waste of valuable bandwidth?

No.

1. It was entertaining, except to Erik
2. It drew on the broader community to make a point to the Improve list.
3. It was closed before you wrote this anyway.

cheers
David

> miscdas _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From alex at mindlube.com  Thu Nov 21 15:08:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Thu Nov 21 15:08:01 2002
Subject: MS Access db via ODBC on Mac?
In-Reply-To: <9B81134A-FD80-11D6-B2AF-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <2428E2C6-FD8C-11D6-966F-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Thursday, November 21, 2002, at 11:39  AM, Wolfgang M. Bereuter 
wrote:
>
> Not sure if you all saw Gary Rathbone's post about Inter Application 
> Communication, but check out his site:
>
> http://www.garyrathbone.net/repgen/
>
> He was nice enough to email me an example stack (and give me 
> permission to post it) which is now available here:
>
> http://mailping.net/WebProcess.zip
>
> Definitely worth checking out!
>

Oh yes. Thanks for bringing this up again. I am starting to like this 
idea. Does anyone know in what versions of MS Excel got the "Web Query" 
Capability? It's not in Office X for Mac.

Obviously Office2000 for Windoze has it. What about Office 97?

TIA

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Thu Nov 21 15:38:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Thu Nov 21 15:38:01 2002
Subject: ftp:  how to prevent access to file currently being accessed?
In-Reply-To: <20021121183725.98806.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021121183725.98806.qmail@web11905.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <a05200a00ba02f2cdf23b@[128.196.99.210]>

hello:  thank you for this good idea -- i'll give this a try, since i 
have full control over the access.  best, olli.

11/21/02, Jan Schenkel wrote:

>--- Oliver Hardt <hardt at u.arizona.edu> wrote:
>
>Hi Oliver,
>
>If you control _all_ client access, you could create a
>file in the same directory on the server ; give it the
>same name as the file, but append a simple token like
>'.lock' ; then you can check for the presence of that
>file before allowing the user to edit it from your
>application.
>Of course this won't do anything if users access it
>from another application. Hope this helped
>nonetheless.


From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 21 17:01:02 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 21 17:01:02 2002
Subject: General Lists vs Special Lists
In-Reply-To: <20021121172045.44808.qmail@www.boxfrog.com>
References: <a05100300ba0192e21933@[216.229.107.230]>
 <20021121172045.44808.qmail@www.boxfrog.com>
Message-ID: <a05100301ba02ff213020@[216.229.107.23]>

>sn't this whole thread a big waste of valuable bandwidth?

Anonymous quote from my college days:

>>
Generalist: A person who learns less and less about more and more, 
and ends up knowing nothing about everything.

Specialist: A person who learns more and more about less and less, 
and ends up knowing everything about nothing.
<<

It occurs to me these definitions could be updated to present day:

Gereral List: A list where people talk less and less about more and 
more, and end up saying nothing about everything.

Special List: A list where people talk more and more about less and 
less, and end up saying everything about nothing.

Examples:

General List -- The HyperCard forum as I remember it, and by 
extension other unmoderated forums and wikis (sp?).  IMFO, they are 
only useful as demonstrations of anarchy.

Special List -- A group of Phd quantum physicists discussing the 
intricacies of sub atomic particle composition (as imagined by 
outsiders...I don't mean to imply quantum physicists don't have a 
sense of humor.  The implications of their findings astounding*.) 
The MetaCard List?  Erik's comment seems to imply it; I recall some 
snotty conversations I participated in when I was an MC List member 
(I remember them as candid exchanges among people who knew each other 
well enough to be frank); but I don't remember it as humorless.

Balanced List-- The HyperCard mailing list through all its hosts 
since U of Michigan.  An interest in the general subject was common 
to all List members; but few, if any, claimed to be HyperCard 
specialists.  The breadth of knowledge and discussion on the HC list, 
IMFO, demonstrates the kind of mix of subject knowledge, general 
discussion, and good-natured humor that defines the ideal list.

I trust in Heather to keep this from becoming a General List.

I give fair warning to Erik,  miscdas, and anyone else who wants to 
make this into a Special List: I will fight you every step of the way.

And BTW, isn't it wasting bandwidth and your time to respond to a 
message clearly labeled "Off Topic" instead of just deleting it and 
getting on with your life if you were not interested?
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Thu Nov 21 17:38:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Thu Nov 21 17:38:01 2002
Subject: Controls of Stack
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHKEIJCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Hi All

Does everyone know that repeat with x=1 to the number of controls of stack y
only enumerates the controls on the current card? Bit of a bugger..eh?

How does one parse all the controls of a stack ensuring that those in a
background only get parsed once unless they are fields with the sharedText
set to false... etc

FYI... I'm trying to develop the basis for a language engine when it wasn't
a requirement for the first version of the program. In the short term I want
to generate a list of objects with visible text. Then I'll search scripts
for ask and answer dialogs and any other hard coded text.

When I have all that I'll create stack file with a custom property set that
can be parsed to set everything for a particular language. Then I'll learn
to translate to ... ;-)

Cheers

Monte



From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 21 18:07:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Thu Nov 21 18:07:01 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <15FD2FA2-FD89-11D6-91B5-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>
Message-ID: <20021121230040.19721.qmail@web20009.mail.yahoo.com>

> > Isn't this whole thread a big waste of
> valuable bandwidth?
> 
> No.
> 
> 1. It was entertaining, except to Erik

i WAS entertained!

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus ? Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
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From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 21 18:13:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Thu Nov 21 18:13:01 2002
Subject: General Lists vs Special Lists
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba02ff213020@[216.229.107.23]>
Message-ID: <20021121230655.6888.qmail@web20005.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Rob Cozens <rcozens at pon.net> wrote:
> >sn't this whole thread a big waste of valuable
> bandwidth?

> Special List: A list where people talk more and
> more about less and 
> less, and end up saying everything about
> nothing.
>
> The MetaCard List?  Erik's comment seems to
> imply it; ... but I don't remember
> it as humorless.

calmate Rob, where is your sense of irony?

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus ? Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
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From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Thu Nov 21 18:15:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Thu Nov 21 18:15:01 2002
Subject: Video Editing
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHEEIKCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Hi All

Are there any video editing externals? 

Monte Goulding
B.App.Sc. (Hons.)

Executive Director
Sweat Technologies

email: monte at sweattechnologies.com
website: www.sweattechnologies.com
mobile (International): +61 421 138 274 
       (Australia): 0421 138 274



From rpresender at earthlink.net  Thu Nov 21 18:22:00 2002
From: rpresender at earthlink.net (Robert Presender)
Date: Thu Nov 21 18:22:00 2002
Subject: internanl Icons with Standalone 
In-Reply-To: <200211211547.KAA16500@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <16EB78F6-FDA7-11D6-87ED-000393A19046@earthlink.net>

Hi Jan and Andre,
Don't know if this is what you are looking for.. but anyway.....

I just open the stack revicons.rev of  Revolution UI Stacks(in  
Application Overview) and found all kinds of icons including the 
ToolBar Icons, etc.  There are five cards.

Using 1.1.1 and OS 10.2.2.  I took a long, long time for each card to 
show.  At first I thought that the cards couldn't be opened and I used 
force quit.  I decided to wait awhile and finally
a card opened.

Regards ... Bob
On Thursday, November 21, 2002, at 07:47  AM, Jan Schenkel wrote:

> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 23:09:24 -0800 (PST)
> From: Jan Schenkel <janschenkel at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: internanl Icons with Standalone
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>
> --- Andre Rombauts <andre.rombauts at win.be> wrote:
>> Le 19/11/2002 07:19, Andre Rombauts ?
>> andre.rombauts at win.be a ?crit:
>>
>>> Even if I check the relevant option in the Build
>> dialog to include the icons
>>> lib, internal icons are not available in dialog
>> boxes such as ?ask? or
>>> ?answer?... :-(
>>> Any idea.
>>>
>> No reply to my question. Is it so stupid?... :-(
>> Andr?
>>
>
> Hi Andre,
>
> It's not a silly question. If my guess is correct,
> you'd like to include some of the nice icons in the
> toolbar or scattered around the rest of RunRev.
> I haven't found them yet, but as they're an integral
> part of the IDE, they might fall under copyright and
> that could explain why they aren't in a library.
> However, technically nothing is to stop you from using
> the Application Overview and wading through all the
> RunRev UI stacks in search of these images.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Jan Schenkel.
>



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Thu Nov 21 18:50:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Thu Nov 21 18:50:01 2002
Subject: internanl Icons with Standalone 
In-Reply-To: <16EB78F6-FDA7-11D6-87ED-000393A19046@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHEEILCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

One of the first questions I asked Kevin when I got rev was about the IDE icons and he said it's fine to use them. I doubt he would have changed his mind. I just opened the stack revIcons and imported them into a new image library for my use. 

If it were me and I was allowing people to use these icons I'd add value to my product from the start and include appropriate ones as image libraries anyway. 

Note that you can use any part of the IDE as long as you don't make a product that interferes with rev's business plan. 

Monte



From tmw at his.com  Thu Nov 21 20:34:01 2002
From: tmw at his.com (tom)
Date: Thu Nov 21 20:34:01 2002
Subject: reading QT tracks - timecode
Message-ID: <200211220127.gAM1RbA25989@mail.his.com>

I am building an application in HC, that I am thinking of porting to Rev.

I have bought Rev and the manuals but having a hard time making the 
transition.

As I strugle I have run in to a easy in HC fucntion that it is not clear 
that Rev is up to. 

Can anyone tell me if:

 - Rev can read a timcecode track (a track placeed in Mov with apple's 
tool - 'QTTimeCode'). 

 - us this track info go to a specific time in the movie

 - display / record this timecode in a Rev Field as the movie is playing 
and when playing is paused.

Maybe a simpler question is: Can Rev use the same QT XCMD that HC uses?
I know this will limit playing to Macs.. but that for now is ok.




- Also as a movie player does Rev do a better or worse job than QT player?

I ask as in Os X i am finding QT player is having trouble playing my 
movies about 15 FPS while in OS 9 they play fine at 30 FPS. [I assume 
this is a downside of true multiTasking.]  FWIW the movies in question 
are DV and in hour + chunks, so pre-loading into memory is probably out.


Thanks
  Tom Witte



From mdswindell at charter.net  Thu Nov 21 21:34:01 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Thu Nov 21 21:34:01 2002
Subject: Can a mouseclick simultaneously send a message as it ends a
	"repeat until the mouseclick" loop?
In-Reply-To: <200211220127.gAM1RbA25989@mail.his.com>
Message-ID: <BA02D607.3A27%mdswindell@charter.net>

If I am in a (repeat until the mouseclick) loop, is it possible to have the
same mouseclick that ends the repeat also send a mouseUp event to another
button?  I have a repeating slide show that I'd like the user to be able to
change simply by clicking on a new button, not clicking once to stop the
slideshow, and again to start the new one.  Another angle on accomplishing
this?

Thanks,
Mark 



From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Thu Nov 21 22:10:01 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Thu Nov 21 22:10:01 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <20021121230040.19721.qmail@web20009.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <FAF17FC6-FDC6-11D6-91B5-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Friday, Nov 22, 2002, at 10:00 Australia/Sydney, erik hansen wrote:

>>> Isn't this whole thread a big waste of
>> valuable bandwidth?
>>
>> No.
>>
>> 1. It was entertaining, except to Erik
>
> i WAS entertained!

Sorry Erik. We misunderstood you...You were just caught in my humourous 
sally....cheers, David
>
> =====
> erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail Plus ? Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
> http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Thu Nov 21 23:47:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Thu Nov 21 23:47:01 2002
Subject: Off Topic Group Quiz
In-Reply-To: <FAF17FC6-FDC6-11D6-91B5-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>
Message-ID: <20021122044048.67088.qmail@web20010.mail.yahoo.com>

> Sorry Erik. We misunderstood you...You were
> just caught in my humourous 
> sally....cheers, David

otay

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

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From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Fri Nov 22 01:13:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Fri Nov 22 01:13:01 2002
Subject: Controls of Stack
In-Reply-To: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHKEIJCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <20021122060646.43546.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Monte Goulding <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
wrote:
> 
> Hi All
> 
> Does everyone know that repeat with x=1 to the
> number of controls of stack y
> only enumerates the controls on the current card?
> Bit of a bugger..eh?
> 
> How does one parse all the controls of a stack
> ensuring that those in a
> background only get parsed once unless they are
> fields with the sharedText
> set to false... etc
> 
> FYI... I'm trying to develop the basis for a
> language engine when it wasn't
> a requirement for the first version of the program.
> In the short term I want
> to generate a list of objects with visible text.
> Then I'll search scripts
> for ask and answer dialogs and any other hard coded
> text.
> 
> When I have all that I'll create stack file with a
> custom property set that
> can be parsed to set everything for a particular
> language. Then I'll learn
> to translate to ... ;-)
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Monte
> 

Hi Monte,

You'll have to check the object's long ID and keep
track of group objects. Untested, but something along
these lines should work:

set the wholeMatches to true
repeat with i = 1 to the number of controls
  put the long ID of control i into tLongID
  if (word 1 of tLongID is "group") or \
     (word 5 of tLongID is "group") then
    if lineOffset(tLongID, tKnownGroupItems) > 0 then
      next repeat
    else
      put tLongID & return after tKnownGroupItems
    end if
  end if
  -- do your stuff here
end repeat    

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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From sims at ezpzapps.com  Fri Nov 22 01:16:00 2002
From: sims at ezpzapps.com (sims)
Date: Fri Nov 22 01:16:00 2002
Subject: [OT]  Netherlands
Message-ID: <a05200f01ba037b281e25@[10.0.1.2]>

Thank you to the many Dutch speaking people who replied!
Translation done.


Grazzi!

sims



At 7:11 +0100 11/22/02, sims wrote:
>I'm hoping that someone from the Netherlands can translate
>a comment sent to me by a purchaser of one of my Rev
>shareware products....
>
>Please email me at sims at ezpzapps.com
>
>Thanks
>
>sims



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Fri Nov 22 01:19:00 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Fri Nov 22 01:19:00 2002
Subject: internanl Icons with Standalone 
In-Reply-To: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHEEILCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <20021122061307.25638.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Monte Goulding <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
wrote:
> 
> One of the first questions I asked Kevin when I got
> rev was about the IDE icons and he said it's fine to
> use them. I doubt he would have changed his mind. I
> just opened the stack revIcons and imported them
> into a new image library for my use. 
> 
> If it were me and I was allowing people to use these
> icons I'd add value to my product from the start and
> include appropriate ones as image libraries anyway. 
> 
> Note that you can use any part of the IDE as long as
> you don't make a product that interferes with rev's
> business plan. 
> 
> Monte
> 

Hi Monte,

Thanks for pointing it out as the 'revicons' stack.
It's the fact that these icons weren't included in a
library, that lead me to the conclusion there was a
copyright on them.
Moreover, those people that make these icons, clicking
their mouses endlessly, peering at the screen at
various resolutions to make sure it's just right
[anyone else get visions of Trappist munks making
miniatures?] generally do get paid for it and may have
copyrights on them.
But if we can use them, all the more fun :-)

Jan Schenkel.

PS: One can indeed learn a _lot_ from the RunRev IDE
scripts ; high-quality, well-tested code...

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Fri Nov 22 01:31:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Fri Nov 22 01:31:01 2002
Subject: Can a mouseclick simultaneously send a message as it ends a "repeat until the mouseclick" loop?
In-Reply-To: <BA02D607.3A27%mdswindell@charter.net>
Message-ID: <20021122062438.44603.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Mark Swindell <mdswindell at charter.net> wrote:
> If I am in a (repeat until the mouseclick) loop, is
> it possible to have the
> same mouseclick that ends the repeat also send a
> mouseUp event to another
> button?  I have a repeating slide show that I'd like
> the user to be able to
> change simply by clicking on a new button, not
> clicking once to stop the
> slideshow, and again to start the new one.  Another
> angle on accomplishing
> this?
> 
> Thanks,
> Mark 
> 

Hi Mark,

Even though your 'repeat until the mouseClick' is
considered a 'no-no' because it gobbles up all the CPU
time, you should have a look at the 'mouseControl'
definition in the Transcript documentation.
Basically, it gives you the type and the number of the
control the mouse pointer is currently hovering over.
So your loop should end something like this:

  repeat until the mouseClick
    -- do your slideshow here
  end repeat
  get the mouseControl
  if it is not empty then send "mouseUp" to it

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Fri Nov 22 01:43:00 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Fri Nov 22 01:43:00 2002
Subject: Controls of Stack
In-Reply-To: <20021122060646.43546.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHIEIPCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

> 
> set the wholeMatches to true
> repeat with i = 1 to the number of controls
>   put the long ID of control i into tLongID
>   if (word 1 of tLongID is "group") or \
>      (word 5 of tLongID is "group") then
>     if lineOffset(tLongID, tKnownGroupItems) > 0 then
>       next repeat
>     else
>       put tLongID & return after tKnownGroupItems
>     end if
>   end if
>   -- do your stuff here
> end repeat    
> 
> Hope this helped,
> 
> Jan Schenkel.
> 
Thanks Jan


From mdswindell at charter.net  Fri Nov 22 02:54:01 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Fri Nov 22 02:54:01 2002
Subject: Can a mouseclick simultaneously send a message as it ends a
	"repeat until the mouseclick" loop?
In-Reply-To: <20021122062438.44603.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BA032102.3A4D%mdswindell@charter.net>

on 11/21/02 10:24 PM, Jan Schenkel at janschenkel at yahoo.com wrote:

> --- Mark Swindell <mdswindell at charter.net> wrote:
>> If I am in a (repeat until the mouseclick) loop, is
>> it possible to have the
>> same mouseclick that ends the repeat also send a
>> mouseUp event to another
>> button?  I have a repeating slide show that I'd like
>> the user to be able to
>> change simply by clicking on a new button, not
>> clicking once to stop the
>> slideshow, and again to start the new one.  Another
>> angle on accomplishing
>> this?
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> Mark 
>> 
> 
> Hi Mark,
> 
> Even though your 'repeat until the mouseClick' is
> considered a 'no-no' because it gobbles up all the CPU
> time, you should have a look at the 'mouseControl'
> definition in the Transcript documentation.
> Basically, it gives you the type and the number of the
> control the mouse pointer is currently hovering over.
> So your loop should end something like this:
> 
> repeat until the mouseClick
> -- do your slideshow here
> end repeat
> get the mouseControl
> if it is not empty then send "mouseUp" to it
> 
> Hope this helped,
> 
> Jan Schenkel.

Thanks, Jan.  When I checked out the mouseControl function it appears to
return the type and layer of the control.  While I could send a mouseUp to
the control by testing for it being under the cursor, what I need it for the
mouseUp to be sent on actually clicking the mouse from within the repeat
loop, not simply crossing over, or hovering over, the control region.  I'm
probably missing something, so please educate me.

Given that I have a pretty simple thing going on: On ShowWords... repeat
until the mouseclick... put word the random of gMyWords into fld myField...
other stuff... wait gtheTicks... end repeat... end mouseUp, how could I
better script the performance to be able to execute a new mouseUp without
having to waste one to exit the existing one without having to waste one?


Thanks again,
Mark



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Fri Nov 22 04:26:00 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Fri Nov 22 04:26:00 2002
Subject: Can a mouseclick simultaneously send a message as it ends a "repeat until the mouseclick" loop?
In-Reply-To: <BA032102.3A4D%mdswindell@charter.net>
Message-ID: <20021122092011.7621.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Mark Swindell <mdswindell at charter.net> wrote:
> [snip]
> 
> Thanks, Jan.  When I checked out the mouseControl
> function it appears to
> return the type and layer of the control.  While I
> could send a mouseUp to
> the control by testing for it being under the
> cursor, what I need it for the
> mouseUp to be sent on actually clicking the mouse
> from within the repeat
> loop, not simply crossing over, or hovering over,
> the control region.  I'm
> probably missing something, so please educate me.
> 
> Given that I have a pretty simple thing going on: On
> ShowWords... repeat
> until the mouseclick... put word the random of
> gMyWords into fld myField...
> other stuff... wait gtheTicks... end repeat... end
> mouseUp, how could I
> better script the performance to be able to execute
> a new mouseUp without
> having to waste one to exit the existing one without
> having to waste one?
> 
> 
> Thanks again,
> Mark
> 

Hi Mark,

While I'm not using RunRev for multimedia purposes,
let's see what I can come up with...

First of all, let's redo the repeat loop and make it a
'send' loop. This should probably go in the card
script or somewhere similar:

local sTheSlideSendID
on doSlideThing
  global gMyWords, gTheTicks
  put word the random of gMyWords into fld myField
  -- other stuff
  -- ...
  -- now instead of 'wait' we use 'send ... in time'
  if "doSlideThing is not in the pendingMessages \
  then
    send "doSlideThing" to me in gTheTicks ticks
    put the result into sTheSlideSendID
  end if
end doSlideThing

on endSlideThing
  cancel sTheSlideSendID
end endSlideThing

This last handler will allow us to easily stop the
slide show loop from within another handler. Now we
rescipt the buttons so that they halt the slide show
and do something else.

on mouseUp
  if "doSlideThing" is in the pendingMessages then
    send "endSlideThing" to this card
  end if
  -- start something else
end mouseUp

This way the engine can return CPU-time to the OS in
between the showing of slides, unlike when you're
using the 'wait' command.
This tactic also avoids the 'repeat until mouseClick'
which would have similar effects ; plus, you don't run
the risk of the mouse having mopved to a different
spot in between your detecting the click and checking
where it is at that time.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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From wmb at internettrainer.com  Fri Nov 22 04:45:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Fri Nov 22 04:45:01 2002
Subject: Valentina and OS-X (Darwin) revisited...
In-Reply-To: <158BC46E-FD88-11D6-91B5-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>
Message-ID: <3FB2E004-FDFE-11D6-A7D4-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Donnerstag, November 21, 2002, at 08:33  Uhr, David Vaughan wrote:

> UNIX 1970s editor for full screen terminals, superseding ed, the line 
> editor for teletypes and line-interactive terminals.
Uff:)
>
> regards
> David

Thanks

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Fri Nov 22 05:01:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Fri Nov 22 05:01:01 2002
Subject: Rev 2.0
Message-ID: <p05100300ba03aebc54b9@[10.0.1.202]>

Hello,


Just to let the pressure going higher : next week should be THE week...!!!
I sleep very bad since 2 days...I'm waiting very impatiently...
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From gsaylor at net-virtual.com  Fri Nov 22 05:16:01 2002
From: gsaylor at net-virtual.com (Greg Saylor)
Date: Fri Nov 22 05:16:01 2002
Subject: Valentina and OS-X (Darwin) revisited...
In-Reply-To: <200211212202.RAA27865@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211212202.RAA27865@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <20021122101055.22989@mail.earthlink.net>

>UNIX 1970s editor for full screen terminals, superseding ed, the line 
>editor for teletypes and line-interactive terminals.

While this is certainly technically correct... I just wanted to point
out, after having digesting this (and several long islands), that this
simple (although, as I mentioned, accurate statement) does not pay homage
to that which is "vi"...  And even though this is soooo far off topic as
to make this response almost sinful, I feel compelled to set the record
entirely straight (err, whatever your preference is)...

So without further adieu:

It is pronounced "vee-eye". Not "veye" or "vee".

There are a few things you need to know.  Lots of things you should know.
 And a handful of things you can know, if you so desire.

If you type "vi /lfjksadkfjl/sdfajldsjfd/sdjfdlsajf" and you don't see
something which looks like the following, then your system does not have
"vi" installed:

~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
~
"/lfjksadkfjl/sdfajldsjfd/sdjfdlsajf" [New File]
NOTICE-1: vi doesn't care that these directories don't exist.  It assumes
you are smarter then to edit files in directories which don't exist.
NOTICE-2: Press the arrow keys - go right ahead.  Notice they do nothing.
 How strange.
NOTICE-3: Be careful!  Don't go pressing any keys on the keyboard besides
the arrow keys, otherwise even wierder things will happen!

Okay, now press "i".  Nothing happened -- or did it?  Well, you will now
see that you are in "INSERT MODE" - and in fact if someone has setup your
vi environment to interact with humans, you might actually see that at
the bottom of the screen.

.. Well, anyways, I just wanted to spend a few moments and "paint a
picture"... Hopefully this will encourage someone (even ONE person) to
learn this wonderful gift given to us from UNIX...

Sincerely,

/dev/null

P.S. Sorry to be off topic, but I am sure this made at least a couple of
people snicker...



From chripa at aon.at  Fri Nov 22 05:47:01 2002
From: chripa at aon.at (Chris Pastl)
Date: Fri Nov 22 05:47:01 2002
Subject: How to open a driver on Mac OS 9? 
Message-ID: <BA03C83D.14E%chripa@aon.at>

I want to use Revolution?s "open driver" function
on Mac OS 9;
but I always get the following message when I try to
open a driver: "Can?t open that file".
Other programs can access the driver;
so the problem might be Revolution.

I?ve tested many different names and cases,
but I get the same result every time.

Does anybody know how to make this running?


Chris 


From heather at runrev.com  Fri Nov 22 06:19:01 2002
From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams)
Date: Fri Nov 22 06:19:01 2002
Subject: General Lists vs Special Lists
In-Reply-To: <200211212202.RAA27865@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA03BE79.9ACD%heather@runrev.com>

> I trust in Heather to keep this from becoming a General List.
> 
Why, thank you Rob. Actually, it's the good folks on the list who make it
what it is. The amount of cheerful, friendly, incredibly erudite advice that
gets dispensed round here never ceases to astound me. Personally, I enjoy
the occasional off topic thread - though the operational word there is
occasional - as I think do most folk. When people start getting irritated is
when to stop however. As, I think, we all know.

> I give fair warning to Erik,  miscdas, and anyone else who wants to
> make this into a Special List: I will fight you every step of the way.

Rob, if I thought you were planning to start posting regularly on politics,
artwork and the state of the nation, those words would alarm me... Since we
all have seen and benefited from your regular, excellent, on topic postings,
I think I should be safe to leave it entirely up to your own good judgement.

A little bit of sugar now and then helps the coding go better.

Can I just slip in a reminder here about html formatting? Please, plain text
only for your postings, turn off all that fancy formatting before you hit
send. It's very indigestible for those folks who don't get single messages.

Oh, and my contribution to the off topic list... How about novel writers?

Regards,

Heather

-- 
Heather Williams <heather at runrev.com> <http://www.runrev.com/>
Runtime Revolution Ltd.
Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707
Ten Thumbs Typing Tutor Teach your Fingers to Dance



From rodmc at runrev.com  Fri Nov 22 07:11:01 2002
From: rodmc at runrev.com (Rod McCall)
Date: Fri Nov 22 07:11:01 2002
Subject: Rev 2.0
In-Reply-To: <p05100300ba03aebc54b9@[10.0.1.202]>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20021122115057.024a1d00@mail.spamcop.net>

Dear Yves,

We will be discussing the final date shortly. However I would advise 
against any customers getting sleepless nights over Revolution. While the 
team are excited about the up and coming release we all try to get a good 
nights sleep after a hard days work, I would advise all our customers to do 
the same :-)

As an aside there are two articles in MacLife Germany:

11/2002 A full and excellent review of Revolution 1.1.1
12/2002 A tutorial of 1.1.1

We've had a lot of press coverage and overall a series of really good 
reviews in the last 12 months, so thanks to everyone here for using Rev and 
hence helping to make use news worthy.

Cheers,

rod


At 10:54 22/11/2002 +0100, yves COPPE wrote:
>Hello,
>
>
>Just to let the pressure going higher : next week should be THE week...!!!
>I sleep very bad since 2 days...I'm waiting very impatiently...
>--
>Greetings.
>
>Yves COPPE
>
>Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be
>_______________________________________________
>use-revolution mailing list
>use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

Rod McCall  <www.runrev.com>
Runtime Revolution Ltd
Revolution - The Solution for Software Development
tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165 fax: +44 (0) 131 718 4334

All email subject to spam and virus checks. This may delay a response.



From steve at messimercomputing.com  Fri Nov 22 09:14:01 2002
From: steve at messimercomputing.com (Steve Messimer)
Date: Fri Nov 22 09:14:01 2002
Subject: Getting the name of objects
In-Reply-To: <200211220755.CAA04623@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA03A46F.E02%steve@messimercomputing.com>

Hi,

I need some help with this. I am creating groups in one stack and pasting
them in another.  The group contains a field and a lock button that when
clicked will toggle the lockText property of the field. The problem is that
in the process of pasting the grp it is renamed so the lock btn has to be
able to determine the name of the grp in order to work. ( have tried the
script w/o the grp reference and it doesn't work. here are a few of the
scripts I have tried without success.

on mouseUp
  if the icon of me is 954 then
    set the icon of me to 953
    set the lockText of fld "fldGrp" of the owner of me to false
  else
    set the icon of me to 954
    set the lockText of fld "fldGrp" of the owner of me to true
  end if
end mouseUp

on mouseUp
  put the short name of the owner of me into myOwner
  if the icon of me is 954 then
    set the icon of me to 953
    set the lockText of fld "fldGrp" of grp myOwner to false
  else
    set the icon of me to 954
    set the lockText of fld "fldGrp" of grp myOwner to true
  end if
end mouseUp

on mouseUp
put quote & the short name of the owner of me & quote into myOwner
  if the icon of me is 954 then
    set the icon of me to 953
    set the lockText of fld "fldGrp" of grp myOwner to false
  else
    set the icon of me to 954
    set the lockText of fld "fldGrp" of grp myOwner to true
  end if
end mouseUp

Thanks for your help.

Steve

Stephen R. Messimer
Messimer Computing, Inc
208 1st Ave South
Escanaba, MI 49829
www.messimercomputing.com




From doupsy at wanadoo.fr  Fri Nov 22 09:17:01 2002
From: doupsy at wanadoo.fr (doupsy at wanadoo.fr)
Date: Fri Nov 22 09:17:01 2002
Subject: Special characters with menuitems
Message-ID: <7428AFFA-FE20-11D6-94EF-0003937E4820@wanadoo.fr>

Hello,

How is it possible to write menuitems that contains special characters 
without wanting special effect.
for example i want this menuitem    :        Monsieur (j)

With XFCN FullHPop (Hypercard) we use \  before special character to put 
out the effect of this special character.

Thanks.

Edouard



From giulio at cantoberon.it  Fri Nov 22 10:55:01 2002
From: giulio at cantoberon.it (giulio mastrosanti)
Date: Fri Nov 22 10:55:01 2002
Subject: "Move all images into individual files" build option
In-Reply-To: <200211220757.CAA04771@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <DE236AB8-FE31-11D6-BC6B-000393A949D8@cantoberon.it>

Hi all,
Can't realize how to use "Move all images into individual files" build 
option.
I imagined checking it on the build options form to have a smaller 
executable, and the imagines I have imported into my card to be on some 
subfolder of the executable folder.
But this don't seem to happen, what am I missing?
thanx for your answer,

       Giulio



From dsc at swcp.com  Fri Nov 22 10:57:00 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Fri Nov 22 10:57:00 2002
Subject: Can a mouseclick simultaneously send a message as it ends a "repeat until the mouseclick" loop?
In-Reply-To: <20021122092011.7621.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <C2685944-FE31-11D6-9279-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Friday, November 22, 2002, at 02:20 AM, Jan Schenkel wrote:

> First of all, let's redo the repeat loop and make it a
> 'send' loop.

I recommend Jan's approach.

And would add this.

If doSlideThing is called from a button mouseUp, you need a way to keep 
from starting a second slide show running on top of and interfering with 
the first.  It can also keep the first from being able to be stopped.

The simplest way might be this:

on startSlideThing
    endSlideThing
    doSlideThing
end startSlideThing

...and don't call doSlideThing from anywhere else.

You can also use a busy flag which can have advantages in preventing a 
stagger when stopping and immediately starting a slide show.


If cards can be changed, consider what you want to happen.  You may want 
to endSlideThing.  If not, the field should be card qualified or be me.  
(In the latter case, put the three slideThing handlers in the field and 
send to the field; your field becomes a slide show object.)


(And to add to the confusion... You might consider keeping the slide 
show on all the time and simply switch out the word list, using a blank 
list to keep it from flashing.)

Dar Scott



From dsc at swcp.com  Fri Nov 22 11:12:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Fri Nov 22 11:12:01 2002
Subject: Getting the name of objects
In-Reply-To: <BA03A46F.E02%steve@messimercomputing.com>
Message-ID: <DBFDAE4B-FE33-11D6-9279-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Friday, November 22, 2002, at 07:08 AM, Steve Messimer wrote:

>     set the lockText of fld "fldGrp" of the owner of me to false

I have used "of the owner of me" (Rev 1.1.1) in the past and it has 
worked.  Maybe something else is wrong.  Maybe the field got renamed 
somehow?

(Uh.  This same code broke under a quick look at an MC alpha.  I'm not 
sure if it was the "of the owner of me" part; I think it was calling 
handlers in groups.  I was looking at something else and was not able to 
look into it at the time.)

This sibling referencing oughta be handy in using multiple copies of the 
same group on one card.  (Translation:  I would like to do this 
eventually and if this happens to be what you are doing and it works, 
I'd be pleased if you report that.)

Dar Scott



From kevin at runrev.com  Fri Nov 22 11:19:01 2002
From: kevin at runrev.com (Kevin Miller)
Date: Fri Nov 22 11:19:01 2002
Subject: Schedule for 2.0
Message-ID: <BA040813.D61A%kevin@runrev.com>

Hi,

I have a little good, and a little not so good news about 2.0.

First, the not so good news.  Unfortunately, we are running a little later
than expected.  We want to ensure that 2.0 is in the best possible shape and
the feature set is well tested.  As such the release is going to be later
than we originally published, though not by all that much.  We want to get
it right.  Please bear with us a little longer.

The good news is that we're going to fix the subscription renewal cut off
date at 26th October.  Anyone having purchased after that date, in 2001,
will get a free upgrade when we ship 2.0.  Thus many people will qualify for
a free upgrade.  However, please don't let that put you off renewing - 2.0
has been a very big development task, and your support in renewing your
subscription around now would be much appreciated if you can afford to do so
:-)

Kind regards,

Kevin

Kevin Miller <kevin at runrev.com> <http://www.runrev.com/>
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
Tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165.  Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707.



From rcozens at pon.net  Fri Nov 22 11:28:00 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Fri Nov 22 11:28:00 2002
Subject: Controls of Stack
In-Reply-To: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHKEIJCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
References: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHKEIJCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <a05100301ba03fa26fd79@[216.229.107.154]>

>Does everyone know that repeat with x=1 to the number of controls of stack y
>only enumerates the controls on the current card? Bit of a bugger..eh?
>
>How does one parse all the controls of a stack ensuring that those in a
>background only get parsed once unless they are fields with the sharedText
>set to false... etc

Hi Monte,

It was a pain in the derriere in HyperCard where there is only one 
background per card.  It can only be worse in Revolution.

I believe the recommended approach to translation is to use the 
Profile Manager to preconfigure each control for each language 
supported.  I personally do not use this approach because I want my 
app to be translatable into any (Western) language, not just those it 
ships with.

FYI, the Serendipity Reference includes a short primer on stack 
translatability in the appendix, and the Serendipity Library includes 
translation tools + examples...but no handler to inventory your 
controls  :{(
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Fri Nov 22 11:28:59 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Fri Nov 22 11:28:59 2002
Subject: General Lists vs Special Lists
In-Reply-To: <BA03BE79.9ACD%heather@runrev.com>
References: <BA03BE79.9ACD%heather@runrev.com>
Message-ID: <a05100302ba03ff272a6d@[216.229.107.154]>

>Rob, if I thought you were planning to start posting regularly on politics,
>artwork and the state of the nation, those words would alarm me.

That's fair, Heather, and just what I would expect to keep this from 
becoming a "General List".  If you need any guidance in keeping me in 
line, perhaps Jacque Gay can give you some pointers from her 
experience as HyperCard List mom.

Anyway, I'll keep my politics below my signature and attempt to touch 
on art only in some context that applies to the topic under 
discussion.

Peace,
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Fri Nov 22 11:29:57 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Fri Nov 22 11:29:57 2002
Subject: General Lists vs Special Lists
In-Reply-To: <20021121230655.6888.qmail@web20005.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021121230655.6888.qmail@web20005.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <a05100303ba0400c08a80@[216.229.107.154]>

>calmate Rob, where is your sense of irony?

My apologies, Erik.

We had not conversed enough for me to know whether to take your 
initial comment as a warning or an order.  Sorry I was in the frame 
of mind to assume the worst instead of the best.

I'm glad your were entertained, and sorry I spoiled it by being 
confrontational.
-- 

Rob


From mpetrides at earthlink.net  Fri Nov 22 11:32:04 2002
From: mpetrides at earthlink.net (Marian Petrides)
Date: Fri Nov 22 11:32:04 2002
Subject: Schedule for 2.0
Message-ID: <Springmail.0994.1037982181.0.73374100@webmail.pas.earthlink.net>

Kevin,

Thank you very much for doing the honorable thing! 

Count me in for a renewal--and YES, I had been holding off until I really
needed a new version because I thought I was going to have just missed the
deadline yet again.

Marian

On Fri, 22 Nov 2002 16:13:07 +0000 Kevin Miller <kevin at runrev.com> wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> I have a little good, and a little not so good
> news about 2.0.
> 
> First, the not so good news.  Unfortunately, we
> are running a little later
> than expected.  We want to ensure that 2.0 is
> in the best possible shape and
> the feature set is well tested.  As such the
> release is going to be later
> than we originally published, though not by all
> that much.  We want to get
> it right.  Please bear with us a little longer.
> 
> The good news is that we're going to fix the
> subscription renewal cut off
> date at 26th October.  Anyone having purchased
> after that date, in 2001,
> will get a free upgrade when we ship 2.0.  Thus
> many people will qualify for
> a free upgrade.  However, please don't let that
> put you off renewing - 2.0
> has been a very big development task, and your
> support in renewing your
> subscription around now would be much
> appreciated if you can afford to do so
> :-)
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> Kevin
> 
> Kevin Miller  
> Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for
> Software Development
> Tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165.  Fax: +44 (0)1639
> 830 707.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 



From troy at rpsystems.net  Fri Nov 22 11:34:31 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Fri Nov 22 11:34:31 2002
Subject: Schedule for 2.0
In-Reply-To: <BA040813.D61A%kevin@runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA03C42E.1691C%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/22/02 11:13 AM, "Kevin Miller" <kevin at runrev.com> wrote:

> First, the not so good news.  Unfortunately, we are running a little later
> than expected.  We want to ensure that 2.0 is in the best possible shape and
> the feature set is well tested.  As such the release is going to be later
> than we originally published, though not by all that much.  We want to get
> it right.  Please bear with us a little longer.

An updated beta sometime soon? Doesn't the feature set need "real world"
testing? (Preferably one with an enabled builder.)

Other than that, don't worry about it. Of all people, it should be this
group that understands software development scheduling issues.


-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net



From themacguy at macosx.com  Fri Nov 22 11:36:02 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Fri Nov 22 11:36:02 2002
Subject: Strange script error
Message-ID: <4BF14EC8-FE37-11D6-B251-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

I have a handler in an Image object (id 1054) on the second card (id 
1051) in my stack:
____
on mouseUp
	set the currentFrame of me to 1
	go card "quiz"
	-- that's the first card in the stack; it's named "quiz"
	--
	-- this is a two-frame gif used as a rollover button
	-- we reset it to frame 1 before we leave
end mouseUp
____

When I click on the image I am brought to the first card but an error 
message occurs:

Error description:  Handler: error in statement
go card "quiz"
Line: 3 Character: 1
Value: mouseUp

Error description:  Object Name:

Line: 0 Character: 0
Value: image id 1054 of card id 1051 of stack "/Macintosh 
HD/Users/blevine/Demo Apps/Revolution 1.1.1/Rhyming Pairs.112002.rev"
____

Any ideas what I'm doing wrong?

Thanks,
Barry



From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Fri Nov 22 11:37:00 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Fri Nov 22 11:37:00 2002
Subject: Rev 2.0
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20021122115057.024a1d00@mail.spamcop.net>
Message-ID: <EA05613D-FE37-11D6-A64D-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Hi all,

> ...
> As an aside there are two articles in MacLife Germany:
>
> 11/2002 A full and excellent review of Revolution 1.1.1
> 12/2002 A tutorial of 1.1.1

we all should give a very big hand to our german revolutionist
Mr. Malte Brill, who wrote these two articles.

Thank you Malte ;-)


Regards

Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de



From mdswindell at charter.net  Fri Nov 22 11:38:00 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Fri Nov 22 11:38:00 2002
Subject: Can a mouseclick simultaneously send a message as it ends a
	"repeat until the mouseclick" loop?
In-Reply-To: <C2685944-FE31-11D6-9279-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <BA039BD5.3A7D%mdswindell@charter.net>

on 11/22/02 7:47 AM, Dar Scott at dsc at swcp.com wrote:

> On Friday, November 22, 2002, at 02:20 AM, Jan Schenkel wrote:
> 
>> First of all, let's redo the repeat loop and make it a
>> 'send' loop.
> 
> I recommend Jan's approach.
> 
> And would add this.
> 
> If doSlideThing is called from a button mouseUp, you need a way to keep
> from starting a second slide show running on top of and interfering with
> the first.  It can also keep the first from being able to be stopped.
> 
> The simplest way might be this:
> 
> on startSlideThing
> endSlideThing
> doSlideThing
> end startSlideThing
> 
> ...and don't call doSlideThing from anywhere else.

Thanks, Jan and Dar, for your suggestions.  I will try out the send
technique, as it sounds like it is a more efficient routine I need to become
familiar with. 

I misspoke about the "slide show." What is going on is "like" a slide show,
in that a series of words supplied from a variable are displayed in a field.
These lists are called from buttons that the user clicks to activate.  (Two
sets of them could not run at once, since there is only one global variable
supplying the words, and it is filled with a new set of words on each
mouseUp handler.) These words are then put, one at a time, into the same
field for display. 

So, the behavior I want is for a set of words to be displaying indefinitely
at user defined intervals, and then upon receiving a mouseclick on a
different button, for the different list to begin displaying immmediately,
without need of an intermediate click to stop the first handler from
executing.

Thanks,

Mark



From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Fri Nov 22 11:45:01 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Fri Nov 22 11:45:01 2002
Subject: Schedule for 2.0
In-Reply-To: <BA040813.D61A%kevin@runrev.com>
Message-ID: <019CC37D-FE39-11D6-A64D-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Hi Kevin,

> Hi,
>
> I have a little good, and a little not so good news about 2.0.
>
> First, the not so good news.  Unfortunately, we are running a little 
> later
> than expected.  We want to ensure that 2.0 is in the best possible 
> shape and
> the feature set is well tested.  As such the release is going to be 
> later
> than we originally published, though not by all that much.  We want to 
> get
> it right.  Please bear with us a little longer.

Don't worry Kevin.

This will be a ridiculously small delay compared to your first
announcement of Revolution and its actual shipping date ;-)

> ...
> Kind regards,
>
> Kevin

Regards

Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de



From mmaitzen at iupui.edu  Fri Nov 22 12:04:01 2002
From: mmaitzen at iupui.edu (Maitzen, Michael R.)
Date: Fri Nov 22 12:04:01 2002
Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #870 - 15 msgs
Message-ID: <8F38A22EC36A0948B854417D7EC91E0308F2D9@iu-mssg-mbx01.exchange.iu.edu>

I asked this earlier but I did not get a reply. This may be because you already answered this earlier but, if so, I missed it. Will there be a printed addendum to the printed manuals when the update comes out? pdf files maybe? Or will it just be in the on-line help.

Thanks,

MRM

> Subject: Schedule for 2.0
> From: Kevin Miller <kevin at runrev.com>
> To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I have a little good, and a little not so good news about 2.0.
> 
> First, the not so good news.  Unfortunately, we are running a little later
> than expected.  We want to ensure that 2.0 is in the best possible shape and
> the feature set is well tested.  As such the release is going to be later
> than we originally published, though not by all that much.  We want to get
> it right.  Please bear with us a little longer.
> 
> The good news is that we're going to fix the subscription renewal cut off
> date at 26th October.  Anyone having purchased after that date, in 2001,
> will get a free upgrade when we ship 2.0.  Thus many people will qualify for
> a free upgrade.  However, please don't let that put you off renewing - 2.0
> has been a very big development task, and your support in renewing your
> subscription around now would be much appreciated if you can afford to do so
> :-)
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> Kevin
> 
> 
> Michael R. Maitzen
> Teleproduction Supervisor
> Liberal Arts Technical Services
> Indiana University Purdue University Indianapolis (IUPUI)
> mmaitzen at iupui.edu
> http://comtechlab.iupui.edu


From kevin at runrev.com  Fri Nov 22 12:10:00 2002
From: kevin at runrev.com (Kevin Miller)
Date: Fri Nov 22 12:10:00 2002
Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #870 - 15 msgs
In-Reply-To: <8F38A22EC36A0948B854417D7EC91E0308F2D9@iu-mssg-mbx01.exchange.iu.edu>
Message-ID: <BA0413E1.D634%kevin@runrev.com>

On 22/11/02 4:58 pm, Maitzen, Michael R. <mmaitzen at iupui.edu> wrote:

> I asked this earlier but I did not get a reply. This may be because you
> already answered this earlier but, if so, I missed it. Will there be a printed
> addendum to the printed manuals when the update comes out? pdf files maybe? Or
> will it just be in the on-line help.

We will be updating the online help (extensively) and there will be a new
set of printed manuals available.

Kevin

Kevin Miller <kevin at runrev.com> <http://www.runrev.com/>
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
Tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165.  Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707.



From themacguy at macosx.com  Fri Nov 22 12:18:00 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Fri Nov 22 12:18:00 2002
Subject: Strange script error
Message-ID: <72CE00B8-FE3D-11D6-BE25-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

I think I resolved the error. I added "of this stack" to the code, so:

go card "quiz"

becomes:

go card "quiz" of this stack

I would've thought that the message hierarchy could handle this as the 
card of that name resides in the current stack.
Guess I have to be more specific. I'm probably spoiled by my HyperCard 
days. (*grin*)

Barry



From dsc at swcp.com  Fri Nov 22 12:19:02 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Fri Nov 22 12:19:02 2002
Subject: High precision decimal arithmetic
Message-ID: <222C0B73-FE3D-11D6-9279-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

Some months ago some discussion indicated some limitations to the 
available precision and to use of a binary point in Revolution 
arithmetic.

I'm hoping to get my workload down by mid December so that I can take a 
couple days to build my first pass at a high precision decimal 
arithmetic library.  By "decimal", I mean a virtual decimal point.  By 
"high precision", I mean more digits than standard.  I will start out 
simple and then perhaps make something fancier.  I'll add trig and such 
to what I like best.

This kind of thing has advantages but has some obvious disadvantages.  
All operations and most relations will be by functions, making 
expressions a little harder to read.  Computation time will be much 
slower.  Conversion to and from text strings will most likely have to be 
explicit.

I have a couple questions.

1.
Am I reinventing the wheel?  Does someone have something like this 
available or in the oven?

2.
I got to thinking that there might be others interested in this kind of 
thing and there might be an advantage to me to make something that meets 
popular needs.  (I'm content should I be the only one.)

What kind of high precision decimal arithmetic would people be 
interested in tinkering with, find useful, or even have needs for?  How 
many digits total?  How many digits to the right of the decimal point?

Some ideas:

Fixed point--  18 digits total, six past the decimal point?  30 digits 
total, 12 past the decimal point?

Floating point--  18 digits total?  36 digits total?  Total digits at 
least as much as specified in a property?

Indefinite--  total digits limited by memory (or property?).  12 digits 
to the right of the decimal point?  Digits to the right greater than or 
equal a number in a property?

I have almost a month before I hope to make a stab at this, so your 
pondering a little before commenting is OK for my schedule.

Dar Scott



From wmb at internettrainer.com  Fri Nov 22 16:14:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Fri Nov 22 16:14:01 2002
Subject: Schedule for 2.0
In-Reply-To: <BA03C42E.1691C%troy@rpsystems.net>
Message-ID: <7DFB2DA2-FE5E-11D6-B05F-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Freitag, November 22, 2002, at 05:23  Uhr, Troy Rollins wrote:

> An updated beta sometime soon? Doesn't the feature set need "real 
> world"
> testing? (Preferably one with an enabled builder.)

I dont understand this too... Why not a beta?

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From tkuypers at pandora.be  Fri Nov 22 16:21:00 2002
From: tkuypers at pandora.be (tkuypers at pandora.be)
Date: Fri Nov 22 16:21:00 2002
Subject: Http or https
Message-ID: <BA045CE2.4462%tkuypers@pandora.be>

I?m building a small application to get some information from a website.

When an url starts with ?http? everything works fine, but now I need to
acces information from a database (I think) and the url starts with ?https?.
The result remains empty, nothing is returned, while the url pasted directly
into Explorer gives me the result I need...

Is this a known limitation?

The url I use is: 
https://www.notams.jcs.mil/distribution/query.html?locid=&locidl=EBBR&textTy
pe=report&but2=Help

Any advise is welcome...

Regards,

Ton aka Dopey
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From alex at mindlube.com  Fri Nov 22 16:35:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Fri Nov 22 16:35:01 2002
Subject: [OT] report manager in rev 2.0; what to do today?
Message-ID: <5DE964A0-FE61-11D6-9F31-000393529642@mindlube.com>

I am looking at the Report Manager scren grab on 
http://runrev.com/news/revolution20.html . Is the Report Manager just a 
GUI for already existing programmatic interfaces, or are there new 
printing features being delivered?

In 1.1.1, I want to print a report containing a very large scrolling 
group. If I print the card, it only prints what's visisible, with the 
scrollbar. I am thinking I should lock screen, copy the group to a 
custom sized card, and print that card, then unlock screen. Sound right?

Or is there anything upcoming in 2.0 that will make this job easier and 
or better looking?

TIA

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From rpresender at earthlink.net  Fri Nov 22 17:26:01 2002
From: rpresender at earthlink.net (Robert Presender)
Date: Fri Nov 22 17:26:01 2002
Subject: Strange script error
In-Reply-To: <200211221701.MAA19164@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <72EC24D2-FE68-11D6-83AB-000393A19046@earthlink.net>

On Friday, November 22, 2002, at 09:01  AM, Barry Levine wrote:

Will adding the stack name do it: vis,  go card "quiz" of stack 
"whatever" ?

Regards .... Bob

> I have a handler in an Image object (id 1054) on the second card (id
> 1051) in my stack:
> ____
> on mouseUp
> 	set the currentFrame of me to 1
> 	go card "quiz"
> 	-- that's the first card in the stack; it's named "quiz"
> 	--
> 	-- this is a two-frame gif used as a rollover button
> 	-- we reset it to frame 1 before we leave
> end mouseUp
> ____
>
> When I click on the image I am brought to the first card but an error
> message occurs:
>
> Error description:  Handler: error in statement
> go card "quiz"
> Line: 3 Character: 1
> Value: mouseUp
>
> Error description:  Object Name:
>
> Line: 0 Character: 0
> Value: image id 1054 of card id 1051 of stack "/Macintosh
> HD/Users/blevine/Demo Apps/Revolution 1.1.1/Rhyming Pairs.112002.rev"
> ____
>
> Any ideas what I'm doing wrong?
>
> Thanks,
> Barry



From iago at iago.net  Fri Nov 22 17:31:01 2002
From: iago at iago.net (Iago)
Date: Fri Nov 22 17:31:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <BA045CE2.4462%tkuypers@pandora.be>
References: <BA045CE2.4462%tkuypers@pandora.be>
Message-ID: <20021122222719.GU21158@iago.net>

  It's a known limitation, yes. Once they release 2.0,
  apparently https/ssl support is "up next" on the list, but
  I suspect that still means at least several months in
  coming. A pity, really, because until that happens, I'm
  not able to write the apps I want to for my place of work.

On Fri, 22 Nov 2002, tkuypers at pandora.be wrote:

> I'm building a small application to get some information
> from a website.
> 
> When an url starts with 'http' everything works fine, but
> now I need to acces information from a database (I think)
> and the url starts with 'https'. The result remains empty,
> nothing is returned, while the url pasted directly into
> Explorer gives me the result I need...
> 
> Is this a known limitation?
> 
> The url I use is:
> https://www.notams.jcs.mil/distribution/query.html?locid=&locidl=EBBR&textTy
> pe=report&but2=Help
> 
> Any advise is welcome...

-- 
Fred Hicks <iago AT iago DOT net>


From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Fri Nov 22 17:37:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Fri Nov 22 17:37:01 2002
Subject: General Lists vs Special Lists
In-Reply-To: <a05100303ba0400c08a80@[216.229.107.154]>
Message-ID: <20021122223052.9652.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Rob Cozens <rcozens at pon.net> wrote:
> >calmate Rob, where is your sense of irony?
> 
> My apologies, Erik.
> 
> We had not conversed enough for me to know
> whether to take your 
> initial comment as a warning or an order. 
> Sorry I was in the frame 
> of mind to assume the worst instead of the
> best.
> 
> I'm glad your were entertained, and sorry I
> spoiled it by being confrontational.

just keep those artful comments coming!

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

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From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Fri Nov 22 17:43:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Fri Nov 22 17:43:01 2002
Subject: Rev 2.0
In-Reply-To: <EA05613D-FE37-11D6-A64D-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>
Message-ID: <20021122223727.38804.qmail@web20010.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Klaus Major <k_major at os.surf2000.de> wrote:
> > As an aside there are two articles in MacLife
> Germany:
> >
> > 11/2002 A full and excellent review of
> Revolution 1.1.1
> > 12/2002 A tutorial of 1.1.1
> 
> we all should give a very big hand to our
> german revolutionist
> Mr. Malte Brill, who wrote these two articles.

are these on the web?

=====
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From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Fri Nov 22 17:44:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Fri Nov 22 17:44:01 2002
Subject: Controls of Stack
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba03fa26fd79@[216.229.107.154]>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHCEJHCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

> I believe the recommended approach to translation is to use the
> Profile Manager to preconfigure each control for each language
> supported.  I personally do not use this approach because I want my
> app to be translatable into any (Western) language, not just those it
> ships with.

My thoughts exactly. I'm thinking of creating an interface for user
translation and then asking them to send them to me.



From alex at mindlube.com  Fri Nov 22 18:07:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Fri Nov 22 18:07:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <20021122222719.GU21158@iago.net>
Message-ID: <50EE52D7-FE6E-11D6-BF11-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Friday, November 22, 2002, at 03:27  PM, Iago wrote:

>   It's a known limitation, yes. Once they release 2.0,
>   apparently https/ssl support is "up next" on the list, but
>   I suspect that still means at least several months in
>   coming. A pity, really, because until that happens, I'm
>   not able to write the apps I want to for my place of work.

OK who wants to write an external to wrap libcurl? ( 
http://curl.sourceforge.net/ ) Or, if you are running OS X, the curl 
command comes pre-installed and you could definitely run it from the 
shell.

"Curl is a command line tool for transferring files with URL syntax, 
supporting FTP, FTPS, HTTP, HTTPS, GOPHER, TELNET, DICT, FILE and LDAP. 
Curl supports HTTPS certificates, HTTP POST, HTTP PUT, FTP uploading, 
kerberos, HTTP form based upload, proxies, cookies, user+password 
authentication, file transfer resume, http proxy tunneling and a 
busload of other useful tricks."

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From iago at iago.net  Fri Nov 22 18:25:01 2002
From: iago at iago.net (Iago)
Date: Fri Nov 22 18:25:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <50EE52D7-FE6E-11D6-BF11-000393529642@mindlube.com>
References: <20021122222719.GU21158@iago.net> <50EE52D7-FE6E-11D6-BF11-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <20021122232134.GX21158@iago.net>

  Personally, I'd prefer an internal implementation, since
  the URLs in my case are liable to have username/password
  components, ala https://foo:bar at baz.com/

  I'd rather that not show up in a ps listing because I
  launched an external command. :)

  But who am I to speak? I haven't learned much about the
  actual construction yet, because all practical learning
  projects I have in mind involve working with https. So I
  patiently await the fruits of others' labors.

  Thanks, by the way, to the others. :)

On Fri, 22 Nov 2002, Alex Rice wrote:

> OK who wants to write an external to wrap libcurl? (
> http://curl.sourceforge.net/ ) Or, if you are running OS
> X, the curl command comes pre-installed and you could
> definitely run it from the shell.
> 
> "Curl is a command line tool for transferring files with
> URL syntax, supporting FTP, FTPS, HTTP, HTTPS, GOPHER,
> TELNET, DICT, FILE and LDAP. Curl supports HTTPS
> certificates, HTTP POST, HTTP PUT, FTP uploading,
> kerberos, HTTP form based upload, proxies, cookies,
> user+password authentication, file transfer resume, http
> proxy tunneling and a busload of other useful tricks."
> 
> Alex Rice, Software Developer Architectural Research
> Consultants, Inc. alrice at swcp.com alex_rice at arc.to
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution

-- 
Fred Hicks <iago AT iago DOT net>


From tkuypers at pandora.be  Fri Nov 22 18:39:01 2002
From: tkuypers at pandora.be (tkuypers at pandora.be)
Date: Fri Nov 22 18:39:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <20021122232134.GX21158@iago.net>
Message-ID: <BA047D4F.446F%tkuypers@pandora.be>

And I thought to have found the ideal tool for development in RR and again
run into a project which proves me wrong...
GRRRRRR

Please, anyone, do us all a favour and build this external... Even as a link
to this curl-thing, it's better then nothing... And it will give our
Scottish friends a little time off when the release 2.0...

Ton aka Dopey



From alex at mindlube.com  Fri Nov 22 18:45:02 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Fri Nov 22 18:45:02 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <20021122232134.GX21158@iago.net>
Message-ID: <8BEFA210-FE73-11D6-BF11-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Friday, November 22, 2002, at 04:21  PM, Iago wrote:

>   Personally, I'd prefer an internal implementation, since
>   the URLs in my case are liable to have username/password
>   components, ala https://foo:bar at baz.com/
>
>   I'd rather that not show up in a ps listing because I
>   launched an external command. :)

You're right, this would be a drawback of using curl from the shell & 
command line. However, if it were a Rev. "external" it would actually 
be "internal" :-) No ps listing to be seen because it would be in the 
same process as Rev.

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From alex at mindlube.com  Fri Nov 22 19:00:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Fri Nov 22 19:00:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <BA047D4F.446F%tkuypers@pandora.be>
Message-ID: <9CF8255E-FE75-11D6-BF11-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Friday, November 22, 2002, at 04:33  PM, tkuypers at pandora.be wrote:

> And I thought to have found the ideal tool for development in RR and 
> again
> run into a project which proves me wrong...
> GRRRRRR

There is no ideal tool. For each unique project there is an ideal 
tool(s) but there is no such thing as THE ideal tool. If you require 
SSL downloads then yes, Rev is not the ideal tool.

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From chipp at chipp.com  Fri Nov 22 19:10:00 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Fri Nov 22 19:10:00 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <BA045CE2.4462%tkuypers@pandora.be>
Message-ID: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCAEOKDHAA.chipp@chipp.com>

IMHO, the proper way to go about this is to use OpenSSL (www.openssl.org)
source and create externals for Mac,PC,Linux which work with LibURL. In this
way, the basic syntax can stay consistent, and you don't have to add
redundant features by creating a whole new URL library.

-Chipp



From iago at iago.net  Fri Nov 22 19:13:01 2002
From: iago at iago.net (Iago)
Date: Fri Nov 22 19:13:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCAEOKDHAA.chipp@chipp.com>
References: <BA045CE2.4462%tkuypers@pandora.be> <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCAEOKDHAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <20021123000944.GY21158@iago.net>

On Fri, 22 Nov 2002, Chipp Walters wrote:

> IMHO, the proper way to go about this is to use OpenSSL
> (www.openssl.org) source and create externals for
> Mac,PC,Linux which work with LibURL. In this way, the
> basic syntax can stay consistent, and you don't have to
> add redundant features by creating a whole new URL
> library.

  This was much my thought, but I have no idea how to make
  it so.

  Like I said, I'm wearing my patient hat.

-- 
Fred Hicks <iago AT iago DOT net>


From chipp at chipp.com  Fri Nov 22 19:28:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Fri Nov 22 19:28:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <9CF8255E-FE75-11D6-BF11-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCOEOKDHAA.chipp@chipp.com>

I got a question for all of you https users.... Exactly what do you want it
for? Please cite some examples. IOW, would it be better to have an encrypt
tool instead? There seem to be lots of workarounds for a *mostly* secure
solution using RR/MC. (md5digest with base64encode offset by your
birthdate;-)

My understanding of one of the basics of public/private key encryption is
that the client 'browser' side doesn't need to know the challenge phrase.
But, if you're building the client (RR or MC) then it's easy to embed the
challenge phrase. Now, I'm not so sure you can build international banking
applications this way, but surely you can do a 99% protection.

I guess I'd like to better understand a 'case' where I couldn't solve the
problem in RR/MC.

Next question... how much would everyone be willing to pay for an https
external?

$0
$1000

somewhere in-between?

-Chipp



From alex at mindlube.com  Fri Nov 22 19:37:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Fri Nov 22 19:37:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCAEOKDHAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <CFD3EBAC-FE7A-11D6-B698-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Friday, November 22, 2002, at 05:02  PM, Chipp Walters wrote:

> IMHO, the proper way to go about this is to use OpenSSL 
> (www.openssl.org)
> source and create externals for Mac,PC,Linux which work with LibURL. 
> In this
> way, the basic syntax can stay consistent, and you don't have to add
> redundant features by creating a whole new URL library.

In either case, LibCurl would be the way to go. LibCurl itself uses 
OpenSSL. OpenSSL is a relatively low-level crypto toolkit. It knows 
nothing about networking or URLs... which is what LibCurl brings into 
the picture.

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alrice at swcp.com
alex_rice at arc.to



From dsc at swcp.com  Fri Nov 22 20:06:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Fri Nov 22 20:06:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <50EE52D7-FE6E-11D6-BF11-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <F06B05CC-FE7E-11D6-9279-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Friday, November 22, 2002, at 04:01 PM, Alex Rice wrote:

> OK who wants to write an external to wrap libcurl? 
> ( http://curl.sourceforge.net/ ) Or, if you are running OS X, the curl 
> command comes pre-installed and you could definitely run it from the 
> shell.
>
> "Curl is a command line tool for transferring files with URL syntax, 
> supporting FTP, FTPS, HTTP, HTTPS, GOPHER, TELNET, DICT, FILE and LDAP. 
> Curl supports HTTPS certificates, HTTP POST, HTTP PUT, FTP uploading, 
> kerberos, HTTP form based upload, proxies, cookies, user+password 
> authentication, file transfer resume, http proxy tunneling and a 
> busload of other useful tricks."

It's been two hours since Alex wrote this.  I would have expected a 
short script using the Revolution shell command (or the workaround for 
OS X for Revolution 1.1.1) by now.  I just glanced at the site and it 
looks looks like binaries with SSL are available for Windows, OS X and 
lots of Linuxes.

We need more list showoffs!!

Dar Scott



From rcozens at pon.net  Fri Nov 22 20:12:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Fri Nov 22 20:12:01 2002
Subject: General Lists vs Special Lists
Message-ID: <a05100300ba047fb576be@[216.229.107.55]>

Dear miscdas,

"Sin in haste, repent at leisure:"

I have spent much of this day trying to find the best way to 
apologize to you, and searching for justification for what I 
ultimately concluded was totally inexcusable behavior on my part.

You are absolutely entitled to your opinion, and you deserved a 
courteous, thoughtful reply like you got from everyone but me.

I have no excuse...it is (to use today's vernacular) so NOT what I'm 
all about.  I hope as time passes and we get to know each other 
better, you will agree.

If you are angry with me, you have a right, and if you would like to 
vent privately, I promise a courteous, conciliatory reply (or I will 
wimp out and not replay: but hopefully, you'll feel better anyway).

Rob

To All List Members:

If I can't demonstrate good List behavior, I should be pointed to as 
an example of what is inappropriate  behavior on the kind of Balanced 
List I described.

Confrontation is not the way to win the hearts and minds of fellow 
list members.  Such behavior on a continuing & unrepentant basis 
should be cause for dismissal from the List.

I consider myself warned, down one strike, and on probation.

If I can't find a non-confrontational way to respond, I won't respond at all.

I grovel in mortification.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Fri Nov 22 20:21:00 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Fri Nov 22 20:21:00 2002
Subject: General Lists vs Special Lists
In-Reply-To: <a05100300ba047fb576be@[216.229.107.55]>
Message-ID: <FBDF5488-FE80-11D6-91B5-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Saturday, Nov 23, 2002, at 12:07 Australia/Sydney, Rob Cozens wrote:

> Dear miscdas,
>
> "Sin in haste, repent at leisure:"
snip

Don't get too stressed about it Rob. Forgiveness works pretty well, and 
bounce can be restored. You are not Robinson Crusoe and I for one would 
look for unrepentant persistence before I worried about sanctions. You 
are not within a bull's roar of that as I am sure others will write 
publicly and privately to say.

cheers
David
>
> Rob Cozens
> CCW, Serendipity Software Company
> http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm
>
> "And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
> Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."
>
> from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From rogerguay at centurytel.net  Fri Nov 22 23:15:01 2002
From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay)
Date: Fri Nov 22 23:15:01 2002
Subject: Why doesn't this work, please?
Message-ID: <36343426-FE99-11D6-8873-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net>

Hi folks,

I'm using the following script to clone an invisible button "Video" and 
renaming the clones.  And, despite my attempts to "choose browse tool" 
the selector tool comes up every time this script is executed:

On mouseDown
   global Vn
   add 1 to Vn
   clone button "video"
   set the name of last card button to "V"&Vn
   set the visible of last card button to true
   choose Browse Tool
end mouseDown

on mouseleave
   choose Browse Tool
end mouseleave


Can anyone help?

Thanks, Roger



From bvlahos at mac.com  Fri Nov 22 23:44:01 2002
From: bvlahos at mac.com (Bill Vlahos)
Date: Fri Nov 22 23:44:01 2002
Subject: Why doesn't this work, please?
In-Reply-To: <36343426-FE99-11D6-8873-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net>
Message-ID: <492EF474-FE9D-11D6-B534-003065EC5590@mac.com>

Roger,

There is nothing wrong with your script. A bug in the Revolution IDE 
(Integrated Development Environment) sometimes prevents "choose browse 
tool" to work. This is fixed in the 2.0 version.

The good news is that what you want to do will work fine in any 
standalone you create. It is just in the IDE where it won't work.

Bill Vlahos

On Friday, November 22, 2002, at 08:08  PM, Roger Guay wrote:

> Hi folks,
>
> I'm using the following script to clone an invisible button "Video" 
> and renaming the clones.  And, despite my attempts to "choose browse 
> tool" the selector tool comes up every time this script is executed:
>
> On mouseDown
>   global Vn
>   add 1 to Vn
>   clone button "video"
>   set the name of last card button to "V"&Vn
>   set the visible of last card button to true
>   choose Browse Tool
> end mouseDown
>
> on mouseleave
>   choose Browse Tool
> end mouseleave
>
>
> Can anyone help?
>
> Thanks, Roger
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sat Nov 23 03:13:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sat Nov 23 03:13:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCOEOKDHAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <20021123080714.97788.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Chipp Walters <chipp at chipp.com> wrote:
> I got a question for all of you https users....
> Exactly what do you want it
> for? Please cite some examples. IOW, would it be
> better to have an encrypt
> tool instead? There seem to be lots of workarounds
> for a *mostly* secure
> solution using RR/MC. (md5digest with base64encode
> offset by your
> birthdate;-)
>
> My understanding of one of the basics of
> public/private key encryption is
> that the client 'browser' side doesn't need to know
> the challenge phrase.
> But, if you're building the client (RR or MC) then
> it's easy to embed the
> challenge phrase. Now, I'm not so sure you can build
> international banking
> applications this way, but surely you can do a 99%
> protection.
> 
> I guess I'd like to better understand a 'case' where
> I couldn't solve the
> problem in RR/MC.
> 
> Next question... how much would everyone be willing
> to pay for an https
> external?
> 
> $0
> $1000
> 
> somewhere in-between?
> 
> -Chipp
> 

Hi Chipp,

This approach would work just fine if you have control
over both client and server side (in which case you
could just forego libURL, open a connection and start
transfering data, knowing in advance how you're going
to encrypt it)
But it's a very different situation when you're just a
link in the chain and have to work with what has been
previously installed and programmed. Especially when
you're linking to 'outside' sources, where you have no
say whatsoever in the implementation.

In reply to your second quesion: as I don't need it
right at this momnet, I'd sit and wait for RunRev 2.1
with built-in support ; and probably get the external
if the need arises, in which case I'd make the
customer pay for it if he needs it that desparately
and that quickly ;-)

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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From ericpeden at homemail.com  Sat Nov 23 03:32:00 2002
From: ericpeden at homemail.com (Eric Peden)
Date: Sat Nov 23 03:32:00 2002
Subject: 'revdb, restricted under current license' - causes and solutions
Message-ID: <4839A970-FEBD-11D6-B6A2-000A27B3D3FA@homemail.com>

Fellow Revvers,

How many times have you seen the dreaded "revdb, restricted under 
current license" message? Too many, if your projects are anything like 
mine. I've compiled a bit of information on this error message as well 
as some workarounds; hopefully this information will prove useful to 
some of you.

First, the cause: this error seems to be triggered when more than one 
database connection or cursor is opened. The documentation states that 
only one connection is allowed for non-Professional licenses and that 
Pro licenses can have unlimited connections; however, my preliminary 
testing suggests that this error occurs under Pro licenses, as well.

So, how can it be avoided? Make sure that you always store the results 
of a revdb_open(), revdb_query(), or revdb_queryblob() request; these 
results are connection/cursor IDs that, even if the results they point 
to are empty, must be closed before another connection/cursor is 
opened. As soon as you're finished with the connection/cursor, call the 
corresponding close function: revdb_close() and revdb_closecursor(), 
respectively.

Unfortunately, during testing, the restricted error is all too likely 
to crop up, even if you follow the recommendations above. Any errors 
that occur before the connection/cursor can be closed will leave them 
"dangling," causing the restricted error when the script is run again. 
A common method for dealing with this is to quit Revolution and re-open 
it; this works, but is time-consuming. In place of this, the dangling 
items can be closed by hand with the following procedure:

1. Open the Message box.
2. Execute 'revdb_connections()'
3. For each integer returned (there should be only 1; if there's more 
than that, you shouldn't be seeing a restricted error), execute 
'revdb_close(connectionID)'. This closes the dangling connection and 
any cursors open under it.

One could also close just the dangling cursor(s) without touching the 
connection(s) by using the corresponding cursor commands in the above 
procedure.

With careful programming, errors of this kind can be eliminated in 
distribution stacks by making certain that connection/cursor calls are 
balanced. I've found that this is made easier by creating a robust 
'open' function that only opens a connection if there isn't one open 
already, and then calling this function before each database access. 
Cursors, on the other hand, should be as limited in scope as possible. 
In virtually all cases, a cursor can (and should!) be closed in the 
same function that opened it; just make sure to never ignore the return 
value of a revdb_query*().

Hopefully some of you will find this information helpful; if you've 
anything to add or any corrections to make, I look forward to hearing 
from you.

-- eric



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sat Nov 23 03:47:02 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sat Nov 23 03:47:02 2002
Subject: Valentina and OS-X (Darwin) revisited...
In-Reply-To: <20021120190433.10714@mail.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20021123084101.10512.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Greg Saylor <gsaylor at net-virtual.com> wrote:
> [snip]
> 
> John,
> 
> Thanks for the reply!...
> 
> Regarding your clarification:
> 
> 1)I don't quite get what you are saying....  There
> is a "Macho" version
> of Valentina - isn't that one which will work on
> Darwin or am I 
> confused?...
> 2) By the 'cgi' version do you mean 
> this "Darwin.tgz" I downloaded from
> http://www.runreve.com/engines11/Darwin.tgz ?...
> 3) [ blank look ]
> 
> Regarding your recommendation:
> 1) Already got that.
> 2) Where is the RunRev Newbie board?... I must be so
> new that I can't find it.
> 
> 
> Is he talking about running some sort of 
> client/server application with 
> a Revolution stack running as the server > 
> piece?.....  If so will it be able
> to handle multiple simultaneous requests?...
> 
> The idea of maintaining text files inside of stack
> is precisely what I want to get away from.. I want 
> to be able to edit my files with vi or
> bang out scripts for doing database manipulations 
> from some other tool
> (like PERL)...  The big thing for me is that what we

> are workign on is
> moving a portion of a client/server application > 
> which currently resides
> in Oracle down to PC's and Mac systems..  The 
> current process of
> collecting data and keeping the database updated is
> almost 100% automated....  I want to ensure that 
> this process continues transparently....  So what I
> ened is a way to build, index, basically I
> need to be able execute all of the Revolution 
> transcript functions from the command line - plain-
> and-simple...  If you are suggesting that I 
> can setup a server which will allow me to do this, 
> it is interesting to me...
> If you are saying I still have to bury my code 
> inside of a GUI development environment where
> developers can't get at it to fix it
> without popping up some GUI application, that's a 
> lot less interesting to
> me (and in fact, I would probably get laughed out of

> the office if I tried to suggest it)...  It's goign 
> to be tricky enough to get them to
> learn this new transcript language (I am sure there
> will be a lot of resistance to it - as there has 
> been with me)....  So in other words, I cna play a 
> little bit of Voodoo magic here and hide an OS-X 
> server in the back room where nobody has to deal 
> with it, but when they write their
> scripts they are going to want to be able to develop

> those scripts using
> the development tools they already have for writing 
> command-line apps and
> to be able to do it in basically the same way....  
> They have over a million lines of code devoted to 
> this application and to have some other
> piece hanging off a ledge somewhere else is just 
> going to be very
> distracting when trying to track down bugs or add 
> new build procedures....
> 
> As a side note, I have noticed on several OS-X 
> development sites that
> does appear to be possible to call Carbon and/or 
> [whatever] functions
> from a command-line environment...  I'm not sure 
> what all the terminology
> is, for some reason Mach-O, CDF, and Carbon seem 
> significant....  But,
> that there are ways to cross those boundaries and 
> link in libraries from
> one of the other environments...  Though this part 
> of my research ont he
> subject goes back a long ways, that seems to be the 
> result of what I came up with....
> 
> Thanks, again, for your reply!..
> 
> - Greg

Hi Greg,

Well, upon reading the replies, I was very happy to
learn a few things, such as Valentina being able to
work under Darwin [opens perspectives] and how you
should be able to get it to work right now, using MC
2.4.3 and the VXCMD.

The reason I suggested the 'write your own server'
approach is that :
(1) you could do it right now (bearing in mind I
didn't know there ws a way before the RR2 release
(2) it works just fine in terms of performance and
ease of setup
(3) it gives that 'nice' IDE which other programmers
seem to dislike so much.

Oh well, I guess I'm just more of a 'pack it in the
least number of files' kind-of-guy ;-)

Jan Schenkel.

PS: in case you still haven't found the RunRev Newbie
Board, it's at
http://www.mailping.net/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus ? Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com


From iago at iago.net  Sat Nov 23 03:54:02 2002
From: iago at iago.net (Iago)
Date: Sat Nov 23 03:54:02 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <20021123080714.97788.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCOEOKDHAA.chipp@chipp.com> <20021123080714.97788.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20021123085011.GC21158@iago.net>

Chipp Walters <chipp at chipp.com> wrote:

> I got a question for all of you https users.... Exactly
> what do you want it for? Please cite some examples.

  I work daily on a https-secured intranet site that uses
  http-style authentication to control access. I'd like to
  develop some web browser independent tools that can pull
  down data from a given url for use on a local system.
  I can get into the particulars if so desired, but that's
  the abstracted general case.

-- 
Fred Hicks <iago AT iago DOT net>


From iago at iago.net  Sat Nov 23 03:55:00 2002
From: iago at iago.net (Iago)
Date: Sat Nov 23 03:55:00 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCOEOKDHAA.chipp@chipp.com>
References: <9CF8255E-FE75-11D6-BF11-000393529642@mindlube.com> <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCOEOKDHAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <20021123085113.GD21158@iago.net>

On Fri, 22 Nov 2002, Chipp Walters wrote:

> Next question... how much would everyone be willing to pay for an https
> external?
> 
> $0
> $1000
> 
> somewhere in-between?

  I wouldn't be paying for it.  My company would.  I'd have to
  check with my manager.

-- 
Fred Hicks <iago AT iago DOT net>


From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Sat Nov 23 06:14:01 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Sat Nov 23 06:14:01 2002
Subject: Rev 2.0
In-Reply-To: <20021122223727.38804.qmail@web20010.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <F13540A4-FED3-11D6-BDCD-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Hi Eric,

>
> --- Klaus Major <k_major at os.surf2000.de> wrote:
>>> As an aside there are two articles in MacLife
>> Germany:
>>>
>>> 11/2002 A full and excellent review of
>> Revolution 1.1.1
>>> 12/2002 A tutorial of 1.1.1
>>
>> we all should give a very big hand to our
>> german revolutionist
>> Mr. Malte Brill, who wrote these two articles.
>
> are these on the web?

I am afraid not.

Just the printed magazines.

> =====
> erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

Have a nice weekend.


Regards


Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de



From troy at rpsystems.net  Sat Nov 23 10:54:00 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Sat Nov 23 10:54:00 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <20021123085011.GC21158@iago.net>
Message-ID: <BA050D64.169B3%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/23/02 3:50 AM, "Iago" <iago at iago.net> wrote:

>> I got a question for all of you https users.... Exactly
>> what do you want it for? Please cite some examples.
> 
> I work daily on a https-secured intranet site that uses
> http-style authentication to control access. I'd like to
> develop some web browser independent tools that can pull
> down data from a given url for use on a local system.
> I can get into the particulars if so desired, but that's
> the abstracted general case.

Yep. That's it in a nutshell. Corporate intranets. If we want our apps to
interact with them, they have to offer some sort of security. HTTP
connectivity is nice, but companies don't need me to display their public
web site content - they have browsers for that.

I won't go in to what the issue has cost me already... but I will say that
several months of development ended up on the scrap heap. My own fault, I
should have considered the issue earlier and elected to use a tool that
offered SSL functionality from the beginning.

I will say that I think the issue is critical for professional networked
applications. Absolutely critical.
-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net



From rcozens at pon.net  Sat Nov 23 10:58:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Sat Nov 23 10:58:01 2002
Subject: Controls of Stack
Message-ID: <a05100300ba05532086f0@[216.229.107.226]>

>How does one parse all the controls of a stack ensuring that those in a
>background only get parsed once unless they are fields with the sharedText
>set to false... etc

Hi Again Monte,

This could be too little or too late, but following is a handler used 
by the HyperTalk version of OenoLog to capture all translatable 
fields in a text file, identified by card & control ids.  If one put 
the background logic inside a repeat loop, it should work for 
Revolution stacks.  It only deals with fields, as OenoLog has no 
menuBar, named icons, or tool tips.  I'm too lazy to parse it this 
AM, so here it is for what it's worth:

on mouseUp  -- 4/21/01
   global cancelTranslated,gimmieTime,myLanguage,okTranslated,whatFileTranslated
   put the optionKey into optionState
   if the icon of me > 20000 then exit mouseUp
   speakup
   set the hilite of me to false
   allOff
   put card field "Language" into saveLanguage
   get myLanguage
   put myFolder()&"OeNotes"&&it&":OeHelp"&&it&".txt" into fileName
   delete the last char of it -- ")"
   delete the first char of it -- "("
   put it into card field "Language"
   --  ask file whatFileTranslated with fileName
   --  if it is empty then
   --    put saveLanguage into card field "Language"
   --    allOn
   --    exit mouseUp
   --  end if
   --  put it into fileName
   if optionState is up then
     answer (field "Can't Quit Field Help") with cancelTranslated or 
okTranslated
     speakUp
   else get okTranslated
   if it is cancelTranslated then
     put saveLanguage into card field "Language"
     allOn
     exit mouseUp
   end if
   open file fileName
   if the result is not empty then
     answer the result
     ohOh
     answer the result
     answer (card field "Open Error Alert Help")&&fileName&"!"
     speakUp
     put saveLanguage into card field "Language"
     allOn
     exit mouseUp
   end if
   push card
   put return&numToChar(215) into theDelimiter
   put empty into backgroundList
   set the cantAbort of this stack to true
   lock screen
   lock messages
   go first
   repeat
     if "Image" is in the short name of this card then exit repeat
     put true into doShared
     put the short id of this card into cardId
     get the short id of this background
     if it is in backgroundList then
       repeat with x = 1 to number of lines of backgroundList
         if it = line x of backgroundList then put false into doShared
       end repeat
     end if
     if doShared then put it&return after backgroundList
     repeat with x = 1 to the number of background fields
       set cursor to busy
       put the short name of field x into fieldName
       if fieldName is "Help" or "Result" is in fieldName then next repeat
       if ("Help" is not in fieldName and "About" is not in fieldName 
and "Title" is not in fieldName) or "Page Title" is in fieldName then 
next repeat
       if fieldName is in "Title,Index Title" then put line 2 of field 
x into theMessage
       else put field x into theMessage
       if (theMessage <= " " and length(theMessage) < 2) then next repeat
       put the sharedText of field x into shareMe
       if doShared or not shareMe then
         put the short id of field x into itemID
         write 
cardId&&itemID&&"BF"&&fieldName&return&theMessage&theDelimiter to 
file fileName
       end if
     end repeat
     repeat with x = 1 to the number of card fields
       set cursor to busy
       put the short name of card field x into fieldName
       if "Help" is not in fieldName and "Title" is not in fieldName 
then next repeat
       put card field x into theMessage
       if (theMessage <= " " and length(theMessage) < 2) or "Result" 
is in fieldName then next repeat
       put the short id of card field x into itemID
       write 
cardId&&itemID&&"CF"&&fieldName&return&theMessage&theDelimiter to 
file fileName
     end repeat
     if cardId is 36080 then -- report format
       put the short id of button "Type" into itemId
       write cardId&&itemID&&"PB Type"&return&(button 
"Type")&theDelimiter to file fileName
     end if
     go next
   end repeat
   close file fileName
   pop card
   set the cantAbort of this stack to false
   put saveLanguage into card field "Language"
   allOn
   unlock screen
   unlock messages
end mouseUp


Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rogerguay at centurytel.net  Sat Nov 23 11:49:01 2002
From: rogerguay at centurytel.net (Roger Guay)
Date: Sat Nov 23 11:49:01 2002
Subject: use-revolution digest, Vol 1 #873 - 13 msgs
In-Reply-To: <200211230848.DAA04466@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <A0409A7E-FF02-11D6-A5F5-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net>

Thanks very much, Bill . . .that helps a lot.

Cheers, Roger


> Message: 10
> Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 20:37:34 -0800
> Subject: Re: Why doesn't this work, please?
> From: Bill Vlahos <bvlahos at mac.com>
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>
> Roger,
>
> There is nothing wrong with your script. A bug in the Revolution IDE
> (Integrated Development Environment) sometimes prevents "choose browse
> tool" to work. This is fixed in the 2.0 version.
>
> The good news is that what you want to do will work fine in any
> standalone you create. It is just in the IDE where it won't work.
>
> Bill Vlahos
>



From giulio at cantoberon.it  Sat Nov 23 12:08:00 2002
From: giulio at cantoberon.it (giulio mastrosanti)
Date: Sat Nov 23 12:08:00 2002
Subject: 'Move all images into individual files' build option 
Message-ID: <3751CEF6-FF05-11D6-B57E-000393A949D8@cantoberon.it>

Hi all,
Can't realize how to use "Move all images into individual files" build 
option.
I imagined checking it on the build options form to have a smaller 
executable, and the imagines I have imported into my card to be on some 
subfolder of the executable folder.
But this don't seem to happen, what am I missing?
thanx for your answer,

       Giulio



From iago at iago.net  Sat Nov 23 13:14:00 2002
From: iago at iago.net (Iago)
Date: Sat Nov 23 13:14:00 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <BA050D64.169B3%troy@rpsystems.net>
References: <20021123085011.GC21158@iago.net> <BA050D64.169B3%troy@rpsystems.net>
Message-ID: <20021123181014.GF21158@iago.net>

On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, Troy Rollins wrote:

> On 11/23/02 3:50 AM, "Iago" <iago at iago.net> wrote:
> 
> >> I got a question for all of you https users.... Exactly
> >> what do you want it for? Please cite some examples.
> > 
> > I work daily on a https-secured intranet site that uses
> > http-style authentication to control access. I'd like to
> > develop some web browser independent tools that can pull
> > down data from a given url for use on a local system. I
> > can get into the particulars if so desired, but that's
> > the abstracted general case.
> 
> Yep. That's it in a nutshell. Corporate intranets. If we
> want our apps to interact with them, they have to offer
> some sort of security. HTTP connectivity is nice, but
> companies don't need me to display their public web site
> content - they have browsers for that.

  Yep. We also have the intranet system accessible from
  home, which is why we can't simply rely on http and
  internal access behind a corporate firewall.

> I won't go in to what the issue has cost me already... but
> I will say that several months of development ended up on
> the scrap heap. My own fault, I should have considered the
> issue earlier and elected to use a tool that offered SSL
> functionality from the beginning.

  That sucks -- I've considered the issue as a first
  priority for every option I've looked at, which is why I
  haven't gone with Revolution _yet_. The indication that it
  will have SSL as whatever follows 2.0's release gives me
  some hope there -- the development of standalone apps is
  not a top priority, thankfully.

> I will say that I think the issue is critical for
> professional networked applications. Absolutely critical.

  Completely true. Revolution's drawn my attention because
  of the ability to create apps that run on many different
  systems. The userbase that I've got could, at any time, be
  running on a Mac, Windows of any stripe, Linux, Solaris...
  It could be a nightmare, but Revolution seems to be able
  to deliver on 95% of what I need it to. That final 5% is
  blisteringly critical, though, and a dealbreaker until
  it's addressed.

  I don't want this to come off as a complaint -- just a
  clear communication to the community that this is really a
  #1 need for people like me. Without https support --
  Revolution's just another app I could build a D&D GM's
  tool with, with no bearing on my professional life. I'd
  really like that to be otherwise.

-- 
Fred Hicks <iago AT iago DOT net>


From dsc at swcp.com  Sat Nov 23 13:35:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Sat Nov 23 13:35:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <20021123181014.GF21158@iago.net>
Message-ID: <68A1B234-FF11-11D6-930C-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Saturday, November 23, 2002, at 11:10 AM, Iago wrote:

> Without https support --
>   Revolution's just another app I could build a D&D GM's
>   tool with, with no bearing on my professional life. I'd
>   really like that to be otherwise.

Hmmm.  For my profession I would like to see much more extensive basic 
TCP/IP support, broader serial I/O support, expanded general I/O and 
even register I/O support, knobs, sliders, graphs, meters and so on.

I guess that this partly depends on the identity of the product and what 
can be built from the available components.

Alex Rice just showed us the way to get https.  Is there something 
missing in that?

Dar Scott




From iago at iago.net  Sat Nov 23 13:46:01 2002
From: iago at iago.net (Iago)
Date: Sat Nov 23 13:46:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <68A1B234-FF11-11D6-930C-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
References: <20021123181014.GF21158@iago.net> <68A1B234-FF11-11D6-930C-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <20021123184150.GI21158@iago.net>

On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, Dar Scott wrote:

> Alex Rice just showed us the way to get https. Is there
> something missing in that?

  1) It hasn't been done yet (I lack the skill, so I have to
     wait for someone else to do it and then provide
     instruction on how to make use of it).

  2) I'm not clear yet on how well it would be supported
     across all platforms (this may be a non-reason, which
     I'll freely grant -- #1's the sticker here, not this).

  Honestly, I'm completely newbie at developing apps with
  Revolution -- and I'm not going to invest the effort to
  learn how until I hear the magical phrase "Revolution now
  supports https". Until then, I don't have the time to
  invest.

-- 
Fred Hicks <iago AT iago DOT net>


From rcozens at pon.net  Sat Nov 23 13:57:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Sat Nov 23 13:57:01 2002
Subject: Controls of Stack
Message-ID: <a05100300ba057b046bf2@[216.229.107.123]>

Monte, et al:

Some followup thoughts re dialog, Menu, & toolTip translation:

In Serendipity Library all single-line & single-word messages, menu & 
menuItem names, and toolTips are stored in one Library field which 
can be loaded from/to a text file.  The field is loaded into a local 
variable, sdbMessages, which is accessed by the sdbMessage function 
as I described in "RE: 31142 lines/cards/records" on the 21st (second 
example).

Serendipity Reference stores such items in its database, English 
Reference Text.sdb.  You can look at the Change Translation Database 
menuPick to see how it is handled.

Because SDB Utilities is meant to be run as a standalone, it updates 
menus & toolTips from sdbMessages every time it opens...see the stack 
preOpenStack logic.

http://www.oenolog.com/ftp/serendipity_downloader.htm

-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From tkuypers at pandora.be  Sat Nov 23 14:06:01 2002
From: tkuypers at pandora.be (tkuypers at pandora.be)
Date: Sat Nov 23 14:06:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <20021123184150.GI21158@iago.net>
Message-ID: <BA058EB4.4499%tkuypers@pandora.be>

I have seem to brought up something with my question I believe...
I am a RunRev Newby as well, but have been looking at it for a while now and
cannot wait anymore until a new relase brings the features I need... I just
have started developing in it and love it very much, despite missing this
little but oh so needed feature of fetching data from a https-site...
One of the things asked is "what are you willing to pay for it"?
For now the answer would be "nothing" because I need it for a non-profit
charity thing, but in the future I wouldn't care, because I would bill the
client for it...
Someone pointed out to me that there is no "ideal" development-tool, because
they all have flakes or missing out on a few things, but I still think RR
comes very close and I will figure out a way to fetch the info I need, but I
still hope there will be some techno-wizzard who will set up an external to
solve my problem. And if not, we all have to wait until our Scottish friends
put it on their development-schedule... There are worse things to be waiting
for ;-)

Thanks for all your support and info on this subject, it has become a lot
more clear to me than it was 2 days ago and I will keep on watching out for
a solution.

Ton aka Dopey



From troy at rpsystems.net  Sat Nov 23 14:14:00 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Sat Nov 23 14:14:00 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <BA058EB4.4499%tkuypers@pandora.be>
Message-ID: <BA053C3E.169C5%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/23/02 1:59 PM, "tkuypers at pandora.be" <tkuypers at pandora.be> wrote:

> I have seem to brought up something with my question I believe...
> I am a RunRev Newby as well, but have been looking at it for a while now and
> cannot wait anymore until a new relase brings the features I need... I just
> have started developing in it and love it very much, despite missing this
> little but oh so needed feature of fetching data from a https-site...

I guess "rekindled" the discussion would be more like it. Kevin Miller from
RunRev and I have had extensive discussions on the issue, and they are fully
aware that the issue is a priority to allow Rev to be used in networked
business applications - hence the announcement that shortly after the
release of 2.0 we should be seeing some internal functionality.

I for one am greatly looking forward to this, as it will open up a whole new
world of application development areas for all of us.
-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Sat Nov 23 19:16:02 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Sat Nov 23 19:16:02 2002
Subject: Controls of Stack
In-Reply-To: <a05100300ba05532086f0@[216.229.107.226]>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHKEJOCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Thanks Rob for your help. 




From kee at kagi.com  Sat Nov 23 21:38:01 2002
From: kee at kagi.com (kee nethery)
Date: Sat Nov 23 21:38:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <BBEIJJIICJJBOLMBODHCOEOKDHAA.chipp@chipp.com>
Message-ID: <28998443-FF4F-11D6-A25E-003065F25CD4@kagi.com>

On Friday, November 22, 2002, at 04:20 PM, Chipp Walters wrote:

> I got a question for all of you https users.... Exactly what do you 
> want it
> for? Please cite some examples.

We have databases of customer data that need to be searched for us to 
do customer support. We can live with HTTP for people on our internal 
LAN but we do have remote employees and they are not allowed to pass 
customer data via clear text. We could do a secure tunnel but setting 
that up and managing it would be a pain and expensive.

These database systems have internal Web server CGIs that are allowed 
to access them. I have really nice interfaces into this data with lots 
of business logic using RR. But no one outside our local LAN is allowed 
to use these tools until the data is encrypted when going over public 
networks.

We have thousands of suppliers who use our services and for now, their 
only access is via web browser (via HTTPS).

> IOW, would it be better to have an encrypt
> tool instead?

No. I do not want to be the person building encryption. If someone 
intercepted personal data because I was transferring it via a home brew 
security system, I think that would be a very bad thing for our 
reputation.

> Next question... how much would everyone be willing to pay for an https
> external?
>
> $0
> $1000
>
> somewhere in-between?

I would not use an HTTPS external. The focus is security and the 
easiest way to defeat HTTPS is to build a trap door into the code. How 
do I know that an HTTPS external is safe to use? How do I know that it 
has been tested adequately? How do I know that the code I've downloaded 
has not been compromised (like the Sendmail version a couple months 
ago). As an external there is just not much that an individual can do 
to convince me to trust their code.

For me, HTTPS has to come with RR and it has to be backed by them. They 
have to fear that they will suffer a loss of reputation if there is 
something evil in their HTTPS code, and do enough code reviews and 
testing to convince themselves that they are supplying a secure set of 
code.

Also, I'd feel a lot better if every RR user could use and observe the 
RR HTTPS solution. The more users the better.

Just my paranoid 2 cents.

Kee Nethery



From troy at rpsystems.net  Sat Nov 23 23:13:01 2002
From: troy at rpsystems.net (Troy Rollins)
Date: Sat Nov 23 23:13:01 2002
Subject: Http or https
In-Reply-To: <28998443-FF4F-11D6-A25E-003065F25CD4@kagi.com>
Message-ID: <BA05BA9A.169E2%troy@rpsystems.net>

On 11/23/02 8:50 PM, "kee nethery" <kee at kagi.com> wrote:

> We have databases of customer data that need to be searched for us to
> do customer support. We can live with HTTP for people on our internal
> LAN but we do have remote employees and they are not allowed to pass
> customer data via clear text. We could do a secure tunnel but setting
> that up and managing it would be a pain and expensive.

Exactly!! Perfect example Kee.

Kagi and the way that it needs to work share a lot in common with most
companies who have adapted to the internet as a way of operating.

Without secured networking on this level, one cannot challenge the browser
for application development - with it, developers can offer better software
solutions that employ the network, but are more optimized for the task at
hand than a web browser.

-- 
Troy
RPSystems, Ltd.
www.rpsystems.net





From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Sun Nov 24 00:33:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Sun Nov 24 00:33:01 2002
Subject: thank you notes
In-Reply-To: <A0409A7E-FF02-11D6-A5F5-000393A1CAAA@centurytel.net>
Message-ID: <20021124052712.70731.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com>

i am going to start sending my thank you notes
directly to the person who sent the advice. this
does mean a little extra cut & paste, but should
reduce the info deluge if only by a little.
has this ever been an issue in email etiquette?

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
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Yahoo! Mail Plus ? Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com


From alarm at icdc.com  Sun Nov 24 07:49:01 2002
From: alarm at icdc.com (Adrian L'Armand)
Date: Sun Nov 24 07:49:01 2002
Subject: Background
Message-ID: <BA0633F5.2BA0%alarm@icdc.com>

I must have missed something but how does one put buttons and fields in the
background so that they appear on every card. I am coming from HyperCard
where it was very easy.
Adrian



From simran at teleline.es  Sun Nov 24 08:02:00 2002
From: simran at teleline.es (Peter Lundh)
Date: Sun Nov 24 08:02:00 2002
Subject: matrixMultiplication of imageData
Message-ID: <BA067CC4.616F%simran@teleline.es>

Hi all-

I know it's Sunday, but I urgently need some help with the matrixMultiply
command. I have an image in RGB format whose data resides in imageData. I
have the following matrix computation to perform:

|16 |   | 65.481  128.553   24.966|   |R|
|128| + |-37.797  -74.203  112.000| * |G|
|128|   |112.000  -93.786  -18.214|   |B|

I then need to put the result into a new image

Grateful for any advice, or help.

-Peter
-- 
Peter Lundh von Leithner
E: simran at teleline.es
Derby
UK



From terry at discovery.nl  Sun Nov 24 08:19:01 2002
From: terry at discovery.nl (Terry Vogelaar)
Date: Sun Nov 24 08:19:01 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <BA0633F5.2BA0%alarm@icdc.com>
Message-ID: <BA068EBC.18A5C%terry@discovery.nl>

> I must have missed something but how does one put buttons and fields in the
> background so that they appear on every card. I am coming from HyperCard
> where it was very easy.

It still is easy, but it is different. Just group the objects that form a
'background'. Groups replace the HC background. You only have to turn the
'backgroundBehaviour' on in the props palette.

This approach is much more flexible, because you can place multiple groups
on one card.

In the docs: "Learning Revolution->For new developers->Experienced HC/SC
developers" section "About... Revolution for HC developers" paragraph
"Backgrounds and groups" explains it all.

Terry



From gary.rathbone at btclick.com  Sun Nov 24 08:26:00 2002
From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone)
Date: Sun Nov 24 08:26:00 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <BA0633F5.2BA0%alarm@icdc.com>
Message-ID: <000001c293bc$1b09b170$0e00000a@server>

Take a look at 
http://www.xworlds.com/metacard/metaclass.htm

Although its Metacard based the principal is the same. Lesson 6 deals
with "Groups and Backgrounds". 

Or take a look at
http://www.runrev.com/revolution/developers/articles/tipoftheweek/5.html
Which is "aimed mainly at developers coming from HyperCard" - thanks to
Sarah Reichelt.

Regards

Gary Rathbone BSc MBCS
Chartered Information Systems Practitioner


-----Original Message-----
From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
[mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Adrian
L'Armand
Sent: 24 November 2002 12:45
To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
Subject: Background


I must have missed something but how does one put buttons and fields in
the background so that they appear on every card. I am coming from
HyperCard where it was very easy. Adrian

_______________________________________________
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution




From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Sun Nov 24 10:04:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Sun Nov 24 10:04:01 2002
Subject: rev UI: properties/scripts floating windows
Message-ID: <a05200a01ba0699031597@[68.129.88.48]>

hello:  is there a way to stop the script/properties windows from 
floating in the UI?  if not, i would like to suggest this as a future 
feature of RR.  thanks.  olli.


From rcozens at pon.net  Sun Nov 24 11:53:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Sun Nov 24 11:53:01 2002
Subject: Controls of Stack
Message-ID: <a05100300ba06b134deb6@[216.229.107.150]>

You are certainly welcome, Monte.

I think translatability is relatively easy to achieve in Transcript, 
and yet a feature that would help differentiate Revolution apps from 
those created on other platforms.  Certainly user translatability 
can't be attained using C or other platforms that require pre-runtime 
library/resource linking.

I will make time available to assist anyone working on translatable 
RunRev apps.

If you have any questions, a need to see the translation handlers in 
Serendipity Library.rev (which is password protected), or have any 
suggestions how I might improve my approach to translatability, 
please let me know.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From mdswindell at charter.net  Sun Nov 24 12:20:01 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Sun Nov 24 12:20:01 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <000001c293bc$1b09b170$0e00000a@server>
Message-ID: <BA0648A3.3B7D%mdswindell@charter.net>

on 11/24/02 5:19 AM, Gary Rathbone at gary.rathbone at btclick.com wrote:

> Take a look at 
> http://www.xworlds.com/metacard/metaclass.htm
> 
> Although its Metacard based the principal is the same. Lesson 6 deals
> with "Groups and Backgrounds".

Thanks for pointing this out.  What a great resource. Talk about your basic
clean, clear, concise and thorough.  Does the Revolution site link to this
resource anywhere? 
 
> Or take a look at
> http://www.runrev.com/revolution/developers/articles/tipoftheweek/5.html
> Which is "aimed mainly at developers coming from HyperCard" - thanks to
> Sarah Reichelt.

Definitely.  As a former HyperCard/SuperCard user, I found this article to
be of enormous help to me when I was confused as to the group v background
metaphor.  Also very clear and well written.

Mark



From katir at hindu.org  Sun Nov 24 15:16:01 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Sun Nov 24 15:16:01 2002
Subject: Photo Processor/Manager
Message-ID: <ED1D635B-FFE8-11D6-885F-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

I have to manage a lot of incoming digital photo images on a daily 
basis coming in from cameras, emails from around the world, posted to 
folders on a server etc. up to now iView was used to deal with all 
these but it is pathetically inefficient for dealing with fresh input. 
(great for long term archives though)

  I just built in about 45 minutes a little interface in Rev and I'll 
continue to develop to do the following:

-- browse a directory of photos and display them, one at a time,
-- delete, copy or move those photos to a pre-set destination directory.
-- launch those images using imageReady, imageReady droplets, Photoshop 
or Illustrator as external "slave" services, where paths to those apps 
are pre-set in preferences, to scale down, rotate 90 degrees CW or 90 
CCW.
-- globally move all files from one directory to another
later:
-- reorder and batch rename the photos (currently done in iView, which 
is good for this...)
-- caption the photos (currently done in Supercard to be ported to 
Revolution...)

etc. That's the context in case it is useful. Many of the above 
operations are incredibly simple, a few lines of code does just about 
everything,

but here are some challenges and I suspect many of these wheels have 
already been invented or looped through already:

1) GET RECT OF IMAGE IN ADVANCE:
Can we get the rect of an image on disk, or the imagedata in variable 
before display?  I can't find any "imagedata properties" as such.  I 
need to retain the 2048 X 1536 pixel aspect ratio and data in the 
imagedata of high res images coming in off camera, but constrain that 
to a smaller size for display. So that the image will actually fit 
reasonably in a stack window area of about 4 X 5 inches maximum. Also 
one won't know in advance the orientation which could be vertical or 
horizontal.  If we can get the rect before display we can then script 
the image object size accordingly, lock it and then assign the file ref 
to it before display. Of course I could display it first, get the rect 
and then do it... but the idea is to make this as fast as possible.

b) ROTATE AND SCALE IMAGES/QUALITY ISSUE
Using ImageReady and PhotoShop as background slave processors for 
scaling down and rotation is pretty powerful.  In terms of the quality 
of the final output, my assumption is that this is probably the best 
way to go and that to build those operations natively into the 
interface would be doable--using angle, then export image etc.-- and 
perhaps save the time required for launching, but then the quality 
would simply not be there.  Right or wrong? And with OSX there is 
something to be said for offloading these tasks to other apps, because 
we can go back to Rev and continue work right now. But in cases where 
those apps simply are not available for one reason or another, if 
someone has built a native image import, scale/rotate, export widget, I 
could use that.... something simple.

c) RE- ORDERING-BATCH RENAME -- Think tank open
iView does this well, but still, consolidation into the Rev interface 
will save yet another 5-10 minutes and avoid the necessity for iView to 
be installed on the given workstation. Has anyone already built a mini 
image browser stack where you can move images around? or would a better 
strategy to use a field, set the image data of characters in a list and 
then drag these around in the field (haven't actually done that yet, 
but sounds theoretically doable) In the end, after re-ordering, we want 
to batch rename them in their logical numeric order: 01-11-23.jpg, 
02-11-23.jpg etc.

TIA!

Sannyasin Sivakatirswami

Himalayan Academy Publications
katir at hindu.org

www.HimalayanAcademy.com, www.HinduismToday.com
www.Gurudeva.org, www.Hindu.org



From snharper at cs.uchicago.edu  Sun Nov 24 15:37:01 2002
From: snharper at cs.uchicago.edu (sean nicholas harper)
Date: Sun Nov 24 15:37:01 2002
Subject: Http or https - shell MacOSX
In-Reply-To: <50EE52D7-FE6E-11D6-BF11-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211241430390.30277-100000@abyss.cs.uchicago.edu>

How do you run a shell command in macosx with runtime? This is very useful
functionality for me, but the manual says you can't do it, which seems
silly.

Sean



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Sun Nov 24 15:49:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Sun Nov 24 15:49:01 2002
Subject: Http or https - shell MacOSX
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211241430390.30277-100000@abyss.cs.uchicago.edu>
Message-ID: <20021124204301.59835.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>

--- sean nicholas harper <snharper at cs.uchicago.edu>
wrote:
> How do you run a shell command in macosx with
> runtime? This is very useful
> functionality for me, but the manual says you can't
> do it, which seems
> silly.
> 
> Sean
> 

Hi Sean,

This will be addressed in version 2.0 ; for now, you
can use a work-around via AppleScript. Here's a link
that explains this and other things:

http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm
Scroll to the 'MacOS X' section and click on the link.

Hope this helped,

Jan Schenkel.

PS: Here's perhaps a useful link to search the
use-revolution mailing list archives
http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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Yahoo! Mail Plus ? Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
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From gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com  Sun Nov 24 18:00:01 2002
From: gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com (Geoff Canyon)
Date: Sun Nov 24 18:00:01 2002
Subject: Controls of Stack
In-Reply-To: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHKEIJCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
References: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHKEIJCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <a05100300ba0706707497@[188.9.94.76]>

>Hi All
>
>Does everyone know that repeat with x=1 to the number of controls of stack y
>only enumerates the controls on the current card? Bit of a bugger..eh?
>
>How does one parse all the controls of a stack ensuring that those in a
>background only get parsed once unless they are fields with the sharedText
>set to false... etc
>
>FYI... I'm trying to develop the basis for a language engine when it wasn't
>a requirement for the first version of the program. In the short term I want
>to generate a list of objects with visible text. Then I'll search scripts
>for ask and answer dialogs and any other hard coded text.
>
>When I have all that I'll create stack file with a custom property set that
>can be parsed to set everything for a particular language. Then I'll learn
>to translate to ... ;-)
>
>Cheers
>
>Monte

It's been a long time, and the code is likely a plate of spaghetti, but the mcRipper stack I wrote does exactly this sort of "parse all the controls" loop:

<http://www.inspiredlogic.com/mc/ripper.html>
-- 

regards,

Geoff Canyon
gcanyon at inspiredlogic.com


From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Sun Nov 24 19:57:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Sun Nov 24 19:57:01 2002
Subject: Printing a portion of a card
Message-ID: <E8A08A14-000F-11D7-ABD8-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

Hi All,

I have a problem with printing the bottom portion of a card. It prints 
the correct bit of the card but I can't get it to start at the top left 
of the paper, it always prints down the page as if leaving room for the 
non-printed section of the card.

Here is my setup:

The card is 723 pixels wide x 560 high.
The page setup is for A4 paper in landscape mode.
This gives a printPaperSize of 841,595 (with the default printMargins)

I want to print the card from 4,157 to 719,554.
Here is the command I am using:
	print this card from 4,157 to 719,554 into 72,72,697,451

Surely this should make the printout start 1 inch from the top and 1 
inch from the left of the paper. It looks like it starts 1 inch from 
the left but about 3 inches from the top.

If anyone has any suggestions I would be most grateful. I use Mac OS X 
10.2.2, Rev 1.1.1

Thanks,
Sarah

P.S. In the docs, the "into" page rect is specified as being top, left, 
bottom, right. I assume this is an error and the standard L,T,R,B is 
still being used.




From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Sun Nov 24 20:10:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Sun Nov 24 20:10:01 2002
Subject: Printing a portion of a card
In-Reply-To: <E8A08A14-000F-11D7-ABD8-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>
Message-ID: <BA06B6F0.207D8%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Sarah wrote:

> I have a problem with printing the bottom portion of a card. It prints
> the correct bit of the card but I can't get it to start at the top left
> of the paper, it always prints down the page as if leaving room for the
> non-printed section of the card.
> 
> Here is my setup:
> 
> The card is 723 pixels wide x 560 high.
> The page setup is for A4 paper in landscape mode.
> This gives a printPaperSize of 841,595 (with the default printMargins)
> 
> I want to print the card from 4,157 to 719,554.
> Here is the command I am using:
> print this card from 4,157 to 719,554 into 72,72,697,451
> 
> Surely this should make the printout start 1 inch from the top and 1
> inch from the left of the paper. It looks like it starts 1 inch from
> the left but about 3 inches from the top.
> 
> If anyone has any suggestions I would be most grateful. I use Mac OS X
> 10.2.2, Rev 1.1.1

You may need to adjust the printmargins global property.

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.1: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From rpresender at earthlink.net  Sun Nov 24 21:00:01 2002
From: rpresender at earthlink.net (Robert Presender)
Date: Sun Nov 24 21:00:01 2002
Subject: Development vs Standalone
Message-ID: <B927914C-0018-11D7-9BBB-000393A19046@earthlink.net>

Hi,
I assume that I am doing something wrong.  Will appreciate help.

Using OS 10.2.2/rev 1.1.1r2(OSx)/Emac also OS 9.2.2/rev 1.1.1r2(OS)/PB 
G3

My project works OK in the development stage but when I do a Build, the 
standalone doesn't execute properly.

The standalone opens with the Splash, etc but doesn't  want to execute 
some custom btns both menu and other types on substacks.

  All my substacks appear in the Data folder of the standalone.

  It seems that some btn menus  don't activate their applicable handlers 
in the Main stack when in Build but do  so when in development.

Selected build options are as follows:
Basic .. Create folder for substacks, Mac OSX, auto download.....

Stacks .. Current stack file, copy default font and color, remove Rev 
UI ..., move substacks into indiv files, auto apply stackFiles info to 
mainStack

Resources.. ask,answer,cursors, icon lib

MacOS option .. only creatpr signature.

TIA
Regards ... Bob



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Sun Nov 24 21:14:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Sun Nov 24 21:14:01 2002
Subject: Development vs Standalone
In-Reply-To: <B927914C-0018-11D7-9BBB-000393A19046@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHAEKICLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

>
>   All my substacks appear in the Data folder of the standalone.
>
This is the problem. You have three choices:
 - switch off the move substacks into the data folder option when you build
(means you can't save data in them)
 - alter your design so you have a standalone splash screen that opens the
mainstack.
 - alter your design so that code that you have placed in the mainstack but
you wish to call from the substacks is moved into a library stack. (this is
what I would do because you will probably find that you can create a generic
library that you cna use in other apps).

Cheers

Monte



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sun Nov 24 22:26:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sun Nov 24 22:26:01 2002
Subject: Photo Processor/Manager
References: <ED1D635B-FFE8-11D6-885F-003065FB9830@hindu.org>
Message-ID: <004301c29430$d5955570$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> 1) GET RECT OF IMAGE IN ADVANCE:
> Can we get the rect of an image on disk, or the imagedata in variable
> before display?  I can't find any "imagedata properties" as such.  I
> need to retain the 2048 X 1536 pixel aspect ratio and data in the
> imagedata of high res images coming in off camera, but constrain that
> to a smaller size for display. So that the image will actually fit
> reasonably in a stack window area of about 4 X 5 inches maximum. Also
> one won't know in advance the orientation which could be vertical or
> horizontal.  If we can get the rect before display we can then script
> the image object size accordingly, lock it and then assign the file ref
> to it before display. Of course I could display it first, get the rect
> and then do it... but the idea is to make this as fast as possible.

You can use an offscreen image object that is invisible and whose lockLoc
property is false. Import the image and then get its width and height... OR
you can use an image object whose lockLoc property is TRUE, and then get the
'formattedWidth' and 'formattedHeight' of the image (which will return its
original width and height).

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Sun Nov 24 22:50:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Sun Nov 24 22:50:01 2002
Subject: Why doesn't this work, please?
In-Reply-To: <a05111a63ba04b0a6d33c@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <CEC17D6C-0025-11D7-ABD8-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

As Bill says, this is a bug in the IDE. A workaround is to use:
	send "choose browse tool" to me in 5 ticks

This seems to work MOST of the time.

Sarah

On Saturday, November 23, 2002, at 02:12  pm, Roger Guay wrote:

> Hi folks,
>
> I'm using the following script to clone an invisible button "Video" 
> and renaming the clones.  And, despite my attempts to "choose browse 
> tool" the selector tool comes up every time this script is executed:
>
> On mouseDown
>   global Vn
>   add 1 to Vn
>   clone button "video"
>   set the name of last card button to "V"&Vn
>   set the visible of last card button to true
>   choose Browse Tool
> end mouseDown
>
> on mouseleave
>   choose Browse Tool
> end mouseleave
>
>
> Can anyone help?
>
> Thanks, Roger
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Sun Nov 24 22:51:00 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Sun Nov 24 22:51:00 2002
Subject: Printing a portion of a card
In-Reply-To: <a05111a5fba072809cf17@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <2D8D317B-0028-11D7-ABD8-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

Thanks for the idea Richard, but I already tried setting the 
printMargins.
Perhaps I should try setting the top margin to a negative number :-)

Sarah

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 11:06  am, Richard Gaskin wrote:

> Sarah wrote:
>
>> I have a problem with printing the bottom portion of a card. It prints
>> the correct bit of the card but I can't get it to start at the top 
>> left
>> of the paper, it always prints down the page as if leaving room for 
>> the
>> non-printed section of the card.
>>
>> Here is my setup:
>>
>> The card is 723 pixels wide x 560 high.
>> The page setup is for A4 paper in landscape mode.
>> This gives a printPaperSize of 841,595 (with the default printMargins)
>>
>> I want to print the card from 4,157 to 719,554.
>> Here is the command I am using:
>> print this card from 4,157 to 719,554 into 72,72,697,451
>>
>> Surely this should make the printout start 1 inch from the top and 1
>> inch from the left of the paper. It looks like it starts 1 inch from
>> the left but about 3 inches from the top.
>>
>> If anyone has any suggestions I would be most grateful. I use Mac OS X
>> 10.2.2, Rev 1.1.1
>
> You may need to adjust the printmargins global property.
>
> -- 
>  Richard Gaskin
>  Fourth World Media Corporation
>  Developer of WebMerge 2.1: Publish any database on any site
>  ___________________________________________________________
>  Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
>  Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Sun Nov 24 22:59:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Sun Nov 24 22:59:01 2002
Subject: Development vs Standalone
In-Reply-To: <a05111a74ba0734b3c6e9@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <DDDCA8F2-0028-11D7-ABD8-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

Is the splash screen the main stack or do you have another stack which 
contains all the general handlers but which got bumped down the 
hierarchy when you inserted the splash stack? That's what happened to 
me once when using the splash screen approach. The solution was to have 
an extra line in your splash screen openStack handler:
start using "The stack with all my scripts"

When you do a build like this, my preference is to say "No data folder" 
as well as using "Move substacks..."
If you do this, you will find your application folder includes the 
clickable app as well as a folder called
"My App.rev_components". I find this works better than creating a data 
folder which has this components folder as a sub-folder of it.

Sarah


On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 12:00  pm, Robert Presender wrote:

> Hi,
> I assume that I am doing something wrong.  Will appreciate help.
>
> Using OS 10.2.2/rev 1.1.1r2(OSx)/Emac also OS 9.2.2/rev 1.1.1r2(OS)/PB 
> G3
>
> My project works OK in the development stage but when I do a Build, 
> the standalone doesn't execute properly.
>
> The standalone opens with the Splash, etc but doesn't  want to execute 
> some custom btns both menu and other types on substacks.
>
>  All my substacks appear in the Data folder of the standalone.
>
>  It seems that some btn menus  don't activate their applicable 
> handlers in the Main stack when in Build but do  so when in 
> development.
>
> Selected build options are as follows:
> Basic .. Create folder for substacks, Mac OSX, auto download.....
>
> Stacks .. Current stack file, copy default font and color, remove Rev 
> UI ..., move substacks into indiv files, auto apply stackFiles info to 
> mainStack
>
> Resources.. ask,answer,cursors, icon lib
>
> MacOS option .. only creatpr signature.
>
> TIA
> Regards ... Bob
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From katir at hindu.org  Mon Nov 25 00:44:12 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Mon Nov 25 00:44:12 2002
Subject: Extract ImageSource URL from a char in a field?
Message-ID: <27A4C294-0038-11D7-885F-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

Is it possible to extract the file name of the image which was used to 
set the imageSource of a character in a field?

eg.

set the imagesource of char 1 of fld "browser" to ("binfile:" & 
gCurrentFolder&gCurrentImage)

Works fine. I get the image in the field.... but later  can we get the 
actual file reference out?  I would like to some how extract from char 
1 that it was

"/myhardDrive/photos/redFlower.jpg"

  which now appears in the place of character 1 in the field.

Possible? or has char 1 now become a simple pixel object embedded in 
the stack with no relation/record whatsoever of its source?

Sannyasin Sivakatirswami

Himalayan Academy Publications
katir at hindu.org

www.HimalayanAcademy.com, www.HinduismToday.com
www.Gurudeva.org, www.Hindu.org



From jacque at hyperactivesw.com  Mon Nov 25 01:35:01 2002
From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay)
Date: Mon Nov 25 01:35:01 2002
Subject: Printing a portion of a card
References: <200211250545.AAA13214@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <3DE1C329.2060409@hyperactivesw.com>

Sarah <sarahr at genesearch.com.au> wrote:

> I want to print the card from 4,157 to 719,554.
> Here is the command I am using:
> 	print this card from 4,157 to 719,554 into 72,72,697,451
> 
> Surely this should make the printout start 1 inch from the top and 1 
> inch from the left of the paper. It looks like it starts 1 inch from 
> the left but about 3 inches from the top.

Looking at the numbers, it looks like Rev is adding together the card 
coordinates and the print rect, so you are getting 76 pixels from the 
left and 229 pixels from the top, which is about one inch and three inches.

What happens if you do this instead:

set the printmargins to 72,72,697,451
print this card from 4,157 to 719,554

Untested, but worth a try.

-- 
Jacqueline Landman Gay         |     jacque at hyperactivesw.com
HyperActive Software           |     http://www.hyperactivesw.com



From marcus at bointon.com  Mon Nov 25 04:36:01 2002
From: marcus at bointon.com (Marcus Bointon)
Date: Mon Nov 25 04:36:01 2002
Subject: Photo Processor/Manager
In-Reply-To: <ED1D635B-FFE8-11D6-885F-003065FB9830@hindu.org> 
References: <ED1D635B-FFE8-11D6-885F-003065FB9830@hindu.org>
Message-ID: <20021124210305.26403.qmail@rack.synchromedia.co.uk>

Sannyasin Sivakatirswami writes: 

> b) ROTATE AND SCALE IMAGES/QUALITY ISSUE
> Using ImageReady and PhotoShop as background slave processors for scaling 
> down and rotation is pretty powerful.  In terms of the quality of the 
> final output, my assumption is that this is probably the best way to go 
> and that to build those operations natively into the interface would be 
> doable--using angle, then export image etc.-- and perhaps save the time 
> required for launching, but then the quality would simply not be there.  
> Right or wrong? 

At least partly wrong! It's possible to rotate (in 90 dgree steps) JPEG 
files without doing a decompress/recompress (which loses quality) - it can 
be effected by rearranging the compressed JPEG data. It's also possible to 
crop on block boundaries in a similar way. GraphicConverter will do lossless 
rotation - Photoshop won't. If you have a search on google you might find 
some C source for doing this, though that probably wouldn't help you in 
Rev... 

Marcus
-- 
Marcus Bointon
Synchromedia Limited: Putting you in the picture
marcus at synchromedia.co.uk | http://www.synchromedia.co.uk 


From heather at runrev.com  Mon Nov 25 05:07:01 2002
From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams)
Date: Mon Nov 25 05:07:01 2002
Subject: thank you notes
In-Reply-To: <200211241656.LAA02440@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA07A541.9BF9%heather@runrev.com>

> Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 21:27:12 -0800 (PST)
> From: erik hansen <erikhans08 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: thank you notes
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> 
> i am going to start sending my thank you notes
> directly to the person who sent the advice. this
> does mean a little extra cut & paste, but should
> reduce the info deluge if only by a little.
> has this ever been an issue in email etiquette?

Guys, this is your list. However, I must say it has never been an issue in
the past, and my personal feeling is that it's nice for people to get a
public acknowledgement of how much help they have given. Sometimes a nugget
from the list can be a life saver, and it's good to let people know you
appreciate it. Obviously, if it started to take over the content, or people
became annoyed by it, then I'd ask you all to cut down on public thankyous.
At present I don't think this is the case. While active, this list isn't
overwhelming... Yet :-)

Regards,

Heather
-- 
Heather Williams <heather at runrev.com> <http://www.runrev.com/>
Runtime Revolution Ltd.
Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707
Ten Thumbs Typing Tutor Teach your Fingers to Dance



From sims at ezpzapps.com  Mon Nov 25 05:50:01 2002
From: sims at ezpzapps.com (sims)
Date: Mon Nov 25 05:50:01 2002
Subject: file extensions
In-Reply-To: <000001c293bc$1b09b170$0e00000a@server>
References: <000001c293bc$1b09b170$0e00000a@server>
Message-ID: <a05200f01ba07ae4673ca@[10.0.1.2]>

I am building an import-export feature into an app.

It will export a custom prop or import a plain text
file and make it into a custom prop.

I only want to allow previously exported files to be imported,
so I am thinking of adding a file extension to the file name
as a 'test' to help (ex: only files that end with ".DOG" can be
imported) ensure that only exported files get imported.

I am wondering if this is a reasonable way to proceed...especially
with Windows machines. Type/creator codes for non-osx macs
can be registered, is such a procedure needed for file extensions
on a Windows system?

Thanks in Advance!

sims



From tkuypers at pandora.be  Mon Nov 25 05:54:01 2002
From: tkuypers at pandora.be (tkuypers at pandora.be)
Date: Mon Nov 25 05:54:01 2002
Subject: https, the sequel...
Message-ID: <BA07BE7D.4502%tkuypers@pandora.be>

I have created a small exe in Visual Basic wich does the job for me: when I
type in the  command in DOS with the parameters, it returns a textfile that
I can use...

The command I need to use is SourceGetter
?https://ThePageIneed-c:\myoutput.txt?
Or ?myProgram? + quote + the https-query + ?-? + path & name of outputfile.

But I can?t get the shell command working from within RR :-((

Can anybody point me out to an example, I don?t understand what to do with
the ?shellCommand? and ?Shell? commands...

Many thanx in advance

Ton aka Dopey
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From malte.brill at t-online.de  Mon Nov 25 06:34:01 2002
From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill)
Date: Mon Nov 25 06:34:01 2002
Subject: Rev 2.0
Message-ID: <BA07C7D2.D6%520041426354-0001@t-online.de>

>we all should give a very big hand to our german revolutionist
>Mr. Malte Brill, who wrote these two articles.

Hey Klaus, you make me blush! ;-)


>are these on the web?

Sorrowly not (yet). If anyone is interested in reading the German review, I
will try to make a PDF version of it, and send it via mail. (please mail me
off list). For the german tutorials I am sure I will put these on my
Website, when the Mag is outdated and all copyright falls back to me. (They
are very low level though, so I guess they are not too interesting for
experienced users and maybe need some revision.)

My kind regards to all the nice people on this list. Without your help I
would never have been able to find the ease in using Revolution.

Vive la revolution!
Malte



From rpresender at earthlink.net  Mon Nov 25 09:45:01 2002
From: rpresender at earthlink.net (Robert Presender)
Date: Mon Nov 25 09:45:01 2002
Subject: Development vs Standalone
In-Reply-To: <200211250545.AAA13185@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <A040429C-0083-11D7-A248-000393A19046@earthlink.net>

On Sunday, November 24, 2002, at 09:45  PM, Monte Goulding  wrote:

>>   All my substacks appear in the Data folder of the standalone.
>>
> This is the problem. You have three choices:
>  - switch off the move substacks into the data folder option when you 
> build
> (means you can't save data in them)
Neglected to include that I have to save data that the user enters.  I 
have used this method before but with a much simpler project that 
worked OK.  This brings up another question regarding the data folder 
which I will put on the list.

>  - alter your design so you have a standalone splash screen that opens 
> the
> mainstack.
>  - alter your design so that code that you have placed in the 
> mainstack but
> you wish to call from the substacks is moved into a library stack. 
> (this is
> what I would do because you will probably find that you can create a 
> generic
> library that you cna use in other apps).
>
Thank you for putting me on the right track.

Regards....Bob



From rpresender at earthlink.net  Mon Nov 25 10:20:01 2002
From: rpresender at earthlink.net (Robert Presender)
Date: Mon Nov 25 10:20:01 2002
Subject: Development vs Standalone
In-Reply-To: <200211250545.AAA13185@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <7DC69E1E-0088-11D7-A248-000393A19046@earthlink.net>

On Sunday, November 24, 2002, at 09:45  PM, Sara wrote:

> Is the splash screen the main stack or do you have another stack which
> contains all the general handlers but which got bumped down the
> hierarchy when you inserted the splash stack? That's what happened to
> me once when using the splash screen approach. The solution was to have
> an extra line in your splash screen openStack handler:
> start using "The stack with all my scripts"

I believe that I do have a conflict in the way I open the project which 
affects the standalone.
I will look into the 'start using' procedure (Monte also suggested 
this).

> When you do a build like this, my preference is to say "No data folder"
> as well as using "Move substacks..."

Neglected to mention that I have to save data that the user enters


> If you do this, you will find your application folder includes the
> clickable app as well as a folder called
> "My App.rev_components". I find this works better than creating a data
> folder which has this components folder as a sub-folder of it.

It seems that the "My App.rev_components" is the same as "Data" but 
doesn't allow the saving of user entered data. In either case, it  
would be nice to be able to hide these folders from the user.  I had 
some success previously by using ResEdit  to make the files invisible 
but not the folder.

Thank you for your input.  I am going to revamp the way the project is 
opened.

Regards... Bob

>
> On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 12:00  pm, Robert Presender wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>> I assume that I am doing something wrong.  Will appreciate help.
>>
>> Using OS 10.2.2/rev 1.1.1r2(OSx)/Emac also OS 9.2.2/rev 1.1.1r2(OS)/PB
>> G3
>>
>> My project works OK in the development stage but when I do a Build,
>> the standalone doesn't execute properly.
>>
>> The standalone opens with the Splash, etc but doesn't  want to execute
>> some custom btns both menu and other types on substacks.
>>
>>  All my substacks appear in the Data folder of the standalone.
>>
>>  It seems that some btn menus  don't activate their applicable
>> handlers in the Main stack when in Build but do  so when in
>> development.
>>
>> Selected build options are as follows:
>> Basic .. Create folder for substacks, Mac OSX, auto download.....
>>
>> Stacks .. Current stack file, copy default font and color, remove Rev
>> UI ..., move substacks into indiv files, auto apply stackFiles info to
>> mainStack
>>
>> Resources.. ask,answer,cursors, icon lib
>>
>> MacOS option .. only creatpr signature.
>>
>> TIA
>> Regards ... Bob
>>



From rcozens at pon.net  Mon Nov 25 11:52:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Mon Nov 25 11:52:01 2002
Subject: thank you notes
In-Reply-To: <BA07A541.9BF9%heather@runrev.com>
References: <BA07A541.9BF9%heather@runrev.com>
Message-ID: <a05100300ba07ee857e5b@[216.229.107.118]>

>  > i am going to start sending my thank you notes
>>  directly to the person who sent the advice. this
>>  does mean a little extra cut & paste, but should
>>  reduce the info deluge if only by a little.
>>  has this ever been an issue in email etiquette?

Interesting idea, Erik.  I don't recall the issue being discussed on 
any list I've subscribed to previously.

I have no strong feelings about this, and will be happy to accede to 
the will of the majority.

If it were my call, however, I would say "Continue to post thank yous 
to the list." and here's why:

Suppose (a) I'm back from holiday after a few days not reading List 
messages, or (b) I'm a newbie looking for information on a specific 
thread in the List archives.  I find your post asking "where can I 
find ..." or "why doesn't this syntax work", an answer from Jan, an 
answer from Dar, and nothing.

Without your thank you in the thread, I don't know if the issue was 
resolved to your satisfaction, and if the two answers were different, 
I don't know which one worked and which one didn't.  The thank you 
serves to designate closure of the thread.

Other ancillary issues:

* If ten people answer, you will need to send ten thank yous instead of one.
* Are you then obligated to send "thanks for nothing" notes to people 
whose suggestion didn't work?
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From dsc at swcp.com  Mon Nov 25 12:13:22 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Mon Nov 25 12:13:22 2002
Subject: thank you notes
In-Reply-To: <a05100300ba07ee857e5b@[216.229.107.118]>
Message-ID: <BAA6DE38-0097-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 08:26 AM, Rob Cozens wrote:

> Without your thank you in the thread, I don't know if the issue was 
> resolved to your satisfaction, and if the two answers were different, I 
> don't know which one worked and which one didn't.

Yes.  Many responses are in the form of "I have never done this, but 
this should work.." which has for some of us the invisible parenthetical 
remark "I hope you get this worked out and mention how it works on the 
list, because I think I will want to do that someday and I certainly 
don't want to go through the trouble you seem to be having."  :-)

Dar



From rcozens at pon.net  Mon Nov 25 12:54:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Mon Nov 25 12:54:01 2002
Subject: thank you notes
In-Reply-To: <BAA6DE38-0097-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
References: <BAA6DE38-0097-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <a05100301ba0812fc0fa0@[216.229.107.150]>

>Many responses are in the form of "I have never done this, but this 
>should work.." which has for some of us the invisible parenthetical 
>remark "I hope you get this worked out and mention how it works on 
>the list, because I think I will want to do that someday and I 
>certainly don't want to go through the trouble you seem to be 
>having."

LOL, Dar.

Bravo!  BTW, have you gotten all the kinks out of socket connections 
and published a tutorial yet?   :{`)
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From kray at sonsothunder.com  Mon Nov 25 13:07:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Mon Nov 25 13:07:01 2002
Subject: Extract ImageSource URL from a char in a field?
References: <27A4C294-0038-11D7-885F-003065FB9830@hindu.org>
Message-ID: <005c01c294ab$fb536420$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Have you tried:

  get the imageSource of char 1 of fld "browser"

???

If so, what did you get?

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sannyasin Sivakatirswami" <katir at hindu.org>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Cc: <metacard at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2002 11:38 PM
Subject: Extract ImageSource URL from a char in a field?


> Is it possible to extract the file name of the image which was used to 
> set the imageSource of a character in a field?
> 
> eg.
> 
> set the imagesource of char 1 of fld "browser" to ("binfile:" & 
> gCurrentFolder&gCurrentImage)
> 
> Works fine. I get the image in the field.... but later  can we get the 
> actual file reference out?  I would like to some how extract from char 
> 1 that it was
> 
> "/myhardDrive/photos/redFlower.jpg"
> 
>   which now appears in the place of character 1 in the field.
> 
> Possible? or has char 1 now become a simple pixel object embedded in 
> the stack with no relation/record whatsoever of its source?
> 
> Sannyasin Sivakatirswami
> 
> Himalayan Academy Publications
> katir at hindu.org
> 
> www.HimalayanAcademy.com, www.HinduismToday.com
> www.Gurudeva.org, www.Hindu.org
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 


From kray at sonsothunder.com  Mon Nov 25 13:11:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Mon Nov 25 13:11:01 2002
Subject: file extensions
References: <000001c293bc$1b09b170$0e00000a@server> <a05200f01ba07ae4673ca@[10.0.1.2]>
Message-ID: <006701c294ac$89a36db0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

There isn't an "official" registry, but I usually check
http://www.file-ext.com/ to see what has been used and try to pick something
that hasn't...

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/


----- Original Message -----
From: "sims" <sims at ezpzapps.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 4:49 AM
Subject: file extensions


> I am building an import-export feature into an app.
>
> It will export a custom prop or import a plain text
> file and make it into a custom prop.
>
> I only want to allow previously exported files to be imported,
> so I am thinking of adding a file extension to the file name
> as a 'test' to help (ex: only files that end with ".DOG" can be
> imported) ensure that only exported files get imported.
>
> I am wondering if this is a reasonable way to proceed...especially
> with Windows machines. Type/creator codes for non-osx macs
> can be registered, is such a procedure needed for file extensions
> on a Windows system?
>
> Thanks in Advance!
>
> sims
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From dsc at swcp.com  Mon Nov 25 13:17:00 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Mon Nov 25 13:17:00 2002
Subject: thank you notes
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba0812fc0fa0@[216.229.107.150]>
Message-ID: <3D650C2D-00A1-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 10:51 AM, Rob Cozens wrote:

> BTW, have you gotten all the kinks out of socket connections and 
> published a tutorial yet?   :{`)

What a cool idea!  I can use one myself.  (I have the memory of a 
goldfish.)  If I wait until 2.0 then it will be a lot simpler; some 
workarounds and warnings will become short historical parenthetical 
remarks.

Dar Scott



From rcozens at pon.net  Mon Nov 25 13:50:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Mon Nov 25 13:50:01 2002
Subject: thank you notes
In-Reply-To: <3D650C2D-00A1-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
References: <3D650C2D-00A1-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <a05100300ba0820382b89@[216.229.107.50]>

>>BTW, have you gotten all the kinks out of socket connections and 
>>published a tutorial yet?   :{`)
>
>What a cool idea!  I can use one myself.  (I have the memory of a 
>goldfish.)  If I wait until 2.0 then it will be a lot simpler; some 
>workarounds and warnings will become short historical parenthetical 
>remarks.

I, for one, will eagerly await it, Dar.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From themacguy at macosx.com  Mon Nov 25 15:02:01 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Mon Nov 25 15:02:01 2002
Subject: Moving images around randomly
Message-ID: <DFC5D84E-00AF-11D7-B655-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

I am developing an app that will have a number of fairly small images 
on one screen; maybe 50 pixels square. I was thinking about using image 
objects (but will listen to any suggestions). The app will have these 
objects moving about in the upper half of the window in a manner that 
I'm sure has some mathematical model. Imagine balls moving randomly 
about, each proceeding in a straight line, bouncing off the "walls" 
-and- off each other. There does not need to be any exact "precision" 
in terms of the angles at which the bounce occurs nor will the movement 
of any object be especially fast; actually, fairly slow is what we 
want. Furthermore, each of the "balls" will need to respond to a 
mouseUp event (which I know I can do without a problem).

Before I try to re-invent the wheel, has anyone done or seen anything 
similar to this (that you would like to share)? I would imagine that 
the code resides in each object. I also would think that the direction 
of each object's travel will need to be mapped to a variable that 
changes as the object collides with another object or one of the 
"walls".

How am I doing so far?

Thanks,
Barry



From tkuypers at pandora.be  Mon Nov 25 15:15:01 2002
From: tkuypers at pandora.be (tkuypers at pandora.be)
Date: Mon Nov 25 15:15:01 2002
Subject: Shell command in Windows
Message-ID: <BA0841B5.4546%tkuypers@pandora.be>

Can anyone please explain how to use the shell function in RR.

I need to run a dos-program and send some parameters with it at startup.
It would look like this:
SourceGetter ?https://ThePageIneed-c:\myoutput.txt?
Or ?myProgram? + quote + the https-query + ?-? + path & name of outputfile.

When typing it in into the cmd-box it works fine, but I can?t get it working
from within RR...

Many thanks in advance

Ton aka Dopey
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From sims at ezpzapps.com  Mon Nov 25 15:22:01 2002
From: sims at ezpzapps.com (sims)
Date: Mon Nov 25 15:22:01 2002
Subject: file extensions
In-Reply-To: <006701c294ac$89a36db0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>
References: <000001c293bc$1b09b170$0e00000a@server>
 <a05200f01ba07ae4673ca@[10.0.1.2]>
 <006701c294ac$89a36db0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <a05200f02ba08368d2e83@[10.0.1.2]>

>There isn't an "official" registry, but I usually check
>http://www.file-ext.com/ to see what has been used and try to pick something
>that hasn't...

As we say on a small island in the middle of the Med...

Grazzi hafna!

sims





From dsc at swcp.com  Mon Nov 25 15:36:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Mon Nov 25 15:36:01 2002
Subject: Shell command in Windows
In-Reply-To: <BA0841B5.4546%tkuypers@pandora.be>
Message-ID: <AA92147C-00B4-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 01:08 PM, tkuypers at pandora.be wrote:

> Can anyone please explain how to use the shell function in RR.
>

Try this:

on mouseUp
    put shell("ping 127.0.0.1") into field "Report"
end mouseUp

(Note:  Ping does crlflf for double-spaced lines which are not converted 
right.  I think shell might have other trouble with line ends, too, so 
watch out for that.)

Dar Scott



From dsc at swcp.com  Mon Nov 25 15:41:00 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Mon Nov 25 15:41:00 2002
Subject: thank you notes
In-Reply-To: <a05100300ba0820382b89@[216.229.107.50]>
Message-ID: <50F0BDA0-00B5-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 11:46 AM, Rob Cozens wrote:

>>> BTW, have you gotten all the kinks out of socket connections and 
>>> published a tutorial yet?   :{`)
>>
>> What a cool idea!  I can use one myself.  (I have the memory of a 
>> goldfish.)  If I wait until 2.0 then it will be a lot simpler; some 
>> workarounds and warnings will become short historical parenthetical 
>> remarks.
>
> I, for one, will eagerly await it, Dar.

Hmmm.  Based on the underwhelming response to my mention of decimal 
numbers, I might do this instead mid December.  What should a tutorial 
be like?  Web single page?  Web multiple pages?  Stack?  A bunch of tips 
dropped on Ken's lap?

Dar Scott



From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Mon Nov 25 15:52:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Mon Nov 25 15:52:01 2002
Subject: array: can it be returned by a function?
Message-ID: <a05200a01ba083c050af7@[68.129.118.38]>

hello:  i create an array and load it with values in a function.  the 
function returns the array variable.  this variable, however, never 
makes it back to the calling handler.
	can arrays be returned by functions or not?
thanks!  olli.


From dsc at swcp.com  Mon Nov 25 16:03:00 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Mon Nov 25 16:03:00 2002
Subject: Shell command in Windows
In-Reply-To: <BA0841B5.4546%tkuypers@pandora.be>
Message-ID: <60257917-00B8-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 01:08 PM, tkuypers at pandora.be wrote:

> I need to run a dos-program and send some parameters with it at startup.
> It would look like this:
> SourceGetter ?https://ThePageIneed-c:\myoutput.txt?
> Or ?myProgram? + quote + the https-query + ?-? + path & name of 
> outputfile.
>
Are you missing a quote at the end of that line?  Perhaps that is the 
problem.

Dar Scott




From scott at tactilemedia.com  Mon Nov 25 16:17:01 2002
From: scott at tactilemedia.com (Scott Rossi)
Date: Mon Nov 25 16:17:01 2002
Subject: Moving images around randomly
In-Reply-To: <DFC5D84E-00AF-11D7-B655-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
Message-ID: <BA07D1FE.5715%scott@tactilemedia.com>

Recently, "Barry Levine"  wrote:

> I am developing an app that will have a number of fairly small images
> on one screen; maybe 50 pixels square. I was thinking about using image
> objects (but will listen to any suggestions). The app will have these
> objects moving about in the upper half of the window in a manner that
> I'm sure has some mathematical model. Imagine balls moving randomly
> about, each proceeding in a straight line, bouncing off the "walls"
> -and- off each other. There does not need to be any exact "precision"
> in terms of the angles at which the bounce occurs nor will the movement
> of any object be especially fast; actually, fairly slow is what we
> want. Furthermore, each of the "balls" will need to respond to a
> mouseUp event (which I know I can do without a problem).
> 
> Before I try to re-invent the wheel, has anyone done or seen anything
> similar to this (that you would like to share)? I would imagine that
> the code resides in each object. I also would think that the direction
> of each object's travel will need to be mapped to a variable that
> changes as the object collides with another object or one of the
> "walls".

You can try the Bouncer demo posted on our downloads page (top of the list):

  http://www.tactilemedia.com/download/

Also posted is "Lemmings", a drag routine that affects multiple objects and
makes for a drag effect with a very organic/lifelike feel.  This was modeled
after a Flash project I disassembled, and while I don't have the math quite
right (Richard Hertz, where are you?) this is quite a fun little stack.

Personally, I've always thought there should be more "porting" of other
behaviors/effects from other development platforms (Flash, Director, etc)
and would encourage folks who have the inclination to do so and share with
the list.

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, Multimedia & Design
-----
E: scott at tactilemedia.com
W: http://www.tactilemedia.com



From rcozens at pon.net  Mon Nov 25 16:56:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Mon Nov 25 16:56:01 2002
Subject: Socket Tutorial Guidelines [was: thank you notes]
In-Reply-To: <50F0BDA0-00B5-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
References: <50F0BDA0-00B5-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <a05100301ba08462c30e8@[216.229.107.177]>

>What should a tutorial be like?

That's up to the author, Dar.

The best example that comes to my mind is the Apple Event Primer 
stack from Apple.  I have it opened here now...

"This stack is an introduction to HyperCard's new ability to 
communicate with other applications and other Macintosh computers via 
Apple events."

The sections are:

* Setting up
* Choosing
* Asking
* Telling
* Conversing
* Exploring

eMail me privately if you would like a copy (you should be able to 
open it in RunRev).

Basically, I would like to see the ins & outs and dos & don'ts of 
establishing interprocess communication via sockets, eg: how do I 
establish communication & exchange data between two or more Rev 
standalones.

Perhaps this is a good time to ask for confirmation of what I think I know:

I have selected socket communication as the preferred approach to 
interapplication communication because it is the only approach I know 
of that works on all platforms, and over the Internet as well. 
Obviously, scripting Apple event handlers does one little good when 
it's time to port to Unix/Windows.  Am I losing any significant 
timing and/or data passing capacity advantages of platform-specific 
avenues of interprocess communication?

In other words, is there any intrinsic reason for using Apple events 
on Macs and  their equivalent on Windows vs using sockets on both?
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From bvlahos at mac.com  Mon Nov 25 17:35:01 2002
From: bvlahos at mac.com (Bill Vlahos)
Date: Mon Nov 25 17:35:01 2002
Subject: Socket Tutorial Guidelines [was: thank you notes]
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba08462c30e8@[216.229.107.177]>
Message-ID: <48B6F2CA-00C5-11D7-993B-003065EC5590@mac.com>

I think you are correct to use socket communication for your 
application because you are writing both the client and server.

Apple Events offers benefits only supported on Macintosh computers to 
take advantage of AppleScript dictionaries. There is nothing like 
AppleScript for any other platform. AppleScript is terrific but it is 
not cross-platform.

Bill Vlahos

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 01:49  PM, Rob Cozens wrote:

> I have selected socket communication as the preferred approach to 
> interapplication communication because it is the only approach I know 
> of that works on all platforms, and over the Internet as well. 
> Obviously, scripting Apple event handlers does one little good when 
> it's time to port to Unix/Windows.  Am I losing any significant timing 
> and/or data passing capacity advantages of platform-specific avenues 
> of interprocess communication?
>
> In other words, is there any intrinsic reason for using Apple events 
> on Macs and  their equivalent on Windows vs using sockets on both?



From harrison at all-auctions.com  Mon Nov 25 17:53:01 2002
From: harrison at all-auctions.com (Rick Harrison)
Date: Mon Nov 25 17:53:01 2002
Subject: Socket Tutorial Guidelines [was: thank you notes]
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba08462c30e8@[216.229.107.177]>
Message-ID: <BA081272.200B%harrison@all-auctions.com>

on 11/25/2002 4:49 PM, Rob Cozens at rcozens at pon.net wrote:

>> What should a tutorial be like?
> 
> That's up to the author, Dar.
> 

I would also be very very interested in seeing such
a tutorial.

Let me know when you have it done!!!

Thanks,

Rick Harrison



From tkuypers at pandora.be  Mon Nov 25 17:57:00 2002
From: tkuypers at pandora.be (tkuypers at pandora.be)
Date: Mon Nov 25 17:57:00 2002
Subject: Shell command in Windows & fetching https
In-Reply-To: <60257917-00B8-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <BA0867CB.4565%tkuypers@pandora.be>

Dar,

Thanks for your advice, it was not the quote missing, that was just a typo
in my mail, it was the fact that I didn't know how to use the shell-command.

And now it works, I now can fetch the proper information out of a https-site
:-)))

Many thanks again.

Ton



From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Mon Nov 25 17:57:16 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Mon Nov 25 17:57:16 2002
Subject: Socket Tutorial Guidelines [was: thank you notes]
In-Reply-To: <48B6F2CA-00C5-11D7-993B-003065EC5590@mac.com>
Message-ID: <BA07E946.20898%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Bill Vlahos wrote:

> I think you are correct to use socket communication for your
> application because you are writing both the client and server.
> 
> Apple Events offers benefits only supported on Macintosh computers to
> take advantage of AppleScript dictionaries. There is nothing like
> AppleScript for any other platform. AppleScript is terrific but it is
> not cross-platform.

AppleScript is also useful, of course, for communicating with other
(non-Rev-based) apps.

But as for dictionaries, we could easily include custom properties to serve
the same need, with a function callable over sockets to access it.

If there's a need for interoperability between Rev-based apps from different
authors, we could define a standard for the function name, something like
SocketDictionary().

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.1: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From dsc at swcp.com  Mon Nov 25 18:13:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Mon Nov 25 18:13:01 2002
Subject: Socket Tutorial Guidelines [was: thank you notes]
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba08462c30e8@[216.229.107.177]>
Message-ID: <9A282A6C-00CA-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 02:49 PM, Rob Cozens wrote:

> Basically, I would like to see the ins & outs and dos & don'ts of 
> establishing interprocess communication via sockets, eg: how do I 
> establish communication & exchange data between two or more Rev 
> standalones.

Personally, I like TCP/IP for IPC.

It is interesting that you brought this up.  (No, folks, Rob and Dar are 
not the same person; I don't think I have even met Rob outside this 
list.)  I think it would be good to encourage discussion on what Rev-Rev 
IPC might be like, should it grow beyond a few ad hoc methods.

>
> Perhaps this is a good time to ask for confirmation of what I think I 
> know:
>
> I have selected socket communication as the preferred approach to 
> interapplication communication because it is the only approach I know 
> of that works on all platforms, and over the Internet as well. 
> Obviously, scripting Apple event handlers does one little good when 
> it's time to port to Unix/Windows.  Am I losing any significant timing 
> and/or data passing capacity advantages of platform-specific avenues of 
> interprocess communication?

It depends on what you think as significant.  Figure on a couple ms on 
the same lan or same computer.

For communication on the same computer or the same lan, UDP will work 
fine.  I use it with some robustness added over the Internet.  Messages 
will have to be under about 64 K.  Over a WAN or Internet I would keep 
the datagram small (under 1000 char).  For larger messages (over 64K 
local or over about 1000 remote) you should TCP.  That will have a time 
hit in connecting, though.  If you are streaming, use UDP or keep a TCP 
link connected.

I reported on the improve list a "write dalliance" bug that can affect 
performance on OS X.  It does not apply if you use callbacks, which I 
encourage anyway.

I have been plagued with a "same computer" or "very, very slow computer" 
problem on Windows that prevented use of TCP; the notification of the 
open success came before the engine was ready to receive it.  This has 
been fixed with MC 2.5A6, so this should be OK on Revolution 2.0.

> In other words, is there any intrinsic reason for using Apple events on 
> Macs and  their equivalent on Windows vs using sockets on both?

There might be if your need is immediate for OS X.  It has been 
mentioned to me that UDP IPC experiments on OS X show a delay in message 
transfer if the recipient does not have the active window.  I have not 
looked into this, but you may want to run the experiment before a final 
decision.  (I don't know if this is the same as the "write dalliance" 
bug.)  I hope this gets fixed (or is already fixed), but I'm up to my 
neck in Windows alligators, so I don't know when I'll get a chance to 
look at it myself.

There are (were?) some minor differences between OS X and Windows that 
will have to be addressed.  If a connection is refused, you get a 
socketError on Windows but a socketClosed on OS X, for example.  The 
timeouts for open are host dependent.

Summary:  Yes!  TCP/IP for Revolution IPC!

Dar Scott





From dsc at swcp.com  Mon Nov 25 18:24:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Mon Nov 25 18:24:01 2002
Subject: Shell command in Windows & fetching https
In-Reply-To: <BA0867CB.4565%tkuypers@pandora.be>
Message-ID: <1FC213BC-00CC-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 03:50 PM, tkuypers at pandora.be wrote:

> And now it works, I now can fetch the proper information out of a 
> https-site
> :-)))

If Ton can do this with his program, I would guess that others can do it 
with curl until https is included in Revolution.

I recommend that those experimenting use files for info to the program 
and use "shell" rather than "open process".

(I saw in the cURL man that there are a couple ways to point to certs, 
but it is not clear whether there are some built-in root certs or 
whether one has to set this up if verification is needed.  Either way, 
with a little fiddling one can have https.)

Good work, Ton!

Dar Scott





From dsc at swcp.com  Mon Nov 25 18:51:00 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Mon Nov 25 18:51:00 2002
Subject: Socket Tutorial Guidelines [was: thank you notes]
In-Reply-To: <BA07E946.20898%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <E1C12542-00CF-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 03:50 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:

> If there's a need for interoperability between Rev-based apps from 
> different
> authors, we could define a standard for the function name, something 
> like
> SocketDictionary().

I think it is a good idea to start thinking about this.

Six not-very-concrete thoughts off the top of my head:

Some method of one scheme should be very easy for newbies to use.

The basis should allow for RPC, messaging, state reflection and maybe 
other models.

The overall model should allow client-server, source-sink as well as 
other relationships.

Models should be very Revolution and optimized about Revolution concepts 
such as handlers, functions, strings, properties, objects...

Standards are OK where they help, but not when they get in the way.

This should be tough/robust/tenacious rather than reporting lots of 
errors.  (But maybe there can be two ways to do this.)

Dar Scott





From bvlahos at mac.com  Mon Nov 25 19:22:01 2002
From: bvlahos at mac.com (Bill Vlahos)
Date: Mon Nov 25 19:22:01 2002
Subject: Socket Tutorial Guidelines [was: thank you notes]
In-Reply-To: <BA07E946.20898%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <2DD0A418-00D4-11D7-A9A3-003065EC5590@mac.com>

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 02:50  PM, Richard Gaskin wrote:

> AppleScript is also useful, of course, for communicating with other
> (non-Rev-based) apps.
>
> But as for dictionaries, we could easily include custom properties to 
> serve
> the same need, with a function callable over sockets to access it.
>
> If there's a need for interoperability between Rev-based apps from 
> different
> authors, we could define a standard for the function name, something 
> like
> SocketDictionary().
What a great idea. The Rev folks should come up with the standard 
format but anyone could run with it. This would definitely grab wide 
attention in the computer world for Revolution.

Bill Vlahos



From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Mon Nov 25 19:54:00 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Mon Nov 25 19:54:00 2002
Subject: array: can it be returned by a function?
In-Reply-To: <a05200a01ba083c050af7@[68.129.118.38]>
Message-ID: <C32EC5C8-00D8-11D7-968E-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Tuesday, Nov 26, 2002, at 07:45 Australia/Sydney, Oliver Hardt wrote:

> hello:  i create an array and load it with values in a function.  the 
> function returns the array variable.  this variable, however, never 
> makes it back to the calling handler.
> 	can arrays be returned by functions or not?

Yes they can. I have done this and just tested it again. If it is still 
a problem, can you reveal some code?

regards
David

> thanks!  olli.
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From dsc at swcp.com  Mon Nov 25 20:21:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Mon Nov 25 20:21:01 2002
Subject: array: can it be returned by a function?
In-Reply-To: <C32EC5C8-00D8-11D7-968E-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>
Message-ID: <6C2E1000-00DC-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 05:48 PM, David Vaughan wrote:

> Yes they can. I have done this and just tested it again.

Wow!  I didn't know that.

I tried it and it works:
***************************************
local test

on mouseUp
   local anotherVar
   put "abc" into test["A"]
   put "xyz" into test["B"]
   put someFun() into anotherVar
   put anotherVar["A"] & anotherVar["B"] into field "Report"
end mouseUp

function someFun
   return test
end someFun
***************************************

I had tried this:

put someFun()["A"] after field "Report"

which wouldn't compile and then assumed it couldn't be done.

One could make a function to to the lookup, I suppose.

This is interesting.  Values can be arrays as well as strings in some 
sense.  (They can be also numbers, not quite masquerading as strings.)  
I like the idea of arrays as values rather than a kind of variable.  I 
have used that in LabView.

Dar Scott



From dsc at swcp.com  Mon Nov 25 20:44:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Mon Nov 25 20:44:01 2002
Subject: array: can it be returned by a function?
In-Reply-To: <6C2E1000-00DC-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <BAF0B3DC-00DF-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 06:14 PM, Dar Scott wrote:

> On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 05:48 PM, David Vaughan wrote:
>
>> Yes they can. I have done this and just tested it again.
>
> Wow!  I didn't know that.
>
> I tried it and it works:
***************************************
on mouseUp
   local x, y
   put "123" into y["C"]
   put fillArray(y) into x
   put x["A"] & x["B"] & x["C"] into field "Report"
end mouseUp

function fillArray theArray
   local arrayHolder
   put  theArray into arrayHolder
   put "  abc  " into arrayHolder["A"]
   put "  xyz  " into arrayHolder["B"]
   return arrayHolder
end fillArray
*****************************************

And this, too!  An array can be passed as an arg.

The field gets "  abc    xyz  123"!

There's a story about the fellow who bought a chainsaw and after cutting 
a cord of wood complained to the salesman that it didn't seem to 
increase his output as the salesman indicated.  The salesman asked him 
to bring it in and he would look at it.  When the salesman fired it up, 
the woodsman jumped back and said, "What's that noise??!!"

I'm that woodsman.

Dar Scott






From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Mon Nov 25 21:08:00 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Mon Nov 25 21:08:00 2002
Subject: array: can it be returned by a function?
In-Reply-To: <C32EC5C8-00D8-11D7-968E-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>
References: <C32EC5C8-00D8-11D7-968E-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05200a03ba088554cac6@[68.129.118.38]>

hi david:  here is the code that doesn't work.  the function is 
called from handlers with a tab-separated list of values (the data 
for the array and the keys).  when i trace the function, the local 
var lPPArray appears to be doing fine, however, the calling handler 
doesn't get the array back.  perhaps you could try this out and see 
whether it works ... thanks a lot!  olli.

-- this function gets a tab-separated list of
-- values (ppData) and a tab-separated list of
-- keys (ppKeys).  then an array is filled up
-- with the ppData values and returned

function gF_LoadPPRec pData,pKeys
   put empty into lPPArray
   set the itemDelimiter to tab
   repeat with i = 1 to the number of items of pKeys
     put item i of pData into lPPArray[(item i of pKeys)]
   end repeat

   return lPPArray
end gF_LoadPPRec



11/26/02, David Vaughan wrote:

>can you reveal some code?


From dsc at swcp.com  Mon Nov 25 21:39:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Mon Nov 25 21:39:01 2002
Subject: array: can it be returned by a function?
In-Reply-To: <a05200a03ba088554cac6@[68.129.118.38]>
Message-ID: <545CED42-00E7-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 07:01 PM, Oliver Hardt wrote:

> -- this function gets a tab-separated list of
> -- values (ppData) and a tab-separated list of
> -- keys (ppKeys).  then an array is filled up
> -- with the ppData values and returned
>
> function gF_LoadPPRec pData,pKeys
>   put empty into lPPArray
>   set the itemDelimiter to tab
>   repeat with i = 1 to the number of items of pKeys
>     put item i of pData into lPPArray[(item i of pKeys)]
>   end repeat
>
>   return lPPArray
> end gF_LoadPPRec

on mouseUp
   local theArray
   put gF_LoadPPRec(("abc" & tab & "xyz"), ("A" & tab & "B")) into 
theArray
   put theArray["A"] && theArray["B"] into field "Report"
end mouseUp

Works for me.  Well, in that trivial case.

Dar Scott
Just learning the power of arrays



From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Mon Nov 25 21:52:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Mon Nov 25 21:52:01 2002
Subject: thank you notes
In-Reply-To: <BA07A541.9BF9%heather@runrev.com>
Message-ID: <20021126024627.73997.qmail@web20004.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Heather Williams <heather at runrev.com> wrote:

> my personal feeling is that it's
> nice for people to get a public acknowledgement
> of how much help they have given.

in that case...

=====
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From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Mon Nov 25 21:59:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Mon Nov 25 21:59:01 2002
Subject: Moving images around randomly
In-Reply-To: <a05111a5fba083159fe45@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <1E492910-00EA-11D7-ABD8-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

I haven't done anything like yet, but I would recommend against having 
the code in each object unless they all do different things. If the 
objects all respond in the same way to a click, then put the script in 
the card or stack and check "the target" to see what was actually 
clicked.

The movement variables could be stored as custom properties of each 
object.

Sarah


On Tuesday, November 26, 2002, at 05:58  am, Barry Levine wrote:

> Before I try to re-invent the wheel, has anyone done or seen anything 
> similar to this (that you would like to share)? I would imagine that 
> the code resides in each object. I also would think that the direction 
> of each object's travel will need to be mapped to a variable that 
> changes as the object collides with another object or one of the 
> "walls".




From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Mon Nov 25 22:03:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Mon Nov 25 22:03:01 2002
Subject: thank you notes
In-Reply-To: <a05100300ba07ee857e5b@[216.229.107.118]>
Message-ID: <20021126025714.95373.qmail@web20010.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Rob Cozens <rcozens at pon.net> wrote: 
> Without your thank you in the thread, I don't
> know if the issue was 
> resolved to your satisfaction, and if the two
> answers were different, 
> I don't know which one worked and which one
> didn't.  The thank you 
> serves to designate closure of the thread.

you're right.

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

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From alanira9 at mac.com  Mon Nov 25 22:13:01 2002
From: alanira9 at mac.com (Alan Gayne)
Date: Mon Nov 25 22:13:01 2002
Subject: Socket Tutorial Guidelines
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba08462c30e8@[216.229.107.177]>
Message-ID: <1444C82B-00EC-11D7-9D4F-000393BB44C6@mac.com>

Somewhat off topic, does anyone have or know of a well detailed, step 
by step tutorial on how to use RunRev as the front end of a Filemaker 
database?

 From the references I've seen on the list it would seem that this is a 
fairly widespread technique but I'm yet to find a really good tutorial.

In my Hypercard days I always stored my data my stacks.  But taking 
into account the current state of RunRev's reports generator (still MIA 
in 2.0?) and the fact that RunRev keeps everything in memory, it seems 
that the RunRev/Filemaker combination might just be what I'm looking 
for (at least for now).

I'm pretty sure that Runrev has all the tools but I have no conceptual 
understanding of how they are best used.  So if anyone has the kind of 
tutorial I'm talking about I would really appreciate the help.

Kind regards,
Alan

On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 04:49 PM, Rob Cozens wrote:

> Basically, I would like to see the ins & outs and dos & don'ts of 
> establishing interprocess communication via sockets, eg: how do I 
> establish communication & exchange data between two or more Rev 
> standalones.



From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Mon Nov 25 22:31:01 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Mon Nov 25 22:31:01 2002
Subject: array: can it be returned by a function?
In-Reply-To: <a05200a03ba088554cac6@[68.129.118.38]>
Message-ID: <AF985ABB-00EE-11D7-968E-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Tuesday, Nov 26, 2002, at 13:01 Australia/Sydney, Oliver Hardt wrote:

> hi david:  here is the code that doesn't work.  the function is called 
> from handlers with a tab-separated list of values (the data for the 
> array and the keys).  when i trace the function, the local var 
> lPPArray appears to be doing fine, however, the calling handler 
> doesn't get the array back.  perhaps you could try this out and see 
> whether it works ... thanks a lot!  olli.
>
> -- this function gets a tab-separated list of
> -- values (ppData) and a tab-separated list of
> -- keys (ppKeys).  then an array is filled up
> -- with the ppData values and returned
>
> function gF_LoadPPRec pData,pKeys
>   put empty into lPPArray
>   set the itemDelimiter to tab
>   repeat with i = 1 to the number of items of pKeys
>     put item i of pData into lPPArray[(item i of pKeys)]
>   end repeat
>
>   return lPPArray
> end gF_LoadPPRec

Oliver

I wrote this:
on mouseUp
   put 1 & tab & 2 & tab & 3 & tab & 4 into pKeys
   put "Freddo" & tab & "Frog" & tab & "was" & tab & "here" into pData
   get gf_LoadPPRec(pData,pKeys)
   combine it with return and comma
   put it into field "f2"
end mouseUp

function gF_LoadPPRec pData,pKeys
   put empty into lPPArray
   set the itemDelimiter to tab
   repeat with i = 1 to the number of items of pKeys
     put item i of pData into lPPArray[(item i of pKeys)]
   end repeat
   return lPPArray
end gF_LoadPPRec

which you can see includes your untouched function. It simply exercises 
it; and it worked perfectly, producing:
1,Freddo
2,Frog
3,was
4,here
from that input data.

Something else is the matter. Is your calling function correct?

regards
David
>
>
>
> 11/26/02, David Vaughan wrote:
>
>> can you reveal some code?
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Mon Nov 25 23:45:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Mon Nov 25 23:45:01 2002
Subject: array: can it be returned by a function?
In-Reply-To: <AF985ABB-00EE-11D7-968E-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>
References: <AF985ABB-00EE-11D7-968E-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>
Message-ID: <a05200a00ba08a85018c8@[128.196.99.210]>

David:  thank you very much -- it appears that i simply did not 
understand that in order to put the values of the array into a field 
(or message box), i need to use the combine command.  you solved my 
problem!  thanks a lot!  best, olli.



11/26/02, David Vaughan wrote:

>On Tuesday, Nov 26, 2002, at 13:01 Australia/Sydney, Oliver Hardt wrote:
>
>>  -- this function gets a tab-separated list of
>>  -- values (ppData) and a tab-separated list of
>>  -- keys (ppKeys).  then an array is filled up
>>  -- with the ppData values and returned
>>
>>  function gF_LoadPPRec pData,pKeys
>>    put empty into lPPArray
>>    set the itemDelimiter to tab
>>    repeat with i = 1 to the number of items of pKeys
>>      put item i of pData into lPPArray[(item i of pKeys)]
>>    end repeat
>>
>>    return lPPArray
>>  end gF_LoadPPRec
>
>Oliver
>
>I wrote this:
>on mouseUp
>   put 1 & tab & 2 & tab & 3 & tab & 4 into pKeys
>   put "Freddo" & tab & "Frog" & tab & "was" & tab & "here" into pData
>   get gf_LoadPPRec(pData,pKeys)
>   combine it with return and comma
>   put it into field "f2"
>end mouseUp
>
>function gF_LoadPPRec pData,pKeys
>   put empty into lPPArray
>   set the itemDelimiter to tab
>   repeat with i = 1 to the number of items of pKeys
>     put item i of pData into lPPArray[(item i of pKeys)]
>   end repeat
>   return lPPArray
>end gF_LoadPPRec
>
>which you can see includes your untouched function. It simply 
>exercises it; and it worked perfectly, producing:
>1,Freddo
>2,Frog
>3,was
>4,here


From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Tue Nov 26 00:17:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Tue Nov 26 00:17:01 2002
Subject: are arrays auto-sorted by their keys?
Message-ID: <a05200a01ba08b2356a79@[68.129.127.189]>

hello:  as keys i use words, not numbers.  when i convert the array 
to an "ordinary" container using the combine command, i find that the 
keys have been automatically sorted alphanumerically.  is there a way 
to have RR not do this?  thank you!  olli.


From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Tue Nov 26 01:08:01 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Tue Nov 26 01:08:01 2002
Subject: are arrays auto-sorted by their keys?
In-Reply-To: <a05200a01ba08b2356a79@[68.129.127.189]>
Message-ID: <89BE0074-0104-11D7-968E-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Tuesday, Nov 26, 2002, at 16:11 Australia/Sydney, Oliver Hardt wrote:

> hello:  as keys i use words, not numbers.  when i convert the array to 
> an "ordinary" container using the combine command, i find that the 
> keys have been automatically sorted alphanumerically.  is there a way 
> to have RR not do this?  thank you!  olli.

Ah, you got me there. No, I do not know how to prevent that if arrays 
are used. It may be interesting, without being an answer, that if you 
simply take the keys of the array then they are not sorted as the 
"combine"d data is sorted. However, nor are the keys in the order of 
creation. I assume they are in hash number order. Try it.
e.g.
puf function1(data1,data2) into array1
get the keys of array1
combine array1 with return and comma
put it & return & array1

cheers
David
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Tue Nov 26 01:19:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Tue Nov 26 01:19:01 2002
Subject: debugging <on openstack>
In-Reply-To: <D2ED8613-FC2D-11D6-AF59-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <20021126061327.35945.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com>

this is in stack "frog":
on openStack
  breakpoint
  insert script of stack "aa" into front
  insert script of stack "aa1" into front
end openStack

"frog" is the first stack opened. with the Script
Debug window open execution does NOT halt at the
breakpoint. i also tried <on startUp> the Script
Debug window  does show "frog" as a Trace: stack
but has handlers  only for stack "RevMenubar"

should this work or is the handler simply not
engaging for some other reason?




=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

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From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Tue Nov 26 03:30:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Tue Nov 26 03:30:01 2002
Subject: MAC address
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHKELBCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Hi All

Do we have access to the MAC address/Physical Address?

Cheers

Monte Goulding
B.App.Sc. (Hons.)

Executive Director
Sweat Technologies

email: monte at sweattechnologies.com
website: www.sweattechnologies.com
mobile (International): +61 421 138 274 
       (Australia): 0421 138 274



From sylvain at bouju.net  Tue Nov 26 04:00:00 2002
From: sylvain at bouju.net (Sylvain Bouju)
Date: Tue Nov 26 04:00:00 2002
Subject: Palette (How to?)...
Message-ID: <1fm91nz.le7eh9pmgugiM%sylvain@bouju.net>

What is the best way for palette creation,
and is there somewhere some examples?

I have made a stack for a palette, a picture in it
for the different tools I need, and a global stack script
based on the clicLoc for the action , but doing so,
I don't find the way to hilite each tool on mouseDown...

-- 
Sylvain Bouju
sylvain at bouju.net
-- 


From dsc at swcp.com  Tue Nov 26 04:15:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Tue Nov 26 04:15:01 2002
Subject: MAC address
In-Reply-To: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHKELBCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <B45A64F1-011E-11D7-856F-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Tuesday, November 26, 2002, at 01:23 AM, Monte Goulding wrote:

> Do we have access to the MAC address/Physical Address?

I don't think so.  On OS X try shell("ifconfig -a") and parse the result 
from that.  On Windows do something similar with (I think) ipconfig.

Dar



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Tue Nov 26 04:46:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Tue Nov 26 04:46:01 2002
Subject: MAC address
In-Reply-To: <B45A64F1-011E-11D7-856F-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHIELCCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Thanks Dar


> > Do we have access to the MAC address/Physical Address?
> 
> I don't think so.  On OS X try shell("ifconfig -a") and parse the result 
> from that.  On Windows do something similar with (I think) ipconfig.
> 
Hmm... what do you get from get shell("ifconfig -a");put it on OS X

I thought we got shell access on OS X now? It works fine in Terminal.

I get 0 and that's with MC 2.4.3 and 2.5A1

You don't know about OS 9 do you?

Cheers

Monte


From wmb at internettrainer.com  Tue Nov 26 10:11:00 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Tue Nov 26 10:11:00 2002
Subject: Socket Tutorial Guidelines
In-Reply-To: <1444C82B-00EC-11D7-9D4F-000393BB44C6@mac.com>
Message-ID: <7CB0B639-0150-11D7-A524-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Dienstag, November 26, 2002, at 04:06  Uhr, Alan Gayne wrote:

> Somewhat off topic, does anyone have or know of a well detailed, step 
> by step tutorial on how to use RunRev as the front end of a Filemaker 
> database?
>
> From the references I've seen on the list it would seem that this is a 
> fairly widespread technique but I'm yet to find a really good > tutorial.

Thats a very interesting idea for me too...
Is it possible?
Does it make any sense to build the UI in Rev instead directly in FM, 
what seems easier to me...?
For what kind of solutions could make it sence compared to 4D, 
Valentina or mySQL..?
Can FM do anything what they cant do..?
Is it easier (cheaper) to publish a FM Database on the web and connect 
to it with "Rev client"?

Thanks in advance for some ideas to that...

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From rcozens at pon.net  Tue Nov 26 11:01:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Tue Nov 26 11:01:01 2002
Subject: Socket Tutorial Guidelines [was: thank you notes]
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba08462c30e8@[216.229.107.177]>
References: <50F0BDA0-00B5-11D7-BBC1-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
 <a05100301ba08462c30e8@[216.229.107.177]>
Message-ID: <a05100302ba0948da5b3e@[216.229.107.175]>

Hi All,

It appears to me there is enough potential interest in interprocess 
communication to justify formation of an off-List group to work with 
Kevin on this issue.

Since it is unrealistic to expect much of Kevin's attention until 
after release of version 2.0, I suggest we wrap this up until then.

I will revive this thread sometime around the first of the year as 
Socket Communications Study Group.

In the meantime, if anyone who hasn't commented would like a specific 
invitation to join that discussion, send me a note privately.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Tue Nov 26 11:10:01 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Tue Nov 26 11:10:01 2002
Subject: Socket Tutorial Guidelines
In-Reply-To: <7CB0B639-0150-11D7-A524-003065430226@internettrainer.com>
Message-ID: <20021126160356.6231.qmail@web11904.mail.yahoo.com>

--- "Wolfgang M. Bereuter" <wmb at internettrainer.com>
wrote:
> 
> On Dienstag, November 26, 2002, at 04:06  Uhr, Alan
> Gayne wrote:
> 
> > Somewhat off topic, does anyone have or know of a
> well detailed, step 
> > by step tutorial on how to use RunRev as the front
> end of a Filemaker 
> > database?
> >
> > From the references I've seen on the list it would
> seem that this is a 
> > fairly widespread technique but I'm yet to find a
> really good > tutorial.
> 
> Thats a very interesting idea for me too...
> Is it possible?
> Does it make any sense to build the UI in Rev
> instead directly in FM, 
> what seems easier to me...?
> For what kind of solutions could make it sence
> compared to 4D, 
> Valentina or mySQL..?
> Can FM do anything what they cant do..?
> Is it easier (cheaper) to publish a FM Database on
> the web and connect 
> to it with "Rev client"?
> 
> Thanks in advance for some ideas to that...
> 
> regards
> Wolfgang M. Bereuter
> 

Hi Alan, Hi Wolfgang,

RunRev 2.0 will have a report generator, so that's
good news and much appreciated.

The main reason why I'd use RunRev UI on top of
FileMaker database is that:
1) FM doesn't have a complete scripting language, so
if you need to make a lot of complicated convoluted
changes, it can get hairy.
2) FM datafiles are prone to data loss because it's
too easy to go into a field and change something --
it's hard to make good interfaces that prevent this,
as you can't lock/unlock fields and have to maintain
two separate layouts.

If you're only using FileMaker as a back-end database,
you might as well take a look at Valentina ; from the
comments I've heard so far, it seems sturdy and fast.
However, FileMaker has a Web Companion which means you
don't have to use the cgi-version of RunRev to display
data from the database.
Plus, given the addition of XML to FileMaker Pro 6 and
to RunRev 2.0, we could see some interesting synergies
there.

Just a few thoughts,

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
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From dsc at swcp.com  Tue Nov 26 11:11:00 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Tue Nov 26 11:11:00 2002
Subject: MAC address
In-Reply-To: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHIELCCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <C1DA9153-0158-11D7-9C2D-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Tuesday, November 26, 2002, at 02:39 AM, Monte Goulding wrote:

>>> Do we have access to the MAC address/Physical Address?
>>
>> I don't think so.  On OS X try shell("ifconfig -a") and parse the 
>> result
>> from that.  On Windows do something similar with (I think) ipconfig.
>>
> Hmm... what do you get from get shell("ifconfig -a");put it on OS X
****************************
function shellSH cmd
   -- Sorry, no quote marks in cmd in this version
   -- Uses sh; use full path in command
   -- And shellCommand is ignored
   put "do shell script" & quote & cmd & quote into s
   do s as AppleScript
   put result() into r
   replace numToChar(13) with linefeed in r
   return r
end shellSH

on mouseUp
   put shellSH("/sbin/ifconfig -a") into field "Report"
end mouseUp
****************************

Tested on Rev 1.1.1: Works.

I had left out two things in saying "shell".  There is no working shell 
in Rev 1.1.1 OS X and the workaround uses sh without your environment so 
you have to specify the path.

> I get 0 and that's with MC 2.4.3 and 2.5A1

I would have thought that would work.

>
> I thought we got shell access on OS X now? It works fine in Terminal.

In 2.0, I believe.

> You don't know about OS 9 do you?

I just had to rebuild my OS 9 classic, so I'm not able to answer well.  
I have used some 3rd party network utilities in the past that were 
applescriptable, but I don't remember names.

Dar Scott



From janschenkel at yahoo.com  Tue Nov 26 11:19:00 2002
From: janschenkel at yahoo.com (Jan Schenkel)
Date: Tue Nov 26 11:19:00 2002
Subject: Socket Tutorial Guidelines [was: thank you notes]
In-Reply-To: <a05100302ba0948da5b3e@[216.229.107.175]>
Message-ID: <20021126161310.58541.qmail@web11901.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Rob Cozens <rcozens at pon.net> wrote:
> Hi All,
> 
> It appears to me there is enough potential interest
> in interprocess 
> communication to justify formation of an off-List
> group to work with 
> Kevin on this issue.
> 
> Since it is unrealistic to expect much of Kevin's
> attention until 
> after release of version 2.0, I suggest we wrap this
> up until then.
> 
> I will revive this thread sometime around the first
> of the year as 
> Socket Communications Study Group.
> 
> In the meantime, if anyone who hasn't commented
> would like a specific 
> invitation to join that discussion, send me a note
> privately.
> -- 
> 
> Rob Cozens

Hi Rob,

Either you read my mind, or you haven't waded through
your inbox yet. I contacted a few people (including
you) off-list for the same purpose.

Jan Schenkel.

=====
"As we grow older, we grow both wiser and more foolish at the same time."  (La Rochefoucauld)

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com


From Doug_Ivers at lord.com  Tue Nov 26 11:26:01 2002
From: Doug_Ivers at lord.com (Ivers, Doug E)
Date: Tue Nov 26 11:26:01 2002
Subject: double-click on substack to open standalone
Message-ID: <E08533A454364A4C8B395EA007D1F42309768E@ntsrvcrd04.main.lord.com>

For all supported platforms, how do I make sure that my standalone app. opens when the user double-clicks on my "data" stack?


-- D
doug_ivers at lord.com


From pixelbird at interisland.net  Tue Nov 26 12:11:01 2002
From: pixelbird at interisland.net (Ken Norris (dialup))
Date: Tue Nov 26 12:11:01 2002
Subject: Not getting digest email
In-Reply-To: <200211241655.LAA02395@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA08ED49.6141%pixelbird@interisland.net>

Hello RR list,

I'm used to getting 2 or more digest versions of this list daily, but
Ihaven' received anything since Sunday morning. Either things are really
slow or else there's a problem.

Any response?

Best regards,
Ken N.



From terry at discovery.nl  Tue Nov 26 13:00:01 2002
From: terry at discovery.nl (Terry Vogelaar)
Date: Tue Nov 26 13:00:01 2002
Subject: Palette (How to?)...
In-Reply-To: <1fm91nz.le7eh9pmgugiM%sylvain@bouju.net>
Message-ID: <BA0973C0.18AD6%terry@discovery.nl>

> What is the best way for palette creation,
> and is there somewhere some examples?
> 
> I have made a stack for a palette, a picture in it
> for the different tools I need, and a global stack script
> based on the clicLoc for the action , but doing so,
> I don't find the way to hilite each tool on mouseDown...

You should make a button for each tool. Each button can have proper icons
for each mouse state and you can also show tooltips on mouseover.

Terry



From sylvain at bouju.net  Tue Nov 26 14:05:01 2002
From: sylvain at bouju.net (Sylvain Bouju)
Date: Tue Nov 26 14:05:01 2002
Subject: Palette (How to?)...
In-Reply-To: <BA0973C0.18AD6%terry@discovery.nl>
Message-ID: <1fm9twe.10y7r4hacc3lsM%sylvain@bouju.net>

> You should make a button for each tool. Each button can have proper icons
> for each mouse state and you can also show tooltips on mouseover.

Thank you!

And my second question is about how to create
cross platform icons, because I have not yet
founded any icon editor inside Revolution...

-- 
Sylvain Bouju
sylvain at bouju.net
-- 


From kray at sonsothunder.com  Tue Nov 26 14:07:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Tue Nov 26 14:07:01 2002
Subject: MAC address
References: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHKELBCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <00d601c2957d$8da90470$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Monte,

Take a look at this tip:

http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_env001

It has complete info on getting the MAC address on both Mac (OS 9 and X) and
Windows.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
To: "Rev List" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 2:23 AM
Subject: MAC address


>
> Hi All
>
> Do we have access to the MAC address/Physical Address?
>
> Cheers
>
> Monte Goulding
> B.App.Sc. (Hons.)
>
> Executive Director
> Sweat Technologies
>
> email: monte at sweattechnologies.com
> website: www.sweattechnologies.com
> mobile (International): +61 421 138 274
>        (Australia): 0421 138 274
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Tue Nov 26 14:12:00 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Tue Nov 26 14:12:00 2002
Subject: double-click on substack to open standalone
References: <E08533A454364A4C8B395EA007D1F42309768E@ntsrvcrd04.main.lord.com>
Message-ID: <00e301c2957e$4da3e600$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Take a look at these tips:

http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_file004
http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_file005

The first is for Windows, and the second is for OS X.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/


----- Original Message -----
From: "Ivers, Doug E" <Doug_Ivers at lord.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 10:17 AM
Subject: double-click on substack to open standalone


> For all supported platforms, how do I make sure that my standalone app.
opens when the user double-clicks on my "data" stack?
>
>
> -- D
> doug_ivers at lord.com
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Tue Nov 26 14:24:01 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Tue Nov 26 14:24:01 2002
Subject: Palette (How to?)...
In-Reply-To: <1fm9twe.10y7r4hacc3lsM%sylvain@bouju.net>
Message-ID: <ECA5BAA7-0173-11D7-A2B6-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Bon soir Sylvain,

>> You should make a button for each tool. Each button can have proper 
>> icons
>> for each mouse state and you can also show tooltips on mouseover.
>
> Thank you!
>
> And my second question is about how to create
> cross platform icons, because I have not yet
> founded any icon editor inside Revolution...

Since icons are nothing else but images displayed inside buttons,
you can (should) create icons/images with your favourite
image-editor.

Save it in a format that can be read by RR, means "JPG", "GIF" or "PNG".

So they are crossplatform automatically :-)


That's all...
C'est tout...

> Sylvain Bouju
> sylvain at bouju.net

Hope this helped.


Au revoir


Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de



From miscdas at boxfrog.com  Tue Nov 26 15:55:01 2002
From: miscdas at boxfrog.com (miscdas at boxfrog.com)
Date: Tue Nov 26 15:55:01 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <000001c293bc$1b09b170$0e00000a@server> 
References: <000001c293bc$1b09b170$0e00000a@server>
Message-ID: <20021126204931.57842.qmail@www.boxfrog.com>

Or, try using the "built-in" help; in this case the Application Tutorial. 
Step 10 describes groups and backgrounds and walks you through creating 
them. 

I don't come from any type of XTalk background.  I rarely need to venture 
outside of the information provided in the MC download to answer these types 
of rather basic questions. I'm certain better use could be made of the 
supplied resources. 

miscdas 

 

>Gary Rathbone writes:

> Take a look at 
> http://www.xworlds.com/metacard/metaclass.htm 
> 
> Although its Metacard based the principal is the same. Lesson 6 deals
> with "Groups and Backgrounds".  
> 
> Or take a look at
> http://www.runrev.com/revolution/developers/articles/tipoftheweek/5.html
> Which is "aimed mainly at developers coming from HyperCard" - thanks to
> Sarah Reichelt. 
> 
> Regards 
> 
> Gary Rathbone BSc MBCS
> Chartered Information Systems Practitioner 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of Adrian
> L'Armand
> Sent: 24 November 2002 12:45
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Background 
> 
> 
> I must have missed something but how does one put buttons and fields in
> the background so that they appear on every card. I am coming from
> HyperCard where it was very easy. Adrian


From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Tue Nov 26 16:24:00 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Tue Nov 26 16:24:00 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <20021126204931.57842.qmail@www.boxfrog.com>
Message-ID: <8F8EEBBD-0184-11D7-968E-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Wednesday, Nov 27, 2002, at 07:49 Australia/Sydney, 
miscdas at boxfrog.com wrote:

> Or, try using the "built-in" help; in this case the Application 
> Tutorial. Step 10 describes groups and backgrounds and walks you 
> through creating them.
> I don't come from any type of XTalk background.  I rarely need to 
> venture outside of the information provided in the MC download to 
> answer these types of rather basic questions. I'm certain better use 
> could be made of the supplied resources.
> miscdas
>
True, miscdas, but the list exists in part to help people discover the 
documentation as well as the product, or the use-list would hardly need 
to exist at all. A pointer to using the documentation (as you have done 
here) as well as to the answer helps people get up and running faster. 
To ex-HyperTalkers it can be both a transitional advantage and a 
constraint on discovery that Rev is a superset of HC.

regards
David
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Tue Nov 26 16:34:00 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Tue Nov 26 16:34:00 2002
Subject: MAC address
In-Reply-To: <00d601c2957d$8da90470$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHEELGCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Fantastic!

> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Ken Ray
> Sent: Wednesday, 27 November 2002 5:27 AM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Re: MAC address
> 
> 
> Monte,
> 
> Take a look at this tip:
> 
> http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_env001
> 
> It has complete info on getting the MAC address on both Mac (OS 9 
> and X) and
> Windows.
> 
> Ken Ray
> Sons of Thunder Software
> Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
> To: "Rev List" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 2:23 AM
> Subject: MAC address
> 
> 
> >
> > Hi All
> >
> > Do we have access to the MAC address/Physical Address?
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Monte Goulding
> > B.App.Sc. (Hons.)
> >
> > Executive Director
> > Sweat Technologies
> >
> > email: monte at sweattechnologies.com
> > website: www.sweattechnologies.com
> > mobile (International): +61 421 138 274
> >        (Australia): 0421 138 274
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > use-revolution mailing list
> > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> >
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 


From sylvain at bouju.net  Tue Nov 26 16:36:01 2002
From: sylvain at bouju.net (Sylvain Bouju)
Date: Tue Nov 26 16:36:01 2002
Subject: Palette (How to?)...
In-Reply-To: <ECA5BAA7-0173-11D7-A2B6-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>
Message-ID: <1fma0ui.1tzstq03o26dwM%sylvain@bouju.net>

> Save it in a format that can be read by RR, means "JPG", "GIF" or "PNG".
> That's all...

Then, I can have them as (hiden) images in the stack
in order they become a local library and can be used
as icons for buttons? Or I need to keep somewhere the
original graphic files and the links to them?

Thank you!

-- 
Sylvain Bouju
sylvain at bouju.net
-- 


From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Tue Nov 26 16:47:00 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Tue Nov 26 16:47:00 2002
Subject: Palette (How to?)...
In-Reply-To: <1fma0ui.1tzstq03o26dwM%sylvain@bouju.net>
Message-ID: <D4A561D6-0187-11D7-A2B6-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Bon soir Sylvain,

>> Save it in a format that can be read by RR, means "JPG", "GIF" or 
>> "PNG".
>> That's all...

In addition you can even import images on your favourite platform
(BMP on win and PICT on a mac. No idea of the native Linux/unix
image format).

Once they are imported they are converted internally
by the engine and thus can be used on every platform, too.

> Then, I can have them as (hiden) images in the stack
> in order they become a local library and can be used
> as icons for buttons?

Yes :-)

> Or I need to keep somewhere the
> original graphic files and the links to them?

You can do that, too, but then you have to deliver these external
image-files aswell and take care to keep the filename-property 
correct...

Just remember ANY image (referenced or internal/imported) can be an 
icon.
There is NO restriction of the size of an icon.

> Thank you!

De rien :-)

> Sylvain Bouju
> sylvain at bouju.net


Regards


Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de



From alanira9 at mac.com  Tue Nov 26 18:29:01 2002
From: alanira9 at mac.com (Alan Gayne)
Date: Tue Nov 26 18:29:01 2002
Subject: Palette (How to?)...
In-Reply-To: <ECA5BAA7-0173-11D7-A2B6-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>
Message-ID: <003AE0E9-0196-11D7-9D4F-000393BB44C6@mac.com>

On Tuesday, November 26, 2002, at 02:19 PM, Klaus Major wrote:

> Bon soir Sylvain,
>
>>> You should make a button for each tool. Each button can have proper 
>>> icons
>>> for each mouse state and you can also show tooltips on mouseover.
>>
>> Thank you!
>>
>> And my second question is about how to create
>> cross platform icons, because I have not yet
>> founded any icon editor inside Revolution...
>
> Since icons are nothing else but images displayed inside buttons,
> you can (should) create icons/images with your favourite
> image-editor.
>
> Save it in a format that can be read by RR, means "JPG", "GIF" or 
> "PNG".
>
> So they are crossplatform automatically :-)
>
>
> That's all...
> C'est tout...
>
>> Sylvain Bouju
>> sylvain at bouju.net
>
> Hope this helped.
>
>
> Au revoir
>
>
> Klaus Major
> k_major at os.surf2000.de
>
> Hi Klaus,

Creating the images are not a problem - but I'm not real clear how to 
import them into my stacks.

Thanks in advance,
Alan



From mswindel at santacruz.k12.ca.us  Tue Nov 26 19:16:01 2002
From: mswindel at santacruz.k12.ca.us (Mark Swindell)
Date: Tue Nov 26 19:16:01 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <20021126204931.57842.qmail@www.boxfrog.com>
Message-ID: <BA094D47.3CCF%mswindel@santacruz.k12.ca.us>

on 11/26/02 12:49 PM, miscdas at boxfrog.com at miscdas at boxfrog.com wrote:

> Or, try using the "built-in" help; in this case the Application Tutorial.
> Step 10 describes groups and backgrounds and walks you through creating
> them. 
> 
> I don't come from any type of XTalk background.  I rarely need to venture
> outside of the information provided in the MC download to answer these types
> of rather basic questions. I'm certain better use could be made of the
> supplied resources.
> 
> miscdas 

I don't find the Rev 1.1 documentation to be particularly well implemented
or cross-referenced, unfortunately.  Many times I have "patiently" waded
through screen after screen and dead end after dead end looking for a nugget
about topic x that I know I saw a couple days prior, often to no avail.  I'm
looking forward to the new docs that will ship with 2.0.

Also, when one is used to a certain paradigm (like HyperCard), it can shape
your thinking and constrain your ability to grasp a different way of doing
things, especially from within an environment and scripting language so
overwhelmingly similar to what you're used to.

-Mark



From alanIra9 at mac.com  Tue Nov 26 20:57:00 2002
From: alanIra9 at mac.com (Alan Gayne)
Date: Tue Nov 26 20:57:00 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <BA094D47.3CCF%mswindel@santacruz.k12.ca.us>
Message-ID: <89B5F823-01AA-11D7-A4C2-000393158950@mac.com>

On Tuesday, November 26, 2002, at 07:09  PM, Mark Swindell wrote:

> Also, when one is used to a certain paradigm (like HyperCard), it can 
> shape
> your thinking and constrain your ability to grasp a different way of 
> doing
> things, especially from within an environment and scripting language so
> overwhelmingly similar to what you're used to.


Hi Mark,

I can certainly relate to how you're feeling - as I recall, I described 
it as entering a house very similar, but not exactly like your own - 
and then finding yourself in a closet when you thought you were 
entering the lavatory.

The good news is that it does get considerably easier with the help of 
the many good people on this list.  And take it from this old scripter, 
you WILL find that RunRev is immensely more powerful and versatile than 
our old friend Hypercard.

As it was pointed out to me, it's a good idea to remember that 
Revolution is a very young application, and is far ahead of where 
Hypercard was at a similar time after its introduction.  All of the 
add-on goodies you're used to with Hypercard will likely come in 
relatively short order.

So be a little patient, not only with RunRev, but with your own 
learning curve.

Good luck!

Alan



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Tue Nov 26 21:12:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Tue Nov 26 21:12:01 2002
Subject: MAC address
In-Reply-To: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHEELGCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHOELKCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

I spoke too soon

Is there any way to get it without being a superuser on OS X? Or to supply a
superuser password or something?

Thanks

Monte
>
> Fantastic!
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Ken Ray
> > Sent: Wednesday, 27 November 2002 5:27 AM
> > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > Subject: Re: MAC address
> >
> >
> > Monte,
> >
> > Take a look at this tip:
> >
> > http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_env001
> >
> > It has complete info on getting the MAC address on both Mac (OS 9
> > and X) and
> > Windows.
> >
> > Ken Ray
> > Sons of Thunder Software
> > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
> > To: "Rev List" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 2:23 AM
> > Subject: MAC address
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Hi All
> > >
> > > Do we have access to the MAC address/Physical Address?
> > >
> > > Cheers
> > >
> > > Monte Goulding
> > > B.App.Sc. (Hons.)
> > >
> > > Executive Director
> > > Sweat Technologies
> > >
> > > email: monte at sweattechnologies.com
> > > website: www.sweattechnologies.com
> > > mobile (International): +61 421 138 274
> > >        (Australia): 0421 138 274
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > use-revolution mailing list
> > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> >
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From snharper at cs.uchicago.edu  Tue Nov 26 22:28:01 2002
From: snharper at cs.uchicago.edu (sean nicholas harper)
Date: Tue Nov 26 22:28:01 2002
Subject: applescript, shell script problem
In-Reply-To: <BA094D47.3CCF%mswindel@santacruz.k12.ca.us>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211262120170.21022-100000@abyss.cs.uchicago.edu>

I have been using the applescript method of executing shell scripts to
gret effect since I learned about the trick a couple days ago.

However, I have this problem:

I keep getting errors when I try and execute a shell command that contains
quotes. What is the proper way of dealing with this?

Thanks!
Sean




From terry at discovery.nl  Tue Nov 26 23:20:01 2002
From: terry at discovery.nl (Terry Vogelaar)
Date: Tue Nov 26 23:20:01 2002
Subject: applescript, shell script problem
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211262120170.21022-100000@abyss.cs.uchicago.edu>
Message-ID: <9893EBF2-01BE-11D7-9A4E-0030656FD666@discovery.nl>

> I have been using the applescript method of executing shell scripts to
> gret effect since I learned about the trick a couple days ago.
>
> However, I have this problem:
>
> I keep getting errors when I try and execute a shell command that 
> contains
> quotes. What is the proper way of dealing with this?

It is not a problem restricted to AppleScript, but there's a good way 
to deal with it. A quote ends the string in Transcript. So if you write:
ask "What do you mean with "OK"?"
it sees OK as a part that needs to be executed, because the string 
ended with the second quote in the line.

Solution: replace every quote that needs to be part of the string like 
this:
ask "What do you mean with " & quote & "OK" & quote & "?"
(or use 'single quotes' when possible)

Terry



From dsc at swcp.com  Tue Nov 26 23:34:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Tue Nov 26 23:34:01 2002
Subject: applescript, shell script problem
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.44.0211262120170.21022-100000@abyss.cs.uchicago.edu>
Message-ID: <A0EB7216-01C0-11D7-9C2D-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Tuesday, November 26, 2002, at 08:22 PM, sean nicholas harper wrote:

> I keep getting errors when I try and execute a shell command that 
> contains
> quotes. What is the proper way of dealing with this?

function shellSH cmd
   -- Sorry, no quote marks in cmd in this version
   -- Uses sh; use full path in command
   -- And shellCommand is ignored
   put "do shell script" & quote & cmd & quote into s
   do s as AppleScript
   put result() into r
   replace numToChar(13) with linefeed in r
   return r
end shellSH

Is this the one you mean?

Look at this line:
put "do shell script" & quote & cmd & quote into s

This will create an AppleScript command like this:
do shell script "ping 127.0.0.1"

If you want to execute a command like this:
transmorgrify "Dar Scott"

It will become this AppleScript command:
do shell script "transmorgrify "Dar Scott""

...with the quotes in all the wrong places.

The quotes you pass to the shellSH function need to be quoted 
AppleScript style.  (Or we need a smarter function.)

I just tried a wild guess.  Try this:

function shellSH cmd
   -- The shellCommand is ignored.
   -- A full path is required.
   replace quote with "\"&quote in cmd
   put "do shell script" & quote & cmd & quote into s
   do s as AppleScript
   put result() into r
   replace numToChar(13) with linefeed in r
   return r
end shellSH

It worked on a quick experiment.  It seems the back slash will quote a 
quote.

Dar Scott





From curry at kagi.com  Tue Nov 26 23:51:01 2002
From: curry at kagi.com (curry)
Date: Tue Nov 26 23:51:01 2002
Subject: Not getting digest email (Ken Norris (dialup))
In-Reply-To: <200211270329.WAA05613@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211270329.WAA05613@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <a05111b00ba09fd1a59d2@[68.34.213.220]>

Ken, do you have a new spam filter on your system or ISP/network? 
Spam assassin gives this digest a pretty high rating sometimes.

Curry



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Wed Nov 27 00:33:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Wed Nov 27 00:33:01 2002
Subject: MAC address
References: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHOELKCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <012701c295d4$ed4124b0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Monte,

You should be able to use "sudo" before issuing the command, as in:

  sudo /sbin/ifconfig en0

Hope this helps,

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



----- Original Message -----
From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 8:05 PM
Subject: RE: MAC address


> I spoke too soon
>
> Is there any way to get it without being a superuser on OS X? Or to supply
a
> superuser password or something?
>
> Thanks
>
> Monte
> >
> > Fantastic!
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> > > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Ken Ray
> > > Sent: Wednesday, 27 November 2002 5:27 AM
> > > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > Subject: Re: MAC address
> > >
> > >
> > > Monte,
> > >
> > > Take a look at this tip:
> > >
> > > http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_env001
> > >
> > > It has complete info on getting the MAC address on both Mac (OS 9
> > > and X) and
> > > Windows.
> > >
> > > Ken Ray
> > > Sons of Thunder Software
> > > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> > > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
> > > To: "Rev List" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 2:23 AM
> > > Subject: MAC address
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Hi All
> > > >
> > > > Do we have access to the MAC address/Physical Address?
> > > >
> > > > Cheers
> > > >
> > > > Monte Goulding
> > > > B.App.Sc. (Hons.)
> > > >
> > > > Executive Director
> > > > Sweat Technologies
> > > >
> > > > email: monte at sweattechnologies.com
> > > > website: www.sweattechnologies.com
> > > > mobile (International): +61 421 138 274
> > > >        (Australia): 0421 138 274
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > use-revolution mailing list
> > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From lambertt at unimelb.edu.au  Wed Nov 27 01:39:01 2002
From: lambertt at unimelb.edu.au (Tim Lambert)
Date: Wed Nov 27 01:39:01 2002
Subject: Charting with Revolution
Message-ID: <1BB9BCF8-01D2-11D7-8003-000393A333E0@unimelb.edu.au>

Is there any way of doing a variety of charts in Rev?  With a plugin 
whatever?

Thanks



From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Wed Nov 27 02:28:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Wed Nov 27 02:28:01 2002
Subject: Charting with Revolution
In-Reply-To: <1BB9BCF8-01D2-11D7-8003-000393A333E0@unimelb.edu.au>
References: <1BB9BCF8-01D2-11D7-8003-000393A333E0@unimelb.edu.au>
Message-ID: <p05100300ba0a21efdecb@[10.0.1.202]>

>Is there any way of doing a variety of charts in Rev?  With a plugin whatever?
>
>Thanks
>


look in the users contribution of the rev website : Graph object.rev

Hope this helps.
-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From dwilk at bradfork.co.uk  Wed Nov 27 03:57:00 2002
From: dwilk at bradfork.co.uk (David Wilkinson)
Date: Wed Nov 27 03:57:00 2002
Subject: File Open Error: Illegal File Name Character " " in xyz.rev 
Message-ID: <E18GeaY-0006eJ-00@iffley.bradcomp.co.uk>

Just a thought

File naming has been a topic before in this list but it would appear 
that if you want your stacks to work seamlessly on 'nix, (not that 
anyone does of course!)  it would be wise to avoid spaces in stack 
file names.  

The db demo included with Rev and Rob Cozens' impressive SDB stacks 
both refuse to run on my Linux box because of the above error.   If 
we are serious about cross-platform development,  we will need to 
work with the lowest common denominator between systems.   For the 
same reason,  if we use applescript to achieve something, it might 
be wiser to find another way round and/or submit a request for the 
absent but required functionality to the list??  

My problem is that I am not creative enough to use a Mac!





From heather.williams11 at btinternet.com  Wed Nov 27 04:49:01 2002
From: heather.williams11 at btinternet.com (Heather Williams)
Date: Wed Nov 27 04:49:01 2002
Subject: not getting digests
In-Reply-To: <200211270329.WAA05613@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA0A3FCA.9D8E%heather.williams11@btinternet.com>

> Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 09:20:10 -0800
> Subject: Not getting digest email
> From: "Ken Norris (dialup)" <pixelbird at interisland.net>
> To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> 
> Hello RR list,
> 
> I'm used to getting 2 or more digest versions of this list daily, but
> Ihaven' received anything since Sunday morning. Either things are really
> slow or else there's a problem.
> 
> Any response?
> 
> Best regards,
> Ken N.

We are having a small problem at the moment. A smallish percentage of our
users are being affected by an incorrect blacklisting of our IP address by
SPEWS, an anti spam organisation. Apparently, this organisation takes it
upon itself to blacklist not only IP addresses that are sending spam, but
also all neighbouring, innocent IP addresses, and in some cases entire
ISP's. A number of reputable ISP's then use this blacklist to block all
email from those addresses. Your ISP is probably one of them. Unfortunately,
SPEWS is uncontactable, unresponsive, and as far as I can tell, actively
does not want to remove innocent businesses from their blacklisting, since
it relies on us to complain to our ISP's and get the spam operations shut
down. We are attempting to do this. How long it will take and how successful
we will be, I do not know.

In the meantime, all I can suggest is that you contact me directly if you
have specific enquiries about Revolution, and I can respond through my
backup email address. You can reach the digests online, from the archives,
or at 

http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com

For a searchable list.

My apologies for this very annoying interruption to our usual service.

Regards,

Heather




From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Wed Nov 27 07:06:05 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Wed Nov 27 07:06:05 2002
Subject: Palette (How to?)...
In-Reply-To: <003AE0E9-0196-11D7-9D4F-000393BB44C6@mac.com>
Message-ID: <D00F4EFC-01FF-11D7-846E-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Hi Alan,

>> Hi Klaus,
>
> Creating the images are not a problem - but I'm not real clear how to 
> import them into my stacks.

There are 2 ways to do this (and 50 ways to leave your lover ;-)

1. Choose the image-tool (bottomleft) in the tool-palette and create
an (at first empty) image-object.
Now you will have to link (reference) it to a file in the 
properties-palette
on the tab "Image" ("Link to file").
NO copy of the image will be imported into your stack.
If you move, delete or rename the referenced image-file, it will
NOT show up in your stack

2. Menu: File -> Import as control -> Image...
This way you can browse your harddisk/cd, select an image and
a COPY of that image will be imported into your stack.
Now you could even delete the original image-file...

Hope this helps.

> Thanks in advance,
> Alan

Regards


Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de



From alanira9 at mac.com  Wed Nov 27 07:20:01 2002
From: alanira9 at mac.com (Alan Gayne)
Date: Wed Nov 27 07:20:01 2002
Subject: Palette (How to?)...
In-Reply-To: <D00F4EFC-01FF-11D7-846E-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>
Message-ID: <A90704CE-0201-11D7-9D4F-000393BB44C6@mac.com>

Thanks  Klaus

I hope to have a chance to try out these techniques sometime over the 
weekend.

I'll let you know how I make out.

Regards,
Alan
On Wednesday, November 27, 2002, at 07:00 AM, Klaus Major wrote:

> Hi Alan,
>
>>> Hi Klaus,
>>
>> Creating the images are not a problem - but I'm not real clear how to 
>> import them into my stacks.
>
> There are 2 ways to do this (and 50 ways to leave your lover ;-)
>
> 1. Choose the image-tool (bottomleft) in the tool-palette and create
> an (at first empty) image-object.
> Now you will have to link (reference) it to a file in the 
> properties-palette
> on the tab "Image" ("Link to file").
> NO copy of the image will be imported into your stack.
> If you move, delete or rename the referenced image-file, it will
> NOT show up in your stack
>
> 2. Menu: File -> Import as control -> Image...
> This way you can browse your harddisk/cd, select an image and
> a COPY of that image will be imported into your stack.
> Now you could even delete the original image-file...
>
> Hope this helps.
>
>> Thanks in advance,
>> Alan
>
> Regards
>
>
> Klaus Major
> k_major at os.surf2000.de
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Wed Nov 27 08:36:00 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Wed Nov 27 08:36:00 2002
Subject: logical time/date operators?
Message-ID: <a05200a05ba0a783d1c64@[68.129.23.11]>

hello:  i want to compare time and date information to determine 
whether a certain time/date falls within a certain time/date window. 
apparently, this doesn't work with the > or < operators (at least i 
cannot get that to work).  will i have to write my own function, is 
there something built in RR, or does someone have a solution to 
share?  thanks!  olli.


From k_major at os.surf2000.de  Wed Nov 27 09:13:01 2002
From: k_major at os.surf2000.de (Klaus Major)
Date: Wed Nov 27 09:13:01 2002
Subject: logical time/date operators?
In-Reply-To: <a05200a05ba0a783d1c64@[68.129.23.11]>
Message-ID: <94C14D14-0211-11D7-846E-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>

Hi Oliver,

> hello:  i want to compare time and date information to determine 
> whether a certain time/date falls within a certain time/date window. 
> apparently, this doesn't work with the > or < operators (at least i 
> cannot get that to work).  will i have to write my own function, is 
> there something built in RR, or does someone have a solution to share? 
>  thanks!  olli.

a good idea (i use it, so it must be a good idea ;-) is to convert 
dates to seconds
and then do the comparison. So you can even add/subtract half a day 
etc...

Try it, it might work for you, too :-)

Hope that helps.


Regards

Klaus Major
k_major at os.surf2000.de



From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Wed Nov 27 09:49:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Wed Nov 27 09:49:01 2002
Subject: logical time/date operators?
In-Reply-To: <94C14D14-0211-11D7-846E-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>
References: <94C14D14-0211-11D7-846E-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>
Message-ID: <a05200a00ba0a871ae69b@[128.196.99.210]>

hello Klaus: thanks for this great idea -- i'll give this a try!  best, olli.



11/27/02, Klaus Major wrote:

>Hi Oliver,
>
>>  hello:  i want to compare time and date information to determine 
>>whether a certain time/date falls within a certain time/date 
>>window. apparently, this doesn't work with the > or < operators (at 
>>least i cannot get that to work).  will i have to write my own 
>>function, is there something built in RR, or does someone have a 
>>solution to share?  thanks!  olli.
>
>a good idea (i use it, so it must be a good idea ;-) is to convert 
>dates to seconds
>and then do the comparison. So you can even add/subtract half a day etc...
>
>Try it, it might work for you, too :-)
>
>Hope that helps.
>
>
>Regards
>
>Klaus Major
>k_major at os.surf2000.de
>
>_______________________________________________
>use-revolution mailing list
>use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Wed Nov 27 11:28:00 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Wed Nov 27 11:28:00 2002
Subject: Quit on Mac OS X
Message-ID: <p05100300ba0a92d22169@[10.0.1.203]>

Hi,


I've made a Standalone from an app on Mac OS X with Rev 1.1.1



I have a menu "fichier" (= file in english)
The last item is "Quitter" (= quit in english)

When the user selects "fichier-> quitter" the app performs some work 
before quitting

But in Mac OS X, you have a new Menu at the left of the file menu. 
There is also an item "quit" at the end of this menu.
So if the user chooses this way to quit the program, the work before 
quitting is not executed.

How can I know that the user has choose one or other menu to quit ?

Thanks.
-- 
yves copp?


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 27 11:31:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 27 11:31:01 2002
Subject: File Open Error: Illegal File Name Character " " in xyz.rev
In-Reply-To: <E18GeaY-0006eJ-00@iffley.bradcomp.co.uk>
References: <E18GeaY-0006eJ-00@iffley.bradcomp.co.uk>
Message-ID: <a05100300ba0a98d74b50@[216.229.107.153]>

>The db demo included with Rev and Rob Cozens' impressive SDB stacks
>both refuse to run on my Linux box because of the above error.

Thanks for the "heads up", David.

It will be changed in the next Library Update.

Am I correct that this restriction applies only to the mainstack 
stack file names?  In other words, it's OK to set a stack's name or 
label to "Serendipity Library" so long as the stack resides in a file 
named "Serendipity_Library.rev"?  And by extension, spaces are OK in 
substack names so long as they are not saved externally from the 
mainstack?

David, et al:  I'm still in the process of learning the realities of 
multi-platform distribution.  It is my goal that Serendipity Library 
work seamlessly for both Run Rev & MetaCard on all supported 
platforms.  I will respond to any issues along this line...just let 
me know where the problems are.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 27 11:31:22 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 27 11:31:22 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <BA094D47.3CCF%mswindel@santacruz.k12.ca.us>
References: <BA094D47.3CCF%mswindel@santacruz.k12.ca.us>
Message-ID: <a05100301ba0a9bd8002a@[216.229.107.153]>

>I don't find the Rev 1.1 documentation to be particularly well implemented
>or cross-referenced, unfortunately.  Many times I have "patiently" waded
>through screen after screen and dead end after dead end looking for a nugget
>about topic x that I know I saw a couple days prior, often to no avail.

Hi Mark,

The most fruitful approach I've found is to select "Revolution 
Documentation" from the "Help" menu, go to the roadmap if not already 
there, and select "Transcript Language Dictionary".  Note the window 
contents you get are different from what you see if you select 
"Transcript Dictionary" directly from the Help menu.

Check out the "Show" and "Filter With" buttons.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 27 11:31:43 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 27 11:31:43 2002
Subject: logical time/date operators?
In-Reply-To: <94C14D14-0211-11D7-846E-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>
References: <94C14D14-0211-11D7-846E-000A27B49A96@os.surf2000.de>
Message-ID: <a05100302ba0a9d43554c@[216.229.107.153]>

>a good idea (i use it, so it must be a good idea ;-) is to convert 
>dates to seconds
>and then do the comparison. So you can even add/subtract half a day etc...

Hi Oliver,

The use of seconds is handy, as Klaus suggested, if one needs to 
add/subtract from the original date/time.

If that isn't necessary, dateItems format works also, and has the 
advantage that one can determine the actual date/time just by looking 
at it.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From harrison at all-auctions.com  Wed Nov 27 11:58:00 2002
From: harrison at all-auctions.com (Rick Harrison)
Date: Wed Nov 27 11:58:00 2002
Subject: Quit on Mac OS X
In-Reply-To: <p05100300ba0a92d22169@[10.0.1.203]>
Message-ID: <BA0A626D.204C%harrison@all-auctions.com>

I had this same problem as does probably a lot of others
on the list.

In my case there were only 2 times when it was critical to
know which quit happened to update my preference files for
the user.  That happened to be on the very first run of
the program and at registration time.  The solution for
me was to force my own "File Quit" if the user was doing
any of these two processes.  The rest of the time it didn't
matter at all for my particular application.

The only other work around for me would have been to eliminate
my own "File Quit" and to do my updating long before the use
ever quit my application.

Hope this helps!

Rick Harrison



From rcozens at pon.net  Wed Nov 27 12:14:02 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Wed Nov 27 12:14:02 2002
Subject: General Lists vs Special Lists
Message-ID: <a05100301ba0aa79cc3c6@[216.229.107.140]>

"Understanding is the booby prize": A lesson relearned...hopefully for good:

You were all kind enough to leave the chastising of me to me and let 
the matter drop; however I found my remarks so out of my idea of my 
character that I had to keep searching for some lesson or meaning.

I recalled an incident on the HyperCard mailing List over four years 
ago, and immediately felt the same feeling of apologetic 
embarrassment.  The person I found it necessary to grovel before 
publicly at that time had committed the sin of having their message 
in my eMail queue just after one of the last messages posted to the 
List by a new member who WAS unrepentingly & continually 
confrontational, just before he was removed from the list.

I recall writing "I had just worked up a head of steam replying to 
..., and I should have taken a deep breath and counted to 10 before 
responding to you."

I thought that lesson would last me a lifetime; but obviously I 
needed a reminder.  Sorry it came at Erik & miscdas' expense; 
hopefully it may save some of you the need to learn this by 
experience.
-- 

Rob


From yvescoppe at skynet.be  Wed Nov 27 12:47:01 2002
From: yvescoppe at skynet.be (yves COPPE)
Date: Wed Nov 27 12:47:01 2002
Subject: Quit on Mac OS X
In-Reply-To: <BA0A626D.204C%harrison@all-auctions.com>
References: <BA0A626D.204C%harrison@all-auctions.com>
Message-ID: <p05100300ba0ab3a39418@[10.0.1.202]>

>I had this same problem as does probably a lot of others
>on the list.
>
>In my case there were only 2 times when it was critical to
>know which quit happened to update my preference files for
>the user.  That happened to be on the very first run of
>the program and at registration time.  The solution for
>me was to force my own "File Quit" if the user was doing
>any of these two processes.  The rest of the time it didn't
>matter at all for my particular application.
>
>The only other work around for me would have been to eliminate
>my own "File Quit" and to do my updating long before the use
>ever quit my application.
>
>Hope this helps!


I understand your way but have still a question :

which message is sent to the engine when the user "quit" using the 
app Menu of Mac OS X ?

So I could write a script :

something like :
on quit
    dostuff
edn quit

whatever the user chooses to quit (file menu or app menu). So I 
ccould suppress the quit menu in the file menu.

thanks.

-- 
Greetings.

Yves COPPE

Email : yvescoppe at skynet.be


From mswindel at santacruz.k12.ca.us  Wed Nov 27 14:46:01 2002
From: mswindel at santacruz.k12.ca.us (Mark Swindell)
Date: Wed Nov 27 14:46:01 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba0a9bd8002a@[216.229.107.153]>
Message-ID: <BA0A5F65.3CE6%mswindel@santacruz.k12.ca.us>

on 11/27/02 8:02 AM, Rob Cozens at rcozens at pon.net wrote:

> Hi Mark,
> 
> The most fruitful approach I've found is to select "Revolution
> Documentation" from the "Help" menu, go to the roadmap if not already
> there, and select "Transcript Language Dictionary".  Note the window
> contents you get are different from what you see if you select
> "Transcript Dictionary" directly from the Help menu.
> 
> Check out the "Show" and "Filter With" buttons.


Thanks, Rob.  What you described is pretty much what I do... I'm not
complaining with my comments, as I know the issues are being addressed.  I'm
looking forward to seeing the new documentation setup, and of (probably)
purchasing the print manual.  I'm not a great fan of hypertext manuals as a
sole source of info... for one thing my monitor keeps falling off my belly
when I lay down on the couch to browse around the docs a bit.

Mark



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Wed Nov 27 16:37:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Wed Nov 27 16:37:01 2002
Subject: MAC address
In-Reply-To: <012701c295d4$ed4124b0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHEEMACLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Hi Ken

Can you tell me more because I get a usage report with
put shell("sudo /sbin/ifconfig en0")

Cheers

Monte

> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Ken Ray
> Sent: Wednesday, 27 November 2002 3:52 PM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Re: MAC address
>
>
> Monte,
>
> You should be able to use "sudo" before issuing the command, as in:
>
>   sudo /sbin/ifconfig en0
>
> Hope this helps,
>
> Ken Ray
> Sons of Thunder Software
> Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
> To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 8:05 PM
> Subject: RE: MAC address
>
>
> > I spoke too soon
> >
> > Is there any way to get it without being a superuser on OS X?
> Or to supply
> a
> > superuser password or something?
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Monte
> > >
> > > Fantastic!
> > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> > > > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Ken Ray
> > > > Sent: Wednesday, 27 November 2002 5:27 AM
> > > > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > Subject: Re: MAC address
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Monte,
> > > >
> > > > Take a look at this tip:
> > > >
> > > > http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_env001
> > > >
> > > > It has complete info on getting the MAC address on both Mac (OS 9
> > > > and X) and
> > > > Windows.
> > > >
> > > > Ken Ray
> > > > Sons of Thunder Software
> > > > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> > > > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
> > > > To: "Rev List" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 2:23 AM
> > > > Subject: MAC address
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Hi All
> > > > >
> > > > > Do we have access to the MAC address/Physical Address?
> > > > >
> > > > > Cheers
> > > > >
> > > > > Monte Goulding
> > > > > B.App.Sc. (Hons.)
> > > > >
> > > > > Executive Director
> > > > > Sweat Technologies
> > > > >
> > > > > email: monte at sweattechnologies.com
> > > > > website: www.sweattechnologies.com
> > > > > mobile (International): +61 421 138 274
> > > > >        (Australia): 0421 138 274
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > use-revolution mailing list
> > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Wed Nov 27 17:26:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Wed Nov 27 17:26:01 2002
Subject: MAC address
References: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHEEMACLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <01a101c29662$2241e360$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Hmm... it appears to not work consistently (I tried it on an iMac at work
and got a password prompt). I don't know if you can pass the password along
with 'sudo' to get it to work. Does anyone have an idea on this?

BTW Monte, what do you get back if you just issue:

  /sbin/ifconfig en0

???

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 27, 2002 3:31 PM
Subject: RE: MAC address


> Hi Ken
>
> Can you tell me more because I get a usage report with
> put shell("sudo /sbin/ifconfig en0")
>
> Cheers
>
> Monte
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Ken Ray
> > Sent: Wednesday, 27 November 2002 3:52 PM
> > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > Subject: Re: MAC address
> >
> >
> > Monte,
> >
> > You should be able to use "sudo" before issuing the command, as in:
> >
> >   sudo /sbin/ifconfig en0
> >
> > Hope this helps,
> >
> > Ken Ray
> > Sons of Thunder Software
> > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
> > To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 8:05 PM
> > Subject: RE: MAC address
> >
> >
> > > I spoke too soon
> > >
> > > Is there any way to get it without being a superuser on OS X?
> > Or to supply
> > a
> > > superuser password or something?
> > >
> > > Thanks
> > >
> > > Monte
> > > >
> > > > Fantastic!
> > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Ken Ray
> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, 27 November 2002 5:27 AM
> > > > > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > Subject: Re: MAC address
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Monte,
> > > > >
> > > > > Take a look at this tip:
> > > > >
> > > > >
http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_env001
> > > > >
> > > > > It has complete info on getting the MAC address on both Mac (OS 9
> > > > > and X) and
> > > > > Windows.
> > > > >
> > > > > Ken Ray
> > > > > Sons of Thunder Software
> > > > > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> > > > > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> > > > >
> > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
> > > > > To: "Rev List" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 2:23 AM
> > > > > Subject: MAC address
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Hi All
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Do we have access to the MAC address/Physical Address?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Cheers
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Monte Goulding
> > > > > > B.App.Sc. (Hons.)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Executive Director
> > > > > > Sweat Technologies
> > > > > >
> > > > > > email: monte at sweattechnologies.com
> > > > > > website: www.sweattechnologies.com
> > > > > > mobile (International): +61 421 138 274
> > > > > >        (Australia): 0421 138 274
> > > > > >
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > use-revolution mailing list
> > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Wed Nov 27 17:38:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Wed Nov 27 17:38:01 2002
Subject: MAC address
In-Reply-To: <01a101c29662$2241e360$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHCEMBCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>


>
>
> Hmm... it appears to not work consistently (I tried it on an iMac at work
> and got a password prompt). I don't know if you can pass the
> password along
> with 'sudo' to get it to work. Does anyone have an idea on this?
>
> BTW Monte, what do you get back if you just issue:

I get the correct MAC address, however, my client said that they will not
accept it if the user must be logged in as a superuser. So far I've said
I'll find out but at the worst case they may need to get their C programmer
to write an external.

I also get a password prompt returned. I was living in hope that it might
display the standard password dialog.
>
>   /sbin/ifconfig en0
>
> ???
>
> Ken Ray
> Sons of Thunder Software
> Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
> To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 27, 2002 3:31 PM
> Subject: RE: MAC address
>
>
> > Hi Ken
> >
> > Can you tell me more because I get a usage report with
> > put shell("sudo /sbin/ifconfig en0")
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Monte
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> > > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Ken Ray
> > > Sent: Wednesday, 27 November 2002 3:52 PM
> > > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > Subject: Re: MAC address
> > >
> > >
> > > Monte,
> > >
> > > You should be able to use "sudo" before issuing the command, as in:
> > >
> > >   sudo /sbin/ifconfig en0
> > >
> > > Hope this helps,
> > >
> > > Ken Ray
> > > Sons of Thunder Software
> > > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> > > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
> > > To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 8:05 PM
> > > Subject: RE: MAC address
> > >
> > >
> > > > I spoke too soon
> > > >
> > > > Is there any way to get it without being a superuser on OS X?
> > > Or to supply
> > > a
> > > > superuser password or something?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks
> > > >
> > > > Monte
> > > > >
> > > > > Fantastic!
> > > > >
> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf
> Of Ken Ray
> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, 27 November 2002 5:27 AM
> > > > > > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > > Subject: Re: MAC address
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Monte,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Take a look at this tip:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_env001
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It has complete info on getting the MAC address on both
> Mac (OS 9
> > > > > > and X) and
> > > > > > Windows.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Ken Ray
> > > > > > Sons of Thunder Software
> > > > > > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> > > > > > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
> > > > > > To: "Rev List" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 2:23 AM
> > > > > > Subject: MAC address
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hi All
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Do we have access to the MAC address/Physical Address?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Cheers
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Monte Goulding
> > > > > > > B.App.Sc. (Hons.)
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Executive Director
> > > > > > > Sweat Technologies
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > email: monte at sweattechnologies.com
> > > > > > > website: www.sweattechnologies.com
> > > > > > > mobile (International): +61 421 138 274
> > > > > > >        (Australia): 0421 138 274
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > use-revolution mailing list
> > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Wed Nov 27 17:49:01 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Wed Nov 27 17:49:01 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba0a9bd8002a@[216.229.107.153]>
Message-ID: <BA0A8A66.20A79%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

> I don't find the Rev 1.1 documentation to be particularly well implemented
> or cross-referenced, unfortunately.  Many times I have "patiently" waded
> through screen after screen and dead end after dead end looking for a nugget
> about topic x that I know I saw a couple days prior, often to no avail.

The difficulty of the "unlearning" process is a common challege when moving
between laguages, perhaps especially compounded with such similar dialects
as HyperTalk and Transcript, close as they are yet so different.

Having made this jouney between a half-dozen or so xTalks, for myself I've
found starting with properties as perhaps the most useful point of entry
into documentation when looking for a way to implement something.
Abstractly, so much of xTalk scripting is setting properties; the range of
properties available to an object will often tell you what you need to solve
a UI issue.

So when I first started learning MetaCard I wrote a property sheet utility,
which (like VB, ToolBook, and others) provides an overview of nearly all
properties for the selected object (or card, or stack, and it lists global
props as well).  It also provides a quick way to edit values:  just
double-click a line and an editor appropriate to the data type opens (color
picker for colors, answer for Booleans, etc.).

I've made this available to a few friends and clients, and just recently did
some more debugging and posted the latest version to my site:

<http://www.fourthworld.com/rev/>

I hope you find it helpful for learning about properties in Rev.

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.1: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From herve.proudhon at medecine.univ-mrs.fr  Wed Nov 27 17:50:00 2002
From: herve.proudhon at medecine.univ-mrs.fr (Herve Proudhon)
Date: Wed Nov 27 17:50:00 2002
Subject: Quit on MacosX
In-Reply-To: <200211271701.MAA20753@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <6CE1BE43-0259-11D7-A957-000393862BF2@medecine.univ-mrs.fr>

> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 11:52:13 -0500
> Subject: Re: Quit on Mac OS X
> From: Rick Harrison <harrison at all-auctions.com>
> To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
>
> I had this same problem as does probably a lot of others
> on the list.
>
> In my case there were only 2 times when it was critical to
> know which quit happened to update my preference files for
> the user.  That happened to be on the very first run of
> the program and at registration time.  The solution for
> me was to force my own "File Quit" if the user was doing
> any of these two processes.  The rest of the time it didn't
> matter at all for my particular application.
>
> The only other work around for me would have been to eliminate
> my own "File Quit" and to do my updating long before the use
> ever quit my application.
>
> Hope this helps!
>
> Rick Harrison
>
The only possibility I know is to trap the corresponding AppleEvent :

on AppleEvent the_Class,the_ID,the_Sender

   if the_ID = "quit" then
     do_whatever_you_wish
     quit
   else
     pass appleEvent
   end if

end AppleEvent

Regards

Herve Proudhon

----------------------
Diondine, logiciel de di?t?tique
http://www.diondine.com


From dsc at swcp.com  Wed Nov 27 17:59:00 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Wed Nov 27 17:59:00 2002
Subject: MAC address
In-Reply-To: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHCEMBCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <ECE15918-025A-11D7-A12A-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Wednesday, November 27, 2002, at 03:32 PM, Monte Goulding wrote:

> I get the correct MAC address, however, my client said that they will 
> not
> accept it if the user must be logged in as a superuser. So far I've said
> I'll find out but at the worst case they may need to get their C 
> programmer
> to write an external.

That shell workaround for Revolution 1.1.1 on OS X seems to work for 
me.  Well, that doesn't mean much; I can type it it at the terminal, too.

How come this works for me?  Whatever my system has maybe you want.

Dar Scott



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Wed Nov 27 18:06:00 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Wed Nov 27 18:06:00 2002
Subject: MAC address
In-Reply-To: <01a101c29662$2241e360$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHCEMCCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Hey are you sure you need to be logged in as a superuser. I just created a
new user without admin privileges and it works fine. It even works just as:
ifconfig en0 on OS X.2. I'm not quite up with X so perhaps ther is some
other definition of superuser that I don't know?????

Could we have a group test to put my mind at ease please. If anyone with Rev
2.0 or MC 2.3.4 could login as a user without admin privileges create a
stack with:

on mouseUp
  put shell("ifconfig en0")
end mouseUp

In a button script (for some reason you can't just use the message box).
Perhaps you could email reports to monte at sweattechnologies.com and I'll send
a summary to the list.
>
> Hmm... it appears to not work consistently (I tried it on an iMac at work
> and got a password prompt). I don't know if you can pass the
> password along
> with 'sudo' to get it to work. Does anyone have an idea on this?
>
> BTW Monte, what do you get back if you just issue:
>
>   /sbin/ifconfig en0
>
> ???
>
> Ken Ray
> Sons of Thunder Software
> Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
> To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 27, 2002 3:31 PM
> Subject: RE: MAC address
>
>
> > Hi Ken
> >
> > Can you tell me more because I get a usage report with
> > put shell("sudo /sbin/ifconfig en0")
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Monte
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> > > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Ken Ray
> > > Sent: Wednesday, 27 November 2002 3:52 PM
> > > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > Subject: Re: MAC address
> > >
> > >
> > > Monte,
> > >
> > > You should be able to use "sudo" before issuing the command, as in:
> > >
> > >   sudo /sbin/ifconfig en0
> > >
> > > Hope this helps,
> > >
> > > Ken Ray
> > > Sons of Thunder Software
> > > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> > > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
> > > To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 8:05 PM
> > > Subject: RE: MAC address
> > >
> > >
> > > > I spoke too soon
> > > >
> > > > Is there any way to get it without being a superuser on OS X?
> > > Or to supply
> > > a
> > > > superuser password or something?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks
> > > >
> > > > Monte
> > > > >
> > > > > Fantastic!
> > > > >
> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > > [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf
> Of Ken Ray
> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, 27 November 2002 5:27 AM
> > > > > > To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > > Subject: Re: MAC address
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Monte,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Take a look at this tip:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> http://www.sonsothunder.com/devres/revolution/revolution.htm?_env001
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It has complete info on getting the MAC address on both
> Mac (OS 9
> > > > > > and X) and
> > > > > > Windows.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Ken Ray
> > > > > > Sons of Thunder Software
> > > > > > Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> > > > > > Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > From: "Monte Goulding" <monte at sweattechnologies.com>
> > > > > > To: "Rev List" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 2:23 AM
> > > > > > Subject: MAC address
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hi All
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Do we have access to the MAC address/Physical Address?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Cheers
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Monte Goulding
> > > > > > > B.App.Sc. (Hons.)
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Executive Director
> > > > > > > Sweat Technologies
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > email: monte at sweattechnologies.com
> > > > > > > website: www.sweattechnologies.com
> > > > > > > mobile (International): +61 421 138 274
> > > > > > >        (Australia): 0421 138 274
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > use-revolution mailing list
> > > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > use-revolution mailing list
> > use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From chipp at chipp.com  Wed Nov 27 18:10:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Wed Nov 27 18:10:01 2002
Subject: not getting digests
In-Reply-To: <BA0A3FCA.9D8E%heather.williams11@btinternet.com>
Message-ID: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAMENNCOAA.chipp@chipp.com>

If you are not getting your RR list because of a blacklist problem aka
Spews, you can contact your mailserver ISP and request they quit using
Spews. There are a number of effective anti-spam client controls including
bayesian filters and Cloudmark's Spamnet. These blacklists are as bad as the
spammers and you *should* protest. There's no telling *how* much vital email
you're missing.

-Chipp

> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Heather
> Williams
> Sent: Wednesday, November 27, 2002 3:24 AM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Cc: pixelbird at interisland.net
> Subject: Re: not getting digests
>
>
> > Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 09:20:10 -0800
> > Subject: Not getting digest email
> > From: "Ken Norris (dialup)" <pixelbird at interisland.net>
> > To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> > Reply-To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> >
> > Hello RR list,
> >
> > I'm used to getting 2 or more digest versions of this list daily, but
> > Ihaven' received anything since Sunday morning. Either things are really
> > slow or else there's a problem.
> >
> > Any response?
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Ken N.
>
> We are having a small problem at the moment. A smallish percentage of our
> users are being affected by an incorrect blacklisting of our IP address by
> SPEWS, an anti spam organisation. Apparently, this organisation takes it
> upon itself to blacklist not only IP addresses that are sending spam, but
> also all neighbouring, innocent IP addresses, and in some cases entire
> ISP's. A number of reputable ISP's then use this blacklist to block all
> email from those addresses. Your ISP is probably one of them.
> Unfortunately,
> SPEWS is uncontactable, unresponsive, and as far as I can tell, actively
> does not want to remove innocent businesses from their blacklisting, since
> it relies on us to complain to our ISP's and get the spam operations shut
> down. We are attempting to do this. How long it will take and how
> successful
> we will be, I do not know.
>
> In the meantime, all I can suggest is that you contact me directly if you
> have specific enquiries about Revolution, and I can respond through my
> backup email address. You can reach the digests online, from the archives,
> or at
>
> http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=site:lists.runrev.com
>
> For a searchable list.
>
> My apologies for this very annoying interruption to our usual service.
>
> Regards,
>
> Heather
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Wed Nov 27 18:15:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Wed Nov 27 18:15:01 2002
Subject: MAC address
In-Reply-To: <ECE15918-025A-11D7-A12A-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHIEMCCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

>
> That shell workaround for Revolution 1.1.1 on OS X seems to work for
> me.  Well, that doesn't mean much; I can type it it at the terminal, too.
>
> How come this works for me?  Whatever my system has maybe you want.
>
It seems the script that Ken has on his site states a superuser requirement
that may or may not be necessary. That the only point of contention at this
stage. It seems to work perfectly well and even as a a non superuser. The
only thing now is to get a comment from Ken as to why the script has the
requirement.

Thanks for everyone's help (particularly Ken)

Cheers

Monte



From mdswindell at charter.net  Wed Nov 27 19:50:01 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Wed Nov 27 19:50:01 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <BA0A8A66.20A79%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <BA0AA6C7.3C36%mdswindell@charter.net>

on 11/27/02 2:42 PM, Richard Gaskin at ambassador at fourthworld.com wrote:

> So when I first started learning MetaCard I wrote a property sheet utility,
> which (like VB, ToolBook, and others) provides an overview of nearly all
> properties for the selected object (or card, or stack, and it lists global
> props as well).  It also provides a quick way to edit values:  just
> double-click a line and an editor appropriate to the data type opens (color
> picker for colors, answer for Booleans, etc.).
> 
> I've made this available to a few friends and clients, and just recently did
> some more debugging and posted the latest version to my site:
> 
> <http://www.fourthworld.com/rev/>
> 
> I hope you find it helpful for learning about properties in Rev.

Richard,

What a great tool.  In literally less than two minutes after downloading it
I had gleaned a great deal about the properties of stacks, groups, buttons,
you name it.   Having it all right there, front and center at a glance, is a
great help.

Thank you,
Mark



From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Wed Nov 27 20:11:01 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Wed Nov 27 20:11:01 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <BA0AA6C7.3C36%mdswindell@charter.net>
Message-ID: <20021128010528.11557.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com>

<http://www.fourthworld.com/rev/>
also has a great scripting guide.

--- Mark Swindell <mdswindell at charter.net> wrote:

> on 11/27/02 2:42 PM, Richard Gaskin at
> ambassador at fourthworld.com wrote:
> 
> > So when I first started learning MetaCard I
> wrote a property sheet utility,
> > which (like VB, ToolBook, and others)
> provides an overview of nearly all
> > properties for the selected object (or card,
> or stack, and it lists global
> > props as well).  It also provides a quick way
> to edit values:  just
> > double-click a line and an editor appropriate
> to the data type opens (color
> > picker for colors, answer for Booleans,
> etc.).
> > 
> > I've made this available to a few friends and
> clients, and just recently did
> > some more debugging and posted the latest
> version to my site:
> > 
> > <http://www.fourthworld.com/rev/>
> > 
> > I hope you find it helpful for learning about
> properties in Rev.
> 
> Richard,
> 
> What a great tool.  In literally less than two
> minutes after downloading it
> I had gleaned a great deal about the properties
> of stacks, groups, buttons,
> you name it.   Having it all right there, front
> and center at a glance, is a
> great help.
> 
> Thank you,
> Mark

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com


From erikhans08 at yahoo.com  Wed Nov 27 20:19:00 2002
From: erikhans08 at yahoo.com (erik hansen)
Date: Wed Nov 27 20:19:00 2002
Subject: using Find in the Script Editor
In-Reply-To: <20021128010528.11557.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20021128011304.29260.qmail@web20002.mail.yahoo.com>

is there a way to Find only complete words in the
Script Editor? i.e. "con" would NOT Find the
first 3 letters of "control". i tried the
dictionary and the menus, but couldn't find anything.

=====
erik at erikhansen.org    http://www.erikhansen.org

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com


From chipp at chipp.com  Wed Nov 27 20:52:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Wed Nov 27 20:52:01 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <BA0A8A66.20A79%ambassador@fourthworld.com>
Message-ID: <ACEELABEAIANJNCEJFMAGEOBCOAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Hey Richard - thanks for the link.

I'm in agreement with you. When I first started using RR, I did the same
thing..wrote a PropList plugin which allowed me to compare the properties of
two different objects. This way, I could find an object I liked in another
stack and recreate the property list for a similar object in my stack. A
great tool for learning. It can be found at:
http://www.altuit.com/webs/altuit2/RunRev/Plugins.htm

I believe your stack will also let a user set the properties...mine only
compares the properties.

Another thing I found helpful (and I still do this), is RTM. What I mean is,
purchase the manuals (I bought MC and RR both) and spend some time each
evening just perusing the *huge* lists of properties, functions and handler
examples. It's amazing what you can learn by just reading a bit each night.

Lastly, early on as a new RR/MC user, I spent quite a number of hours
perusing the list archives. It's truly amazing the value there. Sure would
be cool to figure out a way to somehow *organize* all those cool tips and
techniques into a document of sort. Anyway, it was time well spent.

-Chipp

>

> So when I first started learning MetaCard I wrote a property
> sheet utility,
> which (like VB, ToolBook, and others) provides an overview of nearly all
> properties for the selected object (or card, or stack, and it lists global
> props as well).  It also provides a quick way to edit values:  just
> double-click a line and an editor appropriate to the data type
> opens (color
> picker for colors, answer for Booleans, etc.).
>
> I've made this available to a few friends and clients, and just
> recently did
> some more debugging and posted the latest version to my site:
>
> <http://www.fourthworld.com/rev/>
>
> I hope you find it helpful for learning about properties in Rev.
>
> --
>  Richard Gaskin
>  Fourth World Media Corporation
>  Developer of WebMerge 2.1: Publish any database on any site
>  ___________________________________________________________
>  Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
>  Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From kray at sonsothunder.com  Wed Nov 27 21:18:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Wed Nov 27 21:18:01 2002
Subject: MAC address
References: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHIEMCCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <01d801c29682$dae809b0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> It seems the script that Ken has on his site states a superuser
requirement
> that may or may not be necessary. That the only point of contention at
this
> stage. It seems to work perfectly well and even as a a non superuser. The
> only thing now is to get a comment from Ken as to why the script has the
> requirement.

Because it's a mistake? ;-)

Actually, where I got the call from had stated that in order to accesss
/sbin you needed to be logged in with superuser access. If the fact is that
it works regardless of login state, I'm happy to remove that requirement.

BTW: I note you are calling 'ifconfig en0' instead of '/sbin/ifconfig en0';
are you getting the same result? If so, perhaps the fact that '/sbin' is not
needed affects the login status...

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Wed Nov 27 21:36:00 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Wed Nov 27 21:36:00 2002
Subject: MAC address
In-Reply-To: <01d801c29682$dae809b0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHAEMGCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

> Because it's a mistake? ;-)

Fantastic!
>
> Actually, where I got the call from had stated that in order to accesss
> /sbin you needed to be logged in with superuser access. If the
> fact is that
> it works regardless of login state, I'm happy to remove that requirement.
>
> BTW: I note you are calling 'ifconfig en0' instead of
> '/sbin/ifconfig en0';
> are you getting the same result? If so, perhaps the fact that
> '/sbin' is not
> needed affects the login status...
>
Well actually it worked with both commands on both super and non-super user
logins. I think that part of the confusion is that when I first tested it I
typed into the message box and for some reason put shell("ifconfig en0")
put's 0 into the message box. I still can't work out why!

Anyway just ifconfig en0 seems to work fine and there seems to be no
dependancy on superuser access. Now are ifconfig and ipconfig guaranteed to
be installed?

Thanks again for your help Ken

Monte



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Wed Nov 27 21:54:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Wed Nov 27 21:54:01 2002
Subject: MAC address
References: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHAEMGCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <01eb01c29687$f6f81500$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> Anyway just ifconfig en0 seems to work fine and there seems to be no
> dependancy on superuser access. Now are ifconfig and ipconfig guaranteed
to
> be installed?

Well, 'ifconfig' should be installed as it is part of the TCP/IP
configuration for OS X. It's my understanding that 'ipconfig' is installed
by default in Win98 Second Edition and above. However for Win 95 and the
first edition of Win98, you can include the 'ipconfig.exe' application in
your distribution and run it from a CD, or the equivalent, to get the info
you need. I don't know about the licensing situation from Microsoft (I'd bet
there isn't one since you can download it for free), but if you don't need
to address Win95 or Win98 first edition, you should be safe.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From jacque at hyperactivesw.com  Wed Nov 27 22:24:01 2002
From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay)
Date: Wed Nov 27 22:24:01 2002
Subject: Quit on Mac OS X
References: <200211272307.SAA29152@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <3DE58B0B.4010008@hyperactivesw.com>

yves COPPE <yvescoppe at skynet.be> wrote:

> I understand your way but have still a question :
> 
> which message is sent to the engine when the user "quit" using the 
> app Menu of Mac OS X ?

The double "quit" menu item in OS X was a bug in older MetaCard engines. 
It has been fixed with newer versions of MetaCard and I assume the next 
version of Revolution will have fixed it too. Using a newer version of 
Rev under OS X, there will be only one "Quit" menu item, and it will 
work with your scripts. So the best solution would be to wait.

-- 
Jacqueline Landman Gay         |     jacque at hyperactivesw.com
HyperActive Software           |     http://www.hyperactivesw.com



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Wed Nov 27 22:48:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Wed Nov 27 22:48:01 2002
Subject: MAC address
In-Reply-To: <01eb01c29687$f6f81500$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHCEMICLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

Does anyone have a Win95 box? My oldest box is Win98 and it works fine
there. I don't think it's going to be much of a problem but I wouldn't mind
finding out. It should be OK. I'm doing this for a client that says MacOS 9
is a dead platform so I think they would laugh at me if I said I had a
problem with pre 98 versions of Windows.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of Ken Ray
> Sent: Thursday, 28 November 2002 1:14 PM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Re: MAC address
>
>
>
> > Anyway just ifconfig en0 seems to work fine and there seems to be no
> > dependancy on superuser access. Now are ifconfig and ipconfig guaranteed
> to
> > be installed?
>
> Well, 'ifconfig' should be installed as it is part of the TCP/IP
> configuration for OS X. It's my understanding that 'ipconfig' is installed
> by default in Win98 Second Edition and above. However for Win 95 and the
> first edition of Win98, you can include the 'ipconfig.exe' application in
> your distribution and run it from a CD, or the equivalent, to get the info
> you need. I don't know about the licensing situation from
> Microsoft (I'd bet
> there isn't one since you can download it for free), but if you don't need
> to address Win95 or Win98 first edition, you should be safe.
>
> Ken Ray
> Sons of Thunder Software
> Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From curry at kagi.com  Wed Nov 27 23:54:01 2002
From: curry at kagi.com (curry)
Date: Wed Nov 27 23:54:01 2002
Subject: not getting digests
In-Reply-To: <200211271633.LAA18706@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211271633.LAA18706@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <a05111b00ba0b4d399999@[68.34.213.220]>

>Unfortunately,
>SPEWS is uncontactable, unresponsive, and as far as I can tell, actively
>does not want to remove innocent businesses from their blacklisting, since
>it relies on us to complain to our ISP's and get the spam operations shut
>down. We are attempting to do this. How long it will take and how successful
>we will be, I do not know.

That's disgraceful. Any means to reach their goal. That's a source of 
many, many problems in the world today, and it's interesting that an 
example of this kind of philosophy and behavior even shows up here!

Maybe we should think about how to put SPEWS in their proper place 
and inform people about their techniques!

Curry


From miscdas at boxfrog.com  Thu Nov 28 07:06:01 2002
From: miscdas at boxfrog.com (miscdas at boxfrog.com)
Date: Thu Nov 28 07:06:01 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <8F8EEBBD-0184-11D7-968E-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au> 
References: <8F8EEBBD-0184-11D7-968E-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>
Message-ID: <20021128120042.59457.qmail@www.boxfrog.com>

David Vaughan writes:
[snip]
> True, miscdas, but the list exists in part to help people discover the 
> documentation as well as the product, or the use-list would hardly need to 
> exist at all. A pointer to using the documentation (as you have done here) 
> as well as to the answer helps people get up and running faster. 
> 
> regards
> David
>> _______________________________________________

My point, apparently not readily seen, is that new users could probably 
benefit enormously from simply spending some time going through the 
tutorials and actually DOING them to gain a familiarity with basic features. 
Then, if difficulties arise with an application, make use of the mailing 
list or private contacts. I see on this list (as well as on other forums to 
which I belong) that many new users ask basic questions that are well 
documented either in the documentation that was supplied with the app 
(tutorials, example stacks, code snippets, etc.), or in the discussion 
archives. A very little personal effort to "discover" a solution not only 
benefits the person, but keeps the mailing list less "cluttered". 

I don't see that it is at all difficult to "discover" the documentation. It 
is again a very basic exercise to navigate to the folder where the app was 
installed and "look around" at the supplied files, as well as to simply 
click "help", press F1, etc. while the app is running. 

The list does and can exist without ever touching these basic areas, except 
in the instances where the documentation is poorly written (or even in 
error), or to reveal new-found properties or uses for some basic documented 
functions. 

A little thought on the subject reveals this can be seen as matter of 
courtesy to others. 

miscdas


From matt.denton at limelight.com.au  Thu Nov 28 07:18:01 2002
From: matt.denton at limelight.com.au (Matt Denton)
Date: Thu Nov 28 07:18:01 2002
Subject: Cursor Disappearing Problem then Solution
In-Reply-To: <200211272308.SAA29240@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA0C5330.263D%matt.denton@limelight.com.au>

Hi List, this is Matt here.

Today I had a problem with the cursor disappearing when entering a field.
Very annoying. Now I had a quick check on the list, not sure if anyone has
found the solution or dealt with this, apologies if it has been covered.
Here's what I found and the solution:

PROBLEM
After creating a field, adding, editing and subtracting objects on the card,
suddenly one field would not show the cursor.  Had this problem once before
but no solution... After checking all the standard 'traversal on' and 'auto
hilite' etc. (which may cause a cursor not to appear).

SOLUTION
I tried lots of things, then I duplicated the field.  Viola - cursor back.
But why?

I then stepped through each of the two field's properties, comparing each
and setting one property at a time - the new good duplicate setting each
property of the dud field.  What I found was that the RECT was the culprit,
it was the only property I had to change to get Flashy Cursor back on stage.
I also found by simply moving the field over to the right side of the screen
Flashy came back too.  I then moved it back to the old position and the
cursor with the correct cursor still waving at me.  This didn't always work,
seemed like you needed a big move.

Anyway that's what I found. Same issue in Rev 2 Beta 6.  (Hehe... only
joking, I mean Rev Alpha 12:~)  Not sure what creates the initial condition,
perhaps this has been mended in Rev 2?  (I have a stack if you guys need it
anyway).

Chow back to late night code and cups of tea (and tiptoeing for a mini snack
from the fridge for fear of discovery...)

M@
Matt



From dwilk at bradfork.co.uk  Thu Nov 28 07:24:18 2002
From: dwilk at bradfork.co.uk (David Wilkinson)
Date: Thu Nov 28 07:24:18 2002
Subject: File Open Error: Illegal File Name Character " " in xyz.rev
In-Reply-To: <200211271634.LAA18808@www.runrev.com>
References: <200211271634.LAA18808@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <E18HNNW-0001K1-00@iffley.bradcomp.co.uk>

Rob 

I did a few experiments and it appears that the restriction is more 
to do with RevDev under Linux:

1: Rename a standalone to include a space - runs fine from term 
window or file browser.  Build a standalone with spaces in name - 
Distribution builder replaces them with underscores.

2: Change a stackfilename(.rev) to eliminate space - opens fine. If 
I eliminated the Serendipity stack name spaces the stack would open  
but your error checking for the existence of the original filenames 
meant it then exited gracefully.

3: Try to save or open a mainstack(.rev) with space in filename in 
RevDev - produces illegal file name error message.

Conclusion: Main problems with spaces are
1: RevDev - includes some precautionary filtering?(other unices?)
2: Difficult to read in console window especially with long paths!! 
(escaped spaces)


And yes this seems to be the case :
> Am I correct that this restriction applies only to the mainstack
> stack file names? ?In other words, it's OK to set a stack's name
> or label to "Serendipity Library" so long as the stack resides in
> a file named "Serendipity_Library.rev"? ?And by extension, spaces
> are OK in substack names so long as they are not saved externally
> from the mainstack?

But I still don't  use spaces;  but then I still use punched cards.


From matt.denton at limelight.com.au  Thu Nov 28 07:39:00 2002
From: matt.denton at limelight.com.au (Matt Denton)
Date: Thu Nov 28 07:39:00 2002
Subject: Cursor Disappearing Problem then Solution
In-Reply-To: <200211281222.HAA09473@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA0C5827.2641%matt.denton@limelight.com.au>

Hello dear List, Matt again.

> I also found by simply moving the field over to the right side of the screen
> Flashy came back too.  I then moved it back to the old position and the
> cursor with the correct cursor still waving at me.  This didn't always work,
> seemed like you needed a big move.

I actually found the REAL culprit: the rect of a locked field above
overlapped by a bit the rect of the editable field.  Motto: check the rects
of all your fields, they might bite you later.

Recipe: create a field, check cursor is OK and showing in field. Type
something:  your name...  your favourite fruit (mango is mine).

Now create a label field, make sure the rect overlaps the editable field a
bit.  Try clickin' on the editable field, you get focus, you can type, but
no cursor.

There you go.  The real problem it seems, thought I'd better update from
last e-mail.

Sorry to bother you all, my 2 cent solution.  Probably a million others have
found this solution.  Now a million x 2 cents...

M@
Matt



From benr_mc at cogapp.com  Thu Nov 28 07:53:01 2002
From: benr_mc at cogapp.com (Ben Rubinstein)
Date: Thu Nov 28 07:53:01 2002
Subject: Re-ordering substacks?
Message-ID: <BA0BC04F.33C6%benr_mc@cogapp.com>

Is there any way to change the order of substacks?  I'm not really sure what
impact - if any - the order of substacks has - so in effect I'm really just
trying to re-order them in the App Overview, to help me keep track.

But given that this is the use- list, is there anything I can do which will
cause the order in 'the substacks' to change?

And if there is a way to do so, will it have any effects, apart from
reordering them in the App Overview?

TIA,
 
  Ben Rubinstein               |  Email: benr_mc at cogapp.com
  Cognitive Applications Ltd   |  Phone: +44 (0)1273-821600
  http://www.cogapp.com        |  Fax  : +44 (0)1273-728866




From heather at runrev.com  Thu Nov 28 08:35:01 2002
From: heather at runrev.com (Heather Williams)
Date: Thu Nov 28 08:35:01 2002
Subject: not getting digests
In-Reply-To: <200211281221.HAA09447@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA0BCA98.9E63%heather@runrev.com>

> Maybe we should think about how to put SPEWS in their proper place
> and inform people about their techniques!

I totally agree with you, it's appalling. Unfortunately most of my "copious
spare time" (TM Jeanne DeVoto, thank you Jeanne) is already being taken up
with the fallout from this occurrence, trying to contact people by
alternative means and general damage limitation. If anyone wants to take the
matter up in any way they have my full moral support. Hopefully the
situation will be resolved shortly,

Regards,

Heather
-- 
Heather Williams <heather at runrev.com> <http://www.runrev.com/>
Runtime Revolution Ltd.
Tel: +44 (0) 131 7184333 Fax: +44 (0)1639 830707
Ten Thumbs Typing Tutor Teach your Fingers to Dance



From katir at hindu.org  Thu Nov 28 10:45:01 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Thu Nov 28 10:45:01 2002
Subject: More Applescript Power
Message-ID: <C4C86D6A-02E7-11D7-99B9-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

In Supercard you could


Compile an applescript, check it's syntax, add it as a resource, run it 
as complied script etc.

How can you run a compiled Applescript from Revolution? A text field is 
a poor applescript dev environment. I want to be able to run a compiled 
Applescript from an external file without having to turn that script 
into an applet/app. and debug it in Apple Script Studio or the script 
editor where we have syntax checking....

How?





From katir at hindu.org  Thu Nov 28 10:52:00 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Thu Nov 28 10:52:00 2002
Subject: Set Multiple Filters
Message-ID: <B63BD782-02E8-11D7-99B9-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

I tried

filter gFileList with "*JPG,*.GIF,*.JPEG,*.jpg,*.jpeg,.*gif"

But it doesn't work... only one parameter is accepted:

filter gFileList with "*.JPG"

How to filter for multiple strings? I must be missing something simple.

TIA
Sannyasin Sivakatirswami

Himalayan Academy Publications
katir at hindu.org

www.HimalayanAcademy.com, www.HinduismToday.com
www.Gurudeva.org, www.Hindu.org



From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 28 11:55:07 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 28 11:55:07 2002
Subject: File Open Error: Illegal File Name Character " " in xyz.rev
In-Reply-To: <E18HNNW-0001K1-00@iffley.bradcomp.co.uk>
References: <200211271634.LAA18808@www.runrev.com>
 <E18HNNW-0001K1-00@iffley.bradcomp.co.uk>
Message-ID: <a05100301ba0bf6174722@[216.229.107.121]>

>I still don't  use spaces;  but then I still use punched cards.

Thanks for checking further, David.

I went through the Library yesterday and replaced " " with "_" in all 
external stack, folder, and file name references.

I want to test this for a day or two, because the changes were 
throughout the scripts of four mainstacks & several substacks; but it 
should be available for downLoad by Monday at the latest.

I would have expected all punched card readers to have died years 
ago.  Sounds like someone should increase your capital equipment 
budget.    :{`)
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 28 11:55:31 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 28 11:55:31 2002
Subject: Re-ordering substacks?
In-Reply-To: <BA0BC04F.33C6%benr_mc@cogapp.com>
References: <BA0BC04F.33C6%benr_mc@cogapp.com>
Message-ID: <a05100302ba0bf875d5b9@[216.229.107.121]>

>Is there any way to change the order of substacks?

Ben, et al:

The one time I tried to do this, I set the mainstack property to 
remove a substack from the mainstack and then add it back...which put 
it at the bottom of the list.

You might try something like:

get the substacks of this stack
sort it -- syntax?
set the substacks of this stack to it

I don't think this will cause any ramifications outside the AO.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From gary.rathbone at btclick.com  Thu Nov 28 12:19:01 2002
From: gary.rathbone at btclick.com (Gary Rathbone)
Date: Thu Nov 28 12:19:01 2002
Subject: Basic Questions (was RE: Background)
In-Reply-To: <20021128120042.59457.qmail@www.boxfrog.com>
Message-ID: <000001c29701$4ef1b4e0$0e00000a@server>

I whole heartedly disagree ! I'm happy to see anyone to ask any RR
related question on this list and am constantly surprised by how others
put a new angle on an aspect I considered I was familiar with.

The list helped me a great deal when I first started with MC and RR and
now I'm in a position to return the favour. Fortunately I appreciate
that a 'basic question' is purely subjective. What is 'basic' for one
person is 'difficult' for another.

True, the list could exist "without ever touching these basic areas",
but it would be a much poorer resource for it. "As a matter of courtesty
to others" I suggest that new users are not critisised but encouraged to
participate, I am not so arrogant as to realise I may learn something
new myself.

Regards

Gary Rathbone BSc MBCS
Chartered Information Systems Practitioner

--------------------------------------
I see on this list (as well as on other forums to 
which I belong) that many new users ask basic questions that are well 
documented either in the documentation that was supplied with the app 
(tutorials, example stacks, code snippets, etc.), or in the discussion 
archives. 

The list does and can exist without ever touching these basic areas,
except 
in the instances where the documentation is poorly written (or even in 
error), or to reveal new-found properties or uses for some basic
documented 
functions. 

A little thought on the subject reveals this can be seen as matter of 
courtesy to others. 

miscdas
_______________________________________________
use-revolution mailing list
use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution




From bornstein at designeq.com  Thu Nov 28 13:06:01 2002
From: bornstein at designeq.com (Howard Bornstein)
Date: Thu Nov 28 13:06:01 2002
Subject: Cursor Disappearing Problem then Solution
Message-ID: <200211281759.gASHxsk24042@mailout6-0.nyroc.rr.com>

>I tried lots of things, then I duplicated the field.  Viola - cursor back.
>But why?

I ran into the same problem and came up with the same solution.

>I actually found the REAL culprit: the rect of a locked field above
>overlapped by a bit the rect of the editable field.  Motto: check the rects
>of all your fields, they might bite you later.

This makes perfect sense in my case also.

Thanks for going that extra mile and tracking down the problem, Matt!

Regards,

Howard Bornstein
____________________
D E S I G N  E Q
www.designeq.com


From rcozens at pon.net  Thu Nov 28 13:20:15 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Thu Nov 28 13:20:15 2002
Subject: Basic Questions (was RE: Background)
In-Reply-To: <000001c29701$4ef1b4e0$0e00000a@server>
References: <000001c29701$4ef1b4e0$0e00000a@server>
Message-ID: <a05100309ba0c06e439bd@[216.229.107.184]>

>I suggest that new users are not critisised but encouraged to
>participate, I am not so arrogant as to realise I may learn something
>new myself.

Well put, Gary.

I couldn't agree more.

And let me point out, at least for business applications programmers 
such as moi, the broader one's knowledge, the more valuable one is to 
one's clients.

Over the years I have customized accounting or operational software for:

An auto parts manufacturer
A polymer manufacturer
General contractors
A drywall contractor
A metropolitan police department
A pension fund investor
A stock broker
A neurosurgeon
A new age music publishing company
HVAC contractors
An accounting software publisher
A door & trim manufacturer
A publisher of self-instructional training materials for the banking industry
A mushroom farm
Port of Vancouver USA
The Canadian Public Health Association
A bakery
A wholesale food manufacturer & distributor
Several wineries
and others I can't think of at the moment.

These people want software engineers who can apply their technical 
knowledge to the real-world problems of their specific enterprise AND 
to interface with the users in a knowledgeable, good humored manner.

If a system designer can't converse in the language of the user, 
his/her system is NOT going to succeed...at least I've found it to be 
the kiss of death where ever I've seen the situation come up.

So if one is planning to write Compilers, O/Ss, or some other highly 
technical aspect of programming, perhaps one can stick one's head in 
the sand and say "I don't want to hear or talk about anything but the 
principal subject of the list."

But if one is designing software for people in the real world beyond 
IS, one should, IMFO, embrace the opportunity to learn about that 
real world and, perhaps, to sharpen skills in establishing a 
good-humored dialog with people one "works" with on a day-to-day 
basis.

Cheers!
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From wmb at internettrainer.com  Thu Nov 28 13:41:01 2002
From: wmb at internettrainer.com (Wolfgang M. Bereuter)
Date: Thu Nov 28 13:41:01 2002
Subject: Basic Questions (was RE: Background)
In-Reply-To: <a05100309ba0c06e439bd@[216.229.107.184]>
Message-ID: <1F5B3851-0300-11D7-B798-003065430226@internettrainer.com>

On Donnerstag, November 28, 2002, at 07:15  Uhr, Rob Cozens wrote:

>
>> I suggest that new users are not critisised but encouraged to
>> participate, I am not so arrogant as to realise I may learn something
>> new myself.
>
> Well put, Gary.
>
> I couldn't agree more.
Me tooo!

> And let me point out, at least for business applications programmers 
> such as moi, the broader one's knowledge, the more valuable one is to 
> one's clients.

----
>
> But if one is designing software for people in the real world beyond 
> IS, one should, IMFO, embrace the opportunity to learn about that real 
> world and, perhaps, to sharpen skills in establishing a good-humored 
> dialog with people one "works" with on a day-to-day basis.
Again me tooo!

regards
Wolfgang M. Bereuter

Learn easy with trainingsmaps?

INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter
Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria
...............................
http://www.internettrainer.com, wmb at internettrainer.com
...............................
Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539



From miscdas at boxfrog.com  Thu Nov 28 14:38:01 2002
From: miscdas at boxfrog.com (miscdas at boxfrog.com)
Date: Thu Nov 28 14:38:01 2002
Subject: Background
In-Reply-To: <BA094D47.3CCF%mswindel@santacruz.k12.ca.us> 
References: <BA094D47.3CCF%mswindel@santacruz.k12.ca.us>
Message-ID: <20021128193156.92451.qmail@www.boxfrog.com>

Mark Swindell writes: 

> 
> Also, when one is used to a certain paradigm (like HyperCard), it can shape your thinking and constrain your ability to grasp a different way of doing things, especially from within an environment and scripting language so overwhelmingly similar to what you're used to. 
> 
> -Mark 
> 
 

Which is EXACTLY why DOING the tutorials is of such benefit! READING about 
something gets you acquainted; WORKING with it brings intimacy. 

miscdas 



From dsc at swcp.com  Thu Nov 28 14:43:00 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Thu Nov 28 14:43:00 2002
Subject: send and long names
Message-ID: <B6E497B0-0308-11D7-9410-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

Is the long name of an object always sufficient to uniquely identify it 
for a send?  Is there a better way to uniquely identify an object that 
is suitable for send?

Dar Scott



From michaell at unimelb.edu.au  Thu Nov 28 17:45:01 2002
From: michaell at unimelb.edu.au (Michael J. Lew)
Date: Thu Nov 28 17:45:01 2002
Subject: Moving images around randomly
Message-ID: <p05111a16ba0c4b174884@[128.250.229.137]>

I've made a pharmacology teaching tool that has buttons moving around 
in a box randomly and bouncing off the walls. They also stick to a 
button when they get close enough. I'm sure you will be able to get 
some goodnees out of the code. I'll send it to you off-list.

Regards,
-- 
Michael J. Lew

Senior Lecturer
Department of Pharmacology
The University of Melbourne
Parkville 3010
Victoria
Australia

Phone +613 8344 8304

**
New email address: michaell at unimelb.edu.au
**


From revolution at knowledgeworks.plus.com  Thu Nov 28 20:01:01 2002
From: revolution at knowledgeworks.plus.com (Bernard Devlin)
Date: Thu Nov 28 20:01:01 2002
Subject: combining cards from stacks
Message-ID: <200211290100.UAA23893@www.runrev.com>

I want to have an application where the users can store multiple stacks (with
the same structure), and each stack would represent some way in which the user
chooses to categorize the stacks.  (I'm envisioning situations in which the
stacks may contain many thousands of cards, and the cards may be storing images
and/or text too... and since I understand that Rev loads the entirety of the
stack(s) in memory, this could become an issue, so I want to allow for this in
the initial design - this design would allow the users to break up their stacks
into categories if memory was an issue and recombine them when required).

I understand that I can let the user create new stacks using the templateStack
feature, so creating multiple stacks should be straightforward.  I also
understand that cards can be copied between stacks.

I would like to allow the user to select a series of these identically
structured stacks, and to 'combine' the stacks into a central stack that they
would then process.  Can this central stack be 'virtual' i.e. just a window onto
the selected stacks but appearing to the user as a single stack (for example, if
they were to move between the cards, could these cards be viewed sequentially,
but come from different stacks?)  Or will I have to copy all the users
selections into a real stack, and have them browse that stack?

Also, I would like to have a navigation stack that allows the user to
select/deselect the stacks that will be viewed.  I have seen the tree list
viewer "user contribution" on the runrev site, and I think that I could work
with that.  But I was wondering if there any other implementations of this kind
of functionality around?

Regards,
Bernard


From katir at hindu.org  Thu Nov 28 20:30:01 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Thu Nov 28 20:30:01 2002
Subject: Extract ImageSource URL from a char in a field?
In-Reply-To: <005c01c294ab$fb536420$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <5BBCB6CE-0339-11D7-99B9-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

duh (smile) I wasn't thinking in terms of properties...

indeed i get

binfile:/Users/katir/Graphics/Test manage files 1/12-14-07.jpg

Thanks...


On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 07:56 AM, Ken Ray wrote:

> Have you tried:
>
>   get the imageSource of char 1 of fld "browser"
>
> ???
>
> If so, what did you get?
>
> Ken Ray
> Sons of Thunder Software
> Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Sannyasin Sivakatirswami" <katir at hindu.org>
> To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
> Cc: <metacard at lists.runrev.com>
> Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2002 11:38 PM
> Subject: Extract ImageSource URL from a char in a field?
>
>
>> Is it possible to extract the file name of the image which was used to
>> set the imageSource of a character in a field?
>>



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Thu Nov 28 20:44:00 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Thu Nov 28 20:44:00 2002
Subject: combining cards from stacks
In-Reply-To: <200211290100.UAA23893@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHAEMPCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

open card x in stack y


From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Thu Nov 28 20:59:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Thu Nov 28 20:59:01 2002
Subject: Printing a portion of a card
In-Reply-To: <a05111adeba0774adc596@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <3E8E4C20-033D-11D7-ABD8-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

Thanks for the idea but that didn't work either. The only thing that 
works is setting ridiculous values for the print into rect. e.g.
print this card from 4,157 to 719,554 into 68,-50,942,695

One other word of warning, I was using the printPaperSize to adjust my 
printout to fit the paper. After using Page Setup to set landscape A4, 
the printPaperSize was 842,595 (oddly one pixel wider than when I 
tested a few days ago). However when I tried printing again, although 
the print out came out in landscape format, the printPaperSize had 
revert to 595,842 i.e. portrait.

Maybe I'll just wait for version 2 and see if these problems disappear 
:-)

Sarah


On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 04:33  pm, J. Landman Gay wrote:

> Sarah <sarahr at genesearch.com.au> wrote:
>
>> I want to print the card from 4,157 to 719,554.
>> Here is the command I am using:
>> 	print this card from 4,157 to 719,554 into 72,72,697,451
>>
>> Surely this should make the printout start 1 inch from the top and 1 
>> inch from the left of the paper. It looks like it starts 1 inch from 
>> the left but about 3 inches from the top.
>
> Looking at the numbers, it looks like Rev is adding together the card 
> coordinates and the print rect, so you are getting 76 pixels from the 
> left and 229 pixels from the top, which is about one inch and three 
> inches.
>
> What happens if you do this instead:
>
> set the printmargins to 72,72,697,451
> print this card from 4,157 to 719,554
>
> Untested, but worth a try.
>
> --
> Jacqueline Landman Gay         |     jacque at hyperactivesw.com
> HyperActive Software           |     http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From sarahr at genesearch.com.au  Thu Nov 28 21:59:01 2002
From: sarahr at genesearch.com.au (Sarah)
Date: Thu Nov 28 21:59:01 2002
Subject: Set Multiple Filters
In-Reply-To: <a05111ae0ba0bec28c7e8@[192.168.0.100]>
Message-ID: <AFBB79E8-0345-11D7-ABD8-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>

I think you need to use a loop for multiple filters. You will have to 
filter for each of the file extensions and then merge the results into 
a single list. Is filter case-sensitive? You might not need to use 6 
filters if it isn't.

Sarah


On Friday, November 29, 2002, at 01:52  am, Sannyasin Sivakatirswami 
wrote:

> I tried
>
> filter gFileList with "*JPG,*.GIF,*.JPEG,*.jpg,*.jpeg,.*gif"
>
> But it doesn't work... only one parameter is accepted:
>
> filter gFileList with "*.JPG"
>
> How to filter for multiple strings? I must be missing something simple.
>
> TIA
> Sannyasin Sivakatirswami
>
> Himalayan Academy Publications
> katir at hindu.org
>
> www.HimalayanAcademy.com, www.HinduismToday.com
> www.Gurudeva.org, www.Hindu.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>




From bvg at mac.com  Thu Nov 28 22:20:01 2002
From: bvg at mac.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rnke_von_Gierke?=)
Date: Thu Nov 28 22:20:01 2002
Subject: combining cards from stacks
In-Reply-To: <200211290100.UAA23893@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <A6ADBD6A-0348-11D7-8A81-003065AD94A4@mac.com>

On Freitag, Nov 29, 2002, at 01:53 Europe/Zurich, Bernard Devlin wrote:

> I want to have an application where the users can store multiple 
> stacks (with
> the same structure), and each stack would represent some way in which 
> the user
> chooses to categorize the stacks.  (I'm envisioning situations in 
> which the
> stacks may contain many thousands of cards, and the cards may be 
> storing images
> and/or text too... and since I understand that Rev loads the entirety 
> of the
> stack(s) in memory, this could become an issue, so I want to allow for 
> this in
> the initial design - this design would allow the users to break up 
> their stacks
> into categories if memory was an issue and recombine them when 
> required).

I think if it is not necessary that you hide the images from the user, 
then you could refer the images instead of loading them into the stack. 
By doing this, the stack will only load images that are on the current 
card, not every one in the whole stack.
Text can be read from files (probably encrypted) Into fields, but it 
needs a little more work that with the pictures....

If you want definitely have all the data in stacks, then I would try to 
keep the stacks at small pieces from the beginning. Else you would have 
to first make a new stack, then copy the cards one by one and then 
delete the recently copied cards (again one by one). That is rather 
slow (i tried to do that once with only a few card, and it was too slow 
for me).

you mentioned "thousands" of cards, if you mean 3-6 thousands, you 
could be on the good side of things, other reported that that is doable 
without slowdown, if there is enough memory.

It is possible to show Cards from one Stacks inside of another Stack, 
but both have to be in memory (will automatically load if not there) , 
so it is kinda useless for you :)



From JamesHBeckmann at aol.com  Thu Nov 28 22:43:01 2002
From: JamesHBeckmann at aol.com (JamesHBeckmann at aol.com)
Date: Thu Nov 28 22:43:01 2002
Subject: Scaling an Image
Message-ID: <11f.1a7e416a.2b183aca@aol.com>

I'm new.  I am seeking some advice.

I wish to:  Show an image (file in the same folder) that has its rect set to 
the rect of a fld, visible for 3 seconds then hidden.

I would like to have this image scaled to the fld's rect.

I do not want this image incorporated into the stack.

I've tried different configurations of the following:  import paint, set rect 
of image to rect of fld, etc.

I can't get the image scaled to a different size from its original, nor hide 
it after it is visible.

Jim


From dvk at dvkconsult.com.au  Thu Nov 28 23:23:00 2002
From: dvk at dvkconsult.com.au (David Vaughan)
Date: Thu Nov 28 23:23:00 2002
Subject: Cursor Disappearing Problem then Solution
In-Reply-To: <200211281759.gASHxsk24042@mailout6-0.nyroc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <648D400A-0351-11D7-968E-000393598038@dvkconsult.com.au>

On Friday, Nov 29, 2002, at 04:59 Australia/Sydney, Matt Denton wrote:

>> Viola - cursor back.
>>
Matt
Did you mean the strings of your heart were singing (at a fifth below 
the violin), or were you looking for Voila? Perhaps it was a woman 
nearby to whom you exclaimed: "Gosh Viola. The cursor's back!"
:-)
David



Post Script to linguists: There is no grave on the a in Voila because 
this is plain text, so leave me alone... dv.



From katir at hindu.org  Fri Nov 29 00:14:01 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Fri Nov 29 00:14:01 2002
Subject: Bug: Launch Not work on OSX/OSX Rotate image trick
In-Reply-To: <BA026BD6.C262%rfarnold@bu.edu>
Message-ID: <ABF93812-0358-11D7-99B9-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

Though my license does not expire until January 18, 2003 I was 
unsubscribed from the Improve list, so will send bug reports here in 
the hope they are not bugs but only what I don't know.

OSX 10.2.2 Rev 1.5


Problems with Launch command:
Bug:
1) Rev will not "forget' that the application is no longer running.

a) set an application path to BBEdit in a preference field.
b) Launch a file using

launch "some/File/path" with "/Applications/BBedit 6.5/BBEdit 6.5

First time (BBedit is not open) the file is opened... as expected.

Quit BBEdit...

use the launch button again.. .this time the file is not launched...
  if I quit Rev and re-boot, it is launched.

Not a bug, but a "how to?"
2) The documentation clearly states that if the application is already 
open then "launch" will do nothing... OK, so, then, how does one open a 
file in an already running application?  Of course I can use 
applescript... but would rather stay in xTalk.

3) this is totally obscure problem with Adobe products... anyone know 
about this?

Launch "somepath/some.jpg" with "/Applications/Adobe Photoshop 
7.0/Adobe Photoshop 7.0

will not work... and, what is even stranger, if you do

answer file "Find your copy of Photoshop"
put it

and locate the application, Rev returns:

/Applications/Adobe Photoshop 7.0/Adobe Photoshop 7.0/

with a "/" at the end, even though it appears that you are pointing to 
the Adobe photoshop file and not a folder??

Almost got my little image manager CPU wrapped up... helper apps are 
the last leg for file times  that Rev can't put into an image object.

FYI: here;s a great little script for anyone on OSX handling incoming 
photos from digital cameras that need to be rotated... runs great from 
Rev.

Put this in your image object, whose image is a file ref.

on mouseUp
   put the filename of me into mySource
   put mySource into tPath
   replace "/" with ":" in tPath
   delete char 1 of tPath
   put fld "appleScript" into tScript
   replace "###sourcePath###" with tPath in tScript
   answer "Rotate" with "90" or "-90" or "Cancel"
   if it is "Cancel" then exit mouseUp
   replace "###angle###" with it in tScript
   do tScript as applescript
set the filename of me to empty ## refresh image
set the filename of me to mySource
end mouseUp

And this in your applescript field:

try
	tell application "Image Capture Scripting"
		set this_image to open file "###sourcePath###"
		rotate this_image to angle "###angle###"
		save this_image in file "###sourcePath###"
	end tell
	return true
on error error_message
	return false
end try

Image Capture Scripting is a scripting addition and this all runs in 
the background.


Sannyasin Sivakatirswami

Himalayan Academy Publications
katir at hindu.org

www.HimalayanAcademy.com, www.HinduismToday.com
www.Gurudeva.org, www.Hindu.org



From jeanne at runrev.com  Fri Nov 29 00:24:00 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Fri Nov 29 00:24:00 2002
Subject: send and long names
In-Reply-To: <B6E497B0-0308-11D7-9410-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <v03130308ba0c8d2a7f70@[165.247.203.1]>

At 11:36 AM -0800 11/28/02, Dar Scott wrote:
>Is the long name of an object always sufficient to uniquely identify it
>for a send?

Not in all cases. (For example, you might have two buttons on the same card
that have the same name. Their long names will be the same.) You can use
the name safely only if you have control over the names of objects in the
stack. (Of course, this is often the case.)

>Is there a better way to uniquely identify an object that
>is suitable for send?

The long ID is guaranteed unique and is generally the best way if you have
any doubts about new objects that might be created.

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From jeanne at runrev.com  Fri Nov 29 00:24:33 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Fri Nov 29 00:24:33 2002
Subject: using Find in the Script Editor
In-Reply-To: <20021128011304.29260.qmail@web20002.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20021128010528.11557.qmail@web20003.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <v03130309ba0c9f84cf46@[165.247.203.1]>

At 5:13 PM -0800 11/27/02, erik hansen wrote:
>is there a way to Find only complete words in the
>Script Editor?

Check the "Whole Word Searching" item in the View menu. (The option is also
available in the Preferences dialog, in the "Script Editor" pane.)

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From jeanne at runrev.com  Fri Nov 29 00:24:51 2002
From: jeanne at runrev.com (Jeanne A. E. DeVoto)
Date: Fri Nov 29 00:24:51 2002
Subject: Scaling an Image
In-Reply-To: <11f.1a7e416a.2b183aca@aol.com>
Message-ID: <v0313030aba0ca71d983e@[165.247.203.1]>

At 7:36 PM -0800 11/28/02, JamesHBeckmann at aol.com wrote:
>I wish to:  Show an image (file in the same folder) that has its rect set to
>the rect of a fld, visible for 3 seconds then hidden.
>
>I would like to have this image scaled to the fld's rect.
>
>I do not want this image incorporated into the stack.

Try this:

  set the lockLoc of the templateImage to true
  set the rect of the templateImage to the rect of field "My Field"
  set the filename of the templateImage to myFilePath
  -- setting the templateImage sets up properties for the next
  -- image you create:
  create image "Holder" -- make a blank image with above settings
  wait for 3 seconds
  hide image "Holder"
  send "choose browse tool" to me in 1 tick

>I've tried different configurations of the following:  import paint, set rect
>of image to rect of fld, etc.
>
>I can't get the image scaled to a different size from its original, nor hide
>it after it is visible.

The import command brings the picture file into the stack - which you don't
want. Instead, you set the image's filename property to the name of the
picture file to diplay the external file in the image object.

Normally, Revolution automatically adjusts the size of images to fit the
contents. Setting the lockLoc to true turns this behavior off.

--
Jeanne A. E. DeVoto ~ jeanne at runrev.com
Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development
http://www.runrev.com/




From kray at sonsothunder.com  Fri Nov 29 01:47:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Fri Nov 29 01:47:01 2002
Subject: More Applescript Power
References: <C4C86D6A-02E7-11D7-99B9-003065FB9830@hindu.org>
Message-ID: <036a01c29771$a58a5440$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

I don't think you can execute a compiled applescript resource in Rev, but
there's nothing wrong with using Apple's Script Editor to get it right, and
then copy and paste it into a field or custom property that you then execute
from Transcript.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Sannyasin Sivakatirswami" <katir at hindu.org>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 28, 2002 9:40 AM
Subject: More Applescript Power


> In Supercard you could
>
>
> Compile an applescript, check it's syntax, add it as a resource, run it
> as complied script etc.
>
> How can you run a compiled Applescript from Revolution? A text field is
> a poor applescript dev environment. I want to be able to run a compiled
> Applescript from an external file without having to turn that script
> into an applet/app. and debug it in Apple Script Studio or the script
> editor where we have syntax checking....
>
> How?
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Fri Nov 29 02:00:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Fri Nov 29 02:00:01 2002
Subject: Launch Not work on OSX/OSX Rotate image trick
References: <ABF93812-0358-11D7-99B9-003065FB9830@hindu.org>
Message-ID: <03a101c29773$60e8d4e0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Sannyasin,

> Problems with Launch command:
> Bug:
> 1) Rev will not "forget' that the application is no longer running.
>
> a) set an application path to BBEdit in a preference field.
> b) Launch a file using
>
> launch "some/File/path" with "/Applications/BBedit 6.5/BBEdit 6.5
>
> First time (BBedit is not open) the file is opened... as expected.
>
> Quit BBEdit...
>
> use the launch button again.. .this time the file is not launched...
>   if I quit Rev and re-boot, it is launched.

The problem (I think) is that Rev thinks that it "owns" the process, and
therefore since you didn't quit it *from* Rev, it still thinks it's open.
Try checking the "openProcesses' and see if you have a process listed there
after you launch. If you do, you should 'kill' the process and see if it
will work again.

> Not a bug, but a "how to?"
> 2) The documentation clearly states that if the application is already
> open then "launch" will do nothing... OK, so, then, how does one open a
> file in an already running application?  Of course I can use
> applescript... but would rather stay in xTalk.

Sorry; I think you have to use AppleScript until this is resolved.

> 3) this is totally obscure problem with Adobe products... anyone know
> about this?
>
> Launch "somepath/some.jpg" with "/Applications/Adobe Photoshop
> 7.0/Adobe Photoshop 7.0
>
> will not work... and, what is even stranger, if you do
>
> answer file "Find your copy of Photoshop"
> put it
>
> and locate the application, Rev returns:
>
> /Applications/Adobe Photoshop 7.0/Adobe Photoshop 7.0/
>
> with a "/" at the end, even though it appears that you are pointing to
> the Adobe photoshop file and not a folder??

No, that's not strange at all under OS X. Technically applications ARE
folders (actually "packages"); if you control-click on them and choose "Show
Package Contents" you can see what is inside - including the REAL
application. You might try including the trailing "/" after the path name to
the app and see if it launches properly.

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From revolution at knowledgeworks.plus.com  Fri Nov 29 03:29:01 2002
From: revolution at knowledgeworks.plus.com (Bernard Devlin)
Date: Fri Nov 29 03:29:01 2002
Subject: combining cards from stacks
In-Reply-To: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHAEMPCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
References: <200211290100.UAA23893@www.runrev.com> <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHAEMPCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>
Message-ID: <200211290828.DAA32585@www.runrev.com>

> open card x in stack y

Monte, if this meets my criteria, it is a truly elegant solution.  I can cycle
through the user's selected stacks, and open each card in the central stack.

However, I just tried it, and what seems to happen is it seems to open the
stack in the window of another stack.

For example, if I type this into the message box:

open "card id 1075" of "stack A" in "stack B"

the card appears to open in Stack B, however _the title_ of stack B becomes
"Stack A", and all the cards from Stack A are there.  

Strangely enough "open" does not appear at all in the "Transcript Dictionary",
but can be found by searching the documentation, where it appears to be a
synonym for "go".  The "go" command does refer to opening stacks in other
windows.  

I'm a bit confused by this command.  I went to the Google search of this list
and "open card" did not turn up many resources there, so I think others on the
list may also benefit from further discussion/investigation into this.

I have the suspicion that if I open the cards from say Stack C then these cards
will over-write the cards in Stack B, or at the very least over-write the title
of the stack.  If the cards are not over-written, I guess I could just change
the title back again after loading all the stacks.


From malte.brill at t-online.de  Fri Nov 29 09:32:01 2002
From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill)
Date: Fri Nov 29 09:32:01 2002
Subject: Just another player.
In-Reply-To: <200211281222.HAA09473@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA0D3763.10D%520041426354-0001@t-online.de>

Hi there,
I just want to announce that runrev have put a stack of me, based on the
German Workshop I wrote, on their users contribution site.
It is just another player stack. :-)
This one with a little more scripting. The stack runs in fullscreen mode up
to 1024x768 pixels. If the screen resolution is higher, it still runs in
1024x768, but is centered in the middle of the screen. It will also be
centered if the resolution is not in a 4:3 aspect ratio (e.g. Cinema
Display). The player contains a "jogwheel" (scalebar), with 2 scrolling
speeds forwards and backwards.  Movies will be scaled in the correct aspect
ratio (4:3 ,16:9 or any other ratio) to fit as big as possible on the card.

If you want to take a quick look at it and have any comments I am happy to
receive them.

Regards,

Malte 



From mcompanys at mac.com  Fri Nov 29 11:01:01 2002
From: mcompanys at mac.com (Manuel Companys)
Date: Fri Nov 29 11:01:01 2002
Subject: Just another player.
In-Reply-To: <BA0D3763.10D%520041426354-0001@t-online.de>
Message-ID: <BA0D4C5C.12274%mcompanys@mac.com>

Le 29/11/02 15:25, ??Malte Brill?? <malte.brill at t-online.de> a ?crit?:

> Hi there,
> I just want to announce that runrev have put a stack of me, based on the
> German Workshop I wrote, on their users contribution site.

> 
> If you want to take a quick look at it and have any comments I am happy to
> receive them.
> 
How can I down load it?

Manuel



From malte.brill at t-online.de  Fri Nov 29 12:19:01 2002
From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill)
Date: Fri Nov 29 12:19:01 2002
Subject: Just another player.
Message-ID: <BA0D5E95.10E%520041426354-0001@t-online.de>

Hi Manuel, just follow that link:
http://www.runrev.com/revolution/developers/developerdownloads/usercontribut
ions.html

You can find many interesting stacks there.

Au revoir,

Malte



From DVGlasgow at aol.com  Fri Nov 29 13:21:01 2002
From: DVGlasgow at aol.com (DVGlasgow at aol.com)
Date: Fri Nov 29 13:21:01 2002
Subject: improve rev list [was Launch Not work on OSX/OSX Rotate image trick]
Message-ID: <110.1c58eede.2b1908a8@aol.com>

In a message dated 29/11/02 5:12:06 AM, Sannyasin Sivakatirswami 
<katir at hindu.org> writes:

<< Though my license does not expire until January 18, 2003 I was 

unsubscribed from the Improve list, so will send bug reports here in 

the hope they are not bugs but only what I don't know. >>

I have been unexpectedly unsubscribed too.  I'm not too upset, because I find 
this list more useful, and saw the 'improve' list as a forum for bug 
reporting and contributing to the Evolution of Revolution.  As far as these 
activities go, I am a makeweight, and they won't miss me.  

I did think I would get at least 1 upgrade whilst still on the 'professional' 
list, though.  Or did I imagine that part of the deal?  I would have happily 
missed out on the previous 9 months, for just 8 weeks around the time of the 
upgrade to 2.0.

Never mind.  Still having fun.

Incidentally, there was a recent thread about accessing images and text and 
not wanting it all in memory.  The suggestion was to reference rather than 
import the material.  That of course works.  However, I also have a vague 
memory that it is possible to store data in properties within  closed stacks 
that can be accessed without loading the whole stack into memory.  Actually, 
as I type, this strikes me as deeply implausible.  Did I make it up?


Best wishes,

David Glasgow
Home/ forensic assessments --> <A HREF="http://members.aol.com/dvglasgow/">
DVGlasgow </A>
Courses --> <A HREF="http://www.i-Psych.co.uk">i-Psych</A>


From kray at sonsothunder.com  Fri Nov 29 13:29:00 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Fri Nov 29 13:29:00 2002
Subject: combining cards from stacks
References: <200211290100.UAA23893@www.runrev.com> <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHAEMPCLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com> <200211290828.DAA32585@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <03d301c297d3$af211630$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Bernard,

You have stumbled upon an interesting (and potentially useful) command in
Rev. The idea was that if you wanted to have a single window that could
display the contents of multiple stacks, you could open a stack "in" the
window of another stack. This would mean there would be no need to redraw
the window frame; just the contents of the window would change to reflect
that in the new stack. This is different than opening one stack with the
same rectangle on top of another stack (which would cause Rev to redraw the
entire region and it would appear to "blink" as the new stack opened).

Although this may not be documented in Rev, it *is* documented in MetaCard
under the "go" command with the syntax:

    go [to] [invisible] <stack> [as <mode>][in window <wid>]

Where the description states:

    The <wid> parameter can be either the name or the
    windowID of a stack that the new stack should
    open into instead of opening a new window.

Hope this helps clear things up,


Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bernard Devlin" <revolution at knowledgeworks.plus.com>
To: "use-revolution" <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Friday, November 29, 2002 2:21 AM
Subject: Re: combining cards from stacks


>
> > open card x in stack y
>
> Monte, if this meets my criteria, it is a truly elegant solution.  I can
cycle
> through the user's selected stacks, and open each card in the central
stack.
>
> However, I just tried it, and what seems to happen is it seems to open the
> stack in the window of another stack.
>
> For example, if I type this into the message box:
>
> open "card id 1075" of "stack A" in "stack B"
>
> the card appears to open in Stack B, however _the title_ of stack B
becomes
> "Stack A", and all the cards from Stack A are there.
>
> Strangely enough "open" does not appear at all in the "Transcript
Dictionary",
> but can be found by searching the documentation, where it appears to be a
> synonym for "go".  The "go" command does refer to opening stacks in other
> windows.
>
> I'm a bit confused by this command.  I went to the Google search of this
list
> and "open card" did not turn up many resources there, so I think others on
the
> list may also benefit from further discussion/investigation into this.
>
> I have the suspicion that if I open the cards from say Stack C then these
cards
> will over-write the cards in Stack B, or at the very least over-write the
title
> of the stack.  If the cards are not over-written, I guess I could just
change
> the title back again after loading all the stacks.
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From rcozens at pon.net  Fri Nov 29 15:52:00 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Fri Nov 29 15:52:00 2002
Subject: Serendipity Library Update 20021127
Message-ID: <a05100300ba0d7e91bbcf@[216.229.107.92]>

Hi All,

Serendipity Library Update 20021127 is now available at 
http://www.oenolog.com/ftp/serendipity_downloader.htm

This update was released primarily to provide Unix file & folder name 
compatibility by replacing spaces with underscores in all external 
stack, file, and folder names.  It also includes some minor changes 
to ClickClock, including changing the logic in the card script so the 
message box is not opened when the stack opens.

Components of this update are incompatible with those of previous 
updates: all files & folders must be replaced.  Any developers' 
stacks that contain 'start using stack "Serendipity Library.rev"' 
must change that reference to "Serendipity_Library.rev"; otherwise 
simple file replacement is all that is required to update to the new 
version.

BTW, Chipp reported on the improve-rev list that he got an 
administrative error message when trying to access my website.  I 
just tried it, and all seems OK.  If anyone has a problem, let me 
know privately.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From mdswindell at charter.net  Fri Nov 29 17:24:01 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Fri Nov 29 17:24:01 2002
Subject: Appearance of progress bars/sliders
In-Reply-To: <a05100300ba0d7e91bbcf@[216.229.107.92]>
Message-ID: <BA0D2799.3CA1%mdswindell@charter.net>

Is it possible to override the default appearance of progress bars?  How
would I do this?  I haven't found anything in the tutorials or docs that
covers the customization or development of progress bars or sliders.  Is it
easy enough to roll your own?

Thanks,
Mark



From mcompanys at mac.com  Fri Nov 29 17:32:00 2002
From: mcompanys at mac.com (Manuel Companys)
Date: Fri Nov 29 17:32:00 2002
Subject: Just another player.
In-Reply-To: <BA0D5E95.10E%520041426354-0001@t-online.de>
Message-ID: <BA0DA7E7.12291%mcompanys@mac.com>

Le 29/11/02 18:12, ??Malte Brill?? <malte.brill at t-online.de> a ?crit?:

> Hi Manuel, just follow that link:
> http://www.runrev.com/revolution/developers/developerdownloads/usercontribut
> ions.html
> 
> You can find many interesting stacks there.
> 
Thanks, Malte

By the way, are you using a macintosh? I wrote some "didacticiels de
langues" as we say in french, some of theese HyperCard stacks deal with
german, specially about "particle verbs" such as ?bersetzen vs ?berSetzen.

Auf wiedersehen!



From rcozens at pon.net  Fri Nov 29 19:37:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Fri Nov 29 19:37:01 2002
Subject: Appearance of progress bars/sliders
In-Reply-To: <BA0D2799.3CA1%mdswindell@charter.net>
References: <BA0D2799.3CA1%mdswindell@charter.net>
Message-ID: <a05100302ba0db636a963@[216.229.107.156]>

>Is it possible to override the default appearance of progress bars?

Hi Mark,

I have not tried it yet; but if I were to do so, I would start by 
clicking on a progress bar in the development mode and select "Object 
Appearance" from the object menu.  Try changing some settings and see 
what you get.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Fri Nov 29 19:37:50 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Fri Nov 29 19:37:50 2002
Subject: Serendipity Library Update 20021127.00001
Message-ID: <a05100303ba0db72ce342@[216.229.107.156]>

Hi All,

I've updated the bundled files and ClickClock.rev.sgx at 
http://www.oenolog.com/ftp/serendipity_downloader.htm to correct a 
scripting error that caused ClickClock to display an invalid time if 
it was passed a time 58 or 59 minutes after the hour.

-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From dsc at swcp.com  Fri Nov 29 19:39:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Fri Nov 29 19:39:01 2002
Subject: Converting numbers to text and back
Message-ID: <3652BBBA-03FB-11D7-AEF0-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

Is there a value I can set numberFormat to so that this is true for any 
x that contains a number?

(x + empty) + 0 = x

I want to convert a value that is internally a number to a string such 
that when I convert it back it is the same or very close.

I'd like to use a method that uses numberFormat, but I'm willing to look 
at others.

Dar Scott



From katir at hindu.org  Fri Nov 29 20:17:01 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Fri Nov 29 20:17:01 2002
Subject: Launch Not work on OSX/OSX Rotate image trick
In-Reply-To: <03a101c29773$60e8d4e0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <B8E04873-0400-11D7-9375-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

I copied this to the improve list as it appears we have a bug or a 
needed feature. It could be an Adobe problem also...

See below. OSX 10.2.2

I. Failure to see inside package.

I tested the following:

answer file "Search for an application that is a package"
put it

/Applications/Adobe Photoshop 7/Adobe Photoshop 7.0/

is returned.

indicating a failure to "see" inside the package... it is not possible 
from inside the dialog box to cntrl-select a file inside a package. 
Leaving it as a directory, one cannot use the path to launch a file.

launch "some.jpg" with "/Applications/Adobe Photoshop 7/Adobe Photoshop 
7.0/"

will not work.


2. Doing as Ken says.  control clicked on the package. The actual 
application file appears, ais the same name, appending this to the path 
one gets:

/Applications/Adobe Photoshop 7/Adobe Photoshop 7.0/Adobe Photoshop 7.0

launch "some.jpg" with "/Applications/Adobe Photoshop 7/Adobe Photoshop 
7.0/Adobe Photoshop 7.0"

YES! this does work. Subsequent attempts to open a file with Photoshop 
already open do not work (as documented) will have to use applescript.

3.
Close process  "/Applications/Adobe Photoshop 7/Adobe Photoshop 
7.0/Adobe Photoshop 7.0"

Does nothing if Photoshop is open. Openprocesses still returns path to 
PS.

4. kill process  "/Applications/Adobe Photoshop 7/Adobe Photoshop 
7.0/Adobe Photoshop 7.0"  returns "Process did not die" if Photoshop is 
still open.

5. Quit Photoshop:

--Openprocesses() still returns the path.
--Close process  doesn't do anything. Launch command will not work even 
though Photoshop has been quit.

--Kill process "/Applications/Adobe Photoshop 7/Adobe Photoshop 
7.0/Adobe Photoshop 7.0" returns "Process did not die"

BUT! after running the kill process on the application that was already 
quit... the Launch command does in fact boot Photoshop now... even 
though the kill command didn't think it had killed the process.

??? Some engine anomalies there... but

Solutions: on OSX if helper app is open, use applescript to launch the 
file.
If the helper app was previously opened by Rev, but subsequently quit 
then
use a kill command before trying to use it again in the same session.

global gCurrentFolder
on menuPick which
   switch which
   case "Photoshop"
     put (fld "PhotoshopLoc" of stack "prefs") into tAppPath
     kill process tAppPath
     break
case "ImageReady"
     put (fld "ImageReadyLoc" of stack "prefs") into tAppPath
     kill process tAppPath
   break
   case "Illustrator"
     put (fld "IllustratorLoc" of stack "prefs") into tAppPath
      kill process tAppPath
  break
   case "BBEdit" ## check on some text file...captions etc.
     put (fld "BBeditLoc" of stack "prefs") into tAppPath
      kill process tAppPath
  break
   end switch
   launch (gCurrentFolder& fld "currentImage") with tAppPath
end menuPick


On Thursday, November 28, 2002, at 08:48 PM, Ken Ray wrote:

> Sannyasin,
>
>> Problems with Launch command:
>> Bug:
>> 1) Rev will not "forget' that the application is no longer running.
>>
>> a) set an application path to BBEdit in a preference field.
>> b) Launch a file using
>>
>> launch "some/File/path" with "/Applications/BBedit 6.5/BBEdit 6.5
>>
>> First time (BBedit is not open) the file is opened... as expected.
>>
>> Quit BBEdit...
>>
>> use the launch button again.. .this time the file is not launched...
>>   if I quit Rev and re-boot, it is launched.
>
> The problem (I think) is that Rev thinks that it "owns" the process, 
> and
> therefore since you didn't quit it *from* Rev, it still thinks it's 
> open.
> Try checking the "openProcesses' and see if you have a process listed 
> there
> after you launch. If you do, you should 'kill' the process and see if 
> it
> will work again.
>
>> Not a bug, but a "how to?"
>> 2) The documentation clearly states that if the application is already
>> open then "launch" will do nothing... OK, so, then, how does one open 
>> a
>> file in an already running application?  Of course I can use
>> applescript... but would rather stay in xTalk.
>
> Sorry; I think you have to use AppleScript until this is resolved.
>
>> 3) this is totally obscure problem with Adobe products... anyone know
>> about this?
>>
>> Launch "somepath/some.jpg" with "/Applications/Adobe Photoshop
>> 7.0/Adobe Photoshop 7.0
>>
>> will not work... and, what is even stranger, if you do
>>
>> answer file "Find your copy of Photoshop"
>> put it
>>
>> and locate the application, Rev returns:
>>
>> /Applications/Adobe Photoshop 7.0/Adobe Photoshop 7.0/
>>
>> with a "/" at the end, even though it appears that you are pointing to
>> the Adobe photoshop file and not a folder??
>
> No, that's not strange at all under OS X. Technically applications ARE
> folders (actually "packages"); if you control-click on them and choose 
> "Show
> Package Contents" you can see what is inside - including the REAL
> application. You might try including the trailing "/" after the path 
> name to
> the app and see if it launches properly.
>
> Ken Ray
> Sons of Thunder Software
> Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
> Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution


>
>
Om Shanti,
Sannyasin Sivakatirswami

Himalayan Academy Publications
katir at hindu.org

www.HimalayanAcademy.com, www.HinduismToday.com
www.Gurudeva.org, www.Hindu.org




From katir at hindu.org  Fri Nov 29 20:23:00 2002
From: katir at hindu.org (Sannyasin Sivakatirswami)
Date: Fri Nov 29 20:23:00 2002
Subject: Buttons slow to respond to second click, Why?
Message-ID: <97CD5E26-0401-11D7-9375-003065FB9830@hindu.org>

Why are buttons or fields with handlers very prone to not responding 
right away to a second click that is intended to invoke the  same 
action again ... forcing one to pause a bit and then click again... 
Even though the intended action to be taken by the invoked handler is 
already complete and a trivial one in terms of CPU requirements...  
i.e. one would expect the button to be returned to a ready state in 
milliseconds.... but instead the user is still forced to wait before 
clicking again to get the button to respond....

Is there some buffer setting that needs to be tweaked to allow for the 
second click, or some default delay interval that can be adjusted to 
zero?

Very annoying when using a button over and over again to process some 
small things such as delete a line in a list.

Thanks
Sannyasin Sivakatirswami

Himalayan Academy Publications
katir at hindu.org

www.HimalayanAcademy.com, www.HinduismToday.com
www.Gurudeva.org, www.Hindu.org



From mdswindell at charter.net  Fri Nov 29 20:27:00 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Fri Nov 29 20:27:00 2002
Subject: Appearance of progress bars/sliders
In-Reply-To: <a05100302ba0db636a963@[216.229.107.156]>
Message-ID: <BA0D5246.3CA9%mdswindell@charter.net>

on 11/29/02 4:29 PM, Rob Cozens at rcozens at pon.net wrote:

>> Is it possible to override the default appearance of progress bars?
> 
> Hi Mark,
> 
> I have not tried it yet; but if I were to do so, I would start by
> clicking on a progress bar in the development mode and select "Object
> Appearance" from the object menu.  Try changing some settings and see
> what you get.


Thanks for the suggestion, but I see no such option, and the colors palette
has no effect on the graphic used.  So it appears to be a standard locked
graphic residing somewhere.

I have the slider behaving (mostly) as I want it to, but would like to
customize its appearance to go with the rest of the environment.  If that's
not possible it's ok, but it would be nice to have the option of easily
changing between a few options, or supplying my own.

Nark



From ambassador at fourthworld.com  Fri Nov 29 20:33:00 2002
From: ambassador at fourthworld.com (Richard Gaskin)
Date: Fri Nov 29 20:33:00 2002
Subject: Buttons slow to respond to second click, Why?
In-Reply-To: <97CD5E26-0401-11D7-9375-003065FB9830@hindu.org>
Message-ID: <BA0D53E1.20C34%ambassador@fourthworld.com>

Sannyasin Sivakatirswami wrote:

> Why are buttons or fields with handlers very prone to not responding
> right away to a second click that is intended to invoke the  same
> action again ... forcing one to pause a bit and then click again...
> Even though the intended action to be taken by the invoked handler is
> already complete and a trivial one in terms of CPU requirements...
> i.e. one would expect the button to be returned to a ready state in
> milliseconds.... but instead the user is still forced to wait before
> clicking again to get the button to respond....
> 
> Is there some buffer setting that needs to be tweaked to allow for the
> second click, or some default delay interval that can be adjusted to
> zero?
> 
> Very annoying when using a button over and over again to process some
> small things such as delete a line in a list.

This may be a function of the doubleClickInterval, a global property
inherited from the system (on Mac and Win; om UNIX it's default value is
250) which is the threshold of time between clicks during which the second
click willl trigger a mouseDoubleUp message.

But rather than altering that value, maybe you could add a mouseDoubleUp
message to your object?

Hope that helps....

-- 
 Richard Gaskin 
 Fourth World Media Corporation
 Developer of WebMerge 2.1: Publish any database on any site
 ___________________________________________________________
 Ambassador at FourthWorld.com       http://www.FourthWorld.com
 Tel: 323-225-3717                       AIM: FourthWorldInc



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Fri Nov 29 20:44:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Fri Nov 29 20:44:01 2002
Subject: Converting numbers to text and back
References: <3652BBBA-03FB-11D7-AEF0-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <041f01c29810$7b118680$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Dar,

I'm not sure what you mean... Rev does this conversion automatically for
you, so if you do something like:

on mouseUp
  put "123.456" & empty into tNumString
  set the numberFormat to "###.##"
  put (tNumString+0)
end mouseUp

You end up getting:

123.46

in the message box. Is this not what you want?

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dar Scott" <dsc at swcp.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Friday, November 29, 2002 6:32 PM
Subject: Converting numbers to text and back


> Is there a value I can set numberFormat to so that this is true for any
> x that contains a number?
>
> (x + empty) + 0 = x
>
> I want to convert a value that is internally a number to a string such
> that when I convert it back it is the same or very close.
>
> I'd like to use a method that uses numberFormat, but I'm willing to look
> at others.
>
> Dar Scott
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From dsc at swcp.com  Fri Nov 29 20:59:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Fri Nov 29 20:59:01 2002
Subject: Converting numbers to text and back
In-Reply-To: <041f01c29810$7b118680$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <796AE9E0-0406-11D7-AEF0-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Friday, November 29, 2002, at 06:33 PM, Ken Ray wrote:

> I'm not sure what you mean...

I'll make this up on the fly and test later; you should get the idea:

on mouseUp
   put random(20)/random(20) * 10 ^ (random(100)-50) into x
   set numberFormat to "0.000"
   put x & empty into y
   put y + 0 into z
   put x = z
end mouseUp

I want to change the value set to numberFormat so this is true.

Dar



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Fri Nov 29 22:53:03 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Fri Nov 29 22:53:03 2002
Subject: Converting numbers to text and back
References: <796AE9E0-0406-11D7-AEF0-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <043a01c29822$785806a0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Well, I ran the code you provided and got "true" in the message box. Is this
what you want?

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



----- Original Message -----
From: "Dar Scott" <dsc at swcp.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Friday, November 29, 2002 7:53 PM
Subject: Re: Converting numbers to text and back


>
> On Friday, November 29, 2002, at 06:33 PM, Ken Ray wrote:
>
> > I'm not sure what you mean...
>
> I'll make this up on the fly and test later; you should get the idea:
>
> on mouseUp
>    put random(20)/random(20) * 10 ^ (random(100)-50) into x
>    set numberFormat to "0.000"
>    put x & empty into y
>    put y + 0 into z
>    put x = z
> end mouseUp
>
> I want to change the value set to numberFormat so this is true.
>
> Dar
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From dsc at swcp.com  Sat Nov 30 01:23:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Sat Nov 30 01:23:01 2002
Subject: Converting numbers to text and back
In-Reply-To: <043a01c29822$785806a0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <4266B662-042B-11D7-AEF0-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Friday, November 29, 2002, at 08:42 PM, Ken Ray wrote:

> Well, I ran the code you provided and got "true" in the message box. Is 
> this
> what you want?

I apologize Ray.  I needed to run off and rattled off something too 
fast.  I should have waited until I could give this proper consideration 
and not waste your time.

Consider this:

on mouseUp
   set numberFormat to "0.0000000000000000"
   put 1/3 into f
   put empty into field "Report"
   repeat with theE = -100 to 100
     put f * 10 ^ theE into x
     put x & lineFeed after field "Report"
   end repeat
end mouseUp

For the first several rows I get zeros.  I really want small numbers.  
For the last few rows I get long numbers.

I think I have to find a way that does not use numberFormat.  Upon 
consideration that seems obvious.

I will experiment with format(), which I have ignored, thinking it was 
just there for C programmers.  Maybe I thought so before I understood 
more about Revolution numbers.

Dar Scott





From degbert at mac.com  Sat Nov 30 02:15:01 2002
From: degbert at mac.com (David Egbert)
Date: Sat Nov 30 02:15:01 2002
Subject: Converting Rev color to HTML color?
Message-ID: <BA0DB1A3.B689%degbert@mac.com>

I'm trying to convert the color returned from Answer Color to a HTML-style
color.  Is there a function that will do that?  I tried using "answer color
with #FFFFFF" in hopes it would return HTML color, but that didn't work.

Any ideas?

Many thanks to this wonderful group in helping me get up to speed with Rev!


--
Dave Egbert



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sat Nov 30 02:21:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sat Nov 30 02:21:01 2002
Subject: Converting numbers to text and back
References: <4266B662-042B-11D7-AEF0-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <001e01c2983f$86f574f0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> Consider this:
>
> on mouseUp
>    set numberFormat to "0.0000000000000000"
>    put 1/3 into f
>    put empty into field "Report"
>    repeat with theE = -100 to 100
>      put f * 10 ^ theE into x
>      put x & lineFeed after field "Report"
>    end repeat
> end mouseUp
>
> For the first several rows I get zeros.  I really want small numbers.
> For the last few rows I get long numbers.


Well, if you don't want scientific notation, and you have some feel for the
total number of digits you want, you can use the format function this way:
(this is using up to 100 characters before the decimal and 100 after):

on mouseUp
  put 1/3 into f
  put empty into field "Report"
  repeat with theE = -100 to 100
    put f * 10 ^ theE into x
    put format("%100.100f",x) & lineFeed after field "Report"
  end repeat
end mouseUp

If you *do* want scientific notation, just change the "f" to "e" and give it
smaller numbers. For example the following provides for 1 character to the
left of the decimal and 4 to the right with scientific notation:

on mouseUp
  put 1/3 into f
  put empty into field "Report"
  repeat with theE = -100 to 100
    put f * 10 ^ theE into x
    put format("%1.4e",x) & lineFeed after field "Report"
  end repeat
end mouseUp

Hope this helps,

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sat Nov 30 02:48:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sat Nov 30 02:48:01 2002
Subject: Converting Rev color to HTML color?
References: <BA0DB1A3.B689%degbert@mac.com>
Message-ID: <002a01c29843$460f3df0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Dave,

Here's the conversion code I use - note it's a little funky when it comes to
making sure that "0" is really "00", but it works:

on mouseUp
    answer color
    if it <> "" then
        put ConvertToHex(it)
    end if
end mouseUp

function ConvertToHex pRGB
    set the numberFormat to "00"
    put "" into retVal
    repeat with x = 1 to 3
        put baseConvert(item x of pRGB,10,16) into tVal
        if isNumber(tVal) then
            put tVal + 0 after retVal
        else
            put tVal after retVal
        end if
    end repeat
    return "#" & retVal
end ConvertToHex

The reason for the "put tVal + 0 after retVal" is that in order to force a
number to adopt the numberFormat, you need to do some kind of math
calculation on it; adding 0 is the best way to do that.

Hope this helps!

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



----- Original Message -----
From: "David Egbert" <degbert at mac.com>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 30, 2002 1:06 AM
Subject: Converting Rev color to HTML color?


> I'm trying to convert the color returned from Answer Color to a HTML-style
> color.  Is there a function that will do that?  I tried using "answer
color
> with #FFFFFF" in hopes it would return HTML color, but that didn't work.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> Many thanks to this wonderful group in helping me get up to speed with
Rev!
>
>
> --
> Dave Egbert
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From chipp at chipp.com  Sat Nov 30 02:51:01 2002
From: chipp at chipp.com (Chipp Walters)
Date: Sat Nov 30 02:51:01 2002
Subject: Converting Rev color to HTML color?
In-Reply-To: <BA0DB1A3.B689%degbert@mac.com>
Message-ID: <EJEKIIHDOMKODEBKONOOEEEECLAA.chipp@chipp.com>

Dave, you can use the following to craft your own function:
I use the following: (a mouseMove handler in the stack script)

on mouseMove
  put the mouseColor into thecolor
  set the numberFormat to "##"
  put formathex(baseConvert(item 1 of thecolor,10,16)) into R
  put formathex(baseConvert(item 2 of thecolor,10,16)) into G
  put formathex(baseConvert(item 3 of thecolor,10,16)) into B
  put thecolor into cd fld 1
end mouseMove

function formathex thevalue
  if the length of thevalue is 1
  then put "0" before thevalue
  return thevalue
end formathex

_______________________________________________
improve-revolution mailing list
improve-revolution at lists.runrev.com
http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/improve-revolution

> -----Original Message-----
> From: use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com
> [mailto:use-revolution-admin at lists.runrev.com]On Behalf Of David Egbert
> Sent: Saturday, November 30, 2002 1:07 AM
> To: use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> Subject: Converting Rev color to HTML color?
>
>
> I'm trying to convert the color returned from Answer Color to a HTML-style
> color.  Is there a function that will do that?  I tried using
> "answer color
> with #FFFFFF" in hopes it would return HTML color, but that didn't work.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> Many thanks to this wonderful group in helping me get up to speed
> with Rev!
>
>
> --
> Dave Egbert
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution



From dsc at swcp.com  Sat Nov 30 03:11:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Sat Nov 30 03:11:01 2002
Subject: Converting numbers to text and back
In-Reply-To: <001e01c2983f$86f574f0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>
Message-ID: <63214C8E-043A-11D7-AEF0-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Saturday, November 30, 2002, at 12:10 AM, Ken Ray wrote:

> If you *do* want scientific notation, just change the "f" to "e" and 
> give it
> smaller numbers. For example the following provides for 1 character to 
> the
> left of the decimal and 4 to the right with scientific notation:
>
> on mouseUp
>   put 1/3 into f
>   put empty into field "Report"
>   repeat with theE = -100 to 100
>     put f * 10 ^ theE into x
>     put format("%1.4e",x) & lineFeed after field "Report"
>   end repeat
> end mouseUp
>
> Hope this helps,

Thanks, Ray.

Yeah, format() is what I need.  By smaller numbers, I meant the numbers 
not the numeral length.  I want to represent the value of any number big 
or small in a string so that all the info is there.  The e format is 
just what I need.

I had hoped there was a way in numberFormat since that is what combine 
uses.

It looks as though if I dump an array of numbers I will have to iterate 
through and use format().

Dar



From dsc at swcp.com  Sat Nov 30 03:18:01 2002
From: dsc at swcp.com (Dar Scott)
Date: Sat Nov 30 03:18:01 2002
Subject: Converting numbers to text and back
In-Reply-To: <63214C8E-043A-11D7-AEF0-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <6100E362-043B-11D7-AEF0-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>

On Saturday, November 30, 2002, at 01:04 AM, Dar Scott wrote:

> Thanks, Ray.

I mean, Ken.  I better get to bed.  I'm batty.

dar



From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sat Nov 30 03:30:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sat Nov 30 03:30:01 2002
Subject: Converting numbers to text and back
References: <63214C8E-043A-11D7-AEF0-0050E4C0B205@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <003101c29849$257d5300$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

> Thanks, Ray.

No problem, Scott. ;-)

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/



From malte.brill at t-online.de  Sat Nov 30 05:42:01 2002
From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill)
Date: Sat Nov 30 05:42:01 2002
Subject: Appearance of progress bars/sliders 
Message-ID: <BA0E530C.114%520041426354-0001@t-online.de>

Hi Mark,

perhaps I can give you a leg up.

I tried the following:

Created a stack, one card 1 button, a proress bar called "scale", a graphic
called "box".

in the cardscript:

global flag
on opencard
  put 1 into flag
end opencard 

In the buttonscript:

global flag,ratio
on mouseUp
  put the width of scrollbar "scale"/the endvalue of scrollbar"scale" into
ratio
  put flag*-1 into flag
  send los to me
end mouseUp
on los
  set the thumbposition of scrollbar "scale" to the thumbposition of
scrollbar "scale"+1
  if the thumbposition of scrollbar "scale"=the endvalue of scrollbar
"scale" then set the thumbposition of scrollbar "scale" to 0
  if flag=-1 then
  send los to me in 5 ticks
  send los to graphic "box" in 5 ticks
  end if
end los

in the graphicscript:

global ratio
on los
  set the rectangle of me to 0,50,the thumbposition of scrollbar
"scale"*ratio,70
end los


Hope that helps,

Malte



From malte.brill at t-online.de  Sat Nov 30 06:12:01 2002
From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill)
Date: Sat Nov 30 06:12:01 2002
Subject: was :Just another player.
Message-ID: <BA0E5A1F.115%520041426354-0001@t-online.de>

Bonjour Manuel,

>By the way, are you using a macintosh?
OS 9 and a machine with Win 98 on it  (no Linux, yet :-( I?m a bit scared to
set up a Linux machine, as I have no idea of how this would need to be
done.) 
> I wrote some "didacticiels de
>langues" as we say in french, some of theese HyperCard stacks deal with
>german, specially about "particle verbs" such as ?bersetzen vs ?berSetzen.

Sounds interesting. Do you plan to port these to Rev?

have a nice time,

Malte




From malte.brill at t-online.de  Sat Nov 30 06:16:01 2002
From: malte.brill at t-online.de (Malte Brill)
Date: Sat Nov 30 06:16:01 2002
Subject: Appearance of progress bars/sliders
In-Reply-To: <200211281222.HAA09473@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA0E5B24.116%520041426354-0001@t-online.de>

Hey Mark,

perhaps you might want to take a look at the user contribution "fun with
fields" by Klaus Major. He did a custom scrollbar there on card 4. (with a
little banana as a thumb.)

My excuses to the list for the nearly unreadable script in my previous post
to this topic. 



From switchedon at hsj.com  Sat Nov 30 10:07:01 2002
From: switchedon at hsj.com (Bill Lynn)
Date: Sat Nov 30 10:07:01 2002
Subject: Stack Size Changes
In-Reply-To: <200211300145.UAA16336@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA0E3CD0.19A6%switchedon@hsj.com>

I've run into an annoying and persistent problem with Rev 1.1.1 running
under Mac OS 9.2.2. I have the stack size set to 800 x 600 (my current
screen size) with no decorations, not resizeable and the following stack
script:

on openstack
  set  the loc of me to the screenloc
end openstack

Then I save the stack, quit Rev and the next time I open the stack it's 800
x 539. The only two things I have noticed that have changed in properties
are the height and the popup next to Window decorations reads "decorations"
instead of "empty." When I reset these two properties it looks fine while
I'm working on the stack. Then I save and shutdown. The next time I open the
stack the same thing has happened.

Even more odd is the fact that, when I set my screen resolution to 1024 x
768 the stack opens at 800 x 600 with no problem.

Is Rev reserving some stack height for it's own purposes (i.e. displaying
it's menu and toolbars)? Or is this a bug? Surely one should be able to
create a stack to fill up the screen.


Cheers... Bill Lynn
Simtech Publications
www.hsj.com



From hardt at u.arizona.edu  Sat Nov 30 10:20:01 2002
From: hardt at u.arizona.edu (Oliver Hardt)
Date: Sat Nov 30 10:20:01 2002
Subject: Stack Size Changes
In-Reply-To: <BA0E3CD0.19A6%switchedon@hsj.com>
References: <BA0E3CD0.19A6%switchedon@hsj.com>
Message-ID: <a05200a00ba0e856f65a7@[128.196.99.207]>

hello bill:  i recently wrote an application that covered the entire 
screen.  i do not know if that made the difference but
(1) i set the size using the "rect" property (in your case: set the 
rect of this stack to "0,0,800,600")
(2) i did not have a menubar.

hope it addresses your problem.  best, olli.


11/30/02, Bill Lynn wrote:

>I've run into an annoying and persistent problem with Rev 1.1.1 running
>under Mac OS 9.2.2. I have the stack size set to 800 x 600 (my current
>screen size) with no decorations, not resizeable and the following stack
>script:
>
>on openstack
>   set  the loc of me to the screenloc
>end openstack


From alex at mindlube.com  Sat Nov 30 10:56:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Sat Nov 30 10:56:01 2002
Subject: 2.0?
Message-ID: <66B07BCE-047B-11D7-886F-000393529642@mindlube.com>

Well, November has come and gone. How is it going with Rev 2.0? Not 
complaining, just curious.

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alex_rice at ARCplanning.com
alrice at swcp.com





From alex at mindlube.com  Sat Nov 30 11:07:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Sat Nov 30 11:07:01 2002
Subject: couple of printing issues
Message-ID: <F42578F4-047C-11D7-886F-000393529642@mindlube.com>

In my first attempt at printing, I am using this code. I haven't tried 
on Windows yet, but overall it works pretty good on OS X.

   set the printScale to 0.9
   set the printRotated to true
   set the printCardBorders to true
   answer printer
   open printing with dialog
      print this stack
   close printing

Are there any workarounds for this issues?

1)  printScale and printRotated seem to have no effect; they still have 
to be manually selected in the first print setup dialog.

2) When running as look and feel "Appearance Manager", none of the 
controls are printed (buttons, checkboxes, text fields, etc.)

3) When I cancel out of the print dialog, it pops up again, then if I 
hit Cancel again, then the handler exits. It seems maybe Rev is calling 
the print dialog twice?

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alex_rice at ARCplanning.com
alrice at swcp.com





From rcozens at pon.net  Sat Nov 30 11:17:02 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Sat Nov 30 11:17:02 2002
Subject: Appearance of progress bars/sliders
In-Reply-To: <BA0D5246.3CA9%mdswindell@charter.net>
References: <BA0D5246.3CA9%mdswindell@charter.net>
Message-ID: <a05100301ba0e8aa6075f@[216.229.107.77]>

>Thanks for the suggestion, but I see no such option, and the colors palette
>has no effect on the graphic used.

Sorry Mark,

You must be running v1.1.1.  The Object Appearance menuItem was 
introduced in v1.5.A7.

Anyway, I tried changing every option in the color palette, with no 
success.  The only way I could change the bar's appearance was to 
change the look & feel to a different platform.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From rcozens at pon.net  Sat Nov 30 11:17:27 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Sat Nov 30 11:17:27 2002
Subject: Stack Size Changes
In-Reply-To: <BA0E3CD0.19A6%switchedon@hsj.com>
References: <BA0E3CD0.19A6%switchedon@hsj.com>
Message-ID: <a05100306ba0e9225ca3c@[216.229.107.77]>

>Is Rev reserving some stack height for it's own purposes (i.e. displaying
>it's menu and toolbars)? Or is this a bug? Surely one should be able to
>create a stack to fill up the screen.

Hi Bill,

I ran into the same problem opening a 800x600 stack (with no menubar) 
on an iBook with a 800x600 screen.

The following in preOpenStack fixes it:

   set the height of this stack to 600
   set the loc of this stack to the screenloc

-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From switchedon at hsj.com  Sat Nov 30 11:30:02 2002
From: switchedon at hsj.com (Bill Lynn)
Date: Sat Nov 30 11:30:02 2002
Subject: Stack Size Changes
In-Reply-To: <200211301608.LAA29239@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <BA0E506A.19AD%switchedon@hsj.com>

> (1) i set the size using the "rect" property (in your case: set the
> rect of this stack to "0,0,800,600")

Mine, too, is set to 0,0,800,600. I've also tried making the stack resizable
with minimum and maximum sizes both set at 800 x 600. Still no good.

> (2) i did not have a menubar.

Nor do I.

Can anyone else replicate this problem?

Cheers... Bill Lynn
Simtech Publications
www.hsj.com




From themacguy at macosx.com  Sat Nov 30 12:50:01 2002
From: themacguy at macosx.com (Barry Levine)
Date: Sat Nov 30 12:50:01 2002
Subject: "grabbing a tool"
Message-ID: <32CBB246-048B-11D7-B35F-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>

I think I understand setting the cursor to an image but the Rev docs 
indicate I need to have an image that's 16x16 pixels in order to 
maintain Mac & PC compatibility. What I'd like to do is have a mouseUp 
on an image "lock" that image to the position of the cursor (something 
on the order of picking up a weapon in a FPS; the weapon is usually a 
hundred pixels large or even more). Then, when the user does another 
mouseUp (and does it within a certain distance of a "target point"), I 
can "release" the image and return it to it's origin.

Near as I can tell, the pseudocode for the movement tracking would be 
something like:

on moveMe
	set the loc of image "theTool" to the loc of the cursor
	send moveMe to image "theTool"
end moveMe

Am I moving down the correct path?
Thanks,
Barry



From rcozens at pon.net  Sat Nov 30 13:22:01 2002
From: rcozens at pon.net (Rob Cozens)
Date: Sat Nov 30 13:22:01 2002
Subject: "grabbing a tool"
In-Reply-To: <32CBB246-048B-11D7-B35F-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
References: <32CBB246-048B-11D7-B35F-000393AAEF66@macosx.com>
Message-ID: <a05100300ba0eb0a5f4af@[216.229.107.160]>

>Am I moving down the correct path?

Hi Barry,

Check out the mouseMove message and grab command in Rev Dictionary. 
You shouldn't have to send anything; just script a mouseMove handler 
in your image.  Grab may even be a better choice...I have not used it.
-- 

Rob Cozens
CCW, Serendipity Software Company
http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm

"And I, which was two fooles, do so grow three;
Who are a little wise, the best fooles bee."

from "The Triple Foole" by John Donne (1572-1631)


From mdswindell at charter.net  Sat Nov 30 14:12:00 2002
From: mdswindell at charter.net (Mark Swindell)
Date: Sat Nov 30 14:12:00 2002
Subject: Klaus's banana  (was Progress bars/Sliders...)
In-Reply-To: <BA0E5B24.116%520041426354-0001@t-online.de>
Message-ID: <BA0E4C00.3CD2%mdswindell@charter.net>

on 11/30/02 3:10 AM, Malte Brill at malte.brill at t-online.de wrote:

> Hey Mark,
> 
> perhaps you might want to take a look at the user contribution "fun with
> fields" by Klaus Major. He did a custom scrollbar there on card 4. (with a
> little banana as a thumb.)
> 
> My excuses to the list for the nearly unreadable script in my previous post
> to this topic. 


Thanks for your help, Malte.  Klaus's banana script is pretty much what I
was looking for.  But moreover, his whole stack is a a sketch of what could
be for Revolution, and still isn't (or if it is, I haven't found it).

It'd be a fantastic learning and resource tool for all of us mortals if an
assemblage of the folks from the mountain contributed a card or two or five
of tricks and hints and possibilities like this to a single learning stack
similar to Klaus's but in a much grander scale, with commented scripts and
variations on the the themes involved. (For example, the banana on Klaus's
card scrolls a field, but other examples with different fruits or glowing
balls of energy sliding on laser rails could do other sliderly things... set
volumes, speed of slide shows, continuously output data to fields etc.)
Klaus's illustration of how the mousetext, mousechar, mousechunk works is
the best I've seen for the novice trying to make sense of it all, but it
needn't stop there.

Combine this effort with the support of some expert, tasteful graphic
artists to really make the stack look sharp and annihilate the cheese factor
(the real reason HyperCard never took off, I still believe), and you'd have
a hall of wonder and a great place to usher new  users into the potential
and reality of Revolution, and a great place for us intermediates to
continue to grow.  

I understand that this is at least partially the point of the user
contributions section of the runrev site, but having a single dedicated
"encyclopedia" library of resources included with the demo app, with
multiple illustrations of technique and function, would be hard to beat.

Ramblingly yours,
Mark



From jacque at hyperactivesw.com  Sat Nov 30 14:28:01 2002
From: jacque at hyperactivesw.com (J. Landman Gay)
Date: Sat Nov 30 14:28:01 2002
Subject: Stack Size Changes
References: <200211301701.MAA31810@www.runrev.com>
Message-ID: <3DE90FCF.9090604@hyperactivesw.com>

Bill Lynn <switchedon at hsj.com> wrote:

>> (1) i set the size using the "rect" property (in your case: set the
>> rect of this stack to "0,0,800,600")
> 
> Mine, too, is set to 0,0,800,600. I've also tried making the stack resizable
> with minimum and maximum sizes both set at 800 x 600. Still no good.
> 
>> (2) i did not have a menubar.
> 
> Nor do I.
> 
> Can anyone else replicate this problem?

I had the same problem a long time ago with a much earlier version of 
the MC engine. No one responded to my questions about it on the mailing 
list, so it must be rare. This was a year or two ago. I solved the 
problem on my own by setting the screen resolution to the one that 
didn't work, setting the stack size while I was there, and saving the 
stack while in that same resolution. After that, opening the stack at 
any screen resolution seemed to preserve the size no matter what.

I don't know if this will work in all cases though. It is probably safer 
to just set the desired size in a preOpenStack handler, as others have 
suggested.



From Timothy_Hart at umit.maine.edu  Sat Nov 30 21:58:01 2002
From: Timothy_Hart at umit.maine.edu (Timothy Hart)
Date: Sat Nov 30 21:58:01 2002
Subject: 2.0?
In-Reply-To: <66B07BCE-047B-11D7-886F-000393529642@mindlube.com>
References: <66B07BCE-047B-11D7-886F-000393529642@mindlube.com>
Message-ID: <fc.004c4d190fffa3f23b9aca009a3eec54.fffa46e@umit.maine.edu>

use-revolution at lists.runrev.com writes:
>Well, November has come and gone. How is it going with Rev 2.0? Not 
>complaining, just curious.
Yeah I am very curious as well.   Is it just taking longer than anticipated to get the bugs out.  I am used to these delays being a Nintendo fan but would like to know when we can expect it to come out.  I am eagerly awaiting its release.  What's
the hold up?

-Tim









From jswitte at bloomington.in.us  Sat Nov 30 22:18:00 2002
From: jswitte at bloomington.in.us (Jim Witte)
Date: Sat Nov 30 22:18:00 2002
Subject: Encoding for HTML pages??
Message-ID: <5B83E824-04D9-11D7-8514-000A27D93820@bloomington.in.us>

Hi,

   I'm making a Revolution browser for the HotOrNot site (what a better 
way to learn revolution.. ;-).  But whenever I do the following (for 
example), "put URL "http://www.hotornot.com/" into cd fld "code" the 
field has a bunch of gibberish that doesn't seem to want to copy out of 
Rev (looks like high-bit-set ASCII to me..)  Is this some sort of 
low-grade encryption on HTML going on?

Jim



From monte at sweattechnologies.com  Sat Nov 30 22:25:01 2002
From: monte at sweattechnologies.com (Monte Goulding)
Date: Sat Nov 30 22:25:01 2002
Subject: Set Multiple Filters
In-Reply-To: <AFBB79E8-0345-11D7-ABD8-0003937A97B8@genesearch.com.au>
Message-ID: <FLEGJBMJADGKMCHIMFOHOENACLAA.monte@sweattechnologies.com>

> >
> > filter gFileList with "*JPG,*.GIF,*.JPEG,*.jpg,*.jpeg,.*gif"

Try filter gFileList with "*JPG | *.GIF |*.JPEG |*.jpg |*.jpeg|.*gif"

Just an idea ??


From kray at sonsothunder.com  Sat Nov 30 22:29:01 2002
From: kray at sonsothunder.com (Ken Ray)
Date: Sat Nov 30 22:29:01 2002
Subject: Encoding for HTML pages??
References: <5B83E824-04D9-11D7-8514-000A27D93820@bloomington.in.us>
Message-ID: <009f01c298e8$477379e0$6601a8c0@mckinley.dom>

Jim,

Try:

  set the htmlText of fld "code" to url "http://www.hotornot.com/"

You still won't get any tables, etc., but it should look better...

Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Email: kray at sonsothunder.com
Web Site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jim Witte" <jswitte at bloomington.in.us>
To: <use-revolution at lists.runrev.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 30, 2002 9:02 PM
Subject: Encoding for HTML pages??


> Hi,
> 
>    I'm making a Revolution browser for the HotOrNot site (what a better 
> way to learn revolution.. ;-).  But whenever I do the following (for 
> example), "put URL "http://www.hotornot.com/" into cd fld "code" the 
> field has a bunch of gibberish that doesn't seem to want to copy out of 
> Rev (looks like high-bit-set ASCII to me..)  Is this some sort of 
> low-grade encryption on HTML going on?
> 
> Jim
> 
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
> 


From mpetrides at earthlink.net  Sat Nov 30 23:03:01 2002
From: mpetrides at earthlink.net (Marian Petrides)
Date: Sat Nov 30 23:03:01 2002
Subject: 2.0?
In-Reply-To: <fc.004c4d190fffa3f23b9aca009a3eec54.fffa46e@umit.maine.edu>
Message-ID: <AE05D208-04E0-11D7-9C4E-0003936D5826@earthlink.net>

Sheesh!  Chill, guys (and gals)... it's coming soon, isn't that enough?

M


On Saturday, November 30, 2002, at 08:51 PM, Timothy Hart wrote:

> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com writes:
>> Well, November has come and gone. How is it going with Rev 2.0? Not
>> complaining, just curious.
> Yeah I am very curious as well.   Is it just taking longer than 
> anticipated to get the bugs out.  I am used to these delays being a 
> Nintendo fan but would like to know when we can expect it to come out. 
>  I am eagerly awaiting its release.  What's
> the hold up?
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> use-revolution at lists.runrev.com
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
>



From alex at mindlube.com  Sat Nov 30 23:23:01 2002
From: alex at mindlube.com (Alex Rice)
Date: Sat Nov 30 23:23:01 2002
Subject: 2.0?
In-Reply-To: <AE05D208-04E0-11D7-9C4E-0003936D5826@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <CCE0E361-04E3-11D7-B999-000393529642@mindlube.com>

On Saturday, November 30, 2002, at 08:55  PM, Marian Petrides wrote:

> Sheesh!  Chill, guys (and gals)... it's coming soon, isn't that enough?

<humor>

Ah, that depends which meaning of "soon" are we using:

Sooner or later

Before long

In the near future

Sooner said than done

As soon as it might be

Soon after sunrise

Real Soon Now: adv. [orig. from SF's fanzine community, popularized by 
Jerry Pournelle's column in "BYTE"] 1. Supposed to be available (or 
fixed, or cheap, or whatever) real soon now according to somebody, but 
the speaker is quite skeptical. 2. When one's gods, fates, or other 
time commitments permit one to get to it (in other words, don't hold 
your breath). Often abbreviated RSN. Compare copious free time.

</humor>

Again, not complaining, just curious. If Rev 2.0 were rock concert 
tickets, I would be camping out on the sidewalk grilling wieners right 
now. :-)

Alex Rice, Software Developer
Architectural Research Consultants, Inc.
alex_rice at ARCplanning.com
alrice at swcp.com